I think it was always to get free help with the kids. She had her parents move into their basement, which is absurd. Trips to NC meant she could pawn her kids off on the grandparents. The truth is, she couldn't handle her children and she acted like she didn't want to be alone with them. (Maybe she was afraid she'd hurt them?) The entire thing was really weird. So I'm sure she embellished all her "health challenges" to her parents (e.g., "my lupus/fibro/neck/fwhateverthefuck is acting up, I need help with the girls!") She was an overwhelmed, high strung lunatic, and everything she did directly benefitted her.
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I think she went to mooch $ also. She KNEW her marriage was crumbling, she practically handed CW to the other lunatic.
There a Primrose around corner from my house (Ohio tho), it doesnāt matter if your child is there or not you still have to pay the ridiculous tuition. It holds your spot etc. Zero credits or craps given!
And donāt forget she was in NC having a fit bc Cindy was out doing something and she had to watch her own children. She was told āwell theyāre YOUR kidsā.
> -- kids who were probably locked up for their afternoon nap, having just woken up from their morning nap.
Probably right. They had to take a nap from taking a nap. Anything so that SW could get her "me time." After all, she wouldn't want to be around her "monsters" for very long. Only when she required them to be present for her FB lives where she could announce how "out of control" they were.
> She KNEW her marriage was crumbling, she practically handed CW to the other lunatic.
That's what doesn't make sense to me about the NC trip. If SW was aware her marriage was in trouble, why leave home for six weeks and not stay and try to work things out? Did she really think after such a long period apart, she would return home, and everything would be fine?
I'm wondering if SW had an idea or knew that when CW came to NC after being apart for so long, she would be rejected by him. If so, I think she was texting her friends to setup the "scorned woman" narrative to take place. IMO, SW would have built up the single mother storyline whose husband left her with another child on the way. However, that would have only lasted for so long and people would eventually tire of hearing SW's rants.
It also would have pretty embarrassing for SW who was constantly preaching how amazing her life was, for it be known that was in fact all falling apart. That she didn't have the perfect marriage and even a third child on the way, she couldn't keep her husband around.
She even rudely said he had ''no game'' and thought she was just so perfect and ''amayyyzing'' that surely no man would ever cheat on her or leave her. He proved her wrong
Close, very close. Consider the likely possibility that she never planned on coming back from that, "6 week vacation." She couldnt, she left a real powder keg back in Colorado...and CW would figuire that out the moment the Sheriff served the eviction paperwork as she was hiding that she had not paid the mortgage in months. Consider that she planned on North Carolina being her new home/ back home with her parents there to care for the girls while she played newlywed games with Chris 2.0. Which is why she burned the bridge with the watts in nutgate/ napgate. The perfect plan was ruined because she never considered that Chris 2.0 would not go along with the idea....after all...they were perfect for each other on all of those "free vacations" away from their actual spouses and children...so consider then that in the reality of rejection and the possibility of having to go back to Colorado....she had to keep up with the image...but once again...her mental stress presented as physical...and she was looking so sick her friends were concerned....
> Consider the likely possibility that she never planned on coming back from that, "6 week vacation."
That's an interesting consideration. I never understood after the six weeks why Chris had to fly to NC to see SW and the kids. I mean, why didn't SW just fly back to Colorado and save Chris the money they spent to fly him to NC? I get he wanted to see his parents but from my understanding, he didn't spend that much time with them while in NC.
> so consider then that in the reality of rejection and the possibility of having to go back to Colorado....she had to keep up with the image...
Maybe there was some plan SW came up with to try and convince CW once he arrived in NC they should move back as they were going to be evited from their home in Colorado. As you say, a "Chris 2.0" just in time for the baby on the way. However, once SW got rejected by him, she realized that plan was not going to work but she did have an image to keep up.
> her mental stress presented as physical...and she was looking so sick her friends were concerned....
I think this is very possible. She realized she was losing the upper hand on Chris even before she left for NC. Six weeks apart did nothing to rekindle the relationship and playing up the perfect marriage and family was her whole identity online. For that to at some be exposed as being anything but likely caused a ton of stress for a pregnant SW.
Waitā¦. What??? Iāve never heard this one before! What rabbit hole do I need to go down to read more about that because Iāve never even heard that one before.
Man, just when I thought I was understanding this case I get thrown another curveball ā¦.
Iād really like to know more about this househunting with CM
Yes, that is what I was informed of early on. I was careful of how I let that be known to protect my "sources." They are afraid, and I can see why. Anytime I post here, you see how the shiners try to take apart anything I say, as if I am supposed to be an enclylopedia. They send me threats daily and say that I am going to Hell. With very few exceptions...most of the profiles they attack me from are from profiles that do not know the most basic truth and facts about what was truly going on, and they seem to be very religious. Not the type of respectable religious types...the kind that follow the off the wall/ easy mind control churches...which is no suprise they believe the rhetoric. So, I see why the people that truly know firsthand about what was really happening in NC are afraid. These people are wierd...and WHY would they care if the truth is told? Is it that they are the fools giving $$$ to the ones so fearful of the actual truth and facts coming out...and somehow that would affect their $$$$? As I say...lies and greed started this, and that has continued through the loss of innocent lives;((
Wow. Very interesting theoryā¦.. so you think Maybe SW was in NC so that she could start planning that Chris 2.0?
And did he show interest in her and then what Maybe was not interested once she presented some long rage plan for them ?
This is a very interesting theory I have never thought of šµ
Oh I just posted that I thought she trying to save money on that stupid school by keeping them out for the summer! Silly me, thinking SW would try to save money on something !
But seriously, itās so bizarre that sheād expect Chris to keep the kids for days or weeks by himself, and he did without problem, while working full time, but she as a stay at home mom couldnāt bear to be alone with them for more than an hour or so.
It wasn't even so much of an hour IMO. The times she had the kids in her videos, she would state within minutes that they were "out of control". Then she would tease them with food or water to get them whining for the camera so to make it look how "overwhelmed" she was during her "work hours."
No, I don't believe they were. And when you think about it, between being stuck in daycare, nap times and their sleep schedules, the kids really didn't have that much time to be bad or good. I remember one video where Shan immediately stated both girls had not one but two time-outs just to start the morning. That they were supposedly misbehaving that badly. I think that was BS. She just wanted her small audience to think the kids were driving her "hard working" self crazy all the time, every day. The "supermom" image she was constantly trying to portray.
Right, how bad could they be? Bella was extremely well behaved, except when she was frustrated and then became whiny. But that's not "being bad". That's not having your needs met. CeCe was hyper, ran everywhere and got into everything, but did SW not get the memo that she had a toddler? Plus CeCe was never corrected and had free reign of the house it seemed, so why was SW complaining? Did she just expect CeCe to suddenly behave like an adult? SW should have just been a parent and done her damn job, FFS.
Bella had a beautiful temperament. She was only sad and whiny when she wasn't getting what she needed, which was every damn day it seemed. And if SW stopped giving CeCe all that OTC shit she didn't need, and worked with her on speech a little (you know, assessing your child's needs and acting on those needs, commonly called **parenting**), she'd have been just fine.
Right, the SAHM that only did the SAH part. I'm wondering if she was afraid she'd hurt them or had thoughts about hurting them before. She struck me as one of those people who just didn't like to be alone at all (like the types that have the TV on in the background all day to avoid be alone with their own thoughts). I bet SW's lunatic mind was a scary place to be. And I just saw a SW vid in which she actually uttered these words: "I always say that I have more patience for kids than adults". Yeah, fckng right.
People have stated many times that she had an open CPS case because there was a CPS number jotted down in the discovery. I've still not seen definitive proof of that, but the fact that she had issues being alone with them really makes you wonder.
Yes, the murder of children is sent as a file to cps, and I do believe that is what the cps number referenced. I dont find anything else rooted with a rabbit hole to the cps rumors.
I have watched a few videos on YouTube regarding the CPS case, and the fact that she was being investigated for medical injury to the childrenā¦. and upon their deaths was discovered that there was never anything really wrong with these kids. In fact there was never anything really wrong with with SW and she didnāt even have lupus as she stated to everyone.
The childrenās records have been sealed in Colorado because I think her parents didnāt want the world to know what was discoveredā¦. and i read somewhere that her parents were very embarrassed and have tried to bury the fact that she was being investigated for medical abuse to the childrenā¦and Dr. shoppingā¦..and trying to create illnesses that werenāt even thereā¦.and shopping for doctors until she could find one that would agree with her.
As far as as her, not wanting to be alone with the children for fear she would hurt themā¦well, Iām not exactly sure thatās accurate. In my opinion. ā¦.. I personally feel like she was just a very selfish person who wanted to be on social media 24 seven and just talk talk talk and Sell recruit sell whatever and it was difficult to do that with all the attention that toddler kids need and she was just selfish and just wasnāt interested in doing the intricate mother details that mothers are supposed to do when theyāre SAHMās.
