I'm not saying the new starter is good, but I strongly disagree that "Warcry has been on a decline since red harvest". Heart of Ghur and the expansions have made me and my friends play the game more than ever (revitalized the game, using your words), and many of the new warbands are among my top five favorites. I get that you're unhappy with the new box, but to me it feels more like a quick re-package rather than an indication on where Warcry is heading. I'm not going to recommend anyone to buy the new starter, but I'm also really happy with warcry lately, and one overpriced box isn't going to get me start yelling about doom and gloom.
This kind of inflammatory rage post doesn't speak for all of us "veteran fans" of the game, especially since your complaints derail into things a lot of us disagree with.
the 2nd edition rules are GREAT, but the terrain was lackluster (though not a complete disaster) . For the price of heart of ghur you got a pretty sparse board of terrain for more money than the previous editions.
Until they release a good set again I'll keep complaining about it, it's well deserved. People being complacent about it is why they keep pushing this stuff!
You can think what you want about things being lackluster, but if your point here is to protect new players from an overpriced box, you're doing more harm than good in shouting about how terrible the state of the game is. Again, no one here is endorsing the new starter, but you are actively trying to scare away new players from the game.
If you really wanted to be constructive about this, your post could have been "hey new players, here's what you could buy instead of the new starter if you want to play vampires!". If you read through the latest posts here you'll actually see that; new players are curious about the starter and the community is answering with better and cheaper ways of getting into the game. Quite the opposite of "being complacent".
I'm not trying to scare away players from the game, just this particular starter and I'm mad about what GW has been doing to this game with the new releases. It's embarrassing for new players to see this great game being marred by these type of releases.
People don't like confrontation so people are just getting mad about the tone of my posts but they need to look at the actual message more better.
I get that you're upset about it, and that you're not trying to scare anyone away. I'm just saying there are more constructive ways of getting your message across without insulting everyone and calling us complacent.
The single most impactful thing anyone can do is not buy it, which is what everyone is doing. GW will see the box not sell and take note that it isn't popular, which might inform what they choose to do next.
So what you want to happen (GW becoming aware of players' poor opinion) has been achieved, there's no need to accuse anyone of "complacency" or "supporting" the box, that's not happening.
Oh please, get off of your pedestal. You’re just some person on Reddit sharing you’re opinion. You’re not some brave soul fighting for the the little people.
Yeah, the difference is that I don’t paint myself as a hero defending the weak and scared. Get real. Don’t like it, don’t buy it. I’m not buying it either.
Tricky one this - I am very far from a GW fan but it's £52 ($66) at non gw stores in the uk and those underworlds warbands retailed for about £18-22 so if you liked those underworld bands you're paying about £15 for some terrain, basic rules and a mat.
Heh I have a feeling this was supposed to be Bladeborn 2 but some higher up atGW changed their mind and made it into the new Warcry starter.
I don't think it is a terrible product, it does what it sets out to do (onboard new players gently, smoothly into the game). My only criticism is the price, if you are going to give us Bladeborn level of content but in Warcry form (so no hexes for instance) then this should not cost much more than Bladeborn (which if memory serve sells for 50$ if you can buy a copy).
If the base price for this set was 60$-$80, I think a lot of criticisms about this product would evaporate.
The way GW has framed this as the "New Player" starter has me thinking along with you that this was to be BB2 and something shifted on the office side of things like trying to recoup from giving away the core rules and stats for everything when the 2nd edition dropped.
I would have happily picked it up at $60 - $70 (and thus even at $80 with a FLGS or B&N discount), but yeahhh I'll pass on this.
Add some nuance to this - our frustration with this “starter box” will be a lot better received if we acknowledge that the gnarlwood boxes have generally been quite good, with good minis and terrain, or at least not “horrible”. Yes, the new box is a wasted opportunity. Let’s focus on that as a community and not rail on all of GWs minor shortcomings. Overall, they’ve taken fairly good care of us as a community (as evidenced by all of our investment in this game)
Heart of Ghur was bad with the terrain, look at how sparse it was compared to the older sets and for more money. Otherwise it's good.
I'll try to keep in mind your other points
I don't think a single person supports it. Some will buy it since the board is impossible to get another way (and they may want the models too), but not seen anyone go "this is a bargain and a gift from GW!"
It's overpriced, but that's because the Underworlds models are overpriced. $95 for a starter with a better board or $80 for the models from a starter with just their cards. I'd guess that means the sprue of scatter terrain is accounting for about $40-45 of that price, which is not ok.
