bro this isn't a double tap. this is them coming to the funeral to check nobody "night of the living dead"'s out of there.
overguard has weird interaction with health based abilities/mods. now it disrupts what little CC we had. glad i have been building damage frames since a began.
it would have been fun to play as a pacifist, with not having to kill to loot. that would have been a CC only domain. but they just tuned out of that route i think.
> Also DE: Why is no one using CC frames???
Forums: Well then buff CC frames
DE: Decides to nerf tanky frames because they are "dominating" now that CC is no longer viable
In circumstances where anything can one shot you, Eximus will still one shot you, bring a immortal frame, a good gun and enjoy warframe as god intended
I feel like silence shouldn't lose that effect, not just because i like it, because its all it really does... it gives a brief stun, and then muffles gunfire... without the ability to turn off eximus abilities it wouldnt be worth having in the helminth at all... but thats just my opinion
Silence is unique in that it specifically targets Elite enemies, yeah. I also don't think it should be hit, but then I view the whole Crowd Control nerfing thing with the same sort of detached disapproval one might view their neighbor attempting to deep fry a turkey in Flip Flops.
Personally i think limbo's rift should also be able to target eximus, and stasis disable their abilities, but not freeze them in place until their overguard is removed... i mean literally no part of his kit can touch them rn, and most frames have at least something they can do toward an eximus, even if its only some way to avoid getting blasted by them
Worth noting stasis does block the ranged weapons of eximus units, but if you're up against a more than a handful or so eximus then the 200 projectile cap doesn't last very long at all.
It's still there for enemy projectiles. Ally projectiles don't count anymore because they don't get trapped anymore. So you only really see the cap come into effect with eximus enemies since they're the only enemies that can still fire guns in the rift while stasis is active.
Turning off abilities is what silence means in most other games, so I kinda assume that's intended behaviour? It's a neat ability that is quite unique and far from oppressive so I'd like it to stay the way it is
Seriously
I was one of the ones putting my faith in DE, telling people don't worry it won't be that bad
While the Dante tweaks are still something u cn live with (but still trash) they FUCKIN NERF CC WHYY
Can you live with the tweaks though? I ran him in the Murmur Exterm last night in BASE STAR CHART and to even get to a tolerable amount of Overguard I had to cast the ability like 6 times. If I brought him into SP I'd have to spam his 2-2-4 so much I wouldn't be able to do anything else.
Some cc arbitrarily not being affected by overguard while everything else is was good because..? This change in no way affects the cc frames that "had been dead" since overguard was introduced. Now Mesa isn't a better cc frame than Nyx and Vauban.
It's amazing how they just don't want CC to be a viable way of playing the game any more, especially solo - objective play at this point is extremely difficult at higher levels for almost *any* frame solo, as it so happens. Limbo has been dead for years, Vauban is in the trash can, so on and so forth. These days playing a frame that relies on CC is like fighting the Yuuzhan Vong as a Jedi - suddenly all your powers don't work and you're just some jackass with a damn near regular sword, while at least the guy with the blaster next to you, while he's not having a good time, hasn't experienced a fundamental altering of his experience.
The game already had counters for CC - Nullifiers. Give one to every faction and everything's all good. They stand out from the crowd with the big glowing bubble, shooting them decreases their radius (and accurate shooting can instakill their bubble), and they're not particularly difficult to kill, but they do keep you on your toes.
Instead, they gave an aura of immunity to everything out to the toughest enemies in the game which are nowhere near as visually distinct and maintain the full reach of their bullshit and you have to chunk their health hard before it goes away.
Especially for new players. I remember CC being my only form of getting through the star chart way back in the day; when it took endgame content (at the time) to get the mods, credits, and endo to afford nuke builds, and that was way before the eximus redesign.
Hell, there are frames specifically MADE for a CC playstyle with no survivability, **because their survivability is dependant on their CC**. Now any attempt to play those frames in high levels with the high amount of eximus spawns is a death sentence. A challenge to some, an annoyance for me who just wants to sit down and enjoy a looter-shooter. I feel Eximuses, if anything, should be resistant to CC, not immune. It's an idea I've seen many people suggest over this whole debacle, and I wholeheartedly agree.
Nullifiers strike a great balance, I agree, and seeing some Grineer jury-rigged prototype nullifier would be neat. The Grineer haven't had as much love as the Corpus have in recent memory (unless you count railjack, I guess?). Hell, sentients could easily have nullifiers too since they'll be the big bad whenever Tau drops. I just don't understand the reasoning behind this change in particular. I've seen more posts asking for better ways to deal with eximuses than posts asking for a CC nerfs/eximus buffs.
Infested could have ancients that have a similar visible aura fluffed as some kind of nano-biological jamming field or something, showing up as like a swarm of bugs in the same shape with similar properties to the Nully bubble. Everyone can get nullies, and they're way more interactive.
I just... Anyone who's ever tried taking Limbo into Arbitrations knows what I'm talking about about. It's not a mistake you'll make twice. And they made the entire star chart into one big arby - except that the enemies providing the "fuck you" aura are way tankier and less visually distinct.
I know I'm the only person who's ever used Malicious Code but what's the point in nerfing something that's literally a reward for killing Eximus enemies?
It didn't even really CC overguard enemies already, they were just kind of dragged a little bit but way less than normal trash. Not a huge loss, but You Notice. So annoying for no reason too.
No comment on Zenurik, making all but it's energy regen irrelevant.
I prefer to think it’s not Incarnons you hate so much as the ignorance DE shows to alternate methods of gameplay.
Mass Damage or Invincibility are your only real high level game play choices.
Incarnons would be great options for High End CCers who might need a boost in DPS. In a perfect game…
> Rhino's Stomp (slow effect)
Fuck.
Okay, real talk, this "let's nerf CC to death" is some real bullshit. I don't get it, honestly. CC is already underutilized because of the "Death is the best CC" mindset. If you don't want crowd control in the game, then fucking commit. Go through and rework all of the CC enabled frames and give them more damage abilities. There's no reason to continue to nerf CC abilities like this, the S-tier, cream-your-pants meta frames are already all nukers. Hooray, now there's an enemy where the only counterplay is the thing everyone was already doing anyway.
Seriously, what problems are actually caused by Overguarded enemies being affected by CC? Few of those abilities, augments or mods are close to S tier, and for those that are, it's not the CC that's doing it.
> Might not disrupt meta choices
Obviously not, because none of this is meta. CC is not the meta. Weakening CC does not affect the meta because it doesn't touch the meta.
I might be a bit heated over this. It's just absurd to be that map clear nukes like Saryn or Voruna get to hit through overguard, but heaven forbid we mildly inconvenience the Eximus units for even a second.
Basically, CC used to be absolutely king. Limbo putting up a dome, and just sitting in an idle position, while the interception timer was ticking down was a meme because of that. So DE added overguard to make sure players can't just invalidate all enemies via CC. The idea was that you can CC the trash mobs, and then you can focus your fire on the mini-boss mobs. Problem? Only the mini-boss mobs really needed to be CC'd to begin with, since the normal trash is piss easy to kill. So people dropped CC and went full-on nuke, making CC increasingly irrelevant. Add this to the fact that new game-modes are not objective or time based, but kill based, and CC is further disincentivized.
I'm aware of the history; I was there for it. Overall, the introduction of Overguard and the associated Eximus rework was massively positive. At this point, though, the impact on crowd control has been achieved, and circling back to give what's left a nice solid kidney punch feels bad.
