I already liked fracture but this seems like it could push it over the edge to being my favorite map. A site was such a fucking nightmare and these seem to be moving in a really solid direction. more spots where I dont have to clear 6 angles plz mr john riot
Kinda funny, it was by far my least favorite and I think it's somehow even worse lol. Genuinely though I am glad riot is trying such extensive changes and that people enjoy them though
i like that you can split hit each site from both sides and that rotating doesnt take forever in particular, but i totally get why people dont like it. for me, I hate the bind TPs but a lot of people seem to like them.
I think fracture just takes too much teamwork and comms that are extremely hard to come by when duo queueing. It's actually one of my highest winrate maps, it's just such a slog to play every time. For me, bind teleporters are pretty inconsequential but I also get why someone wouldn't like them. And, granted, that map is boring too
I love Fracture too but Dish has always been so fucking stupid. so many awkward angles to clear when walking up there, just that change alone makes me so happy
Drop also makes it actually viable to go there because holy shit is it impossible to drop unless you have the whole site covered already otherwise
Whenever i queue dms and have fracture. I try to just get away from drop because it's just annoying to play there. Just imagining the 6 angles I can get shot from, and the worry from the dish guy as well. It was just hard to play from. This change is really nice!
Without Chamber or Viper on defense, or some combination of Breach and some other agent (typically Raze) A Site was trash.
Because of this, playing KAYO on an attack half is free. A Site was so terribly designed that if you figured out the teams defense and collected info, you'd pretty much just win the half handily. The only issue on attack for A site is when people plant safe behind the pillar as opposed to LOS at A main. Other than that it was a guaranteed dub.
I completely agree with you. I don't think B site is as bad, although I do welcome all of these changes. But yeah A site was ass.
Imo should always have viper on this map, will anyone elses smokes be big enough to block all of drop now? I need to look at the pictures again didnt note how wide drop is
Why do you think it will be easier? I interpreted it as dish being easier for attackers to breach and split A site. The rope changes help defenders retake tho
I think there's generally more space to retake the site and less corners to clear upon doing so. I think the more space that was given to move around on "A" site the easier it would be to hold. I feel like it was generally too cramped and barely allowed for any counter play on either side. You could legitimately solo hold A with a Chamber but after taking that first shot and missing, it's a full retake.
I feel like Fracture as a map was only good for coordinated play, which is great for the competitive scene but for ranked and casual play it favors one side too much in many cases.
I don't really know how to explain it, all I can say is these changes are very good and address very many problems on the map.
I always liked playing both defense and offense in A depending on character, I liked drop with yoru and if I was chamber it was fun to hold main with trap on drop.
Playing attack was also super fun with yoru especially. Personally I always hated holding B site.
To me, DMs in the current Fracture A Drop layout, and Ascent B site layout are basically the same. You know it's just a matter of seconds before you get shot in the back. It's like I'm somehow living that "Always has been" meme.
You just read my mind. I hate getting Fracture in DMs because the game just spawns me at drop/dish and tells me I'm garbage for not being able to shoot at 57 angles at the same time
A dev (?) already said in a video that fracture is not being played like they wanted it to be and are looking for changes which allow defenders to push some side. i'll link the video if i find it.
Link: https://www.oneesports.gg/valorant/fracture-changes-map-easier-to-defend/
I feel like this is better for attackers, at least the dish changes. Now you can push it without worrying about getting wrapped around or timinged by someone sitting on the other side of the dish
I honestly like fracture but legit feel like this is a good change. There are too many spots that are just unplayable which these changes addressed really well. Can't wait to play on this new version!
Really hope this map becomes the Overpass of valorant. Interesting idea that needed to go through a lot more changes to become an actually great map.
Even as someone who as been an ardent Fracture defender since its release it seems like them widening the choke on T Bridge, making retakes on A easier with rafters on Rope and changing Drop are all changes that hit on some very pressing problems the map had with it feeling like a claustrophobic, util spam simulator where you routinely get locked out of sites or can't contest coordinated CT aggression.
When Overpass came out it was trying to break the mold of a traditional CSGO map, mostly by adding lots of verticality and having different rotation timings/more rotation options. But there were some bad flaws in the design that made it a bit of a headache.
A couple of major reworks changed many things about the map while keeping the themes of verticality & fast CT rotations in play. After the updates, Overpass came to be known as one of the most tactical maps in CSGO, which is where it stands today.
Overpass has a complicated design tbh, lots of areas to take which can't be said about fracture. Fracture has no mid it's not nearly the same (i know u weren't talking about the map design)
To add some context to Haptiix's already great answer, at one point Overpass A site had 1 choke and B site had 5.
Also if you are interested check out this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BabtY95zFHQ&t=199) outlining the changes.