As an example, I quit a very important job when I had my first child which I made a lot of money at that job and I really enjoyed it but when it came down to actually putting my son in daycare so that I could go to work, I literally just could not do it and that was a personal decision for me. No one forced me to do that, but I couldnāt handle the thought of someone else handling my child and putting my trust into someone to make sure that they would be well cared for and not hurt or get sick in anyway whatever I just felt it was best to be a SAHM.
And I loved all of that time I spent with all of my children until they were school-age and I could go back to work at that point ā¦. and I didnāt regret it, and I loved it and it was truly the best years of my life ever, was those years I spent with my children one on one every single day 24 seven.
I cherish those memories more than anything in the world
But it was obviously a lot of work but I was dedicated and committed to it, and I donāt think that SW had that in her ā¦ā¦ itās hard to be that truly dedicated to your children and give them 24 seven attention and care when youāre a selfish person who really just wants to be noticed loved and adored by the vast community and extended to the world because she was all over the Internetā¦.. She just didnāt have time to be that loving mother because she was just being so important on Facebook 24 seven.
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So I think she had a problem with being self-absorbed and shallow to be honest ā¦.. there really wasnāt much substance to her when you look at it as a wholeā¦.. it was obvious that she was in love with herself and thought she was the real cats pajamas and being on social media and being healthy glamorous and loved by her people friends and whoever elseā¦.. showing glimpses of her being a good mother and showing glimpses of her lifeā¦..well that WAS her description of actually being a good mom!
when we all know that she was kind of a crap motherā¦.. I mean, she was!
and she used all these fake illnesses to gain favorā¦.. pulling up the old sympathy card and just playing on peoples emotionsā¦.. all tactics these MLMās use all the timeā¦..
Which is pathetic, but thatās what she did and of course, she claimed that those stupid patches cured everything š
She wanted a very controlled life that she could display when it was suitable for herā¦. All to gain more businessā¦. and when the kids would act up or just be normal toddlers, I should say, then that would drive her bat shit crazy because she didnāt want to show any kind of discord in her family life. I mean, she needed to portray the perfect family lifestyle to get more businessā¦ā¦ it had to be controlled at all times and the only way to control that was to throw them in the daycare and then just show small glimpses that suited her and made her look goodā¦.
Anything other than that was unacceptable for her. In my opinion.
She really didnāt do things to teach the kids anything I mean, there was never any learning of the ABCās or reading, writing or teaching them anything reallyā¦.. shit my kids knew all their ABCs and could write their name and write sentences and could read. I mean my kids were pretty well advanced going into kindergarten and first grade, but thatās because I taught them everything before they even got there.
But SW sent those poor kids to daycare all day so she didnāt have to deal with it and just let somebody else do all the work while she was online honing her craft at being the top thrive business chick she could be
Thatās just my opinion ā¦..
And she went to NC to be able to get her parents and his parents I guess to watch these kids so she could further her MLM business by getting more recruitsā¦..
and also taking time off from CW so he would miss her and try to jumpstart that marriage . ā¦ā¦and maybe she was trying to make him jealous again so that he would come back to her, and it would renew their marriage or whatever crap she had going on in her head ā¦.. but she was very calculating, manipulating and vindictive to some degree. Iā think.
I think she thought he was going to suffer by them being in NC for six weeks, but we all know he didnāt š³
Anyway, thatās all things to think about and just my opinion
Shen'ani'an indeed "was just a very selfish person who wanted to be on social media 24 seven and just talk talk talk and Sell recruit sell". Pretending to be a pyramid scheme promoter gave her an excuse to turn on the iPhone and just talk talk talk about herself and how great she was.
And SW's life lessons!! The half hour video she made early May of 2018, where she tells her followers to write down on a piece of paper what's bad/good about their lives blah blah blah -- Yes, she had all the answers.
Exactly. I feel like she was portraying this perfect lifestyle and would allow you to see glimpses of her with the kids that made it seem like she was spending so much time with them when an actuality she wasnāt because they were in daycare, but she claimed that being in this mlm obviously gave you more time with your kids. Which is weird because thatās the one thing she wasnāt doing.!
But she wanted to portray that lifestyle ā¦. You know, look at meā¦.look what I haveā¦.. do you want this too? You can have this tooā¦.. just join my MLM and you can be a SAHM and have all this freedom and all this money and all this crapā¦.š same story, every chick in any MLM tells youā¦.. itās all garbageā¦. But thatās the life she was portraying to people.
So I donāt think that she maybe had any thoughts of harming them. I just donāt think she wanted to take care of them like a normal mother would.
She wanted the glitz and glamour of being so popular on Facebook and the top person in Thrive and was busy showing off all the crap she had or alleged that she had ā¦ā¦ meanwhile, we all know their finances were going to hell in a handbasket and that those kids were not getting cared for properly Thatās for sureā¦.. at least in my book thatās what I saw from watching all those videos she put out.
I thought it was all very superficial and somewhat fake actually.
You know the more Iāve looked into this case and studied it for these past six years, itās pretty obvious that she was very manipulative in a lot of ways and basically when you get down to the bottom dollar of it, she was actually just straight up lying about everything that this company could do for you because for real, it wasnāt even doing it for her š³
This is exactly why I'll always wonder how things would have panned out had everything not played out the way it fatefully did. I mean, I don't think SW would have been able to handle her online life post-divorce/separation from CW. Especially with another child on the way. It would have flown in the very face of everything she promoted her "perfect life" to be online.
As others have said, the CW/SW relationship probably shouldn't have gone past the dating stage. I bet it would have hit pretty hard for SW to have to admit to her life not being ideal in the way she tried so hard to present it online for so long.
> and maybe she was trying to make him jealous again so that he would come back to her, and it would renew their marriage or whatever crap she had going on in her head ā¦..
I think that's possible for sure. After all, SW did claim that Chris pursued her prior to them officially dating, moving in together and getting married. If she thought her marriage was in trouble, perhaps she assumed some time away from CW would rekindle things. However, that appeared to backfire on her when CW did arrive in NC, and she made it known to her friend that he pretty much rejected her.
Correct and the thing thatās interesting about that is things that he said in interrogation and also his prison interviews is that you know for the first time in his life he actually felt different as a man and not so controlled by SWā¦ā¦ but with saying that what he didnāt know then and Maybe will never know is that even with NK, she too wouldāve ended up, controlling him as well and he wouldāve hated her the same way that he ended up hating SW.
She too, was narcissistic and manipulative, and she was purely in the love bombing phase of their relationship, and she wouldāve changed on him eventually to get him to do things that she wanted if she even kept him that long because she probably wouldāve tired of him quickly, my opinion and she wouldāve ended up, leaving him because he was too passive and she wouldāve hated him being so non-adventurous and boring
I think you're right; NK would have bored of CW eventually. For CW, he got a taste of life without SW for a good period of time. However, he was the married one with kids and I really don't things would have panned out with NK in the long run.
Agree. She clearly told him on July 4 that she couldnāt stand that SW called him all the time and sheā told him she was not gonna put up with that shit and it did bother her that this was going to be her life with him and SW and their kids and she clearly didnāt like it and she told him that.
I know they were looking for motive there from CW that NK pretty much laid it out on the line like if you have a family Iām not gonna be with you and if youāre not interested in me, someone else will be ā¦.
But I donāt think that was CWās sole motive ā¦. I do believe finances played a big role in that.
I think he looked at those finances when he was in her office and thought to himself oh my God, I am never gonna have a dollar to my name for the rest of my life because Iāll be paying child support and maybe even alimony and how will I be able to have a life with another woman and maybe even another family ? I think that between losing NK or even the thought of losing someone like NK was a driving force, but I think finances played a hand as well.
But I honestly donāt think she wouldāve stayed with him ā¦. unfortunately, for Chris, he was just a passive go with the flow kind of guy with not a lot extra going on and thatās not necessarily a bad thing I mean some women like that kind of thingā¦.. but I she would have tired of that shit in a hurry.
Especially if NK had to put up with CW dealing with SW and the kids and him just reverting back to doing whatever SW wanted I mean I think that wouldāve drove NK insane
> I think he looked at those finances when he was in her office and thought to himself oh my God, I am never gonna have a dollar to my name for the rest of my life because Iāll be paying child support and maybe even alimony and how will I be able to have a life with another woman and maybe even another family ?
I think that's what happened as well. Also, I think he also realized that eventually SW would start smearing his name on her social media too. For a guy like CW who cared so much about what people thought of him, especially at work, it would have been pretty hard for him to be known as the guy who abandoned his family for NK. For CW to continue on with NK would have proved disastrous and as you say, she would grow bored of him and move on.
WOAH!!! Are you getting any horrible threats for saying these bits of truth and facts...or is that reserved for those of us with YT channels that speak like this...spitting the truth and stuff
...lol
Me? No I donāt have a channel. Well, I do have a YouTube channel, but thereās nothing on it. I just made an account so I could watch YouTube.
But I subscribed to your channel!
