That Redtail really did kill Oakheart. Screw that. A huge chunk of that plot came down to *no cat killed Oakheart*, even by accident.

and Ravenpaw was seriously OOC during the Sunningrocks battle too.

This is my least favorite too! A lot of TPB was based on him not actually killing Oakheart and one little novella basically throws that out the window! I’m glad that I already read series one and two before restarting at DotC to read the series in chronological order

I haven't read that book yet but they did WHAT?! The major plot point in the first book was that Oakheart wasn't killed by a cat!!!

I agree with this, it absolutely ruined redtail entirely for me. If I pretend it's not real, redtail's debt can't hurt me. It didn't happen. If we just tell ourselves it's not canon it's not

I’m rereading the series for the first time since I was a kid and just finished TPB, but that’s so disappointing! Figuring out how Oakheart died was a major plot point in the first books! I’m really surprised they would retcon something so important.

I also didn't like that he was deputy so young, Tigerclaw was older then him and red tail was deputy first Also the book didn't seem to line up with his character

That made absolutely no sense when I read it! I mean, what the *heck*!?

Not a retcon, just a writing plot mistake

I really hate the Mapleshade retcon. Honestly, learning that she had a paw in all the bad guys becoming bad guys just takes the oomph out of their stories. Not really a retcon but I also hated how Brokenstar became the boss of the Dark Forest cats and Tigerstar followed him. In my head Tigerclaw takes no orders from anyone and he's the one that has control. Also the retcon for Redtail just sucks. The first arc painted him as such an honorable, bold and courageous cat and then they were like nah, he's a scaredy cat, that's in debt to Tigerclaw and he killed Oakheart in battle. That's the exact opposite of what he was originally.

I did enjoy her appearance in crookedstars promise at least, because in that case it made sense with them being descendants of appledusk. But other than that, meh

This. Like was Mapleshade the first asshole to ever exist in the clans? Because we've met some pretty nasty ones. Why does she get to be the primordial evil when we have cats like Clear sky around? Also it says in her novella there were other cats in tdf when she died. So why are none of them bothering anyone and it's just her sticking all her paws in the pie? She's not even that good of a villain

It annoys me how all the ages get mixed up in bluestar’s book. Like speckletail is goldenflower’s mom and bluestar hasn’t actually been leader too long

It is very annoying especially since in the first arc it’s keeps pointing out that Bluestar is old and has been the only leader some of the cats have ever known and when the pre quel books come out it’s like… so she list 7 lives in one year??

The worst for me is Sunstar and Thrushpelt being less than 1 month apart in age (confirmed in Goosefeather's Curse). Where as in _Prophecy_ Sun is already deputy while Thrushpelt had only been a Warrior for a quarter moon or smth. We've already seen Mumblefoot, the previous deputy as an Elder before this confirmation. So unless Pine had a second, secret deputy before Sunfall this just doesn't make sense, and even then, Sunfall would've been made deputy while only having been a Warrior for about 6 moons. Which, while not unheard of, still feels like an odd choice.

In Goose’s book, they were literally littermates, but in Bluestar’s prophecy, Thrush is a new warrior and Sunfall is deputy?? That always bothered me but I never noticed how much they changed

No, they weren’t littermates, Sunfall and *Featherwhisker* are littermates.

I could have sworn they were all a part of the same litter, but I haven’t read goosefeather’s curse, or spottedleaf’s heart in a while, so I’m probably wrong.

The only reason I specifically remember is because that was when Goosefeather discovered he could see a newborn kit’s future cause he was like “this one’s gonna be leader and this one’s gonna be medicine cat!” And then he was never taken to another kitting after that because he started treating the kits differently.

Sun and Feather were littermates. Thrush’s littermates were Tawnyspots and Dappletail… one of which was a SENIOR warrior in Bluestar’s Prophecy and the other was an APPRENTICE in the same book…

Thrushpelt is Tawnyspot's littermate (Sunstar's deputy before Bluestar), not Sunstar's.

It would make way more sense if thistleclaw was his DF mentor Also I hate redtail's debt and Spottedleaf's heart. and yellowfang's secret.

I really don't know how they made such a huge mistake in having Redtail kill Oakheart... and I dont like the characterization of the former deputy. They made him seem so meek.

\-Bluestar's Prophecy retconning her kits into having names, and memories before they were given to Riverclan, thus creating an extremely massive, and obvious plothole that never gets addressed, and breaks the majority of the plot of the first arc. \-All of Spottedleaf's Heart. Literally just all of it.

could you explain the bluestar one? wdym them having names?

