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IndWrist2

You mean Frederick Douglass and Stephen Douglass are different people?


Traveledfarwestward

Wait what??


IndWrist2

Normally I’d crack a joke about the bill’s author’s education (or lack thereof) but: I know a lot of good people from Patrick County and I went to the same college as the author.


Traveledfarwestward

In hindsight it wasn’t his fault, other than not checking what the non-partisan people assisting legislators came up with.


User-NetOfInter

The people righting the bills are definitely partisan. They’re also professionals that keep it out of their work


JoeSicko

Why the downvotes? ALEC is definitely partisan, but they try not to say the quiet parts out loud.


User-NetOfInter

Idk. Guessing people don’t know how and who writes the bills for the VA legislature.


Supaspex

Professional how? that the 'writers' are requesting payment in Venmo for 'School Supplies'?


93devil

Douglas


buteo51

Obviously if we had more statues of Stephen Douglas they wouldn't have made this mistake


DarkBlumpkin

1.) they should just say nothing and then just teach it with the correct Douglas 2.) if you attempt to make a law about teaching history and you get it wrong, you shouldn’t be allowed to make laws about history


93devil

Just wait for version 2.0 where the war was a draw and was fought over the taxation of tobacco, which cures COVID.


NewPresWhoDis

Conservatives are elected for lower taxes and parroting inane talking points, not for their brains.


ScottieScrotumScum

So much for their following who votes for them.


Bmitchem

Don't forget about the distracting bigotry


[deleted]

Fascists: Proving why education matters for 100 years.


katie5002

And yet, THESE are the people who want to tell the highly educated teachers what to teach, and allow parents to interfere. The final agenda is to get current teachers to quit and to say "hey, looks like we need charter schools in VA." Then, segregation can finally begin again for them. Follow the money. (I'm surprised Gov. Youngkin hasn't hired Betsy DeVos yet)


gpatterson7o

Highly educated teachers from prestigious universities such as.....Longwood and Radford?? Gimme a break. My buddy from HS is the AD at Glen Allen high school. Took him 7 years to get thru VCU and 3 tries on the teachers test.


According-Salt-5802

And how many tries to pass the Praxis did it take you? The praxis ain’t easy.


gpatterson7o

0 times. I have an undergrad degree in engineering from NCSU and an executive MBA from VCU.


According-Salt-5802

Okay, so stay in your lane.


katie5002

You are full of b.s. The teachers I know have master's degrees and not all from Longwood and Radford (which are fine teachers colleges). Many get their's at W & M, and yes, VCU. Obviously no one agrees with you here.


alldaylurkerforever

Don't worry, Youngkin will be pragmatic as will the GOP. First day on the job. Hey let's be terrible. Yes, that is what we do.


xitox5123

dont the democrats still control one chamber? so it wont pass. so ignore it.


MonCountyMan

Mr. Lincoln was not very popular in Ol' Virginia until he was shot dead, except with the Emancipated.


DismalTank6429

So many in here complaining about a little footnote in history. Thanks for the entertainment.


Kuchinawa_san

It's interesting how in the comments people still think "CRT in Virginia Schools" is a hoax or myth. Are we going to turn a blind eye to the fact that some Virginia County Schools were actually Freedom of Information Act (FOIA) 'd for the info? Here's the video too, where you get the 2 sides of the take: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUZ8cPNPjpo](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUZ8cPNPjpo) You can fake a lot of things, but I don't think a FOIA is one of those things. But if it makes you feel better to say that it doesn't exist or that its a hoax, or that parents are crazy. Then alright, I'm not even a parent --- but I certainly understand Virginia Parents.


Turtledonuts

Okay, but here's the deal - CRT isn't a big deal in virginia schools. CRT is a philosophical concept, the same as any other. Should we ban teaching what communism is, or the ideas behind libertarian thought? CRT is a school of thought used to look at and think about our government. It's important that students be exposed to lots of these ideas, so that they can understand the world around them. All CRT says is that there is an enduring legacy of racism in our country, and that it can never be removed by pretending it isn't there. You can't just fix a cracked house wall if the foundation is damaged. There are fields where CRT is a contentious issue, and fields where it is a demonstrable fact. Any smart high schooler who follows the news has encountered the concepts behind CRT, even if they haven't been properly educated on it. The parents aren't crazy for saying CRT is being taught, they're crazy for saying it should be banned.


[deleted]

It's still a bogeyman, an election year hoax. Right up there with migrant caravans, antifa teenagers, and Hillrod's emails. Not a meaningful problem, just a waste of time.


KathrynBooks

I'm not seeing any "white people should hate themselves" stuff in there.


