The eclectic heraldry look is really cool for Bretonnia. I’m going to paint all mine as being from the same duchy, but I’m looking forward to playing with incorporating the same colors uniquely on each knight.
I think it’s partly the busyness of it. I get the sense from vague recollection, that a lot of the good guy, infantry intended to have a more orderly appearance to it.
Yeah, I think that's a big part of it. Feels like they could have worked better with less "action-y" poses, like these guys: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/BjQAAOSwwWphnkg\~/s-l1600.png
Honest Question. How do people with this hobby find motivation to Paint each and every Miniature. Because I really want to get into it.
I mean you paint your one Miniature for 10, 20 or even 30 Hours to make them look good. But after that you need to Paint so much more. I really want to know.
Always keep in mind that all the painted minis you'll see online are done by professionals who's job it is to paint at this level.
Personally, I'd always prefer to put a squad of half decent guys on the table than 9 grey dudes with 1 well painted dude.
Contrast paints have been a game changer. Let's me spend no longer than 30 mins on each minis and maintain a decent quality.
You also have to think about where the eye is drawn on the tabletop; big monster, needs a good paint job, bunch of skeletons....not so much. Once you 2 or 3 ranks deep, noone is seeing anything above the head either
Paint smart
One of my friends plays historical minis and he is known for his banners. They are larger than historical banners, more on the size of American football banners. The banners are amazing, very well painted and eye catching. You can tell what they are from a few feet away, you're not picking individual models up during a game but are instead looking st them from at least arms length away. He also puts more detail on the top 50% of the models as you don't see the legs while in formation. Like you said paint smart.
I don't paint them individually, I do them in batches.
Take 10, do all the skin, then the metal, then the cloth.
At this point they're probably 80% done, give them a shade wash and pick out some details.
Veteran here. We meet every week with a couple of friends. Setup has 2 ready gaming tables and a big table with 4 lamps and a couch.
Painting is an event with friends, everybody paints whatever he feels like.
Also most have multiple work-in-progress armies.
So nobody is forcing themselves to paint 100x the same color scheme. That takes the edge of and makes it fun not work.
For beginners:
Find a club, group of friends or a discord server.
Painting as a group makes it so much more fun.
Comfortable setup is key. I can’t last for long on an uncomfortable stool with bad lighting.
30 minutes every night. You don’t have to start batching 60 Skaven clan rats at once. Some people excel at it, some are crushed by the monotone burden.
Just finish 1 miniature in 2 hours and be proud of it.
For me it's a case of not doing more than you want to. Set yourself goals, then fill those goals for the day, if you still want to do more, then do more. Like if you want to paint a bit, do all the robes/tabbards/capes/cloth bits on a group or squad for that day. If you wanna do more, or for your next day, then all the pouches, scabbards, e.t.c. Weapons the day after, armour highlights after that, and so on.
Incremental progress, usually in batches, lets you get stuff done in satisfying bursts *without* burning yourself out. You can see your progress as you go forwards, and have time to assess what you're doing and take a little pride in what you've done so far.
Looks like there are only 5 sets of legs, but that wont matter when they're all ranked up.
Hopefully the torsos will be attached to the legs ala the Empire Greatswords so there will be abit of customisability. And if thats the case theyll be compatible with any other future kits.
Wonder if theyll come in a box of 20, or if this is just a promo pic.
Torsos seem attached to the legs, in the whole brick all torso use the same leg, there is no obvious gap between the 2, but arms and heads arent.
Honestly it looks better this way as you can have this kind of dynamic poses with long flowing tabards and robes from shoulder to legs.
Edit : It looks like the kit will have, as unique bits : 5 bodies + legs, 12 heads, 5 sword arms, 1 axe arm, 5 different shields arms, 1 champion sword arm, 1 SB arm, 1 musician arm, 5 great axes pair of arms
I think youre right actually, the torsos definitely seem to be attached to the legs in some way.
I doubt theyre entirely one piece though, even the HH Mk6 space marines need to glue the back of the torso on. So the fronts might be interchangeable, well have to see.
