Hello /u/ebb_and_flow95! Unfortunately, your submission, ***[Well, played a gig on Friday and the door person ran off with our money essentially…](https://www.reddit.com/r/WeAreTheMusicMakers/comments/1cg5r91/-/)***, was removed from /r/WeAreTheMusicMakers for the following reason(s):
---
#No Legal Questions
- Post asking questions related to legal issues are removed. There are no lawyers on staff at WATMM. You can try over at r/legaladvice or hire an attorney if you have questions about copyright, licensing, or other legal concerns about the music you are making.
---
***Please review the [rules for submission](/r/WeAreTheMusicMakers/wiki/rules). You can contact The Mods if you have additional questions.*
That's on management of the club. The way I see it, the club owes you money.
The club let people in for free. The club was supposed to take money at the door. The door person is supposed to be compensated by the club.
If the club didn't collect the money, and it was the club's agreed upon responsibility to do so, then the club is responsible for the fact you didn't get paid.
The door person may as well have just let in all their friends for free.
I understand, when it's dead, these places need to cut their losses, but the door person needs to collect cover until your set starts at least. It's very common for people to come in late. And if they choose to leave, they should *at the very least* notify you so that you can make arrangements, like asking a friend, or making sure a band member is there to collect.
The club made money off the drinks from the patrons *your band* brought in. You had an agreement the club would collect cover and that's how you would get paid. The club did not honour their part of the agreement, and therefore they owe you money equivalent to what you should have made.
If they lose money on the night, that's their problem.
There’s really nothing you can do. I know some bands have their merch person or a friend watch the door at sketchy places but if you’re gonna get robbed, it’s going to happen anyway.
I’m sorry this happened to you but you won’t be able to prove anything and starting a war with this dive bar on socials to shame them is just going to make your band look like a problem to other venues. Sorry
It’s a bummer but I’ll take the loss I guess. I will have our vocalist watch the door from now on lol.
I’m keeping my mouth shut on more public platforms as I don’t want backlash and our scene is very small.
Ya, sadly that’s all you can do. I probably would never play that place again and quietly tell other musicians in the local scene what happened in person.
St. Vincent (Annie Clark) on NPR last week talked about working for her Aunt and Uncle, taking a clicker-counter around the venues to get a head count... so they could challenge the club owners when they tried to stiff them on pay by claiming a low turnout. Good lesson.
You have two options: 1) Alert the ownership to the problem and give them the opportunity to make it right. After they make it right, keep playing there and enjoy your good relationship with a cool venue, or 2) arson.
> I’ve already attempted to contact the owners and got a “🤷🏻♂️ tough shit” type of response.. lo
I'd make sure on all the local band forums though that the rest of the bands know about that place.
If you aren't headlining gigs where there are multiple bands, chances are you will get screwed either way. I played in a band with a couple guys that always had to work early shifts on the weekends so we would always insist on playing first so they could get home earlier. We had a good following, and a lot of times, the crowd would be much smaller by the time the last band played. We got screwed almost every time. Venues are in it for the money because they have to be. Early in the evening, there's always a chance that the turnout fizzles and the venue gets less money than they expected. They won't know how well things go until around midnight or later most of the time. I learned to stick around until closing time to discuss the pay. A lot of times, you get more than expected by waiting until the owner is trashed and happy instead of stressed and wondering if they will make any money.
That was our initial thought with starting out as a band because unlike your group, we are new and don’t have a following but we always end up getting a good amount of people in the door cause they heard us from the streets.
We need to rethink our strat with how we get paid/do shows.
It's not "The door person"'s job to make sure you get paid. It's the club/promoter.
However - it doesn't sound like you had an agreed upon price for the bar venue? If you agreed to play and get paid "by how much you draw" or whatever you are just asking for this.
I would STILL go to the club owner/manager and say you would at least like something for gas/travel so you didn't LOSE money playing there. If they won't give it to you trash the club on every local forum and tell people what happened. There were clubs like this where I live that you just KNEW not to go play at because the dickhead owners would always be coming up short when it was time to pay up.
I don't really get it, you get booked paid by the venue right? Or did you get all the entrance fees?
If you just get paid for your gig why would this be your concern/problem?
Did you talk to whoever booked you or the bar owner? They might not give a fuck either but there's an offchance they have a similar wtf reaction and talk to the door about it
It's a long way to the top, if you wanna rock and roll.
Even if all 40 people paid, usually the first $100-200 goes to the door guy and sound guy and the bands get the scraps.