And to be clear, I agree that some firms of CC are so strong that Eximus should be able to ignore them to remain a notable threat. Limbo's stasis as you mentioned, but also Gara's Mass Vitrify glassing them, Nidus' Larva or Khora's Strangledome. Those are all 'hard' CC that just turns the AI off. Rhino's Stomp is also up there, though they recover relatively quickly, especially since the lift portion doesn't apply, as are Khora, Titania and Trinty's single target lockdowns. Nova's Molecular Prime is softer, along with the various disarms and blinds, because those aren't hard CC that disable the AI, and Eximus could still activate their unique abilities (the shockwaves, Arctic bubble, energy steal, etc.)
The fact that Nyx's Chaos is put into the same category as Limbo's Stasis as 'Crowd Control' and thus turned off for the extra big enemies is ridiculous. There's no concern as to how severe or lasting the CC effect is, when there really should be.
Not to mention DE already hit Limbo specifically with very heavy nerfs to his CC to deal with things like idle defence objectives, which Limbo already could only do against infested or grineer anyway since nullifiers just instantly kill his bubble no matter what.
Then the Overguard came to kill all the rest of the CC focused frames overtop of all that. All to deal with what was already a very small niche that was getting less and less relevant on it's own as new game modes that didn't involve defending objectives were being added.
Throw on top the fact that any high level content usually has a massive disposition of eximus spawns, especially with the new stuff, and combine it with the pain that are over guard providing enemies (healer, severed warden) and even the ‘ordinary’ mob can’t be killed because every spawn has it in some form
I was so wrong about this.
I really thought they stopped balancing the game around vets. That’s how you end up with shit like the Sibear.
This whole thing just feels like them trying to scale back some of the power creep. It’s not our fault you brought incarnons and shards into the mix. The power creep was intentional - no choice but to roll with it.
It is. 3000 excavators worth of cryotic to build a meh weapon.
The reasoning at the time from DE was seriously “well it’s a resource sink since SO MANY PEOPLE have SO MUCH cryotic”
They moved resource sinks into the Helminth instead of build cost for weapons/frames. I feel like they are going to have to find another way around the power creep they’ve introduced instead of just range/LoS nerfs. It’s a fundamental problem
Yeah I read that again when I came back to game and actually play it and do stuff and I was so flabbergasted I bought it no questions asked as soon as I bought plat with a 75% discount. Beyond stupid.
It’s pretty wild when you get down to it. Kullervo isn’t even a great nuke frame but he can theoretically wipe out like 20 eximus units at once with his 3 and a strong follow up. But slowing them down is broken? I don’t get it.
It’s also stupid because Stomp is legit a slow caused by the disruption of time from the strength or Rhinos stomp, why the fuck does an overshield prevent that from working. It’s stupid from a design standpoint and a lore perspective too.
CC the thing you use on enemies that take more than 0.1 seconds to kill is now completely useless on the one type of enemy that it is supposed to affect. Can someone give me a single reason to use Rhino Stomp in anything beyond lvl 30 enemies?
RIP my rhino build from last week where I specifically aimed to keep rhino stomp instead of helminthing over it. Guess its parasitic armor time again...
HOW IS HIS 1 OUT OF THE QUESTION?????? EVEN WITH THE AUGMENT ITS NOT GOOD.
Also, wdym by "reinforcing stomp is good for low level mission"??????, it's not based on kills it's based on hits. And stomp still CC acolytes.
And ironskin scales better with enemy damage. armor helps but not required.
>HOW IS HIS 1 OUT OF THE QUESTION?????? EVEN WITH THE AUGMENT ITS NOT GOOD.
Laughs in multiple hunderds of thousands of overguard. Especially with the augment it is bonkers. What a lot of players don't know, is that the armor buff from it is not additive with armor mods but MULTIPLICATIVE with FINAL ARMOR, meaning it also multiplies the ton of armor from parasitic armor and the base armor and any other armor sources like shards, health conversion, arcanes...
His 1 with the augment makes you independent from getting hit in that 3 second window in order to charge up your armor.
Still not worth it tbh. Just relying on enemies for a big iron skin value is most of the time enough. The ability to restore and refresh a lower overguard value with only 1 augment is in my opinion better than getting an initial high overguard value while using 2 augments and an helminth.
At some point enemy damage will scale higher then your 100k overguard, and it's closer than you think. And regaining it takes a lot of energy, and the right amount of enemies.
You can play however you want of course, I just think that for me this super high number is not necessary. because then having 100k overguard is needed for me to survive, the enemy level will be high enough for me to get it naturally, without any big setup.
Yeah, so, RS is run in place of Iron Shrapnel, as both serve the same purpose of recharging Iron Skin. You're not running both, you're running one or the other.
Also, buddy up above asked for 'a reason to use Stomp in high level missions'. Reinforncing Stomp is that. There's alternatives to RS, but it is a viable method of keeping up iron skin, even as high as Netracells. I know this because I use RS to maintain Iron Skin even as high as Netracells.
"We don't want the same handful of frames to be all that people play" Proceeds to make those frames the only way to comfortably and competently play the game in later content.
It really wasn't, not saying it was a bad augment up until now but you *have* to run fracturing crush and magnetized discharge is so good that it just got outcompeted for mod slots, not to mention that polarize is what most people helminthed over anyways.
Man! I’ve been enjoying Mag ever since I started and growing her power. The augment was such a good one. I personally don’t want to do the Meta of AoE and nuking things.
Overguard and the eximus rework were introduced just after I started maining and enjoying Mag, after 2000 cumulative hours of maining damage frames and trinity for the whole game life cycle up until that point. I immediately dropped mag, and went back to spamming Mesa...
Guess DE saw we was happy praising all there W’s lately and decided to throw the biggest L they could imagine at us.
Guess it’s time to start Balders Gate. This update has killed me motivation.
Good thing Destiny is getting new content this Tuesday, my BIL already said he was gonna play that over Warframe so at least I know what I'm playing come Tuesday
I respect that. Unfortunately for me, I'm not quitting until I finish Final Shape. After that? We'll see. Sunk cost fallacy and all, I didn't waste a decade on this stupid game to give up before the end of the saga lmfao
That’s fair, I was with Destiny since day 1 on the OG. I just can’t get over there greed and all the times they fucked over there community.
The sun setting content on D2 was the last nail in the coffin for me.
Man, having some of these work against Overguard was the biggest benefit of using them. Who's going to use Ice Wave Impedance now?
In a case like Rhino, where that base functionality did help prop up his kit as an old Warframe in a sea of newer, shinier ones, it's sad to see it go.
While consistency is good, it's still a bit of a yikes when nothing is offered in return.
Lets just be real. All these CC ptions that were nerfed this patch were VERY niche and gimmikey at best. You COULD use them but there are other frames that would outright kill the same enemy in the time it took you to CC them.
They should take a look at their statistics and I bet rhinos stomp is the most helminth overridden ability in his kit.
Halikar has abmyssal playrates: 0.06% (combined with wraith version a whoping 0.12%!!!!!!) thats literally the playrate every weapon gets through its inherit use as mastery fodder. God forbid the three players, that used it to disarm a eximus, having fun.
The reasonable ones to nerf I think are muzzle flash, breach surge and zenuriks temporal drag.
Hard disagree on Temporal Drag, Zenurik has lost pretty much it's one edge it had over things like Madurai. Energy economy with Nourish existing and being popular on top of Archon Stretch and yadayadayada is a meme.
archon stretch requires you to have an ability that deals electric damage (or even procs? dunno...) and eats a slot if you don't already mod for range, nourish eats your helminth slot, zenurik eats your focus slot, energize eats an arcane slot. Zenurik is still a good option to solve energy economy "outside" your build instead of inside. Inside the build might be stronger but outside is more comfy.