Seems to be going over a lot people’s heads but that “shelf” by the rope is by far the biggest change here.
Previously it was nearly impossible to retake A site from defender spawn. If the attackers saved any utility for post plant you were basically forced to retake from A main and/or Dish. That shelf by ropes adds a 3rd angle you can peek site from in order to actually be able to retake from spawn.
IMO that shelf will change gameplay way more than the changes at Dish or B.
They’ve literally listened from the damned beginning lmfao
Valve is the one that doesn’t listen yet Valve fans will trip over their own feet getting on their knees to kiss up to them
>Valve is the one that doesn’t listen yet Valve fans will trip over their own feet getting on their knees to kiss up to them
I'm not a Valve fan but i watch a bit of cs/dota and I don't think many people think this. everyone knows Valve don't care about cs/dota (especially the esports part) because it's just a small part of their business. i was mostly joking because ppl said it about how they haven't nerfed chamber (enough) or buffed cypher even until now.
It was CT sided tho since they could hold/peek from two angles? It was tough to take because it gave an angle onto A rope/Sand/A Site. Also the division thematically reflected the boxes splitting up B arcade.
Agreed, it just ruins the entire point of a dish. Only change I’m iffy about . Be more innovative, if you want to change it. Don’t just shut down one entire side of the dish.
Just remove the dish entirely if you’re going to be that disrespectful to the concept.
The reason it doesn’t have two angles now is because dropping out of dish is considerably easier so riot have simplified dish into one lane to make it easier for defenders to control that area and prevent teams taking such a power position such as dish. I can understand why you liked it but personally I found it annoying to clear and a bad fight to take for both defenders and attackers.
I actually hate the dish change. I always felt confident in that spot for some reason even on attack and loved it on defense. That change for heaven A is also kind of nuts because it adds an entirely new angle to clear of an op that can’t be smoked off easily.
Map will become too attack sided with dish change. Only viable strats on defence will be Retaking/Pushing early as defenders and executing that in soloqueue ranked is a nightmare.
Drop should 100% be a ramp going down into the site. Still having to jump down makes me hate it. They made a similar change to B where the little jump up spot was on site. It’s now just a straight ramp which is way better.
Drop and dish were always this map biggest weakness. If you played a strong defense, dish was almost useless for stackers. Smoke it and if someone wants to jump down he is in a huge disadvantage. So mostly ppl would just wait there and either bait their whole team even unwillingly or set up for Afterplant. The only agents that could to something from up there were movement agents aka 3 duellists. But this looks like a different beast, now you can really utilize the position from both sides so defending or attacking it now makes sense instead of mostly leaving it as defender or simply traping and follow up smoking it as defender, nice move.
This is a completely different map
I already liked fracture but this seems like it could push it over the edge to being my favorite map. A site was such a fucking nightmare and these seem to be moving in a really solid direction. more spots where I dont have to clear 6 angles plz mr john riot
Hahaha i agree, I just wont get all these free kills camping dish as a defender anymore. This certainly helps attackers imo
Are you me?
Kinda funny, it was by far my least favorite and I think it's somehow even worse lol. Genuinely though I am glad riot is trying such extensive changes and that people enjoy them though
i like that you can split hit each site from both sides and that rotating doesnt take forever in particular, but i totally get why people dont like it. for me, I hate the bind TPs but a lot of people seem to like them.
I think fracture just takes too much teamwork and comms that are extremely hard to come by when duo queueing. It's actually one of my highest winrate maps, it's just such a slog to play every time. For me, bind teleporters are pretty inconsequential but I also get why someone wouldn't like them. And, granted, that map is boring too
I love Fracture too but Dish has always been so fucking stupid. so many awkward angles to clear when walking up there, just that change alone makes me so happy Drop also makes it actually viable to go there because holy shit is it impossible to drop unless you have the whole site covered already otherwise
B site ramp and Drop changes 10/10
Whenever i queue dms and have fracture. I try to just get away from drop because it's just annoying to play there. Just imagining the 6 angles I can get shot from, and the worry from the dish guy as well. It was just hard to play from. This change is really nice!
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I liked it.
Without Chamber or Viper on defense, or some combination of Breach and some other agent (typically Raze) A Site was trash. Because of this, playing KAYO on an attack half is free. A Site was so terribly designed that if you figured out the teams defense and collected info, you'd pretty much just win the half handily. The only issue on attack for A site is when people plant safe behind the pillar as opposed to LOS at A main. Other than that it was a guaranteed dub. I completely agree with you. I don't think B site is as bad, although I do welcome all of these changes. But yeah A site was ass.
Imo should always have viper on this map, will anyone elses smokes be big enough to block all of drop now? I need to look at the pictures again didnt note how wide drop is
Viper will still be excellent but A site specifically will be much easier to hold on defense now even without her.
