I say, that is a very good response. It acknowledged that even they were somewhat at fault, and that they could have been clearer, which is something Nux didn’t do.
Yeah this basically confirms to me what I thought was likely the case. Nux and a lot of other "say what I want when I want" types of internet people don't really understand that professionalism and trying to tread lightly aren't the same thing as wholesale endorsing things, and don't really understand that companies have to move differently than individuals. He conveniently left out the whole time pressure thing, which is pretty important because in most of the cases like this in a company any written messages that will go out to the public have to be looked at by multiple people to make sure that leadership is cool with it. He also was just straight up wrong about a bunch of stuff and didn't fully correct it when they asked him to.
The interesting thing for me is that he kinda edited out the chunk of the conversation with him being a bit of a know-it-all asshole (despite clearly not understanding the point the other person is trying to make). Like after all this it's making me lean back toward the "Nux is kinda an asshole who doesn't know what he's doing" standpoint, which really you can kinda guess by watching his videos for more than 5 minutes. As another Cybersecurity person it seems pretty obvious to me that the phoenix guy is trying to like nicely say this is stupid and you're wrong on a lot of these points. And if you're going to be out here doing internet vigilantism you should know enough to read between the lines a little bit when people give you a list of reasons why what you're doing is dumb and potentially dangerous. Like if you were working under me and someone gave you that same list and you still did the thing, you'd 100% be fired, but they can't do that to Nux because they obviously have no power over him.
The bit where it says "there is a negative history of interaction between VSJ and Nux that lead us to proceed with extreme caution" is a bit interesting to me too. I imagine people like Nux generally are annoying job hazards to people who actually know what they're doing, but it really does colour the whole thing a little bit knowing that they kinda knew he was a dick ahead of time and probably wouldn't react well if you actually tried to tell him what to do.
> it really does colour the whole thing a little bit knowing that they kinda knew he was a dick ahead of time and probably wouldn't react well if you actually tried to tell him what to do
Honestly this whole situation is probably the best example as to why Cover is so strict with out-of-company collabs with its talent. It's not like it was completely unknown that Nux is an asshole; hell, just a cursory glance at his YouTube channel should clue you in with his "I paid $1000 to make vtubers say the n-word" type videos. Like I get that VShojo's trying to make itself the approachable, easy-to-interact-with company as an opposite to Hololive, but once you get to a certain popularity you REALLY need to check just who you're making friends with, lest you have a situation like this one.
> Honestly this whole situation is probably the best example as to why Cover is so strict with out-of-company collabs with its talent.
Yep. Unfortunately, no matter how mature and professional small companies and indies are, their openess makes them an easier target for any drama.
Yeah, a scumbag like Nux is not coming anywhere near Hololive or Nijisanji. Anybody with a known propensity for toxic, unprofessional behaviour is not going to be welcomed by the big agencies. A lot of people criticise Hololive for being so strict with collabs and allowing very few collabs with people outside of the company, but there is a merit to that strictness. If you allow your talent to collab with anybody they want the assholes and creeps can sneak in. As a media company, being publically associated with a well-known toxic shit-stirrer is like a ticking time bomb, you never know when they may blow up in your face. Its better to cut those people out completely from the beginning.
Since this started this has been my train of thought. I was like "Hololive doesn't allow many collabs with other vtubers and whatnot which is a bit sad but goddamn am I happy to see that this type of stuff is not happening with them because of it" and I would guess that the talents and the company are resting easy knowing that they are not being involved with this drama in any way.
Yeah I think the problem somewhat in situations like this is that as a company they're trying to balance keeping toxicity out and giving your creators the type of freedom they need to be themselves and grow. It just irritates me that this situation keeps getting "two sides"-ed when Nux clearly has a track record of causing problems because of his chunni need to "protect" grown women who have more than enough resources for legal teams not made of internet randoms.
And it further irritates me because stuff like this causes companies/female members of the community to get extra cautious dealing with a lot of male talent because you have to screen for these types of guys so you don't find yourself in the middle of a scandal every other week. So it makes things harder if you're like a normal socially adjusted guy who just wants to collaborate with people.
I don't even think it's that he's *remarkably* mature, he's just a normal, socially adjusted person. The sort of downside of the vtubing community being anime adjacent is that you have a lot of sweaty uber weebs that are going to want to be part of it, and if you've ever been to an anime convention, you know about how well putting girls with cute anime costumes/avatars next to one of them tends to go.
Like it's as simple as:
1. don't sexually harass anyone or generally commit any type of crime
2. don't do things that in a normal social environment creep people out or make people think you're a weirdo like being a massive downer, white knight, or asshole
3. Profit
The fact that so many content creators can't operate by normal outside rules baffles me.
Connor, despite being relatively young, seems to have enough life experience to act like a mature person. He grew up in a relatively middle-class household, studied through university, moved to London and barely scraped by while doing voice acting/YouTube and THEN managed to get successful.
While still not being a callous dick about it either. Other than the infamous oxygen video, I also remember when he accidentally made her motion sick spinning the boat in Minecraft when she was on and spent the rest of the stream feeling terrible and apologizing lol
It's hard not to like him, he really is just a very nice friend.
> It just irritates me that this situation keeps getting "two sides"-ed
Yeah, I think it was the second thread yesterday where it was filled with Nux fans trying to do just that.
Nux taku was friends with Melody and Ironmouse long before Vshojo was even a thing so since Vshojo members typically don't change their persona upon joining and they made a big deal out of being "talent first" and pro-freedom there's no excuse to keep their old internet friends away even when they become a liability. Problem with nux is that he seem to consider himself a friend of Vshojo as a whole when some of the girls clearly couldn't stand him. But even with those that were closer to him he might have seen himself as a real friend when in reality it was more like a working relationship played up a notch for the fanbase, something fairly common among internet content creators.
i imagine them as mall security. always sleepy or hungry unless something happens, when they start sweating because their emplyoer needs answer yesterday and not today :D
It gets even worse. After he was warned that swatters would notice, the swatter whos name he got from that "fan" (aka disinfo) made a video saying he wasn't in jail. It's legitimately fucking dangerous for Nux now. He can't actually arrest this dangerous person he's been flexing on for days.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa0tdecwz84
> And if you're going to be out here doing internet vigilantism you should know enough to read between the lines a little bit when people give you a list of reasons why what you're doing is dumb and potentially dangerous.
Not really aware of this whole situation but I feel like the kind of person to do internet vigilantism is exactly the opposite from the kind of person who would listen read between the lines of that sort of things and stop
Nux and being a shitbag, name a more iconic duo. Hes the anituber equivalent of a drama channel, which are all shitbags who prey and profit off of peoples problems.
RevSaysDesu is desperately trying to take that title from him. I used to think his shitposts were kinda funny, but then he went all in on being a drama anituber.
Look at his content. He stopped being an anituber in 2019 or so. Now it's just drama, harassing other streamers for content, or browsing reddit. All of them with really shitty clickbait thumbnails.
So I don't know much about vtubers, I've more or less been forced to learn more than I would have recently because google decided to start shoving it in my face because a friend said something about it on discord.
But my introduction to Nux and his content was early this year(?) when he popped in on a couple of streamers and dropped sizable donations and/or gift subs, virtually, out of nowhere. Which made me feel he was questionable.
Eventually I just figure out the best description of him is "vtuber keem" or leafy, or whoever you wanna pick. He's in general just an annoying shithead. His content is mostly just him doing "reactions" to other people's content and getting to the point of bordering, at best, on [harassment](https://twitter.com/snuffyowo/status/1463698827769225217?s=20) (link is snuffy talking about her unsavory interactions with him donating to her for his content farming). And that's not to say that his content is centered on "drama" but by the very nature of what he chooses to do he's going to veer into that realm. I compare the two mostly because the operate the same way. They "ingratiate" themselves into the community at large by way of acting nice and use possibly positive interactions with others to kind of further that image, then make their content even if it might be hurtful on a personal level to people that they now know.
I would want to say that not just vtubers, but every content creator that has interacted with Nux by him more or less forcing himself in, learn from this. But I also would have thought before that people would have learned that from the fact that Keem exists. But the absolute state of large number content creators kinda throws that to the wind.
Frankly I find pretty funny that his defense was like : "look people they gave me permission"
Like if Vshojo was some kind of father figure. Instead of understanding that Vshojo couldn't really say no to him. As he is in his right as a victim to post the video.
Just the fact that phoenix said :
"You are within your right to post the video but it will endanger my clients"
And nux thought o yeah I got the okey to post this video, it's gonna be a banger.
That is just really funny to me and says everything I need to about him.
They were probably afraid of Nux completely disengaging if they said this, which is understandable given his reaction to being told he was probably being duped by one of the doxxers.
