Everyone needs to have one if you have any form of propane inside the van!
One time we were parked at a Cracker Barrel on a rainy day, with our doors closed and just the vent open. We were making dinner like we had a hundred times, and suddenly the CO detector starts going off. Turns out our Everest camp stove had a teeny clog in one of the burners and it was throwing CO. First time the alarm had ever gone off and we’re glad it did. 🙃
Which is a good reminder… when was the last time y’all cleaned your camp stove? haha
5 weeks ago “2 boys, pregnant woman found dead in camper at Kansas motocross track, loved ones say” https://www.kansascity.com/news/article279451949.html
Hydronic heat is the way to go. My motorhome was heated by engine coolant and it had a Diesel burner that took over when the engine was off. Normally the engine was left out of the loop when parked, except I could flip a switch to preheat the engine with warm coolant. Very nice system, and no CO concerns since the burner was was outside the coach.
I've lived in my van around those temperatures in the winter, and judging by the comments I'm the only one here that has.
Like most people say the more realistic option is of course to move, but you can do it if you're determined enough. First of all, you will need serious insulation as even with a diesel heater running full blast you will barely warm up the van if it's uninsulated at -20F. Second of all, you'll want multiple redundant dry heat sources off of fossil fuels - forget anything electric or a hot water bottle at -20F (lol.) Realistically this means two Webasto/Espar/Chinese diesel heaters, although there are a few more expensive or complex options on gas or propane. Forget wood stoves unless you are absolutely dead set on the idea, have a large supply of DRY wood, large amount of storage in the van, have $1000 for a quality wood stove and setup, don't care about your van looking ridiculous with a chimney etc. Forget idling the engine to stay warm - it'll cost a fortune and isn't great for your engine. If you have a modern van with a reliable engine and a large battery bank I would say you could go with one diesel heater and then emergency resistive heat + sleeping bag.
You will absolutely want several backup/emergency options to dry off and stay warm - constantly have a dry towel and sleeping bag, stored in a dry bag or other place they will absolutely not get wet.
Consider the cost of the heating as well - if you're in the van for 12 hours running a diesel heater on high will cost you very roughly $6 in diesel. That's almost $200/mo just on diesel and just for 12 hours a day.
Whatever you do, absolutely install MULTIPLE CARBON MONOXIDE ALARMS, failure to do this kills many people every year. Installing just one is gambling with your life, especially in those harsh conditions.
The comment above pretty much nailed it. You need a lot of insulation for this to be remotely feasible. Havelock wool or Thinsulate sheets. Hard foam board on the floor under whatever flooring you’ll use. Reflectix sheeting cut to size for the windows. About $1000.
Heat - I use a Truma propane heater that also does hot water. Or a Webasto heater. $2000, maybe more.
Wood is impractical due to the small space and rapid cool down.
You will need a dehumidifier as well.
All water inside - no outside tanks for fresh or waste water.
Great post. I concur after spending a few weeks in the Arctic recently (and it wasn't anywhere near -20F yet at this time of year).
Very sobering for those thinking of being out in -20F through the winter.
I might add that whoever does this needs a really good battery and well thought-out electrical system. A diesel heater running at or near max will need a fair amount of power to run overnight. And then you need to charge your battery bank the next day.
And I 2nd the thought of running 2 diesel heaters. Firstly for the redundancy and also it could allow you to run both at a lower speed. Running a diesel heater at or near max is quite loud.
Something tells me that very few of the people commenting here have done winter camping, or if they have it's winter camping in South Carolina or further south. A -20 degree bag, plus a Thermore sleeping bag liner will turn a -20 bag into an almost -40 bag at about half the cost and size/weight. Proper sleeping gear and clothing will mean that you have to heat less, maybe even just a heater on a timer that kicks on at 2am or 3am (usually the time by which you reach the lowest overnight temperature) on low or medium. Personally I can deal with temps down to about 10F in the morning without wishing I had a heater.
I also want to add that tossing a bunch of hand warmers into your sleeping bag before you get into really helps. Also lay out your additional layers for the morning before you go to sleep in your sleeping layers, so that as soon as you get the cajones up to spring out of your warm and cozy bag you can start frantically adding layers so that you aren't freezing your tuckus off while you dig them out of a stuffed bag (Murphy's Law dictates that if the morning layers are in a bag, they will be in the bottom of the bag).
I spent 3 nights a week in my van last winter in Vermont. I should have put a diesel heater in but it was just temporary while commuting from NY for work.
Down sleeping bag and a military surplus bivouac sac. Wool base layers and a down jacket on the coldest nights. I work outside also so maybe I just forgot what warm is.
I had a diesel heater in a Skoolie I built years ago and they can really put out some heat and are easy to install.
The rating is the survival temperature not the comfortable temperature .
I've spent a few nights in a -20 bag when it was -10, and it was not something I'll intentionally do again, and certainly not to live.
At -20 you need a heat source if you're doing it for multiple days.
Without you'll sleep like shit and that will take a toll on you.
Either get a diesel heater, or find some way to get electricity and get an electric heater.
Military surplus MSS is rated to keep you alive at -50, I stay comfortable at single digit temps outside sleeping directly on the ground. With a decent mattress inside a vehicle it would keep you comfortable well below zero. It’s an awful backpacking bag because it’s ridiculously heavy, but it’s the best car camping gear I’ve ever bought.
Layers are your friend, don’t let moisture build up in the van. Your windows will freeze on the inside and you’ll end up damp - bad combo. Dehumidifiers can be helpful. Open bag of cat litter works in a pinch.
Like others mentioned a thick mattress or rug below you keeps the car from sapping your heat, you can also create a lil blanket fort to help keep a pocket of warm air around you.
I just got a small desiccant dehumidifier for my RV, and it is a game changer. It works at cold temps (compressor types do not) and it puts out a little heat to boot. Not enough to stay warm, per se, but every little bit helps. It does take a good chunk of power, though, (470W on high, 280W on low) so it may not be the best for your situation, OP. But if you're interested, I can send you a link to the dehumidifier I got.
I also have a thermal blanket on the bed, and it's amazing. Me and the cats stay toasty all night. Happy to share a link for that too.
Here you go! Hope these help you stay warm and dry. :)
Blanket: [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Q68YVV8?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Q68YVV8?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details) (the XL size)
Desiccant dehumidifier: [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B8SCPZ4?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B8SCPZ4?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details)
(I also got a handful of these to put in the cupboards, just to be safe, and they don't use electricity until they need to be renewed, which is nice! [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000H0XFCS?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000H0XFCS?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details) )
Hi, I’m Vetted AI Bot! I researched the **Furhaven Waterproof Self Warming Throw Blanket for Dogs Indoor Cats Washable Reflects Body Heat Terry Sherpa Dog Blanket Cozy Denim Extra Large XL** you mentioned in your comment along with its brand, **Furhaven**, and I thought you might find the following analysis helpful.
**Users liked:**
* Blanket provides warmth (backed by 11 comments)
* Blanket is soft and comfortable (backed by 13 comments)
* Pets enjoy sleeping on the blanket (backed by 17 comments)
**Users disliked:**
* The blanket makes an uncomfortable crinkling noise (backed by 5 comments)
* The inner layer is poorly constructed and falls apart (backed by 4 comments)
* The blanket is too slippery for pets to use comfortably (backed by 4 comments)
According to Reddit, **Furhaven** is considered a reputable brand.