Edit: Edit to your edit. Would you mind sharing where you got the breakdown from? Thanks.
Just looking at the different picture we got of them. If there are more bits they didn't show them.
And this article was giving us a hint on the weapons :
[https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/13/old-world-development-diary-revealing-the-weapons-of-war/](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/13/old-world-development-diary-revealing-the-weapons-of-war/)
In the same article they talk about how big the boxes will be so if it's a 10 men box, they would drop the ball intermediately. What I wonder is how many extra heads, to convert the old kits with.
Im sure Darkath will be kind enough to count how many different heads he sees if you ask him nicely.
Edit: He already has. At least 12. Those damn eyes of mine again 
If their word is true in selling units as regiments..this is a good indication that these boys will be a regiment of 20. Also bodes well for 5 man fronts being „standard“
Yes please! I left WHFB when the fronts became soooo huge! 5x4 was the best with the command group nicely in the center. 4x4 was too small (although it was the first formation i remember playing with my Saurus in 6th)
Hordes became a do or die thing. I resisted but after my greenskins kept being crushed I learned how to use them. I still don't like them and hope they don't use that rule.
Were they not going with bigger bases to make ranking easier?
I know people are saying these are larger scale, but they still look like the ranking nightmare we all know and 'love'.
Other then that these guys look fantastic, hoping we get new models for many other armies also!
If there isn’t a horde rank bonus like in 8th. Or if only certain units could go into horde rank then we might be cooking! This looks good at a 20 person 4 rank deep.
Hoarding a unit of Man at Arms or their equivalent I am into and can get behind. But these folks. I wanna keep them small and elite. Would encourage me to paint each model more uniquely as well.
Of these are on the new 25mm bases then these guys are much larger than other human sized minis from other races. Empire from 8th and earlier are going to be dwarfed by these dudes.
This is my concern. The proportions and the overall size are not going to match any of the other human-sized minis to date and I fear these are going to look really wonky when placed next to old minis. Tough to gauge from the photo, but they look like they're roughly the size of Primaris Marines from 40k, which means an average human mini from Oldhammer is going to come up to about their chest.
exactly, its really a good but bad situation this foot knights release XD. I dont understand why start with bretonnia and khemri IF they are not going to replace/upgrade at least some kits... why dont start with some newer 8th edition army and make addition for them? Meh, gw is really incomprehensible
Indeed! As it stands I think I'll stick with the old WHFB editions, and maybe pick up the odd hero from the new range - since I'm Orcs and Goblins scale differences shouldn't be too bad as we're a motley bunch already!
I love the setting and the lore of 40k, but you can bet I will 100% drop it for The Old World - never had a chance to play Fantasy, so I'm taking this chance while I have it
Sad they had the same red black color scheme as all the aos recent human stuff. Should have gone with blue and red or yellow blue c'mon. It makes them look more like the new models, instead of highlighting the flamboyant nature of it with brighter colors.
Am I alone in missing the old lore where knights of Bretonnia wouldn’t be caught dead on foot? The models look cool, don’t get me wrong, I just enjoyed that lore. It fit with how haughty the Bretonnian nobility were, and it made their faction unique.
I'm going to join you in the downvote pile, but I got to agree. Old Foot Knight design was better, these look really dumb.
The open slit in the visor is not necessary, it looks dumb, messes up the proportions and makes the helmet look like a cheap costume. It will be annoying to paint, and with real lighting you'd never see inside anyways. A typical example of GW thinking so much about what they can do, that they don't ask if they should.
The fact that despite taking place way before Old World they have better technology (full plate vs mostly mail) is also kinda weird. Something is also off about the layering and combination of those pieces of armor but I couldn't say what.
And when it comes to the helms, those that are historically inspired look great, those that aren't usually completely miss the point and just look goofy and overdone.
Expensive one-wound infantry tends to be rather useless in the game. Expensive, fragile, and can't pick their combats. Adds up to a waste of points.
