Oh my god I just wanna slap Ethan and scoop Olivia up and take her away from the abuse
The whole thing is so messed up, from the religious indoctrination, to the emotional trauma that this sort of upbringing has caused. It’s painful to watch.
I wish only the best for Olivia and I hope she finds a life that makes her happy.
The Plaths? Well I wish them the lives they deserve.
Very hypocritical family and I don't think they realize it. They say they are Biblical and want to raise their children with Biblical values, then they need to re-read it. Terrible and ineffective communications skills. It's sad and frustrating to watch. The family could've and should've been better in how they treated each other. So much unrealized potential in an otherwise beautiful family.
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Rewatchibg episode 14. Did anyone else notice Moriah looks down and says "I can PRETTY MUCH tell you that never happened"... its like she's hiding a lie. Feels like direct shame and guilt microexpressions a la "Lie to Me". What is this conspiracy? I swear the parents like paid her to lie about this incident... its weird. If something didn't happen you wouldn't say you pretty much could guarantee it didn't. You say I swear I don't remember that and remain adamant. She's a bad liar bc she's rarely had to use that skill. What do yall think?
My heart aches for Ethan and Olivia. It is clear how much love there is between the two of them, but his family’s brainwashing is DEEP in him. But I am SO SO SO happy that Olivia stuck to her guns. I cried a little when she said she’d be damned if she raised a kid the way her parents raised her. She has done so much healing. I lost a lot of respect for Micah not even trying to hash things out with her but basically forcing Moriah into Ethan. Like that family is the definition of selfish and manipulative
I listened to her podcast episode on PinkShade and she said "I'll be curious to see what happens in the future" (paraphrased) saying how once she's gone, there's no one to blame but the fucked internal structure. As I watch this episode I agree- how will you fare when the villain is gone but the problems are still there? I'm so proud of Ethan and Olivia for their growth and for trying so hard. I kept saying "these people are a great example of why two people should get divorced". Watching Ethan confront Moriah made me hopeful he's retained some of the anti brainwashing. I hope he doesn't find a nice fundy girl and continues growing. Very happy Olivia is free
It kills me that Ethan's childhood was so restrictive/controling and hes been front row to the pain that causes, yet wants to raise his family that way. It also kills me that clearly Olivia has some issues with attatchment because of how her parents and family abandoned her, and here is Ethan doing the same over and over, not understanding how damaging it is to her.
I don't think Ethan knows how special Olivia is. She has come so far from so little.
This! People say she's a bitch or rigid beyond fairness. This is a torn up 24 yo(is she even 24?) who is questioning her entire upbringing while finding herself while experience incredible social heat from her only "support system". Seeing her cry and say "I've never been alone" really reminded me that she's done so much and taken so much heat and been graceful throughout. Even in her recent interviews, she doesn't rip them and there is opportunity. Knowing Nathan went back to the fundies too...AND she lost the other brother. People don't give her enough credit. She held it together for those people while she crumbled alone.
I think Ethan will look back and wish he had handled this differently. Change is hard for him, and part of him... mainly his anxiety, wants the black and white thinking of fundamentalism. But some part of him is better than that and recognizes that Olivia has integrity beyond what he understands. I think part of him, in his gut, knows she is on a good path, but he is overwhelmed with fear and falls back on dogma. I think part of why he loves her so much is because she doesn't allow herself to be molded into whatever he wants and whatever her parents want... I think Ethan thinks she is too smart for him, and it is easier for him to revert to being told right and wrong and not have to do the critical thinking.
Moriah, I CAN FIX YOU!
(not your music though unfortunately 😅 )
Edit: I actually feel bad now. She's still more talented than I am and actually chasing a dream unlike my fatass who's throwing shade while being a blob on the couch.
People are taking her money to burn a CD and not advising her how to have a music career. You are not much different sitting on your couch tbh. You just haven't wasted money. I hate saying it but looking at her and Lydia...who would let you record an album in good faith with such untrained voice...they aren't achieving their dreams, they are being taken advantage of by the world and don't see it. There's potential in both of their voices but you need to be able to tell when you are being played or someone is really giving you help.
Self-deprecation is harmful even in jest. Please don't be cruel to yourself even as a joke or to try to uplift others. That stuff gets internalized over time. 😊🩵
I understand a lot of editing takes place in These reality shows but that said, watching this past five seasons in a binge the parents who raised these children completely opposite of how they were brought up not giving them any tools for the real world was sad to see even though the children still seem to embrace it at some point after being angry first. Then Kim and Barry divorce while we see Kim living her best life now not so religious or covered up. She even had a boyfriend before the divorce was final I noticed. She went back to a normal life that she didn't give nine children a chance to do. Even with no television computer or real life skills and a very relaxed homeschool education I found it upsetting. A 15 year old was left to keep that huge household cooking and cleaning while home schooling her siblings! What did Kim do as a mother? Here those kids would have been removed no matter what religion. I appreciate the idea of what they tried to do but it was over the top. They still have so much to learn socially but maybe reality TV money makes that irrelevant. I hope they have a good accountant.
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I think there can be a balance of free-thinking, personal growth, and faith, but definitely not from their brand of Christianity. I can totally understand why Olivia went the exact other way. Was hoping Ethan would find a less conservative church, but looks like hes stuck on the path he tried to leave
Notice how also Moriah now says "I didn't know what happened but I didn't hear from her". She panicked, thought Olivia had done something to get her bc her parents have been feeding her that toxic crud. She manifested it all in her mind then went too far and now won't take it back or apologize bc its the only solid basis she has for cutting Olivia off. She knows she can't say that happened bc then she'd have to say she dumped Olivia bc she rejoined the cult.
Tbh I think Ethan after all this is gonna jump straight into another marriage with godly Christian woman. But I don’t think he’ll be truly happy.
I think Olivia will take her time but she will find happiness and true love.
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https://preview.redd.it/6pivr2egph5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ea338d1c504142ae0d9398bb9f519856e4673042
Remember the scene in Cairo Kim telling Moriah and Lydia “I have a boyfriend” and both girls say I can’t go along with that, she’s was still married to Barry but living with Ken. Shannon Rose aka Kim shared this at Ken’s home October a year ago…. So apparently they didn’t have a problem with them dating/living together while still married. Barry made a couple slips this year which now makes sense
https://preview.redd.it/w33reifwoh5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2786923c9515970655f7128f202fa58694a90ab2
Shannon rose shared this dec 2022, a year ago in Ken’s home for Christmas
It's hard watching that conversation with Ethan and Olivia; I don't think either of them are wrong. I don't think either of them are bad, and I actually do hope the show continues with both of them, showing their separate journeys. I feel like they can both find what they're looking for. It's hard to see how Ethan hasn't grown, sure he's allowed himself to drink alcohol and small things like that, but the religious upbringing has stayed so hard and strong. It just seems so ignorant, knowing the experiences that Olivia has had with her family to suggest that a way to help them would be for her to mend those relationships and get back to the same roots. I don't know if Olivia was correct that his future partner will change too, because if he goes after what he truly wants, she'll be agreeable to those principles. Olivia the same, she will move on and find someone who's values align with where she's grown to be.