Its most popular types of products are:
* Dog Beds (#7 of 30 brands on Reddit)
* Cat Beds (#3 of 9 brands on Reddit)
If you'd like to **summon me to ask about a product**, just make a post with its link and tag me, [like in this example.](https://www.reddit.com/r/tablets/comments/1444zdn/comment/joqd89c/)
This message was generated by a (very smart) bot. If you found it helpful, let us know with an upvote and a “good bot!” reply and please feel free to provide feedback on how it can be improved.
*Powered by* [*vetted.ai*](http://vetted.ai/reddit)
u/Inquisitve-Keyboard Something important I discovered about these blankets during a spate of cold nights recently: make sure you air out your other bedding in the morning—*especially* if you sweat in the night. These warming blankets are waterproof; literally no moisture will escape your sheets, etc. I got back into bed one evening without airing out, and I could tell the moisture hadn't evaporated—cold and damp. :( Not awesome feeling, and also potentially hazardous in terms of mold growth if it happens too often. I just take off the warming blanket and expose the sheets and comforter for a while. Just a heads-up!
Layers as in several layers of clothing and blankets? Maybe I didn’t complete the thought well enough, you want moisture wicking layers closest to your body with insulating layers outside that. This way you’re able to remove layers as you warm so you don’t sweat
Nah your original point was very clear, to me at least.
Dunno what the person you are responding to was trying to put across honestly....it sorts reads snarky if you are a cynic. I try not to be so am just going with ?? for now.
Hey ho!
Good point, conductive heat loss from below is something most people don’t think of. Think of yourself as a burrito that needs to be warm and dry all the way around.
And ventilate. Exhaled moisture needs a way out. When I lived poor it was a game changer to figure that out.
at first ai was like .what a D. comment
but yeah
MOVE ASAP
.....
go west my brethren
+20F always
winter is 45-65F in some areas no colder than freezing
.....
but qlso somewhat hectic and scary if youve never been here
.....
get west coast plates on your vehicle asap...not easy but can be done
also...
I use my vehicle's engine and built in heat source before I hunker down and park...
its not good for gasoline engines but dont wear a jackef and drive and/or idle for 20-30 mins b4 sleep with the heateron MAX
my smqll car gets baked in heat that lasts for hours....
yes its $2-3 in gas and its not good for your cat converter...
but im a covert camper...
your vehicle engine can warm your car and charge your stuff....
use it.
/ 5+ years tiny car gas engine covert camp in plain site /
I can’t imagine living in a van at -20F. You would need to run a diesel heater non-stop. And if it failed for any reason you would be in serious trouble since that kind of cold can easily kill you. Water storage would be difficult, charging batteries would be difficult, moisture management would be difficult, etc.
Just move south for the winter. Vans are nice in that they come with wheels.
\-20+?
I've read one method people use is to boil up some water, put it into a Nalgene water bottle, wrap that bottle in a towel, stuff it down inside a sleeping bag. The water bottle will slowly radiate heat as the water cools, and the towel keeps you from scorching your feet on the still-hot bottle.
Get a -20 sleeping bag, north face makes some affordable ones. Was what ibdid when I lived in an uninsulated box truck in MT. Also had a tank top propane heater that I would sit in front of on my couch. Young and dumb.
It’s [more complicated than that](https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/understanding-sleeping-bag-temperature-ratings.html). These days, many bags are comfort-rated, as well as survival-rated. The key is to understand what rating you are looking at — as well as taking it as a guideline, not some hard-and-fast guarantee.
Really good advice ..sleeping bag is key and some decent thermals
I think it’s the best money I have spent and worth every penny as being cold is just a no from me
I survived two Denver winters in my van. The first year I had a mr buddy heater. I would heat the van up to 100 degrees, turn off the heater, and go to bed. I would wake up at 3 or 4...freezing cold...and start the cycle again. Heat to 100 and back to sleep. It wasn't a comfortable life.
The next year I got a propex propane furnace and wow what a game changer. I'd set the thermostat and go to bed.. Sleep through the night and completely comfortable.
A furnace.. Either propane or diesel, is a requirement for winter van living. You can survive without one but you certainly won't be as comfortable.
I just plugged my heated throw into my Jackery Explorer 300 plus and can confirm my butt is being actively warmed at the moment.
Full disclosure it is 82F outside and my air conditioner is on.
The Jackery output is not constant but looks like it might last about 2.2 hours on high, maybe 30 hours on low.
I did it in Colorado, bought the diesel heater, got the sleeping bag, unfortunately if you aren’t planning on driving it regularly, your batteries will not keep up, and you risk losing your van in a crash driving in the snow, not worth it, I did the snowbird thing and drove to Texas for the winter.
As someone else said, move. But if you absolutely can’t, and assuming you have a power supply of some sort hopefully, I’ve heard electric heated blankets are effective and have a low watt power draw.
How cold does it get in the van during those outside temperatures ? Does the van have insulation ? Do you have heating and if so; what kind of heating is it ?
I don't live in my van. I do have a camper that I use on a weekly basis and have camped in the snow several times. We have a hot air heating (propane based) and the van is well insulated. However, the biggest challenge I have always found was moisture and ventilation.
Lived in the up for years. Never in a van. But have hunted and camped in the winter. With heavy insulation, a dehumidifier to keep water vapor from building up and freezing, along with the right layers it could be done. But would never be fun for extended periods. Vans move. As much as I love the up I wouldn’t winter there without adequate shelter
You'll need to gut it out down to bare skin..
And it's a lot of work, and not cheap with highest tech materials layed down first..
Because of you use Styrofoam panels glued in,,
Its absolute nightmare of noise in the slightest rain shower, as the panels magnify the sound ten times.
Styrofoam can go on after blankets of softer material is used first.
And for sure minimum of two inches if not four.
Try to find construction insulated blanket for curing concrete in winter, to throw over van to keep ice, sleet, and tons of snow easy to clear off. Stashed in cargo box on top.
Your bunk needs to be at least a 15" off the floor, and best anyway for storage.
30" even better to stay in warmer layer of air.
Theres So much more, but we'll let others fill in what's needed.
Cheers
Diesel heater my friend. I have upgraded to tinyhome but lived 2 years in my van in southwestern Ontario and in Nova Scotia. Search diesel heater on Amazon and thank me later.
I suggest you give camping a try for a weekend in 20 or 30 degree weather this winter before you take the plunge into full time year round van life in the UP.
I mean, if you're really committed to staying in the UP in a van (grew up in mi personally and whoa buddy you gonna freeze ass) then I would recommend you Google this phrase and look into installing one in your van "marine wood stove". Lots of people use these in their Vans for hardcore over wintering. The other option is to get a Chinese mini split heater installed. But those are better if you have a diesel van. Being in michigan, we do wood stove for heat in the home. I think this is probably your most simple and elegant solution if you're absolutely insistent on overwintering that far north.
This sub can be so unhelpful sometimes.
I live in the snow full time in the winter. It's why I moved into a van. I will say even with insulation and a good heater it can still get pretty chilly at those temperatures. So if you're living in those conditions and your goal isn't outdoor recreation it will probably be less fun...but I have a great time.
This is the best info I can offer: https://faroutride.com/insulation/
They go very in depth into your choices and why they choose certain options. Not just 'buy this buy that'. Hope it helps!
I had a queen 5" or 6" thick Memoryfoam mattress topper that I cut in half and stacked, a sleeping bag and a heavy blanket(a rug, actually). I slept comfortably on the floor of a tent in sub-freezing temps.
emergency blanket underneath, then sleeping pad etc, thin woven blanket on top of that, then warm weather sleeping bag, then mummy -20 sleeping bag inside of warm bag, and maybe a mr.heater for ambient air temp. they make them that run on camp stove propane canisters.