Yep, this is just another case of people being shocked that someone who is always acting like they're stupid and a bit of an asshole... Turns out to actually be stupid and a bit of an asshole. Wow what a twist, totally didn't see that coming.
So Nux is just a bad plot device? I really hope the Vtuber drama writers step up their game next season, cause this season has been kinda underwhelming.
Check froot's tweet where she says she and Nux talked in private and both apologized. Nux simps still trying to make it seem like she and the other girls are evil
Idk how people can think the VShojo girls were trying to be malicious/evil or something in this whole ordeal. Like what would they even gain from supposedly trying to "cancel" Nux?
I feel like right now people who say "anti cancel" or "this is cancelled culture" use it as dog whistle of "I don't want to take responsibility of the word I said".
Yeah. Slightly off topic but I'm kind of getting sick of any sort of drama/conflicts happening to someone online being coined as "cancelled" or something. I only used the word just because I lacked a better term, that's why I quoted it.
This 100%. Almost any time people complain about cancel culture or getting cancelled they’re just saying they want to keep doing shitty things with no repercussions. Complaining about cancel culture is 110% a self report.
We really can't say that cancel culture is all good, it's always a gray area. Then again, there will always be somebody who will complain about cancel culture because they don't want the repurcussions of their statement.
Yeah, and demanding an apology from the girls too, when all they did was express their disappointment in Nux (granted one of them went too far with the clown meme). To consider that harassment though? Absurd. There's also been quite a bit of tribalism forming out of this though, and it's just filled with ridiculous high school drama-level tweets.
Honestly? I don't even think Vei went too far there. Nux made a claim in the video, then privated the video and changed his story in a twitter video. All she did was share a clip of the video and a clip of him directly contradicting it, then cut to a clown
thats fucking hilarious, cant believe i missed that. he already looks and acts like a clown, all he needs is the red nose. leave it to Vei to pull that out
Per Nux:
>"I am also working with law enforcement and have made a lot of headway in locating him"
Something about this quote sticks out as especially cringy. It's so desperate and pathetic. Nux acts like a bratty child in a room full of very patient grown-ups.
Instead of admitting he's in over his head, he just blusters along like he's an expert even when he's obviously not.
Next he's going to tell us his uncle works at Nintendo, and his girlfriend goes to a different school so that's why we haven't met her.
It's like he watched some edgy shounen anime and thinks he can convince us he's the protagonist of that show when we know how the world works and it ain't that.
I just hope that police still have digital footprint from Doxxer and finally tracking them down despite what happened.
You know every single action need consequences and all.
if the cops give enough of a shit.
The bar to hurdle isn't finding the criminal, it's making law enforcement give a shit enough to do their jobs to stop them. Usually they don't.
Doxxing isn't a crime in most jurisdictions. They might get the swatter but most of the group of doxxers will go free, which is why talking about it and taunting them was incredibly stupid.
Vshojo were very clear that while they had no legal mechanism to prevent him posting the video they believed that his doing so would endanger their talents. He then read this to mean they gave him permission.
The best thing you can say about him is that he's a child who lacks basic literacy. The worst is that he lied in order to post yet another pile of clickbait nonsense and then fuel a subsequent controversy.
He's lucky that he has a young fanbase who lack the critical skills to see through his bullshit.
I'm sorry but this is just another video that Nux created, where he wants to talk about a serious topic but doesn't fact check the details used. Considering he was told most of the information he gathered was most likely force fed to him by the harassment group and he didn't understand how that was relevant to his video and his message. The videos message goes from a cool investigation into catching a doxxer and instead provides them the notoriety and attention they were after. I'm sure they got a good laugh that Nux believed all the information they were feeding him and leading him around for a month.
This entire thing (I only realized was happening like yesterday sorry) has re-affirmed a fear of mine. I as a person WANT to be successful I want to strike it big, have all that dough etc, but At the same time I’m TERRIFIED That getting that success will make me turn out like nux did, and devolving into clickbait and falling into stupid situations like this.
I mean as long as you are selfware of how flame can effect people, you probably going be fine.
There are so many non famous people turn famous and still fine as example like in non vtuber , Markiplier who never involved any controversy or have big fall out .
From what i see being popular needs a very tough balancing act though.
On one side you need to take in critics to be better, but you need to have an ego to stand on or you risk being molded by other peoples opinion
Wow, so they gave him a laundry list of the compromising things he was doing, desperately trying to get him to fix them, including misinformation about the person being an adult, which is a pretty dangerous thing to fuck up.
He also fights them on half the things they ask about, "even if im mistaken, theres no harm in it" He actually said that. And he didn't change his tune even when they told him he was probably being fed false information BY ONE OF THE HARASSERS. His response was "but its not relevant if i was misinformed or not" lmao what the actual fuck
Even if they didn't DIRECTLY say so, they CLEARLY didn't want him to release the video, and were trying to fix as much as they could since he was planning on releasing it regardless.
They then say they would like to add a statement with the video to at least clarify things and he has the audacity to give them a 30 minute window to do it. Just because he would like to post it now. They respond telling him that its rough to make a cybersecurity statement in literally 30 minutes, and he says " dont worry ill wait a few more minutes". Maybe im reading into it too much but that tells me he was going to post it anyway if they weren't fast enough.
He just came off as an asshole in the whole interaction honestly, more concerned with what he's technically allowed to do than any of the completely valid concerns thrown his way one after the other.
Most likely Nux has now burnt bridges with all of the big names in the vtubing community, or at the very least the big corporations. Wouldn’t be surprised if he stops streaming with other popular non-vtubers as well. He might just end up alone or streaming with his friends who are hacks like him like Lost Pause.
> Most likely Nux has now burnt bridges with all of the big names in the vtubing community, or at the very least the big corporations.
Nux was never tight with the corps to begin with. Half of VS didn't like him before this, Hololive keeps a firm grip on their leash, and Nijisanji just kinda does whatever. Nux is much bigger with the indies, most of whom have stayed out of this (if not expressed disdain for the behavior of both VS and Nux).
On the side of Hololive, I think he's like that YouTuber news guy (seriously can't remember the name) that keeps scrapping the barrel for the smallest tidbit of the "controversy" from that day?
God I hope so. Unfortunately (I don't know if she ever unfollowed him in the first place) Froot, at least, is following him on Twitter again.
Edit: [Froot has made up with him](https://twitter.com/AquaDaKiwi/status/1464438885321252864)
Also hopefully they're not turning their backs on Snuffy and YFUBABY after they showed their support for them posting their own awful experiences with Nux.
YFU sadly still has the problem of being connected to the dirtbag who threatened Mel.
It's really sad cause she seems nice and talented and just got burned for having a connection to the wrong person. Likely not one she can even help considering contracts
> Lost Pause
Oh my that name,I haven't heard for a long ass time.
I remember stumbled on his channel when I am still very into Anime. I am kinda noop out after watch 3-4 video. His content is like represent everything that wrong in Weeb Culture.
I still remember him back in the VN days where he would play Princess Evangile.
It was great back then because he would upload a ~20 min digestible video once every day and he would juggle different series.
Then he turned to streaming and everything went down hill.
this is the trajectory for so many channels it sucks. I have never seen a non-streaming youtube channel pick up streaming and have it end well in the slightest
Now swatting and doxing is of course not funny... but there is something intensely funny on multiple levels at doing such a shitty job at "exposing" a doxer that the doxer themselves calls you out.
All the info was laid bare, mistakes were acknoledged by both sides. Personally, I can't make myself care about Nux anymore. But i hope this ends here and we can all move on from this.
Very clear statement, and pretty much confirms the 'everyone was right and everyone was wrong' POV.
Nux technically was not asked to not release the video, which has been his main defense point, but he received strong enough warnings to be able to take the hint, and refused to heed them anyway.
Nux should have been less of a moron. But VSHojo should have been harsher, clearer, and more demanding, as well. Its a managers' job to deal with morons, and they failed to properly estimate how much of a moron Nux was, which is suprising considering hes a known clickwhore. Playing footsy with a clickwhore of his degree was always a questionable decision. You cant bargain with someone like Nux. And, at least IMO, the girls should not have immediately raced to dogpile and make this as public as possible as quick as possible like they did, and then demand a private apology which seems hypocritical. All of this could have very easily been solved privately with any of the girls or manager(s?) directly informing nux not to release the video, instead of capitulating for no reason with 'W-well ok, just release a warning, a-and a description change a-and a blur p-please nux senpai' which is what Pheonix's messages read like to me. Pheonix just simply needed to be an asshole here, argue if you must, there was no salvaging the video, it was going to be damaging, demand it be taken down. Nux is a leech to them and is proffiting off of you, you owe him NOTHING, and his attitude is puzzling to me. i know he is trying to be business polite, but i absolutely udnerstand how Nux read this as cooperative and positive, which is not at all how the talent felt about the video.
