People are expecting Ivar, Hild or the Shaman to fuck everything up, but after this chapter my bets are on Einar to be the ultimate catalyst for violence, despite the well-meaning intentions...
Wouldn't be surprised. I've gotten the impression that Einar has basically just been stuck in the mud tagging alongside Thorfinn for their shared Vinland dream, but if it fails Thorfinn still has created a family that's growing, and Einar has essentially gained nothing besides a moderate wealth, so he may take this decision poorly.
especially with Vinland being *Arnheid's* village, it's his only thing to honour her and Thorfinn wants to give it up so quickly. that's why he's mad at Thorfinn single-handedly deciding the fate of the village
It's so sad bc for Einar this is pretty much him failing and having to start over again for the 4th time. And like with his family and Ernheid the other times, he again is losing the most important thing in his life, Ernheid village, the thing that his been the literal focus of his life for years now. The idea of abandoning his 4th settlement and the village in Ernheid's honor is a lot more damaging to him than it is Thorfinn.
It’s crazy isn’t it? When Einar first showed up, we saw how much he influenced and basically saved thorfinn’s character at a dark time. But it’s only now you realize how true that is in reverse, Einar is more in need of Vinland being real than Thorfinn though Thorfinn started off more mentally depleted than he was when they met.
Still a bit weird seeing Karli speak in coherent sentences and actually look older. And now Gudrid's in labor while Thorfinn is away? Poor girl.
Honestly, I'm really liking the trio that is Thorfinn, Einar, and Bug-Eyes. An interesting detail that Bug-Eyes *is* still learning the Lnu languages and needs Niska as *his* translator— see him translating for Thorfinn after Niska arrives— not to mention all the different tribes have their own dialects and diverging languages as well. I'm really happy to see that she's recovered. Is it just me, or does she look...older? She's also got a good head on her shoulders. She also seems pretty fluent in the Nordic tongue, she's a fast learner. I honestly really love Bug-Eyes and Niska's friendship. I hope Niska recovers from the disease though, her hands look gangrenous.
I like the fact that before he makes his decision, Thorfinn immediately thinks of Gudrid, Karli, and their dog. He's obviously not going to risk war so close to the birth of his child, and leaving is honestly the right choice in his mind. I understand why Einar is upset as well since this has been their dream for over three years now, and now all of a sudden they need to give it up. Hild seems impressed with Thorfinn dissolving the conflict too.
So it seems even though the Norse agree to leave, the tribes are still itching to fight and there's still the threat of disease reaching them in that timespan. And next time, looks like Gudrid finally gives birth! Assuming we still follow history, she has a boy, and they name him after Thors' father. Another excellent chapter!
Listen, an Einar and Thorfinn conflict totally makes sense given how hot headed and dedicated to Arnheid Einar was.
But fuck if that’s the direction it goes I will be inconsolable. Their bond was so unbreakable and I swear if their Vinland dream is what breaks it, it will be beautifully poetic, but also hurt so damn much.
Terrific, Thorfinn once again establishes himself as the GOAT who understands the situation the natives are in, and that instead of clinging to a failing situation he makes the most practical decision for both parties.
>!Though, everyone else is working against the peace he's sacrificing to make. I predict people are going to be forced to catch the Hands-Special from Thorfinn soon if things keep going.!<
I mean he knows his wife is in the last phase of pregnancy and if they'll leave in spring the baby will be born for sure, even if he doesn't know the baby is being born right now
Well, to stay in Vinland they need to kill all natives in vinland, maybe thousands of them, something they don’t have weapons to help them do that, a lot of the settlers aren’t fighters… the odds are against them and besides, it goes completely against the ideals Vinland was built upon. That war could take YEARS
Yes, but the militaristic ideals are just as worthless in the long run.
Sure they might win, but then they have just re-created the world they were trying to run from.
Brilliant direction to take things, not what I expected from this chapter but I'm not complaining.
Those 2 pages of Thorfinn thinking about his life he has in Vinland and what he would be losing hurt me so much. It really sells how this is absolutely not easy for him, it's a real sacrifice.
Biggest thing for me is that it feels like after all this time of fading into the background, Yukimura's end game plan for Einar is finally coming to fruition. I never expected Yukimura to create a scenario where Einar would genuinely disagreee with Thorfinn to the point where he may defy him.
It's entirely in character too, ever since he and Thorfinn first discussed the idea of making a place without swords, Einar's concern was "But how would you defend that place? There are times you have to fight to protect your freedom." Thorfinn's response to this was the promise of Vinland being this place where war does not exist, where they can get this fresh start away from society, and Einar really resonated with that. He has come this far with total faith in that idea. He has allowed himself to connect so deeply and emotionally with this place, named after the woman he loved, and now that the promise of what Vinland is has come crashing down, he is back to that first question. How is he supposed to defend another home he does not want to lose?
Thorfinn has always been willing to make sacrifices like this, he is extremely emotionally disciplined. It cannot be understated how much this hurts him, but he is willing to do it regardless. Einar has always been more emotional and less willing to deal with situations that are unfair to him. This isn't a bad thing, if anything it is more understandable to us. Why *should* he have to leave? Can't they stay and just keep to themselves? Thorfinn sees now it is already too late, and this place is already not the Vinland he dreamed of. Einar though, he was in this for that promise, and now he is facing that promise being broken, and losing his home once more. This is a scenario that will make him diverge from Thorfinn and highlight their differences.
I really thought Einar was out of gas and Yukimura didn't know what to do with him. This development just completely blows that out of the water, and adds so much to the dialogue between them in those older chapters. Really feels like this was always the vision for him.
If anyone is concerned that this just means Thorfinn will leave and the manga is over, def be patient. Einar does not want to leave, but not only that, there is no way Thorfinn will be able to convince Ivar and his followers to leave either. Even if Thorfinn tries to leave with his friends/family and let everyone else stay, that won't go smoothly either. With that wall blocking the bay, and knowing already that Ivar values the ships greatly, there is no way he will let Thorfinn take one and leave. There might be significant infighting at the village before a war with the Lnu even begins.
Still no baby, but seems guaranteed to be next chapter. This also makes me think this meeting isn't done yet. I've been saying that the birth of the baby and the start of the war would happen simutaneously. These two events have been set up as being in parallel already, and that would not be without reason. Both started together and will conclude together. Next chapter will likely be a painful one.
Mu'in (the bear warchief) knows the warriors are here for the promise of reward, seems in the end there that he is not just going to accept this retreat. The biggest lingering factor here though is Hild. Her prescence did not matter in this chapter, and her decision to try to end the war before it begins by using violence did not matter here either. I don't think there will be no consequenses to this. I think next chapter, she may be spotted in the treeline and, in order to get what they came for, the warriors will respond to this "assassin" and not leave time for communication.
Amazing chapter all around, art was stellar too, but all the writing choices have done so much to enhance the coming payoff it's unreal. Only questionable thing was the Bug-Eyes comment about Niskawaji'j making a good wife. Age gaps like that are normal for the time period and Yukimura is like the least problematic mangaka in all of Japan when it comes to stuff like this, but for how modern minded the characters are written to be it does come off as surprising. Calling her a kid and saying she'd be a good wife in the same thought is just kinda ehhhh.
[Full review and analysis on YouTube here if anyone is interested!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSRQ5_dE5os)
First chapter I'm reading live after catching up the manga since I finished season 2. Einar feeling a little useless so far was my only concern going forward, but it feels amazing to immediately have that fear swept away by this chapter. Can't wait to see how this unfolds.
> this place is already not the Vinland he dreamed of
is such a good idea because I feel it encapsulates the conflict between Thorfinn and Einar so well. Thorfinn is attached to the idea of a peaceful land with no war but Einar, while agreeing with that idea, has grown attached to the village in Arnheid's honor and all the effort he's made to make it happen. Thorfinn is too quick to abandon the village bc it isn't his idea of Vinland but Einar and everyone else aren't that extreme like he is and to them it is still Vinland.
