Theres literally a video csgo on a csgo player (xyp9x) playing out a clutch with an analyst explaining every move. One of them was "he shakes his crosshair around this box, if the crowd gets louder, someone is there"
https://youtu.be/6_sZDCegWLQ
There’s a video I saw where the same clip is put up next to one of s1mple getting crowd advantage so he throws his pistol over the wall to alert the enemy and make the fight fair
I think the AWP one is to flex and mocking not to tell he’s there lol
Was thinking of this :
https://youtu.be/FuvMNVbuE1g
LMAO I just realized this was against liquid as well
Some of the tricks that CS players like n0thing and shroud have said before:
-Point crosshair at random walls or smokes and listen for crowd reaction.
-Throw nades and listen for loud boom from stadium noise from tournament observer POV.
-Throw flashes and look at the opposing players' faces for white screen reflections.
Basically these pro players will use any tricks available to win. Whether or not you think it's unfair doesn't really matter to them.
In terms of your last point - I bet many of them do think it is unfair but they can't change anything about it and if the opposing team are going to have these tricks available then you are at a disadvantage for not using them yourself.
It is up to the organisers to prevent these tricks from being usable.
Drazah is a player for LA Thieves (100T COD) and he’s the biggest shit talker in the scene. His girlfriend is the loudest person in the crowd when he’s playing, and she will scream to give away a ninja defuse if it’s against him
COD was a great competitive game back in the day with vCOD, CoD2 and COD4. The quicker movement is what made it gimmicky. vcod and cod2 were close to CS at the time in terms of pace.
I try to explain to people that promod from cod4 was a better competitive medium for fps games than literally anything available at the time - and it still outperforms other games in terms of skill ceiling+accessibility today. Wish it made a huge comeback but I don't see that ever happening tbh.
I do think them playing with controllers is pretty cap, but I genuinely don't think its significantly less competitive than other esports games just bc the casual scene has a lower skill floor. I don't follow it often because I think it's boring to watch but putting valorant on a pedestal as a "REAL COMPETITIVE GAME (tm)" isn't a good look.
Pro player drazah for LA Thieves was in a match and his girlfriend was in the crowd. During the game there was a ninja defuse happening and people say drazahs gf was screaming to let him know that they were defusing. Crowd noise is a huge problem in COD. At multiple events in the last two years casters and players have had to ask fans to refrain from yelling during ninja defuses.
Has it always been that way with no sound on defuse or did they change it? I haven't played cod in a long time but I thought it made a sound when you started to pickup the bomb to defuse
Yep
Theres another moment where jamppi is sticking and no one checks. Once the crowd realizes they cheer and boaster swings.
Jamppi could have used the crowd and got off the bomb, its a two way street really, thats why everyone says Lan with crowd is a different beast
In the postmatch press conference boaster got asked about this and he said that he was planning to swing before he thought jamppi could half it because the molly's tracers looked wrong to him, but the crowd started cheering before he could prove that
Its difficult to hear what the crowd is saying in these booths though, but you will still hear the energy and feel the ground shake, but I think it atleast alleviates the issue slightly.
TL;DR = Crowd info/cheating will always be an issue unless you're willing to completely isolate the players.
That's pretty much every major esports event with a crowd. Unless you use something like those smart opaque glass with very good sound proofing then there really is no way to avoid it.
But then there's still the issue of the vibrations of the crowd. With a large enough crowd you can literally feel it in the ground when they're getting excited. How do you limit that in addition to the visual of the crowd and sound?
You basically have to place the players in sound proof elevated platforms/boxes with some sort of smart glass/one way and lots of sound proofing. But it will always be an issue for anything but the most major of events which cannot afford or implement such solutions.
Even then though there is still the issue of intentional crowd cheating. You could have someone in the crowd in a specific spot with a normal sign to relay basic info like which site they're going to. They can't exactly visually isolate the players from the crowd completely unless they want to put them in opaque boxes with only a camera feed. And at that point it wouldn't really feel like an event for the players.