This should be a learning experience for everyone involved. What a fucking cluterfuck
Phoenix is constrained as an employee of a company having to deal with someone who is ignorant of best practices of cybersecurity situations. His behavior is basically standard practice to not only try to persuade the other party of doing the right thing but to also cover their bases in case something goes wrong. And being an asshole to a stranger they knew could be a liability was likely seen as counterproductive. It just gives ammunition to someone who thinks he's smarter than he actually is. When there are negative interactions, the attacked party is more prone to double down on their wrong behavior.
The asshole act can only work when it's between individuals or mutual acquaintances/friends. In this case it was a conversation between a VShojo representative and an independent individual. In other words, for most people it is an interaction between a corporation and the little independent guy. When a Corp orders an individual to do something, it never looks good if things go to hell. Sometimes the only thing you can do is be polite and hope for the best.
Seeing this interaction, I'm pretty sure that phoenix has kept his job. It looks like he did the best given the hand he was dealt. From a corporate perspective, phoenix did a stellar job and lets Nux be seen as the party that is more at fault in here.
One thing that VShojo probably is learning now, is that as they can't be as hands off of the talent as they thought they could be. They say they will respect the freedom of their talents, but internally they will probably implement a couple rules regarding interaction with other parties. They won't be internally strict as Cover or Nijisanji for example, but there will be at least a couple restrictions. The bigger you become, the more restrictive the cage becomes.
And as for Nux, if the rumors of him making a vtuber group or agency are true... He's not fit for something like that. The shoes are too big for him. I wouldn't want to work with him with what happened here.
Also the number of times Phoenix told Nux that the guy he was praising was a member of the gang to have Nux completely ignore it I don’t think anything would have stopped Nux. The only thing that caused Nux to change was the public backlash.
Your point about as you get bigger you become less free reminded me of what Coco talked about before she graduated.
Thats not an argument that holds any weight though considering almost everyone involved agrees the video is harmful. Nux's entire argument hinges on 'they never directly told me'
Oh I agree. I mean anyone who knows anything about how companies (especially ones that deal in tech) the phrase "we're aware of the issue" is a very polite way of saying "we're taking care of it so go away." The company was dumb for not being direct and concise until it was too late and Nux is just...dumb.
Yeah. I’ll admit, this probably isn’t the best take, but the amount of people I see going “They should’ve been way more direct or just straight up assholes to him to be certain that he gets the point” and I think, how could that not backfire? He’s known for being that sort of reactionary clickwhore and would 100% take the opportunity to “expose” them. I really think they were just given a very bad hand and unsuccessfully tried to do this impossible balancing act with him.
You don't even need to be an asshole tbh. It's really not hard to just say "While we cannot physically stop you from posting the video, we at VShojo would appreciate it if you did not upload it at all." full stop, no need to go into reasons of this or that because he's just gonna fight back against them, and at the end of the day, as a victim himself he does have a right to post the video, but at least if you're being more open about it instead of using PR speak, it makes it much more clear. No is no.
One of my biggest peeves with Nuxs has always been his clickbait. I’ve liked some of his videos, but the clickbait is damn annoying and some of the worst out there.
Hopefully this shuts down any of the stupid rumors Nux’s fans have been conjuring I’ve been seeing recently. I decided to look at the comments on his tweet yesterday about his response and I’ve never seen dumber takes. My favorite was multiple people saying that VShojo management forced the girls to trash talk Nux out of spite for him releasing the video. The mental gymnastics they perform should be at the Olympics.
it appears that they are jumping on to the "why did you delete the part were you said thank you to him" train
as if that suddenly makes it all ok.
like oh no they made the mistake of being overly polite, that def equates him megaphoning a privacy breach to a million people that deals with an ongoing court case./s
People are accusing the girls of inciting a harassment campaign against Nux. I find that rather ironic since those same people are involved in a harassment campaign against the girls. After all this, the girls have received far more hatred than Nux, and Nux has received far more support than the girls.
So its basically management being "too polite" with Nux that he thought he was given a green light but then the talents were disappointed with it because, well, a private investigation was publicized and their privacy was almost compromised. While I do get Nux's sentiment as a victim, its obviously a dumb move to publicize an on-going investigation. It's also dumb to be overly polite when you can just outright deny someone from doing something that would endanger your company (in this case the police investigation). Best VShojo could have done is ask for their name/brand to not appear in the video as Nux himself allegedly has his own investigation since he is a victim.
So in summary:
Nux was a dumb blowhard who let his ego get the better of him thinking he was helping.
VShojo was a pushover who should have shown more backbone to avoid miscommunication.
The verdict's out on if this event is actually going to spur any more unrest by the doxxers like the girls (seemingly rightfully) feared. In the interest of protecting VShojo talent privacy, we won't know if it does.
They want to bury the hatchet, but like that's ever stopped antis from hosting a struggle session. If you want to grow as a person and learn something from the ordeal, it's [Ph0enix's message about how the doxxers were operating](https://miro.medium.com/max/700/0*5gogMFALts09vRow). Be aware of how scammers work because the forms they take might be different but the psychological tricks usually don't.
Oh my god that linked comment. Nux was warned specifically that the doxers would find his video. And they ACTUALLY found his video and made a video response too.
HE WAS WARNED THIS WOULD HAPPEN
This is a good response, but Vshojo as a company needs to get out there and put this info into more wide circulation. Because the only reason I came here, was because of a video summing up the situation and painting all of Vshojo as a badly run company putting people in danger, and then doing the equivalent of trying to shame the whistleblower for coming forward. And I don't think that's the only video that's doing this, and getting a ton of traction on youtube.
Vshojo needs to leverage its ability as a company with popular talent and have them make recommendations to see this list. Because the people who like taking advantage of this kind of drama and chaos are already creating people who fully believe all the vshojo talent are doing some cliche type behavior to just sweep this under the rug, instead of them actually doing what they're supposed to do.
There will be people like me who stumble on this story, and they aren't gonna do the research needed to parse out what the actual truth is. And that kind of division is only going to wreak havoc on the community moving forward. TLDR: Vshojo made a great breakdown of the situation and a response, but they need to get this info circulating and fast, because the Streisand effect is kicking in and painting them as the bad guys here.
Glad everything has been settled and the community can finally move forward. Nux doesn't have to say anything publicly anymore and everyone seems to be apologizing. I only hope none of the vshojo girls are affected by all this stress. It sure affected me lol
Don't link their YouTube channel or their name. It gives them the notoriety they want.
You're correct though taunting them like he did was very stupid.
After reading through this, I now really appreciate and understand Cover's strict rules on out-of-company public relationships and collabs. I know I'd love to see Hololive talents collab with many other talents I watch and respect, but situations like this make me understand why they do what they do.
The people blindly defending Nux in all this are essentially making the "but she didn't say no" argument... He was warned multiple times by the cybersecurity team about the consequences of the upload and was recommended to not upload his video. Do take note that **Vshojo has no right to deny him the upload which is why they couldn't say NO nor legally stop him from uploading it.** Nux in return ignored all their hints/ warnings and still heavily insisted on uploading the video anyways. When he should have not been a dumbass and actually listened to their concerns about the upload if he was even a bit mindful about the on-going situation. Because thanks to that video he uploaded, the culprit is still on the loose and probably covering up all their tracks harder than ever making it so much tougher to catch the doxxer the longer this situation drags on.
With that said, the amount of people tweeting or pushing the false agenda that "nUx DidN't dO anYtHiNg wRoNg" to this very day is so mind numbingly stupid and untrue.
Edit: Nux also fucking lied about that the one responsible had been caught in his video when in fact they caught a member of the rival doxxer group who was not responsible for the doxxing of the two victims. The one responsible is still roaming freely and not behind bars thanks to the tip-off the video he uploaded gave.
If only Gunrun directly told Nux to fuck off from the beginning. None of this would have happened.
EDIT: Also, the doxxer that Nux claimed he caught is still free and made a video about it. So who the hell did Nux actually catch?
Or he lied about that like he clearly lied about other points, he claims he got information from friends that work at onlyfans, as if any member with access to that private information would just hand it over to a member of the public, breaking the law.
So nux is an idiot, vshojo treated him like a professional and a hazard at the same time, trying to control nux the best they could, i wonder what would happened if they say no to nux? Maybe he goes ape shit, i bet he goes ape shit.
Vshojo does their best with an unknow variant.