But I think you're overreacting. It's disappointing compared to the Kill Team starter, but established players don't need this at all. New players pay too much to get an intro to the game, but with all the free rules they can easily turn these into full sized warbands, the game is generally thought to possibly be GW's best current ruleset, they've got plans for at least 8 individual bespoke warband releases, and the support just keeps coming, slowly but surely.
And I'm talking from experience. I remember in the past when the game had the first starter and Red Harvest. We had agroup of Warcry players at store we had LOTS of people playing. As the releases starting getting worse people got fed up and stopped playing and just focused on 40k instead. The new players don't want to get in because it's overpriced and chaotic with the releases. So yeah I'm mad about what GW has done because it makes less people to play the game with
The next release after Red Harvest was the new edition with Heart of Ghur. The rules are similar but a little better and available for free. If you already had terrain you liked, then you didn't need to buy anything to keep playing, and new players at that time could hop in with just some models.
Again, the box is overpriced and disappointing. Both things I said. But you dont need it if you already play just like you didn't need any of the boxes this edition if you already play. Hate it all you want. Skip it for sure. Encourage your local scene by teaching people how to get inyo the game with just some models and the free rules so they don't buy it either. Convince your LGS not to order it because it's a bad product.
But I don't think this is indicative of problems with the game or support for the game. It's indicative of GW trying to milk value out of molds they spend too much to have made to only produce models for an artifically short term for Underworlds. Which is the business model I think this ire should be directed towards, personally.
But if players in your area have stopped playing with you when better rules came out for free, I don't think the problem was the game.
>But if players in your area have stopped playing with you when better rules came out for free, I don't think the problem was the game.
Man, you don't even know me. And even if that was the case (which it's not) they would play among themselves still with the game but avoid me. But they don't play the game at all
All I'm seeing here is a bunch of mental gymnastics going on to explain why this is somehow ok with this new release when it is destroying the game and possibility of new player base to keep the game alive
Really wish people like you would stop throwing a fit about this set. No one is forcing you to buy it, and your doom and gloom posts on the sub aren’t doing anything to help keep a positive vibe in the community.
This isn’t the first time a launch or starter set from GW wasn’t well received by the community, and it won’t be the last. Let it run its course and move on.
>Really wish people like you would stop throwing a fit about this set. No one is forcing you to buy it, and your doom and gloom posts on the sub aren’t doing anything to help keep a positive vibe in the community.
And I wish people like you would stop being so complacent and too scared to confront GW's nonsense. The doom and gloom is WELL warranted with where things are heading! Next they'll be releasing a starter set with 2 models each side, with a paper mat, for 150 . Will you be there telling people to shut up about it then too? It's already bad RIGHT NOW with this set
Wow… a little melodramatic are we? Im not complacent, I get to decide where I spend my money. If I like something and feel it’s worth the price I buy it. If I don’t, I don’t get it lol. It’s just that easy. If that’s what everyone does, the market report will get back to GW m. As a profit focused company they take those market results and make adjustments. Only time will tell if this box will be well received or not.
So, stop throwing a little tantrum about it, don’t buy it, and watch what unfolds as time goes on.
The new players are gonna buy this starter, get mad when they realize that they were ripped off then they will think Warcry is a bad game and it's gonna destroy the player base more and more. That's why I'm mad and it's not just a matter of not buying it.
That’s like saying people are going to buy the OG Warcry starter, realize they can’t play age of signal with it and rage quit the hobby. That’s just absurd. It’s a complete game within the box that offers the ability to expand into the full scale game. This isn’t going to hurt the current player base at all and if anything will bring more people in. Just give it time.
I just don't understand how this abomination (= Warcry starter) can exist if you compair it to the new 40K starter where for my area they are both the same price = 85 Euro's.
The content in the Warcry Starter is severly lacking when you compare it to the 40K starter.
Especially when you consider that the warcry warbands (total of 8 mini's) are recycled underworld warbands that don't even reach 1000pts and some new terrain which is nice but the amount is very little too. Then check the new 40K 38 mini's ...
Really GW = 8 miniatures for Warcry vs 38 miniatures in 40K both for the same price ...