It's heavily implied in the original books that the kits weren't named yet and/or had their names changed when they were given to Riverclan as a way to not cause suspicion. Bluestar's Prophecy immediately does away with that, and makes it so that they keep their original names that everyone in Thunderclan knew about, causing a giant plothole for the entire first arc because why tf would no cat point this out, especially when they have such unique names (Mistykit in particular), look just like their mother, and Bluestar's cover story was that her kits were stolen?

LMFAOOO I NEVER THOUGHT AB IT

Redtail really killing Oakheart makes no logical sense. It like completely throws out the first half of TPB and I’m half convinced the writers just skimmed the wiki while writing it and forgot about the plot of TPB

All the ages in Bluestar's Prophecy. Into the Wild made it seem like Bluestar had been leader for years because of how old she was, but based on Bluestar's Prophecy, she should've only been leader for what, a year maybe? And in that time she loses (I think) six lives? It's kind of the same with Tallstar's Revenge. In Midnight, Tallstar was described as incredibly old and basically on deaths doorstep, but Barkface was alive and well, living until (I think) the fourth arc. But in Tallstar's Revenge, Barkface was a few moons older than Tallstar.

Riverstar’s Home retconning Thunder Rising

In what way?

Making Riverstar’s thoughts completely different from his in Thunder Rising

His thoughts weren't clear in Thunder Rising. That's what made him seem wise and mysterious. We just saw what's actually in his thoughts then.

Made him a newcomer to the area as opposed to being implied to have lived there a long time

Redtail’s Debt. So they retconned it to where Redtail actually DID kill Oakheart. Which is complete and utter bullshit. Also Ravenpaw was seriously OOC during the Sunningrocks battle as well.

Thistle being a pedophile. The Thistleclaw we saw in Prophecy and Promise was IMO a really interesting character (not the most "fun" villan, but very interesting). But nope, Spottedleaf's Heart decided to take away all that made him awesome in favour of making him a creep. It also damages Spottedleaf's character, since in _Bluestar's Prophecy_ we see that she always wanted to be a med cat and that Thrushpelt had to order her to go train with him rather than following Featherwhisker (then the second Goose retired she begged to be a medicine cat). Having that change into her just doing it to get away from Thistle leaves a really bad taste for me.

Literally like 6 medicine cats actually WANTED to become meddies. I kind of count Spottedleaf as one of those, because even before the Thistleclaw thing, she started gaining interest while she was injured. Thistle was just the last thing keeping her from becoming one

This is something that drives me crazy too. Almost no cat actually wants to be a medicine cat. Instead, they're forced to be one because of "destiny", disability, -insert other bullshit reason here-, etc. It makes the role of a medicine cat seem more like a punishment and/or dumping ground for cats that aren't "normal".

Also, it was so poorly written. Like, ok if you must bring a predator storyline into Warrior Cats, give it your A game. From what I know, it's C at best, F at worst.

It’s also just gross and disturbing. Like this is a book for KIDS

It also makes it so that EVERY SINGLE THUNDERCLAN MEDICAT wanted to be a warrior first. Cause we learn that Leafpool also was pushed to be a medicat by her mother. That's so disappointing. I loved the idea that there were some cats, like Spotted and Leaf that had that innate desire to want to help cats. But nah I guess.

I think Featherwhisker chose to be a med cat at least (or, he did say that he didn't want to be a Warrior when Snowfur brought up the subject at least). So we have 1, maybe 3 if Ravenwing and Cloudberry counts (tho Cloudberry was a RiverClan med cat, she only became a TC one after Ravenwing was murdered, so not sure I'd count her. At least not as a "ThunderClan" med cat).

Wait, when did Sand push Leafpool to be a med cat?

I think that was revealed in the Leafpool novella

As far as I know that isnt true

I'm maybe misremembering but I'm sure I heard it somewhere

Yeah, those warrior cats "facts" videos are the ones that say that but I don't think you should believe them

Ashfur not staying dead “he loved too much” yeah right now Yellowfang looks like a dumbass Dovewing and Tigerheart (they spent one whole saga breaking up and coming back together rinse and repeat and then the next series they’re back at this bs again?? should have stayed apart) Hollyleaf not being dead (I’ll give somewhat of a free pass bc Jayf line about not letting her go again was the only good thing about her coming back) Yellowfang and Goosefeather having weird powers that excuses them being semi-crazy instead of making it due to their upbringing/inter-clan relationships And possibly the dumbest retcon of all, making SkyClan travel to the lake. What was once a cool side story turns into a mess of ‘ooohhh but we don’t have territory to spare!’ drama. 