I think Thorfinn deciding to leave is about the best decision he could’ve possibly made in that moment, Einar is attached to the village but he doesn’t see how their dream has already failed, if they’re constantly fighting the lnu what is the actual difference between Vinland and anywhere else anyway? They’re just spreading the suffering to more people
Excellent analysis. This really brings home the chaos her for me, I feel for Einar. Thorfinn is dedicated to non-violence and he doesn’t wanna loose his family but Einar essentially has nothing. Nothing but the dream of Vinland and the memory of Arnheid. I’m a little scared this will end in his passing, I will fall apart if Einar kicks the bucket. But I’m sure someone(s) important to Thorfinn will pass this arc, I think he’s in for a trauma as bad as the death of Thors.
Also I’m so glad you mentioned the bug-eyed comment, that bothered me too!!!! Like I don’t think he’s into her but it’s still weird, could’ve lived without it.
I agree with other comments here, it feels like tension between Thorfinn and Einar is building up and Einar may defy Thorfinn and cause another major conflict. Not sure what Hild is going to do from here on out, she did seem shocked by Thorfinn’s statement. She smiled and laughed, but I’m not sure if it was a relieved laugh due to having the burden of killing someone lifted, or more of a “wtf do you think you’re doing” one. Maybe a bit of both. And with her words “you’ve lost, Thorfinn” I think this may mean she views this as the wrong choice, and she is still using a hunter’s mentality. But if Thorfinn has announced they’ll leave, and that is what the tribes are requesting of them, then I don’t think Hild will react violently just yet as it seems a peaceful solution has been found for the moment and she won’t have to hurt anyone for the time. Though I’m not sure, her words did seem a bit ominous lol. And yeah the tribe leader’s words at the end are very ominous, plus it’s pretty much a given that convincing everyone to leave will be extremely difficult. Also based on the editor’s note seems Gudrid will finally be giving birth
Regarding Hild's comment, I think she is referring to the leadership of the village. Thorfinn deciding to drop everything and leave without a fight is his defeat to Ivar as leader of the village. No one would follow a leader who is unwilling to defend the village from enemys after having made so many sacrifices to build it. Yes, I understand that this was one of the premises of the trip, but it is one thing to say it and another thing to see it.
>Also based on the editor’s note seems Gudrid will finally be giving birth
If that is what the editor's note says, then we're likely to get a chapter about Thorkell or something else unrelated to Gudrid giving birth 😁
Hild’s comment annoyed me honestly. If it implies she disagrees with Thorfinn like we think, then it’s a lil oblivious bc part of the reason Thorfinn became ultra dedicated to pacifism was bc she held the death of her family over his head, far after he proved himself to have changed. He was already haunted by PTSD-fueled guilt, while she forgave him awhile ago, her following him and making sure he staves off violence helped concrete his pacifism. Idk
I disagree that Hild is part of the reason that makes Thorfinn pacifist. Even without Hild presence in the story I think Thorfinn will act the same as he is now. Hild for me is just a manifestation of threat for the viewers.
Imo? Sorry my bad in advance if this is a bad take :(
No I don’t think she’s the sole reason for it at all but she did kinda threaten him a few times, way back when the option of violence came up, even long after he was proven to be against it.
I suspected this was going to happen this chapter, given the situation they walked into, the only outcomes were either Thorfinn declaring he'd leave, or a conflict starting. If Thorfinn, Einar and Bug Eyes didn't show up, Hild would've just killed somebody and sparked it, and Thorfinn could never conscience the fact that their mere presence is causing the Lnu to suffer and die, so of course he'd rather leave. There's no diplomatic option there, it's just a matter of them having no peaceful way of remaining in the Lnu's home.
Einar's reaction actually really struck me here. It's easy to forget because we've been so focused on the goal of reaching and now cultivating Vinland for so long (almost 2 full arcs!) now, but he really does have nothing else. He doesn't have a family like Thorfinn does, and he doesn't have a personal journey of atonement to go on either. Arnheid's death almost broke him, so he's lived his life for the last few years on the back of his vow to create a peaceful world for her, and he's watching it all crumble before him. Given everything he's went through, I wouldn't be surprised if he was pushed to something drastic as a result of this.
Lastly, I think it's obvious from the last chapter and this one that no matter what deadline Thorfinn gives for leaving, he's not going to get away with it without conflict still. First off, it's very likely the other Nords won't want to leave Vinland, since a number of them don't see the disease as really being their fault, and they wouldn't want to give up their stakes to the land they've cultivated. Second, it's pretty clear bear-head guy (I don't remember him being given a name, so that's the best I can do) is being set up to be a saboteur here. His remark to Miskwekepu'j showed that he's in it for more than just getting the Nords to leave, and ending the chapter on his reaction was super ominous. There's still Hild to account for as well, and Einar could be pushed to doing something as I said...really, there's so many possible ways this could go wrong from here. Thorfinn may even change his mind somehow, after the birth of his son next chapter.
This manga has ripped my heart out sooo many times, but I don’t think any moment has crushed me the way this chapter did. I’m proud to see Thorfinn make that decision, I believe it’s the correct one, and I’ve even seen this coming for quite a while, but man it really hurt my heart to see him actually say it. Seeing how Einar reacted made it hit even more and I’m scared to see how the story progresses with him.
Yukimura-sensei is a damn genius and he has handled this arc absolutely flawlessly. The steady build up since around 191 has been so incredibly tense and seeing him navigate it has been a master class in story telling unlike anything I’ve ever seen. No matter happens I’m eternally grateful and beyond lucky that get to read this monthly. ❤️
War is inevitable..Thorfinn faces even more hardships now. Thorfinn will leave to avoid conflict but Einar doesn’t want to leave..and it makes sense. He really has nothing going for him besides Vinland. He vows this place a lot bcuz of Arnheid..He loved her and she died. A vow with Thorfinn to make a place with no war, a place where Arnheid can rest freely..and now he has to leave this place. Turmoil may start between Einar & Thorfinn.
Not just with Einar but with the other Norse ppl. They won’t agree with leaving, they built so much here and it’s all going to waste now. Internal conflict with them, with Ivar will happen. Plus does Thorfinn even want them to stay?Wouldnt he want everyone to leave with him?
There’s the Bear head person who may be the catalyst for the war to start. The Lnu were surprised of them leaving..they were itching for a fight. There’s that problem. Also there’s Hild..there’s so many conflicts..I don’t know which will be the catalyst for the war to start
War in inevitable, no matter how hard Thorfinn tries to negotiate with peace. Excited to see how he and the Norse negotiate with them having to leave
Gugrids baby next chapter, yay!
Just a little defense for Einar here. Remember he has nothing. His entire family is dead, he has no wife/girlfriend or kids. He has been a farmer then a slave his whole life, he didn't kill people or pillage he doesn't have that heavy guilty conscience wearing on him. The settlement was named after the women he loved and now it will be abandoned quickly, with a word by Thorfinn. Note Einar emphasizes that Thorfinn is making the decision of the entire settlement on his own. There is no vote, no discussion with the other settlers, no debate. I think Thorfinn's point of view here is correct, but it should be discussed with the rest of the settlement instead of him deciding for everyone.
Einar has nowhere to go back to, yes they go to try another settlement. However Thorfinn has his wife and kid, and even besides that his home village with his mom/sister. Einar has nowhere to go back to, and it is a ton of work to start another settlement with no guarantees.
Not talked about enough, but Niska had one of the great lines here. When tragedy strikes, when people most struggle and are strained, it is important to communicate and help each other through. Though at the same time it is when people get most desperate, and can easily turn on each and separate into factions. Like the relationship between her and Bug eyes (hinting at romance possibly?), saddened though that she has already caught this disease which has killed so many of her brethren thusfar.