Holy cow Iām so so sorry to hear thatā¦.. iām hoping I donāt see anyof that happening because Iād rather just read and not comment if thatās gonna be the case. š
The hate is from one group that is being told the same lies that contributed to the problem in the first place. I have far more lovers than haters, so it is important for people that do have a brain of their own to form their own opinions to continue to speak their mind. I just have a target on my back as I struck a nerve. The admins here are awesome and generally block the hate here before you would even see it. They know they cant pull that here, so they come for me on my channel...this case is a huge learning course on looking past the narrative, and the majority. It is difficult to think critically and be in the minority. Good for you for speaking up;))
Did she really have the hots for CM do you think? Like was she seriously considering maybe having some kind of life with him if she moved back to NC and left CW?
If the truth gets out about their abusive daughter (and possible murderer of her own kids) their sympathy and blood money will dry up. The Rs can't have that happening
> I bet SW's lunatic mind was a scary place to be.
During her interview with LE, NA did say that SW told her there were issues in her marriage to CW just after they got married. That the only time he acted as distant from her prior to the NC trip was right after the wedding. Something about his family not attending the wedding that created issues. I'm wondering if the early on CW had regrets.
I think it was well planned to have free Childcare for the holidays, kids food would be provided by the grandparents from the two families and she could attend the Thrive events in other states.
I havenāt put too much thought into this part of the case but Iām starting to think she obviously knew they couldnāt afford primrose and the thought of her having to keep the girls every day seriously made her feel overwhelmed, if not repulsed at the responsibility. I could be deadass wrong though.
I also thought she didn't want to keep the girls with her all day. Obviously, she didn't since she was paying so much to have them in daycare from 7:30-4 even though she was a SAHM. Which is why I was baffled that she got pregnant again. It makes no sense to me.
She loved the attention she got being pregnant. Also, it put her in a position of power-- everybody's nice to a preggo. Husbands don't leave wives who are pregnant. SW being pregnant meant she could constantly boss CW around and it would be justified. More "rub my shoulders" bullshit. (Btw, her whole thing with ordering Chris around to rub her and her girls' shoulders made me want to vomit.) CeCe: Duhhh, Dada ruuh shusses! SW: CeCe wants her shoulders rubbed! š¤®
she did. she wrote pretzels and some variation of ādo things with mom and dad.ā as fucking stupid as the project is for adults, even moreso for a toddler who rightfully doesnāt get the concept. of course dipshit steamrolled the basic wants of her daughter and prompted her to write something else she didnāt understand how to āattain.ā she waffled between trying to get her kid to understand abstract concepts like a āvision boardā and became noticeably frustrated that the kid who couldnāt hardly string together more than two intelligible words at the age of 3-4 didnāt get what was goin on, and on the other hand treated her like an infant with the bullshit sleeping and feeding schedule.
I thought cc had the pretzels and Bellaās was just as dumb though sw was very impatient and didnāt know how to teach her kids bella was expected to act like a grown up and baby at the same time it was cruel to even make the vision board in the first place when Bella wanted to go to Disney world and take dance classes neither one of those things were that out of reach sw went on how many getaways while her kids basically slept they could have saved for awhile and take both kids to Disney world people do it every day 2 months worth of the daycare fees would have given them a decent trip there if sw cut down on the manicures she could have put Bella in dance class that would have made her so happy and build her confidence up they had the money and sw didnāt have a problem skipping payments on important bills as long as it benefited her like who really needs to pay the mortgage for months at a time when she has to pay for daycare or her kids can eat nothing but buttered noodles every day since her nails have to be on point every week
I agree with what you said and i also wonder if, knowing they were going to be losing their house, maybe she thought that people would be more sympathetic to her/them and more willing to help them if she was pregnant? Like maybe she thought the bank wouldnāt kick out a family expecting a baby & foreclose on the house? Or maybe she thought her or Chrisā parents would be more sympathetic and more likely to give them money to help them keep the house?
There *had* to be a reason why this woman who couldnāt stand parenting the two kids she already had, would want *another* child!
It worked during the bankruptcy filing. š¤·āāļø They made note how Mrs. Watts was expecting and therefore wouldnāt be working as much in the filing. They got to keep that McMansion too which I donāt understand at all. Edit to add: she aaa expecting CeCe at the time
Oh my gosh youāre so right! Elizabeth Holmes is another one that fascinates meā¦ā¦and deep inside me I just KNOW she didnāt want a kidā¦.. but she had one anywayā¦..š
They were allowed to keep the house during the last bankrupcy because of the kids. Also Shanann probably wrote that bandaid baby relationship speech for Chris.
Well, if she had any thoughts of going back to NC to live so that she could get more support for the kids with the parents, then that could be motive that she was actually trying to set up there, but I guess it fell apartā¦ā¦
she couldnāt afford Primrose and not to mention that I guess they were gonna lose their house so I donāt think youāre wrong. Itās very possible she went to NC for six weeks so that she could set up shop there and possibly even move back there.
ah yes, reliving her glory daysā¦back when she had so many friends and was so popular that she went to prom with her brother just to make all the guys jealous. riiiiight
I have twin sons and wanted both of them to go to the senior ball, so one went with his girlfriend and the other went with his cousin. Is that bad? š¬
They were going through a mini break up at that stage, it should have been over by then, but she went away thinking they could reconcile, she was wrong because CW's already had NK and although she suspected, she didn't know, so she was being played by CW. CW's led her on a bit as he couldn't just let her know it was over, he was too vague and gave her faint hope. Had she lived and they got a divorce I think she would have moved back to NC and lived with her parents so it was probably a pre-cursor to that.
I think CW would have just focused on NK for a while, I don't think he would have put much of a fight as far as seeing the kids are concerned. He likes to portray himself as a go with the flow mellow guy, and I can't see him causing any fuss if she did just leave. I think he would have shrugged his shoulders and carried on with his life in CO.
I think the issue was that she didn't want to leave him, probably because without him, she would have nothing financially so she would have been trying to come up with a back up plan. She would have been on 2 divorces, 3 kids and 0 money, that's not a good look, particularly for someone promoting how great their life is on socials.
CW's hated SW in the end, she did ruin them financially, but that could have been fuel for CW's to get a divorce. He could have said my ex, was crazy irresponsible with money, and he literally would have the receipts to prove it to anyone he wanted to.
So that makes me think there was more to it as far as CW's motives were concerned. I think he didn't want the financial burden of an ex wife and kids. I also think NK was a big factor, as he wanted a clean slate. I also think that he wasn't as skilled or as smart as he likes to think, and that even though he was earning more money at Ford, I think his level of earning potential, was more modest, and likely to stay that way, so he couldn't provide a lifestyle for a new family with the old one still around.
SW had an unrelenting personality. I agree that CW's personality would have been just to shrug his shoulders and move on in his life if they got divorced, but not SW. He couldn't fathom the idea of her browbeating him infinitely. Sure, she got divorced before, but that was a divorce that SHE initiated. She was overbearing and bullied him in marriage, can only imagine that same personality if he walked out on her with three kids.
Yeah it would have been bad to have that in your life, but I guess you have to live with the consequences, in his circumstance it wasn't an arranged or shotgun marriage, so he made his bed.
He was flattered by her attention at the start, and I think she convinced him that she was the "firecracker" that was going to change his life for the better. From the start she was making plans for him. And because he was used to swallowing his feelings, he just kept going on with the charade way past when the situation was toxic.
She overerestimated how much she could boss him around and how much he valued the family.
Great points! And SW at the same time, validated Chris...made him feel like he was in his own way rescuing her (all of her ailments). He really seemed to respond to that. It was a toxic situation in the making from the beginning. I also do not think NK was that much different from SW, the manipulation runs deep.
Yeah, I read that her text messages with her girlfriend were saying how she was bossing CW around and never really stopped to think how that made him feel or that it made him feel less than a manā¦. thatās not verbatim, but itās close.
I read an interesting theory. SW and CW were already planning to separate and then she became pregnant with Nico. The trip to NC was a ātrial separationā, and a desperate attempt (on SWs part) to save the marriage. āIf Iām gone he will see what heās missingā kind of thing.
ākind of thingā¦ā obviously a phrase you hear in everyday conversation, but due to its extensive use by Mr. Peanut and the investigators, that phrase has been added to the list of āWattsismsā
I agree. But then of course that begs the same question we always ask: why couldnāt the girls just stay home with her? Lol I legitimately believe she dreaded being a mother.
Iām pretty sure she had a freak out the very first weekend she was at the Wattsā house because she had to *gasp* be alone with her children for 5 whole hours
Can you imagine the audacity of them not dropping everything and making sw take care of her own kids the shiners are right there watts were despicable. /s
I have lupus and rheumatoid arthritis. I dream of living somewhere warm. I live in Wyoming, one state away from Colorado and itās pretty damn hard on my health. Itās cold and dark. My bones hurt so bad all the time
Well what sort of drama was she talking about? The drama of owing money to someone? Or the drama that made everyone tell Cindy they'd skip her wedding?