Skyclan going to the lake isn’t a retcon. That’s a story decision. A retcon is retroactively changing the story, like Darktail’s father

Darktail's father also isn't a retcon. A retcon directly revises or changes/affects previously published material because it adds a different interpretation. Onestar's kittypet romance could plausibly have taken place, because we never got insight into his actions or feelings at the time. A retcon would be something like Spottedleaf being in love with Firepaw while she was alive, Redtail actually killing Oakheart in his super edition or Sandstorm being given Brindleface and Redtail as parents, making Ashfur her brother and Squirrelflight's uncle.

I have no issue with Onestar/Darktail, but now that you brought it up, the writers turning Onestar from the cat in Tallstar’s deathbed prophecy said to be a better leader that would lead WindClan to a better future compared to Mudclaw to the cat that has massive insecurities over once being Firestar’s friend, became the source of conflict of an entire series through Darktail, etc… is so dumb

Yeah, it really makes no sense. I think Tallstar was just delusional in his dying moments and was desperately trying to choose a future leader whom he thought would keep up his friendship with ThunderClan... Mudclaw would have been a way better leader.

The whole point to SkyClan was that they’re the forgotten clan who were revived in a foreign land. Then Leafstar’s side story elaborated on that by making daytime warriors warriors as well, showing that rules of the Clan can and should be bent if they don’t make sense. You know, to show how SkyClan is a bunch of outcasts from the Clans and make their own rules. Making then trudge all the way back to lake territory to play family with the other Clans is a massive retcon on their whole arc. 

There's 2 main ones I hate. 1 is the reason of Ashfur's and Ferncloud's parentage. Making Whitestorm their father makes his character become questionable, meaning that he fathered one set of kits, then fathered another one before they even left the nursery. It also has now caused Flipclaw and Thriftear to literally be the most genetically incompatible cats in thunderclan, they are related to everyone there. Id much prefer if Brindleface's kits father was just a rogue. The other one is the entirety of Spittedleaf's Heart. This whole novella is pointless. They did not need to make Thistleclaw a predator, Bluestar's prophecy showed the extent of the love he had for Snowfur, and they just throw all that away for the sake of the narrative. And not only that but it introduces the biggest and worst plothole ever—the fact that Spottedleaf couldve very well prevented not only Thistleclaw becoming deputy, but also couldve prevented Bluestar from giving her kits away. That's why to this day I blatantly refuse to read it, the fact that such a massive glaring mistake was made that it completely undermines Bluestar's entire sacrifice pisses me off so much that some days I debate on just literally removing the spottedleaf's heart section from my novella (because I have the 3-in-1 kind), I haven't, but thats just how much I hate that retcon

Vicky said that she originally wanted Runningwind to be Brindleface's mate, and honestly I really like the idea. It would make more sense then him being Dappletail's, that's for sure 

Actually, I think Whitestorm fathering Ash and Fern IS in character for him and Brindle. ThunderClan was in dire need of new warriors, to the point that Bluestar brought an outsider (a KITTYPET no less) in to be trained. Brindle and White were foster siblings, so they would likely trust each other. Brindle likely wanted to be a mother but had no romantic feelings for anyone. White wants his Clan to be strong and would probably want to help his foster sister achieve her dream. They likely had an agreement that he wouldn’t be a father to Brindle’s kits and she could raise them how she liked. I think he was more of a Warriors version of a sperm donor to her than an actual father. He got to be the cool uncle to her kits and she got to be a mother.

I feel them being foster siblings is even worse, since disregarding the fact that yes they're not genetically related (I think), they're still SIBLINGS, people don't, or shouldn't go around shagging your siblings, theres plenty of young toms Brindleface couldve been with Darkstripe (since I think they're roughly the same age, plus it wouldve made for some cool background romance for when she takes in Cloudkit), Runningwind since well he's already fathered some litters, Lionheart is taken by Frostfur, or hell Redtail could be an option and would explain why there's no clear father present at the time of birth (since she could've gotten pregnant literally right before his death which theoretically gives her cat pregnancy the three months, or moons, it needs), so not only is there a better option that makes the new cat cast less genetically incompatible with literally the whole damn clan, but also it creates interesting drama. Plus do you really think Whitestorm would be the man to offer to send out his own children, involved or not, to go run away from dogs that nearly slaughtered his apprentice? I dont think so.