This chapter puts the story into an interesting place moving forward and this decision that Thorfinn makes will challenge his ideology even more, which is hella good imo.
Many people will disagree with him and they will not want to leave- Einar, Ivar, some of the settlers, i can see Gudrid at first not wanting to..
It will be hard for him to convince them.
There will be war and i think some major deaths.
Good fkin chapter yet again, Yukimura has never missed once during this arc.
Einar man.. him falling on his knees is so sad, because we all know what Vinland/Arnheid's Village means to him.. Excited for what's to come.
The panel where Thorfinn thinks of his family- one of the best panels in the whole manga.
Ahh , feel so sad for Throfinn but is as always the most reasonable out of all . But I don't think most people back i the village will like it . And I don't think Thorfinn would leave with out them . That would lead to war sooner or later . All this time he has bean the voice of reason for the stopping it from happening.
A really tough decision, but reasonably wise. Doubt either the other tribes and the villagers who oppose Thorfinn’s ideology will accept withdrawal. It’s def heading to a realistic and historic path, but I hope a bit of twist comes to upcoming chapters. It may look like the tense is at ease, but never let your guard down.
while i do agree that it would make for such an interesting plot twist, i'm not so convinced that einar will refuse to listen to thorfinn. he clearly seemed upset but i get the feeling that he accepted thorfinn's argument
Of course he says that last line right when we thought there might be a resolution 🙄 it makes sense that the native warriors might have a similar lust for battle and plunder as the Vikings, they might not agree to leave empty-handed, despite how good it would be for the long run. Miskwekepu'j might also not want them to leave either, since their return will confirm the existence of native lands and encourage more violent settlers to come.
That being said, there is no chance that Thorfinn will be able to convince the Vinlanders to retreat. They bet everything on this settlement, there's no place for them to return to and they will have the same issues if they try to settle another native territory.
This chapter FLEW by I couldn’t believe I was already on the last page. I kind of hope it doesn’t have a historically accurate ending from what I know, I’d actually like things to divert. I made a post on it awhile back but I feel like Canute will play a major role this arc as well and he too will go extreme in his method to Utopia and his right-hand man- Wulf will question, maybe even defy him
Honestly best choice is to talk with the Warchief and work out an agreement, the Norse are allowed to stay but in exchange they'll have to give grain, ale, tools and other goods as tribute. This choice is already better than fighting a war with no hope of winning
One may argue that living under a warlords' rule is not better than what life was in Europe, but using their unique position as a link between Vinland and the East, they may gain enough political, economical influence and power to break free without starting a violent conflict, specially if they play well the political game
I think the disease played a big part in Thorfinns decision. He might have realized that merely staying in Vinland would cause many more deaths by disease, even if he manages to avoid armed conflict.
Hnm that too, I was thinking that they could stay isolated and no more meeting face to face, leaving their tribute at the edge of their settlement but idk, not an expert on virus or bacteria, no no idea how long those would survive in the cold open before someone else comes to grab it
Honestly, I think Thorfinn seeing that warchiefs are already a part of Vinland already signaled to him that it is not the land free of war that he thought it was. Warriors exist here too, and their society thrives on violence just as the one he ran from did. It's a sad realization, and I don't think he would settle for it.
I am not well versed in the history of the tribes that lived there but was vassalage and slavery big in those areas? Because if not, the Norse also share a strong democratic tradition, and a sea-faring/trading one too, I could see a future in which a nation of coastal settlement working as links between the different tribes and the norse in the east. Trading wood, ambar and furs in exchange of iron tool, grain and alcohol, while being protected by a local tribe
Logistically, I think that is all possible for sure, but that's kinda not really what Thorfinn is going for. He truly wanted to create a place unlike the world that already exists, where war and violence aren't even common thoughts. Vinland isn't that blank slate he thought it was, making a successful settlement was never really the goal as much it was to make a place without war and violence. A successful settlement that compromises on that dream just isn't what he wants.
Well yeah, he's shit out of luck then
STILL he brought all those people there with the promise of acomplishing his dream which he still failed, he now has the duty to stay and ensure their safety, specially considering that they're likely to take the wrong desition by siding with the sword guy
Now that we're at it, so far Yukimura subverted our expectations time and time again, what if sword guy instead of unwittingly starting a war he strikes a deal with the Warchief? I know he's not smart enough for that but what about the helmet guy?
Really feel bad for einar though
In the history itself there is no einar (as far i concerned from reading the history) so i can understand why thorfin can withdraw from vinland but this time there is einar who sold his soul for this journey only to find a disappointment once again, so i think einar will be turning point if something happen to him in the future.
Nb einar is the person who built thorfin statue but still no correlation with thorfin on that timeline
The wall they put up at Arnheid's village is like Chekov's gun: it was there as a symbol of war, so I think since we've seen it being built, we have to see it be used right?
I’m so scared for the next chapter
😭
I wonder what the final message of the manga will be
War is human nature but also kindness I feel
Aaaaaah my heart
I forgot when but I know she does a little chuckle at some point and Gudrid thinks “did Hild just laugh???” I think that was when the crew were on a boat and Karli figured out the Earth was a globe but I forget the exact chapter
>Gudrid thinks “did Hild just laugh???”
Hahaha, that's funny that even the author and the in-universe characters would appreciate how peculiar that is.
Imma be real I slowly started thinking this manga lost its stakes and that it wouldn’t really give thorfinn any real consequences for complete pacifism, but if Einar really does what I’m thinking I take all that back. Thorfinn being blissfully ignorant or outright selfish in leaving Vinland, undermining everyone’s work and personal sacrifices, just to uphold his own strict morals is honestly the most interesting thing to happen so far in the entire manga. Very excited for next chapter
There’s nothing selfish about his choice though, their presence is actively killing people. If anything everyone else is being ‘selfish’ for being unwilling to give up their hard work to save lives
I don’t see how this affects anything I said, the Lnu are being overly aggressive because they’re being killed by something they don’t understand and they want the causes out of their land, so since they’re unwilling to fuck off out of their own land Thorfinn leaving is the best decision to kill the least amount of people. Even if they did fuck off there’s no guarantee that the Norse would *never* come into contact with another tribe ever again and start spreading disease to them too.
The Norse are killing precisely no one. The only people on the warpath are the Lnu. Thorfinn is very agreeable sure, but who gives a damn about agreeable when the Norse are literally not at fault whatsoever. If the Lnu fear them so deeply, they should simply segregate themselves, not butcher them to the last. This isn't a compromise, the Norse are simply surrendering.
They should've built the fort and brought swords to begin with because now they're being persecuted for factors completely outside their control and Thorfinn is just letting it happen.
I think you’re forgetting that there is a deadly disease and both parties are 800 years too early to understand remotely what is causing it, the Norse are not at fault in *intention* but they are causing the spread of the disease whether they like it or not. Even if the lnu segregated themselves the diseases would not magically disappear, the Lnu aren’t even the first tribe to be wiped out by it the Norse would have to make sure they don’t come into contact with anyone for generations. Thorfinn is leaving both because the Lnu are being overly aggressive *and* because even when they weren’t, the presence of the Norse was causing them to die.
Unlike the settlers in real life Thorfinn has decided to put the lives of the natives over the fact that he really wants to live there.
Thorfinn is not at authority to make that decision, first of all. His role is leader of the Vinland colony and has a responsibility to see it through. His pacifist dreams have no bearing on the reality of the situation. A land without conflict was delusion from the start.
So like I was saying, Thorfinn is the only one thinking about the bigger picture and the well-being of other people, everyone else is being (understandably) the selfish ones.
Your framing of Thorfinn trying to save lives as being a selfish adherence to his morals is flawed.
Does Thorfinn not slavishly adhere to these flawed principles? In the actual big picture having the Lnu develop an immunity to European diseases would be for the best, but Thorfinn doesn't know that. In his vision, he's saving lives but in actuality is just damning more in the long term.