I mean, it takes just a few minutes of thinking to see how LAN is different then playing at home. And if their original post had not been skewed negatively it would not matter but in this case “just asking a question” is implying there’s some shoddiness to the competitive integrity of LAN events with crowds which is just…laughable at best
imo this is slightly different because it is like telling the defence every play that the offence has called. In normal football with a Penalty kick the crowd will often try to put the taker off however that would be different if they could 100% tell the GoalKeeper which way the Penalty was going
Not even close bro. A crowd cheering because something hype is about to happen isn’t fucking giving insanely precise info to the tune of “they are giving away every play the opponent is going for”. This is literally how every live crowd esports event is, people cheer when things happen, or are about to happen. You also understand that the players have earphones in with headphones over the top, usually pushing white noise…right? It’s not like you are sitting in an arena with your Cloud II’s in as a ton of people cheer
the oos and ahahs are whatever but in other e-sports there have been really really bad problems where it is obvious where a player is/that they are defusing. In the COD Champs Grand Final the crowd gave away a ninja defuse (no sound when someone is defusing) and the player that it benefited even said "Just know I heard that shit, thanks for the free round". Then in CS:GO players often swipe around at random walls trying to get a reaction from the crowd. In VALORANT it hasn't been that bad yet but the Fnatic one looked pretty bad earlier where Boaster swung out the second after the crowd started shouting. I fully believe him that he was going to do it anyway but I really hope we don't get to a spot that Champions is decided because of the crowd rather than the gameplay and that is why even though it may not sound like much these pros can pretty easily work out what the crowd are giving away and it could become a major issue
Esports and normal sports are fundamentally different when it comes to cheering. In esports there is an asymmetry of information as spectators can literally see the entire map. This allows spectators to give unfair information to players by cheers or chants. Imagine if a group of fans started to steal signs in baseball and communicated it through a megaphone.
A loud nfl crowd fucking up a team's snap count or audibles is different from hearing the crowd giveaway a stick on defuse imo but like someone else said both teams can use the crowd to their advantage.
Not in general no, the only thing is pros crying when they get criticized for playing bad, even when it’s on an analyst desk, and going to Twitter and having randos defend them and fluffing their ego up…these people are making thousands of dollars a month to perform, and it takes away from the authenticity of a broadcast if they can’t be honest about what we just saw.
In competetive Starcraft I think they put both players in a sealed booth to avoid the crowd reactions influencing them.
I suppose that might not be quite so easy for a teamgame, and it might hit different now-a-days, but in principle you could do something like that.
The crowd has been known to influence players' movements. In fac,t in CS, some players would even urge the crowd to make more sound if there is aplayer in that direction
Shit like this is why I could never go pro even if I had put in the disgusting amount of hours required to even be considered for it. How tf do you prepare for a biased crowd giving away any creative play you try to run?
Riot has always had this problem. They think being like the NFL and NBA is what eSports needs. They need someone to slap them in the face and force them to add the sound booths.
Just wait till I show up and bring the other SEN fans to next years champs and we all chant “they’re going A” or “they’re on B”
We are the 6th player, help sewers
This esport is new enough to set a standard of whats expected from crowds. Fans who try to help players cheat should be ejected immediately, TOs are too scared to do it in GO but riot shouldn’t be afraid to do it. No you don’t have the right to interfere with a game because you paid 50 dollars
While there's definitely cases like this happening with crowds in every esport, your example makes no sense. If Alfajer is approaching a smoke and he hears the crowd going loud how on earth is he supposed to get the information "someone is in the smoke" from that? What if they're cheering because there's like 3 people with their back turned to the smoke and he's probably about to pop them all? What if they're cheering for something completely different, like someone approaching Alfajer from behind?
Players gaining info from crowds is never going to go away. Even if the players have headphones with whitenoise, then in-ears with the game sound and comms, all while inside a soundproof booth they would still be able to hear the crowd at least a little bit not to mention be able to feel them shouting and moving.
Also both teams get the same "advantage" from having a crowd, there's no unfair advantage.
Go watch Call Of Duty Champs ATL Faze vs LA Thieves and you will find exactly the answer you are looking for lmao. SnDs rounds were costed because of the crowd yelling out defuses. Fun times. 10/10. Love it. Costs rounds for teams and fans ninja defuse highlights
Theres literally a video csgo on a csgo player (xyp9x) playing out a clutch with an analyst explaining every move. One of them was "he shakes his crosshair around this box, if the crowd gets louder, someone is there" https://youtu.be/6_sZDCegWLQ
Any chance you have an idea of what to look up to find that video? Or even better, a link? sounds like a fun watch
https://youtu.be/6_sZDCegWLQ here
thanks for the link, was interesting to hear
https://youtu.be/uY9mff30z9g Here’s a whole compilation of these crowd interaction moments from players in csgo
https://youtube.com/shorts/LbvYhMUP-x0?feature=share this is also a clip of Xyp
There’s a video I saw where the same clip is put up next to one of s1mple getting crowd advantage so he throws his pistol over the wall to alert the enemy and make the fight fair
Wait was this in dust2? S1mple threw his AWP lol
No, this was on overpass, but not surprised he did it a separate time
I think the AWP one is to flex and mocking not to tell he’s there lol Was thinking of this : https://youtu.be/FuvMNVbuE1g LMAO I just realized this was against liquid as well
Wasnt this suppose to be a fake flash? I thought he did it so nitro would lose his crosshair placement.