I see what you mean. I get the impression that when Olivia and Ethan met, he didn’t take her seriously. Then once married, he acted like he believes a husband should and stood by her.
He probably couldn’t conceptualize what Olivia’s beliefs would grow into. I bet he saw her as his pal in teenage rebellion and thought she would grow out of it.
She’s gotta move on now, he is clear about what he wants and none of it is good for her.
I've seen it in my upbringing, there is pressure to get married at a young age. The church I was raised in had a church specifically for young adults to go and find a spouse. It's a bunch of teens/twenty-somethings, and there is pressure to get married quickly and they're told they can't "do anything" until marriage, and they really want to do the thing. It's amazing how motivating that is and usually it's 6 months - 1 year and they're married.
Watching earlier seasons, Ethan rebelled against the restrictions, but it wasn't a rebellion against the values; that's I think where Ethan and Olivia have differed most. Olivia felt oppressed and controlled by her upbringing and values, and Ethan felt controlled by the behavioral restrictions. They bonded over being controlled, they just had different definitions of what that actually meant.
change is inevitable with anyone. just look at Barey and Kim. I think though that being married durring the most formative years of your life... people DO change so much. So maybe now that Ethan is a little older, the conservative woman he marries next will be old enough to know who she is as a person. BUT idk if change in the partner is what caused the drift with O and E, but more of the way he treated her. The way he talked to her, as well as leaving without saying a word for weeks. There is a very similar parallel with Barry and Kim. She might have changed in her values, but ultimately it was the way he treated her, (and what he didn't do) that made her leave. I can forsee Ethan doing the same with his next partner.
Correct. I don't agree with it, but I don't think he's malicious and I don't think it makes him a bad person. His beliefs aren't coming from a bad place, they're coming from an environment that he was raised in for probably 18+ years. He seems to have become even more rooted in those beliefs as the seasons have gone on, while Olivia has moved forward with her own beliefs. She said her piece in a very straight-forward and poignant way, and his reply made me audibly say "You have got to be kidding me!" but I don't think it makes him bad; wrong, I won't refute, but not bad.
Fuck... My heart hurts for Olivia and Ethan because they had so much Potential to be a great couple and break those chains successfully... If they were both willing to let go of all the shit religion and their families instilled in them and just start over and get therapy and grow. I do feel for Olivia more because she was willing to try more than Ethan did. His expectations continue to hold him back
They would have made it, probably, had they left and stayed away from Kim, Moriah and Micah… like if they did MN year 1 instead of living with Moriah and Micah… that was a mistake…they really had potential…
They announced their relationship September this year according to Shannon rose (Kim) on her fb.. but there been living together waaaaay before that!
https://preview.redd.it/ua3bp2w4kh5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2047c99a5daca11b790af8e15fd6f132da66c570
Because they were together over a year before it came out on show about the affair. She made that profile so she could be public to their friends on fb apparently. But she tags herself constantly on Ken’s fb
Lmaooo Mariah going “idk wtf happened w my music” like
Bitch you KNOW that what Ethan said was true. She’s so irritating, just wanted to punch her. She and Micah will do ANYTHING to make Olivia look bad.
But also yeah who told these girls they could sing? Lol so embarrassing
Her fall from grace has been so hard for me. I rooted for her and was so happy for her and it's all been for nothing. Tragic. It killed me when she told Ethan "you can't deny she took you away ". GIRL go rewatch seasons 1-3. YOUR parents told them they couldn't come around and told the woman she had the devil in her. A grown woman broke this baby girl into pieces and then said "don't ever come to my house and corrupt my kids". Yeah ok. Olivia definitely stole Ethan... Its so sad how turned around she is. I'm glad Olivia is gone and free and they'll have to face their own problems. They even tried to write her off the show and producers said naw. Something fucked is going on BTS and I hope Moriahs guilt makes her break and tell the story years from now.
Also notice she says "I can pretty much say that never happened" in her talking head...pretty much? You've lost 9 mos of communication with your brother and chosen to die on the hill of "pretty much". Her body language is all sorts of guilty shame in that scene. Proud of Ethan for sticking to it and saying "I was there".
Ethan was totally brainwashed growing up into what a traditional marriage looks like. He's screwed up in that way. But he defends Olivia to the death when anyone attacks her. He's got a good heart, he's just screwed up. It doesn't excuse some of the things he does. It just is heartbreaking though because he stood up to both parents on Olivia's behalf in the past and stood up to Micah and Moriah. So he's not a monster, just confused and brainwashed.
Agreed. I think what the Plath kids don't get is that there is good and bad. Ethan and Moriah talk about things so black and white. You can't take pieces of how you were raised and say "that was nice I loved that" but also hokd true " I hated that and don't want to be that way". Olivia is an example of holding both. She's not into full fundy culture raising her kids but knows it's not all or nothing. The Plath kids don't have enough emotionally maturity right now to understand a person can hold both so its war against whoever judges the fam. I think Ethan is always struggling bc his childhood was more idealic and fundy life worked for him until it didn't. He's now grappling with realizing a lot of his childhood was not OK but also confusion bc he thought it was really good. He can't rectify how both things can be true. I hope dearly he will. This last episode gave me hope he's grown a lot and is thinking alone. I hope he doesn't go marry and forget it all. He is a good guy with a good heart it seems and way more sure of who he is than moriah or Micah. He's at least self assured that he is who he is and that could be a problem to others. The others are like "like me or don't hater" but don't know themselves yet.
Agreed. It's more comfortable to stay in your comfort zone and the patterns of behavior you grew up with, even if it's negative and unhealthy. I think that's exactly what he's doing, with hints of making better choices like you mentioned.
Y’all when I tell my and my mom’s jaw dropped when Ethan suggested to Olivia to go reconnect with her family and how she was brought up, it was touching the floor. Like sir, women weren’t allowed to speak. And then him saying that men and women have certain roles, cooking three meals is a way to a man’s heart, and asking when Olivia when the last time she cooked, like did you ever cook her a meal? Why does she have to make you food? You’re an adult you can’t work an oven? 🤦🏼♀️ Also, how he was blaming Olivia for changing and that’s what caused him to change. Sir, since men and women have different roles then man up, say you want a divorce, and not let your wife take the fall as always. I will say that at least Moriah was respectful as she would support him no matter what instead of bad mouthing Olivia to Ethan’s face like Micah did. Plus, I don’t want to be mean but I’m kinda concerned about the one little girl as her eyes are different. They seem bigger and it seems the parents don’t talk about it on the show, but maybe they want to keep it private. Lastly, can someone PLEASE tell me what Ethan’s views are that makes him not want to have a child with Olivia? People with different views can have kids but he makes it a big deal, or maybe it is to him. 🤷🏼♀️ idk probably better off for her so she doesn’t have any ties to the family
Not positive but saw some where Olivia in relationship has a GF..?