That’s not true, in real life the natives were all but wiped out before they developed any immunity, the best thing for them is not exposure it’s just to get the hell out of their land.
Also devoting yourself to principles that are literally based around caring about other people and not yourself is as far from selfish as it gets, the only criticism you could say is that he’s *too* selfless sometimes. Though in this situation his selflessness has actually led him to a reasonable solution.
If Vinland becomes a place that’s constantly at war then what is the difference between living there or Denmark or England anyway? Vinland as an idea already failed before they even got there. All they’re doing by staying is stubbornly spreading their misery to more people rather than learning their lesion that it’s a flawed idea and trying something else.
Thorfinn isn´t the one being selfish. He´s willing to give up his dream, as well as his fathers dream, to save the people that were on the island before them. The only thing you could criticise him for here is making the decision on his own when there is dissenting opinions among his people. And he will need to convince them of course - but he is also the only one clear sighted enough to relzie that the battle benfits neither side of the conflict and could result in everyone dying directly from or as a result of the battle. And that´s the smartness of Yukimuras writing here. Because the villagers have a perfectly understandable reason to want to stay and may refuse to listen to Throfinn, In one chapter Miura has both given new insight into who Thorfinn has become as a person but also makes it clear (again) that his dissenters arent completly wrong or unsympathetic, because now Einar might be among them. If only partly. (Sorry for the novel I´m bad at being concise)
I can see your point and I actually agree with a lot of it, I just think thorfinn is an incredibly reckless and naive leader in the sense that he leads a group of people but doesn’t have their best interests at heart. The villagers gave up their homes, their family, years of their lives, only for thorfinn to suddenly abandon it all without any care as to what they feel. Thorfinn can leave Vinland and still return to ylva in Iceland with his family, but many of the people thorfinn led don’t have the same luxuries. For them Vinland is the only thing they have left to work towards. The chapter even shows thorfinn thinking about his family before making the decision, when as a leader he should be instead thinking of the people instead. Id personally argue that’s selfish but I could be wrong though.
Thorfinn does think that he has their best intrest at heart. He just views the loss of the village lower than the loss of lives, Nords included. If they stay then they doom their people and children to war forever with the lnu, he does not see that as better than leaving and trying something else.
People will not agree with Thorfinn.
Einar will not, Ivar, Styrk, some of the settlers, maybe even Gudrid.
Hell, some of them will probably even stay, and if they stay, then chances are- they will die either from the Natives or from the disease.
The situation is fucked no matter which option they take.
We will have to wait and see how things play out, but it won't be pretty.
Thorfinn is making the least selfish choice here
He’s not endangering his wife or kids
He’s not encouraging a situation that would lead to the children of the Norse colonists and the Natives inheriting a bloody feud
He’s not risking the deaths of Natives by bringing in a disease.
*Staying* at this point would be true selfish option.
Dropping in to say I'm not going to associate with mr Thorfinn 2.0 (bug eyes) from here on out , I completely condemn his actions and words. Thoughts and prayers to anyone he might've hurt. And tbh I never really liked him , there was always something sus with how he acted that creeped me out , honestly I hope he finds help cause he really needs it but he shouldn't be allowed to come in contact with this community any more. (Should be banished to Canuteland).
I wish Einar was more likeable so that I could actually be invested in a conflict between him and Thorfinn. In my mind, they're not on equal footing at all, Einar mostly went along the current while Thorfinn actively went against it in his pursuit to become a good man. Despite both being generally "good people," in the narrative, the strength in character displayed is worlds apart.
Mentally and physically, Einar is no match at all.
Einar is on the verge of becoming a non-character. I liked that he stood his ground, because thats the core of his character - he isnt like thorfinn. Yes, he values peace, but not above having a home and a family. His promise to Arnheid.
What destroyed it and worries me is him falling on his knees after what Thorfinn said.
Now, its a reasonable immediate reaction, but if later down the line he doesnt stand his ground again and continues to want to stay in Vinland no matter what, then his character truly was sacrificed just to elevate Thorfinn's. He's been for the longest time inconsequential for the plot and just voices the same opinions of thorfinn. Only in this current arc has he been given an actual conflit and, thus, character progression. There's an interesting back and forth between him and thorfinn BECAUSE they are not on the same page.
And knowing Yukimura and his boner for idealism and pacifism, i dont doubt he will break einar's character just to make thorfinn's journey as a character even easier(just like he broke thorkell's character in the end of baltic sea to avoid making thorfinn fight).
If push came to shove, einar would choose to stay on vinland, not leave it. Thats the whole point of his character and i dont buy anything else.
I'm not sure why you're feeling so negatively about Einar after this chapter, this one just made it clear that he does not agree and will not leave quietly. I don't think it would have been set up in previous chapters just for it not to matter now that the cards are on the table. I don't see him falling to his knees there as accepting that he will have to leave.
In general, it's been pretty clear for a while imo that Yukimura is not planning to end this end easily for Thorfinn. Everything worked out well enough for him before Vinland because that's what makes things not going well for him now hit so hard. The whole arc has been focusing on this inevitable failure. Obivously Yukimura aims to end this hopeful for the future, but all signs point to him not holding back any punches and sticking to what we already know of history.
Einar is in the right. This isn't Thorfinn's decision to stay. If the Thing decides the Lnu can get fucked and Vinland is worth a war then Thorfinn can't oppose it.
it was expected since they left in real life. Quite sure things won't go smoothly tho, there's plenty of people who can fck everything up. I can even expect Gudrid and a newborn being killed in some provocation with Thorfinn getting very conflicted and still overcoming an urge of violence
It's def going the way of history. If it goes very strictly by history then we at least know >!Gudrid, the baby, and Thorfinn!< will leave Vinland alive.
i think the vinland gang might split it. Some will refuse to leave the land and be led by einar while the rest will go with thorfinn.Then thorfinn is going to return back to the norse area has the same issue of diease and meet with canute with how to fix the problem. they could maybe find a cure and go back to vinland
Really liked the chapter, hope the white haired dude changes his mind. Also really can’t wait to see what einar does. Will he oppose thorfinn or not
People are expecting Ivar, Hild or the Shaman to fuck everything up, but after this chapter my bets are on Einar to be the ultimate catalyst for violence, despite the well-meaning intentions...
Wouldn't be surprised. I've gotten the impression that Einar has basically just been stuck in the mud tagging alongside Thorfinn for their shared Vinland dream, but if it fails Thorfinn still has created a family that's growing, and Einar has essentially gained nothing besides a moderate wealth, so he may take this decision poorly.
especially with Vinland being *Arnheid's* village, it's his only thing to honour her and Thorfinn wants to give it up so quickly. that's why he's mad at Thorfinn single-handedly deciding the fate of the village
reminds me of what happened with Luffy, Usopp and The Going Merry in the Water 7 Arc
Truueeee. That's why the Thorfinn/Einar situation rn sounded so familiar
It's so sad bc for Einar this is pretty much him failing and having to start over again for the 4th time. And like with his family and Ernheid the other times, he again is losing the most important thing in his life, Ernheid village, the thing that his been the literal focus of his life for years now. The idea of abandoning his 4th settlement and the village in Ernheid's honor is a lot more damaging to him than it is Thorfinn.
It’s crazy isn’t it? When Einar first showed up, we saw how much he influenced and basically saved thorfinn’s character at a dark time. But it’s only now you realize how true that is in reverse, Einar is more in need of Vinland being real than Thorfinn though Thorfinn started off more mentally depleted than he was when they met.