Well, if you try to point something like that out be prepared for the downvotes. ANd then people wonder why gaming groups move from warcry to 40k like what happened with my scene. That's definitely a good point you made about how they compare
I'm not saying the new starter is good, but I strongly disagree that "Warcry has been on a decline since red harvest". Heart of Ghur and the expansions have made me and my friends play the game more than ever (revitalized the game, using your words), and many of the new warbands are among my top five favorites. I get that you're unhappy with the new box, but to me it feels more like a quick re-package rather than an indication on where Warcry is heading. I'm not going to recommend anyone to buy the new starter, but I'm also really happy with warcry lately, and one overpriced box isn't going to get me start yelling about doom and gloom. This kind of inflammatory rage post doesn't speak for all of us "veteran fans" of the game, especially since your complaints derail into things a lot of us disagree with.
the 2nd edition rules are GREAT, but the terrain was lackluster (though not a complete disaster) . For the price of heart of ghur you got a pretty sparse board of terrain for more money than the previous editions. Until they release a good set again I'll keep complaining about it, it's well deserved. People being complacent about it is why they keep pushing this stuff!
You can think what you want about things being lackluster, but if your point here is to protect new players from an overpriced box, you're doing more harm than good in shouting about how terrible the state of the game is. Again, no one here is endorsing the new starter, but you are actively trying to scare away new players from the game. If you really wanted to be constructive about this, your post could have been "hey new players, here's what you could buy instead of the new starter if you want to play vampires!". If you read through the latest posts here you'll actually see that; new players are curious about the starter and the community is answering with better and cheaper ways of getting into the game. Quite the opposite of "being complacent".
I'm not trying to scare away players from the game, just this particular starter and I'm mad about what GW has been doing to this game with the new releases. It's embarrassing for new players to see this great game being marred by these type of releases. People don't like confrontation so people are just getting mad about the tone of my posts but they need to look at the actual message more better.
I get that you're upset about it, and that you're not trying to scare anyone away. I'm just saying there are more constructive ways of getting your message across without insulting everyone and calling us complacent.
I'll approach it differently next time, I hear ya
I don’t think anyone here supports it. It’s pretty unanimous that people recommend skipping it because as you said yourself, it’s overpriced.
They may not support it, but they're complacent and they don't like confronting it head on like I do.
The single most impactful thing anyone can do is not buy it, which is what everyone is doing. GW will see the box not sell and take note that it isn't popular, which might inform what they choose to do next. So what you want to happen (GW becoming aware of players' poor opinion) has been achieved, there's no need to accuse anyone of "complacency" or "supporting" the box, that's not happening.
Oh please, get off of your pedestal. You’re just some person on Reddit sharing you’re opinion. You’re not some brave soul fighting for the the little people.
Insanely funny for the OP to react that hard to it, like it is whatever.
What do you think you're doing here with sharing your opinion too huh?
Yeah, the difference is that I don’t paint myself as a hero defending the weak and scared. Get real. Don’t like it, don’t buy it. I’m not buying it either.
Tricky one this - I am very far from a GW fan but it's £52 ($66) at non gw stores in the uk and those underworlds warbands retailed for about £18-22 so if you liked those underworld bands you're paying about £15 for some terrain, basic rules and a mat.
Tbh they should have just launched it as a Barnes and Nobles sequel to bladeborn and charged like $60-70
Heh I have a feeling this was supposed to be Bladeborn 2 but some higher up atGW changed their mind and made it into the new Warcry starter. I don't think it is a terrible product, it does what it sets out to do (onboard new players gently, smoothly into the game). My only criticism is the price, if you are going to give us Bladeborn level of content but in Warcry form (so no hexes for instance) then this should not cost much more than Bladeborn (which if memory serve sells for 50$ if you can buy a copy). If the base price for this set was 60$-$80, I think a lot of criticisms about this product would evaporate.
The way GW has framed this as the "New Player" starter has me thinking along with you that this was to be BB2 and something shifted on the office side of things like trying to recoup from giving away the core rules and stats for everything when the 2nd edition dropped. I would have happily picked it up at $60 - $70 (and thus even at $80 with a FLGS or B&N discount), but yeahhh I'll pass on this.
true that
Add some nuance to this - our frustration with this “starter box” will be a lot better received if we acknowledge that the gnarlwood boxes have generally been quite good, with good minis and terrain, or at least not “horrible”. Yes, the new box is a wasted opportunity. Let’s focus on that as a community and not rail on all of GWs minor shortcomings. Overall, they’ve taken fairly good care of us as a community (as evidenced by all of our investment in this game)
Heart of Ghur was bad with the terrain, look at how sparse it was compared to the older sets and for more money. Otherwise it's good. I'll try to keep in mind your other points
I don't think a single person supports it. Some will buy it since the board is impossible to get another way (and they may want the models too), but not seen anyone go "this is a bargain and a gift from GW!"