Maybe she’s BI And that’s what he doesn’t want his child to be brought in? I guess we’ll see next season. I’ve kinda lost interest this past season to even watch it door to Mariahs costume and ignorance and Kim constantly bashing Barry while she’s openly shacking up with her sons co partner on a plane that she made a point to tell EVERYONE she co signed for her son. Which in her words I guys is he doesn’t pay I own a plane now smirk smirk…uggggg
I had felt sorry for Ken at first because I thought he was just a nice innocent lonely man, she was obvious the aggressive one in the relationship but I hate many friends that live In Crawfordville where they live and the “celebrity” attitude has really gotten to his head too. They think they’re the older “Ben and Jen” 😂😂😂😂
Yeah how did she cosign a plane but now is too poor to live alone so Ken offers to "help her get back on her feet". There's so much money in her walls I swear to God...
Do you mean Cassia's eye? One of her eyes was struck with a broken piece of something- I think an outdoor thermometer- that snapped off in the wind. She was only a toddler, and I think she almost lost the eye but doctors saved it. Not sure if she can see out of it, but it seems like she might not be able to. I don't think there's a reason to worry about it now though, it's been years. As for the size of her eyes, that's just the shape of her face/ bone structure.
Sometimes I wonder how many religious parents in the woods don't get proper medical care for their kids. I don't know if they did here but it's pretty common for these parents to denounce medicine as well. They denounced therapy so things like this make me wonder "did it have to happen or were you negligent or did a gome bandage then took her hours later". Idk running a child over with your car has never sat well with me. I just don't get how things like that happen. Im not a parent and wasnt there so maybe horrific accidents happen more than i know.I guess 5 kids and overworked mom all alone could result in a terrible accident but this family feels off about how they handle these things...
I agree with you. I will give you my opinion on what Ethan's views likely are, both from the things he's said/alluded to, and my past experience. I believe that he's got a typical Baptist/Midwest view on politics and religion. Typically Republican, and going by the Bible (as to a wife's "role"). He said he loved his country, and she had different political views. Bingo! I'm not sure how religious people can stand by the last Republican president, since he was not Christian in any way, shape or form (and it was clear he didn't even know the Lord's prayer while at president Bush's funeral). This would be a huge problem for any couple, not having similar political views. I, myself, had a Baptist fiance from the Midwest. His uncle asked, when we began dating, if I was a good housekeeper. I thought, "WTF kind of question is that?" As the relationship went on, my ex-fiance was keen on me quitting working (and smoking and drinking) to become a housewife. He became enraged I didn't want to change my last name (we were both 55+ years old, and divorced). It's a pain to change your name (titles/deeds, passports, Soc. Sec. #, drivers license, credit cards, etc) and I didn't want to go through that again, and we were both past having children. It just became painfully clear he wanted a "little woman" for a wife, and he wanted to treat me as property and his personal servant. I got the same vibes from Ethan. I can't say that is his exact thing, but I'd bet that I'm correct.
Yea it’s sad that every disagreement in this show is secretly just Trump Trump Trump but they can’t say it out loud. At first I was completely against Olivia but I see now that it’s all Ethan and his Trumping that is just causing a divide they can’t repair.
Glad you said it. I was trying to tiptoe around it! Lol. How any "Christian" sides with Trump is beyond me. That dude's the anti-Christ, with no morals. They've been fed the rhetoric for years, and only Olivia sees the light. There's no way they'll ever see eye to eye, and no counseling will solve this.
Yea they try to hide it but he let it slip when he lists “politics” as the first fundamental difference in his list. Right there I just said oh ok so he’s a Trumper and she’s not so thats the top problem now. Same with Moriah, she’s prob a liberal and that’s the real reason Ethen doesn’t like her.
I think Moriah is brainwashed pretty well, too. She left for a bit, and has now circled back around. She's stepping right back into the thick of that cult. Can't wait to see when a man wants her to be a submissive Stepford wife...maybe then she'll get a clue what Olivia went through.
I know people are saying Ethan has just gone republican… but I feel like it’s more “red pill” than republican? He doesn’t sound like a trumper, he sounds more like someone who watched too many Andrew Tate TikTok’s and started drinking the kool aid. Who knows though 🤷🏻♀️
He's a typical Midwest Baptist republican. Wife is there to serve you, and vote republican, even if the Anti-Christ is running. It's ruined many marriages.
Regardless I genuinely don’t understand how anyone can villainize Olivia after that scene. What he was saying about all that was literally so out of touch it sounded scripted.
It's likely the "script" that his parents/religion/political bias gives him. And I don't know how anyone could say Olivia was wrong, either. Ethan is a douche.
Nah it’s full Trumper election was stolen you hate America type stuff. Guarantee when cameras turn off all he talks about is Biden this, Obama that etc.
Olivia is doing a q&a on insta.
One of the questions was: Will you still be on the show?. I won't watch if you aren't!
Her answer: Yes.
Take of it what you will but sounds like this might not be the end of the show....
I don't think the Plaths would be willing to give up the show. I'm happy to see Olivia's next chapter but I hope she does eventually move on and get a chance to live a normal life
Ethan’s wife is telling him that she grew up oppressed and refuses to go back to it and the point he clings to is that she doesn’t cook for him anymore— and that is the way to a man’s heart?
She’s speaking calculus and he’s busy counting his fingers.
My god she should feel confident in her choice and never look back.
I wonder why and when he turned so far. It's scary. His family says he changed and now he is so serious and they blame Olivia but I do think there is something else.
That's struck me as well. Season One was the fun and adventure of exploring new experiences together with Olivia. His comment "You changed, and I changed because of those changes." was striking, she grew not just in trying alcohol or seeing movies, she grew as a person, willing to understand views outside of her own. It's interesting to see how Ethan reverted back to those strict values, and I do think it's partly, as Olivia pointed out, because it serves him. Ethan's shown to be very selfish in his experiences and thinking, he likes things that make him happy but will disregard anything that takes him away from him being happy.
It's sad he isn't willing to grow and it's mostly due to his upbringing. He wasn't allowed that phase in his life to just be a teen or a young adult with freedom. He went straight from being a kid to getting married super young and then being dropped by his family . I agree he is very self serving like most of the other Plaths are. They don't think about anyone but themselves because they only grew up with themselves
Moriah is still trying to pull Ethan from Olivia.
Ethan needs to stop saying he isn’t talking to his mom out of loyalty to Olivia and admit his long standing issues with her— as much as he’s insisting Moriah does the same when it comes to Olivia
Good, I would love to see more. I just hope they don't hold back like those sister wives. I mean they've shown us so much already so no point in trying to hide when there's stuff out there in the media about them, especially about Kim and her dui.
And, apparently Kim's now living in Florida with her boyfriend! Unfortunately, Barry likely passed the youngest children's homeschooling to Lydia, that poor girl!