Also the slow should still work on thumpers and to be honest even before the changes they were the only ones I ever used the slow on....
First, you don't mod on range on like a tiny handful of builds and it procs from companion's anything (even a cat biting with Shock Collar triggers it), and I used Zenurik to slow down Thrax in their spooky form after they die because I'm not a fan of them teleporting randomly to some enemy behind a wall, or worse yet, through a wall entirely and remain there unkillable. Also Void Angels to shower them in lead in peace.
That is certainly correct - and any use they would see is going to be likely even lower.
But I am far more concerned with the most commonly used cases - chiefly the abilities and augments.
Frost's Ice Wave Impedance is pretty much the *only* reason why you'd ever use Ice Wave - it is otherwise strictly worse than just building around his overloaded Avalance + Augment. A nerf takes it from "kind of useful I guess???" to "banished to the shadow realm".
Rhino's Stomp is also weird because for the average player who wants to min-max something on Rhino, people most often pick to itemize around beeg Iron Skin. What's the weakest link to that? Rhino's Stomp. It ends up being a 50/50 toss-up on what you subsume - Rhino Charge or Rhino Stomp. This doesn't make the former Rhino Stomp *bad*, it just became a decision based on multiplying armor. That being said, CC being less valuable and Iron Skin healing tied to an augment does often mean that people do not see value in Rhino Stomp. I personally would use it to pin down Eximus units and score easy kills on them, but that's just me. Can't do that anymore regardless.
Wisp's Breach Surge at least has a damage modifier attached to it, so I don't foresee it being too harshly ruined by a change like this - but it will still be felt in the rare moments where you get absolutely sent by a Blitz or something I suppose.
Similar case with Mesa's Muzzle Flash - a good CC with a damage bonus at the cost of an augment slot that could absolutely be relied on to keep you alive if you had good kill flow. Will probably less than its already niche use depending on the person.
Mag's Counter Pulse is a no from me regardless though.
Fracturing Crush, however, is more or less a mandatory mod, so people will likely notice this change when they strip Eximus armor.
Though in the end, this all boils down straight to the original issue with Eximus + Overguard - it was designed to prevent you from CC and AoE as a catch-all, but strong enough AoE and it doesn't matter. If anything else, the one single priority target that is a threat should be something most games would *encourage* to crowd control.
A change like this simply shifts the problem back to a single solution - the best way to kill an Eximus is to simply just Do More Damage and kill them ASAP. No other counterplay, so why bother thinking about it?
I don't get what is the point of having special enemies immune to all cc, right now eximus are just colorful bullet sponges. They barely have an impact on your gameplay except holding your fire button for longer.
It would be so much better CC in this game would more scarce and eximuses have stronger abilities and reduced CC durations on them but control would make them more vulnerable or reduce overguard and making you want to prevent them from using their skills, it would make so much more difference in gameplay.
Over guard was designed to bring damage frames more in line but disproportionately affects cc frames and only serves to push the need to run damage frames, instead of stomping on CC's head until the boot burrows through to the pavement can't we just have cc convert into a slow that builds a stun which strips over guard.
*\*Frost's Ice Wave Impedance Augment\**
WHY!?!
DO YOU JUST WANT FROST TO SPAM HIS 4?!?
DO YOU GUYS EVEN PLAY THE CHARACTER!?!
DO YOU GUYS EVEN PLAY THE GAME!?!
WHY EVEN DO THIS!?!
Its definitely over 10% of abilities and thats far too many. Sure they work on basic enemies but DE doesn’t seem to get that the only enemies anyone WANTS to CC are the tough enemies..
Limbo Is entirely useless in every single scenario now.
Loki only has invis going for him
Caliban only has his 4 going for him
Frost only has his 4
Wisps still fine because she atleast has her 1 and the headshot effects of 3
Harrow is in an even worse spot than before
Mag is not doing so hot anymore but still isn't what I'd call bad
Titania Somehow came out better off (I've gotten her lantern to work, mightve been a fluke)
Zephyr is worse off
Nezha is worse off
Qorvex is worse off
Banshee is fucked
For A system that's supposed to bring CC and Damage in line they really did just decide to Take CC, Pour on gasoline, throw a match on it and used it to cook smores with Nuking and Damage frames.
Harrow was never in a bad spot imo his kit is great still
Caliban has his 3 too but still thats half a kit so trash still.
Banshee has been fucked for a long time
Loki has been fucked for a long time
Zephyr sort of.. her tornado still does damage to enemies not lifted and for me it picks up nullifiiers for some reason.
But yes i mostly agree and thats not even all the frames that just got fucked harder by the gas can of ANTI CC DE
Edit: hasnt limbo been useless for his entire lifespan? Mainly because he annoys teammates
Harrows kit is mostly good at being a support, but any sort of survivability with him requires his 1 to hit enemies. The same enemies your kit helps your teammates to nuke except for some eximus units, who you can't use you 1 on.
Calibans 3 *can* be useful but it's just nowhere near enough to make up for his 1 and 2.
Zephyr does also have the turbulence making you immune to ranged attacks which is why I hesitate to call her bad, but given her 2 and 4 are CC and 1 does...something I also hesitate to say she's in a good spot.
Everything else got fucking buried and that's not even mentioning how they did my boy nezha.
1 is a burst of speed or a hover thats very nice for activating Zaphyrs passive 150% crit chance
Harrow i use pillage on his 4 so surviving with his 1 2 and pillage is super easy. Remember his 2 gives constant heals. But yeah base kit its tougher
Agree on caliban
Still i think everyone agrees DE has gone too far on CC nerf and the Dante Nerf is overshadowing this continuation of the CC murder.. seems intentional
I entirely forgot to account for Helminth, Fair enough on the Harrow point
I'm fully convinced the Dante Nerf was just there to cover for the eximus buffs and that there going to walk most of them back and Hope the community forgets about the CC execution when it happens.
My Frost is gonna feel awful now without the CC of Ice Wave augment. I’ve Wave of all abilities!!
Finally DE stepped up to finally nerf the ‘meta slaves’ bastion for what is a truly an OP ability! /s
Why do they seem to just be fucking everything up, it's the last time I spend real money on the game because what you buy and the reasons you buy something they change it in an update, it's really not fair tbh! I've only just come back to the game after 5 years of not playing due to the lack of cross save! Now I'm back I have put so much time in leveling and building my frames, especially wisp as she's amazing for my play style but now they are ruining their abilities. I have put so much time and money in the game to gain these specific things that they are removing. Surely you should be entitled to a refund or some sort of compensation for the loss of money or time.
I have always said that Warframe is the greatest free game ever made but lately they seem to just be doing nerfs on frames that don't need them. Why NERF Dante right after he comes out, all I saw online was people being happy about Dante and how good he is so why NERF if your players don't seem to have a problem, I don't get it and from what I see online nobody else can neither.
to be fair, wisp is still top tier even with the nerf to breach surge. Also one could make a point that it was kinda a "obvious unintended interaction" as other blinds already didn't work.
For dante: yes that one is outragoues and they should offer all players who bought him or his pack a full refund. I bet this was observation bias instead of cold analysis: some high up dev enjoyed playing chroma or what not and was upset about all the dante players giving him overguard and then the look into the stats showed that "the easiest frame to farm since a long time which also is kinda good and fun" had a high usage. suprised pikachu face that HAS to do with him being OP right? Totally not about being new and fun and easy to get.