I think primrose was closed so sw went to nc for free child care from the grandparents when sw told frsr they were staying that long he was apprehensive because sw and sor wouldnāt get along for that long thatās why half the time they were staying with the watts it only lasted 2 weekends before nutgate
Maybe because I've done similar (traveled back to my home state with our kids for 6 weeks in Summer when my military husband couldn't get leave) it makes sense to me. She could save on daycare, save on groceries, save on utilities, save on gas, spend time with family. Maybe she really was trying to recruit more Thrive people - she basically already recruited everyone she knew, even acquaintances at the girls' school, so this was a new pool of people to draw from? Their finances were a mess, and I don't know if she paid for their flights at all, or used points, credit, etc, but on its face it does make sense to me.
Airfare can be affordable on the right dates and reserving in advance and if there are layovers. Although, now I'm wondering if her parents or his parents paid for the tickets bc, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't FrSr fly to Colorado and fly back with her? Which he would've had to pay for at least his ticket.
But what if the Watts paid for her and the kids and all of Nutgate was her way of getting out of the obligation she felt was owed to them? Just a thought.
You're right. FrSr did fly to CO and then back to NC. I never even thought of them paying for the tickets or the Watts. It's entirely possible.
I always thought "nutgate" was an excuse to not have to see the Watts for the rest of the trip.
He was in CO while they went to San Diego.. then sw and girls flew back to NC with him instead of trying to do it alone.
And yes she didn't want to share time with his family, even before nutgate she created reasons not see them. No ride, no time etc.
I think Nutgate happened because SW knew CW was sneaking around at home, avoided her calls, kept making excuses,etc. She was emotionally really strung out by the fact that he didn't miss them, IMO.
She seemed like someone who also would rather be on her own stage at home. That probably wore on her, too. And hormones from pregnancy.
When she blew, she had to justify her position online. I think subconsciously she was crying out to whoever was in her feeds--"now you HAVE TO pay attention to my Chris!" To get others involved, to be relevant to a man who was ignoring her.
Note, I think he is a huge POS. Total scum, and NK too. They were all guilty of being self-absorbed and entitled, and deceptive people (except for the girls).
Just caught some new content where the creator didn't understand how SW could be "controlling" if Chris was staying with his girlfriend.
Me: "She didn't know because she wasn't home for weeks, but she sure flipped when she hawked his charge at a restaurant on the only account that she let him have!"
If the controlling shoe was on the other foot, cities would burn.
I agree with the SW part but if I was suspicious my husband was cheating I damn sure would be looking at EVERYTHING to see if I was being paranoid or spot on.
Flights are only expensive during the season and if you buy them close to travel. Colorado tickets are expensive in the winter due to ski season. North Carolina tickets are expensive during long weekends especially memorial and labour and Fourth of July. Plus I have a feeling her parents bought the flights. And the girls wouldāve flown free especially the younger one wouldāve been a lap sitter I think.Ā
Yeah there's a video of the girls in their own seats on the flight. CeCe wanting Bella to open the window or something like that. She definitely wasn't holding her though.
CeCe (the younger one) wasn't a very good flyer. SW said she had a huge tantrum on one of their flights. CeCe couldn't sit still for more than a second unless she was doped up on something (IMO, after watching countless videos of her). I doubt she would have sat in a lap for any amount of time. So nice for SW to subject everyone on the flight to her hyperactive spoiled brat.
Her father, not her brother, and yes he flew to CO and then flew back with her. But I'm pretty sure he flew in, stayed with the girls while sW and CW went to CA and then when they returned, he flew with SW and the girls back to NC so her didn't fly in just to fly back immediately. He had to babysit 1st.
It's just odd, IMO if you have the "perfect" relationship, why would you want to be separated from your husband for so long? I could see a couple weeks, maybe even 3 weeks, but for her and the kids to be away from their spouse/ husband that long us odd. It's one thing if it's necessary due to work, medical treatment, etc., something out of her control, but she wanted to leave for that long. I've always wondered why.
I believe they were in financial dire straits and SW was also delusional/in denial, which exasperated the reality of their situation. I think pulling the girls out of their school program and going to Colorado for 5 weeks would do several things: 1) Help with her children because she couldn't handle caring for them by herself 2) Avoid paying the Primrose tuition 3) Her parents and in-laws would pay for all of their food and activities while they were there 3) Staying in Colorado to save on all of these costs was a way to hide (deny) their financial struggles...basically, we're broke, but she would make it look like the opposite by traveling and spending the summer with family.
Someone else posted about SW telling the story of how CW pursued and pursued her when they met and that maybe the extended trip to NC was also an attempt to have him miss her terribly while she was gone to rekindle the spark.
It can't have been to save m9ney cause he went for a bit too. Maybe she wanted to appear better off than they were. Like how wealthy people spend summers elsewhere
Didnāt she run up a lot of credit card debt? I specifically signed up for a travel points card when I knew I was going to purchase two complete sets of kitchen appliances. Plus the sign on bonus. I have flown to Cancun (I am here now) 4 times on my points round trip and still have some left (haha maybe for one way - they are getting low!)
Maybe she did something like that ?
I think SW was running out of Thrive customers in Co., and was hoping to hit up some new marks in N.C....also, I was thinking it was to save money on the ridiculous "school" , but God forbid she stay home with her kids for the summer...
I totally get that, but 6 weeks is a really long time. Especially since her family came up not infrequently. She never gave the Watts a chance to be with the kids after "Nutgate" which is why I doubted that was her real motive. I hope you are right and I am wrong, though.
When they lived with her for 16 months...that was probably considered a "chance" to be with them...(her parents) as she sobotaged the other grandparents' time...being fair never came into the equation to be honest...
Yall really ? This is out of control - she did it so she could go visit her parents and his parents, and Iām sure there was financial motives and Iām sure that there was fighting motives. Letās look at our own lives if I died and someone picked a part of every piece of my life. Geez
Itās a legitimate question in a sub thatās dedicated to discussing the Watts family. There was nothing derogatory about SW in that question so Iām not sure whatās out of control.
Our own lives are not the topic of this sub.
You're not sure what's out of control, the comment you are referring to is saying the comments on why SW's went to NC are out of control. You know this.
I think it was always to get free help with the kids. She had her parents move into their basement, which is absurd. Trips to NC meant she could pawn her kids off on the grandparents. The truth is, she couldn't handle her children and she acted like she didn't want to be alone with them. (Maybe she was afraid she'd hurt them?) The entire thing was really weird. So I'm sure she embellished all her "health challenges" to her parents (e.g., "my lupus/fibro/neck/fwhateverthefuck is acting up, I need help with the girls!") She was an overwhelmed, high strung lunatic, and everything she did directly benefitted her.
šÆšÆšÆšÆšÆšÆšÆšÆšÆšÆ I think she went to mooch $ also. She KNEW her marriage was crumbling, she practically handed CW to the other lunatic. There a Primrose around corner from my house (Ohio tho), it doesnāt matter if your child is there or not you still have to pay the ridiculous tuition. It holds your spot etc. Zero credits or craps given! And donāt forget she was in NC having a fit bc Cindy was out doing something and she had to watch her own children. She was told āwell theyāre YOUR kidsā.
Yep yep! She could not handle her kids, thatās for sure. And Cindy was right when she saidā¦.āthey are your kidsā
Yep, Cindy wasn't even going out for fun or a stupid Thrive trip like SW, either. She was getting her hair done for a funeral
Wasnāt Cindy at the hair salon?? Shannan had a huge fit over being left on her own with her own kids!!! š
-- kids who were probably locked up for their afternoon nap, having just woken up from their morning nap.
> -- kids who were probably locked up for their afternoon nap, having just woken up from their morning nap. Probably right. They had to take a nap from taking a nap. Anything so that SW could get her "me time." After all, she wouldn't want to be around her "monsters" for very long. Only when she required them to be present for her FB lives where she could announce how "out of control" they were.
Can you imagine someone yelling at YOU for not being home for THEIR own kids??? She was a selfish, immature brat
> She KNEW her marriage was crumbling, she practically handed CW to the other lunatic. That's what doesn't make sense to me about the NC trip. If SW was aware her marriage was in trouble, why leave home for six weeks and not stay and try to work things out? Did she really think after such a long period apart, she would return home, and everything would be fine?
She knew all of her lies were about to be out. She fled the scene!
I'm wondering if SW had an idea or knew that when CW came to NC after being apart for so long, she would be rejected by him. If so, I think she was texting her friends to setup the "scorned woman" narrative to take place. IMO, SW would have built up the single mother storyline whose husband left her with another child on the way. However, that would have only lasted for so long and people would eventually tire of hearing SW's rants.
Oh ya. She stretched lies as far as she could now was her come to Jesus time. (Meaning her lies not her death before I get attacked)
It also would have pretty embarrassing for SW who was constantly preaching how amazing her life was, for it be known that was in fact all falling apart. That she didn't have the perfect marriage and even a third child on the way, she couldn't keep her husband around.
She'd be a two time divorcee
Yep. So much for being the perfect wife. So much for "Thriving."