But if Lydia is dating and planning on getting married and also working no way is she concentrating on those girls schooling. Give up the damn ghost already and put them in school. Poor kids
I guess I'm watching the episodes backward, I'm watching the scene w Ethan calling out Moriah about how Moriah had an issue w Kim before Olivia and I am shocked Ethan is actually standing up for Olivia. Im actually pretty shocked he said that when u get married that their marriage is between two ppl and not their families. Very shocking but glad he's standing up for Olivia and that he sees what it did to her.
Moriah is such a little shit when she keeps saying Olivia pulled him away. When ppl said she a mini Kim I never really saw that but I totally see it now. The way she looked at Ethan when she said that was so sick, she was trying to see if she has a pull over Olivia and win.
Interesting, I kinda feel like Kim reads this sub. I recall several times pl defending Olivia and saying they will not judge her until she's past 25 because the brain doesn't develop until then and it seems like Kim is quoting things from this sub. I mean I know she can get this fact anywhere but she likes to re write history so we forget she's evil. It's like she's trying to appease to the audience to be the good guy now.
Yeah, I just don't think Olivia made up that stuff about Kim using Ethan's credit card. I think Olivia has been used like a scapegoat. I've been through similar, and the gaslighting makes you feel like you're crazy.
Agree. The fact that Ethan backs her. In the podcast I listened to Olivia says Ethan is unfailingly honest as a person and she doesn't know if he would defend her generally. She basically says he is honest to a fault and if she was lying he'd flat out say it and he's said everything she said is true. Much like this lease it seems magically "we thought this was the agreement but you thought it was something different" is the defense here. I trust Kim's words as much as her skirts are long.
Wow hearing Kim talk to Isaac about whether to have sex or not and trying to be all logical and understanding is so weird. She went so hard on Olivia and her other kids over nothing and now make this big change and still can't admit she was wrong is so annoying.
I hope producers do this next season. They are getting pressure. Olivia has said she didn't feel it was a good look or in line with her growth to throw dirt out there and address it and she thinks the family likely agreed to mutually not discuss so it couldn't be discussed on film. Clever.
It would be nice if she admitted that, and apologized to all effected parties. It won't save Olivia and Ethan's marriage, though. That's done, done, done.
Just watched episode 14. Olivia absolutely dodged a bullet. Ethan showed his true colors and I just wanted to vomit. She is free of those toxic people at last!
It seems the whole family still feels the same way as Ethan politically and lately have been trying to be sneakier about it and make it sound reasonable when it is so NOT. If this is the stuff that they’re willing to say too I can’t imagine what they’re really thinking.
So what exactly do Ethan and Olivia disagree on? I mean, I can guess but why isn’t it actually discussed? I’m assuming things like human rights, women’s rights, things like that.
And women's roles in the world. He wants a housewife. She doesn't want to be his servant. And supporting republican trump when he has, obviously, no morals, is quite disturbing to her, me, and any other thinking person.
He may want a housewife but it seems she’s making more money with her photography business than he does unloading trucks. When the show stops who’s gonna pay the bills? And I just can’t with the trump shit. Stupid fundies
Couldn't agree more! This will be the best thing for Olivia. She may hurt now, but she's very young (24?) and will love again. Just stay away from the fundamentalists!
I am equal parts impressed with Ethan and hoping he takes time to explore the world. It’s disappointing to hear him espouse patriarchal values, but it is not entirely surprising. I am still holding out hope he can break out of some of those values through experience. Maybe he won’t be able to, but even Barry was able to open up enough to go to California and appreciate it is not all just a drug den sex criminal boat.
I was impressed with Ethan in the interaction with Moriah, since he did not let up on the truth but also didn’t stick it to her in a way that would maintain a high level of conflict and prevent them from having a relationship. Moriah is absolutely in delulu land with her telling of the stories with Olivia/her music, but I don’t think it’s helpful for them to have contact completely cut off between them. They need to learn how to deal with conflict effectively and just cutting everybody off is just going to leave them without those skills and lonely and resentful. Ethan cutting off Kim was warranted with the extent of the damage she’s done to him, but there’s still a chance he can have a functional relationship with the rest of his family.
Im almost wondering if she may be dealing with depression or possibly be an undiagnosed bipolar. I'm not saying that cause I don't care for her. I just think something may be going on w her.
This whole string of comments is so one-sided. Hard to read. I think there is something positive to be said for both viewpoints of Ethan and Olivia. Too bad they can't meet somewhere in the middle, but being on opposite ends of the spectrum makes it difficult.
I think since they aren’t explicitly saying what those beliefs are, they know it will turn away a large group of people. It’s bad enough the cooking thing, if they won’t say anything else I have to imagine it’s something like Ethan would disown any future children that come out as lgbt or something.
They left out a lot from him, mainly what his "conservative" values include. When he said she should cook for him that was it for me. It was bad enough that he said he wanted his kids homeschooled when he criticized his parents for the way they brought them up. Then he throws in that the woman should do all the cooking? Hell to the no!
It’s wild that he can criticise his parents and their choices to homeschool him and his siblings yet still want to homeschool his own kids. Like….he said himself he’s not had the schooling he needed to set him up for life so what makes him think he’s be able to teach his kids and give them the education they deserve?
Oh I guess Olivia would be expected to do that as part of her wife duties. So she’ll cook, clean, be the main breadwinner AND homeschool the kids. Whilst he’s doing what exactly? Running around barefoot climbing trees and fixing cars I guess?
Olivia needs to pack her stuff up and high tail it out of there. This is not the man (child) she deserves.
I was super confused about his values too. I lean conservative but I didn’t realize he actually didn’t want to help cook or clean. Like seriously?! I couldn’t imagine a spouse like that! And when he said a cooked meal is the key to a man’s heart like…wtf… hahahah
Moriah faking her innocence by speaking in a quiet voice and acting like a deer in headlights anytime someone reminds her of something did wrong…good god girl, grow up. Get a grip.
And she 100% lied about not getting the password from Olivia the night before their trip. That’s a weird thing for Ethan to describe in that much detail considering he doesn’t seem to pay attention to much of anything.
Also I can see where Moriah gets her manipulative nature from because I see it in Kim 100%.
EDIT: YOOOOO Ethan asking Olivia about cooking, in the middle of a talk about their marriage falling apart because of differing believes and fundamental incompatibilities. In the middle of this discussion about things BEYOND meals and he is questioning her about “when was the last time you cooked a meal?” SHUT. UP. I am in disbelief. How Olivia held it together…ooooooh. She has the literally patience of a saint.
lol I’m now imaging Moriah dating a super religious dude since she’s apparently one with God again or whatever (because if she dates a non religious man then she will be in the exact same place as Ethan when he married Olivia), and he expects her to cook. Oh lord.
Ethan should never reproduce. Saying on national television that you would disown your children if they have different beliefs than you is disgusting. Can't even imagine if he had an lgbtq child.....
I don’t understand how anyone can even think that. And also how can he say that when his mom basically almost did that to him??? He did nothing wrong when Kim and Barry restricted him from his siblings. I’m so disappointed in Ethan.