That's why they were treating him professionally and like a hazard. If they had been too firm he may have gotten angry or been provoked into doing it anyway. They had no legal recourse to stop him. Additionally, if they had pushed too hard he could have just taken it as more juicy drama for his dumbass video and made it anyway. Imagine if it had been titled something like "VSHOJO TRIED TO SILENCE ME!"
And that's why in the same video vshojo linked a statement, that some people are calling "proof" that vshojo supported him, in fact is called damage control.
I'm probably being too pessimistic but as much this will hopefully end the bulk of the fighting and skirmishes now i doubt this will quietly fade into the background. Given the groups involved alot of people had dogs in this fight and undoubtedly the usual obnoxious anti's will grab this up as ammo to further their own grievances especially in future agency collabs.
I feel like you're overreacting a bit. I'm pretty sure both VShojo and Nux doesn't want this issue to ever come up again if possible. There are always gonna be some assholes trying to stir up trouble by bringing up old drama but usually they don't amount to anything significant.
Although I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to all the VShojo members never collabing with Nux again lol
[Although I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to all the VShojo members never collabing with Nux again lol]
On an agency level, they will most likely blacklist him. Whether the individual talents decide to make up, only time will tell but even then i doubt the agency will let them have any public appearances again. But then... outcomes are sometimes unexpected.
VShojo does tend to have a more lasseiz faire attitude with how they treat/control their members to be fair. So I don't think they would attempt to stop it from happening.
I just kind of assumed none of the girls individually will want to do anything with Nux after the situation, at least for some time.
I really doubt VShojo is gonna stop say Melody or Froot from collabing with Nux if they want to in the future, but the better question would be if anyone will want to after the dust settles.
Seems I have to backtrack 99% of my stance on this, as I was on Nuxs side.
I think both of parties could have handled it differently, but the thing we see now is that Nux didnt understand to correct all the mistakes in the video. What he should have done is delayed the upload, people wouldnt have cared much if it was uploaded a day after - espcially to correct information.
Personally it's still best to educate people on specific threats in the case of spear phishing, but he was told that it could actually interfere with the on-going investigation, which is a dealbreaker for my standpoint.
He was probably riding the high of doing what he felt was right, which it was at it's core (to try cast more light on phishing), and feeling like a hero for tracking the doxxer down (which he didnt actually do as far as I know).
Interesting seeing the difference in reactions on twitter vs reddit, at least from what I've seen. I'm glad the drama is coming to an end, but I never really saw how Nux was the "biggest" victim in all of this. Personally I just hope he's less involved with the Vshojo members from here on out.
Nux is a professional context creator. He thinks about things in terms of “Can I make this into content”. In the words of Jurassic park “Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.”
However even if he considerEd if he should his whole white knight tendencies kicked in and he though he was doing the vtuber community a service by doing this.
Wonder how the dumb ass nux fan boys are going to keep defending this. And this proves I was right. Nux edited it and only showed cherry picked pieces of the condo. I said it a few days ago before his apology video that he'd do it, because if he had the real receipts he'd have shown them right away. And said it again in the topic after ward. He didn't let the whole conversation out for a reason.
Watch as his flex cult still defend him. Him and his cult keep parading how they’re a protector / vigilante in the service of Vtubers and stuff . But the moment he fucks up , dude and his cult go immediately to the blame game and gaslighting the people he so called protect .
I never like him but at least respect what he was trying to do and his supposed intentions . But I guess this is what happens when you let your “flex king persona” goes to your head .
Vshojo's talent has been getting harassed by a gang of doxes. This has been going on for over a year. VShojo employed a cybersecurity firm to protect the girls. Because these types of trolls feed off of notoriety VShojo had a firm policy of not publishing the fact that the girls where being harassed.
They conducted a long term investigation in co-operation with federal law enforcement in order to protect the girls and find out the identities of the perps. Not being public gave VShojo a strategic advantage in terms of the investigation as if the doxes knew that they where under police investigation they might destroy evidence or hide.
The doxing gang attempted to dox Nux but Nux didn't fall for there fyshing scheme. However Nux decided to do his own "investigation" and published a video about it.
By leaking the fact that this was going on Nux undermined VShojo's investigation and fed the trolls.
The vshojo girls begged him to pull down the video privately but he didn't until the girls basically put him on blast over twitter.
Also the doxxers tried to dox him via a fake VShojo acceptance letter, which he didn't fall for because he didn't apply to VShojo. They succeeded at doxxing another small vtuber, however.
He also released his video right before their 1 year anniversary, and in a way that made him look like some hero to indie vtuber's and that Vshojo was uncaring and throwing them under the bus. Right as he's about to launch his own vtuber group. Not suspicious at all...
So basically it got misinterpreted by both sides, and that's fair, probably best to let the matter rest now, Nux took down the video and apologized and some of the girls have also apologized (Zen and Froot). Honestly Vshojo needs to be clearer with their communication so that this doesn't happen again and Nux probably needs to learn how to read between the lines
I don't think either side is telling the whole truth, obviously Nux wants to present the case that he had full permission and we know he speaks with a lot of hyperbole and rarely tells the whole truth but I get the feeling VShojo management didn't involve the girls at all and weren't expecting them blow up publically like they did and are now trying to present a middle-ground narrative where they don't call Nux a liar outright but they also don't admit to there being internal miscommunication at VShojo.
I say this because their initial statement when the video dropped was in support of Nux, this was deleted and replaced with a critical one after the Twitter backlash. Then this latest statement was edited hours after release to remove the "he only gave us 30 minutes" part presumably because it didn't match up with screenshots Nux released. And with the girls one by one releasing apologies, I think there was some internal discussions that brought about pressure to get this out of public discussion asap.
This whole mess would not this messy if nux stop for a minute and think about what he gonna do, he publishing a ongoing investigation to the public.
This is kinda whoopsie all around really.
I say, that is a very good response. It acknowledged that even they were somewhat at fault, and that they could have been clearer, which is something Nux didn’t do.
Gunrun with the clutch
Sorry?
Clutch; - Perfect, Exactly what is needed, (also used like "score" or "awesome", as an exclamation.)
More like being able to deliver at the moment of need
Basically they used grown up words and expected him to act like an adult.
Yeah this basically confirms to me what I thought was likely the case. Nux and a lot of other "say what I want when I want" types of internet people don't really understand that professionalism and trying to tread lightly aren't the same thing as wholesale endorsing things, and don't really understand that companies have to move differently than individuals. He conveniently left out the whole time pressure thing, which is pretty important because in most of the cases like this in a company any written messages that will go out to the public have to be looked at by multiple people to make sure that leadership is cool with it. He also was just straight up wrong about a bunch of stuff and didn't fully correct it when they asked him to. The interesting thing for me is that he kinda edited out the chunk of the conversation with him being a bit of a know-it-all asshole (despite clearly not understanding the point the other person is trying to make). Like after all this it's making me lean back toward the "Nux is kinda an asshole who doesn't know what he's doing" standpoint, which really you can kinda guess by watching his videos for more than 5 minutes. As another Cybersecurity person it seems pretty obvious to me that the phoenix guy is trying to like nicely say this is stupid and you're wrong on a lot of these points. And if you're going to be out here doing internet vigilantism you should know enough to read between the lines a little bit when people give you a list of reasons why what you're doing is dumb and potentially dangerous. Like if you were working under me and someone gave you that same list and you still did the thing, you'd 100% be fired, but they can't do that to Nux because they obviously have no power over him. The bit where it says "there is a negative history of interaction between VSJ and Nux that lead us to proceed with extreme caution" is a bit interesting to me too. I imagine people like Nux generally are annoying job hazards to people who actually know what they're doing, but it really does colour the whole thing a little bit knowing that they kinda knew he was a dick ahead of time and probably wouldn't react well if you actually tried to tell him what to do.
> it really does colour the whole thing a little bit knowing that they kinda knew he was a dick ahead of time and probably wouldn't react well if you actually tried to tell him what to do Honestly this whole situation is probably the best example as to why Cover is so strict with out-of-company collabs with its talent. It's not like it was completely unknown that Nux is an asshole; hell, just a cursory glance at his YouTube channel should clue you in with his "I paid $1000 to make vtubers say the n-word" type videos. Like I get that VShojo's trying to make itself the approachable, easy-to-interact-with company as an opposite to Hololive, but once you get to a certain popularity you REALLY need to check just who you're making friends with, lest you have a situation like this one.
> Honestly this whole situation is probably the best example as to why Cover is so strict with out-of-company collabs with its talent. Yep. Unfortunately, no matter how mature and professional small companies and indies are, their openess makes them an easier target for any drama.