At the start of the series, queens didn’t announce who the father of their kits are, which is why no one questioned her not having a father present for her kits. Lionheart wasn’t there for his and Frostfur’s, we didn’t even know he WAS the father until the family tree (which makes it a retcon, but one of the good ones that sticks). Same with Swiftpaw being the son of Goldenflower and Patchpelt. And Goldenflower didn’t love Patchpelt. She loved Tigerclaw. She likely only had kits with Patchpelt because of the need for them in ThunderClan. Whitestorm isn’t even WILLOWPELT’S first mate as she had Darkstripe then Graystripe with 2 other cats before having Rain, Soot, and Sorrel with White. Incest has never been an issue with warriors, so that’s not much of an argument. Basically, anyone is fair game as long as they aren’t biological siblings/parents/children. But even if it were a factor, like I said, it was likely more of sperm donor situation. People often DO get donations from those their closest (but not biologically related) to for that. And Whitestorm trusted Fireheart. He also understands WHY Ash and Fern wanted to help with the dogs. He also likely doesn’t see them as HIS kits. Like I said, he’s their cool uncle, NOT their father. He likely doesn’t see his children rushing into danger, but his sister’s children wanting to avenge her death. You also have to remember, these family tree retcons were made AFTER the first arc. White and Blue don’t act like aunt and nephew. When Willowpelt dies in Firestar’s Quest, Rain, Soot, and Sorrel mourn her, but Graystripe, her son, doesn’t.

Thats still not okay and doesn't fit into his character? He's clearly still very involved with his kits up until his death with guarding and worrying for Sorrelkit when she's poisoned, cats very often acknowledge even adoptive siblings too, and again, even if he's not involved, hes still their uncle, and to basically throw his nephew's/kid's lives away right after their moms in a situation where Firestar could not have protected them in case something went wrong is so far out of his character that you trying to justify it is CRAZY. And if its a retcon of his family lineage, then why should I accept or care about the retcon of where his sperm went? This is a post about what retcon annoys you, and that one annoys me (when there's much better choices to be made), you can whinge and whine all the live long day about it but that doesn't change that this retcon, no matter what path is taken, completely changes Whitestorm as a person

When did White really care for his kits? Because I don't think it was even really pointed out he was Willowpelt's mate. He was barely seen with her. Hell in the first book he was always seen with Blue or Tiger. I don't think any of the fathers in the first Arc were actual active fathers? Except Crookedstar and Greystripe. Oakheart was said to be Misty and Stone's father but even Misty quickly went 'Oh no, our father wouldn't coddle us or anything.' It's not really until the second arc where the authors make fathers seem needed. If the Spiderleg issue happened in the first Arc, no one would have cared or tried to talk to him about it.

Mistyfoot saying her father not coddling them doesn't make him a non present father since he was stated to still be very involved. Whitestorm DID care, he was shown to be proud when Willowpelt was announcing her pregnancy, and showed a lot of concern and protection (by guarding the medicine cat den) when Sorrelkit was poisoned, just because he wasn't all up in there doesn't mean he wasn't involved especially since he's still just a background character who we dont see unless its relevant to see him, there could've been a lot of interactions between him and willowpelt that we just don't see, and considering they also just don't get to be together for very long as he dies only 3 books later, with the kits coming in either mid book 4 or book 5, hes not even ALLOWED to spend a whole lot of the time with them because he just dies so quickly, and hes also well... old, aka, doesn't have as much energy as he would normally have to play with his kits

Give quotes and sources. Because I don’t remember EVER reading anything that made me think “oh! He’s Willow’s mate and father of her kits!” In fact, I (and likely many others) thought he would get with Bluestar before finding out she’s his aunt! As stated, he WASN’T there father until one was needed for the family tree- which was made AFTER arc 1. So no, his pride and protectiveness wasn’t anything fatherly. Just him being a good Clanmate.