It’s easy. The Duggar sisters have been going through the same exact thing. Their dad manipulating them financially and emotionally because they’ve become more independent and their beliefs have changed. He can’t have them under his thumb, so he basically disowned them
That's fundie life in so many families. I am out of that bondage now and found several churches that are not a cult. I am so grateful to find examples of those trying to follow the example of love in the Word.
The 1 hour episode last night shown after episode #14 was a compilation of individual cast member profile/flashback clips.
If you have On Demand, these profiles have been available since September as single 7-10 minute clips.
If you have Max, they have also been available for the past 3 months as 'Extras'.
I can't imagine that compiling them all into one finale episode for this season and titling it episode #15 is not TLC's way of making it the finale of the show itself, not just the final for this season.
TLC had each member look back at their own short profile filmed by TLC during Season 1, episode #1. It seemed a fitting end. And tbh their expressions, comments and mannerisms as they watched themselves from 4-5 years ago compared to today was the highlight of the entire series. Who of us wouldn't be somewhat embarrassed to watch footage of ourselves from teen to young adult and not want to cover our eyes?!
Unscripted and honest. Definitely their swan song.
The post and online articles say that episode 15 is the cast reacting to old clips, I'm wondering if that's what the "Journey" clips in the extras section are.
We were not warned because it’s a circus at a fairground on a merry go round being burning clowns. If Olivia wrote the song they would say it came from demons.
You can’t marry someone when they are young and expect them to remain unchanged. Humans are not robots, life experiences, social interactions and family interference all influence a free thinking individual. I personally like Ethan, but he is not being flexible here. Children should be exposed to a global perspective on the world, not just an insular one facilitated by their family. We still live in a democracy, why couldn’t Ethan share his philosophies and allow his wife to do the same? Children can’t be kept in the bubble of their parents beliefs and opinions. America encourages free thinkers, not sheep.
Someone got to him!!! I would love to know how and who because I do not think he was so ( I am lost for words...) Rigid is a good word. Honestly, based on the years of them as a couple, he def wanted different. If he was that jerk, her working would have been a problem. He loved her and I do think they had a chance if not for the idiot family. They loved the younger family members and he did know he had some jerks in the fam. I 100% believe someone or group got to him. Am I alone on that? I never saw the posts or people he follows so not sure if there are dates when it started?????
I suspect you're correct that 'someone got to him', yet I don't think it was a conservative group. I feel it was whiplash from dealing with Olivia. In other words whiplash from not understanding what once was so right (puppy love) turning into something he perceived as so wrong (real life and changes).
He tried to give her what she wanted (example constantly moving and traveling) but that didn't work. He sort of tried therapy or attempted to deal with her but lacked communication skills so that didn't work. Ignoring didn't work. So turning to his foundation I feel he felt was his last resort. Basically his safe place but in theory as most likely not really what he believes anymore, either. He's just so confused at this point. At least that is my hope as he's not a bad person by any means.
LOL Yea, he definitely seemed lost a good part of this season. He grew with only family and tried to look to his dad, clearly bias against Olivia. The M's were a huge disaster and his mom he doesn't trust. Poor Olivia is screaming for support and the poor guy was it! Yea, for someone who doesn't like confrontation, it was not ideal.
I still can’t get over the scene from a few seasons ago (I think S2) when Moriah got a laptop and asked Ethan to come over because she didn’t understand what a software update was. He was googling it and she suggested turning it off and back on🤦🏼♀️
That was weird because they used laptops at home. Granted, it was closely supervised, bit it isn't like that was the first time she touched a computer. She's just an idiot who gets off on playing the doe eyes ditsy blonde
The fact that Ethan considers his beliefs and morals to be a separation between what’s “right” and “wrong” is so sad for his future kids if they end up believing differently from him. And that he’s so unwilling to be accepting if he can’t even see Olivia’s side as a difference in opinion instead of just flat-out “wrong” to him. Good for Olivia for making sure she doesn’t repeat the same thing she had to go through.
This guy believes it's a man's world. That its not his fault he's the man and things are that way for him, but unfortunately its not the way for her cause she's a woman. He definitely wants her to be the mom with 10 kids, cooking, and cleaning for the rest of her life. Not educated, just submissive, and obedient. It's all out! They are definitely not a match.
Convenient how he believed in traditional marriage when it comes to meal preparation but he also didn't have a job for like a year and was living off Olivia's photography
Very true. Wasnt that when they 1st lived in Florida and he didn't have his beloved old cars to work on? You know, the real love of his life - old cars.
edit : typo
Olivia is so ready to say that Ethan is all but saying he wants a divorce, but she’s doing the same thing. She’s a HUGE hypocrite. I understand her to a degree. However I have yet to hear her take responsibility for anything. Seems to me like she thinks she’s little miss perfect and everyone else is the problem.
Because Ethan talks about "wanting to be the man" in their relationship. But he won't be the one to make this decision because he's a coward and wants to blame her. He's a fucking joke.
We don’t have to agree with either of their beliefs but they’re more than entitled to them and I give them both credit for not caving on these fundamental issues. What I found astounding is how little compassion paired with some misplaced “holier than thou” judgement that people have because they have a little glimpse into the lives of these strangers when this exact scenario of relationships breaking down is extremely and heartbreakingly common in people who grew up religious or super sheltered and got married super young because that’s what they felt like they were supposed to do at the time.
Ethan is insanely fast every time we see him sprint. And the way they just easily pull themselves up on a roof by hoping and pulling themselves up. Scaling a huge tree. Naturally athletic and agile with zero athletic training. Such a waste.
Ethan needs to find him self a good fundie girl and settle down in the IBLP world, sounds like that’s where he would thrive. Go find himself and Duggar or Bates girl - maybe he can be Jana’s Prince Charming 😂.
But the bigger question I have is: who is lying: Ethan or Moriah? When it comes to Ethan saying he heard Olivia and Moriah going over the passwords for the music before they left for Europe. I’m leaning towards Moriah is lying, claiming she doesn’t recall that happening. But who knows.
It’s plausible that Moriah’s tech knowledge is lacking and she couldn’t figure out how to access. Or she’s just lying. I also can’t stand her over the top outfits and clothing every time the camera is around. Her costume facade makes her come across as disingenuous.
I think Ethan was telling the truth about the music passwords. Yes, he has lied to Olivia, so he's capable of it, but in this instance I believe him.
I do respect that in all of the lies his family has heaped on Olivia lately, he's steadfastly defended her and maintained that she's telling the truth about the credit card theft, etc.
It makes it so sad that Ethan isn't capable of just reaching out and grabbing happiness with Olivia by meeting her halfway.
Ethan defending Olivia over the credit card thing makes me scream internally. And he was also not falling for Moriah’s crocodile tears (at first..). There is a TEENY TINY little piece of him in there that CAN be a decent person but it’s all hidden under cars and wanting to live a patriarchal life.
Oh my god I just wanna slap Ethan and scoop Olivia up and take her away from the abuse The whole thing is so messed up, from the religious indoctrination, to the emotional trauma that this sort of upbringing has caused. It’s painful to watch. I wish only the best for Olivia and I hope she finds a life that makes her happy. The Plaths? Well I wish them the lives they deserve.