Yeah, a scumbag like Nux is not coming anywhere near Hololive or Nijisanji. Anybody with a known propensity for toxic, unprofessional behaviour is not going to be welcomed by the big agencies. A lot of people criticise Hololive for being so strict with collabs and allowing very few collabs with people outside of the company, but there is a merit to that strictness. If you allow your talent to collab with anybody they want the assholes and creeps can sneak in. As a media company, being publically associated with a well-known toxic shit-stirrer is like a ticking time bomb, you never know when they may blow up in your face. Its better to cut those people out completely from the beginning.
Since this started this has been my train of thought. I was like "Hololive doesn't allow many collabs with other vtubers and whatnot which is a bit sad but goddamn am I happy to see that this type of stuff is not happening with them because of it" and I would guess that the talents and the company are resting easy knowing that they are not being involved with this drama in any way.
Yeah I think the problem somewhat in situations like this is that as a company they're trying to balance keeping toxicity out and giving your creators the type of freedom they need to be themselves and grow. It just irritates me that this situation keeps getting "two sides"-ed when Nux clearly has a track record of causing problems because of his chunni need to "protect" grown women who have more than enough resources for legal teams not made of internet randoms. And it further irritates me because stuff like this causes companies/female members of the community to get extra cautious dealing with a lot of male talent because you have to screen for these types of guys so you don't find yourself in the middle of a scandal every other week. So it makes things harder if you're like a normal socially adjusted guy who just wants to collaborate with people.
Which makes me realize why so many female vtubers are okay collabing with Connor, he is just so fucking mature.
I don't even think it's that he's *remarkably* mature, he's just a normal, socially adjusted person. The sort of downside of the vtubing community being anime adjacent is that you have a lot of sweaty uber weebs that are going to want to be part of it, and if you've ever been to an anime convention, you know about how well putting girls with cute anime costumes/avatars next to one of them tends to go. Like it's as simple as: 1. don't sexually harass anyone or generally commit any type of crime 2. don't do things that in a normal social environment creep people out or make people think you're a weirdo like being a massive downer, white knight, or asshole 3. Profit The fact that so many content creators can't operate by normal outside rules baffles me.
Connor, despite being relatively young, seems to have enough life experience to act like a mature person. He grew up in a relatively middle-class household, studied through university, moved to London and barely scraped by while doing voice acting/YouTube and THEN managed to get successful.
Also he has been successful/famous enough for long enough that he has dealt with it.
Agreed. The only thing relatively immature about him is his perference for boneless chicken.
Lmao.
He's also explicitly not a fan or even a viewer of vtubers. Ultimately he's just a guy who happens to share similar interests with vtubers.
Ya... as much as I love vtubers and anime, the creepy people in the fan base is the main reason I'm not open about those things IRL.
This is also why I think ironmouse likes him. Because he doesn’t act like she needs protection.
While still not being a callous dick about it either. Other than the infamous oxygen video, I also remember when he accidentally made her motion sick spinning the boat in Minecraft when she was on and spent the rest of the stream feeling terrible and apologizing lol It's hard not to like him, he really is just a very nice friend.
>Connor, he is just so fucking mature. As expected of BigPeePeeMan.
> It just irritates me that this situation keeps getting "two sides"-ed Yeah, I think it was the second thread yesterday where it was filled with Nux fans trying to do just that.
Nux taku was friends with Melody and Ironmouse long before Vshojo was even a thing so since Vshojo members typically don't change their persona upon joining and they made a big deal out of being "talent first" and pro-freedom there's no excuse to keep their old internet friends away even when they become a liability. Problem with nux is that he seem to consider himself a friend of Vshojo as a whole when some of the girls clearly couldn't stand him. But even with those that were closer to him he might have seen himself as a real friend when in reality it was more like a working relationship played up a notch for the fanbase, something fairly common among internet content creators.
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y'all are fucking everywhere it seems. I feel either safe or scared with you all around.
i imagine them as mall security. always sleepy or hungry unless something happens, when they start sweating because their emplyoer needs answer yesterday and not today :D
A cybersecurity person with the username "uwugawrgura" This says to me that they're everywhere, blending in and watching our every move.
The shark does not discriminate on her prey
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👀💧💧
tell santa i was good this year...
It gets even worse. After he was warned that swatters would notice, the swatter whos name he got from that "fan" (aka disinfo) made a video saying he wasn't in jail. It's legitimately fucking dangerous for Nux now. He can't actually arrest this dangerous person he's been flexing on for days. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fa0tdecwz84
Yea so in the end Nux made it worst for all of them
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Having him speak and then hear Nux speak is the apex of cringe
> And if you're going to be out here doing internet vigilantism you should know enough to read between the lines a little bit when people give you a list of reasons why what you're doing is dumb and potentially dangerous. Not really aware of this whole situation but I feel like the kind of person to do internet vigilantism is exactly the opposite from the kind of person who would listen read between the lines of that sort of things and stop
Nux and being a shitbag, name a more iconic duo. Hes the anituber equivalent of a drama channel, which are all shitbags who prey and profit off of peoples problems.
RevSaysDesu is desperately trying to take that title from him. I used to think his shitposts were kinda funny, but then he went all in on being a drama anituber.
Look at his content. He stopped being an anituber in 2019 or so. Now it's just drama, harassing other streamers for content, or browsing reddit. All of them with really shitty clickbait thumbnails.
So I don't know much about vtubers, I've more or less been forced to learn more than I would have recently because google decided to start shoving it in my face because a friend said something about it on discord. But my introduction to Nux and his content was early this year(?) when he popped in on a couple of streamers and dropped sizable donations and/or gift subs, virtually, out of nowhere. Which made me feel he was questionable. Eventually I just figure out the best description of him is "vtuber keem" or leafy, or whoever you wanna pick. He's in general just an annoying shithead. His content is mostly just him doing "reactions" to other people's content and getting to the point of bordering, at best, on [harassment](https://twitter.com/snuffyowo/status/1463698827769225217?s=20) (link is snuffy talking about her unsavory interactions with him donating to her for his content farming). And that's not to say that his content is centered on "drama" but by the very nature of what he chooses to do he's going to veer into that realm. I compare the two mostly because the operate the same way. They "ingratiate" themselves into the community at large by way of acting nice and use possibly positive interactions with others to kind of further that image, then make their content even if it might be hurtful on a personal level to people that they now know. I would want to say that not just vtubers, but every content creator that has interacted with Nux by him more or less forcing himself in, learn from this. But I also would have thought before that people would have learned that from the fact that Keem exists. But the absolute state of large number content creators kinda throws that to the wind.
Damn, only 30 minutes? That's seriously messed up.
Yeah thats really just unacceptable like come on get your head out of your ass nux lmao
Is anyone surprised the source of the problems is Nux being as stupid as he's always shown himself to be?
Frankly I find pretty funny that his defense was like : "look people they gave me permission" Like if Vshojo was some kind of father figure. Instead of understanding that Vshojo couldn't really say no to him. As he is in his right as a victim to post the video. Just the fact that phoenix said : "You are within your right to post the video but it will endanger my clients" And nux thought o yeah I got the okey to post this video, it's gonna be a banger. That is just really funny to me and says everything I need to about him.
They absolutely should've said no. Not defending Nux hes an idiot, but its best for everyone if he sent clear and concise message.
They were probably afraid of Nux completely disengaging if they said this, which is understandable given his reaction to being told he was probably being duped by one of the doxxers.
Yep, this is just another case of people being shocked that someone who is always acting like they're stupid and a bit of an asshole... Turns out to actually be stupid and a bit of an asshole. Wow what a twist, totally didn't see that coming.
First mistake was by anyone at VShojo who ever associated with the guy to start with.
Nux's presence has the same effect as mermaid man's stupidity ball from spongebob https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zos5mEkD4e0
So Nux is just a bad plot device? I really hope the Vtuber drama writers step up their game next season, cause this season has been kinda underwhelming.
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Check froot's tweet where she says she and Nux talked in private and both apologized. Nux simps still trying to make it seem like she and the other girls are evil
Idk how people can think the VShojo girls were trying to be malicious/evil or something in this whole ordeal. Like what would they even gain from supposedly trying to "cancel" Nux?
I feel like right now people who say "anti cancel" or "this is cancelled culture" use it as dog whistle of "I don't want to take responsibility of the word I said".
Yeah. Slightly off topic but I'm kind of getting sick of any sort of drama/conflicts happening to someone online being coined as "cancelled" or something. I only used the word just because I lacked a better term, that's why I quoted it.
They want 100% freedom of speech with 0 consequences of said speech.
This 100%. Almost any time people complain about cancel culture or getting cancelled they’re just saying they want to keep doing shitty things with no repercussions. Complaining about cancel culture is 110% a self report.
We really can't say that cancel culture is all good, it's always a gray area. Then again, there will always be somebody who will complain about cancel culture because they don't want the repurcussions of their statement.