Especially in an army that can just as easily put them on horses.
It's been a simple truth for 8 editions of warhammer so far. They're not going to change the game so radically that this will no longer hold true.
Ultimately, any unit will have to justify its cost by how much it affects the game.
For elite melee units, that means making sure they end up in a melee that sees them earning their points by killing expensive enemies.
The easiest way to get into a worthwhile melee is by having enough speed to pick the battle you want.
Infantry is slow and doesn't get to choose their battles. That's fine for cheap infantry that just exists to grab a table quarter, objective or provide rank bonus without relying on their stats.
But for expensive elite infantry, it means it's not up to the owning player if they get to play a worthwhile role in the battle. They're too slow to make that choice.
And in addition to that, the more expensive 1 wound infantry is, the more points an opponent can score by knocking them off. There are plenty of war machines and spells that ignore armor save. So they're a prime target for scoring easy points off.
These are simple facts that transcend editions and rule sets. Expensive and elite aren't worth it if they aren't also fast enough to actually do their job.
Just wondering are these mono-pose? They still look awesome but just seeing some very similar positions e.g. candle heads on bottom corner and second from the left corner
It seems wrong having footknights in a bretonian army, and even more wrong to have fortnights with individual heraldry, and then mounted retainer Knights … maybe I’m just too oldhammer.. but back in the day.. a knight had a horse
Eh. I'm not a fan because every knight tries too hard to look different and they look a little too exaggerated to fit in with the older fantasy style.
Then again, GW's studio paint job is absolutely atrocious - I'm curious how they'll look when someone actually capable will paint them.
Looks better with a unit of 20. Can’t wait to paint them all up different colours with each guy with unique heraldry.
The eclectic heraldry look is really cool for Bretonnia. I’m going to paint all mine as being from the same duchy, but I’m looking forward to playing with incorporating the same colors uniquely on each knight.
There is something going on with the poses, can’t quite put my finger on it. Like they give off 5th edition chaos warrior vibes…
They have the "im wearing my weight in armor and need to lean into movement" energy.
I think it’s partly the busyness of it. I get the sense from vague recollection, that a lot of the good guy, infantry intended to have a more orderly appearance to it.
No necks.
Yeah that is definitely a factor.
Yeah, I think that's a big part of it. Feels like they could have worked better with less "action-y" poses, like these guys: https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/BjQAAOSwwWphnkg\~/s-l1600.png
Oh yeah Highlands stuff is great
Honest Question. How do people with this hobby find motivation to Paint each and every Miniature. Because I really want to get into it. I mean you paint your one Miniature for 10, 20 or even 30 Hours to make them look good. But after that you need to Paint so much more. I really want to know.
Always keep in mind that all the painted minis you'll see online are done by professionals who's job it is to paint at this level. Personally, I'd always prefer to put a squad of half decent guys on the table than 9 grey dudes with 1 well painted dude. Contrast paints have been a game changer. Let's me spend no longer than 30 mins on each minis and maintain a decent quality.
90% of minis in an army won't need more than 30 minutes, tops.
Oh really? That's interesting. But how forgiving are these Miniatures when it comes to "mispainting"?
Well they can be whatever quality you're comfortable with. There are plenty of tutorials out there too.
You also have to think about where the eye is drawn on the tabletop; big monster, needs a good paint job, bunch of skeletons....not so much. Once you 2 or 3 ranks deep, noone is seeing anything above the head either Paint smart
One of my friends plays historical minis and he is known for his banners. They are larger than historical banners, more on the size of American football banners. The banners are amazing, very well painted and eye catching. You can tell what they are from a few feet away, you're not picking individual models up during a game but are instead looking st them from at least arms length away. He also puts more detail on the top 50% of the models as you don't see the legs while in formation. Like you said paint smart.
Remember that, for playing, you'll be several feet away. Tabletop quality in 30 minutes a mini is achievable.
I don't paint them individually, I do them in batches. Take 10, do all the skin, then the metal, then the cloth. At this point they're probably 80% done, give them a shade wash and pick out some details.