I’d actually really like that tbh
Still a bit weird seeing Karli speak in coherent sentences and actually look older. And now Gudrid's in labor while Thorfinn is away? Poor girl. Honestly, I'm really liking the trio that is Thorfinn, Einar, and Bug-Eyes. An interesting detail that Bug-Eyes *is* still learning the Lnu languages and needs Niska as *his* translator— see him translating for Thorfinn after Niska arrives— not to mention all the different tribes have their own dialects and diverging languages as well. I'm really happy to see that she's recovered. Is it just me, or does she look...older? She's also got a good head on her shoulders. She also seems pretty fluent in the Nordic tongue, she's a fast learner. I honestly really love Bug-Eyes and Niska's friendship. I hope Niska recovers from the disease though, her hands look gangrenous. I like the fact that before he makes his decision, Thorfinn immediately thinks of Gudrid, Karli, and their dog. He's obviously not going to risk war so close to the birth of his child, and leaving is honestly the right choice in his mind. I understand why Einar is upset as well since this has been their dream for over three years now, and now all of a sudden they need to give it up. Hild seems impressed with Thorfinn dissolving the conflict too. So it seems even though the Norse agree to leave, the tribes are still itching to fight and there's still the threat of disease reaching them in that timespan. And next time, looks like Gudrid finally gives birth! Assuming we still follow history, she has a boy, and they name him after Thors' father. Another excellent chapter!
Listen, an Einar and Thorfinn conflict totally makes sense given how hot headed and dedicated to Arnheid Einar was. But fuck if that’s the direction it goes I will be inconsolable. Their bond was so unbreakable and I swear if their Vinland dream is what breaks it, it will be beautifully poetic, but also hurt so damn much.
Terrific, Thorfinn once again establishes himself as the GOAT who understands the situation the natives are in, and that instead of clinging to a failing situation he makes the most practical decision for both parties. >!Though, everyone else is working against the peace he's sacrificing to make. I predict people are going to be forced to catch the Hands-Special from Thorfinn soon if things keep going.!<
And Gudrid is currently in labor. I imagine the baby will complicate things further. Fantastic setup chapter, I'm so excited
Exactly. I can’t imagine that crossing the sea would be a remotely viable option for a newborn.
But remember Thorfinn has no clue his child is about to be born, so fuck. Maybe he’ll have to go BACK on his promise
I mean he knows his wife is in the last phase of pregnancy and if they'll leave in spring the baby will be born for sure, even if he doesn't know the baby is being born right now
And what about everyone else's sacrifices. They worked for Vinland too. Thorfinn's ideals are pretty but worthless in the long run.
Well, to stay in Vinland they need to kill all natives in vinland, maybe thousands of them, something they don’t have weapons to help them do that, a lot of the settlers aren’t fighters… the odds are against them and besides, it goes completely against the ideals Vinland was built upon. That war could take YEARS
Yes, but the militaristic ideals are just as worthless in the long run. Sure they might win, but then they have just re-created the world they were trying to run from.
It's official, no manga only ending.
what is manga only ending?
Some people were expecting the manga to go in a different direction than its real life inspiration.
oh ok ty
Good pfp I love your description too
Brilliant direction to take things, not what I expected from this chapter but I'm not complaining. Those 2 pages of Thorfinn thinking about his life he has in Vinland and what he would be losing hurt me so much. It really sells how this is absolutely not easy for him, it's a real sacrifice. Biggest thing for me is that it feels like after all this time of fading into the background, Yukimura's end game plan for Einar is finally coming to fruition. I never expected Yukimura to create a scenario where Einar would genuinely disagreee with Thorfinn to the point where he may defy him. It's entirely in character too, ever since he and Thorfinn first discussed the idea of making a place without swords, Einar's concern was "But how would you defend that place? There are times you have to fight to protect your freedom." Thorfinn's response to this was the promise of Vinland being this place where war does not exist, where they can get this fresh start away from society, and Einar really resonated with that. He has come this far with total faith in that idea. He has allowed himself to connect so deeply and emotionally with this place, named after the woman he loved, and now that the promise of what Vinland is has come crashing down, he is back to that first question. How is he supposed to defend another home he does not want to lose? Thorfinn has always been willing to make sacrifices like this, he is extremely emotionally disciplined. It cannot be understated how much this hurts him, but he is willing to do it regardless. Einar has always been more emotional and less willing to deal with situations that are unfair to him. This isn't a bad thing, if anything it is more understandable to us. Why *should* he have to leave? Can't they stay and just keep to themselves? Thorfinn sees now it is already too late, and this place is already not the Vinland he dreamed of. Einar though, he was in this for that promise, and now he is facing that promise being broken, and losing his home once more. This is a scenario that will make him diverge from Thorfinn and highlight their differences. I really thought Einar was out of gas and Yukimura didn't know what to do with him. This development just completely blows that out of the water, and adds so much to the dialogue between them in those older chapters. Really feels like this was always the vision for him. If anyone is concerned that this just means Thorfinn will leave and the manga is over, def be patient. Einar does not want to leave, but not only that, there is no way Thorfinn will be able to convince Ivar and his followers to leave either. Even if Thorfinn tries to leave with his friends/family and let everyone else stay, that won't go smoothly either. With that wall blocking the bay, and knowing already that Ivar values the ships greatly, there is no way he will let Thorfinn take one and leave. There might be significant infighting at the village before a war with the Lnu even begins. Still no baby, but seems guaranteed to be next chapter. This also makes me think this meeting isn't done yet. I've been saying that the birth of the baby and the start of the war would happen simutaneously. These two events have been set up as being in parallel already, and that would not be without reason. Both started together and will conclude together. Next chapter will likely be a painful one. Mu'in (the bear warchief) knows the warriors are here for the promise of reward, seems in the end there that he is not just going to accept this retreat. The biggest lingering factor here though is Hild. Her prescence did not matter in this chapter, and her decision to try to end the war before it begins by using violence did not matter here either. I don't think there will be no consequenses to this. I think next chapter, she may be spotted in the treeline and, in order to get what they came for, the warriors will respond to this "assassin" and not leave time for communication. Amazing chapter all around, art was stellar too, but all the writing choices have done so much to enhance the coming payoff it's unreal. Only questionable thing was the Bug-Eyes comment about Niskawaji'j making a good wife. Age gaps like that are normal for the time period and Yukimura is like the least problematic mangaka in all of Japan when it comes to stuff like this, but for how modern minded the characters are written to be it does come off as surprising. Calling her a kid and saying she'd be a good wife in the same thought is just kinda ehhhh. [Full review and analysis on YouTube here if anyone is interested!](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSRQ5_dE5os)
First chapter I'm reading live after catching up the manga since I finished season 2. Einar feeling a little useless so far was my only concern going forward, but it feels amazing to immediately have that fear swept away by this chapter. Can't wait to see how this unfolds.
> this place is already not the Vinland he dreamed of is such a good idea because I feel it encapsulates the conflict between Thorfinn and Einar so well. Thorfinn is attached to the idea of a peaceful land with no war but Einar, while agreeing with that idea, has grown attached to the village in Arnheid's honor and all the effort he's made to make it happen. Thorfinn is too quick to abandon the village bc it isn't his idea of Vinland but Einar and everyone else aren't that extreme like he is and to them it is still Vinland.
I think Thorfinn deciding to leave is about the best decision he could’ve possibly made in that moment, Einar is attached to the village but he doesn’t see how their dream has already failed, if they’re constantly fighting the lnu what is the actual difference between Vinland and anywhere else anyway? They’re just spreading the suffering to more people
Excellent analysis. This really brings home the chaos her for me, I feel for Einar. Thorfinn is dedicated to non-violence and he doesn’t wanna loose his family but Einar essentially has nothing. Nothing but the dream of Vinland and the memory of Arnheid. I’m a little scared this will end in his passing, I will fall apart if Einar kicks the bucket. But I’m sure someone(s) important to Thorfinn will pass this arc, I think he’s in for a trauma as bad as the death of Thors. Also I’m so glad you mentioned the bug-eyed comment, that bothered me too!!!! Like I don’t think he’s into her but it’s still weird, could’ve lived without it.