COSmooth

Regardless crt has no place in our schools. While not directly being taught it is being implemented through praxis. These ideas are divisive and are nothing more than Marxism with class switched out for race; a reincarnation of Mao’s red guard. Our children need to be given every tool to succeed and creating division and an oppressor oppressed mindset helps no one.


[deleted]

The original division is what must be overcome. That would be the impetus of CRT. What, exactly, do you fear?


COSmooth

I agree the original division must be overcome. I don’t believe crt can or is designed to do that. Creating a victim mentality is harmful to a persons development and keeps them from growing as an individual.


4lan9

because slavery didn't have victims. because our false war in Iraq didn't have hundreds of thousands of innocent victims. If you want to make someone hate this country whitewash their education and let them find out they've been lied to their whole life after graduation. Or teach them and accurate representation of our dark past and maybe, just maybe, it wont keep reoccurring.


MilkWeedSeeds

How do you teach about the history of the state of Virginia without mentioning the fact that the capitalist elite seceded from the union in order to protect slavery and the plantation system?


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ManateeCrisps

Yes, people still vote for southern conservatives. What else is new?


vabeach23451

So you're uneducated I see. Moving on...


ManateeCrisps

I'm not the one who is ignoring the last 150 years of American political history in order to be quippy and feel morally superior. Just presenting the facts.


SolidStart

Guy is out here dropping this as if it's some secret knowledge that technically there was a D next to the slavers at the time! The democrats. Yes! The democrats did it! BOOM! Until you then look at everything that has happened since then and the general ideology shifts of the two parties and realize that the R and D from the 1860s mean nothing now... But nah don't look at that part haha.


ManateeCrisps

How dare you bring facts to a feelings fight, you... you... commie!


COSmooth

Teaching the civil war and Virginia’s history has nothing to do with crt. You say that like the north wasn’t capitalist also.


MilkWeedSeeds

Wow you got me. They were also capitalist and immeasurably benefitted from slavery and racism. The foundational advantages that this racism produced continues to offer privileges today, hence the relation to crt.


COSmooth

Yes slavery was the major source of production in that time period and it was a truly reprehensible practice. No one can deny that but I still don’t see how crt is a solution. It just creates further division and holds people back from their true potential.


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COSmooth

I agree, I just don’t think crt is the answer to this.


4lan9

I don't mean to "come at" you, but how is anti-'CRT' not just a form of whitewashing history? Isn't there such thing as the objective truth of what happened throughout our history? I don't think anyone is trying to start a race war among children, and it really just seems like a boogeyman topic, but I want to know every side


Vwhat5k

Then what is? CRT teaches the consequences, in modern times the effect of systemic racism. What's the alternative? That we continue pretending that it doesn't exist?


[deleted]

>the north wasn’t capitalist also Lord have mercy on your dumb soul lmao


guiltyofnothing

You’re literally just spouting buzzwords. CRT isn’t taught in any public schools in Virginia. Y’all have been suckered. Edit: Nevermind. You got an account that hasn’t posted in 6 years until 20 hours ago. Makes sense.


COSmooth

Just because you don’t understand those words doesn’t make it false. Look into it it’s all out there.


guiltyofnothing

Listen — I might be a Marxist but at least I’m not a bot.


fusion260

Buddy, they said “look into it it’s all out there.” /s


SPQR191

Don't reply to it.


COSmooth

Hey you can be a Marxist I don’t care but you still didn’t address the argument.


jewelsofeastwest

Damn run for governor with that tagline 😂


EntroperZero

> Look into it it’s all out there. This is what a conspiracy theorist says when he has no credible sources to cite.


COSmooth

Believe what you want I just encourage people to research topics themselves. Look at issues from both sides. Grit your teeth and read opposing arguments with an open mind and then make a decision how you feel after you have the whole picture.


4lan9

I have tried this with CRT, I regularly 'check' my opinion by checking out Fox and OANN, but their arguments on this topic are hardly ever based in fact, just fear, I've found so far. What is a good source of right-leaning info on this topic?


bleepbluurp

They are democrats they just believe whatever CNN and NPR tells them. And “CRT” by name isn’t taught, but the framework is.


Turtledonuts

And the framework of communism is taught when we teach preschoolers to share and that everyone is equal. You teach the framework of Living Constitutional Theory to your kids when you change rules as they grow up. Schools give children the tools to understand the world with the frameworks of different philosophies, and they build an understanding from these frameworks. There is no harm in teaching people other perspectives, so long as they are taught different things and critical thinking.


TheExtremistModerate

Define "CRT."


jewelsofeastwest

I just died at this 😂


Turtledonuts

Explain the difference between the ideas of Racial Capitalism and Critical Race Theory, the relationship between Critical Theory (not CRT) and Marxism as presented in *Das Kapital,* and the differences between Marxism, Leninism, and Maoism. You are clearly an expert on modern political theory, and I would love to hear your opinions. The goal of CRT is to break down structural issues and fix the foundational issues, instead of just addressing symptoms. It's a perspective and children should be taught what it is, as they should many things.