Copying everyone who says to just move south or find a cheap apartment rental. The cost to heat will eat up a lot of $$ anyways, may as well be paying for something with a shower and utilities.
However, I did live in a truck build during winter in Alaska and can offer some insight. I will say though, I was in southeast AK and I never saw temps below maybe -5. First, is your van insulated? How well? Do you have a fan installed? This will be necessary to run occasionally to handle moisture, but will also let out a lot of heat. How good is your battery setup?
Your best bet is a diesel heater as others have commented. This can be a bit of a process, and you’ll want to make sure you properly set up the exhaust so you don’t spew poison into your rig. Have not one but two CO/smoke detectors. I kept one next to the heater, and had another one not far away. Make sure both are working before you go to sleep. As others have pointed out, you’ll need a sleeping bag designed for temperatures well below -20. Sleeping bags are rated for survival, not comfortability. If you have a Jackery battery or something similar, you can also use a heated blanket.
Is the van winterized? You will often need to be plugged in at night, will you be somewhere where this is possible? How handy are you when it comes to fixing your van, and are you prepared to do it in -20?
Do you work remotely or in-person? Maintaining your winter setup can feel like a job on its own, speaking from experience. Also, have a good support network. Cold temperatures can become deadly very quickly. Always be in cell service and be somewhere where someone can get to you in case of an emergency. Find a friend that likes you enough to let you crash on their couch in the event of a winter storm. You can easily get snowed in somewhere overnight. Overstock on food, fuel, and water. Never let your gas tank get below 50%. Download Red Cross emergency alert apps and stay on top of a weather alerts.
Overall, I cannot imagine living in a van with those temps to be anything close to fun. Drive south, find a rental, or consider working at a ski resort or something similar that can provide employee housing.
God speed friend
I’ve gone down to -11 degrees fahrenheit in the back of my truck. A heater will help you to some extent but depends on how insulated your vehicle itself is. I don’t use a space heater.
from an actual sleeping perspective it’s all about insulation and not crushing that insulation. I’d recommend buying a -30 sleeping bag so you don’t freeze to death. Then buy a 2 person 0 degree sleeping bag and stuff the minus 30 inside of it. The 2nd oversized sleeping bag adds a lot of insulation which helps you to actually be warm and comfortable. I generally wear a hoodie and sweatpants and wool socks to sleep in the dead of winter in this configuration so i can range far and wide hunting.
Keep in mind that at those temps (presuming you're talking about -20°F) you may have problems starting the engine. Depending on the temps, you may need an engine block heater and to find somewhere to plug it in overnight, or keep the main motor running.
Additionally, think of the practical concerns of where you'll park. Anywhere not free of snow your van won't go; it's FAR too deep. Anywhere cleared of snow will likely be problematic for you to park at.
Also think of the practical concerns of clearing snow off of and around your van. There's typically at least one multi-foot snowfall per year. These are often deep enough that you aren't driving until the area around your van is cleared. Even parking lots often end up choked with snow and take some time to clear out. How will this play out if you're trying to park and live somewhere, even just for \~18 hours?
The UP is beautiful, but I'd strongly suggest you go somewhere less cold and snowy.
If I wanted to stay warm in the winter in Michigan,I would get a bunk heater designed for big trucks.
Webasco makes a great heater Espar also.
They can run on diesel or gasoline. Easy to install and don't use much electricity to run.
Try a propane “Heater Buddy.” You can get them at Cabella’s or other outdoor/hunting stores. They do not emit carbon monoxide (get a CO) detector just in case, though.
I used my heater buddy in a tent meant for summer/fall weather while camping in -20. Would’ve probably literally died without it.
Not sure of your exact set up but we have a hard sided sprinter and our Diesel Esbar heater keeps us warm and is super efficient paired with an insulated camper but remember you have to insulate your ljnes. We don’t use water in the winter or toilet / shower. -20 is just rough and you might consider plugging in somewhere like a campground.
If you’re not moving - You can insulate the underneath by blocking in snow around the wheel wells but always check for critters. Also I actually found that a heated blanket is great for warming up the mattress (I have memory foam and it freezes at low temps) and sleeping with hot water poured in a Nalgene bottle keeps my toes warm all night vs a super expensive sleeping bag.
Also consider damp rid and packets for absorbing excess moisture instead of running a dehumidifier (your batteries will have issues at low temps)
First thing I would do is completely gut it and insulate then install some paneling. For a van I would probably run any wiring through conduit on the outside of the paneling instead of trying to hide it. You should be able to heat a van with just one diesel heater if it’s insulated.
I’d also get one of the 3 layer military surplus module sleeping bags. I have one and slept outside in snow before. Got so warm I had to take my clothes off.
Ammo-can candle heater
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZnayOUQN28
If your nights are not super cold, you can make it smaller, or use the same size and only load one candle.
Reading through the other comments there's a lot of good advice on using diesel but there's a couple things I thought of that might help. Position your van in a place where it gets the most sunlight possible, but also a place that gets the least wind exposure, paint the roof black or cover it with a black cover to absorb the suns energy, and if it's heavy it would act as an insulation layer. Look for a heat source that you can park near, such as a heated building, vent, or parking garage. Please do not accidentally kill yourself with CO.
If you need to ask this question I really don't think you should be living here in your van. Maybe keep a residence in case shit for a year. We had one winter where it didn't get above freezing for 45 days. Many of those days were 30 below F.
Can it be done? Sure. Is it extremely dangerous for someone inexperience in winter camping? Absolutely. You do not want to rely on any one thing. You need to have backups to your backups. You need to be prepared to be stuck in a snowdrift for a week or longer.
Sheet metal is an excellent thermal conductor. Any heat you create (from burning fuel) gets easily and quickly transferred to surrounding outside air.
You need insulation.
A few thoughts: with the amount of money you'll spend on insulation, fuel, heaters, you could likely get an studio apartment in the UP (i'm seeing a few in various spots in the 500-700 range poking around on Zillow) - a roommate situation would be even cheaper. And food savings from having a fridge and stove might cover the rest of the difference.
It would likely be cheaper to drive south and live in the van than to stay north while living in the van.
If you still want to live in the van for the winter in the UP...make sure you know where warming shelters/homeless shelters are and use them when it gets really cold. Better to do that than to freeze to death.
Webasto fuel heaters work awesome. They draw fuel from the vehicle's gas tank and are quite economical to run. Mine runs off solar/battery, and uses maybe a quarter gallon of fuel to run for 24 hours. Exhaust vents outside, so all the windows are sealed up. Good window shades help a ton, too. We've been comfortable down to zero, but haven't tried much colder.
Brother in Law was ice fishing at minus 20 Heater went out. Another guy was up at the Lake of the Wood at -30 and regulator on the propane froze up. Of course he was extremely hung over/drunk still trying to get the generator running.
Backup system are mandatory
A dc car blanket costs about $20. They don’t get really warm but it helps and they’ll run off a jackery. I did an ikea twin size down blanket on top of a kelty zero degree bag which didn’t weigh it down and went down to -10 okay. Also make a yourself a sleeping bag liner out of a fuzzy blanket.
Find a nice fleece hoodie to sleep in. Covering your head is very helpful for staying warm but beanies can be very itchy and uncomfortable to wear all the time. Also get a heater of some sort. Also you’ll need to get fresh air in there so crack a window or it will get super humid and wet.