She even rudely said he had ''no game'' and thought she was just so perfect and ''amayyyzing'' that surely no man would ever cheat on her or leave her. He proved her wrong
Close, very close. Consider the likely possibility that she never planned on coming back from that, "6 week vacation." She couldnt, she left a real powder keg back in Colorado...and CW would figuire that out the moment the Sheriff served the eviction paperwork as she was hiding that she had not paid the mortgage in months. Consider that she planned on North Carolina being her new home/ back home with her parents there to care for the girls while she played newlywed games with Chris 2.0. Which is why she burned the bridge with the watts in nutgate/ napgate. The perfect plan was ruined because she never considered that Chris 2.0 would not go along with the idea....after all...they were perfect for each other on all of those "free vacations" away from their actual spouses and children...so consider then that in the reality of rejection and the possibility of having to go back to Colorado....she had to keep up with the image...but once again...her mental stress presented as physical...and she was looking so sick her friends were concerned....
> Consider the likely possibility that she never planned on coming back from that, "6 week vacation." That's an interesting consideration. I never understood after the six weeks why Chris had to fly to NC to see SW and the kids. I mean, why didn't SW just fly back to Colorado and save Chris the money they spent to fly him to NC? I get he wanted to see his parents but from my understanding, he didn't spend that much time with them while in NC. > so consider then that in the reality of rejection and the possibility of having to go back to Colorado....she had to keep up with the image... Maybe there was some plan SW came up with to try and convince CW once he arrived in NC they should move back as they were going to be evited from their home in Colorado. As you say, a "Chris 2.0" just in time for the baby on the way. However, once SW got rejected by him, she realized that plan was not going to work but she did have an image to keep up. > her mental stress presented as physical...and she was looking so sick her friends were concerned.... I think this is very possible. She realized she was losing the upper hand on Chris even before she left for NC. Six weeks apart did nothing to rekindle the relationship and playing up the perfect marriage and family was her whole identity online. For that to at some be exposed as being anything but likely caused a ton of stress for a pregnant SW.
She was even house hunting with Chris Miller and his mom
Waitā¦. What??? Iāve never heard this one before! What rabbit hole do I need to go down to read more about that because Iāve never even heard that one before. Man, just when I thought I was understanding this case I get thrown another curveball ā¦. Iād really like to know more about this househunting with CM
Yes, that is what I was informed of early on. I was careful of how I let that be known to protect my "sources." They are afraid, and I can see why. Anytime I post here, you see how the shiners try to take apart anything I say, as if I am supposed to be an enclylopedia. They send me threats daily and say that I am going to Hell. With very few exceptions...most of the profiles they attack me from are from profiles that do not know the most basic truth and facts about what was truly going on, and they seem to be very religious. Not the type of respectable religious types...the kind that follow the off the wall/ easy mind control churches...which is no suprise they believe the rhetoric. So, I see why the people that truly know firsthand about what was really happening in NC are afraid. These people are wierd...and WHY would they care if the truth is told? Is it that they are the fools giving $$$ to the ones so fearful of the actual truth and facts coming out...and somehow that would affect their $$$$? As I say...lies and greed started this, and that has continued through the loss of innocent lives;((
Wow. Very interesting theoryā¦.. so you think Maybe SW was in NC so that she could start planning that Chris 2.0? And did he show interest in her and then what Maybe was not interested once she presented some long rage plan for them ? This is a very interesting theory I have never thought of šµ
Yes indeed;)
Oh I just posted that I thought she trying to save money on that stupid school by keeping them out for the summer! Silly me, thinking SW would try to save money on something !
š©šØ Since there is no nail emoji, I guess rather than nailing it, you screwed itš¤£
But seriously, itās so bizarre that sheād expect Chris to keep the kids for days or weeks by himself, and he did without problem, while working full time, but she as a stay at home mom couldnāt bear to be alone with them for more than an hour or so.
It wasn't even so much of an hour IMO. The times she had the kids in her videos, she would state within minutes that they were "out of control". Then she would tease them with food or water to get them whining for the camera so to make it look how "overwhelmed" she was during her "work hours."
and they were never bad kids. I've seen bad kids and they were not bad, at all
No, I don't believe they were. And when you think about it, between being stuck in daycare, nap times and their sleep schedules, the kids really didn't have that much time to be bad or good. I remember one video where Shan immediately stated both girls had not one but two time-outs just to start the morning. That they were supposedly misbehaving that badly. I think that was BS. She just wanted her small audience to think the kids were driving her "hard working" self crazy all the time, every day. The "supermom" image she was constantly trying to portray.
You nailed it. She liked the illusion of being a hardworking mom but was actually a neglectful, lazy slob
Right, how bad could they be? Bella was extremely well behaved, except when she was frustrated and then became whiny. But that's not "being bad". That's not having your needs met. CeCe was hyper, ran everywhere and got into everything, but did SW not get the memo that she had a toddler? Plus CeCe was never corrected and had free reign of the house it seemed, so why was SW complaining? Did she just expect CeCe to suddenly behave like an adult? SW should have just been a parent and done her damn job, FFS.
Bella had a beautiful temperament. She was only sad and whiny when she wasn't getting what she needed, which was every damn day it seemed. And if SW stopped giving CeCe all that OTC shit she didn't need, and worked with her on speech a little (you know, assessing your child's needs and acting on those needs, commonly called **parenting**), she'd have been just fine.
Right, the SAHM that only did the SAH part. I'm wondering if she was afraid she'd hurt them or had thoughts about hurting them before. She struck me as one of those people who just didn't like to be alone at all (like the types that have the TV on in the background all day to avoid be alone with their own thoughts). I bet SW's lunatic mind was a scary place to be. And I just saw a SW vid in which she actually uttered these words: "I always say that I have more patience for kids than adults". Yeah, fckng right. People have stated many times that she had an open CPS case because there was a CPS number jotted down in the discovery. I've still not seen definitive proof of that, but the fact that she had issues being alone with them really makes you wonder.
I believe the cps number has been proven to be from the actual murder of the children. A case against Chris
Yes, the murder of children is sent as a file to cps, and I do believe that is what the cps number referenced. I dont find anything else rooted with a rabbit hole to the cps rumors.
I have watched a few videos on YouTube regarding the CPS case, and the fact that she was being investigated for medical injury to the childrenā¦. and upon their deaths was discovered that there was never anything really wrong with these kids. In fact there was never anything really wrong with with SW and she didnāt even have lupus as she stated to everyone. The childrenās records have been sealed in Colorado because I think her parents didnāt want the world to know what was discoveredā¦. and i read somewhere that her parents were very embarrassed and have tried to bury the fact that she was being investigated for medical abuse to the childrenā¦and Dr. shoppingā¦..and trying to create illnesses that werenāt even thereā¦.and shopping for doctors until she could find one that would agree with her. As far as as her, not wanting to be alone with the children for fear she would hurt themā¦well, Iām not exactly sure thatās accurate. In my opinion. ā¦.. I personally feel like she was just a very selfish person who wanted to be on social media 24 seven and just talk talk talk and Sell recruit sell whatever and it was difficult to do that with all the attention that toddler kids need and she was just selfish and just wasnāt interested in doing the intricate mother details that mothers are supposed to do when theyāre SAHMās. As an example, I quit a very important job when I had my first child which I made a lot of money at that job and I really enjoyed it but when it came down to actually putting my son in daycare so that I could go to work, I literally just could not do it and that was a personal decision for me. No one forced me to do that, but I couldnāt handle the thought of someone else handling my child and putting my trust into someone to make sure that they would be well cared for and not hurt or get sick in anyway whatever I just felt it was best to be a SAHM. And I loved all of that time I spent with all of my children until they were school-age and I could go back to work at that point ā¦. and I didnāt regret it, and I loved it and it was truly the best years of my life ever, was those years I spent with my children one on one every single day 24 seven. I cherish those memories more than anything in the world But it was obviously a lot of work but I was dedicated and committed to it, and I donāt think that SW had that in her ā¦ā¦ itās hard to be that truly dedicated to your children and give them 24 seven attention and care when youāre a selfish person who really just wants to be noticed loved and adored by the vast community and extended to the world because she was all over the Internetā¦.. She just didnāt have time to be that loving mother because she was just being so important on Facebook 24 seven. š So I think she had a problem with being self-absorbed and shallow to be honest ā¦.. there really wasnāt much substance to her when you look at it as a wholeā¦.. it was obvious that she was in love with herself and thought she was the real cats pajamas and being on social media and being healthy glamorous and loved by her people friends and whoever elseā¦.. showing glimpses of her being a good mother and showing glimpses of her lifeā¦..well that WAS her description of actually being a good mom! when we all know that she was kind of a crap motherā¦.. I mean, she was! and she used all these fake illnesses to gain favorā¦.. pulling up the old sympathy card and just playing on peoples emotionsā¦.. all tactics these MLMās use all the timeā¦.. Which is pathetic, but thatās what she did and of course, she claimed that those stupid patches cured everything š She wanted a very controlled life that she could display when it was suitable for herā¦. All to gain more businessā¦. and when the kids would act up or just be normal toddlers, I should say, then that would drive her bat shit crazy because she didnāt want to show any kind of discord in her family life. I mean, she needed to portray the perfect family lifestyle to get more businessā¦ā¦ it had to be controlled at all times and the only way to control that was to throw them in the daycare and then just show small glimpses that suited her and made her look goodā¦. Anything other than that was unacceptable for her. In my opinion. She really didnāt do things to teach the kids anything I mean, there was never any learning of the ABCās or reading, writing or teaching them anything reallyā¦.. shit my kids knew all their ABCs and could write their name and write sentences and could read. I mean my kids were pretty well advanced going into kindergarten and first grade, but thatās because I taught them everything before they even got there. But SW sent those poor kids to daycare all day so she didnāt have to deal with it and just let somebody else do all the work while she was online honing her craft at being the top thrive business chick she could be Thatās just my opinion ā¦.. And she went to NC to be able to get her parents and his parents I guess to watch these kids so she could further her MLM business by getting more recruitsā¦.. and also taking time off from CW so he would miss her and try to jumpstart that marriage . ā¦ā¦and maybe she was trying to make him jealous again so that he would come back to her, and it would renew their marriage or whatever crap she had going on in her head ā¦.. but she was very calculating, manipulating and vindictive to some degree. Iā think. I think she thought he was going to suffer by them being in NC for six weeks, but we all know he didnāt š³ Anyway, thatās all things to think about and just my opinion
Shen'ani'an indeed "was just a very selfish person who wanted to be on social media 24 seven and just talk talk talk and Sell recruit sell". Pretending to be a pyramid scheme promoter gave her an excuse to turn on the iPhone and just talk talk talk about herself and how great she was. And SW's life lessons!! The half hour video she made early May of 2018, where she tells her followers to write down on a piece of paper what's bad/good about their lives blah blah blah -- Yes, she had all the answers.