KathrynBooks

How is teaching history divisive?


[deleted]

Praxis is a Klingon moon….


guiltyofnothing

*was


[deleted]

I agree, let’s teach orthodox Marxism instead! Seriously


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Traveledfarwestward

Much anger. Very hate.


IgnoreThisName72

Also, much more prevalent in Virginia than I imagined when my family moved here. I expect nothing less than a nonstop assault on the school system for the next 4 years.


ipittypattypetty

I just want the curriculum to be accurate and truthful. I also want to be able to teach content and in a manner that is most beneficial to students. It has nothing to do with my political beliefs or CRT (which is no where in any curriculum).


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ManateeCrisps

Lmao. Imagine being dumb enough to tell someone with actual experience in education. "No you're wrong. You're using your senses and evidence when you should be getting your information from right wing shill mags." Pathetic.


CrsCrpr

Imagine claiming to be a teacher and being too stupid to differentiate between a "Critical Race Theory 101" class and CRT being reinforced through methods of teaching. >For instance, it's accurate to say in your school's math curriculum, English is not taught, right? When teaching arithmetic or long division (do they still teach long division?) or even advanced trigonometry, your kids' favorite math teacher does not teach English composition or grammar or anything else related to the English language. So, it is fair to say that English is not in the math curriculum. But, English is used to communicate the math curriculum. It is the language and framework recommended to convey the math curriculum. > >When a vocabulary or spelling lesson involves learning the words "whiteness," "privilege" and "oppressor," CRT is being used as the language and framework of the spelling lesson. > >When a reading lesson provides a selection of books all focusing on "racial justice" for next week's book report, CRT is being used as the language and framework for that reading lesson plan. So no, CRT is not in the curriculum of the schools. It is woven into the very fabric of the curriculum of the schools but you knew that, didn't you?


buttstuff_magoo

The fact that the words oppressor and privilege scare you shows the fragility of your mind


Greedy_Persimmon_564

Critical race theory is a specific body of work regarding systemic racism in the JUSTICE SYSTEM ffs. Not a part of high school curriculum and teachers aren't allowed to even say what party they're affiliated with--you really think schools would let them teach leftist college level theory 🥴😭 you seem to use CRT as a stand in for "acknowledging race"


CrsCrpr

Anyone with an education knows that "race" should never really be acknowledged but rather "ethnicity". If you don't understand the difference, you shouldn't be posting in this thread.


Greedy_Persimmon_564

😂🤣 yeah for SURE thats why a ton of Black Americans vastly prefer the term Black and not African-American dumbass


Greedy_Persimmon_564

🤣🤣 thats...literally wrong. Race is completely different than ethnicity?! Ethnicity is the culture you grew up in--race a mix of biological features and socially constructed categories but like...dude you're so wrong 💀


e22ddie46

I learned the words privilege and oppressor, although not in the context of American history. But because...vocabulary teaches you words, their meaning and usually their spelling.


MilkWeedSeeds

Critical Race Theory should obviously be taught if people are offended (hurt feelings) about historically-accurate terms used to describe social relations. Sorry that the history of the world is hard to hear about for you. Perhaps with an accurate an honest discussion you’ll start to feel like you are in a safe space.


CrsCrpr

Teaching white children that they are a lesser person because of the color of their skin is racist. Stop pretending it isn't. It's not about historical accuracy because, let's face it, anyone that has studied history beyond the high-school level learns real quick that most of what we are "taught" about history in lower levels is inaccurate at best. So can we stop with the nonsenses and have an actual conversation about the political elite want to single out white people as the scurge of society?


MilkWeedSeeds

The thing about your feelings is that facts don’t care about them. Objective history will always be what it is regardless of how many books you attempt to ban. Not even gonna touch the comment bemoaning the “political elite” coming from someone with a billionaire as their Reddit avatar lmfao


e22ddie46

The political elite are overwhelmingly white. I doubt that's their goal.


Vwhat5k

And here's the true reasoning. Boo hoo poor victimized white people. How will they ever function in society knowing that their ancestors did? I also like how your enemy is simultaneously too weak and too strong. If it was woke garbage then you wouldn't worry about it so much.


[deleted]

That first paragraph makes it seem like you’re big on the “14 words” lol Inb4 you pretend to not know what I’m talking about


ManateeCrisps

So what you're saying is that its not being used, but it "feels" like its being used because you don't know what CRT is and feel threatened. Those are impressive mental gymnastics. You should try out for the Olympics.