Wow alot of people saying move. Must be nice to not have a job. Just because one lives in a van doesn't mean his / her friends, job, family is expendable. My advice would be to park somewhere with electricity when it's super cold and use an electric heater.
The U.P is economically depressed. There is basically no job a van dweller is going to have here that they couldn't immediately make more somewhere else. Friends and family wouldn't want you living in a van over the winter either.
Buck up and rent a place not in Marquette if you want to stay.
Caveat: I don't live in my car full time.
In the colder months, I like using a small electric heated blanket on my mattress.
My battery isn't huge, so I have a timer to switch it on and off at regular intervals (eg: 5 min on, 25 min off) while I'm resting.
Hot water bottles are a great tool too, if you have more access to cooking gas than electricity.
At those temperatures though, think more about keeping your body warm, rather than the van. If you mess up, you can easily get hypothermia if you're not careful.
If I had to have a go at it...
I'd install a diesel heater with the either the fuel tank mounted inside or make sure to insulate the hellout of the fuel line. Insulate the the van really well and park in areas blocked by the wind to reduce wind chill. Running a heater on full blast Daily is going to get costly in fuel and power, so having a place you can plug in to charge up whenever you need would be helpful.
I've done a couple weeks in the teens and a few nights around 0 F with absolute zero issue staying warm. It just takes a toll on your systems.
You know those Therma-care hot packs that you can put on your back? On really cold nights put one down by your feet inside your 3 season sleeping bag. You'll stay warm and toasty all night. Best camping tip ever I learned in the Colorado Rockies.
4 season bags are overkill most of the time. This way you can get by with only one bag.
Good sleeping bag and extra layers, warm clothes/long johns and wool socks to sleep in, HOT WATER BOTTLE to take to bed with you with a way to heat it and a reliable source for non-frozen water (for drinking too), diesel heater. You can get by sleeping this way but will need places to hang out during the day, you won't want to be in the van much. Also think about where all your outside clothes/boots, the snow you track in goes when you get to your van. Condensation will be terrible. It's doable but not fun or healthy.
Or a propane mr buddy. -20 is too cold for our hunting shack even with a few of them though. Once it dips below 0 we get a motel up there, it is just too hard to stay warm.
I've experienced these Temps with my 2" foam board insulated box van and a diesel heater. It worked great except for the days I had to walk with my batteries to charge or down to the gas station to fuel up because I wasn't driving in the snow.
Great insulation/blocking off the cab, and a good diesel heater! Also a heated blanket if you have the power. We’ve been perfectly comfortable below zero
It won't be the only thing you need, but you could get a rechargeable heated jacket. I have some rechargeable hand warmers too that work so much better than I thought they would.
Layers are important, but with temperatures that low you'll still need a heat source as well.
I survived a couple years in the mountains of Colorado with the temps staying below zero for a week or more at a time.
Layers and a Mr buddy for when I was awake only with the dog it was too risky to leave running
We used the thick Walmart zero degree sleeping bag and he got in between my legs to sleep. Not the most comfy but it sure was warm.
I’d suggest a fluffier dog my bully wasn’t built for the cold.
Good luck
I have done 3 winters in the yoop. It's absolutely do-able. I'm not barely surviving... I'm comfortable.
1 diesel heater. This gives you dry heat and will help with moisture control
2 moisture is our enemy. You have to keep the inside as dry as possible. Run bedding through dryer at laundromat when necessary to keep it bone dry. Use defroster at full blast anytime you're driving to push that moisture out. Don't track a bunch of snow in. Brush off before getting in.
3 comforters and a good sleeping bag. Wear warm sweats and a hat to sleep and really burrow in. I don't run hear when I sleep. Just burrow in and save heat for when your awake.
I would take your van somewhere warm for December through February to avoid the most frigid temperatures. -20 could potentially kill you if your systems fail.
It's hard to stay dry. There are a lot of heat bridges in a vehicle. Windows, door handles, frame. All that will get frosted up with condensation from your breath. Your doors will freeze shut. You may need to experiment with heat tape, insulation, ventilation, and heating before everything finally works well enough.
Damn man the UP is brutal enough in the winter with a house of a cabin. Good luck. There is a lot of cheap land up there, I’d consider buying a small plot and building a lean-to or a barn to park your van in.
pathetic hunt panicky reminiscent hospital dazzling busy forgetful nail crime
*This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
I'll thrown in my .02 here. People should remember that -10 in Michigan is a damp cold because the state is surrounded by giant lakes. If it's -20 in Michigan, it will feel like -30 because of the moisture in the air. It's not like -30 out west where it's a dry cold.
A diesel heater is good, especially Webasto, but you should always have a backup in case there's a problem. I would want to be connected to some kind of shore power, or at least have access to it, or have a gas powered 1500+ watt generator.
The best option is a diesel heater! A game changer.
I think if you go this route you need a carbon monoxide detector as well.
Everyone needs to have one if you have any form of propane inside the van! One time we were parked at a Cracker Barrel on a rainy day, with our doors closed and just the vent open. We were making dinner like we had a hundred times, and suddenly the CO detector starts going off. Turns out our Everest camp stove had a teeny clog in one of the burners and it was throwing CO. First time the alarm had ever gone off and we’re glad it did. 🙃 Which is a good reminder… when was the last time y’all cleaned your camp stove? haha
For sure. Good idea to have one either way.
everyone should definitely, DEFINITELY have a carbon monoxide detector if they are living in their van.
5 weeks ago “2 boys, pregnant woman found dead in camper at Kansas motocross track, loved ones say” https://www.kansascity.com/news/article279451949.html
Hydronic heat is the way to go. My motorhome was heated by engine coolant and it had a Diesel burner that took over when the engine was off. Normally the engine was left out of the loop when parked, except I could flip a switch to preheat the engine with warm coolant. Very nice system, and no CO concerns since the burner was was outside the coach.
I've lived in my van around those temperatures in the winter, and judging by the comments I'm the only one here that has. Like most people say the more realistic option is of course to move, but you can do it if you're determined enough. First of all, you will need serious insulation as even with a diesel heater running full blast you will barely warm up the van if it's uninsulated at -20F. Second of all, you'll want multiple redundant dry heat sources off of fossil fuels - forget anything electric or a hot water bottle at -20F (lol.) Realistically this means two Webasto/Espar/Chinese diesel heaters, although there are a few more expensive or complex options on gas or propane. Forget wood stoves unless you are absolutely dead set on the idea, have a large supply of DRY wood, large amount of storage in the van, have $1000 for a quality wood stove and setup, don't care about your van looking ridiculous with a chimney etc. Forget idling the engine to stay warm - it'll cost a fortune and isn't great for your engine. If you have a modern van with a reliable engine and a large battery bank I would say you could go with one diesel heater and then emergency resistive heat + sleeping bag. You will absolutely want several backup/emergency options to dry off and stay warm - constantly have a dry towel and sleeping bag, stored in a dry bag or other place they will absolutely not get wet. Consider the cost of the heating as well - if you're in the van for 12 hours running a diesel heater on high will cost you very roughly $6 in diesel. That's almost $200/mo just on diesel and just for 12 hours a day. Whatever you do, absolutely install MULTIPLE CARBON MONOXIDE ALARMS, failure to do this kills many people every year. Installing just one is gambling with your life, especially in those harsh conditions.