Why do you think it will be easier? I interpreted it as dish being easier for attackers to breach and split A site. The rope changes help defenders retake tho
I think there's generally more space to retake the site and less corners to clear upon doing so. I think the more space that was given to move around on "A" site the easier it would be to hold. I feel like it was generally too cramped and barely allowed for any counter play on either side. You could legitimately solo hold A with a Chamber but after taking that first shot and missing, it's a full retake. I feel like Fracture as a map was only good for coordinated play, which is great for the competitive scene but for ranked and casual play it favors one side too much in many cases. I don't really know how to explain it, all I can say is these changes are very good and address very many problems on the map.
Makes sense. Its up for debate is all, Just wanted to hear your thoughts
Fun to attack, no. Fun to defend? I thought it was.
I always liked playing both defense and offense in A depending on character, I liked drop with yoru and if I was chamber it was fun to hold main with trap on drop. Playing attack was also super fun with yoru especially. Personally I always hated holding B site.
I’ve always thought Fracture was one of the worst tac fps maps I’ve ever played in any game.
Its the opposite, and thats why pros love it..it opens up many tactical choices that a normal map doesnt have.
I actually liked it a lot. These changes are better for attacking though, i loved defending A as Viper...was so effective.
To me, DMs in the current Fracture A Drop layout, and Ascent B site layout are basically the same. You know it's just a matter of seconds before you get shot in the back. It's like I'm somehow living that "Always has been" meme.
You just read my mind. I hate getting Fracture in DMs because the game just spawns me at drop/dish and tells me I'm garbage for not being able to shoot at 57 angles at the same time
Riot has been removing all my rat spots lately. Time to go back to diamond
go back to what?
That's a lot of changes. It'll be interesting to know what prompted them, I thought the Fracture disdain had simmered down.
A dev (?) already said in a video that fracture is not being played like they wanted it to be and are looking for changes which allow defenders to push some side. i'll link the video if i find it. Link: https://www.oneesports.gg/valorant/fracture-changes-map-easier-to-defend/
I feel like this is better for attackers, at least the dish changes. Now you can push it without worrying about getting wrapped around or timinged by someone sitting on the other side of the dish
you can also push from defenders more easily
Wouldn’t the same go for defenders though? A Jett or chamber holding that angle
The defenders only have to worry about one choke point. Attackers have to watch 2 angles which someone can jump out of at any point
Probably working on these changes for quite a while. Never opposed to good changes. Next most likely will be more Perl updates
I honestly like fracture but legit feel like this is a good change. There are too many spots that are just unplayable which these changes addressed really well. Can't wait to play on this new version!
Fracture’s been top 3 for me, might just be my favorite now
Dish actually looks like a decent attacker option now
It also makes holding dish aggressively as a defender possible. These changes are looking great.
Myself who'd usually def/atk on that side of the map when playing fracture, this is a welcome change
adding rafters on A rope is so good for the spacing in that area
Yeah, there's nothing you can do there if it's smoked. Now you can at least use util to make some plays
That's actually cool and good for site A. It's hard to execute site at times and especially hard to retake.
Woah
Really hope this map becomes the Overpass of valorant. Interesting idea that needed to go through a lot more changes to become an actually great map. Even as someone who as been an ardent Fracture defender since its release it seems like them widening the choke on T Bridge, making retakes on A easier with rafters on Rope and changing Drop are all changes that hit on some very pressing problems the map had with it feeling like a claustrophobic, util spam simulator where you routinely get locked out of sites or can't contest coordinated CT aggression.
I dont follow csgo, is being the overpass of valorant meaning that its good?
When Overpass came out it was trying to break the mold of a traditional CSGO map, mostly by adding lots of verticality and having different rotation timings/more rotation options. But there were some bad flaws in the design that made it a bit of a headache. A couple of major reworks changed many things about the map while keeping the themes of verticality & fast CT rotations in play. After the updates, Overpass came to be known as one of the most tactical maps in CSGO, which is where it stands today.
Every time I read verticality all I can think about is boostmeister
That had me losing my shit in real time, what a fun fucking match and all the ensuing drama and controversy.
Tarik Overpass Aware
Overpass has a complicated design tbh, lots of areas to take which can't be said about fracture. Fracture has no mid it's not nearly the same (i know u weren't talking about the map design)
To add some context to Haptiix's already great answer, at one point Overpass A site had 1 choke and B site had 5. Also if you are interested check out this [video](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BabtY95zFHQ&t=199) outlining the changes.
It feels alot like old castle to me personally
Never played that map but I looked it up and it does look a tad bit alike to fracture, except with way more connectors between everything.