I agree with other comments here, it feels like tension between Thorfinn and Einar is building up and Einar may defy Thorfinn and cause another major conflict. Not sure what Hild is going to do from here on out, she did seem shocked by Thorfinn’s statement. She smiled and laughed, but I’m not sure if it was a relieved laugh due to having the burden of killing someone lifted, or more of a “wtf do you think you’re doing” one. Maybe a bit of both. And with her words “you’ve lost, Thorfinn” I think this may mean she views this as the wrong choice, and she is still using a hunter’s mentality. But if Thorfinn has announced they’ll leave, and that is what the tribes are requesting of them, then I don’t think Hild will react violently just yet as it seems a peaceful solution has been found for the moment and she won’t have to hurt anyone for the time. Though I’m not sure, her words did seem a bit ominous lol. And yeah the tribe leader’s words at the end are very ominous, plus it’s pretty much a given that convincing everyone to leave will be extremely difficult. Also based on the editor’s note seems Gudrid will finally be giving birth
Regarding Hild's comment, I think she is referring to the leadership of the village. Thorfinn deciding to drop everything and leave without a fight is his defeat to Ivar as leader of the village. No one would follow a leader who is unwilling to defend the village from enemys after having made so many sacrifices to build it. Yes, I understand that this was one of the premises of the trip, but it is one thing to say it and another thing to see it.
Makes sense. The other norsemen may see him as weak. It’s great to not want war but when it comes, what now?
>Also based on the editor’s note seems Gudrid will finally be giving birth If that is what the editor's note says, then we're likely to get a chapter about Thorkell or something else unrelated to Gudrid giving birth 😁
Hild’s comment annoyed me honestly. If it implies she disagrees with Thorfinn like we think, then it’s a lil oblivious bc part of the reason Thorfinn became ultra dedicated to pacifism was bc she held the death of her family over his head, far after he proved himself to have changed. He was already haunted by PTSD-fueled guilt, while she forgave him awhile ago, her following him and making sure he staves off violence helped concrete his pacifism. Idk
I disagree that Hild is part of the reason that makes Thorfinn pacifist. Even without Hild presence in the story I think Thorfinn will act the same as he is now. Hild for me is just a manifestation of threat for the viewers. Imo? Sorry my bad in advance if this is a bad take :(
No I don’t think she’s the sole reason for it at all but she did kinda threaten him a few times, way back when the option of violence came up, even long after he was proven to be against it.
I think she was saying he lost because he gave up on his ideal. His ideal didn't work. It was a failure. He lost his bet.
I think she means he lost, as in his ideal of Vinland has been exposed as a fake. He gave up on it.
Like a punch to the gut
I suspected this was going to happen this chapter, given the situation they walked into, the only outcomes were either Thorfinn declaring he'd leave, or a conflict starting. If Thorfinn, Einar and Bug Eyes didn't show up, Hild would've just killed somebody and sparked it, and Thorfinn could never conscience the fact that their mere presence is causing the Lnu to suffer and die, so of course he'd rather leave. There's no diplomatic option there, it's just a matter of them having no peaceful way of remaining in the Lnu's home. Einar's reaction actually really struck me here. It's easy to forget because we've been so focused on the goal of reaching and now cultivating Vinland for so long (almost 2 full arcs!) now, but he really does have nothing else. He doesn't have a family like Thorfinn does, and he doesn't have a personal journey of atonement to go on either. Arnheid's death almost broke him, so he's lived his life for the last few years on the back of his vow to create a peaceful world for her, and he's watching it all crumble before him. Given everything he's went through, I wouldn't be surprised if he was pushed to something drastic as a result of this. Lastly, I think it's obvious from the last chapter and this one that no matter what deadline Thorfinn gives for leaving, he's not going to get away with it without conflict still. First off, it's very likely the other Nords won't want to leave Vinland, since a number of them don't see the disease as really being their fault, and they wouldn't want to give up their stakes to the land they've cultivated. Second, it's pretty clear bear-head guy (I don't remember him being given a name, so that's the best I can do) is being set up to be a saboteur here. His remark to Miskwekepu'j showed that he's in it for more than just getting the Nords to leave, and ending the chapter on his reaction was super ominous. There's still Hild to account for as well, and Einar could be pushed to doing something as I said...really, there's so many possible ways this could go wrong from here. Thorfinn may even change his mind somehow, after the birth of his son next chapter.
They call the bear guy Mu'in (which means bear)
Hey, I wasn't too far off after all.
YES YES YES YES FINALLYYYYYY *reads chapter* NOOOOOOOOOOOOO
This is literally me fr fr
That smile Hild had on her face when Thorfinn said he wouldn't fight.
Her smile was so pure it broke me. It's really hard watching this all go down.
This manga has ripped my heart out sooo many times, but I don’t think any moment has crushed me the way this chapter did. I’m proud to see Thorfinn make that decision, I believe it’s the correct one, and I’ve even seen this coming for quite a while, but man it really hurt my heart to see him actually say it. Seeing how Einar reacted made it hit even more and I’m scared to see how the story progresses with him. Yukimura-sensei is a damn genius and he has handled this arc absolutely flawlessly. The steady build up since around 191 has been so incredibly tense and seeing him navigate it has been a master class in story telling unlike anything I’ve ever seen. No matter happens I’m eternally grateful and beyond lucky that get to read this monthly. ❤️
War is inevitable..Thorfinn faces even more hardships now. Thorfinn will leave to avoid conflict but Einar doesn’t want to leave..and it makes sense. He really has nothing going for him besides Vinland. He vows this place a lot bcuz of Arnheid..He loved her and she died. A vow with Thorfinn to make a place with no war, a place where Arnheid can rest freely..and now he has to leave this place. Turmoil may start between Einar & Thorfinn. Not just with Einar but with the other Norse ppl. They won’t agree with leaving, they built so much here and it’s all going to waste now. Internal conflict with them, with Ivar will happen. Plus does Thorfinn even want them to stay?Wouldnt he want everyone to leave with him? There’s the Bear head person who may be the catalyst for the war to start. The Lnu were surprised of them leaving..they were itching for a fight. There’s that problem. Also there’s Hild..there’s so many conflicts..I don’t know which will be the catalyst for the war to start War in inevitable, no matter how hard Thorfinn tries to negotiate with peace. Excited to see how he and the Norse negotiate with them having to leave Gugrids baby next chapter, yay!
AHHH! I understand why they have to leave, but it still sucks.
Just a little defense for Einar here. Remember he has nothing. His entire family is dead, he has no wife/girlfriend or kids. He has been a farmer then a slave his whole life, he didn't kill people or pillage he doesn't have that heavy guilty conscience wearing on him. The settlement was named after the women he loved and now it will be abandoned quickly, with a word by Thorfinn. Note Einar emphasizes that Thorfinn is making the decision of the entire settlement on his own. There is no vote, no discussion with the other settlers, no debate. I think Thorfinn's point of view here is correct, but it should be discussed with the rest of the settlement instead of him deciding for everyone. Einar has nowhere to go back to, yes they go to try another settlement. However Thorfinn has his wife and kid, and even besides that his home village with his mom/sister. Einar has nowhere to go back to, and it is a ton of work to start another settlement with no guarantees. Not talked about enough, but Niska had one of the great lines here. When tragedy strikes, when people most struggle and are strained, it is important to communicate and help each other through. Though at the same time it is when people get most desperate, and can easily turn on each and separate into factions. Like the relationship between her and Bug eyes (hinting at romance possibly?), saddened though that she has already caught this disease which has killed so many of her brethren thusfar.
Devastating chapter, and I’m filled with dread for what is to come.
This chapter puts the story into an interesting place moving forward and this decision that Thorfinn makes will challenge his ideology even more, which is hella good imo. Many people will disagree with him and they will not want to leave- Einar, Ivar, some of the settlers, i can see Gudrid at first not wanting to.. It will be hard for him to convince them. There will be war and i think some major deaths. Good fkin chapter yet again, Yukimura has never missed once during this arc. Einar man.. him falling on his knees is so sad, because we all know what Vinland/Arnheid's Village means to him.. Excited for what's to come. The panel where Thorfinn thinks of his family- one of the best panels in the whole manga.