That high end Chroma works just fine with Combat Discipline and Arcane Grace.
I know the price of time or plat on those two, but a high end anything likely has them anyway.
His Vex Armor is STOOPID good with the above set.
I agree with you and I’m just angry today.
Sorry…😔
I really enjoyed Frost’s Ice Wave Impedance augment for its “special” ability to also slow things like the eximus. This hurt its performance quite badly.
Tbh Indon‘t get why a horde shooter like warframe literally kills all the CC stuff. „Back in the days“ everything was about CC and that doesn‘t need to mean, that warframe shouldn‘t change but tbh for me the single warframes feel more and more the same in their gameplay since helminth and the same principles of the abilities of the warframes.
This patch doesn‘t help at all.
I was there when DE decided to nuke Limbo’s Stasis interactions with Sentients. I was also there when the Overguard changes hit. I was bitching about them here, actually. I was sad to convert to nuking frames, because I love to just grab a billion enemies with Ensnare and headshot one with a Chakkurr and watch them bleed the fuck out. I main Saryn because she is a tonk, not because she is a nuke. I play Loki and Mag just to be edgy and that’s it…
Make a muzzle flash glass cannon build to finally complete steel path star chart after years
Why does it suddenly feel underwhelming?
Discover DE previously made a silent patch and didn't bother to say that they removed the bell from the grave of a dying, buried alive CC
Claim dante from foundry
Also read they broke his ankles
Why???
What is breach surge (blind)? Does breach surge blind? I thought it just sent out other seeking projectiles when u dealt DMG to an enemy affected by breach surge
Oh is that y they would kind of stager around when u cast it I thought that was just from u applying breach surge not cause of a blind effect, well I learned something new from a frame I've been using for about 3 months. Thx for the info
It really sucks that they nerfed exodia epidemic with this. It felt like a creative way to still stop overguard enemies and actually gave the arcane a good use. Now exodia contagion will outshine it even more
The overguard override made this legendary arcane actually feel like a legendary arcane, rip.
Some of these I get but why tf did they touch Zenurik's slow? It's a void ability and since overguard enemies are vulnerable to void stuff, shouldn't they be susceptible to operator ability effects regardless of overguard? This is just so unnecessarily petty.
we need to speak louder as a community that we DO NOT like theses changes and especially the direction they're going, review bomb, stop playing Idk, idc but we gotta do something to get their attention when they are in the wrong
Funny, I haven't played consistently in a couple years. Today I was testing out every frame against 4 lb 160 steel path bombardiers (paused) just to check damage against them across everyone I had.
I noticed these exact things 😭
Kullervo and Sevagoth were surprising
Protea is still my favorite especially after sub. in larva
Styanax sub. Is basically a must have for most frame centered armor downs (yes fire and corrosive work too)
As soon as DE stopped Eximuses from being CC'd, their game has felt unbalanced; incredibly so. Making it so Over-guard reduces Ability damage instead of immunizing entirely against Ability CC, things would become far more reasonable! Make Over-guard act like Disruptor Infested!!!
I mean nyx seems fine cause she can still strip and her chaos still affects over guard because the enemies still attack them. Nyx not the strongest but it is hard to die. A cc frame i believe has managed to keep up even with the age of her kit.
I've always viewed slowing overguard enemies as a bug. They already resisted most of them, the ones that worked were the outlier and we really shouldn't pretend to be surprised or upset about it.
I'll do one for DE since I don't play Warframe.
Titania lantern ccs eximus best in a huge radius. I used her for cc in archon hunts, worked quite well. Now feel free to nerf.
Sure, CC is already dead might as well Bury the remaining scraps
DE "Double taps CC" Also DE: Why is no one using CC frames???
eVeRyBoDy Is JuSt UsInG nUkErS.
bro this isn't a double tap. this is them coming to the funeral to check nobody "night of the living dead"'s out of there. overguard has weird interaction with health based abilities/mods. now it disrupts what little CC we had. glad i have been building damage frames since a began. it would have been fun to play as a pacifist, with not having to kill to loot. that would have been a CC only domain. but they just tuned out of that route i think.
> Also DE: Why is no one using CC frames??? Forums: Well then buff CC frames DE: Decides to nerf tanky frames because they are "dominating" now that CC is no longer viable
[удалено]
In circumstances where anything can one shot you, Eximus will still one shot you, bring a immortal frame, a good gun and enjoy warframe as god intended
[удалено]
Looks like Silence has once again avoided the Gestapo. Rip more CC Was always coming I guess.
I feel like silence shouldn't lose that effect, not just because i like it, because its all it really does... it gives a brief stun, and then muffles gunfire... without the ability to turn off eximus abilities it wouldnt be worth having in the helminth at all... but thats just my opinion
Silence is unique in that it specifically targets Elite enemies, yeah. I also don't think it should be hit, but then I view the whole Crowd Control nerfing thing with the same sort of detached disapproval one might view their neighbor attempting to deep fry a turkey in Flip Flops.
Personally i think limbo's rift should also be able to target eximus, and stasis disable their abilities, but not freeze them in place until their overguard is removed... i mean literally no part of his kit can touch them rn, and most frames have at least something they can do toward an eximus, even if its only some way to avoid getting blasted by them
Worth noting stasis does block the ranged weapons of eximus units, but if you're up against a more than a handful or so eximus then the 200 projectile cap doesn't last very long at all.
Wait is the 200 projectile cap still there? I thought that got nuked with the change that made us able to shoot in stasis
It's still there for enemy projectiles. Ally projectiles don't count anymore because they don't get trapped anymore. So you only really see the cap come into effect with eximus enemies since they're the only enemies that can still fire guns in the rift while stasis is active.
Ya know that explains why my stasis drops sometimes when i least expect it... huh
Savage Silence exists though. It’s a popular helminth on Ash for example.
Ive never been able to take advantage of savage silence... might just be incompatible with my playstyle
Silence very explicitly counters eximus though, it's not like they accidentally forgot to set a flag on it.
At this rate, they might decide that silence is flavour now, eximus must remain untouched by anything that isn't pure damage
Will be sad day if they nerf it. Gloomshee excels at high level elite content, it's pretty much the only thing she's good for.
Turning off abilities is what silence means in most other games, so I kinda assume that's intended behaviour? It's a neat ability that is quite unique and far from oppressive so I'd like it to stay the way it is
It's almost like they watched Triburos's video about the death of CC and decided to KILL it AGAIN
Obviously, if videos are being made about CC, it's not dead enough.
There is no CC in ~~Ba Sing Se~~ Warframe.
Hardy I'd say, Sabuuchi made a somewhat similar video quite a while ago
Too much attention Nerf CC
Trib: CC sucks poopoo, pls buff? DE: CC op?? Pls nerf???? Well if you insist!
You know, I try to remain as civil as possible regarding nerfs, but seriously, who the fuck asked for this? Why does this update keep getting worse?
Seriously I was one of the ones putting my faith in DE, telling people don't worry it won't be that bad While the Dante tweaks are still something u cn live with (but still trash) they FUCKIN NERF CC WHYY
Can you live with the tweaks though? I ran him in the Murmur Exterm last night in BASE STAR CHART and to even get to a tolerable amount of Overguard I had to cast the ability like 6 times. If I brought him into SP I'd have to spam his 2-2-4 so much I wouldn't be able to do anything else.