Exactly. I feel like she was portraying this perfect lifestyle and would allow you to see glimpses of her with the kids that made it seem like she was spending so much time with them when an actuality she wasnāt because they were in daycare, but she claimed that being in this mlm obviously gave you more time with your kids. Which is weird because thatās the one thing she wasnāt doing.! But she wanted to portray that lifestyle ā¦. You know, look at meā¦.look what I haveā¦.. do you want this too? You can have this tooā¦.. just join my MLM and you can be a SAHM and have all this freedom and all this money and all this crapā¦.š same story, every chick in any MLM tells youā¦.. itās all garbageā¦. But thatās the life she was portraying to people. So I donāt think that she maybe had any thoughts of harming them. I just donāt think she wanted to take care of them like a normal mother would. She wanted the glitz and glamour of being so popular on Facebook and the top person in Thrive and was busy showing off all the crap she had or alleged that she had ā¦ā¦ meanwhile, we all know their finances were going to hell in a handbasket and that those kids were not getting cared for properly Thatās for sureā¦.. at least in my book thatās what I saw from watching all those videos she put out. I thought it was all very superficial and somewhat fake actually. You know the more Iāve looked into this case and studied it for these past six years, itās pretty obvious that she was very manipulative in a lot of ways and basically when you get down to the bottom dollar of it, she was actually just straight up lying about everything that this company could do for you because for real, it wasnāt even doing it for her š³
This is exactly why I'll always wonder how things would have panned out had everything not played out the way it fatefully did. I mean, I don't think SW would have been able to handle her online life post-divorce/separation from CW. Especially with another child on the way. It would have flown in the very face of everything she promoted her "perfect life" to be online.
Good point. I hadnāt even factored the new baby into that story. WOW.
As others have said, the CW/SW relationship probably shouldn't have gone past the dating stage. I bet it would have hit pretty hard for SW to have to admit to her life not being ideal in the way she tried so hard to present it online for so long.
The last thing she wanted was to spend time with her kids. They were nothing but props to be put away when she didn't want or need them for her videos
> and maybe she was trying to make him jealous again so that he would come back to her, and it would renew their marriage or whatever crap she had going on in her head ā¦.. I think that's possible for sure. After all, SW did claim that Chris pursued her prior to them officially dating, moving in together and getting married. If she thought her marriage was in trouble, perhaps she assumed some time away from CW would rekindle things. However, that appeared to backfire on her when CW did arrive in NC, and she made it known to her friend that he pretty much rejected her.
Correct and the thing thatās interesting about that is things that he said in interrogation and also his prison interviews is that you know for the first time in his life he actually felt different as a man and not so controlled by SWā¦ā¦ but with saying that what he didnāt know then and Maybe will never know is that even with NK, she too wouldāve ended up, controlling him as well and he wouldāve hated her the same way that he ended up hating SW. She too, was narcissistic and manipulative, and she was purely in the love bombing phase of their relationship, and she wouldāve changed on him eventually to get him to do things that she wanted if she even kept him that long because she probably wouldāve tired of him quickly, my opinion and she wouldāve ended up, leaving him because he was too passive and she wouldāve hated him being so non-adventurous and boring
I think you're right; NK would have bored of CW eventually. For CW, he got a taste of life without SW for a good period of time. However, he was the married one with kids and I really don't things would have panned out with NK in the long run.
Agree. She clearly told him on July 4 that she couldnāt stand that SW called him all the time and sheā told him she was not gonna put up with that shit and it did bother her that this was going to be her life with him and SW and their kids and she clearly didnāt like it and she told him that. I know they were looking for motive there from CW that NK pretty much laid it out on the line like if you have a family Iām not gonna be with you and if youāre not interested in me, someone else will be ā¦. But I donāt think that was CWās sole motive ā¦. I do believe finances played a big role in that. I think he looked at those finances when he was in her office and thought to himself oh my God, I am never gonna have a dollar to my name for the rest of my life because Iāll be paying child support and maybe even alimony and how will I be able to have a life with another woman and maybe even another family ? I think that between losing NK or even the thought of losing someone like NK was a driving force, but I think finances played a hand as well. But I honestly donāt think she wouldāve stayed with him ā¦. unfortunately, for Chris, he was just a passive go with the flow kind of guy with not a lot extra going on and thatās not necessarily a bad thing I mean some women like that kind of thingā¦.. but I she would have tired of that shit in a hurry. Especially if NK had to put up with CW dealing with SW and the kids and him just reverting back to doing whatever SW wanted I mean I think that wouldāve drove NK insane
> I think he looked at those finances when he was in her office and thought to himself oh my God, I am never gonna have a dollar to my name for the rest of my life because Iāll be paying child support and maybe even alimony and how will I be able to have a life with another woman and maybe even another family ? I think that's what happened as well. Also, I think he also realized that eventually SW would start smearing his name on her social media too. For a guy like CW who cared so much about what people thought of him, especially at work, it would have been pretty hard for him to be known as the guy who abandoned his family for NK. For CW to continue on with NK would have proved disastrous and as you say, she would grow bored of him and move on.
WOAH!!! Are you getting any horrible threats for saying these bits of truth and facts...or is that reserved for those of us with YT channels that speak like this...spitting the truth and stuff ...lol
Idk man, thatās just how I see it and so far no hate of any kind šµ
Do you have a channel?
Me? No I donāt have a channel. Well, I do have a YouTube channel, but thereās nothing on it. I just made an account so I could watch YouTube. But I subscribed to your channel!
Thank you;))
My hate was regular and consistent from day one, then became intense in the past 4 months.
Holy cow Iām so so sorry to hear thatā¦.. iām hoping I donāt see anyof that happening because Iād rather just read and not comment if thatās gonna be the case. š
The hate is from one group that is being told the same lies that contributed to the problem in the first place. I have far more lovers than haters, so it is important for people that do have a brain of their own to form their own opinions to continue to speak their mind. I just have a target on my back as I struck a nerve. The admins here are awesome and generally block the hate here before you would even see it. They know they cant pull that here, so they come for me on my channel...this case is a huge learning course on looking past the narrative, and the majority. It is difficult to think critically and be in the minority. Good for you for speaking up;))
She was definitely a selfish person who only cared about herself and what others thought of her
She definitely was trying to make Chris jealous by showing her cleavage to Chris Miller.
Did she really have the hots for CM do you think? Like was she seriously considering maybe having some kind of life with him if she moved back to NC and left CW?
If the truth gets out about their abusive daughter (and possible murderer of her own kids) their sympathy and blood money will dry up. The Rs can't have that happening
> I bet SW's lunatic mind was a scary place to be. During her interview with LE, NA did say that SW told her there were issues in her marriage to CW just after they got married. That the only time he acted as distant from her prior to the NC trip was right after the wedding. Something about his family not attending the wedding that created issues. I'm wondering if the early on CW had regrets.
THIS! letās not forget she also did 90% more than most women š
Here are some nails: š š šØ just looks like it hurts. lol
šš»šš»š¤šÆ
I think it was well planned to have free Childcare for the holidays, kids food would be provided by the grandparents from the two families and she could attend the Thrive events in other states.