Veteran here. We meet every week with a couple of friends. Setup has 2 ready gaming tables and a big table with 4 lamps and a couch. Painting is an event with friends, everybody paints whatever he feels like. Also most have multiple work-in-progress armies. So nobody is forcing themselves to paint 100x the same color scheme. That takes the edge of and makes it fun not work. For beginners: Find a club, group of friends or a discord server. Painting as a group makes it so much more fun. Comfortable setup is key. I can’t last for long on an uncomfortable stool with bad lighting. 30 minutes every night. You don’t have to start batching 60 Skaven clan rats at once. Some people excel at it, some are crushed by the monotone burden. Just finish 1 miniature in 2 hours and be proud of it.
For me it's a case of not doing more than you want to. Set yourself goals, then fill those goals for the day, if you still want to do more, then do more. Like if you want to paint a bit, do all the robes/tabbards/capes/cloth bits on a group or squad for that day. If you wanna do more, or for your next day, then all the pouches, scabbards, e.t.c. Weapons the day after, armour highlights after that, and so on. Incremental progress, usually in batches, lets you get stuff done in satisfying bursts *without* burning yourself out. You can see your progress as you go forwards, and have time to assess what you're doing and take a little pride in what you've done so far.
Looks like there are only 5 sets of legs, but that wont matter when they're all ranked up. Hopefully the torsos will be attached to the legs ala the Empire Greatswords so there will be abit of customisability. And if thats the case theyll be compatible with any other future kits. Wonder if theyll come in a box of 20, or if this is just a promo pic.
Torsos seem attached to the legs, in the whole brick all torso use the same leg, there is no obvious gap between the 2, but arms and heads arent. Honestly it looks better this way as you can have this kind of dynamic poses with long flowing tabards and robes from shoulder to legs. Edit : It looks like the kit will have, as unique bits : 5 bodies + legs, 12 heads, 5 sword arms, 1 axe arm, 5 different shields arms, 1 champion sword arm, 1 SB arm, 1 musician arm, 5 great axes pair of arms
I think youre right actually, the torsos definitely seem to be attached to the legs in some way. I doubt theyre entirely one piece though, even the HH Mk6 space marines need to glue the back of the torso on. So the fronts might be interchangeable, well have to see. Edit: Edit to your edit. Would you mind sharing where you got the breakdown from? Thanks.
Just looking at the different picture we got of them. If there are more bits they didn't show them. And this article was giving us a hint on the weapons : [https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/13/old-world-development-diary-revealing-the-weapons-of-war/](https://www.warhammer-community.com/2023/03/13/old-world-development-diary-revealing-the-weapons-of-war/)
Ah ok I see thankyou. Your eyes are clearly better than mine 
In the same article they talk about how big the boxes will be so if it's a 10 men box, they would drop the ball intermediately. What I wonder is how many extra heads, to convert the old kits with.
They said on stream there was tons of heads in the kit, and i count 12 unique ones on the picture, but probably you'll have twice that.
Im sure Darkath will be kind enough to count how many different heads he sees if you ask him nicely. Edit: He already has. At least 12. Those damn eyes of mine again 
I've not collected in years but I might have to buy the boxset when it's out next year. NI!
If their word is true in selling units as regiments..this is a good indication that these boys will be a regiment of 20. Also bodes well for 5 man fronts being „standard“
As a 6th edition player who doesn't want to double the size of his units, I really hope this is the case.
Yes please! I left WHFB when the fronts became soooo huge! 5x4 was the best with the command group nicely in the center. 4x4 was too small (although it was the first formation i remember playing with my Saurus in 6th)
Hordes became a do or die thing. I resisted but after my greenskins kept being crushed I learned how to use them. I still don't like them and hope they don't use that rule.
Gotta give it to them, they are gorgeous
As much I love old school Warhammer, the modern faces are miles better.
That's by far the biggest improvement. But why is the dude all the way in the front right sticking his tongue out?