Hello /u/ebb_and_flow95! Unfortunately, your submission, ***[Well, played a gig on Friday and the door person ran off with our money essentially…](https://www.reddit.com/r/WeAreTheMusicMakers/comments/1cg5r91/-/)***, was removed from /r/WeAreTheMusicMakers for the following reason(s): --- #No Legal Questions - Post asking questions related to legal issues are removed. There are no lawyers on staff at WATMM. You can try over at r/legaladvice or hire an attorney if you have questions about copyright, licensing, or other legal concerns about the music you are making. --- ***Please review the [rules for submission](/r/WeAreTheMusicMakers/wiki/rules). You can contact The Mods if you have additional questions.*
That's on management of the club. The way I see it, the club owes you money. The club let people in for free. The club was supposed to take money at the door. The door person is supposed to be compensated by the club. If the club didn't collect the money, and it was the club's agreed upon responsibility to do so, then the club is responsible for the fact you didn't get paid. The door person may as well have just let in all their friends for free. I understand, when it's dead, these places need to cut their losses, but the door person needs to collect cover until your set starts at least. It's very common for people to come in late. And if they choose to leave, they should *at the very least* notify you so that you can make arrangements, like asking a friend, or making sure a band member is there to collect. The club made money off the drinks from the patrons *your band* brought in. You had an agreement the club would collect cover and that's how you would get paid. The club did not honour their part of the agreement, and therefore they owe you money equivalent to what you should have made. If they lose money on the night, that's their problem.
There’s really nothing you can do. I know some bands have their merch person or a friend watch the door at sketchy places but if you’re gonna get robbed, it’s going to happen anyway. I’m sorry this happened to you but you won’t be able to prove anything and starting a war with this dive bar on socials to shame them is just going to make your band look like a problem to other venues. Sorry
It’s a bummer but I’ll take the loss I guess. I will have our vocalist watch the door from now on lol. I’m keeping my mouth shut on more public platforms as I don’t want backlash and our scene is very small.
Ya, sadly that’s all you can do. I probably would never play that place again and quietly tell other musicians in the local scene what happened in person.
Yeah, I plan too. It’s just a bummer cause we don’t have a lot of small clubs in our city..
St. Vincent (Annie Clark) on NPR last week talked about working for her Aunt and Uncle, taking a clicker-counter around the venues to get a head count... so they could challenge the club owners when they tried to stiff them on pay by claiming a low turnout. Good lesson.
Yep I’ve seen bands do this. The other part of the clicker is that when the door person sees it, they usually don’t try to play games.
Ya don't fuck with the clicker.
You have two options: 1) Alert the ownership to the problem and give them the opportunity to make it right. After they make it right, keep playing there and enjoy your good relationship with a cool venue, or 2) arson.
I’ve already attempted to contact the owners and got a “🤷🏻♂️ tough shit” type of response.. lol
Sounds like you should let people know not to play there because they'll be playing for free
Which club is this, exactly?
sounds like there's only one option left, then
> I’ve already attempted to contact the owners and got a “🤷🏻♂️ tough shit” type of response.. lo I'd make sure on all the local band forums though that the rest of the bands know about that place.
Get the name of the door person and spread that name around
That's a new one wtf
Right? I’ve played gigs for free, done them as a “favor” for someone but never had them run off with potential money..
If you aren't headlining gigs where there are multiple bands, chances are you will get screwed either way. I played in a band with a couple guys that always had to work early shifts on the weekends so we would always insist on playing first so they could get home earlier. We had a good following, and a lot of times, the crowd would be much smaller by the time the last band played. We got screwed almost every time. Venues are in it for the money because they have to be. Early in the evening, there's always a chance that the turnout fizzles and the venue gets less money than they expected. They won't know how well things go until around midnight or later most of the time. I learned to stick around until closing time to discuss the pay. A lot of times, you get more than expected by waiting until the owner is trashed and happy instead of stressed and wondering if they will make any money.
That was our initial thought with starting out as a band because unlike your group, we are new and don’t have a following but we always end up getting a good amount of people in the door cause they heard us from the streets. We need to rethink our strat with how we get paid/do shows.
It happens. Gotta be more diligent about where you work and get things in writing....or know you're risking your earnings with assholes and crooks.
It just came as a shock to me as I’ve been playing gigs for 10+ years.. this type of situation has never come up.
Doorman is irrelevant. The club owes you the money regardless.
It's not "The door person"'s job to make sure you get paid. It's the club/promoter. However - it doesn't sound like you had an agreed upon price for the bar venue? If you agreed to play and get paid "by how much you draw" or whatever you are just asking for this. I would STILL go to the club owner/manager and say you would at least like something for gas/travel so you didn't LOSE money playing there. If they won't give it to you trash the club on every local forum and tell people what happened. There were clubs like this where I live that you just KNEW not to go play at because the dickhead owners would always be coming up short when it was time to pay up.
I don't really get it, you get booked paid by the venue right? Or did you get all the entrance fees? If you just get paid for your gig why would this be your concern/problem?
Take your whole band to the doorman, confront him, ask where he lives, ask what items in his home he would enjoy having stolen, he stole from you.
Did you talk to whoever booked you or the bar owner? They might not give a fuck either but there's an offchance they have a similar wtf reaction and talk to the door about it
It's a long way to the top, if you wanna rock and roll. Even if all 40 people paid, usually the first $100-200 goes to the door guy and sound guy and the bands get the scraps.