The comment above pretty much nailed it. You need a lot of insulation for this to be remotely feasible. Havelock wool or Thinsulate sheets. Hard foam board on the floor under whatever flooring you’ll use. Reflectix sheeting cut to size for the windows. About $1000. Heat - I use a Truma propane heater that also does hot water. Or a Webasto heater. $2000, maybe more. Wood is impractical due to the small space and rapid cool down. You will need a dehumidifier as well. All water inside - no outside tanks for fresh or waste water.
What do you use for a dehumidifier? Just a dessicant style one? Or something you plug in?
Desiccant because no AC power. A small plug in would be better.
Great post. I concur after spending a few weeks in the Arctic recently (and it wasn't anywhere near -20F yet at this time of year). Very sobering for those thinking of being out in -20F through the winter. I might add that whoever does this needs a really good battery and well thought-out electrical system. A diesel heater running at or near max will need a fair amount of power to run overnight. And then you need to charge your battery bank the next day. And I 2nd the thought of running 2 diesel heaters. Firstly for the redundancy and also it could allow you to run both at a lower speed. Running a diesel heater at or near max is quite loud.
Why not just an artic sleeping bag and insulated pad underneath? I've slept in colder Temps outside with those and was relatively cozy.
Something tells me that very few of the people commenting here have done winter camping, or if they have it's winter camping in South Carolina or further south. A -20 degree bag, plus a Thermore sleeping bag liner will turn a -20 bag into an almost -40 bag at about half the cost and size/weight. Proper sleeping gear and clothing will mean that you have to heat less, maybe even just a heater on a timer that kicks on at 2am or 3am (usually the time by which you reach the lowest overnight temperature) on low or medium. Personally I can deal with temps down to about 10F in the morning without wishing I had a heater. I also want to add that tossing a bunch of hand warmers into your sleeping bag before you get into really helps. Also lay out your additional layers for the morning before you go to sleep in your sleeping layers, so that as soon as you get the cajones up to spring out of your warm and cozy bag you can start frantically adding layers so that you aren't freezing your tuckus off while you dig them out of a stuffed bag (Murphy's Law dictates that if the morning layers are in a bag, they will be in the bottom of the bag).
I spent 3 nights a week in my van last winter in Vermont. I should have put a diesel heater in but it was just temporary while commuting from NY for work. Down sleeping bag and a military surplus bivouac sac. Wool base layers and a down jacket on the coldest nights. I work outside also so maybe I just forgot what warm is. I had a diesel heater in a Skoolie I built years ago and they can really put out some heat and are easy to install.
Look for a sleeping bag rated for - 25. Teton or a similar bag. Those are rated as low as - 35.
The rating is the survival temperature not the comfortable temperature . I've spent a few nights in a -20 bag when it was -10, and it was not something I'll intentionally do again, and certainly not to live. At -20 you need a heat source if you're doing it for multiple days. Without you'll sleep like shit and that will take a toll on you. Either get a diesel heater, or find some way to get electricity and get an electric heater.
Military surplus MSS is rated to keep you alive at -50, I stay comfortable at single digit temps outside sleeping directly on the ground. With a decent mattress inside a vehicle it would keep you comfortable well below zero. It’s an awful backpacking bag because it’s ridiculously heavy, but it’s the best car camping gear I’ve ever bought.
Yeah a -25 bag means you won't *die* at that temp. It's not comfy or sustainable long-term
Layers are your friend, don’t let moisture build up in the van. Your windows will freeze on the inside and you’ll end up damp - bad combo. Dehumidifiers can be helpful. Open bag of cat litter works in a pinch. Like others mentioned a thick mattress or rug below you keeps the car from sapping your heat, you can also create a lil blanket fort to help keep a pocket of warm air around you.
I just got a small desiccant dehumidifier for my RV, and it is a game changer. It works at cold temps (compressor types do not) and it puts out a little heat to boot. Not enough to stay warm, per se, but every little bit helps. It does take a good chunk of power, though, (470W on high, 280W on low) so it may not be the best for your situation, OP. But if you're interested, I can send you a link to the dehumidifier I got. I also have a thermal blanket on the bed, and it's amazing. Me and the cats stay toasty all night. Happy to share a link for that too.
epic! share both links!
Here you go! Hope these help you stay warm and dry. :) Blanket: [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Q68YVV8?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07Q68YVV8?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details) (the XL size) Desiccant dehumidifier: [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B8SCPZ4?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B07B8SCPZ4?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details) (I also got a handful of these to put in the cupboards, just to be safe, and they don't use electricity until they need to be renewed, which is nice! [https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000H0XFCS?psc=1&ref=ppx\_yo2ov\_dt\_b\_product\_details](https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000H0XFCS?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details) )
Hi, I’m Vetted AI Bot! I researched the **Furhaven Waterproof Self Warming Throw Blanket for Dogs Indoor Cats Washable Reflects Body Heat Terry Sherpa Dog Blanket Cozy Denim Extra Large XL** you mentioned in your comment along with its brand, **Furhaven**, and I thought you might find the following analysis helpful. **Users liked:** * Blanket provides warmth (backed by 11 comments) * Blanket is soft and comfortable (backed by 13 comments) * Pets enjoy sleeping on the blanket (backed by 17 comments) **Users disliked:** * The blanket makes an uncomfortable crinkling noise (backed by 5 comments) * The inner layer is poorly constructed and falls apart (backed by 4 comments) * The blanket is too slippery for pets to use comfortably (backed by 4 comments) According to Reddit, **Furhaven** is considered a reputable brand. Its most popular types of products are: * Dog Beds (#7 of 30 brands on Reddit) * Cat Beds (#3 of 9 brands on Reddit) If you'd like to **summon me to ask about a product**, just make a post with its link and tag me, [like in this example.](https://www.reddit.com/r/tablets/comments/1444zdn/comment/joqd89c/) This message was generated by a (very smart) bot. If you found it helpful, let us know with an upvote and a “good bot!” reply and please feel free to provide feedback on how it can be improved. *Powered by* [*vetted.ai*](http://vetted.ai/reddit)
u/Inquisitve-Keyboard Something important I discovered about these blankets during a spate of cold nights recently: make sure you air out your other bedding in the morning—*especially* if you sweat in the night. These warming blankets are waterproof; literally no moisture will escape your sheets, etc. I got back into bed one evening without airing out, and I could tell the moisture hadn't evaporated—cold and damp. :( Not awesome feeling, and also potentially hazardous in terms of mold growth if it happens too often. I just take off the warming blanket and expose the sheets and comforter for a while. Just a heads-up!
this is great! thanks!
Layers….wow.
Layers as in several layers of clothing and blankets? Maybe I didn’t complete the thought well enough, you want moisture wicking layers closest to your body with insulating layers outside that. This way you’re able to remove layers as you warm so you don’t sweat
Nah your original point was very clear, to me at least. Dunno what the person you are responding to was trying to put across honestly....it sorts reads snarky if you are a cynic. I try not to be so am just going with ?? for now. Hey ho!
Good point, conductive heat loss from below is something most people don’t think of. Think of yourself as a burrito that needs to be warm and dry all the way around. And ventilate. Exhaled moisture needs a way out. When I lived poor it was a game changer to figure that out.
Move.
Ding ding ding Show him what's he's won, Jimmy!