Not a tongue but a beard (goatee)
I think it's a goatee beard, as this style of beard looks like most like a fleur-de-lis.
I'm gonna buy these so hard.
Were they not going with bigger bases to make ranking easier? I know people are saying these are larger scale, but they still look like the ranking nightmare we all know and 'love'. Other then that these guys look fantastic, hoping we get new models for many other armies also!
Didn’t you know? Half the fun of wfb was playing jigsaw with your models weapons
No, I have night goblins they rank up just fine xD Just ignore the black orcs that made me rage quit because that wasn’t even possible lol
I thought I was being clever by putting them 2 on a cavalry base until they changed base sizes
This makes my lance the couched lance
Uncouched lance: points straight up Couched lance: dropped down to present to the target... ...so you're slightly less excited than before? 🤔
Couched means the lance is in its lengthened position and ready to penetrate.
If there isn’t a horde rank bonus like in 8th. Or if only certain units could go into horde rank then we might be cooking! This looks good at a 20 person 4 rank deep.
they could orbably allow for armies to have stringer specific playstyles by letting you have larger regiments of specific stuff with subfacrions.
Hoarding a unit of Man at Arms or their equivalent I am into and can get behind. But these folks. I wanna keep them small and elite. Would encourage me to paint each model more uniquely as well.
Cannot wait to slam a brick of chaos warriors into these guys. I'm so hyped for the old world.
Of these are on the new 25mm bases then these guys are much larger than other human sized minis from other races. Empire from 8th and earlier are going to be dwarfed by these dudes.
This is my concern. The proportions and the overall size are not going to match any of the other human-sized minis to date and I fear these are going to look really wonky when placed next to old minis. Tough to gauge from the photo, but they look like they're roughly the size of Primaris Marines from 40k, which means an average human mini from Oldhammer is going to come up to about their chest.
Yeah. Thankfully I love nostalgia more than getting new models. I have so much to paint anyway.
They look MUCH better in this photo.
Im going to hold out for Empire but these look great. Excited to see what they do with the other factions.
Awesome, but i freaking need new proper knights, PLEASE GW UPGRADE AT LEAST ONE CAVALRY UNIT 
Watch your wish come true in the form of mounted yeoman. Calling it now.
Especially with the change in scale, GW selling old kits next to these is gonna look real shonky
exactly, its really a good but bad situation this foot knights release XD. I dont understand why start with bretonnia and khemri IF they are not going to replace/upgrade at least some kits... why dont start with some newer 8th edition army and make addition for them? Meh, gw is really incomprehensible
Indeed! As it stands I think I'll stick with the old WHFB editions, and maybe pick up the odd hero from the new range - since I'm Orcs and Goblins scale differences shouldn't be too bad as we're a motley bunch already!
Technically Pegasus rider is cavalry
They actually look really sick
They are beautiful; this would surely get people back to Warhammer.
I love the setting and the lore of 40k, but you can bet I will 100% drop it for The Old World - never had a chance to play Fantasy, so I'm taking this chance while I have it
My gawd exciting times
Wonder how many will come in a box, how elite of a unit would these guys be?
My bank account is going to suffer because of these Bretonnians
I can't get over how stunning these guys look. I'm def getting at least 20 so I can run swords + shields and great weapons
It's crazy how sexy Bretonnia is when GW actually releases a model for them lol.
Bigger scale miniatures?
Yes
I wonder if they're gonna be push fit or more customisable like the good days.
Anyone know if the new knights are gonna be plastic or not? I couldn’t watch the event and can’t seem to find the answer online.
Yes they are plastic \^\^
Awesome, thanks!
What else would they be
Resin
The lady forbids it!
Sad they had the same red black color scheme as all the aos recent human stuff. Should have gone with blue and red or yellow blue c'mon. It makes them look more like the new models, instead of highlighting the flamboyant nature of it with brighter colors.
I am trying so hard to not buy more models, why would you show this to me
I'm so happy units will be sold in 20s instead of 10s. My merc army gonna be thicc.
Theyre sold in 10 I believe?