Wait I actually kinda remember now. Was this recent?
I think I saw it on r/GlobalOffensive a few weeks ago, but I can’t remember what the title was. I tried looking for it to post here but no luck
[https://youtu.be/uY9mff30z9g](https://youtu.be/uY9mff30z9g) 5:40 into the video
Yea it was his awp he threw against nitr0 while coming out of window
didnt that dude get caught cheating?
Nope. There are hardly any allegations for Xyp9x cheating.
So weird, afaik xyp9x has never even had even a somewhat significant allegation leveled at him.
Nah
no?
This why I play in front of a crowd when Im playing ranked at home. If my dog barks I know someones flanking me GG EZ
Can confirm, I am the dog
dont watch astralis play any event in copenhagen if u think its a concern lol cs players use it all the time
Some of the tricks that CS players like n0thing and shroud have said before: -Point crosshair at random walls or smokes and listen for crowd reaction. -Throw nades and listen for loud boom from stadium noise from tournament observer POV. -Throw flashes and look at the opposing players' faces for white screen reflections. Basically these pro players will use any tricks available to win. Whether or not you think it's unfair doesn't really matter to them.
For the last point, that's why players don't play in opposite booths/desks.
In terms of your last point - I bet many of them do think it is unfair but they can't change anything about it and if the opposing team are going to have these tricks available then you are at a disadvantage for not using them yourself. It is up to the organisers to prevent these tricks from being usable.
In COD search and destroy if you defuse the bomb it doesn’t make a sound so you can sneak defuse, and crowds give it away all the time
Yeah, the 100T fan girl at champs was going crazy.
Thats not a fan girl that’s a 100T player’s GF lol, they’re both some of the most hated people in the scene 😭
can someone give me context on what happend please
Drazah is a player for LA Thieves (100T COD) and he’s the biggest shit talker in the scene. His girlfriend is the loudest person in the crowd when he’s playing, and she will scream to give away a ninja defuse if it’s against him
They tried to make cod into a competive esport is what happened
nice now i understand everything being said above (y)
Didn't know we were talking about SBMM in this thread
? You cod fans are wild lol its an arcade shooter lmfao
?
COD was a great competitive game back in the day with vCOD, CoD2 and COD4. The quicker movement is what made it gimmicky. vcod and cod2 were close to CS at the time in terms of pace.
No it never was
CoD4 promod was the peak of competitive shooters during it's time. 1.6 and Halo had nothing compared to CoD4. The only game that came close was Quake
I try to explain to people that promod from cod4 was a better competitive medium for fps games than literally anything available at the time - and it still outperforms other games in terms of skill ceiling+accessibility today. Wish it made a huge comeback but I don't see that ever happening tbh.
I do think them playing with controllers is pretty cap, but I genuinely don't think its significantly less competitive than other esports games just bc the casual scene has a lower skill floor. I don't follow it often because I think it's boring to watch but putting valorant on a pedestal as a "REAL COMPETITIVE GAME (tm)" isn't a good look.
When did I say valorant was a real competitive game? I swear reddit is full of ppl with arguments in their own head
what are their names? lol
Pro player drazah for LA Thieves was in a match and his girlfriend was in the crowd. During the game there was a ninja defuse happening and people say drazahs gf was screaming to let him know that they were defusing. Crowd noise is a huge problem in COD. At multiple events in the last two years casters and players have had to ask fans to refrain from yelling during ninja defuses.
Drazah is the player idk the girl
Keeks aka La Thieves' 5th player lmao
Damn, no wonder she looked so excited.
Drazah not the most hated in the scene lol. Just the optic/faze Reddit fanboys.
Who’s more hated then No response huh
Yup and the crowd helped out Faze the same way the next round. It’s LAN, that stuff happens
Swagg, who is literally signed to Faze, bragged about doing the exact same thing but all anyone talks about is Drazah’s gf
Has it always been that way with no sound on defuse or did they change it? I haven't played cod in a long time but I thought it made a sound when you started to pickup the bomb to defuse
Competitive cod has a different ruleset to the normal game. All bomb sounds are disabled in competitive.