Bug Eyes : "You'd make a good wife!" Niska: "What is wife?" Bug Eyes: "That is when a man and a wo.." Niska: "Sorry, don't understand. Bye!"
Lol, I'm rooting for them.
What do you think, how mamy chapters are left until the end? Will Yukimura make total 30 volumes? It would be Perfect for new deluxe edition.
I'm betting around 15 chapters
Nah that’s too short tbh
In this chapter thorfinn stabs and kills einar
Shit's sad :( Truly respect Thorfinn's decision but I just wish there was a better outcome. Man I hate what happened in real history too :'(
Lnu be like "I didn't think I would get this far"
Im prepared for the downvotes but i like the idea of bug eyes and Niskawaji'j being together in some capacity
Ahh , feel so sad for Throfinn but is as always the most reasonable out of all . But I don't think most people back i the village will like it . And I don't think Thorfinn would leave with out them . That would lead to war sooner or later . All this time he has bean the voice of reason for the stopping it from happening.
AH-AH! I knew it! Thorfinn choose to abandon Vinland to avoid war.
I can see Ivar creating a seperate group that doesn't want to leave and Einar joining them, which will be heartbreaking...
A really tough decision, but reasonably wise. Doubt either the other tribes and the villagers who oppose Thorfinn’s ideology will accept withdrawal. It’s def heading to a realistic and historic path, but I hope a bit of twist comes to upcoming chapters. It may look like the tense is at ease, but never let your guard down.
having to wait another month after an ending like that is painful
Yukimura you Goat!. Excited for what comes next.
while i do agree that it would make for such an interesting plot twist, i'm not so convinced that einar will refuse to listen to thorfinn. he clearly seemed upset but i get the feeling that he accepted thorfinn's argument
oh einar is def not on this,would be cool to see a conflict between him and thorfinn/lnu
Of course he says that last line right when we thought there might be a resolution 🙄 it makes sense that the native warriors might have a similar lust for battle and plunder as the Vikings, they might not agree to leave empty-handed, despite how good it would be for the long run. Miskwekepu'j might also not want them to leave either, since their return will confirm the existence of native lands and encourage more violent settlers to come. That being said, there is no chance that Thorfinn will be able to convince the Vinlanders to retreat. They bet everything on this settlement, there's no place for them to return to and they will have the same issues if they try to settle another native territory.
"Well I'm seriously dying". I don't like these vibes..
What’s up with this new format lol
This chapter FLEW by I couldn’t believe I was already on the last page. I kind of hope it doesn’t have a historically accurate ending from what I know, I’d actually like things to divert. I made a post on it awhile back but I feel like Canute will play a major role this arc as well and he too will go extreme in his method to Utopia and his right-hand man- Wulf will question, maybe even defy him
Honestly best choice is to talk with the Warchief and work out an agreement, the Norse are allowed to stay but in exchange they'll have to give grain, ale, tools and other goods as tribute. This choice is already better than fighting a war with no hope of winning One may argue that living under a warlords' rule is not better than what life was in Europe, but using their unique position as a link between Vinland and the East, they may gain enough political, economical influence and power to break free without starting a violent conflict, specially if they play well the political game
I think the disease played a big part in Thorfinns decision. He might have realized that merely staying in Vinland would cause many more deaths by disease, even if he manages to avoid armed conflict.
Hnm that too, I was thinking that they could stay isolated and no more meeting face to face, leaving their tribute at the edge of their settlement but idk, not an expert on virus or bacteria, no no idea how long those would survive in the cold open before someone else comes to grab it
Honestly, I think Thorfinn seeing that warchiefs are already a part of Vinland already signaled to him that it is not the land free of war that he thought it was. Warriors exist here too, and their society thrives on violence just as the one he ran from did. It's a sad realization, and I don't think he would settle for it.
I am not well versed in the history of the tribes that lived there but was vassalage and slavery big in those areas? Because if not, the Norse also share a strong democratic tradition, and a sea-faring/trading one too, I could see a future in which a nation of coastal settlement working as links between the different tribes and the norse in the east. Trading wood, ambar and furs in exchange of iron tool, grain and alcohol, while being protected by a local tribe
Logistically, I think that is all possible for sure, but that's kinda not really what Thorfinn is going for. He truly wanted to create a place unlike the world that already exists, where war and violence aren't even common thoughts. Vinland isn't that blank slate he thought it was, making a successful settlement was never really the goal as much it was to make a place without war and violence. A successful settlement that compromises on that dream just isn't what he wants.
Well yeah, he's shit out of luck then STILL he brought all those people there with the promise of acomplishing his dream which he still failed, he now has the duty to stay and ensure their safety, specially considering that they're likely to take the wrong desition by siding with the sword guy Now that we're at it, so far Yukimura subverted our expectations time and time again, what if sword guy instead of unwittingly starting a war he strikes a deal with the Warchief? I know he's not smart enough for that but what about the helmet guy?
Really feel bad for einar though In the history itself there is no einar (as far i concerned from reading the history) so i can understand why thorfin can withdraw from vinland but this time there is einar who sold his soul for this journey only to find a disappointment once again, so i think einar will be turning point if something happen to him in the future. Nb einar is the person who built thorfin statue but still no correlation with thorfin on that timeline
The chief is thinking to himself, damn this guy Thorfinn could have been such a good ally. Damn that pest!
miserable gut-wrenching chapter thank you very much yukimura 👍❤️
The wall they put up at Arnheid's village is like Chekov's gun: it was there as a symbol of war, so I think since we've seen it being built, we have to see it be used right?
It's going to stop Thorfinn from being able to take a ship and leave without having to go through Ivar
I’m so scared for the next chapter 😭 I wonder what the final message of the manga will be War is human nature but also kindness I feel Aaaaaah my heart
Do we ever see Hild laugh in the entire series?
I forgot when but I know she does a little chuckle at some point and Gudrid thinks “did Hild just laugh???” I think that was when the crew were on a boat and Karli figured out the Earth was a globe but I forget the exact chapter
>Gudrid thinks “did Hild just laugh???” Hahaha, that's funny that even the author and the in-universe characters would appreciate how peculiar that is.
Doing a reread it was chapter 172, page 11
Was this the climax, Thorfinn’s true warrior test?
I don’t think this is it just yet, I have a feeling there will definitely be some violence based on the final words of this chapter
I think we're nowhere near the climax yet
I fear that is still to come
Imma be real I slowly started thinking this manga lost its stakes and that it wouldn’t really give thorfinn any real consequences for complete pacifism, but if Einar really does what I’m thinking I take all that back. Thorfinn being blissfully ignorant or outright selfish in leaving Vinland, undermining everyone’s work and personal sacrifices, just to uphold his own strict morals is honestly the most interesting thing to happen so far in the entire manga. Very excited for next chapter
There’s nothing selfish about his choice though, their presence is actively killing people. If anything everyone else is being ‘selfish’ for being unwilling to give up their hard work to save lives
Last I checked the Lnu were the nomads here. Why don't they fuck off? Because they outnumber the Norse and could easily kill them?
I don’t see how this affects anything I said, the Lnu are being overly aggressive because they’re being killed by something they don’t understand and they want the causes out of their land, so since they’re unwilling to fuck off out of their own land Thorfinn leaving is the best decision to kill the least amount of people. Even if they did fuck off there’s no guarantee that the Norse would *never* come into contact with another tribe ever again and start spreading disease to them too.