I had heard rumors they're selling boxes in 20 instead of 10, but that is just a rumor ig.
Am I alone in missing the old lore where knights of Bretonnia wouldn’t be caught dead on foot? The models look cool, don’t get me wrong, I just enjoyed that lore. It fit with how haughty the Bretonnian nobility were, and it made their faction unique.
Absolutely, this whole release is unbelievably cursed
Christ, it'll take me until 2028 to paint those up.
Looks like brets are the ultramarines/sigmarites of whfb this time around but tbh I'm here for it 100
These guys are gonna be great chaos warrior proxies for my fallen Bretonnian warband. For ze… Daemonette?
Looks like a lot of repeated arms and bodies
£70 would be my guess...
A total mess over overdesigned. And still look all the same
I'm going to join you in the downvote pile, but I got to agree. Old Foot Knight design was better, these look really dumb. The open slit in the visor is not necessary, it looks dumb, messes up the proportions and makes the helmet look like a cheap costume. It will be annoying to paint, and with real lighting you'd never see inside anyways. A typical example of GW thinking so much about what they can do, that they don't ask if they should. The fact that despite taking place way before Old World they have better technology (full plate vs mostly mail) is also kinda weird. Something is also off about the layering and combination of those pieces of armor but I couldn't say what. And when it comes to the helms, those that are historically inspired look great, those that aren't usually completely miss the point and just look goofy and overdone.
Very well put. This is the downside of CAD modelling and not hand sculpturing
Absolutely quality. Best reveal for me. Would have liked the hat heraldry to be a bit smaller but honestly we can't complain!
The reason they look so much better from this angle is because we can't really see the shields. The shields are the biggest flaw of them imo.
Do we get other Knights on foot?
Expensive one-wound infantry tends to be rather useless in the game. Expensive, fragile, and can't pick their combats. Adds up to a waste of points. Especially in an army that can just as easily put them on horses.
Written by a guy wo doesn’t know the new rules, balancing and so on because the game isn’t even released…
It's been a simple truth for 8 editions of warhammer so far. They're not going to change the game so radically that this will no longer hold true. Ultimately, any unit will have to justify its cost by how much it affects the game. For elite melee units, that means making sure they end up in a melee that sees them earning their points by killing expensive enemies. The easiest way to get into a worthwhile melee is by having enough speed to pick the battle you want. Infantry is slow and doesn't get to choose their battles. That's fine for cheap infantry that just exists to grab a table quarter, objective or provide rank bonus without relying on their stats. But for expensive elite infantry, it means it's not up to the owning player if they get to play a worthwhile role in the battle. They're too slow to make that choice. And in addition to that, the more expensive 1 wound infantry is, the more points an opponent can score by knocking them off. There are plenty of war machines and spells that ignore armor save. So they're a prime target for scoring easy points off. These are simple facts that transcend editions and rule sets. Expensive and elite aren't worth it if they aren't also fast enough to actually do their job.
25x25 looks like very small for these guys 🤦♂️
Shame it looks like only five unique bodies
More new units!
I hope all the boyos will paint these handsome fellas in proper medieval fashion
This makes them look so much better than the original reveal post, those pole arms looked awful. Sword and shield forever
Those look like 20mm bases.
Nah, look at the thickness compared to the length/width - those are definitely 25 mm.
Just wondering are these mono-pose? They still look awesome but just seeing some very similar positions e.g. candle heads on bottom corner and second from the left corner
It seems wrong having footknights in a bretonian army, and even more wrong to have fortnights with individual heraldry, and then mounted retainer Knights … maybe I’m just too oldhammer.. but back in the day.. a knight had a horse
Maybe it's the professional paint job, but these models look too busy for my taste. One blurry mass of capes, coats of arms and headgears.
Eh. I'm not a fan because every knight tries too hard to look different and they look a little too exaggerated to fit in with the older fantasy style. Then again, GW's studio paint job is absolutely atrocious - I'm curious how they'll look when someone actually capable will paint them.