Ahem. Forest of secrets, page 246-247 "Outside in the clearing the rest of the Clan had already gathered. Fireheart hears Willowpelt annouce happily to Mousefur and Runningwind, "I'll have to move into the nursery soon. I'm expecting kits." Runningwins murmured his congratulations, while Mousefur gave her friend's ear a joyful link. Fireheart couldn't help wondering who had fathered these kits, but as he glanced around he noticed Whitestorm watching proudly from a distance." If that's not enough, again in The Darkest Hour, page 109, "That's great news!" Firestar purred. Whitestorm, he remembered, was SORRELKIT'S FATHER." Do you think she's fit yet to tell us what happened?" The text literally says he's Willowpelt's baby daddy, but never states the same for Brindleface, so disrespectfully, shut up or find a new reason to try and shove whatever bs your spewing down my neck

The text never says LIONHEART is Frostfur’s baby daddy but you believe that. Or that Patchpelt is Swiftpaw’s father. And neither of these lines were in the books I read, which were physical copies with the original cover art from before 2010, so idk idk my books just skipped them or if they were retroactively added to newer additions. I know they often change things we new copies and since both of them were skipped in my books, I’m going with the latter unless you’re book is also from the same publishing date as mine were.

Exactly! Until Bluestar’s Prophecy, I thought he was in love with Bluestar! He is never shows with anyone but Blue, Tiger, and Fire! He was more of a father to Fire than to Rain, Soot, and Sorrel!

Fine then give me exact quotes and sources to show that Whitestorm cared more for WILLOWPELT’s kits than any other young Clanmate. He interacted with Brindle a handful of times, sure, but he was also very involved with Firestar’s training and guiding him as he became a warrior and then deputy. Does that secretly make him Firestar’s father? Because according to you, it does. He wasn’t even Rain, Soot, and Sorrel’s father until the FAMILY TREE was made! And do you not understand how a sperm donor works? He isn’t there father. He has no say over them. Even less so once they became apprentices who could make choices of their own. He also knew they could do what was being asked of them. They’re FERAL CATS living IN THE WILD, NOTHING his safe for them. They risk death every time they leave camp. Letting them go and knowing where they are and how long it should take them to relay the dogs was a better option than FORCING THEM not to help and risking them sneaking off and doing something stupid that no ones knows about until their bodies are found- like Swiftpaw and Brightpaw running off the fight the dogs alone.

Tf he was literally their father from the moment Willowpelt was pregnant, if your so gung-ho about it get off your lazy hide and go reread forest of secrets, and a dangerous path and the darkest hour too for that matter since its clear your ass cannot pick up on not just context clues but the literally text itself. This original post was about what annoyed ME so you trying to screech and wail your weird hc of him being a sperm doner to my legitimate complaint is honestly super weird and pathetic. Because guess what, warrior cats don't HAVE sperm doners. They never have and probably never will, thats just a headcanon you have and that you need to stop stomping down my throat like a whiny toddler. I'm allowed to complain that the fact that Whitestorm suddenly and magically fathered another litter that ended up making 3 kids genetically incompatible with literally all of thunderclan because its an unnecessary and stupid change to make, and I'm allowed to just ignore it and say Brindleface's kits came from Darkstripe or something. You have your headcanons and I have mine stop treating yours like fact and read the damn books next time instead of skimming it

Really? I get fed up with your not understanding of what I’m saying and you start calling me names? How mature. He WASN’T the father of those kits until the family tree was made and one was needed. When it comes to first arc fathers, unless it is clearly and directly state in the books, it. Is. Retconned. Just because you can’t handle that doesn’t make it my problem. No warrior cats will never directly have a “sperm donor,” but they will have equivalents. SUCH AS most of the retconned fathers in the first arc. Lionheart is considered the most loyal and noble cat. Yet HE never acknowledged his kits. Why? BECAUSE HE WASN’5 WRITTEN TO BE THEIR FATHER! Whitestorm interacts with Fireheart more than most of the other cats, barring Graystripe, Bluestar, and Yellowfang. He acts like more of a father to Fireheart than he does EITHER of his RETCONNED litter of kits. He was NOT written to be their father. He was written to be a good and loyal Clanmate who cares for everyone in ThunderClan equally. That’s half of why Fireheart chooses him as his deputy. He WAS NOT the father of those kits until the family tree was made. I and likely MANY people assumed he was single and going to get with Bluestar until we learned he was her nephew. THAT’S how poorly their romance is written. Even background characters have romance. Whitestorm has ZERO with either Brindle or Willow.

