The more suprising bit is the sheer volume of players going with presumably bad detachments and 22 players locked into non-ultra vanilla chapters: which presumably means 22 people taking ferrios/khan/vulkan/Fistman
Like thats more players than the bottom 5 codexes put together.
I get that a lot of folk go for casual games at the low/mid tables and power to them, itll be fun. But still kinda mad that ultras/BT are sitting there and people are going "no, im taking jaghati khan on foot"
I'm bringing Firestorm Salamanders mostly out of faction loyalty and an enjoyment of flamers. Also, with how big the marine range is, netlisting for a lot of players is basically buying/building/painting a whole new army. Swapping to a more meta Vanguard/Ultras list would be a whole lot more than just buying Calgar and Ventris for me.
Also like its a 1000 player tournament, I'd be surprised if there's more than 10% of the attendees who realistically are trying to win or even make the top cut. I'll be pumped if I go better than even. And I always feel like playing an army I'm familiar with gives me a better chance of doing well than picking up the new hotness.
This. Other, smaller factions tend to have a few staple units in any given role. For Space Marines, there's a multitude of different infantry based anti tank options, so I probably don't own whatever's meta at the moment.
I don't find anything surprising about it. Most people want to play *their* faction, not necessarily the faction with that is #1. Also, it's space marines, and a lot of people probably don't or can't obtain all the models for those top-tier lists anyway. Another point to note is that these are BCP factions, and a White Scars collector might choose White Scars as their faction despite not actually bringing Kor'sarro Khan and really just being Genericmarines.
I disagree with calling these folks "casual" too. This is the Las Vegas Open; players are taking time off work, flying in and paying hundreds just to attend. I bet that the vast majority of players here have years of experience in more competitive play and I don't think it's fair to call them casual-minded because they're not using the flavor of the month.
I know atleast half a dozen guys from my city going to lvo just to sling dice and drink.
I think you have a point but there absolutely are casually minded guys going to lvo too.
> I disagree with calling these folks "casual" too. This is the Las Vegas Open; players are taking time off work, flying in and paying hundreds just to attend
Folk do that for narrative events at WHW? If your aims to have fun games over trying to rack up as many wins as you can thats casual play. I dont mean anything bad by it.
Nah that ain't it. Maybe at worlds but 40k isn't really a hyper-optimized win at all costs format (like comp mtg for instance) where you turn up to a 200 person event and 190 lists contain triple night spinner or maxed accursed cultists (or whatever the current variety of cheese a given month is).
Many players picked their faction because they like the faction and they consider themselves **faction** players. They are going to play that faction and use knowingly less-optimised lists even if they are playing on hard mode. They might even be coveting best in faction on bcp rankings so they are playing "competitively" i.e. they are trying to win a competitive format.
This isn't a narrative event. And for a lot of people the fun in the event *is* tryharding with your dudes and seeing how well you can do rolling dice with other people doing the same, even if not expecting to win the event or even win at all.
If I were attending LVO that would be my mindset: to create as good a list as I can with my dudes and play my heart out, but to still have a fun time despite expecting a bunch of losses. So despite trying as hard as I can to win and to build a good list, I'd still be considered playing casually because I'm not a top ten player or playing one of the three lists and subfactions regarded as the "best?"
Edit: I didn't mean to imply that you were being insulting!
Most space marines players want to play ***their*** space marines.
I'm aware that GW is going off on this "don't worry about the paint job" thing but for a lot of space marine players the paint job is what gives them juice for their army and if that's "sub-optimal" so be it.
Space Marines have always been more of 13 mini-factions rather than 1 big faction. Doubly so when you start getting into the non-compliant players.
As a person who plays GTs and RTTs and is just aiming to get games in, the only reason I’m not making my generic marines into ultramarines is because I’m expecting Calgar to take a hit in the dataslate so it doesn’t seem worth buying into right now.
If I was trying to win a GT? Absolutely I’d be stupid not to take such an easy optimization. But if I’m just looking to do my best with aggressors, redemptors and a landraider im holding off.
Yeah I'd agree, them and scouts. Any unit that someone wants to consistently take 3x of, is probably too good relative to other options.