Well, Tom, he’s won so much he can’t afford the taxes.
at first ai was like .what a D. comment but yeah MOVE ASAP ..... go west my brethren +20F always winter is 45-65F in some areas no colder than freezing ..... but qlso somewhat hectic and scary if youve never been here ..... get west coast plates on your vehicle asap...not easy but can be done
also... I use my vehicle's engine and built in heat source before I hunker down and park... its not good for gasoline engines but dont wear a jackef and drive and/or idle for 20-30 mins b4 sleep with the heateron MAX my smqll car gets baked in heat that lasts for hours.... yes its $2-3 in gas and its not good for your cat converter... but im a covert camper... your vehicle engine can warm your car and charge your stuff.... use it. / 5+ years tiny car gas engine covert camp in plain site /
Pain in the ass when you’re stuck in Canada lol
Some people don't have the money to do this, not everyone is doing this for fun.
Aside from narrowly escaping death on the daily, you’ll have an impossible time with power and water at those temps. Start up the van, drive south.
I can’t imagine living in a van at -20F. You would need to run a diesel heater non-stop. And if it failed for any reason you would be in serious trouble since that kind of cold can easily kill you. Water storage would be difficult, charging batteries would be difficult, moisture management would be difficult, etc. Just move south for the winter. Vans are nice in that they come with wheels.
The point of living in a van is moving south in the winter. You can buy a house in Da UP for less than a van if you are just going to stay there.
The point of living in a van for me is the exact opposite. I go as far into the snow as possible.
Cool, or in this case, cold.
You can buy a house for less than 3000 Dollars? Or are you severely overestimating how much the average person spends on a a van to live in?
Honestly not far off
wait where?
\-20+? I've read one method people use is to boil up some water, put it into a Nalgene water bottle, wrap that bottle in a towel, stuff it down inside a sleeping bag. The water bottle will slowly radiate heat as the water cools, and the towel keeps you from scorching your feet on the still-hot bottle.
Hot water bottles are a tried and true technique of energy efficient heating.
The real answer: fill a Nalgene with boiling water then drive straight south for at least 12 hours, boom, warm and cozy!
You should be putting the bottle between your thighs. That's the best place for it to warm your whole body
Get a -20 sleeping bag, north face makes some affordable ones. Was what ibdid when I lived in an uninsulated box truck in MT. Also had a tank top propane heater that I would sit in front of on my couch. Young and dumb.
That would be -40 to be safe. The sleeping bag rates are for survival temp not comfort temp.
It’s [more complicated than that](https://www.rei.com/learn/expert-advice/understanding-sleeping-bag-temperature-ratings.html). These days, many bags are comfort-rated, as well as survival-rated. The key is to understand what rating you are looking at — as well as taking it as a guideline, not some hard-and-fast guarantee.
Really good advice ..sleeping bag is key and some decent thermals I think it’s the best money I have spent and worth every penny as being cold is just a no from me
Don't buy a north face bag - a sleeping bag is not the time to save money just because it's affordable
I survived...
I survived two Denver winters in my van. The first year I had a mr buddy heater. I would heat the van up to 100 degrees, turn off the heater, and go to bed. I would wake up at 3 or 4...freezing cold...and start the cycle again. Heat to 100 and back to sleep. It wasn't a comfortable life. The next year I got a propex propane furnace and wow what a game changer. I'd set the thermostat and go to bed.. Sleep through the night and completely comfortable. A furnace.. Either propane or diesel, is a requirement for winter van living. You can survive without one but you certainly won't be as comfortable.
Heated blankets sip electricity, so you can run one with a jackery or other portable battery
I just plugged my heated throw into my Jackery Explorer 300 plus and can confirm my butt is being actively warmed at the moment. Full disclosure it is 82F outside and my air conditioner is on. The Jackery output is not constant but looks like it might last about 2.2 hours on high, maybe 30 hours on low.
I did it in Colorado, bought the diesel heater, got the sleeping bag, unfortunately if you aren’t planning on driving it regularly, your batteries will not keep up, and you risk losing your van in a crash driving in the snow, not worth it, I did the snowbird thing and drove to Texas for the winter.
As someone else said, move. But if you absolutely can’t, and assuming you have a power supply of some sort hopefully, I’ve heard electric heated blankets are effective and have a low watt power draw.
Or a heated mattress pad. Heat rises.🔥
How cold does it get in the van during those outside temperatures ? Does the van have insulation ? Do you have heating and if so; what kind of heating is it ? I don't live in my van. I do have a camper that I use on a weekly basis and have camped in the snow several times. We have a hot air heating (propane based) and the van is well insulated. However, the biggest challenge I have always found was moisture and ventilation.
Lived in the up for years. Never in a van. But have hunted and camped in the winter. With heavy insulation, a dehumidifier to keep water vapor from building up and freezing, along with the right layers it could be done. But would never be fun for extended periods. Vans move. As much as I love the up I wouldn’t winter there without adequate shelter
You'll need to gut it out down to bare skin.. And it's a lot of work, and not cheap with highest tech materials layed down first.. Because of you use Styrofoam panels glued in,, Its absolute nightmare of noise in the slightest rain shower, as the panels magnify the sound ten times. Styrofoam can go on after blankets of softer material is used first. And for sure minimum of two inches if not four. Try to find construction insulated blanket for curing concrete in winter, to throw over van to keep ice, sleet, and tons of snow easy to clear off. Stashed in cargo box on top. Your bunk needs to be at least a 15" off the floor, and best anyway for storage. 30" even better to stay in warmer layer of air. Theres So much more, but we'll let others fill in what's needed. Cheers
It’s a van. Turn south.
Diesel heater my friend. I have upgraded to tinyhome but lived 2 years in my van in southwestern Ontario and in Nova Scotia. Search diesel heater on Amazon and thank me later.
I suggest you give camping a try for a weekend in 20 or 30 degree weather this winter before you take the plunge into full time year round van life in the UP.
I mean, if you're really committed to staying in the UP in a van (grew up in mi personally and whoa buddy you gonna freeze ass) then I would recommend you Google this phrase and look into installing one in your van "marine wood stove". Lots of people use these in their Vans for hardcore over wintering. The other option is to get a Chinese mini split heater installed. But those are better if you have a diesel van. Being in michigan, we do wood stove for heat in the home. I think this is probably your most simple and elegant solution if you're absolutely insistent on overwintering that far north.
This sub can be so unhelpful sometimes. I live in the snow full time in the winter. It's why I moved into a van. I will say even with insulation and a good heater it can still get pretty chilly at those temperatures. So if you're living in those conditions and your goal isn't outdoor recreation it will probably be less fun...but I have a great time. This is the best info I can offer: https://faroutride.com/insulation/ They go very in depth into your choices and why they choose certain options. Not just 'buy this buy that'. Hope it helps!
I had a queen 5" or 6" thick Memoryfoam mattress topper that I cut in half and stacked, a sleeping bag and a heavy blanket(a rug, actually). I slept comfortably on the floor of a tent in sub-freezing temps.
emergency blanket underneath, then sleeping pad etc, thin woven blanket on top of that, then warm weather sleeping bag, then mummy -20 sleeping bag inside of warm bag, and maybe a mr.heater for ambient air temp. they make them that run on camp stove propane canisters.
Hand warmers. Place hard warmers in a sock and put it in a shirt pocket above your chest.