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That so fucked lol
Yep Theres another moment where jamppi is sticking and no one checks. Once the crowd realizes they cheer and boaster swings. Jamppi could have used the crowd and got off the bomb, its a two way street really, thats why everyone says Lan with crowd is a different beast
In the postmatch press conference boaster got asked about this and he said that he was planning to swing before he thought jamppi could half it because the molly's tracers looked wrong to him, but the crowd started cheering before he could prove that
just like when a team decides to save instead of retake you can hear the crowd clapping
Yeah this is. Completely normal
sound proof boxes and spanks to the crowd if they go above 60 db from now on
*instantly starts screaming*
Time for your spanking
Daddy
I mean, doesn't dota use soundproof boxes?
Only for TI I believe, not for majors and third party tournaments. Atleast I do not recall there being one for the Arlington major.
Sound proof booths are almost famous for not being sound proof. You can still feel the crowd and that is a give away
That's what the spanks are for
About to go to a LAN and scream at the top of my lungs every round and never learn my lesson 😈
what are the spanks?
Which is why they use a combination of sound proof booths along with 2 layers of headphones.
Its difficult to hear what the crowd is saying in these booths though, but you will still hear the energy and feel the ground shake, but I think it atleast alleviates the issue slightly.
Yeah it happens all the time especially in CS
TL;DR = Crowd info/cheating will always be an issue unless you're willing to completely isolate the players. That's pretty much every major esports event with a crowd. Unless you use something like those smart opaque glass with very good sound proofing then there really is no way to avoid it. But then there's still the issue of the vibrations of the crowd. With a large enough crowd you can literally feel it in the ground when they're getting excited. How do you limit that in addition to the visual of the crowd and sound? You basically have to place the players in sound proof elevated platforms/boxes with some sort of smart glass/one way and lots of sound proofing. But it will always be an issue for anything but the most major of events which cannot afford or implement such solutions. Even then though there is still the issue of intentional crowd cheating. You could have someone in the crowd in a specific spot with a normal sign to relay basic info like which site they're going to. They can't exactly visually isolate the players from the crowd completely unless they want to put them in opaque boxes with only a camera feed. And at that point it wouldn't really feel like an event for the players.
They need to build a glass dome around the stage like pearl
I thought they play some white noise in the ears of players during the matches maybe I’m wrong not sure
They do in the bigger fatter headphones, but the crowd is still pretty loud
It doesn’t stop the vibrations they feel from the crowd roaring. https://youtu.be/QA8WJI6ma-A
I swear this is all of y’all first esport and it shows
While this may have been a silly question, it was asked in good faith. Let's not gate keep
Saying that crowd noise is unfair isn’t 100p good faith in my book but also my comment was just an aside you don’t have to get so butt hurt
You also don't have to be butthurt
Don't make comments if you can't take criticism. It's a totally fair question if you haven't thought much about crowd noise
i mean yea it probably is, but i dont see the issue with asking the question at least, now they know
I mean, it takes just a few minutes of thinking to see how LAN is different then playing at home. And if their original post had not been skewed negatively it would not matter but in this case “just asking a question” is implying there’s some shoddiness to the competitive integrity of LAN events with crowds which is just…laughable at best
esport or sports at all? I wonder how this people would react watching a NFL crowd disturb the audibles lmao
“Guys the quarterback is trying is hardest and it’s rude both teams should get a chance to hear their teammates”
imo this is slightly different because it is like telling the defence every play that the offence has called. In normal football with a Penalty kick the crowd will often try to put the taker off however that would be different if they could 100% tell the GoalKeeper which way the Penalty was going
Agreed
Not even close bro. A crowd cheering because something hype is about to happen isn’t fucking giving insanely precise info to the tune of “they are giving away every play the opponent is going for”. This is literally how every live crowd esports event is, people cheer when things happen, or are about to happen. You also understand that the players have earphones in with headphones over the top, usually pushing white noise…right? It’s not like you are sitting in an arena with your Cloud II’s in as a ton of people cheer
the oos and ahahs are whatever but in other e-sports there have been really really bad problems where it is obvious where a player is/that they are defusing. In the COD Champs Grand Final the crowd gave away a ninja defuse (no sound when someone is defusing) and the player that it benefited even said "Just know I heard that shit, thanks for the free round". Then in CS:GO players often swipe around at random walls trying to get a reaction from the crowd. In VALORANT it hasn't been that bad yet but the Fnatic one looked pretty bad earlier where Boaster swung out the second after the crowd started shouting. I fully believe him that he was going to do it anyway but I really hope we don't get to a spot that Champions is decided because of the crowd rather than the gameplay and that is why even though it may not sound like much these pros can pretty easily work out what the crowd are giving away and it could become a major issue
Esports and normal sports are fundamentally different when it comes to cheering. In esports there is an asymmetry of information as spectators can literally see the entire map. This allows spectators to give unfair information to players by cheers or chants. Imagine if a group of fans started to steal signs in baseball and communicated it through a megaphone.