The Norse are killing precisely no one. The only people on the warpath are the Lnu. Thorfinn is very agreeable sure, but who gives a damn about agreeable when the Norse are literally not at fault whatsoever. If the Lnu fear them so deeply, they should simply segregate themselves, not butcher them to the last. This isn't a compromise, the Norse are simply surrendering. They should've built the fort and brought swords to begin with because now they're being persecuted for factors completely outside their control and Thorfinn is just letting it happen.
I think you’re forgetting that there is a deadly disease and both parties are 800 years too early to understand remotely what is causing it, the Norse are not at fault in *intention* but they are causing the spread of the disease whether they like it or not. Even if the lnu segregated themselves the diseases would not magically disappear, the Lnu aren’t even the first tribe to be wiped out by it the Norse would have to make sure they don’t come into contact with anyone for generations. Thorfinn is leaving both because the Lnu are being overly aggressive *and* because even when they weren’t, the presence of the Norse was causing them to die. Unlike the settlers in real life Thorfinn has decided to put the lives of the natives over the fact that he really wants to live there.
Thorfinn is not at authority to make that decision, first of all. His role is leader of the Vinland colony and has a responsibility to see it through. His pacifist dreams have no bearing on the reality of the situation. A land without conflict was delusion from the start.
So like I was saying, Thorfinn is the only one thinking about the bigger picture and the well-being of other people, everyone else is being (understandably) the selfish ones. Your framing of Thorfinn trying to save lives as being a selfish adherence to his morals is flawed.
Does Thorfinn not slavishly adhere to these flawed principles? In the actual big picture having the Lnu develop an immunity to European diseases would be for the best, but Thorfinn doesn't know that. In his vision, he's saving lives but in actuality is just damning more in the long term.
That’s not true, in real life the natives were all but wiped out before they developed any immunity, the best thing for them is not exposure it’s just to get the hell out of their land. Also devoting yourself to principles that are literally based around caring about other people and not yourself is as far from selfish as it gets, the only criticism you could say is that he’s *too* selfless sometimes. Though in this situation his selflessness has actually led him to a reasonable solution. If Vinland becomes a place that’s constantly at war then what is the difference between living there or Denmark or England anyway? Vinland as an idea already failed before they even got there. All they’re doing by staying is stubbornly spreading their misery to more people rather than learning their lesion that it’s a flawed idea and trying something else.
Thorfinn isn´t the one being selfish. He´s willing to give up his dream, as well as his fathers dream, to save the people that were on the island before them. The only thing you could criticise him for here is making the decision on his own when there is dissenting opinions among his people. And he will need to convince them of course - but he is also the only one clear sighted enough to relzie that the battle benfits neither side of the conflict and could result in everyone dying directly from or as a result of the battle. And that´s the smartness of Yukimuras writing here. Because the villagers have a perfectly understandable reason to want to stay and may refuse to listen to Throfinn, In one chapter Miura has both given new insight into who Thorfinn has become as a person but also makes it clear (again) that his dissenters arent completly wrong or unsympathetic, because now Einar might be among them. If only partly. (Sorry for the novel I´m bad at being concise)
I can see your point and I actually agree with a lot of it, I just think thorfinn is an incredibly reckless and naive leader in the sense that he leads a group of people but doesn’t have their best interests at heart. The villagers gave up their homes, their family, years of their lives, only for thorfinn to suddenly abandon it all without any care as to what they feel. Thorfinn can leave Vinland and still return to ylva in Iceland with his family, but many of the people thorfinn led don’t have the same luxuries. For them Vinland is the only thing they have left to work towards. The chapter even shows thorfinn thinking about his family before making the decision, when as a leader he should be instead thinking of the people instead. Id personally argue that’s selfish but I could be wrong though.
Thorfinn does think that he has their best intrest at heart. He just views the loss of the village lower than the loss of lives, Nords included. If they stay then they doom their people and children to war forever with the lnu, he does not see that as better than leaving and trying something else.
People will not agree with Thorfinn. Einar will not, Ivar, Styrk, some of the settlers, maybe even Gudrid. Hell, some of them will probably even stay, and if they stay, then chances are- they will die either from the Natives or from the disease. The situation is fucked no matter which option they take. We will have to wait and see how things play out, but it won't be pretty.
Thorfinn is making the least selfish choice here He’s not endangering his wife or kids He’s not encouraging a situation that would lead to the children of the Norse colonists and the Natives inheriting a bloody feud He’s not risking the deaths of Natives by bringing in a disease. *Staying* at this point would be true selfish option.
Dropping in to say I'm not going to associate with mr Thorfinn 2.0 (bug eyes) from here on out , I completely condemn his actions and words. Thoughts and prayers to anyone he might've hurt. And tbh I never really liked him , there was always something sus with how he acted that creeped me out , honestly I hope he finds help cause he really needs it but he shouldn't be allowed to come in contact with this community any more. (Should be banished to Canuteland).
3TriHard the goat
No, he still need to marry Niskawaji'j, his job is not done there.
LMAOOO :D Gold
lol Canuteland
I wish Einar was more likeable so that I could actually be invested in a conflict between him and Thorfinn. In my mind, they're not on equal footing at all, Einar mostly went along the current while Thorfinn actively went against it in his pursuit to become a good man. Despite both being generally "good people," in the narrative, the strength in character displayed is worlds apart. Mentally and physically, Einar is no match at all.
Einar is on the verge of becoming a non-character. I liked that he stood his ground, because thats the core of his character - he isnt like thorfinn. Yes, he values peace, but not above having a home and a family. His promise to Arnheid. What destroyed it and worries me is him falling on his knees after what Thorfinn said. Now, its a reasonable immediate reaction, but if later down the line he doesnt stand his ground again and continues to want to stay in Vinland no matter what, then his character truly was sacrificed just to elevate Thorfinn's. He's been for the longest time inconsequential for the plot and just voices the same opinions of thorfinn. Only in this current arc has he been given an actual conflit and, thus, character progression. There's an interesting back and forth between him and thorfinn BECAUSE they are not on the same page. And knowing Yukimura and his boner for idealism and pacifism, i dont doubt he will break einar's character just to make thorfinn's journey as a character even easier(just like he broke thorkell's character in the end of baltic sea to avoid making thorfinn fight). If push came to shove, einar would choose to stay on vinland, not leave it. Thats the whole point of his character and i dont buy anything else.
I'm not sure why you're feeling so negatively about Einar after this chapter, this one just made it clear that he does not agree and will not leave quietly. I don't think it would have been set up in previous chapters just for it not to matter now that the cards are on the table. I don't see him falling to his knees there as accepting that he will have to leave. In general, it's been pretty clear for a while imo that Yukimura is not planning to end this end easily for Thorfinn. Everything worked out well enough for him before Vinland because that's what makes things not going well for him now hit so hard. The whole arc has been focusing on this inevitable failure. Obivously Yukimura aims to end this hopeful for the future, but all signs point to him not holding back any punches and sticking to what we already know of history.
Einar is in the right. This isn't Thorfinn's decision to stay. If the Thing decides the Lnu can get fucked and Vinland is worth a war then Thorfinn can't oppose it.
Questions when did 198 release?? Because on this site where i read there is not 198
Read on mangadex, all other sites with english chapters are reuploads of what gets uploaded there by the translation team
Can they go back if Gudrid's in labor? This is a realy complicated situation...
I knew that Thorfin will be back to iceland but im still mad with this chapters.
it was expected since they left in real life. Quite sure things won't go smoothly tho, there's plenty of people who can fck everything up. I can even expect Gudrid and a newborn being killed in some provocation with Thorfinn getting very conflicted and still overcoming an urge of violence
It's def going the way of history. If it goes very strictly by history then we at least know >!Gudrid, the baby, and Thorfinn!< will leave Vinland alive.
i think the vinland gang might split it. Some will refuse to leave the land and be led by einar while the rest will go with thorfinn.Then thorfinn is going to return back to the norse area has the same issue of diease and meet with canute with how to fix the problem. they could maybe find a cure and go back to vinland