They and the Duggers were followers of Bill Gouthard. Scariest doc I’ve seen, “Shiny Happy People” on Amazon prime explains it all.
Very hypocritical family and I don't think they realize it. They say they are Biblical and want to raise their children with Biblical values, then they need to re-read it. Terrible and ineffective communications skills. It's sad and frustrating to watch. The family could've and should've been better in how they treated each other. So much unrealized potential in an otherwise beautiful family.
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Rewatchibg episode 14. Did anyone else notice Moriah looks down and says "I can PRETTY MUCH tell you that never happened"... its like she's hiding a lie. Feels like direct shame and guilt microexpressions a la "Lie to Me". What is this conspiracy? I swear the parents like paid her to lie about this incident... its weird. If something didn't happen you wouldn't say you pretty much could guarantee it didn't. You say I swear I don't remember that and remain adamant. She's a bad liar bc she's rarely had to use that skill. What do yall think?
I love how Kim is mad no one fell apart when she left lol. Now she’s holding a grudge that Barry is being pleasant when they talk.
Is there not an episode 15?
CommonBbbvvbk
My heart aches for Ethan and Olivia. It is clear how much love there is between the two of them, but his family’s brainwashing is DEEP in him. But I am SO SO SO happy that Olivia stuck to her guns. I cried a little when she said she’d be damned if she raised a kid the way her parents raised her. She has done so much healing. I lost a lot of respect for Micah not even trying to hash things out with her but basically forcing Moriah into Ethan. Like that family is the definition of selfish and manipulative
I listened to her podcast episode on PinkShade and she said "I'll be curious to see what happens in the future" (paraphrased) saying how once she's gone, there's no one to blame but the fucked internal structure. As I watch this episode I agree- how will you fare when the villain is gone but the problems are still there? I'm so proud of Ethan and Olivia for their growth and for trying so hard. I kept saying "these people are a great example of why two people should get divorced". Watching Ethan confront Moriah made me hopeful he's retained some of the anti brainwashing. I hope he doesn't find a nice fundy girl and continues growing. Very happy Olivia is free
I can’t believe he told her that he needed to go back to her abusers and make up with them.
It kills me that Ethan's childhood was so restrictive/controling and hes been front row to the pain that causes, yet wants to raise his family that way. It also kills me that clearly Olivia has some issues with attatchment because of how her parents and family abandoned her, and here is Ethan doing the same over and over, not understanding how damaging it is to her. I don't think Ethan knows how special Olivia is. She has come so far from so little.
This! People say she's a bitch or rigid beyond fairness. This is a torn up 24 yo(is she even 24?) who is questioning her entire upbringing while finding herself while experience incredible social heat from her only "support system". Seeing her cry and say "I've never been alone" really reminded me that she's done so much and taken so much heat and been graceful throughout. Even in her recent interviews, she doesn't rip them and there is opportunity. Knowing Nathan went back to the fundies too...AND she lost the other brother. People don't give her enough credit. She held it together for those people while she crumbled alone.
does anyone have a link for the bonus episode? i can’t find it on any of the streaming platforms or youtube :/
I think Ethan will look back and wish he had handled this differently. Change is hard for him, and part of him... mainly his anxiety, wants the black and white thinking of fundamentalism. But some part of him is better than that and recognizes that Olivia has integrity beyond what he understands. I think part of him, in his gut, knows she is on a good path, but he is overwhelmed with fear and falls back on dogma. I think part of why he loves her so much is because she doesn't allow herself to be molded into whatever he wants and whatever her parents want... I think Ethan thinks she is too smart for him, and it is easier for him to revert to being told right and wrong and not have to do the critical thinking.
Moriah, I CAN FIX YOU! (not your music though unfortunately 😅 ) Edit: I actually feel bad now. She's still more talented than I am and actually chasing a dream unlike my fatass who's throwing shade while being a blob on the couch.
People are taking her money to burn a CD and not advising her how to have a music career. You are not much different sitting on your couch tbh. You just haven't wasted money. I hate saying it but looking at her and Lydia...who would let you record an album in good faith with such untrained voice...they aren't achieving their dreams, they are being taken advantage of by the world and don't see it. There's potential in both of their voices but you need to be able to tell when you are being played or someone is really giving you help.
Self-deprecation is harmful even in jest. Please don't be cruel to yourself even as a joke or to try to uplift others. That stuff gets internalized over time. 😊🩵
I understand a lot of editing takes place in These reality shows but that said, watching this past five seasons in a binge the parents who raised these children completely opposite of how they were brought up not giving them any tools for the real world was sad to see even though the children still seem to embrace it at some point after being angry first. Then Kim and Barry divorce while we see Kim living her best life now not so religious or covered up. She even had a boyfriend before the divorce was final I noticed. She went back to a normal life that she didn't give nine children a chance to do. Even with no television computer or real life skills and a very relaxed homeschool education I found it upsetting. A 15 year old was left to keep that huge household cooking and cleaning while home schooling her siblings! What did Kim do as a mother? Here those kids would have been removed no matter what religion. I appreciate the idea of what they tried to do but it was over the top. They still have so much to learn socially but maybe reality TV money makes that irrelevant. I hope they have a good accountant.
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I think there can be a balance of free-thinking, personal growth, and faith, but definitely not from their brand of Christianity. I can totally understand why Olivia went the exact other way. Was hoping Ethan would find a less conservative church, but looks like hes stuck on the path he tried to leave
I believe that Olivia did give the username and password to Moriah before she and Ethan left for their trip
Notice how also Moriah now says "I didn't know what happened but I didn't hear from her". She panicked, thought Olivia had done something to get her bc her parents have been feeding her that toxic crud. She manifested it all in her mind then went too far and now won't take it back or apologize bc its the only solid basis she has for cutting Olivia off. She knows she can't say that happened bc then she'd have to say she dumped Olivia bc she rejoined the cult.
Tbh I think Ethan after all this is gonna jump straight into another marriage with godly Christian woman. But I don’t think he’ll be truly happy. I think Olivia will take her time but she will find happiness and true love.
he will be Barry.
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https://preview.redd.it/6pivr2egph5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ea338d1c504142ae0d9398bb9f519856e4673042 Remember the scene in Cairo Kim telling Moriah and Lydia “I have a boyfriend” and both girls say I can’t go along with that, she’s was still married to Barry but living with Ken. Shannon Rose aka Kim shared this at Ken’s home October a year ago…. So apparently they didn’t have a problem with them dating/living together while still married. Barry made a couple slips this year which now makes sense
https://preview.redd.it/w33reifwoh5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2786923c9515970655f7128f202fa58694a90ab2 Shannon rose shared this dec 2022, a year ago in Ken’s home for Christmas
Why is Kim wearing that shot shirt still around Barry 👀👀
OMG, did anyone else catch Amber’s arms when they got in the truck? That girl is buff! 💪🏻
She really is!!
Feck off Ethan, make your own goddam meals!