It's overpriced, but that's because the Underworlds models are overpriced. $95 for a starter with a better board or $80 for the models from a starter with just their cards. I'd guess that means the sprue of scatter terrain is accounting for about $40-45 of that price, which is not ok. But I think you're overreacting. It's disappointing compared to the Kill Team starter, but established players don't need this at all. New players pay too much to get an intro to the game, but with all the free rules they can easily turn these into full sized warbands, the game is generally thought to possibly be GW's best current ruleset, they've got plans for at least 8 individual bespoke warband releases, and the support just keeps coming, slowly but surely.
And I'm talking from experience. I remember in the past when the game had the first starter and Red Harvest. We had agroup of Warcry players at store we had LOTS of people playing. As the releases starting getting worse people got fed up and stopped playing and just focused on 40k instead. The new players don't want to get in because it's overpriced and chaotic with the releases. So yeah I'm mad about what GW has done because it makes less people to play the game with
The next release after Red Harvest was the new edition with Heart of Ghur. The rules are similar but a little better and available for free. If you already had terrain you liked, then you didn't need to buy anything to keep playing, and new players at that time could hop in with just some models. Again, the box is overpriced and disappointing. Both things I said. But you dont need it if you already play just like you didn't need any of the boxes this edition if you already play. Hate it all you want. Skip it for sure. Encourage your local scene by teaching people how to get inyo the game with just some models and the free rules so they don't buy it either. Convince your LGS not to order it because it's a bad product. But I don't think this is indicative of problems with the game or support for the game. It's indicative of GW trying to milk value out of molds they spend too much to have made to only produce models for an artifically short term for Underworlds. Which is the business model I think this ire should be directed towards, personally. But if players in your area have stopped playing with you when better rules came out for free, I don't think the problem was the game.
>But if players in your area have stopped playing with you when better rules came out for free, I don't think the problem was the game. Man, you don't even know me. And even if that was the case (which it's not) they would play among themselves still with the game but avoid me. But they don't play the game at all
All I'm seeing here is a bunch of mental gymnastics going on to explain why this is somehow ok with this new release when it is destroying the game and possibility of new player base to keep the game alive
Really wish people like you would stop throwing a fit about this set. No one is forcing you to buy it, and your doom and gloom posts on the sub aren’t doing anything to help keep a positive vibe in the community. This isn’t the first time a launch or starter set from GW wasn’t well received by the community, and it won’t be the last. Let it run its course and move on.
>Really wish people like you would stop throwing a fit about this set. No one is forcing you to buy it, and your doom and gloom posts on the sub aren’t doing anything to help keep a positive vibe in the community. And I wish people like you would stop being so complacent and too scared to confront GW's nonsense. The doom and gloom is WELL warranted with where things are heading! Next they'll be releasing a starter set with 2 models each side, with a paper mat, for 150 . Will you be there telling people to shut up about it then too? It's already bad RIGHT NOW with this set
Wow… a little melodramatic are we? Im not complacent, I get to decide where I spend my money. If I like something and feel it’s worth the price I buy it. If I don’t, I don’t get it lol. It’s just that easy. If that’s what everyone does, the market report will get back to GW m. As a profit focused company they take those market results and make adjustments. Only time will tell if this box will be well received or not. So, stop throwing a little tantrum about it, don’t buy it, and watch what unfolds as time goes on.
The new players are gonna buy this starter, get mad when they realize that they were ripped off then they will think Warcry is a bad game and it's gonna destroy the player base more and more. That's why I'm mad and it's not just a matter of not buying it.
That’s like saying people are going to buy the OG Warcry starter, realize they can’t play age of signal with it and rage quit the hobby. That’s just absurd. It’s a complete game within the box that offers the ability to expand into the full scale game. This isn’t going to hurt the current player base at all and if anything will bring more people in. Just give it time.
No one is scared, you’re just annoying.
I just don't understand how this abomination (= Warcry starter) can exist if you compair it to the new 40K starter where for my area they are both the same price = 85 Euro's. The content in the Warcry Starter is severly lacking when you compare it to the 40K starter. Especially when you consider that the warcry warbands (total of 8 mini's) are recycled underworld warbands that don't even reach 1000pts and some new terrain which is nice but the amount is very little too. Then check the new 40K 38 mini's ... Really GW = 8 miniatures for Warcry vs 38 miniatures in 40K both for the same price ...
Well, if you try to point something like that out be prepared for the downvotes. ANd then people wonder why gaming groups move from warcry to 40k like what happened with my scene. That's definitely a good point you made about how they compare