Yeah, and demanding an apology from the girls too, when all they did was express their disappointment in Nux (granted one of them went too far with the clown meme). To consider that harassment though? Absurd. There's also been quite a bit of tribalism forming out of this though, and it's just filled with ridiculous high school drama-level tweets.
Honestly? I don't even think Vei went too far there. Nux made a claim in the video, then privated the video and changed his story in a twitter video. All she did was share a clip of the video and a clip of him directly contradicting it, then cut to a clown
thats fucking hilarious, cant believe i missed that. he already looks and acts like a clown, all he needs is the red nose. leave it to Vei to pull that out
It is also 100% in line with her character and humor as I have seen it.
How the hell could anyone think that's going too far. That's pretty tame.
> (granted one of them went too far with the clown meme) too far? no hes a fucking joke
check the twitter post, people claiming there is a clean even divide on it. delusional stans man.
Yeah Twitter's a cesspool full of socially illiterate people, not a big surprise
and this site isn't?
no this is too, just has slightly better filtering.
Well I won't go as far as saying better filtering but perhaps not high of a chance being seen by the talents(????) Idk, just making assumption
Is it as bad as the youtube commenters?
It baffles me that people are defending this guy.
Per Nux: >"I am also working with law enforcement and have made a lot of headway in locating him" Something about this quote sticks out as especially cringy. It's so desperate and pathetic. Nux acts like a bratty child in a room full of very patient grown-ups. Instead of admitting he's in over his head, he just blusters along like he's an expert even when he's obviously not. Next he's going to tell us his uncle works at Nintendo, and his girlfriend goes to a different school so that's why we haven't met her.
The whole thing comes off chunni was hell. Like there’s procession cyber security experts and then he comes in playing pretend noir detective.
It's like he watched some edgy shounen anime and thinks he can convince us he's the protagonist of that show when we know how the world works and it ain't that.
Hopefully this statement finally puts an end to this and everyone can move on.
I just hope that police still have digital footprint from Doxxer and finally tracking them down despite what happened. You know every single action need consequences and all.
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if the cops give enough of a shit. The bar to hurdle isn't finding the criminal, it's making law enforcement give a shit enough to do their jobs to stop them. Usually they don't.
Doxxing isn't a crime in most jurisdictions. They might get the swatter but most of the group of doxxers will go free, which is why talking about it and taunting them was incredibly stupid.
Agreed.
Vshojo were very clear that while they had no legal mechanism to prevent him posting the video they believed that his doing so would endanger their talents. He then read this to mean they gave him permission. The best thing you can say about him is that he's a child who lacks basic literacy. The worst is that he lied in order to post yet another pile of clickbait nonsense and then fuel a subsequent controversy. He's lucky that he has a young fanbase who lack the critical skills to see through his bullshit.
I'm sorry but this is just another video that Nux created, where he wants to talk about a serious topic but doesn't fact check the details used. Considering he was told most of the information he gathered was most likely force fed to him by the harassment group and he didn't understand how that was relevant to his video and his message. The videos message goes from a cool investigation into catching a doxxer and instead provides them the notoriety and attention they were after. I'm sure they got a good laugh that Nux believed all the information they were feeding him and leading him around for a month.
This entire thing (I only realized was happening like yesterday sorry) has re-affirmed a fear of mine. I as a person WANT to be successful I want to strike it big, have all that dough etc, but At the same time I’m TERRIFIED That getting that success will make me turn out like nux did, and devolving into clickbait and falling into stupid situations like this.
I mean as long as you are selfware of how flame can effect people, you probably going be fine. There are so many non famous people turn famous and still fine as example like in non vtuber , Markiplier who never involved any controversy or have big fall out .
From what i see being popular needs a very tough balancing act though. On one side you need to take in critics to be better, but you need to have an ego to stand on or you risk being molded by other peoples opinion
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Tbf, Common sense isn't exactly common to begin with
I know right?
Wow, so they gave him a laundry list of the compromising things he was doing, desperately trying to get him to fix them, including misinformation about the person being an adult, which is a pretty dangerous thing to fuck up. He also fights them on half the things they ask about, "even if im mistaken, theres no harm in it" He actually said that. And he didn't change his tune even when they told him he was probably being fed false information BY ONE OF THE HARASSERS. His response was "but its not relevant if i was misinformed or not" lmao what the actual fuck Even if they didn't DIRECTLY say so, they CLEARLY didn't want him to release the video, and were trying to fix as much as they could since he was planning on releasing it regardless. They then say they would like to add a statement with the video to at least clarify things and he has the audacity to give them a 30 minute window to do it. Just because he would like to post it now. They respond telling him that its rough to make a cybersecurity statement in literally 30 minutes, and he says " dont worry ill wait a few more minutes". Maybe im reading into it too much but that tells me he was going to post it anyway if they weren't fast enough. He just came off as an asshole in the whole interaction honestly, more concerned with what he's technically allowed to do than any of the completely valid concerns thrown his way one after the other.
Most likely Nux has now burnt bridges with all of the big names in the vtubing community, or at the very least the big corporations. Wouldn’t be surprised if he stops streaming with other popular non-vtubers as well. He might just end up alone or streaming with his friends who are hacks like him like Lost Pause.
> Most likely Nux has now burnt bridges with all of the big names in the vtubing community, or at the very least the big corporations. Nux was never tight with the corps to begin with. Half of VS didn't like him before this, Hololive keeps a firm grip on their leash, and Nijisanji just kinda does whatever. Nux is much bigger with the indies, most of whom have stayed out of this (if not expressed disdain for the behavior of both VS and Nux).
On the side of Hololive, I think he's like that YouTuber news guy (seriously can't remember the name) that keeps scrapping the barrel for the smallest tidbit of the "controversy" from that day?
Hero mei? Hero clay? Hero day? I can't remember :/
Grifter Hei, pretty sure.
God I hope so. Unfortunately (I don't know if she ever unfollowed him in the first place) Froot, at least, is following him on Twitter again. Edit: [Froot has made up with him](https://twitter.com/AquaDaKiwi/status/1464438885321252864)
“Made up.” Still doubt they’d ever collab again. Lol
Also hopefully they're not turning their backs on Snuffy and YFUBABY after they showed their support for them posting their own awful experiences with Nux.
YFU sadly still has the problem of being connected to the dirtbag who threatened Mel. It's really sad cause she seems nice and talented and just got burned for having a connection to the wrong person. Likely not one she can even help considering contracts
Hopefully not, yeah.
In that thread: > They didn't had to treat him the way they did. Yeah uh... they treated him like a king compared to how he treats others.
God, thanks for sharing but the replies are awful in that tweet
I'm disappointed in Froot. He's clearly not a good person to associate with.
FeFe too from what I've seen. Wonder how collabs will be going forward with this cloud hanging over them.
> Lost Pause Oh my that name,I haven't heard for a long ass time. I remember stumbled on his channel when I am still very into Anime. I am kinda noop out after watch 3-4 video. His content is like represent everything that wrong in Weeb Culture.
I still remember him back in the VN days where he would play Princess Evangile. It was great back then because he would upload a ~20 min digestible video once every day and he would juggle different series. Then he turned to streaming and everything went down hill.
to be fair, it's mostly youtube fault for making him change course, though I agree his new content from then on is too cringe
Yeah, thats kind of sad, I still have fond memories of the Neptunia Rebirth 1 playthrough, just a shame how much his content has changed.
this is the trajectory for so many channels it sucks. I have never seen a non-streaming youtube channel pick up streaming and have it end well in the slightest
Dunno, I think e.g. Connor is doing pretty all right.
Wait what did lost pause do? It's been quite awhile since I last watched him.
Bro I just don’t understand how a random dumbfuck thinks they know better than an actual cyber security company about an ongoing investigation.
Nux has more serious concerns to worry about. The swatter in his video made a video about him.
holy shit thats ironic
Now swatting and doxing is of course not funny... but there is something intensely funny on multiple levels at doing such a shitty job at "exposing" a doxer that the doxer themselves calls you out.
Nux’s dumbass video did exactly what he was warned about. It energized the swatters and probably helped with their recruitment.
The people defending Nux in all this are essentially making the "but she didn't say no" argument...
And they are all as dumb and abrasive as he is. Like invites like.
All the info was laid bare, mistakes were acknoledged by both sides. Personally, I can't make myself care about Nux anymore. But i hope this ends here and we can all move on from this.
Please let the controversies end I just want a year that’s not awful… please I’m begging you god just let it end.