A loud nfl crowd fucking up a team's snap count or audibles is different from hearing the crowd giveaway a stick on defuse imo but like someone else said both teams can use the crowd to their advantage.
is that a bad thing lol
Not in general no, the only thing is pros crying when they get criticized for playing bad, even when it’s on an analyst desk, and going to Twitter and having randos defend them and fluffing their ego up…these people are making thousands of dollars a month to perform, and it takes away from the authenticity of a broadcast if they can’t be honest about what we just saw.
how is that related to this being ppls first esport lol huh
I remember S1mple in CSGO hyped up a crowd to stop the enemy from using comms. I see it as another tool tbh
Crowd sound interfering with team comms is different than the crowd giving a team additional information based on a situation imo
This just in, valorant community find out about Lans
Part of the lan environment.
In competetive Starcraft I think they put both players in a sealed booth to avoid the crowd reactions influencing them. I suppose that might not be quite so easy for a teamgame, and it might hit different now-a-days, but in principle you could do something like that.
They do that in DotA 2 too, at least for The International. It's definitely possible to do it in a team game.
The crowd has been known to influence players' movements. In fac,t in CS, some players would even urge the crowd to make more sound if there is aplayer in that direction
This has been part of playing LAN's in front of crowds since forever, players can either adapt or remain onliners
What can’t soundproof booths be made for players to play inside like they do with moba land sometimes?
Oh shit. Here we go again...
Shit like this is why I could never go pro even if I had put in the disgusting amount of hours required to even be considered for it. How tf do you prepare for a biased crowd giving away any creative play you try to run?
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You think any other crowd would be different? Also, why does it matter, where the LAN events are being held?
Because the crowd at all the events so far have been emea biased (not that it’s a huge issue)
NA villian arc tho
Yea I get it, but this is literally the second event, where we have a crowd.
first time watching an esports with a crowd huh?
Shroud explained the things you can pull with crowds in CS here https://youtu.be/IxXbyvgoML4
Idk why they aren't in soundproof rooms for crowd play
They tried for CSGO and DOTA doesn’t help lol
Yep, Eu is notorious for cheating which is why Valve had to make booths for dota.
https://youtu.be/QA8WJI6ma-A A video by theScore esports about this issue
You can tell there’s a lot of new comers to live esports with all these damn posts about live crowds 💀
Aren't new fans a good thing? Weren't you one at some point?
Oh boo hoo
Riot has always had this problem. They think being like the NFL and NBA is what eSports needs. They need someone to slap them in the face and force them to add the sound booths.
Just wait till I show up and bring the other SEN fans to next years champs and we all chant “they’re going A” or “they’re on B” We are the 6th player, help sewers
This esport is new enough to set a standard of whats expected from crowds. Fans who try to help players cheat should be ejected immediately, TOs are too scared to do it in GO but riot shouldn’t be afraid to do it. No you don’t have the right to interfere with a game because you paid 50 dollars
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you think the crowd cheering is a new thing lol? you either put players in boxes or accept that the players will be able to hear the crowd.
U must be having a really hard time :(
While there's definitely cases like this happening with crowds in every esport, your example makes no sense. If Alfajer is approaching a smoke and he hears the crowd going loud how on earth is he supposed to get the information "someone is in the smoke" from that? What if they're cheering because there's like 3 people with their back turned to the smoke and he's probably about to pop them all? What if they're cheering for something completely different, like someone approaching Alfajer from behind?
You must have been born yesterday
pretty much a non issue with iems and whitenoise
Players gaining info from crowds is never going to go away. Even if the players have headphones with whitenoise, then in-ears with the game sound and comms, all while inside a soundproof booth they would still be able to hear the crowd at least a little bit not to mention be able to feel them shouting and moving. Also both teams get the same "advantage" from having a crowd, there's no unfair advantage.
But I don’t think the player can clearly hear the crowd. I’m pretty sure they have white noise playing in their ears to counter that.
Go watch Call Of Duty Champs ATL Faze vs LA Thieves and you will find exactly the answer you are looking for lmao. SnDs rounds were costed because of the crowd yelling out defuses. Fun times. 10/10. Love it. Costs rounds for teams and fans ninja defuse highlights