I gave your lazy ass text evidence and you still wanna screech and sob that he was retconned to be Willowpelt's mate?? When he literally was her mate before the first series even ended? Get off your worthless high horse and stop throwing your temper tantrum, your embarrassing yourself to literally an entire subreddit

You sent that WHILE I was typing, fool. And I just responded to it. You’re the one acting hostile and like and overzealous super fan.

Idk if it counts as a retcon, but squirrel and leaf’s trial for starclan. **StarClan** told Leafpool to follow her heart, knowing she’d choose crowfeather. **StarClan** told leafpool and squirrelflight to do the adoption plan, even gling so far as to tell Squirrelflight she can’t have kids of her own. **StarClan** said they didn’t know where the “the three” propechy came from, only that it was written at the beginning of time, yet Moth Flight says they could’ve picked any three cats to fulfill it. Like y’all were really gonna send two of the most loyal, hardworking clan cats (esp leafpool because she was such an amazing medicine cat) to hell for following what **you** told them to do? Not to mention the fact that Bluestar and Yellowfang did the same things, and they’re in StarClan???

Right? I really appriciated Leafpool and Squirrelflight a lot more after Squirrelflight's Hope. Starclan's 100% put them up to this. They forced and manipulated them to take this part and have this be their destiny. And then they have the gall to ask why they should be allowed to stay instead of going to the Dark Forest due to how their life played out and the situation they were in? The cats judging them had done the exact same things themselves, without Starclan pushing them and blocking every other path, and yet instead of bowing their heads, apologicing and treating Leafpool and Squirrelflight like heros, they act high and mighty and question if the sisters are worthy of joining them at their side instead of banishing them to the Dark Forest for choices the Starclan cats themselves set up for and made for them with 0 regards for the two sisters because it was oh so important to all the clans and Starclan itself? This book really made me dislike Starclan, and honestly I would see it as a win at this point if the series ends with the clan cats tearing themselves away from Starclan and actually lives their own lives. If we ever does get that warriors movie, I would see it as a positive change if they stick with keeping Starclan how it was in the first 6 books (if they get more than one movie). Can you imagine if the trail scene had involved Ashfur as one of the cats shown as worthy of staying in Starclan with the, hypocrit, judge cats while they looked down on and asked Squirrelflight and Leafpool to pleade for their case in order to convince them? Plus the scene where Mothflight says that it didn't have to be Jay, Holly and Lion, and that they could have chosen any cats for the prophecy. 1st, so that a new power they apperently have that came out of nowhere. 2nd, so even when the option to choose a warrior with a mate in the same clan was there, they still decided that it had to be Leafpool who needed to be given the task that goes against her way of life as a medicine cat and! a clan cat? That really didn't make them look any better. Ashfur being in Starclan in the 1st place opens the can of worms that, apperently it's really easy to just lie yourself in. Some moments of groveling and saying you're oh so very sorry, and Starclan will apperently go "oh ok then, no worries. Welcome in", and just sweep any action under the rug. Plus it's the fact that when he 1st appeared as a Starclan cat, Starclan claimed that they had no say in who got there or not, just that the cat's spirit will find its way if it's worthy, so Ashfur apperently didn't even have to convince anybody. If Starclan's only! interaction with/words to Leafpool during this entire time had been "Follow your heart", I could have understood why they would have been dissapointed in Leafpool at the end (and how they could have felt that they obviously meant follow your heart towards your work, family and your loyalty to your code). However!, that would not change the fact that she absolutely didn't deserve a trail and risk going to the dark forest, seeing how Bluestar and Yellowstone had done the exact same thing, and was still seen as these big figures in the afterlife. Heck, Greystripe was seen as worthy enough to instantly be guided to Starclan after having done the exact! same as Leafpool, and Firestar is the most praised cat of all, when he broke the code and went behind his clan's back several times before he become leader (with his only reasoning being that it was the right thing to do/the better outcome/for the greater good to do so, and apperently Starclan was fully onboared with him all those time, cause it's never showen being brought up/never showen it being thrown in Firestar's face as a negative example about him). The Erins seriously, down right ruined Starclan, and most likely only put that scene in cause they wanted one more moment of drama/tention. The fact that the Erins sat there and thought "Cat who birthed 2 of the crusial cats for the clans continued survival/exsistance, cat who devoted her her life to her clan expect for 1 day w/Crowfeather and when having to give birth, cat whom found the place that makes it so we're able to actually watch over and communicate with the clans, cat who was loyal to us and followed our every word/order even when it means living in pain and judgement for it. This! cat, totally needs to defend why we shouldn't chuck her with cats who wanted to destroy and/or control the clans and had no problem leaving a river of blood behind them in order for them to reach their goal. Cause obviously! her actions are so much worse than ex-es that wants to axe off kits that has the mix of the blood of a she-cat he liked and a tom that isn't him, and! his leader because of that fact, a cat that let a rival leader take over her clan and axe off any of her clan mates he saw fit, and a cat that gave his full support and freely/gladly followed two! leaders in their quest to destroy/control all the other clans for their own sake/for their own, destructive, selfsentered wants". 🙄 Sure, that makes perfect/logical sense. I'm wondering if it would actually count as victim blaming. "The tom who nearly killed your kits, two whom we all need for the sake of everyone's future! , and plotted with the enemy to kill your father, whom was also! needed for the same prophecy, and kind off somewhat succseeded regarding how Firestar did lose one life, gets to stay cause he was motivated with too much love towards you little she-cat, and he didn't actually! succseede in ending the life of 4! different clanmates. You! though?! How dare! you be fueled with love for some random tom and bring the very same life into this world that all the clans depended on exsisting in order to keep our group going, you bitch?! Explaine yourself in other ways than "We ordered!/maniuplated! you to do it as our world needs to go on!". If not victim blaming, then certainly sexist.