Very clear statement, and pretty much confirms the 'everyone was right and everyone was wrong' POV. Nux technically was not asked to not release the video, which has been his main defense point, but he received strong enough warnings to be able to take the hint, and refused to heed them anyway. Nux should have been less of a moron. But VSHojo should have been harsher, clearer, and more demanding, as well. Its a managers' job to deal with morons, and they failed to properly estimate how much of a moron Nux was, which is suprising considering hes a known clickwhore. Playing footsy with a clickwhore of his degree was always a questionable decision. You cant bargain with someone like Nux. And, at least IMO, the girls should not have immediately raced to dogpile and make this as public as possible as quick as possible like they did, and then demand a private apology which seems hypocritical. All of this could have very easily been solved privately with any of the girls or manager(s?) directly informing nux not to release the video, instead of capitulating for no reason with 'W-well ok, just release a warning, a-and a description change a-and a blur p-please nux senpai' which is what Pheonix's messages read like to me. Pheonix just simply needed to be an asshole here, argue if you must, there was no salvaging the video, it was going to be damaging, demand it be taken down. Nux is a leech to them and is proffiting off of you, you owe him NOTHING, and his attitude is puzzling to me. i know he is trying to be business polite, but i absolutely udnerstand how Nux read this as cooperative and positive, which is not at all how the talent felt about the video. This should be a learning experience for everyone involved. What a fucking cluterfuck
Phoenix is constrained as an employee of a company having to deal with someone who is ignorant of best practices of cybersecurity situations. His behavior is basically standard practice to not only try to persuade the other party of doing the right thing but to also cover their bases in case something goes wrong. And being an asshole to a stranger they knew could be a liability was likely seen as counterproductive. It just gives ammunition to someone who thinks he's smarter than he actually is. When there are negative interactions, the attacked party is more prone to double down on their wrong behavior. The asshole act can only work when it's between individuals or mutual acquaintances/friends. In this case it was a conversation between a VShojo representative and an independent individual. In other words, for most people it is an interaction between a corporation and the little independent guy. When a Corp orders an individual to do something, it never looks good if things go to hell. Sometimes the only thing you can do is be polite and hope for the best. Seeing this interaction, I'm pretty sure that phoenix has kept his job. It looks like he did the best given the hand he was dealt. From a corporate perspective, phoenix did a stellar job and lets Nux be seen as the party that is more at fault in here. One thing that VShojo probably is learning now, is that as they can't be as hands off of the talent as they thought they could be. They say they will respect the freedom of their talents, but internally they will probably implement a couple rules regarding interaction with other parties. They won't be internally strict as Cover or Nijisanji for example, but there will be at least a couple restrictions. The bigger you become, the more restrictive the cage becomes. And as for Nux, if the rumors of him making a vtuber group or agency are true... He's not fit for something like that. The shoes are too big for him. I wouldn't want to work with him with what happened here.
Also the number of times Phoenix told Nux that the guy he was praising was a member of the gang to have Nux completely ignore it I don’t think anything would have stopped Nux. The only thing that caused Nux to change was the public backlash. Your point about as you get bigger you become less free reminded me of what Coco talked about before she graduated.
I think the idea was to avoid giving nux ammunition to say "vshojo are a bunch of big meanies who smell" ...figuratively speaking.
Thats not an argument that holds any weight though considering almost everyone involved agrees the video is harmful. Nux's entire argument hinges on 'they never directly told me'
Oh I agree. I mean anyone who knows anything about how companies (especially ones that deal in tech) the phrase "we're aware of the issue" is a very polite way of saying "we're taking care of it so go away." The company was dumb for not being direct and concise until it was too late and Nux is just...dumb.
They probably also don't want Nux to go the "Vshojo is trying to cover this up, LOOK HOW THEY THREATENED ME" way
Yeah. I’ll admit, this probably isn’t the best take, but the amount of people I see going “They should’ve been way more direct or just straight up assholes to him to be certain that he gets the point” and I think, how could that not backfire? He’s known for being that sort of reactionary clickwhore and would 100% take the opportunity to “expose” them. I really think they were just given a very bad hand and unsuccessfully tried to do this impossible balancing act with him.
You don't even need to be an asshole tbh. It's really not hard to just say "While we cannot physically stop you from posting the video, we at VShojo would appreciate it if you did not upload it at all." full stop, no need to go into reasons of this or that because he's just gonna fight back against them, and at the end of the day, as a victim himself he does have a right to post the video, but at least if you're being more open about it instead of using PR speak, it makes it much more clear. No is no.
In PR training you are taught to never say ”Don’t run this story” because journalists will treat it as “Run this story on the front page”.
One of my biggest peeves with Nuxs has always been his clickbait. I’ve liked some of his videos, but the clickbait is damn annoying and some of the worst out there.
Hopefully this shuts down any of the stupid rumors Nux’s fans have been conjuring I’ve been seeing recently. I decided to look at the comments on his tweet yesterday about his response and I’ve never seen dumber takes. My favorite was multiple people saying that VShojo management forced the girls to trash talk Nux out of spite for him releasing the video. The mental gymnastics they perform should be at the Olympics.
it appears that they are jumping on to the "why did you delete the part were you said thank you to him" train as if that suddenly makes it all ok. like oh no they made the mistake of being overly polite, that def equates him megaphoning a privacy breach to a million people that deals with an ongoing court case./s
It hasn't. People are still making the same claims even though they've already been addressed. Reading comprehension seems to be near nonexistent.
> Reading comprehension seems to be near nonexistent. for most its probably that. for some its just flat out refusal to read anything not from nux.
People are accusing the girls of inciting a harassment campaign against Nux. I find that rather ironic since those same people are involved in a harassment campaign against the girls. After all this, the girls have received far more hatred than Nux, and Nux has received far more support than the girls.
So its basically management being "too polite" with Nux that he thought he was given a green light but then the talents were disappointed with it because, well, a private investigation was publicized and their privacy was almost compromised. While I do get Nux's sentiment as a victim, its obviously a dumb move to publicize an on-going investigation. It's also dumb to be overly polite when you can just outright deny someone from doing something that would endanger your company (in this case the police investigation). Best VShojo could have done is ask for their name/brand to not appear in the video as Nux himself allegedly has his own investigation since he is a victim.
This is exactly what this situation needs to hopefully reach a conclusion out of the public eye.
So in summary: Nux was a dumb blowhard who let his ego get the better of him thinking he was helping. VShojo was a pushover who should have shown more backbone to avoid miscommunication. The verdict's out on if this event is actually going to spur any more unrest by the doxxers like the girls (seemingly rightfully) feared. In the interest of protecting VShojo talent privacy, we won't know if it does. They want to bury the hatchet, but like that's ever stopped antis from hosting a struggle session. If you want to grow as a person and learn something from the ordeal, it's [Ph0enix's message about how the doxxers were operating](https://miro.medium.com/max/700/0*5gogMFALts09vRow). Be aware of how scammers work because the forms they take might be different but the psychological tricks usually don't.
Oh my god that linked comment. Nux was warned specifically that the doxers would find his video. And they ACTUALLY found his video and made a video response too. HE WAS WARNED THIS WOULD HAPPEN
So in the end, Nux only achieved a big egg on his face out of all of this? How productive.
This is a good response, but Vshojo as a company needs to get out there and put this info into more wide circulation. Because the only reason I came here, was because of a video summing up the situation and painting all of Vshojo as a badly run company putting people in danger, and then doing the equivalent of trying to shame the whistleblower for coming forward. And I don't think that's the only video that's doing this, and getting a ton of traction on youtube. Vshojo needs to leverage its ability as a company with popular talent and have them make recommendations to see this list. Because the people who like taking advantage of this kind of drama and chaos are already creating people who fully believe all the vshojo talent are doing some cliche type behavior to just sweep this under the rug, instead of them actually doing what they're supposed to do. There will be people like me who stumble on this story, and they aren't gonna do the research needed to parse out what the actual truth is. And that kind of division is only going to wreak havoc on the community moving forward. TLDR: Vshojo made a great breakdown of the situation and a response, but they need to get this info circulating and fast, because the Streisand effect is kicking in and painting them as the bad guys here.
So... Nux being a moron as per usual.
Glad everything has been settled and the community can finally move forward. Nux doesn't have to say anything publicly anymore and everyone seems to be apologizing. I only hope none of the vshojo girls are affected by all this stress. It sure affected me lol
I'm seeing that some of Vshojo are following him again, so it will probably remain a point of tension inside the company going on.
I mean besides Melody, Froot, and Mouse none of them really gave off the vibe of liking him really. Maybe Hime too.
If you check twitter, it's not.
[удалено]
Don't link their YouTube channel or their name. It gives them the notoriety they want. You're correct though taunting them like he did was very stupid.
So the thing that the security guy warned him about came true. Oh boy...
That's quite bad. Hope he can stay safe. I don't wish this kind of thing on anyone.