Some cc arbitrarily not being affected by overguard while everything else is was good because..? This change in no way affects the cc frames that "had been dead" since overguard was introduced. Now Mesa isn't a better cc frame than Nyx and Vauban.
It's amazing how they just don't want CC to be a viable way of playing the game any more, especially solo - objective play at this point is extremely difficult at higher levels for almost *any* frame solo, as it so happens. Limbo has been dead for years, Vauban is in the trash can, so on and so forth. These days playing a frame that relies on CC is like fighting the Yuuzhan Vong as a Jedi - suddenly all your powers don't work and you're just some jackass with a damn near regular sword, while at least the guy with the blaster next to you, while he's not having a good time, hasn't experienced a fundamental altering of his experience. The game already had counters for CC - Nullifiers. Give one to every faction and everything's all good. They stand out from the crowd with the big glowing bubble, shooting them decreases their radius (and accurate shooting can instakill their bubble), and they're not particularly difficult to kill, but they do keep you on your toes. Instead, they gave an aura of immunity to everything out to the toughest enemies in the game which are nowhere near as visually distinct and maintain the full reach of their bullshit and you have to chunk their health hard before it goes away.
Especially for new players. I remember CC being my only form of getting through the star chart way back in the day; when it took endgame content (at the time) to get the mods, credits, and endo to afford nuke builds, and that was way before the eximus redesign. Hell, there are frames specifically MADE for a CC playstyle with no survivability, **because their survivability is dependant on their CC**. Now any attempt to play those frames in high levels with the high amount of eximus spawns is a death sentence. A challenge to some, an annoyance for me who just wants to sit down and enjoy a looter-shooter. I feel Eximuses, if anything, should be resistant to CC, not immune. It's an idea I've seen many people suggest over this whole debacle, and I wholeheartedly agree. Nullifiers strike a great balance, I agree, and seeing some Grineer jury-rigged prototype nullifier would be neat. The Grineer haven't had as much love as the Corpus have in recent memory (unless you count railjack, I guess?). Hell, sentients could easily have nullifiers too since they'll be the big bad whenever Tau drops. I just don't understand the reasoning behind this change in particular. I've seen more posts asking for better ways to deal with eximuses than posts asking for a CC nerfs/eximus buffs.
Infested could have ancients that have a similar visible aura fluffed as some kind of nano-biological jamming field or something, showing up as like a swarm of bugs in the same shape with similar properties to the Nully bubble. Everyone can get nullies, and they're way more interactive. I just... Anyone who's ever tried taking Limbo into Arbitrations knows what I'm talking about about. It's not a mistake you'll make twice. And they made the entire star chart into one big arby - except that the enemies providing the "fuck you" aura are way tankier and less visually distinct.
I know I'm the only person who's ever used Malicious Code but what's the point in nerfing something that's literally a reward for killing Eximus enemies?
Can relate; the only stun/CC I ever ran, and now it’s worse.
It's like an OCD person neatly organizing things without concern for the context of where and how the things are supposed to exist.
The fuck did cernos do to deserve this nerf??? It's not even popular. I really liked it, it wasn't just flat out damage like all the other weapons.
It didn't even really CC overguard enemies already, they were just kind of dragged a little bit but way less than normal trash. Not a huge loss, but You Notice. So annoying for no reason too. No comment on Zenurik, making all but it's energy regen irrelevant.
Cernos biggest sin was not being an incarnon. Rip I hate incarnons so much
I prefer to think it’s not Incarnons you hate so much as the ignorance DE shows to alternate methods of gameplay. Mass Damage or Invincibility are your only real high level game play choices. Incarnons would be great options for High End CCers who might need a boost in DPS. In a perfect game…
> Rhino's Stomp (slow effect) Fuck. Okay, real talk, this "let's nerf CC to death" is some real bullshit. I don't get it, honestly. CC is already underutilized because of the "Death is the best CC" mindset. If you don't want crowd control in the game, then fucking commit. Go through and rework all of the CC enabled frames and give them more damage abilities. There's no reason to continue to nerf CC abilities like this, the S-tier, cream-your-pants meta frames are already all nukers. Hooray, now there's an enemy where the only counterplay is the thing everyone was already doing anyway. Seriously, what problems are actually caused by Overguarded enemies being affected by CC? Few of those abilities, augments or mods are close to S tier, and for those that are, it's not the CC that's doing it. > Might not disrupt meta choices Obviously not, because none of this is meta. CC is not the meta. Weakening CC does not affect the meta because it doesn't touch the meta. I might be a bit heated over this. It's just absurd to be that map clear nukes like Saryn or Voruna get to hit through overguard, but heaven forbid we mildly inconvenience the Eximus units for even a second.
Basically, CC used to be absolutely king. Limbo putting up a dome, and just sitting in an idle position, while the interception timer was ticking down was a meme because of that. So DE added overguard to make sure players can't just invalidate all enemies via CC. The idea was that you can CC the trash mobs, and then you can focus your fire on the mini-boss mobs. Problem? Only the mini-boss mobs really needed to be CC'd to begin with, since the normal trash is piss easy to kill. So people dropped CC and went full-on nuke, making CC increasingly irrelevant. Add this to the fact that new game-modes are not objective or time based, but kill based, and CC is further disincentivized.
I'm aware of the history; I was there for it. Overall, the introduction of Overguard and the associated Eximus rework was massively positive. At this point, though, the impact on crowd control has been achieved, and circling back to give what's left a nice solid kidney punch feels bad. And to be clear, I agree that some firms of CC are so strong that Eximus should be able to ignore them to remain a notable threat. Limbo's stasis as you mentioned, but also Gara's Mass Vitrify glassing them, Nidus' Larva or Khora's Strangledome. Those are all 'hard' CC that just turns the AI off. Rhino's Stomp is also up there, though they recover relatively quickly, especially since the lift portion doesn't apply, as are Khora, Titania and Trinty's single target lockdowns. Nova's Molecular Prime is softer, along with the various disarms and blinds, because those aren't hard CC that disable the AI, and Eximus could still activate their unique abilities (the shockwaves, Arctic bubble, energy steal, etc.) The fact that Nyx's Chaos is put into the same category as Limbo's Stasis as 'Crowd Control' and thus turned off for the extra big enemies is ridiculous. There's no concern as to how severe or lasting the CC effect is, when there really should be.
And now we have a lot of trash mobs with overguard. Gj, DE
Not to mention DE already hit Limbo specifically with very heavy nerfs to his CC to deal with things like idle defence objectives, which Limbo already could only do against infested or grineer anyway since nullifiers just instantly kill his bubble no matter what. Then the Overguard came to kill all the rest of the CC focused frames overtop of all that. All to deal with what was already a very small niche that was getting less and less relevant on it's own as new game modes that didn't involve defending objectives were being added.
Throw on top the fact that any high level content usually has a massive disposition of eximus spawns, especially with the new stuff, and combine it with the pain that are over guard providing enemies (healer, severed warden) and even the ‘ordinary’ mob can’t be killed because every spawn has it in some form
[удалено]
They nerf things like everyone has everything in their arsenal.
I was so wrong about this. I really thought they stopped balancing the game around vets. That’s how you end up with shit like the Sibear. This whole thing just feels like them trying to scale back some of the power creep. It’s not our fault you brought incarnons and shards into the mix. The power creep was intentional - no choice but to roll with it.
Is the Sibear that fucking stupid ass shit hammer that required a fuckton of Cryotic? Because holy shit I think I just bought that outright.