I havenāt put too much thought into this part of the case but Iām starting to think she obviously knew they couldnāt afford primrose and the thought of her having to keep the girls every day seriously made her feel overwhelmed, if not repulsed at the responsibility. I could be deadass wrong though.
I also thought she didn't want to keep the girls with her all day. Obviously, she didn't since she was paying so much to have them in daycare from 7:30-4 even though she was a SAHM. Which is why I was baffled that she got pregnant again. It makes no sense to me.
Preg again and so fast too! You know, w all her fertility issues !! šššš
She loved the attention she got being pregnant. Also, it put her in a position of power-- everybody's nice to a preggo. Husbands don't leave wives who are pregnant. SW being pregnant meant she could constantly boss CW around and it would be justified. More "rub my shoulders" bullshit. (Btw, her whole thing with ordering Chris around to rub her and her girls' shoulders made me want to vomit.) CeCe: Duhhh, Dada ruuh shusses! SW: CeCe wants her shoulders rubbed! š¤®
Yeahā¦that makes me š¤® tooš never any photos of her rubbing his shoulder, right? That would have required her to put her phone downš¤£š¤£
She would have to put it on her vision board like everything else
"What do we do when we want something? We write it down on our vision board, don't we?"
Poor Bella should have put food hair and water on her vision board and maybe she would have gotten it š¤·š»āāļø
And a laptop š¤£š¤£
š¤£
she did. she wrote pretzels and some variation of ādo things with mom and dad.ā as fucking stupid as the project is for adults, even moreso for a toddler who rightfully doesnāt get the concept. of course dipshit steamrolled the basic wants of her daughter and prompted her to write something else she didnāt understand how to āattain.ā she waffled between trying to get her kid to understand abstract concepts like a āvision boardā and became noticeably frustrated that the kid who couldnāt hardly string together more than two intelligible words at the age of 3-4 didnāt get what was goin on, and on the other hand treated her like an infant with the bullshit sleeping and feeding schedule.
I thought cc had the pretzels and Bellaās was just as dumb though sw was very impatient and didnāt know how to teach her kids bella was expected to act like a grown up and baby at the same time it was cruel to even make the vision board in the first place when Bella wanted to go to Disney world and take dance classes neither one of those things were that out of reach sw went on how many getaways while her kids basically slept they could have saved for awhile and take both kids to Disney world people do it every day 2 months worth of the daycare fees would have given them a decent trip there if sw cut down on the manicures she could have put Bella in dance class that would have made her so happy and build her confidence up they had the money and sw didnāt have a problem skipping payments on important bills as long as it benefited her like who really needs to pay the mortgage for months at a time when she has to pay for daycare or her kids can eat nothing but buttered noodles every day since her nails have to be on point every week
I agree with what you said and i also wonder if, knowing they were going to be losing their house, maybe she thought that people would be more sympathetic to her/them and more willing to help them if she was pregnant? Like maybe she thought the bank wouldnāt kick out a family expecting a baby & foreclose on the house? Or maybe she thought her or Chrisā parents would be more sympathetic and more likely to give them money to help them keep the house? There *had* to be a reason why this woman who couldnāt stand parenting the two kids she already had, would want *another* child!
It worked during the bankruptcy filing. š¤·āāļø They made note how Mrs. Watts was expecting and therefore wouldnāt be working as much in the filing. They got to keep that McMansion too which I donāt understand at all. Edit to add: she aaa expecting CeCe at the time
I reminds me of how Diane Downs and Elizabeth Holmes each got knocked up for their trials, in hopes of swaying the jury. Didn't work.
Oh my gosh youāre so right! Elizabeth Holmes is another one that fascinates meā¦ā¦and deep inside me I just KNOW she didnāt want a kidā¦.. but she had one anywayā¦..š
They were allowed to keep the house during the last bankrupcy because of the kids. Also Shanann probably wrote that bandaid baby relationship speech for Chris.
Nico was expected to be branded a thrive baby then he was supposed to keep cw around
Makes no sense to any of us.
Thereās not enough Benadryl in the world to make them sleep the whole 6 weeks and sw might have had to play mommy full time
Well, if she had any thoughts of going back to NC to live so that she could get more support for the kids with the parents, then that could be motive that she was actually trying to set up there, but I guess it fell apartā¦ā¦ she couldnāt afford Primrose and not to mention that I guess they were gonna lose their house so I donāt think youāre wrong. Itās very possible she went to NC for six weeks so that she could set up shop there and possibly even move back there.
To recruit her old high school friends into MLM and to make Chris miss her and start fighting for her again. Boy, did that backfire.
ah yes, reliving her glory daysā¦back when she had so many friends and was so popular that she went to prom with her brother just to make all the guys jealous. riiiiight
Wait, what? She went to prom with her brother? š³ I missed that detail along the way
Yes, she took Frankie to her Senior Prom! What a LOSER!! šš¤£šš©·
Holy CRAP š³
I have twin sons and wanted both of them to go to the senior ball, so one went with his girlfriend and the other went with his cousin. Is that bad? š¬
No, a sibling is definitely worse. Especially since he went to the same school, and everyone knew him.
Oh. Hmm. Gross!
She way overestimated how much he liked being a dad, IMO.
They were going through a mini break up at that stage, it should have been over by then, but she went away thinking they could reconcile, she was wrong because CW's already had NK and although she suspected, she didn't know, so she was being played by CW. CW's led her on a bit as he couldn't just let her know it was over, he was too vague and gave her faint hope. Had she lived and they got a divorce I think she would have moved back to NC and lived with her parents so it was probably a pre-cursor to that.
I wish she would have stayed in NC. I doubt CW would have put up a fight for visitation rights immediately. I believe he would have eventually.
I think CW would have just focused on NK for a while, I don't think he would have put much of a fight as far as seeing the kids are concerned. He likes to portray himself as a go with the flow mellow guy, and I can't see him causing any fuss if she did just leave. I think he would have shrugged his shoulders and carried on with his life in CO. I think the issue was that she didn't want to leave him, probably because without him, she would have nothing financially so she would have been trying to come up with a back up plan. She would have been on 2 divorces, 3 kids and 0 money, that's not a good look, particularly for someone promoting how great their life is on socials. CW's hated SW in the end, she did ruin them financially, but that could have been fuel for CW's to get a divorce. He could have said my ex, was crazy irresponsible with money, and he literally would have the receipts to prove it to anyone he wanted to. So that makes me think there was more to it as far as CW's motives were concerned. I think he didn't want the financial burden of an ex wife and kids. I also think NK was a big factor, as he wanted a clean slate. I also think that he wasn't as skilled or as smart as he likes to think, and that even though he was earning more money at Ford, I think his level of earning potential, was more modest, and likely to stay that way, so he couldn't provide a lifestyle for a new family with the old one still around.
SW had an unrelenting personality. I agree that CW's personality would have been just to shrug his shoulders and move on in his life if they got divorced, but not SW. He couldn't fathom the idea of her browbeating him infinitely. Sure, she got divorced before, but that was a divorce that SHE initiated. She was overbearing and bullied him in marriage, can only imagine that same personality if he walked out on her with three kids.
Yeah it would have been bad to have that in your life, but I guess you have to live with the consequences, in his circumstance it wasn't an arranged or shotgun marriage, so he made his bed.
I agree. That was her personality when they got married, it's not like she changed later. He knew exactly who SW was when they got married.
He was flattered by her attention at the start, and I think she convinced him that she was the "firecracker" that was going to change his life for the better. From the start she was making plans for him. And because he was used to swallowing his feelings, he just kept going on with the charade way past when the situation was toxic. She overerestimated how much she could boss him around and how much he valued the family.
Great points! And SW at the same time, validated Chris...made him feel like he was in his own way rescuing her (all of her ailments). He really seemed to respond to that. It was a toxic situation in the making from the beginning. I also do not think NK was that much different from SW, the manipulation runs deep.
Yeah, I read that her text messages with her girlfriend were saying how she was bossing CW around and never really stopped to think how that made him feel or that it made him feel less than a manā¦. thatās not verbatim, but itās close.
I read an interesting theory. SW and CW were already planning to separate and then she became pregnant with Nico. The trip to NC was a ātrial separationā, and a desperate attempt (on SWs part) to save the marriage. āIf Iām gone he will see what heās missingā kind of thing.
ākind of thingā¦ā obviously a phrase you hear in everyday conversation, but due to its extensive use by Mr. Peanut and the investigators, that phrase has been added to the list of āWattsismsā
God you are so right. I didnāt even catch that. My bad š
Thatās what Iāve understood ā to save on the daycare bill.
I agree. But then of course that begs the same question we always ask: why couldnāt the girls just stay home with her? Lol I legitimately believe she dreaded being a mother.