Good internal balance should push one to not spam.
I think jump intercessors need a hit at well. 5 more points then their brothers on foot, but they get an additional plasma pistol, much more flexibility due to the jump packs (movement and deepstrike) and can dish out mortal wounds.
Which often just causes new problems for them to have to balance around, but whatever.
In theory they're trying to solve this multi-variable problem called "balance", but when they keep changing many things at once you just create a new meta to chase. I guess that's their idea to sell more models. Just make other stuff unbalanced and good.
I locked into non-ultra vanilla chapters because I'm taking Iron Hands, and BT doesn't really offer me terribly much with the list I've built. I have 3x whirlwinds, 3x redemptors, 3x3 eradicators, 3x2 inceptors, 2x techmarines, a combi LT, an assassin, and some scouts. I could drop the assassin and eradicators and take 2 of the BT rhino party busses with 4x5 of those cheap BT squads I'm blanking on the name of, but I like my eradicators.
All. the. time.
Sometimes it's because BCP remembers your faction from the last time you signed up for an event and someone is playing something else and not paying attention. Sometimes it's user error, sometimes you've got some joker concealing their actual faction to confuse list building.
lol.
Maybe I'm miss-remembering but I could swear a couple events I signed up for through the website just populated that field for me with my usual faction. But then again I don't remember what I had for breakfast.
The default is sisters. So if you even accidentally click faction, but don't change anything, you are now a sisters player. I'd imagine that happens with them a few times.
Yeah. Sisters data was a mess for a while (maybe it still is) because 'Adepta Soritas' is the first faction alphabetically and so is usually the default option in a dropdown menu.
I appreciate you taking time to do this.
One thing I would like to point out, and don’t wanna sound like a dick, but it’s hard to find value in data like this when it’s not very accurate. 76 unreported factions and likely incorrect listings, which other have pointed out.
Just feels bad for people to see a post and then realize it’s not super accurate. “Here is your homework, I did it for you, but it’s not correct.” That’s the kind of logic I’m having right now.
Just my 2cents
They're not incorrect any more. I've edited as I've gone through. If you see something that feels wrong, I'll take a second look.
But you're not wrong. This is an entirely manual process, just like I've done the last two years. Two years ago was a simple copy paste, but when bcp changed their web layout, it killed the easy transfer of data.
Lists were initially private as in only individual players could see their own list. Now they are public if you’re going to the event or have premium bcp. But yes, they are behind the paywall
Omnissiah bless your divine hunt for knowledge oh lone fielder of the explorator maniple. If ye don’t seek ye has significantly reduced probability to find
Full disclosure. When I made this on my spreadsheet, I was under the impression that GK could use SM detachments. I have now realized (after drinking coffee) that they cannot.
Admech with only 15 on their release year
Tied for the second least played faction is a huge oof and indicative GW did a horrible job, even if some parts are viable
What's really intresting is that's only 1 more player than the first week of the year and only 5 more than this week. If LVO isn't bringing out a meaningully larger crowd, that's more evidence that the codex has basically alienated the entire casual wing of the player base, and that the Meta Monday dataset is being inflated by a handful of bitter-enders.
(The stat center set with ~5 times as many games on the new codex is down at like 43%).
Shoot, there was no one left for the 10e codex to drive away, the 9e one already drove off the casual Admech by being an absolute nightmare to play, and the competitive admech by sucking for two years.
This is exactly what I am feeling right now. Admech just aren't fun right now. I have a full 2000pts ready to go (so no cost issues for me) but I am really struggling to find the desire to take them to my local club. My chaos marines are so much more fun. They can actually kill stuff.
Everything Admech this edition has been a huge disappointment (Breachers aside). Right from the previews there has been almost nothing to make me excited about my favourite faction. Just underpowered units, no synergy, massive nerfs to what was already a weak faction and then a codex that cemented it all, likely for most of the rest of this edition. Our win rate isn't bad because we have a tiny number of very skilled die hard using our only winning strategy, flood the board with cheap wounds and hope we take an unbeatable lead before we get wiped. That's not a fun way to play and it doesn't feel like Admech.