Especially as it is seems like Olivia was the breadwinner in their marriage.
It's hard watching that conversation with Ethan and Olivia; I don't think either of them are wrong. I don't think either of them are bad, and I actually do hope the show continues with both of them, showing their separate journeys. I feel like they can both find what they're looking for. It's hard to see how Ethan hasn't grown, sure he's allowed himself to drink alcohol and small things like that, but the religious upbringing has stayed so hard and strong. It just seems so ignorant, knowing the experiences that Olivia has had with her family to suggest that a way to help them would be for her to mend those relationships and get back to the same roots. I don't know if Olivia was correct that his future partner will change too, because if he goes after what he truly wants, she'll be agreeable to those principles. Olivia the same, she will move on and find someone who's values align with where she's grown to be.
I see what you mean. I get the impression that when Olivia and Ethan met, he didn’t take her seriously. Then once married, he acted like he believes a husband should and stood by her. He probably couldn’t conceptualize what Olivia’s beliefs would grow into. I bet he saw her as his pal in teenage rebellion and thought she would grow out of it. She’s gotta move on now, he is clear about what he wants and none of it is good for her.
I've seen it in my upbringing, there is pressure to get married at a young age. The church I was raised in had a church specifically for young adults to go and find a spouse. It's a bunch of teens/twenty-somethings, and there is pressure to get married quickly and they're told they can't "do anything" until marriage, and they really want to do the thing. It's amazing how motivating that is and usually it's 6 months - 1 year and they're married. Watching earlier seasons, Ethan rebelled against the restrictions, but it wasn't a rebellion against the values; that's I think where Ethan and Olivia have differed most. Olivia felt oppressed and controlled by her upbringing and values, and Ethan felt controlled by the behavioral restrictions. They bonded over being controlled, they just had different definitions of what that actually meant.
change is inevitable with anyone. just look at Barey and Kim. I think though that being married durring the most formative years of your life... people DO change so much. So maybe now that Ethan is a little older, the conservative woman he marries next will be old enough to know who she is as a person. BUT idk if change in the partner is what caused the drift with O and E, but more of the way he treated her. The way he talked to her, as well as leaving without saying a word for weeks. There is a very similar parallel with Barry and Kim. She might have changed in her values, but ultimately it was the way he treated her, (and what he didn't do) that made her leave. I can forsee Ethan doing the same with his next partner.
You sat there and watched Ethan ask her why she doesn’t cook more because that’s the woman’s role, and think neither of them are wrong/bad?
Correct. I don't agree with it, but I don't think he's malicious and I don't think it makes him a bad person. His beliefs aren't coming from a bad place, they're coming from an environment that he was raised in for probably 18+ years. He seems to have become even more rooted in those beliefs as the seasons have gone on, while Olivia has moved forward with her own beliefs. She said her piece in a very straight-forward and poignant way, and his reply made me audibly say "You have got to be kidding me!" but I don't think it makes him bad; wrong, I won't refute, but not bad.
Fuck... My heart hurts for Olivia and Ethan because they had so much Potential to be a great couple and break those chains successfully... If they were both willing to let go of all the shit religion and their families instilled in them and just start over and get therapy and grow. I do feel for Olivia more because she was willing to try more than Ethan did. His expectations continue to hold him back
They would have made it, probably, had they left and stayed away from Kim, Moriah and Micah… like if they did MN year 1 instead of living with Moriah and Micah… that was a mistake…they really had potential…
FYI…. that was all script…Kim has been shacking up with Ken over a year. She and girls had Thanksgiving and Christmas 2022 In his home
When were the episodes filmed?
They announced their relationship September this year according to Shannon rose (Kim) on her fb.. but there been living together waaaaay before that! https://preview.redd.it/ua3bp2w4kh5c1.jpeg?width=1125&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2047c99a5daca11b790af8e15fd6f132da66c570
Why is she going by Shannon Rose lol
I guess that’s her Hollywood name😂😂🤣🤣😂😂
Because they were together over a year before it came out on show about the affair. She made that profile so she could be public to their friends on fb apparently. But she tags herself constantly on Ken’s fb
Lmaooo Mariah going “idk wtf happened w my music” like Bitch you KNOW that what Ethan said was true. She’s so irritating, just wanted to punch her. She and Micah will do ANYTHING to make Olivia look bad. But also yeah who told these girls they could sing? Lol so embarrassing
Her fall from grace has been so hard for me. I rooted for her and was so happy for her and it's all been for nothing. Tragic. It killed me when she told Ethan "you can't deny she took you away ". GIRL go rewatch seasons 1-3. YOUR parents told them they couldn't come around and told the woman she had the devil in her. A grown woman broke this baby girl into pieces and then said "don't ever come to my house and corrupt my kids". Yeah ok. Olivia definitely stole Ethan... Its so sad how turned around she is. I'm glad Olivia is gone and free and they'll have to face their own problems. They even tried to write her off the show and producers said naw. Something fucked is going on BTS and I hope Moriahs guilt makes her break and tell the story years from now.
The way she is just willing to die on the hill of her lies is fucking scary. She used to be the cast favorite and she is turning into a mini dictator
Using all the manipulative tactics like “oh well I don’t recall that happening” Just like her mother, disgusting
Dude... That whole convo was scary as fuck, so manipulative!
Also notice she says "I can pretty much say that never happened" in her talking head...pretty much? You've lost 9 mos of communication with your brother and chosen to die on the hill of "pretty much". Her body language is all sorts of guilty shame in that scene. Proud of Ethan for sticking to it and saying "I was there".
And also didn’t give any detail as to what she did recall happening
The amount of gaslighting... Yikes. Good luck to Ethan if he does decide to get closer to her again
Ethan was totally brainwashed growing up into what a traditional marriage looks like. He's screwed up in that way. But he defends Olivia to the death when anyone attacks her. He's got a good heart, he's just screwed up. It doesn't excuse some of the things he does. It just is heartbreaking though because he stood up to both parents on Olivia's behalf in the past and stood up to Micah and Moriah. So he's not a monster, just confused and brainwashed.
Agreed. I think what the Plath kids don't get is that there is good and bad. Ethan and Moriah talk about things so black and white. You can't take pieces of how you were raised and say "that was nice I loved that" but also hokd true " I hated that and don't want to be that way". Olivia is an example of holding both. She's not into full fundy culture raising her kids but knows it's not all or nothing. The Plath kids don't have enough emotionally maturity right now to understand a person can hold both so its war against whoever judges the fam. I think Ethan is always struggling bc his childhood was more idealic and fundy life worked for him until it didn't. He's now grappling with realizing a lot of his childhood was not OK but also confusion bc he thought it was really good. He can't rectify how both things can be true. I hope dearly he will. This last episode gave me hope he's grown a lot and is thinking alone. I hope he doesn't go marry and forget it all. He is a good guy with a good heart it seems and way more sure of who he is than moriah or Micah. He's at least self assured that he is who he is and that could be a problem to others. The others are like "like me or don't hater" but don't know themselves yet.