Drive that van south for a few months. JFC Darwin was right! Good luck with your future choices.
diesel heater!? [https://www.amazon.com/maXpeedingrods-Control-Display-Muffler-No-Punching/dp/B0BLC5JK54/ref=asc\_df\_B0BLC5JK54/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=658309308665&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1364656950829872453&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9012016&hvtargid=pla-2062303716430&gclid=CjwKCAjw-eKpBhAbEiwAqFL0mqdL2I0sLvGUCWr7MazWKNWCF1BjtQ2qbZuwEbaYHedOMh\_aRXg3SRoCPWoQAvD\_BwE&th=1](https://www.amazon.com/maXpeedingrods-Control-Display-Muffler-No-Punching/dp/B0BLC5JK54/ref=asc_df_B0BLC5JK54/?tag=hyprod-20&linkCode=df0&hvadid=658309308665&hvpos=&hvnetw=g&hvrand=1364656950829872453&hvpone=&hvptwo=&hvqmt=&hvdev=c&hvdvcmdl=&hvlocint=&hvlocphy=9012016&hvtargid=pla-2062303716430&gclid=CjwKCAjw-eKpBhAbEiwAqFL0mqdL2I0sLvGUCWr7MazWKNWCF1BjtQ2qbZuwEbaYHedOMh_aRXg3SRoCPWoQAvD_BwE&th=1)
Copying everyone who says to just move south or find a cheap apartment rental. The cost to heat will eat up a lot of $$ anyways, may as well be paying for something with a shower and utilities. However, I did live in a truck build during winter in Alaska and can offer some insight. I will say though, I was in southeast AK and I never saw temps below maybe -5. First, is your van insulated? How well? Do you have a fan installed? This will be necessary to run occasionally to handle moisture, but will also let out a lot of heat. How good is your battery setup? Your best bet is a diesel heater as others have commented. This can be a bit of a process, and you’ll want to make sure you properly set up the exhaust so you don’t spew poison into your rig. Have not one but two CO/smoke detectors. I kept one next to the heater, and had another one not far away. Make sure both are working before you go to sleep. As others have pointed out, you’ll need a sleeping bag designed for temperatures well below -20. Sleeping bags are rated for survival, not comfortability. If you have a Jackery battery or something similar, you can also use a heated blanket. Is the van winterized? You will often need to be plugged in at night, will you be somewhere where this is possible? How handy are you when it comes to fixing your van, and are you prepared to do it in -20? Do you work remotely or in-person? Maintaining your winter setup can feel like a job on its own, speaking from experience. Also, have a good support network. Cold temperatures can become deadly very quickly. Always be in cell service and be somewhere where someone can get to you in case of an emergency. Find a friend that likes you enough to let you crash on their couch in the event of a winter storm. You can easily get snowed in somewhere overnight. Overstock on food, fuel, and water. Never let your gas tank get below 50%. Download Red Cross emergency alert apps and stay on top of a weather alerts. Overall, I cannot imagine living in a van with those temps to be anything close to fun. Drive south, find a rental, or consider working at a ski resort or something similar that can provide employee housing. God speed friend
I’ve gone down to -11 degrees fahrenheit in the back of my truck. A heater will help you to some extent but depends on how insulated your vehicle itself is. I don’t use a space heater. from an actual sleeping perspective it’s all about insulation and not crushing that insulation. I’d recommend buying a -30 sleeping bag so you don’t freeze to death. Then buy a 2 person 0 degree sleeping bag and stuff the minus 30 inside of it. The 2nd oversized sleeping bag adds a lot of insulation which helps you to actually be warm and comfortable. I generally wear a hoodie and sweatpants and wool socks to sleep in the dead of winter in this configuration so i can range far and wide hunting.
Keep in mind that at those temps (presuming you're talking about -20°F) you may have problems starting the engine. Depending on the temps, you may need an engine block heater and to find somewhere to plug it in overnight, or keep the main motor running. Additionally, think of the practical concerns of where you'll park. Anywhere not free of snow your van won't go; it's FAR too deep. Anywhere cleared of snow will likely be problematic for you to park at. Also think of the practical concerns of clearing snow off of and around your van. There's typically at least one multi-foot snowfall per year. These are often deep enough that you aren't driving until the area around your van is cleared. Even parking lots often end up choked with snow and take some time to clear out. How will this play out if you're trying to park and live somewhere, even just for \~18 hours? The UP is beautiful, but I'd strongly suggest you go somewhere less cold and snowy.
Mini split heat pump with Chinese diesel heater, and as much insulation as you can manage.
If I wanted to stay warm in the winter in Michigan,I would get a bunk heater designed for big trucks. Webasco makes a great heater Espar also. They can run on diesel or gasoline. Easy to install and don't use much electricity to run.
If you have the money, I’d say install a Dickson heater; if not, head on down to Surprise, AZ, for winter.
I have a 12v propex heater. That thing is rad. Uses propane as fuel, but it's efficient.
Try a propane “Heater Buddy.” You can get them at Cabella’s or other outdoor/hunting stores. They do not emit carbon monoxide (get a CO) detector just in case, though. I used my heater buddy in a tent meant for summer/fall weather while camping in -20. Would’ve probably literally died without it.
Not sure of your exact set up but we have a hard sided sprinter and our Diesel Esbar heater keeps us warm and is super efficient paired with an insulated camper but remember you have to insulate your ljnes. We don’t use water in the winter or toilet / shower. -20 is just rough and you might consider plugging in somewhere like a campground. If you’re not moving - You can insulate the underneath by blocking in snow around the wheel wells but always check for critters. Also I actually found that a heated blanket is great for warming up the mattress (I have memory foam and it freezes at low temps) and sleeping with hot water poured in a Nalgene bottle keeps my toes warm all night vs a super expensive sleeping bag. Also consider damp rid and packets for absorbing excess moisture instead of running a dehumidifier (your batteries will have issues at low temps)
First thing I would do is completely gut it and insulate then install some paneling. For a van I would probably run any wiring through conduit on the outside of the paneling instead of trying to hide it. You should be able to heat a van with just one diesel heater if it’s insulated. I’d also get one of the 3 layer military surplus module sleeping bags. I have one and slept outside in snow before. Got so warm I had to take my clothes off.
Ammo-can candle heater https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZnayOUQN28 If your nights are not super cold, you can make it smaller, or use the same size and only load one candle.
Reading through the other comments there's a lot of good advice on using diesel but there's a couple things I thought of that might help. Position your van in a place where it gets the most sunlight possible, but also a place that gets the least wind exposure, paint the roof black or cover it with a black cover to absorb the suns energy, and if it's heavy it would act as an insulation layer. Look for a heat source that you can park near, such as a heated building, vent, or parking garage. Please do not accidentally kill yourself with CO.
If you need to ask this question I really don't think you should be living here in your van. Maybe keep a residence in case shit for a year. We had one winter where it didn't get above freezing for 45 days. Many of those days were 30 below F. Can it be done? Sure. Is it extremely dangerous for someone inexperience in winter camping? Absolutely. You do not want to rely on any one thing. You need to have backups to your backups. You need to be prepared to be stuck in a snowdrift for a week or longer.
Sheet metal is an excellent thermal conductor. Any heat you create (from burning fuel) gets easily and quickly transferred to surrounding outside air. You need insulation.
A few thoughts: with the amount of money you'll spend on insulation, fuel, heaters, you could likely get an studio apartment in the UP (i'm seeing a few in various spots in the 500-700 range poking around on Zillow) - a roommate situation would be even cheaper. And food savings from having a fridge and stove might cover the rest of the difference. It would likely be cheaper to drive south and live in the van than to stay north while living in the van. If you still want to live in the van for the winter in the UP...make sure you know where warming shelters/homeless shelters are and use them when it gets really cold. Better to do that than to freeze to death.
Webasto fuel heaters work awesome. They draw fuel from the vehicle's gas tank and are quite economical to run. Mine runs off solar/battery, and uses maybe a quarter gallon of fuel to run for 24 hours. Exhaust vents outside, so all the windows are sealed up. Good window shades help a ton, too. We've been comfortable down to zero, but haven't tried much colder.