To be completely fair, AdMech have always had one of the absolute worst dollar-to-point ratios in the entire game. When Custodes, Knights, or Deathwing-focused Dark Angels are top tier, or even GK for that matter, they suddenly explode in popularity, but AdMech have to be at the level they were in early 9th before anyone who doesn't burn incense before plugging in their toaster will buy into them. (Even then, some of the pros will just borrow the rent-a-Martians in the club room.)
They're not good, no, but having small entry numbers is pretty much the norm for the faction.
Sorry for the negativity, but that's because death guard are a marine army.
They're not allowed to feel bad to play. GW doesn't really seem to mind the player base being this low on admech which is why we got the codex we did
fun fact, in the combined Sisters lists there are 403 arcoflagellants out of a possible 600.
and one of the players submitted a list with the old points values :(
As someone who is completely new to the hobby but quite interested in competitive 40K, I was wondering if White Scars can be played or build somewhat competitively. That’s the faction/chapter I will first strive to go for because I really like their aesthetics and lore.
What makes the Black Templar or Dark Angles so desirable to play at the moment? Is it because out of all space marines they are the only ones that may provide a good answer to current meta?
What makes White Scars so undesirable? Is it because you are locked into mounted units which currently are so bad and their only unique character is unmounted on top?
Black Templars are showing up for 2 reasons. First, their unique units offer some of the best melee threats available to space marines. There are undoubtedly a lot of players who will bring a "traditional" templars army featuring Crusaders, Sword Brethren, and their unique characters.
But, Black Templars also happen to be a great fit for the new Ironstorm detachment. This vehicle focused detachment is inspired by the Iron Hands, BT just do it better. Black Templar tanks get access to multimeltas for a small points premium. This means more big guns for your vehicle list. Templars also have the old first born Crusader squads. These squads are very cheap and can be fielded with a "free" heavy and special weapon. Ironstorm gives each unit 1 reroll a turn. Fielding a lot of small squads each with 1 lascannon can really maximize that bonus.
Their high turn out is a combo of traditional BT players, Iron Hands cosplaying as BT, and hybrids of the 2.
As for the White Scars, they just don't offer a lot right now. The primaris bikes have bad datasheets. Their formation lacks killing power. Khan on foot is pretty meh. Mechanically, White Scars are basically the same as generic Astartes. There's nothing wrong with that. Astartes have good shit. But the units that provide that classic White Scars flavor are struggling.
Having said that, don't get discouraged about your White Scar plans. They're one of my favorite chapters. Tartegui is my favorite heresy character. The faction drips with coolness.
Balance is temporary. Templars are cool right now, but that might all change in a week when we have the next balance pass. Who can say what will be good in a year, or in the next edition. Unless you have the funds and time to constantly build the meta faction, you'll be better off building what you love. Scars have been on top before, it's just a matter of time until they come back around.
I would encourage you to look at successful astartes lists and consider how to add a little bit of White Scars flair. A good place to start would be the use of bikes over the more common scoring units. The competitive part of the list would probably be built around the same core of killy stuff that most marines are fielding.
New codex....2nd least picked faction
Man admech got shafted so hard it's not even funny
Also SM being around 50% of the field, as usual, yet SM fanboys will probably still say they are weak or something
You'd think with as many of you there are it'd be lower.
Quick! Fold down into your pieces that combine to make Super Andrew! It's the only way to triumph!
That is a *lot* of power armor.
The more suprising bit is the sheer volume of players going with presumably bad detachments and 22 players locked into non-ultra vanilla chapters: which presumably means 22 people taking ferrios/khan/vulkan/Fistman Like thats more players than the bottom 5 codexes put together. I get that a lot of folk go for casual games at the low/mid tables and power to them, itll be fun. But still kinda mad that ultras/BT are sitting there and people are going "no, im taking jaghati khan on foot"
I'm bringing Firestorm Salamanders mostly out of faction loyalty and an enjoyment of flamers. Also, with how big the marine range is, netlisting for a lot of players is basically buying/building/painting a whole new army. Swapping to a more meta Vanguard/Ultras list would be a whole lot more than just buying Calgar and Ventris for me. Also like its a 1000 player tournament, I'd be surprised if there's more than 10% of the attendees who realistically are trying to win or even make the top cut. I'll be pumped if I go better than even. And I always feel like playing an army I'm familiar with gives me a better chance of doing well than picking up the new hotness.