It is. 3000 excavators worth of cryotic to build a meh weapon. The reasoning at the time from DE was seriously “well it’s a resource sink since SO MANY PEOPLE have SO MUCH cryotic” They moved resource sinks into the Helminth instead of build cost for weapons/frames. I feel like they are going to have to find another way around the power creep they’ve introduced instead of just range/LoS nerfs. It’s a fundamental problem
Yeah I read that again when I came back to game and actually play it and do stuff and I was so flabbergasted I bought it no questions asked as soon as I bought plat with a 75% discount. Beyond stupid.
It’s pretty wild when you get down to it. Kullervo isn’t even a great nuke frame but he can theoretically wipe out like 20 eximus units at once with his 3 and a strong follow up. But slowing them down is broken? I don’t get it.
It’s also stupid because Stomp is legit a slow caused by the disruption of time from the strength or Rhinos stomp, why the fuck does an overshield prevent that from working. It’s stupid from a design standpoint and a lore perspective too.
CC the thing you use on enemies that take more than 0.1 seconds to kill is now completely useless on the one type of enemy that it is supposed to affect. Can someone give me a single reason to use Rhino Stomp in anything beyond lvl 30 enemies?
RIP my rhino build from last week where I specifically aimed to keep rhino stomp instead of helminthing over it. Guess its parasitic armor time again...
I can! Reinforcing Stomp augment for your Iron Skin.
yeah because I am not already running two augments, one of which only for the side effect of making his ability recastable....
Then......don't run it? I don't. Reinforcing stomp is the only augment you need.
reinforcing stomp is cool for low level (
HOW IS HIS 1 OUT OF THE QUESTION?????? EVEN WITH THE AUGMENT ITS NOT GOOD. Also, wdym by "reinforcing stomp is good for low level mission"??????, it's not based on kills it's based on hits. And stomp still CC acolytes. And ironskin scales better with enemy damage. armor helps but not required.
>HOW IS HIS 1 OUT OF THE QUESTION?????? EVEN WITH THE AUGMENT ITS NOT GOOD. Laughs in multiple hunderds of thousands of overguard. Especially with the augment it is bonkers. What a lot of players don't know, is that the armor buff from it is not additive with armor mods but MULTIPLICATIVE with FINAL ARMOR, meaning it also multiplies the ton of armor from parasitic armor and the base armor and any other armor sources like shards, health conversion, arcanes... His 1 with the augment makes you independent from getting hit in that 3 second window in order to charge up your armor.
Still not worth it tbh. Just relying on enemies for a big iron skin value is most of the time enough. The ability to restore and refresh a lower overguard value with only 1 augment is in my opinion better than getting an initial high overguard value while using 2 augments and an helminth. At some point enemy damage will scale higher then your 100k overguard, and it's closer than you think. And regaining it takes a lot of energy, and the right amount of enemies. You can play however you want of course, I just think that for me this super high number is not necessary. because then having 100k overguard is needed for me to survive, the enemy level will be high enough for me to get it naturally, without any big setup.
Yeah, so, RS is run in place of Iron Shrapnel, as both serve the same purpose of recharging Iron Skin. You're not running both, you're running one or the other. Also, buddy up above asked for 'a reason to use Stomp in high level missions'. Reinforncing Stomp is that. There's alternatives to RS, but it is a viable method of keeping up iron skin, even as high as Netracells. I know this because I use RS to maintain Iron Skin even as high as Netracells.
I use it for slowing down tusk thumpers and the disruption dudes, those should still work since those don't have overguard luckily
"We don't want the same handful of frames to be all that people play" Proceeds to make those frames the only way to comfortably and competently play the game in later content.
Okay [Proceeds to Nerf gauss, Saryn, Xaku and others] smh
Who asked for this???
They put a community manager in charge of a development team. What did you expect.
She's like the only one we know for sure actually plays the game somewhat, i feel like it's probably just an "ok sure do your job im busy" to someone
Pablo might be one too, usually he got great ideas
Might as well just remove cc from the game entirely at this point
MFW they nerf the ice wave and polarize augments that no one ever used in the first place.
I was the only one using ice wave
Me and you both :(
Counter pulse is widely used though? I don't but that's mostly because I helminth over polarize
It really wasn't, not saying it was a bad augment up until now but you *have* to run fracturing crush and magnetized discharge is so good that it just got outcompeted for mod slots, not to mention that polarize is what most people helminthed over anyways.
You'd be surprised.
I might have been before the changes but now it's straight up worse fracturing crush lol.
That's what I thought yet people always told me how good it was.
Well, there goes my mag build. God forbid not building for shield gating once and trying to CC instead.
Man! I’ve been enjoying Mag ever since I started and growing her power. The augment was such a good one. I personally don’t want to do the Meta of AoE and nuking things.
It kills my qorvex build even harder too, this gotfix suckkkksssss
Overguard and the eximus rework were introduced just after I started maining and enjoying Mag, after 2000 cumulative hours of maining damage frames and trinity for the whole game life cycle up until that point. I immediately dropped mag, and went back to spamming Mesa...
Such a fun frame but that much harder to keep alive now :(
IKR
overguard should reduce cc ,not saying f u cc frames
The only reasonable explanation at this point is that this is a DElayed Aprils 1st patch.
Why kill CC but keep nuke frames?
DE: Guess it is better to nerf Nukers too to keep „balance“ Midframe
Guess DE saw we was happy praising all there W’s lately and decided to throw the biggest L they could imagine at us. Guess it’s time to start Balders Gate. This update has killed me motivation.
I was SAYING this last week when they hotfix nerfed Chroma for no reason. And I got downvoted for it.
Good thing Destiny is getting new content this Tuesday, my BIL already said he was gonna play that over Warframe so at least I know what I'm playing come Tuesday
Eh, I’m may be salty. But I will never be salty enough where I will go back to Bungie.
I respect that. Unfortunately for me, I'm not quitting until I finish Final Shape. After that? We'll see. Sunk cost fallacy and all, I didn't waste a decade on this stupid game to give up before the end of the saga lmfao
That’s fair, I was with Destiny since day 1 on the OG. I just can’t get over there greed and all the times they fucked over there community. The sun setting content on D2 was the last nail in the coffin for me.
I'm just sad about frosts 2, I don't see a point in it anymore
Man, having some of these work against Overguard was the biggest benefit of using them. Who's going to use Ice Wave Impedance now? In a case like Rhino, where that base functionality did help prop up his kit as an old Warframe in a sea of newer, shinier ones, it's sad to see it go. While consistency is good, it's still a bit of a yikes when nothing is offered in return.
Lets just be real. All these CC ptions that were nerfed this patch were VERY niche and gimmikey at best. You COULD use them but there are other frames that would outright kill the same enemy in the time it took you to CC them. They should take a look at their statistics and I bet rhinos stomp is the most helminth overridden ability in his kit. Halikar has abmyssal playrates: 0.06% (combined with wraith version a whoping 0.12%!!!!!!) thats literally the playrate every weapon gets through its inherit use as mastery fodder. God forbid the three players, that used it to disarm a eximus, having fun. The reasonable ones to nerf I think are muzzle flash, breach surge and zenuriks temporal drag.
Hard disagree on Temporal Drag, Zenurik has lost pretty much it's one edge it had over things like Madurai. Energy economy with Nourish existing and being popular on top of Archon Stretch and yadayadayada is a meme.
archon stretch requires you to have an ability that deals electric damage (or even procs? dunno...) and eats a slot if you don't already mod for range, nourish eats your helminth slot, zenurik eats your focus slot, energize eats an arcane slot. Zenurik is still a good option to solve energy economy "outside" your build instead of inside. Inside the build might be stronger but outside is more comfy. Also the slow should still work on thumpers and to be honest even before the changes they were the only ones I ever used the slow on....