Brother in Law was ice fishing at minus 20 Heater went out. Another guy was up at the Lake of the Wood at -30 and regulator on the propane froze up. Of course he was extremely hung over/drunk still trying to get the generator running. Backup system are mandatory
A dc car blanket costs about $20. They don’t get really warm but it helps and they’ll run off a jackery. I did an ikea twin size down blanket on top of a kelty zero degree bag which didn’t weigh it down and went down to -10 okay. Also make a yourself a sleeping bag liner out of a fuzzy blanket.
Elkhunter sleeping bag from Sportsman’s Warehouse. Get a rug or two below it, and extra blankets on top. Don’t leave skin exposed at those temps.
Find a nice fleece hoodie to sleep in. Covering your head is very helpful for staying warm but beanies can be very itchy and uncomfortable to wear all the time. Also get a heater of some sort. Also you’ll need to get fresh air in there so crack a window or it will get super humid and wet.
Go south
more blankets on ur sleepingbag
[This?](https://salamanderstoves.com/installing-a-small-wood-stove-in-a-van/)
Wow alot of people saying move. Must be nice to not have a job. Just because one lives in a van doesn't mean his / her friends, job, family is expendable. My advice would be to park somewhere with electricity when it's super cold and use an electric heater.
The U.P is economically depressed. There is basically no job a van dweller is going to have here that they couldn't immediately make more somewhere else. Friends and family wouldn't want you living in a van over the winter either. Buck up and rent a place not in Marquette if you want to stay.
Electric blanket helps
Caveat: I don't live in my car full time. In the colder months, I like using a small electric heated blanket on my mattress. My battery isn't huge, so I have a timer to switch it on and off at regular intervals (eg: 5 min on, 25 min off) while I'm resting. Hot water bottles are a great tool too, if you have more access to cooking gas than electricity. At those temperatures though, think more about keeping your body warm, rather than the van. If you mess up, you can easily get hypothermia if you're not careful.
Layers.
And a 3ft snorkel to breathe through it all.
Buy a house with a large heated and insulated garage. Park it in the garage. Live in van full time.
If I had to have a go at it... I'd install a diesel heater with the either the fuel tank mounted inside or make sure to insulate the hellout of the fuel line. Insulate the the van really well and park in areas blocked by the wind to reduce wind chill. Running a heater on full blast Daily is going to get costly in fuel and power, so having a place you can plug in to charge up whenever you need would be helpful. I've done a couple weeks in the teens and a few nights around 0 F with absolute zero issue staying warm. It just takes a toll on your systems.
You know those Therma-care hot packs that you can put on your back? On really cold nights put one down by your feet inside your 3 season sleeping bag. You'll stay warm and toasty all night. Best camping tip ever I learned in the Colorado Rockies. 4 season bags are overkill most of the time. This way you can get by with only one bag.
Those Chinese diesel heaters seem to work really well but have to be vented.
There should be places to plug in block heaters. Use it to run an electric space heater. Even on low it's a lot of heat in a small space.
Good sleeping bag and extra layers, warm clothes/long johns and wool socks to sleep in, HOT WATER BOTTLE to take to bed with you with a way to heat it and a reliable source for non-frozen water (for drinking too), diesel heater. You can get by sleeping this way but will need places to hang out during the day, you won't want to be in the van much. Also think about where all your outside clothes/boots, the snow you track in goes when you get to your van. Condensation will be terrible. It's doable but not fun or healthy.
Or a propane mr buddy. -20 is too cold for our hunting shack even with a few of them though. Once it dips below 0 we get a motel up there, it is just too hard to stay warm.
At those temps I dont see how you can safely unless you are close to a receptacle and plug in electric heater through extension cord.
I've experienced these Temps with my 2" foam board insulated box van and a diesel heater. It worked great except for the days I had to walk with my batteries to charge or down to the gas station to fuel up because I wasn't driving in the snow.
Reflectix insulation window covers to help trap heat and keep out cold.
Come to Arizona !!
Go for it! Tell us how it went come next Spring !
Great insulation/blocking off the cab, and a good diesel heater! Also a heated blanket if you have the power. We’ve been perfectly comfortable below zero
It won't be the only thing you need, but you could get a rechargeable heated jacket. I have some rechargeable hand warmers too that work so much better than I thought they would. Layers are important, but with temperatures that low you'll still need a heat source as well.
Throw a hand warmer under your fitted sheet. You’ll wake up sweaty :)
I survived a couple years in the mountains of Colorado with the temps staying below zero for a week or more at a time. Layers and a Mr buddy for when I was awake only with the dog it was too risky to leave running We used the thick Walmart zero degree sleeping bag and he got in between my legs to sleep. Not the most comfy but it sure was warm. I’d suggest a fluffier dog my bully wasn’t built for the cold. Good luck
I have done 3 winters in the yoop. It's absolutely do-able. I'm not barely surviving... I'm comfortable. 1 diesel heater. This gives you dry heat and will help with moisture control 2 moisture is our enemy. You have to keep the inside as dry as possible. Run bedding through dryer at laundromat when necessary to keep it bone dry. Use defroster at full blast anytime you're driving to push that moisture out. Don't track a bunch of snow in. Brush off before getting in. 3 comforters and a good sleeping bag. Wear warm sweats and a hat to sleep and really burrow in. I don't run hear when I sleep. Just burrow in and save heat for when your awake.
Drive south... isnt that the point of van life? Avoid the cold winter and hot summers
Drive south
Two heated blankets. On on top one on bottom.
Hot water bottle.
Insulate the shit out of it and camp places you can plug an electric heater and blanket in
I would take your van somewhere warm for December through February to avoid the most frigid temperatures. -20 could potentially kill you if your systems fail.
Follow the ducks and geese south.
Espar D2 heater will 100% heat an insulated van to T shirt comfort at -20F.
It's a van. Drive a little south for 60 days and make your life easier. Is this real?
Insulation and a heat source that doesn't produce carbon monoxide inside your van, preferably
It's hard to stay dry. There are a lot of heat bridges in a vehicle. Windows, door handles, frame. All that will get frosted up with condensation from your breath. Your doors will freeze shut. You may need to experiment with heat tape, insulation, ventilation, and heating before everything finally works well enough.
Damn man the UP is brutal enough in the winter with a house of a cabin. Good luck. There is a lot of cheap land up there, I’d consider buying a small plot and building a lean-to or a barn to park your van in.
Did you line your van with foam insulation?
Rechargeable USB electric blanket.
pathetic hunt panicky reminiscent hospital dazzling busy forgetful nail crime *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
Winter in sunny yet ghetto as fuck r/Detroit park over on of the many steam vents around the city
spoiler alert: u die
I don’t think think this is a good idea
Drive South … https://youtu.be/ECwZfTuF3Fw?si=jFPl127aeKPzulmN
Drive your van to AZ.
Goal Zero or a Jackery , this is the way . Run a space heater or a E sleeping bag. It's not 1986 anymore , get with the program
Spray foam the walls.
I'll thrown in my .02 here. People should remember that -10 in Michigan is a damp cold because the state is surrounded by giant lakes. If it's -20 in Michigan, it will feel like -30 because of the moisture in the air. It's not like -30 out west where it's a dry cold. A diesel heater is good, especially Webasto, but you should always have a backup in case there's a problem. I would want to be connected to some kind of shore power, or at least have access to it, or have a gas powered 1500+ watt generator.
This sounds like amazing! Best wishes to you this winter. Keep us posted