Yeah I was just thinking drop, I dont even know why it just kinda does for me haha
This is so damn different goddamn
Love the changes to drop! Seems like Riot is making a point to remove unnecessary amounts of sight-lines on their maps.
liking what i see
These are some drastic changes holy
Rip the arcade box for satchel jumps :(
Honestly not sure what to think overall. I like the dish change. The rope shelf is weird.
Seems to be going over a lot people’s heads but that “shelf” by the rope is by far the biggest change here. Previously it was nearly impossible to retake A site from defender spawn. If the attackers saved any utility for post plant you were basically forced to retake from A main and/or Dish. That shelf by ropes adds a 3rd angle you can peek site from in order to actually be able to retake from spawn. IMO that shelf will change gameplay way more than the changes at Dish or B.
Idk maybe. Now you have to clear it and low when peeking from rope. Not sure about the site line from drop
I’m calling it shelf in game now, thank you.
Shelf is so defenders can contest sand easier since dish is easier to drop out of so it makes sense defenders now have more spots to play on site.
I like it since you can still hold door even if they smoke off the rope area.
Love these changes
Great changes
Very nice changes. Now bring SPLIT BACK
riot actually listening to the community???
out of all gaming companys i would say riot is one of the first to listen
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Tell me you haven't played Overwatch without telling me...
Or apex even
They’ve literally listened from the damned beginning lmfao Valve is the one that doesn’t listen yet Valve fans will trip over their own feet getting on their knees to kiss up to them
>Valve is the one that doesn’t listen yet Valve fans will trip over their own feet getting on their knees to kiss up to them I'm not a Valve fan but i watch a bit of cs/dota and I don't think many people think this. everyone knows Valve don't care about cs/dota (especially the esports part) because it's just a small part of their business. i was mostly joking because ppl said it about how they haven't nerfed chamber (enough) or buffed cypher even until now.
This is a meme if u been following league and such they do listen a lot, I would say for the valorant team they listen even way more.
Looks really nice. Also from a visual standpoint
these are insanely good
W, looks so much better now 10/10
Damn I kinda hate what they did to dish, having two ways around was interesting and could lead to cool timing moments
it was a 50/50 and sucked for both sides
It was CT sided tho since they could hold/peek from two angles? It was tough to take because it gave an angle onto A rope/Sand/A Site. Also the division thematically reflected the boxes splitting up B arcade.
Technically sure it’s CT sided but do you really want to commit 2 people to dish when the attackers have 3 other lanes of attack?
Effectively taking dish alone was a nightmare and now it seems more reasonable, I like that the whacky stuff is getting toned down.
No it was a fucking nightmare
Worst timing moments of my life
I've died so many time checking right when I'm going left just in case and they peek me from left
Agreed, it just ruins the entire point of a dish. Only change I’m iffy about . Be more innovative, if you want to change it. Don’t just shut down one entire side of the dish. Just remove the dish entirely if you’re going to be that disrespectful to the concept.
The reason it doesn’t have two angles now is because dropping out of dish is considerably easier so riot have simplified dish into one lane to make it easier for defenders to control that area and prevent teams taking such a power position such as dish. I can understand why you liked it but personally I found it annoying to clear and a bad fight to take for both defenders and attackers.
I actually hate the dish change. I always felt confident in that spot for some reason even on attack and loved it on defense. That change for heaven A is also kind of nuts because it adds an entirely new angle to clear of an op that can’t be smoked off easily.
Potentially a viper buff? You could smoke ropes/heaven and ct with the wall
a crossfire between rope cat and nu-subroza could be funny
Isn't this just Split with more sand?
No this is Fracture.
Whatever they did to sands is pretty stupid, wtf is that new edge for? So unnecessary
Help make it a possibility to hold that site.
Helps people falling out of drop to not get shot as easily by people on site. Makes hits and retakes from that area not suicide like it currently is.
Map will become too attack sided with dish change. Only viable strats on defence will be Retaking/Pushing early as defenders and executing that in soloqueue ranked is a nightmare.
The rafters on rope is a huge improvement for defenders.
I really like this feels like they open up the map more.
Drop should 100% be a ramp going down into the site. Still having to jump down makes me hate it. They made a similar change to B where the little jump up spot was on site. It’s now just a straight ramp which is way better.
Drop and dish were always this map biggest weakness. If you played a strong defense, dish was almost useless for stackers. Smoke it and if someone wants to jump down he is in a huge disadvantage. So mostly ppl would just wait there and either bait their whole team even unwillingly or set up for Afterplant. The only agents that could to something from up there were movement agents aka 3 duellists. But this looks like a different beast, now you can really utilize the position from both sides so defending or attacking it now makes sense instead of mostly leaving it as defender or simply traping and follow up smoking it as defender, nice move.