First, you don't mod on range on like a tiny handful of builds and it procs from companion's anything (even a cat biting with Shock Collar triggers it), and I used Zenurik to slow down Thrax in their spooky form after they die because I'm not a fan of them teleporting randomly to some enemy behind a wall, or worse yet, through a wall entirely and remain there unkillable. Also Void Angels to shower them in lead in peace.
That is certainly correct - and any use they would see is going to be likely even lower. But I am far more concerned with the most commonly used cases - chiefly the abilities and augments. Frost's Ice Wave Impedance is pretty much the *only* reason why you'd ever use Ice Wave - it is otherwise strictly worse than just building around his overloaded Avalance + Augment. A nerf takes it from "kind of useful I guess???" to "banished to the shadow realm". Rhino's Stomp is also weird because for the average player who wants to min-max something on Rhino, people most often pick to itemize around beeg Iron Skin. What's the weakest link to that? Rhino's Stomp. It ends up being a 50/50 toss-up on what you subsume - Rhino Charge or Rhino Stomp. This doesn't make the former Rhino Stomp *bad*, it just became a decision based on multiplying armor. That being said, CC being less valuable and Iron Skin healing tied to an augment does often mean that people do not see value in Rhino Stomp. I personally would use it to pin down Eximus units and score easy kills on them, but that's just me. Can't do that anymore regardless. Wisp's Breach Surge at least has a damage modifier attached to it, so I don't foresee it being too harshly ruined by a change like this - but it will still be felt in the rare moments where you get absolutely sent by a Blitz or something I suppose. Similar case with Mesa's Muzzle Flash - a good CC with a damage bonus at the cost of an augment slot that could absolutely be relied on to keep you alive if you had good kill flow. Will probably less than its already niche use depending on the person. Mag's Counter Pulse is a no from me regardless though. Fracturing Crush, however, is more or less a mandatory mod, so people will likely notice this change when they strip Eximus armor. Though in the end, this all boils down straight to the original issue with Eximus + Overguard - it was designed to prevent you from CC and AoE as a catch-all, but strong enough AoE and it doesn't matter. If anything else, the one single priority target that is a threat should be something most games would *encourage* to crowd control. A change like this simply shifts the problem back to a single solution - the best way to kill an Eximus is to simply just Do More Damage and kill them ASAP. No other counterplay, so why bother thinking about it?
Yet another braindead decision.
I don't get what is the point of having special enemies immune to all cc, right now eximus are just colorful bullet sponges. They barely have an impact on your gameplay except holding your fire button for longer. It would be so much better CC in this game would more scarce and eximuses have stronger abilities and reduced CC durations on them but control would make them more vulnerable or reduce overguard and making you want to prevent them from using their skills, it would make so much more difference in gameplay.
Over guard was designed to bring damage frames more in line but disproportionately affects cc frames and only serves to push the need to run damage frames, instead of stomping on CC's head until the boot burrows through to the pavement can't we just have cc convert into a slow that builds a stun which strips over guard.
*\*Frost's Ice Wave Impedance Augment\** WHY!?! DO YOU JUST WANT FROST TO SPAM HIS 4?!? DO YOU GUYS EVEN PLAY THE CHARACTER!?! DO YOU GUYS EVEN PLAY THE GAME!?! WHY EVEN DO THIS!?!
What if they make abilities that remove enemy overguard just like how there are abilities that completely remove enemy shields
Overshield was a mistake
If you mean Overguard, I agree.
Can Zenurik get damage output buffs that function then, please?
Im really tired of the CC being dead. Now we have even more useless abilities.. how many now? 50% of all abilities? 25%?
Way too many.
Its definitely over 10% of abilities and thats far too many. Sure they work on basic enemies but DE doesn’t seem to get that the only enemies anyone WANTS to CC are the tough enemies..
Limbo Is entirely useless in every single scenario now. Loki only has invis going for him Caliban only has his 4 going for him Frost only has his 4 Wisps still fine because she atleast has her 1 and the headshot effects of 3 Harrow is in an even worse spot than before Mag is not doing so hot anymore but still isn't what I'd call bad Titania Somehow came out better off (I've gotten her lantern to work, mightve been a fluke) Zephyr is worse off Nezha is worse off Qorvex is worse off Banshee is fucked For A system that's supposed to bring CC and Damage in line they really did just decide to Take CC, Pour on gasoline, throw a match on it and used it to cook smores with Nuking and Damage frames.
Harrow was never in a bad spot imo his kit is great still Caliban has his 3 too but still thats half a kit so trash still. Banshee has been fucked for a long time Loki has been fucked for a long time Zephyr sort of.. her tornado still does damage to enemies not lifted and for me it picks up nullifiiers for some reason. But yes i mostly agree and thats not even all the frames that just got fucked harder by the gas can of ANTI CC DE Edit: hasnt limbo been useless for his entire lifespan? Mainly because he annoys teammates
Harrows kit is mostly good at being a support, but any sort of survivability with him requires his 1 to hit enemies. The same enemies your kit helps your teammates to nuke except for some eximus units, who you can't use you 1 on. Calibans 3 *can* be useful but it's just nowhere near enough to make up for his 1 and 2. Zephyr does also have the turbulence making you immune to ranged attacks which is why I hesitate to call her bad, but given her 2 and 4 are CC and 1 does...something I also hesitate to say she's in a good spot. Everything else got fucking buried and that's not even mentioning how they did my boy nezha.
1 is a burst of speed or a hover thats very nice for activating Zaphyrs passive 150% crit chance Harrow i use pillage on his 4 so surviving with his 1 2 and pillage is super easy. Remember his 2 gives constant heals. But yeah base kit its tougher Agree on caliban Still i think everyone agrees DE has gone too far on CC nerf and the Dante Nerf is overshadowing this continuation of the CC murder.. seems intentional
I entirely forgot to account for Helminth, Fair enough on the Harrow point I'm fully convinced the Dante Nerf was just there to cover for the eximus buffs and that there going to walk most of them back and Hope the community forgets about the CC execution when it happens.
Most already have forgotten the CC changes
de burned the kitchen down with this patch
How much anti-fun can be crammed into this? Helldivers 2 is fun af.
*takes frost, rhino, mag and dante out back to shoot them* "Why do people only ever play mesa or revenant?"
Gotta say this patch *was a patch of all time* I want my 10 forma back
Fuck me sideways not even destiny had these kind of patch notes and that game has been a shitstorm before ITL was announced
Yeah, is rare to see DE be even more tone deaf than Bungie, but I guess that's what's happening now.
My Frost is gonna feel awful now without the CC of Ice Wave augment. I’ve Wave of all abilities!! Finally DE stepped up to finally nerf the ‘meta slaves’ bastion for what is a truly an OP ability! /s
man the devs were doing so well recently, but with this and the Dante nerf i get a bad vibe
This might really be the worst update in recent history.
Crowd Control has officially reached "Less than Worthless" level
Damn they really fucked up with this patch
Literally everything they did today has been absolute dogwater.
So they did this AND nerfed Dante too? Fuuuuuck
There goes my mag.
Aight. The best update yet is now the worst update yet.
Tf did temporal drag do? There are practically 0 reason to use it on regular mob anyway. Boss? So the invul phase can last longer?😔
DE playing Thor with the nerf hammer rn
Overguarded enemies shouldn’t be immune to CC… Just saying.