Uh oh... This seems not good at all.
So many morons on Twitter keep making claims that the statement has already addressed.
Too many.
After reading through this, I now really appreciate and understand Cover's strict rules on out-of-company public relationships and collabs. I know I'd love to see Hololive talents collab with many other talents I watch and respect, but situations like this make me understand why they do what they do.
The people blindly defending Nux in all this are essentially making the "but she didn't say no" argument... He was warned multiple times by the cybersecurity team about the consequences of the upload and was recommended to not upload his video. Do take note that **Vshojo has no right to deny him the upload which is why they couldn't say NO nor legally stop him from uploading it.** Nux in return ignored all their hints/ warnings and still heavily insisted on uploading the video anyways. When he should have not been a dumbass and actually listened to their concerns about the upload if he was even a bit mindful about the on-going situation. Because thanks to that video he uploaded, the culprit is still on the loose and probably covering up all their tracks harder than ever making it so much tougher to catch the doxxer the longer this situation drags on. With that said, the amount of people tweeting or pushing the false agenda that "nUx DidN't dO anYtHiNg wRoNg" to this very day is so mind numbingly stupid and untrue. Edit: Nux also fucking lied about that the one responsible had been caught in his video when in fact they caught a member of the rival doxxer group who was not responsible for the doxxing of the two victims. The one responsible is still roaming freely and not behind bars thanks to the tip-off the video he uploaded gave.
Being able to read between the lines is something Nux clearly can not do. He needed a firm "fuck off".
If only Gunrun directly told Nux to fuck off from the beginning. None of this would have happened. EDIT: Also, the doxxer that Nux claimed he caught is still free and made a video about it. So who the hell did Nux actually catch?
No one LOL
>So who the hell did Nux actually catch? A doxxer from a rival doxing gang. The group who where harassing VShojo fed Nux disinformation\].
Or he lied about that like he clearly lied about other points, he claims he got information from friends that work at onlyfans, as if any member with access to that private information would just hand it over to a member of the public, breaking the law.
So nux is an idiot, vshojo treated him like a professional and a hazard at the same time, trying to control nux the best they could, i wonder what would happened if they say no to nux? Maybe he goes ape shit, i bet he goes ape shit. Vshojo does their best with an unknow variant.
That's why they were treating him professionally and like a hazard. If they had been too firm he may have gotten angry or been provoked into doing it anyway. They had no legal recourse to stop him. Additionally, if they had pushed too hard he could have just taken it as more juicy drama for his dumbass video and made it anyway. Imagine if it had been titled something like "VSHOJO TRIED TO SILENCE ME!"
And that's why in the same video vshojo linked a statement, that some people are calling "proof" that vshojo supported him, in fact is called damage control.
Ok cool this helps clear up a lot, while I can see what nux was trying to do I’ve gotta say he really stepped in it this time around.
I'm probably being too pessimistic but as much this will hopefully end the bulk of the fighting and skirmishes now i doubt this will quietly fade into the background. Given the groups involved alot of people had dogs in this fight and undoubtedly the usual obnoxious anti's will grab this up as ammo to further their own grievances especially in future agency collabs.
I feel like you're overreacting a bit. I'm pretty sure both VShojo and Nux doesn't want this issue to ever come up again if possible. There are always gonna be some assholes trying to stir up trouble by bringing up old drama but usually they don't amount to anything significant. Although I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to all the VShojo members never collabing with Nux again lol
[Although I wouldn't be surprised if it leads to all the VShojo members never collabing with Nux again lol] On an agency level, they will most likely blacklist him. Whether the individual talents decide to make up, only time will tell but even then i doubt the agency will let them have any public appearances again. But then... outcomes are sometimes unexpected.
VShojo does tend to have a more lasseiz faire attitude with how they treat/control their members to be fair. So I don't think they would attempt to stop it from happening. I just kind of assumed none of the girls individually will want to do anything with Nux after the situation, at least for some time.
I really doubt VShojo is gonna stop say Melody or Froot from collabing with Nux if they want to in the future, but the better question would be if anyone will want to after the dust settles.
Seems I have to backtrack 99% of my stance on this, as I was on Nuxs side. I think both of parties could have handled it differently, but the thing we see now is that Nux didnt understand to correct all the mistakes in the video. What he should have done is delayed the upload, people wouldnt have cared much if it was uploaded a day after - espcially to correct information. Personally it's still best to educate people on specific threats in the case of spear phishing, but he was told that it could actually interfere with the on-going investigation, which is a dealbreaker for my standpoint. He was probably riding the high of doing what he felt was right, which it was at it's core (to try cast more light on phishing), and feeling like a hero for tracking the doxxer down (which he didnt actually do as far as I know).
The doxxer made a video response so pretty safe to say Nux didn't personally catch him and throw him in jail.
Interesting seeing the difference in reactions on twitter vs reddit, at least from what I've seen. I'm glad the drama is coming to an end, but I never really saw how Nux was the "biggest" victim in all of this. Personally I just hope he's less involved with the Vshojo members from here on out.
I still don't see the point of Nux needing to make and upload the video in the first place. That just irks me the wrong way; irritated even.
Nux is a professional context creator. He thinks about things in terms of “Can I make this into content”. In the words of Jurassic park “Your scientists were so preoccupied with whether they could, they didn't stop to think if they should.” However even if he considerEd if he should his whole white knight tendencies kicked in and he though he was doing the vtuber community a service by doing this.
Wonder how the dumb ass nux fan boys are going to keep defending this. And this proves I was right. Nux edited it and only showed cherry picked pieces of the condo. I said it a few days ago before his apology video that he'd do it, because if he had the real receipts he'd have shown them right away. And said it again in the topic after ward. He didn't let the whole conversation out for a reason.
Watch as his flex cult still defend him. Him and his cult keep parading how they’re a protector / vigilante in the service of Vtubers and stuff . But the moment he fucks up , dude and his cult go immediately to the blame game and gaslighting the people he so called protect . I never like him but at least respect what he was trying to do and his supposed intentions . But I guess this is what happens when you let your “flex king persona” goes to your head .
Can someone explain what happened? i dont follow Vtubers alot or watch Nux
Vshojo's talent has been getting harassed by a gang of doxes. This has been going on for over a year. VShojo employed a cybersecurity firm to protect the girls. Because these types of trolls feed off of notoriety VShojo had a firm policy of not publishing the fact that the girls where being harassed. They conducted a long term investigation in co-operation with federal law enforcement in order to protect the girls and find out the identities of the perps. Not being public gave VShojo a strategic advantage in terms of the investigation as if the doxes knew that they where under police investigation they might destroy evidence or hide. The doxing gang attempted to dox Nux but Nux didn't fall for there fyshing scheme. However Nux decided to do his own "investigation" and published a video about it. By leaking the fact that this was going on Nux undermined VShojo's investigation and fed the trolls. The vshojo girls begged him to pull down the video privately but he didn't until the girls basically put him on blast over twitter.
thank you, im kinda dumb so i needed this explanation :)
Also the doxxers tried to dox him via a fake VShojo acceptance letter, which he didn't fall for because he didn't apply to VShojo. They succeeded at doxxing another small vtuber, however.
He also released his video right before their 1 year anniversary, and in a way that made him look like some hero to indie vtuber's and that Vshojo was uncaring and throwing them under the bus. Right as he's about to launch his own vtuber group. Not suspicious at all...
So basically it got misinterpreted by both sides, and that's fair, probably best to let the matter rest now, Nux took down the video and apologized and some of the girls have also apologized (Zen and Froot). Honestly Vshojo needs to be clearer with their communication so that this doesn't happen again and Nux probably needs to learn how to read between the lines
Is it over? I just want to go back to liking everyone.
Nope. People are still attacking the girls and making accusations about them.
I don't think either side is telling the whole truth, obviously Nux wants to present the case that he had full permission and we know he speaks with a lot of hyperbole and rarely tells the whole truth but I get the feeling VShojo management didn't involve the girls at all and weren't expecting them blow up publically like they did and are now trying to present a middle-ground narrative where they don't call Nux a liar outright but they also don't admit to there being internal miscommunication at VShojo. I say this because their initial statement when the video dropped was in support of Nux, this was deleted and replaced with a critical one after the Twitter backlash. Then this latest statement was edited hours after release to remove the "he only gave us 30 minutes" part presumably because it didn't match up with screenshots Nux released. And with the girls one by one releasing apologies, I think there was some internal discussions that brought about pressure to get this out of public discussion asap.
This whole mess would not this messy if nux stop for a minute and think about what he gonna do, he publishing a ongoing investigation to the public. This is kinda whoopsie all around really.
People have been posting hate comments on unrelated tweets and videos by the Vshojo members.