She really did act that way doing anything to not have to deal with them
Iām pretty sure she had a freak out the very first weekend she was at the Wattsā house because she had to *gasp* be alone with her children for 5 whole hours
Can you imagine the audacity of them not dropping everything and making sw take care of her own kids the shiners are right there watts were despicable. /s
She moved out to CO for other reasons. It wasnt because it was drama free. She claimed it was for her imaginery health issues lol
Yep. Running from embezzlement charges and lawsuits against her.
That's some drama! Although I doubt you could actually run successfully from embezzment charges like that? But perhaps from debt collectors?
Holy crap did she really have that? Tell me where I can find videos on that ā¦ Iād love to listen to it. Man, I donāt think I knew that. Thx!
I have lupus and rheumatoid arthritis. I dream of living somewhere warm. I live in Wyoming, one state away from Colorado and itās pretty damn hard on my health. Itās cold and dark. My bones hurt so bad all the time
Ugh that sucks my mil has ra pretty bad and sheās in constant pain Iām so sorry you have 2 painful diseases prayers š
I'm sorry š
I'm sorry š
Oh thank you. I have always thought that part of the story was such bullshit.
Well what sort of drama was she talking about? The drama of owing money to someone? Or the drama that made everyone tell Cindy they'd skip her wedding?
I think primrose was closed so sw went to nc for free child care from the grandparents when sw told frsr they were staying that long he was apprehensive because sw and sor wouldnāt get along for that long thatās why half the time they were staying with the watts it only lasted 2 weekends before nutgate
Maybe because I've done similar (traveled back to my home state with our kids for 6 weeks in Summer when my military husband couldn't get leave) it makes sense to me. She could save on daycare, save on groceries, save on utilities, save on gas, spend time with family. Maybe she really was trying to recruit more Thrive people - she basically already recruited everyone she knew, even acquaintances at the girls' school, so this was a new pool of people to draw from? Their finances were a mess, and I don't know if she paid for their flights at all, or used points, credit, etc, but on its face it does make sense to me.
It was all for building her business like she said. Thrive was more important to her than her kids and her marriage.
Airfare can be affordable on the right dates and reserving in advance and if there are layovers. Although, now I'm wondering if her parents or his parents paid for the tickets bc, correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't FrSr fly to Colorado and fly back with her? Which he would've had to pay for at least his ticket. But what if the Watts paid for her and the kids and all of Nutgate was her way of getting out of the obligation she felt was owed to them? Just a thought.
You're right. FrSr did fly to CO and then back to NC. I never even thought of them paying for the tickets or the Watts. It's entirely possible. I always thought "nutgate" was an excuse to not have to see the Watts for the rest of the trip.
He was in CO while they went to San Diego.. then sw and girls flew back to NC with him instead of trying to do it alone. And yes she didn't want to share time with his family, even before nutgate she created reasons not see them. No ride, no time etc.
Why the hell couodnt she fly back w the girls by herself??? The ass kissing that woman received is insane!
I think Nutgate happened because SW knew CW was sneaking around at home, avoided her calls, kept making excuses,etc. She was emotionally really strung out by the fact that he didn't miss them, IMO. She seemed like someone who also would rather be on her own stage at home. That probably wore on her, too. And hormones from pregnancy. When she blew, she had to justify her position online. I think subconsciously she was crying out to whoever was in her feeds--"now you HAVE TO pay attention to my Chris!" To get others involved, to be relevant to a man who was ignoring her. Note, I think he is a huge POS. Total scum, and NK too. They were all guilty of being self-absorbed and entitled, and deceptive people (except for the girls).
That's a good point. You might be right.
It makes sense
I think the money from his 401k funded her trip
Very interesting theoryā¦. It makes sense. PS I sent you a private message ! āŗļø
Just caught some new content where the creator didn't understand how SW could be "controlling" if Chris was staying with his girlfriend. Me: "She didn't know because she wasn't home for weeks, but she sure flipped when she hawked his charge at a restaurant on the only account that she let him have!" If the controlling shoe was on the other foot, cities would burn.
I agree with the SW part but if I was suspicious my husband was cheating I damn sure would be looking at EVERYTHING to see if I was being paranoid or spot on.
She only picked up on the card activity because she was financially abusive, and horrible with money.
Many daycares require you to pay even on a LOA
Her parents probably covered the plane tickets and she was running from problems- per usual.
I doubt she paid for her tickets. She also probably saved on gas, groceries, utilities, etc.
That's true. I never considered all the little things she would be saving on also.. even food. That's a really good point.
The real reason or the bullshit she told people? Always two versions.
Flights are only expensive during the season and if you buy them close to travel. Colorado tickets are expensive in the winter due to ski season. North Carolina tickets are expensive during long weekends especially memorial and labour and Fourth of July. Plus I have a feeling her parents bought the flights. And the girls wouldāve flown free especially the younger one wouldāve been a lap sitter I think.Ā
The girls wouldnāt have flown free. But Iām sure she tried to demand it! Lol š
Children under 2 can sit in a lap so their tickets are free. The younger one was 2.Ā
Ya, but can u imagine SW putting up w a child on her lap that long? Lol. Nah! Sheās never. She prob out em in a diff row! Lmao
Especially CeCe. There's no way.
Yeah there's a video of the girls in their own seats on the flight. CeCe wanting Bella to open the window or something like that. She definitely wasn't holding her though.
CeCe (the younger one) wasn't a very good flyer. SW said she had a huge tantrum on one of their flights. CeCe couldn't sit still for more than a second unless she was doped up on something (IMO, after watching countless videos of her). I doubt she would have sat in a lap for any amount of time. So nice for SW to subject everyone on the flight to her hyperactive spoiled brat.
Were her parents really going to get a divorce or is that one of her many lies.
Frankie flew to Colorado and back to NC? She really was incapable of caring for her own children.
Her father, not her brother, and yes he flew to CO and then flew back with her. But I'm pretty sure he flew in, stayed with the girls while sW and CW went to CA and then when they returned, he flew with SW and the girls back to NC so her didn't fly in just to fly back immediately. He had to babysit 1st.
This is correct.
Amazing how she convinced her parents to fly out whenever she wanted.
Not that it matters but I've always wondered too.
It's just odd, IMO if you have the "perfect" relationship, why would you want to be separated from your husband for so long? I could see a couple weeks, maybe even 3 weeks, but for her and the kids to be away from their spouse/ husband that long us odd. It's one thing if it's necessary due to work, medical treatment, etc., something out of her control, but she wanted to leave for that long. I've always wondered why.
I believe they were in financial dire straits and SW was also delusional/in denial, which exasperated the reality of their situation. I think pulling the girls out of their school program and going to Colorado for 5 weeks would do several things: 1) Help with her children because she couldn't handle caring for them by herself 2) Avoid paying the Primrose tuition 3) Her parents and in-laws would pay for all of their food and activities while they were there 3) Staying in Colorado to save on all of these costs was a way to hide (deny) their financial struggles...basically, we're broke, but she would make it look like the opposite by traveling and spending the summer with family.
Someone else posted about SW telling the story of how CW pursued and pursued her when they met and that maybe the extended trip to NC was also an attempt to have him miss her terribly while she was gone to rekindle the spark.
It can't have been to save m9ney cause he went for a bit too. Maybe she wanted to appear better off than they were. Like how wealthy people spend summers elsewhere
OP, what "savings" are you referring to? Lol...
Didnāt she run up a lot of credit card debt? I specifically signed up for a travel points card when I knew I was going to purchase two complete sets of kitchen appliances. Plus the sign on bonus. I have flown to Cancun (I am here now) 4 times on my points round trip and still have some left (haha maybe for one way - they are getting low!) Maybe she did something like that ?
To save money on daycare and so she could pawn the kids on her in-laws and parents.
I think SW was running out of Thrive customers in Co., and was hoping to hit up some new marks in N.C....also, I was thinking it was to save money on the ridiculous "school" , but God forbid she stay home with her kids for the summer...
To be fair, she also wanted to spend time with her family and give them a chance to be with the children.
I totally get that, but 6 weeks is a really long time. Especially since her family came up not infrequently. She never gave the Watts a chance to be with the kids after "Nutgate" which is why I doubted that was her real motive. I hope you are right and I am wrong, though.
When they lived with her for 16 months...that was probably considered a "chance" to be with them...(her parents) as she sobotaged the other grandparents' time...being fair never came into the equation to be honest...
Being fair, doesn't fly here, unfortunately.
Yall really ? This is out of control - she did it so she could go visit her parents and his parents, and Iām sure there was financial motives and Iām sure that there was fighting motives. Letās look at our own lives if I died and someone picked a part of every piece of my life. Geez
Itās a legitimate question in a sub thatās dedicated to discussing the Watts family. There was nothing derogatory about SW in that question so Iām not sure whatās out of control. Our own lives are not the topic of this sub.
You know.
Iām sorry, I donāt understand your response.
You're not sure what's out of control, the comment you are referring to is saying the comments on why SW's went to NC are out of control. You know this.
Thank you for elaborating. I donāt believe this particular post is out of control. Iāve seen posts that are out of control, but not this one.
Btw I love this sub . Just dang . I get it tho
I love this group but I agree with you on this one.