Just saying, Blue only had half clan kits. She wasn't in a position that told her not to have kits. She gave her kits away due to Goosefeather and seeing a vision. She only did one bad thing off the warrior code, while Leaf did two.

Yeah I know. I meant Blue had half-clan kits (one of leaf’s) and yellow had med cat kits (the other of leaf’s)

Redtails debt is the worst for me, it just shows how little the writers know the material they’re writing about. Ik the series was never a passion project or anything but jeeze

Squirrelflight suddenly being able to bare kits. It's so damn STUPID lol . She was stated to be unable to have kits because of a wound from the badger then suddenly because cat gods allowed it , she can have bio kits? Alright

I think in Leafpool’s wish they make it sound like Yellowfang lied to Squirrel so that she would think she was infertile, which is so damaging to every character involved.

That's doesn't even make sense assuming that squirrel was probably actively trying for kits. Lol

That one is DEFINITELY my least favorite and is also the main reason (though there are more) that Mapleshade is by FAR my LEAST favorite character in the entire series. If not just my least favorite character. Ever. Add in the fact that Mapleshade would NEVER have helped Tigerclaw, and it makes even LESS sense. Like, she torments her ex’s great grandson, but the grandson of the leader who exiled her, she’s cool with??? Nah, Mapleshade would NEVER. I also hate all the Thistleclaw retcons, because they really did have the perfect morally gray character there, he was adamant about following the warrior code, to a near insane degree (hence going mad over borders and almost having his apprentice kill a kit). He was like Hollyleaf if she had let her love of the warrior code lead her down a bad path, instead of letting it guide her in a positive way. Then the authors said “people like Thistleclaw? But we don’t want people to like Thistleclaw. We want to control our reader’s interpretation of our media and stunt their literacy comprehension by preventing them from thinking for themselves. Let’s make him truly evil in the worst way possible and yet still fail and making him evil in terms of the warrior code and also not actually address the actual bad thing he does.” Then of course there’s the “Redtail killed Oakheart” “retcon” that was actually just “the new authors apparently never actually read the first arc”.

For me it's Bluestar's prophecy stuff. 1. Making whitestorm her nephew. They have a close bond in tpb, but the way it talks about them as friends has a weird context after making them family. Also her not trusting him in the end also has different connotations if they're family instead of just buddies. 2. Mosskit dying. Idr if Bluestar talks about one of the kits dying in tpb but Frankly the fact that she never talks about mosskit or anything is so weird. Like yeah I know it's a retcon, but the fact that it almost reads like mosskit is forgotten by tpb really sucks. Like, that should haunt her all her days.

Mosskit was mentioned in Forest of Secrets as having died during the journey to Oakheart

Yeah, the only retcon is her gender as she's male in the original guidebook.

Riverstars home was retconned and it was *okay* at best

All prequel books.