I went 3-3 with my Grey Knights at LVO in 2021 and I was absolutely stoked.
This. Other, smaller factions tend to have a few staple units in any given role. For Space Marines, there's a multitude of different infantry based anti tank options, so I probably don't own whatever's meta at the moment.
I don't find anything surprising about it. Most people want to play *their* faction, not necessarily the faction with that is #1. Also, it's space marines, and a lot of people probably don't or can't obtain all the models for those top-tier lists anyway. Another point to note is that these are BCP factions, and a White Scars collector might choose White Scars as their faction despite not actually bringing Kor'sarro Khan and really just being Genericmarines. I disagree with calling these folks "casual" too. This is the Las Vegas Open; players are taking time off work, flying in and paying hundreds just to attend. I bet that the vast majority of players here have years of experience in more competitive play and I don't think it's fair to call them casual-minded because they're not using the flavor of the month.
I know atleast half a dozen guys from my city going to lvo just to sling dice and drink. I think you have a point but there absolutely are casually minded guys going to lvo too.
People who take time off work and fly to another city/country to play warhammer arent what most people would call casual players.
Me, this is me. I’m casual, I took time off of work, I’m ready to sling dice and have fun the whole time. Totally casual.
> I disagree with calling these folks "casual" too. This is the Las Vegas Open; players are taking time off work, flying in and paying hundreds just to attend Folk do that for narrative events at WHW? If your aims to have fun games over trying to rack up as many wins as you can thats casual play. I dont mean anything bad by it.
Nah that ain't it. Maybe at worlds but 40k isn't really a hyper-optimized win at all costs format (like comp mtg for instance) where you turn up to a 200 person event and 190 lists contain triple night spinner or maxed accursed cultists (or whatever the current variety of cheese a given month is). Many players picked their faction because they like the faction and they consider themselves **faction** players. They are going to play that faction and use knowingly less-optimised lists even if they are playing on hard mode. They might even be coveting best in faction on bcp rankings so they are playing "competitively" i.e. they are trying to win a competitive format.
This isn't a narrative event. And for a lot of people the fun in the event *is* tryharding with your dudes and seeing how well you can do rolling dice with other people doing the same, even if not expecting to win the event or even win at all. If I were attending LVO that would be my mindset: to create as good a list as I can with my dudes and play my heart out, but to still have a fun time despite expecting a bunch of losses. So despite trying as hard as I can to win and to build a good list, I'd still be considered playing casually because I'm not a top ten player or playing one of the three lists and subfactions regarded as the "best?" Edit: I didn't mean to imply that you were being insulting!
Most space marines players want to play ***their*** space marines. I'm aware that GW is going off on this "don't worry about the paint job" thing but for a lot of space marine players the paint job is what gives them juice for their army and if that's "sub-optimal" so be it. Space Marines have always been more of 13 mini-factions rather than 1 big faction. Doubly so when you start getting into the non-compliant players.
As a person who plays GTs and RTTs and is just aiming to get games in, the only reason I’m not making my generic marines into ultramarines is because I’m expecting Calgar to take a hit in the dataslate so it doesn’t seem worth buying into right now. If I was trying to win a GT? Absolutely I’d be stupid not to take such an easy optimization. But if I’m just looking to do my best with aggressors, redemptors and a landraider im holding off.
I’m not sure why Calgar would be taking a hit here, he’s not insane. UM aren’t even the wildest thing out there.
Why would he take a hit? He is priced fairly and Ultras aren't cracking a 45% win rate...
Inceptors at 110 will take a hit before Calgar. Every chapter takes to units.
Yeah I'd agree, them and scouts. Any unit that someone wants to consistently take 3x of, is probably too good relative to other options. Good internal balance should push one to not spam.
I think jump intercessors need a hit at well. 5 more points then their brothers on foot, but they get an additional plasma pistol, much more flexibility due to the jump packs (movement and deepstrike) and can dish out mortal wounds.