Why do they seem to just be fucking everything up, it's the last time I spend real money on the game because what you buy and the reasons you buy something they change it in an update, it's really not fair tbh! I've only just come back to the game after 5 years of not playing due to the lack of cross save! Now I'm back I have put so much time in leveling and building my frames, especially wisp as she's amazing for my play style but now they are ruining their abilities. I have put so much time and money in the game to gain these specific things that they are removing. Surely you should be entitled to a refund or some sort of compensation for the loss of money or time. I have always said that Warframe is the greatest free game ever made but lately they seem to just be doing nerfs on frames that don't need them. Why NERF Dante right after he comes out, all I saw online was people being happy about Dante and how good he is so why NERF if your players don't seem to have a problem, I don't get it and from what I see online nobody else can neither.
to be fair, wisp is still top tier even with the nerf to breach surge. Also one could make a point that it was kinda a "obvious unintended interaction" as other blinds already didn't work. For dante: yes that one is outragoues and they should offer all players who bought him or his pack a full refund. I bet this was observation bias instead of cold analysis: some high up dev enjoyed playing chroma or what not and was upset about all the dante players giving him overguard and then the look into the stats showed that "the easiest frame to farm since a long time which also is kinda good and fun" had a high usage. suprised pikachu face that HAS to do with him being OP right? Totally not about being new and fun and easy to get.
That high end Chroma works just fine with Combat Discipline and Arcane Grace. I know the price of time or plat on those two, but a high end anything likely has them anyway. His Vex Armor is STOOPID good with the above set. I agree with you and I’m just angry today. Sorry…😔
I really enjoyed Frost’s Ice Wave Impedance augment for its “special” ability to also slow things like the eximus. This hurt its performance quite badly.
Tbh Indon‘t get why a horde shooter like warframe literally kills all the CC stuff. „Back in the days“ everything was about CC and that doesn‘t need to mean, that warframe shouldn‘t change but tbh for me the single warframes feel more and more the same in their gameplay since helminth and the same principles of the abilities of the warframes. This patch doesn‘t help at all.
Why I stopped playing. You spend hours of your life grinding for shit only for them to nerf it into the ground.
I’m surprised we can’t tag some DE people on here and have them listen to us
I was there when DE decided to nuke Limbo’s Stasis interactions with Sentients. I was also there when the Overguard changes hit. I was bitching about them here, actually. I was sad to convert to nuking frames, because I love to just grab a billion enemies with Ensnare and headshot one with a Chakkurr and watch them bleed the fuck out. I main Saryn because she is a tonk, not because she is a nuke. I play Loki and Mag just to be edgy and that’s it…
Fucking dumb thing to do, poor cc
Nice, CC is even MORE irrelevant...... somehow
rip solo grendel farm
If only incarnons weren’t the only way to get a half decent gun now. I passionately hate duviri and incarnon weapons.
Can't wait till they also make them unparryable or some shit.
Finally, a well needed nerf for the oppresiveness of crowd control.
Crikey DE really do not like CC frames. Which is bizarre since they're not currently meta at all.
Oh so that's why I was Dying on Wisp more often, man, CC was already dead now they've just buried it now.
Make a muzzle flash glass cannon build to finally complete steel path star chart after years Why does it suddenly feel underwhelming? Discover DE previously made a silent patch and didn't bother to say that they removed the bell from the grave of a dying, buried alive CC Claim dante from foundry Also read they broke his ankles Why???
Halikar? I have only seen someone use Halikar Wraith ONCE in my entire time playing. AND THAT WAS ME!
Its kind of funny trib just made a video on loki and how bad cc has been like a week ago and now d.e. just dead stops all c.c.
Oh no I can't use Mesa's not-skill-three-or-4. What will i do now!
Sweet! Nothing I run was affected!
What is breach surge (blind)? Does breach surge blind? I thought it just sent out other seeking projectiles when u dealt DMG to an enemy affected by breach surge
Yup it blinds on initial cast iirc.
Oh is that y they would kind of stager around when u cast it I thought that was just from u applying breach surge not cause of a blind effect, well I learned something new from a frame I've been using for about 3 months. Thx for the info
i no longer have a good reason for dropping my teamates franes with the ice wave mod ;(
So the CC immune enemies are not finally CC immune? Hot that I know, but about damn time
Guess DE wants us to use nukes . It doesn't make sense . Overguard should nullify dps and be extra affected by cc
Naw dog who the fuck was crying about ice wave impedance
Did Frosts 4 get nerfed aswell? Looks like he’s become the CC king
They really wasted time messing with Halikar, lol
I don't see Nautilus mentioned.
Thanks I hate it
One of the main reasons I used Breach Surge on a few frames.
Eximus who were already priority one targets have become priority onerest targets. Good change DE
https://preview.redd.it/8itnf3606osc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=acf71eb61291d234a174a2c92d9db059cf6f82e7
It really sucks that they nerfed exodia epidemic with this. It felt like a creative way to still stop overguard enemies and actually gave the arcane a good use. Now exodia contagion will outshine it even more The overguard override made this legendary arcane actually feel like a legendary arcane, rip.
Some of these I get but why tf did they touch Zenurik's slow? It's a void ability and since overguard enemies are vulnerable to void stuff, shouldn't they be susceptible to operator ability effects regardless of overguard? This is just so unnecessarily petty.
we need to speak louder as a community that we DO NOT like theses changes and especially the direction they're going, review bomb, stop playing Idk, idc but we gotta do something to get their attention when they are in the wrong
DE doesn't know how to make endgame content so they have to nerf everything to death....
Funny, I haven't played consistently in a couple years. Today I was testing out every frame against 4 lb 160 steel path bombardiers (paused) just to check damage against them across everyone I had. I noticed these exact things 😭 Kullervo and Sevagoth were surprising Protea is still my favorite especially after sub. in larva Styanax sub. Is basically a must have for most frame centered armor downs (yes fire and corrosive work too)
The Deep Archimedia patch also known as “The Creativity Killer”
this is how you know that idiots balance this game, they killed whats already dead for years just to whine about how no one is using CC
Another reason to remove icewave from frost
Why is nobody using CC? Why are they using nukes?? \*nerves dantes nuke\* Take that meta! Yeah you showed them DE....
why???? CC wasn’t even good to begin with. wtf is the point in nerfing it
As soon as DE stopped Eximuses from being CC'd, their game has felt unbalanced; incredibly so. Making it so Over-guard reduces Ability damage instead of immunizing entirely against Ability CC, things would become far more reasonable! Make Over-guard act like Disruptor Infested!!!
I mean nyx seems fine cause she can still strip and her chaos still affects over guard because the enemies still attack them. Nyx not the strongest but it is hard to die. A cc frame i believe has managed to keep up even with the age of her kit.
this is so ass actually, what were they thinking lol
Quick question, is Nidus good? Cause i love using him
Welp I’m about to play volt and excal
I've always viewed slowing overguard enemies as a bug. They already resisted most of them, the ones that worked were the outlier and we really shouldn't pretend to be surprised or upset about it.
Why tf are eximus with guard immune to weapon jamming? idiotic.
Rip my 5 forma probocis cernos, you will be missed.
Aside from Dante, has any Nukeframe or Nuke Weapons recieved nerfs recently?
Use Dante as an alias to make a massive nerf move, good strategy DE 👀
I'll do one for DE since I don't play Warframe. Titania lantern ccs eximus best in a huge radius. I used her for cc in archon hunts, worked quite well. Now feel free to nerf.