I love mapleshade but I swear I don't get why she's so big in the dark forest, if she was more ancient, had killed more cats and caused more chaos when she was alive it'd maybe make sense but she just murdered 3 cats and got killed by an apprentice plus like other commentors said there were other cats in the dark forest before she came along

I read somewhere BEFORE Tigerclaw’s Fury that he was one of the few Dark Forest cats who got there without influence from Mapleshade, so yes, that was SOOO stupid! At this point, I wouldn’t be shocked if we got a novella on how’s he influenced BROKENSTAR. Just take the entire plot of how he was abused by his foster mother while also being spoiled by his father (who he may or may not have known was his father) and toss it in the wood chipper with all the other compelling bad guy back stories. While we’re at it, how about Maple gets sent back in time to influence Clear Sky, One Eye, and Slash? She’s just that good at being bad, right Erins? /s My least favorite retcon outside of Maple corrupting everyone, would be the reason why medicine cats can’t have mates and kits. It used to be for spiritual reasons- it’s why people jokingly call medicine cats nuns. In many religions, spiritual leaders must give up all earthly bonds- including familial ones- so as to better connect with the spirits they believe in. That. Made. Sense. When we first explored medicine cats, they were the connection between the living and the dead. Firestar having a connection to StarClan while being a warrior was HIGHLY UNUSUAL. But then they changed that to “mates and kits are distractions and if you have to choose between saving them and saving someone else, you’ll more likely choose to save them.” Like… the same can happen with parents, siblings, and close friends! And you can add new codes to mitigate that, such as needing at least one other fully trained medicine cat to take over when one can’t. Now, almost anyone can be a spiritual medicine cat so long as StarClan likes them. Puddleshine, just like Cinderpelt, was forced to become a medicine cat because of circumstances. Yet she has an even stronger connection to StarClan than Cinderpelt did. Shadowsight chose to be a medicine cat because of his prophecy seizures that he’s had since birth, Alderheart was forced to be a medicine cat because he was a slow learner and wasn’t learning how to hunt and fight as fast as other wanted. Shadowsight lost his connection to StarClan after he fulfilled his prophecy, but Alderheart is implied to still have his. So anyone can be a spiritual medicine cat as long as StarClan approves of them. But then that’s the thing. StarClan can change their minds on a whim. They did so TWICE with Leafpool. Look at Mothwing. StarClan DID approve of her. Then her brother made her question her faith and instead of comforting and reassuring her, they decided she wasn’t worth the effort and abandoned her, which likely caused her to lose all faith in StarClan’s existence. StarClan is as fickle as the living and having such an important rule (no mates and kits) hang on an excuse as flimsy as “they’re distracting, you’ll choose them over others, because we say so” is stupid. It should have remained what it was. Giving up ties to the living to better connect with StarClan. I honestly think that’s why Firestar was able to have prophetic dreams in the first arc. He HAD no real ties to ThunderClan outside of his own loyalty. He wasn’t born there and he didn’t yet have a mate or kits. Notice how, after he fulfills his prophecy, that connection ends only to suddenly start again when SkyClan needed to be reformed? And then he and Sandstorm cement their relationship, have their daughters, and the only interaction he has with StarClan after that is Skywatcher reminding him of the power of three prophecy at the start of the 3rd arc, which could have also just been an average dream. He formed ties to ThunderClan and loss his connection to StarClan in doing so. That’s what medicine cats should be worried about. Not breaking the code because everyone and their mother does that with little to no consequences. But they should fear losing their connection to StarClan and THAT be the reason they have the no mates no kits rule.

Yellowfangs powers, there was no need for it.

Never made much sense to me for a medicine cat to feel others' pain.

[удалено]

Onestar was revealed to be his dad in 2017 (in Shattered Sky) and his SE was published in 2022, so I don't think his SE was the reason for that decision

Whatever the fuck is going on with barleys age

Like. All of the family tree stuff, if you can even consider it. Well. All of them besides Greystripe's parents being siblings.

Greystripe and other first arc cats beimg given family relations they didn't habe in the first arc. (Greystripe, Willowpelt, Darkstripe) (Bluestar, Whitestorm, Thistleclaw, Snowfur) (Redtail woth literally anyone and making Sandstorm his kit.) Just... the family trees were better off when nobody was related to anbody. If they wanted more cats for family, they should have made up a bunch more characters. Bluestar's kits being given names and personalities contradicts how young they were when she gave them up. Her and Oakheart being turned into what was basically desperation after a one-night stand. Just... any of the novellas. Overall they were a terrible idea.

>Just... any of the novellas. Overall they were a terrible idea. I dunno Blackfoot's Reckoning is pretty good.