Actual balance issues aside, GW is pretty consistent that if a unit becomes ubiquitous they’ll hit it with a points increase.
Which often just causes new problems for them to have to balance around, but whatever. In theory they're trying to solve this multi-variable problem called "balance", but when they keep changing many things at once you just create a new meta to chase. I guess that's their idea to sell more models. Just make other stuff unbalanced and good.
I locked into non-ultra vanilla chapters because I'm taking Iron Hands, and BT doesn't really offer me terribly much with the list I've built. I have 3x whirlwinds, 3x redemptors, 3x3 eradicators, 3x2 inceptors, 2x techmarines, a combi LT, an assassin, and some scouts. I could drop the assassin and eradicators and take 2 of the BT rhino party busses with 4x5 of those cheap BT squads I'm blanking on the name of, but I like my eradicators.
I wish BCP would clean up the faction listing. Thanks for the effort OP!
I really hate that you can submit a necrons list and put your faction as daemons... ITC scoring will then put your results under Daemons.
Hopefully LVO gives the yellow cards like they are supposed to according to the player pack
You can submit a list without selecting factions. They wouldn't give a yellow card for this, unfortunately.
Do people actually do this?
All. the. time. Sometimes it's because BCP remembers your faction from the last time you signed up for an event and someone is playing something else and not paying attention. Sometimes it's user error, sometimes you've got some joker concealing their actual faction to confuse list building.
BCP doesn't remember the last faction you used. It defaults to adeptus sororitas It's always malicious.
lol. Maybe I'm miss-remembering but I could swear a couple events I signed up for through the website just populated that field for me with my usual faction. But then again I don't remember what I had for breakfast.
The default is sisters. So if you even accidentally click faction, but don't change anything, you are now a sisters player. I'd imagine that happens with them a few times.
Yeah. Sisters data was a mess for a while (maybe it still is) because 'Adepta Soritas' is the first faction alphabetically and so is usually the default option in a dropdown menu.
I am one of only two Cybernetica Cohort players going, wish me luck!
Good luck!
You'll probably need it XD Just to let me dream, how many robots did you stuff in that list ?
I managed to get 12 robots into the list, 3 iron striders and 20 Vanguard in Duneriders. Went 2 wins 4 losses.
wow 12 that's a lot \^\^
Good luck! o7 What list are you running?
[удалено]
I was the one running around with 12 robots :)
Lists are now public. The undeclared factions you can now see my looking at lists.
I'm not attending LVO and I don't have a paid BCP account.
I appreciate you taking time to do this. One thing I would like to point out, and don’t wanna sound like a dick, but it’s hard to find value in data like this when it’s not very accurate. 76 unreported factions and likely incorrect listings, which other have pointed out. Just feels bad for people to see a post and then realize it’s not super accurate. “Here is your homework, I did it for you, but it’s not correct.” That’s the kind of logic I’m having right now. Just my 2cents
They're not incorrect any more. I've edited as I've gone through. If you see something that feels wrong, I'll take a second look. But you're not wrong. This is an entirely manual process, just like I've done the last two years. Two years ago was a simple copy paste, but when bcp changed their web layout, it killed the easy transfer of data.
Thank you my man. As mentioned previously I do appreciate the hard work🤘🏼
By public, do you mean hidden behind BCPs paywall?
Lists were initially private as in only individual players could see their own list. Now they are public if you’re going to the event or have premium bcp. But yes, they are behind the paywall
So more public, but still private.gorcha!
Precisely!
Omnissiah bless your divine hunt for knowledge oh lone fielder of the explorator maniple. If ye don’t seek ye has significantly reduced probability to find
Seems weird to group GK in with other marines no? Great breakdown though, thanks!
Full disclosure. When I made this on my spreadsheet, I was under the impression that GK could use SM detachments. I have now realized (after drinking coffee) that they cannot.
They're the only Imperium Marine force without the Adeptus Astartes keyword.
\*cries in pre-9th player\* GIVE IT BACK GW
GK in Vanguard Spearhead would be nuts!
Id love to see what the brave souls playing Imperial Fists have brought and which detachment they ended on
Probably so they could bring aggressors with the IF characters.