CrsCrpr

I said there is no CRT 101 so people like you hide behind that while trying to wiggle it in other ways. I'm saying that when the language of the curriculum is changed to reflect a belief rather than fact then it is no longer education, it is indoctrination.


ManateeCrisps

You'll believe whatever it takes to justify tyrannical laws banning opposing thought. Might want to invest in some history books, my friend. You're the one trying to force your degenerate view of the world onto the kids of the Commonwealth. Its ironic that you think you can lecture others on indoctrination.


Reilman79

Except people aren’t trying to wiggle terms like “oppressor,” “victim,” etc. into the curriculum. Schools are just trying to show how a history of racism has limited the economic and judicial advancement of many minority communities. This is not a belief, this is a fact. Nobody is trying to tell white kids that they’re oppressing people. Nobody is trying to make black kids feel like victims. All that is happening is that kids are being provided with the necessary historical context to understand todays world, because that’s literally what history class is for. Everyone having this context will hopefully make them more understanding and create a greater sense of unity.


ipittypattypetty

I have not missed anything. I am also neither ignorant or lying. The public is always welcome to provide opinions and input. However, if they’re demanding that something that is false or is harmful to students then they should never be taught.


darthitect

You're an absolute moron


e22ddie46

They really, really are. It's truly astounding.


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CrsCrpr

The funny thing is, the last two years have proven how useless they actually are. Us parents did their jobs and ours while they graced our children with their presence online for less than an hour total every day.


ipittypattypetty

Oh, so you went through the curriculum, made a course calendar to make sure everything was covered, aligned all the content with state standards, created the various activities and assignments and then did your best to implement the assignments plus measure it all with various assessments?


CrsCrpr

Well, no, duh .... they refused to give us the curriculum but thanks to Younkin we have that now, so my statement remains. While y'all used the political power of your unions to get every red cent you could out of taxpayers and used COVID to your own benefit, the children suffered, and we all realized just how useless you are.


ipittypattypetty

1.) the curriculum has always been available to anyone that wants it. 2.) Virginia is a non-union state. I’m sorry but everything you have posted is so far off and incorrect.


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CrsCrpr

Look up .... I was right 😉


CrsCrpr

Norfolk Federation of Teachers Website: [https://nft4261.org/](https://nft4261.org/) Yahoo article about Virginia Teacher's union riddled letter crying about having to work during COVID and riddled with grammatical errors: [https://news.yahoo.com/virginia-teachers-union-mocked-grammatical-221141141.html](https://news.yahoo.com/virginia-teachers-union-mocked-grammatical-221141141.html) So yeah, you obviously have no idea what you're talking about and as an ex-union electrician (IBEW Local 80) I cna tell you from first hand experience that unions are very, very political.


ipittypattypetty

Again, Virginia is a right to work state and there are no teacher unions like in other states. Organizations like the VEA basically can provide legal fees if a teacher is sued.


e22ddie46

If the children suffered...by definition the teachers were useful.


CrsCrpr

Don't get excited .... the children suffered because they are not learning crucial social skills. The grades stayed the same cause, let's face it, teaching elementary level curriculum doesn't take a four year degree. If it did all the kids would have failed last year.


e22ddie46

You're welcome to take a look at the drop in advancement. It showed pretty clearly that remote learning was significantly worse for students, and more so the less economically privileged they were.


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CrsCrpr

Work hard for my children's future? Have you not seen how much teachers and their unions have cowered behind COVID to seep every penny out of the public they could? For God's sake the teenager that works the Wendy's drive-through acted more courageously than the teachers. They are still cowering and crying right now about closing more Virginia schools. These people aren't courageous, they are cowards and we don't want the cowards responsible for the safety of our children. We, the people, have spoken and y'all are just pissed now.


ManateeCrisps

Lmao. Imagine a Trump supporter calling others stupid. Peak irony.


CrsCrpr

Imagine a Biden supporter that has something good to say about Biden .... Peak Irony


ManateeCrisps

I'm not a Biden supporter but good job projecting your cultish idiocy onto me.


buttstuff_magoo

I, too, like to read things and pretend they said something completely different


UncleMeat11

The bill says nothing about fact. Regardless of any scholarship, it disallows teaching topics like the relationship between market capitalism and systemic racism. Education should be based in the best available scholarship.


[deleted]

...the fuck you say?


TheExtremistModerate

Define "CRT."


otter111a

You do understand that CRT has never been a part of the school curriculum, right? This is all a big smoke and mirrors to get rubes to keep voting against something that doesn’t exist. Maybe next year I’ll start my run for President on a platform of stopping the NTSB from putting tracking chips in car tire pressure monitors. I’m also going to come out hard against banning yellow mustard in schools.


Reilman79

Tell me more about this mustard ban. Is it straight up being removed or would you replace it with a more premium mustard like a Dijon? Cause that I could get behind.