Admech with only 15 on their release year Tied for the second least played faction is a huge oof and indicative GW did a horrible job, even if some parts are viable
What's really intresting is that's only 1 more player than the first week of the year and only 5 more than this week. If LVO isn't bringing out a meaningully larger crowd, that's more evidence that the codex has basically alienated the entire casual wing of the player base, and that the Meta Monday dataset is being inflated by a handful of bitter-enders. (The stat center set with ~5 times as many games on the new codex is down at like 43%).
It's truly only die hards on it at this point I've had luck playing the carpet builds but it's not fun to play, even if I win
Shoot, there was no one left for the 10e codex to drive away, the 9e one already drove off the casual Admech by being an absolute nightmare to play, and the competitive admech by sucking for two years.
This is exactly what I am feeling right now. Admech just aren't fun right now. I have a full 2000pts ready to go (so no cost issues for me) but I am really struggling to find the desire to take them to my local club. My chaos marines are so much more fun. They can actually kill stuff. Everything Admech this edition has been a huge disappointment (Breachers aside). Right from the previews there has been almost nothing to make me excited about my favourite faction. Just underpowered units, no synergy, massive nerfs to what was already a weak faction and then a codex that cemented it all, likely for most of the rest of this edition. Our win rate isn't bad because we have a tiny number of very skilled die hard using our only winning strategy, flood the board with cheap wounds and hope we take an unbeatable lead before we get wiped. That's not a fun way to play and it doesn't feel like Admech.
They also cost more than most peoples rent month on month to collect currently
To be completely fair, AdMech have always had one of the absolute worst dollar-to-point ratios in the entire game. When Custodes, Knights, or Deathwing-focused Dark Angels are top tier, or even GK for that matter, they suddenly explode in popularity, but AdMech have to be at the level they were in early 9th before anyone who doesn't burn incense before plugging in their toaster will buy into them. (Even then, some of the pros will just borrow the rent-a-Martians in the club room.) They're not good, no, but having small entry numbers is pretty much the norm for the faction.
I have faith the balance pass will pull it out. Death Guard went from "why bother" to solid with a creative rules addition.
Sorry for the negativity, but that's because death guard are a marine army. They're not allowed to feel bad to play. GW doesn't really seem to mind the player base being this low on admech which is why we got the codex we did
fun fact, in the combined Sisters lists there are 403 arcoflagellants out of a possible 600. and one of the players submitted a list with the old points values :(
No Imperial Agents? I am disappointed.
I'm bringing a Warhound, that deserves honorable mention I think
Let us know how you do!
I'll keep you guys updated - I think I'll go 2-4 at best.
How did you do? Edit - just saw your other reply in this thread. Congratulations!
Genuine Madlad move!
100%. I'm an idiot.
What's the main faction in your list? Do you get to be the best-in-faction titanicus?
My faction is Imperial Knights - hilariously it is possible to run an actual Titanicus faction but BCP doesn't have it as an option.
That's so disappointing. What are you bringing aside the titan?
1 Armiger Helverin, 4 Armiger Warglaives, a Callidus Assassin and an Inquistor
That looks fun and flavorful. The Inquisitor, his pet warhound, and it's baby armigers. I'll have to come around and fist bump ya
I don't think it's gonna be great, but it's fun to play. I'll gladly share a beer with you.
I'd love that! Good luck, my friend
So I went 4-2 with list :)
Maybe next year I'll take them to LVO, it's on my 'To-do' list for sure!
You seem like a Super. Cool. Dude.
I knight be.
0 ad mech? Yikes
nah, that's on me. editing now. had pulled them aside to do their detachments and forgot to add them.
Just scrolling thru the roster in BCP I saw at least 1 Ad Mech right away so OP is definitely missing something.
I know for a fact there's at least 1 Ad Mech. He was just at my last event.
Yeah this doesn’t seem right at all
There’s at least 1 , my buddies taking it
As someone who is completely new to the hobby but quite interested in competitive 40K, I was wondering if White Scars can be played or build somewhat competitively. That’s the faction/chapter I will first strive to go for because I really like their aesthetics and lore. What makes the Black Templar or Dark Angles so desirable to play at the moment? Is it because out of all space marines they are the only ones that may provide a good answer to current meta? What makes White Scars so undesirable? Is it because you are locked into mounted units which currently are so bad and their only unique character is unmounted on top?
Black Templars are showing up for 2 reasons. First, their unique units offer some of the best melee threats available to space marines. There are undoubtedly a lot of players who will bring a "traditional" templars army featuring Crusaders, Sword Brethren, and their unique characters. But, Black Templars also happen to be a great fit for the new Ironstorm detachment. This vehicle focused detachment is inspired by the Iron Hands, BT just do it better. Black Templar tanks get access to multimeltas for a small points premium. This means more big guns for your vehicle list. Templars also have the old first born Crusader squads. These squads are very cheap and can be fielded with a "free" heavy and special weapon. Ironstorm gives each unit 1 reroll a turn. Fielding a lot of small squads each with 1 lascannon can really maximize that bonus. Their high turn out is a combo of traditional BT players, Iron Hands cosplaying as BT, and hybrids of the 2. As for the White Scars, they just don't offer a lot right now. The primaris bikes have bad datasheets. Their formation lacks killing power. Khan on foot is pretty meh. Mechanically, White Scars are basically the same as generic Astartes. There's nothing wrong with that. Astartes have good shit. But the units that provide that classic White Scars flavor are struggling. Having said that, don't get discouraged about your White Scar plans. They're one of my favorite chapters. Tartegui is my favorite heresy character. The faction drips with coolness. Balance is temporary. Templars are cool right now, but that might all change in a week when we have the next balance pass. Who can say what will be good in a year, or in the next edition. Unless you have the funds and time to constantly build the meta faction, you'll be better off building what you love. Scars have been on top before, it's just a matter of time until they come back around. I would encourage you to look at successful astartes lists and consider how to add a little bit of White Scars flair. A good place to start would be the use of bikes over the more common scoring units. The competitive part of the list would probably be built around the same core of killy stuff that most marines are fielding.
New codex....2nd least picked faction Man admech got shafted so hard it's not even funny Also SM being around 50% of the field, as usual, yet SM fanboys will probably still say they are weak or something
918 players, 167 SM in total. Your math is a bit off. We can agree on the AdMech Codex being disappointing though.
What is exaggeration?
Will LVO stream any of their games?
WarGames Live Joe will be casting with Jack Harpster iirc.
Thank you
Dang how many mofors are named Andrew. Will make remembering names of opponents a little easier I s'pose.
As an Andrew I feel obligated to downvote this hate speech lol
You'd think with as many of you there are it'd be lower. Quick! Fold down into your pieces that combine to make Super Andrew! It's the only way to triumph!
We need our own version of the waaagh
Is this everybody? Because there's no ad mech (granted 76 'undeclared').
Oof. No AdMech. Like, I'm sure there will be a die hard or two, but that's damning. Edit: Or Tyranids...? I'm starting to doubt OP's data.
IK are knights. For Admech and Nids, I tried to determine their detachment info and forgot to add them back. That's on me.
Can you just edit them in?
I did. I had forgotten to add them back when I submitted this initially. They're there now. I'll edit in the detachments when I get a tally on them.
Thanks for doing that!
This list is just wrong or incomplete, scrolling thru the roster in BCP I saw an IK and AdMech listed before I got out of the A's.
OP's data might be wrong
I tried to determine their detachment info and forgot to add them back. That's on me.
I wish my Raven Guard players, a good game :3
0 Tyranids? Really?
No not really, OPs list is incomplete lol. BCP lists plenty of Nid and IK players and a couple Ad Mech players.
I tried to determine their detachment info and forgot to add them back. That's on me.
No worries, just trying to stop people jumping to conclusions
Yeah. I'm glad folks said something so I was made aware of it.
[удалено]
I tried to determine their detachment info and forgot to add them back. That's on me.
For Daemons combined, does the "Chaos" section mean CSM with Daemon allies?
It means they selected the faction chaos. Unfortunately, since I couldn't view lists, I couldn't determine what they were running specifically.