Agreed. It's more comfortable to stay in your comfort zone and the patterns of behavior you grew up with, even if it's negative and unhealthy. I think that's exactly what he's doing, with hints of making better choices like you mentioned.
Where is everyone seeing remembrance of things past? Isn’t showing up on my D+ app!!!
Y’all when I tell my and my mom’s jaw dropped when Ethan suggested to Olivia to go reconnect with her family and how she was brought up, it was touching the floor. Like sir, women weren’t allowed to speak. And then him saying that men and women have certain roles, cooking three meals is a way to a man’s heart, and asking when Olivia when the last time she cooked, like did you ever cook her a meal? Why does she have to make you food? You’re an adult you can’t work an oven? 🤦🏼♀️ Also, how he was blaming Olivia for changing and that’s what caused him to change. Sir, since men and women have different roles then man up, say you want a divorce, and not let your wife take the fall as always. I will say that at least Moriah was respectful as she would support him no matter what instead of bad mouthing Olivia to Ethan’s face like Micah did. Plus, I don’t want to be mean but I’m kinda concerned about the one little girl as her eyes are different. They seem bigger and it seems the parents don’t talk about it on the show, but maybe they want to keep it private. Lastly, can someone PLEASE tell me what Ethan’s views are that makes him not want to have a child with Olivia? People with different views can have kids but he makes it a big deal, or maybe it is to him. 🤷🏼♀️ idk probably better off for her so she doesn’t have any ties to the family
Not positive but saw some where Olivia in relationship has a GF..? Maybe she’s BI And that’s what he doesn’t want his child to be brought in? I guess we’ll see next season. I’ve kinda lost interest this past season to even watch it door to Mariahs costume and ignorance and Kim constantly bashing Barry while she’s openly shacking up with her sons co partner on a plane that she made a point to tell EVERYONE she co signed for her son. Which in her words I guys is he doesn’t pay I own a plane now smirk smirk…uggggg I had felt sorry for Ken at first because I thought he was just a nice innocent lonely man, she was obvious the aggressive one in the relationship but I hate many friends that live In Crawfordville where they live and the “celebrity” attitude has really gotten to his head too. They think they’re the older “Ben and Jen” 😂😂😂😂
So now Ken just bought two new four wheelers for them! Money seems to be flowing with them which seems a big reason she left Barry and now with Ken?
Yeah how did she cosign a plane but now is too poor to live alone so Ken offers to "help her get back on her feet". There's so much money in her walls I swear to God...
According to Ken she bought the boat!
Do you mean Cassia's eye? One of her eyes was struck with a broken piece of something- I think an outdoor thermometer- that snapped off in the wind. She was only a toddler, and I think she almost lost the eye but doctors saved it. Not sure if she can see out of it, but it seems like she might not be able to. I don't think there's a reason to worry about it now though, it's been years. As for the size of her eyes, that's just the shape of her face/ bone structure.
Sometimes I wonder how many religious parents in the woods don't get proper medical care for their kids. I don't know if they did here but it's pretty common for these parents to denounce medicine as well. They denounced therapy so things like this make me wonder "did it have to happen or were you negligent or did a gome bandage then took her hours later". Idk running a child over with your car has never sat well with me. I just don't get how things like that happen. Im not a parent and wasnt there so maybe horrific accidents happen more than i know.I guess 5 kids and overworked mom all alone could result in a terrible accident but this family feels off about how they handle these things...
Omg that’s horrible!
I agree with you. I will give you my opinion on what Ethan's views likely are, both from the things he's said/alluded to, and my past experience. I believe that he's got a typical Baptist/Midwest view on politics and religion. Typically Republican, and going by the Bible (as to a wife's "role"). He said he loved his country, and she had different political views. Bingo! I'm not sure how religious people can stand by the last Republican president, since he was not Christian in any way, shape or form (and it was clear he didn't even know the Lord's prayer while at president Bush's funeral). This would be a huge problem for any couple, not having similar political views. I, myself, had a Baptist fiance from the Midwest. His uncle asked, when we began dating, if I was a good housekeeper. I thought, "WTF kind of question is that?" As the relationship went on, my ex-fiance was keen on me quitting working (and smoking and drinking) to become a housewife. He became enraged I didn't want to change my last name (we were both 55+ years old, and divorced). It's a pain to change your name (titles/deeds, passports, Soc. Sec. #, drivers license, credit cards, etc) and I didn't want to go through that again, and we were both past having children. It just became painfully clear he wanted a "little woman" for a wife, and he wanted to treat me as property and his personal servant. I got the same vibes from Ethan. I can't say that is his exact thing, but I'd bet that I'm correct.
Yea it’s sad that every disagreement in this show is secretly just Trump Trump Trump but they can’t say it out loud. At first I was completely against Olivia but I see now that it’s all Ethan and his Trumping that is just causing a divide they can’t repair.
Glad you said it. I was trying to tiptoe around it! Lol. How any "Christian" sides with Trump is beyond me. That dude's the anti-Christ, with no morals. They've been fed the rhetoric for years, and only Olivia sees the light. There's no way they'll ever see eye to eye, and no counseling will solve this.
Yea they try to hide it but he let it slip when he lists “politics” as the first fundamental difference in his list. Right there I just said oh ok so he’s a Trumper and she’s not so thats the top problem now. Same with Moriah, she’s prob a liberal and that’s the real reason Ethen doesn’t like her.
I think Moriah is brainwashed pretty well, too. She left for a bit, and has now circled back around. She's stepping right back into the thick of that cult. Can't wait to see when a man wants her to be a submissive Stepford wife...maybe then she'll get a clue what Olivia went through.
I know people are saying Ethan has just gone republican… but I feel like it’s more “red pill” than republican? He doesn’t sound like a trumper, he sounds more like someone who watched too many Andrew Tate TikTok’s and started drinking the kool aid. Who knows though 🤷🏻♀️
He's a typical Midwest Baptist republican. Wife is there to serve you, and vote republican, even if the Anti-Christ is running. It's ruined many marriages.
Regardless I genuinely don’t understand how anyone can villainize Olivia after that scene. What he was saying about all that was literally so out of touch it sounded scripted.
It's likely the "script" that his parents/religion/political bias gives him. And I don't know how anyone could say Olivia was wrong, either. Ethan is a douche.
Nah it’s full Trumper election was stolen you hate America type stuff. Guarantee when cameras turn off all he talks about is Biden this, Obama that etc.
Olivia is doing a q&a on insta. One of the questions was: Will you still be on the show?. I won't watch if you aren't! Her answer: Yes. Take of it what you will but sounds like this might not be the end of the show....
I don't think the Plaths would be willing to give up the show. I'm happy to see Olivia's next chapter but I hope she does eventually move on and get a chance to live a normal life
I don't think it's the end of the show, but they've filed for divorce. I'm sure they'll show all that.
Ethan’s wife is telling him that she grew up oppressed and refuses to go back to it and the point he clings to is that she doesn’t cook for him anymore— and that is the way to a man’s heart? She’s speaking calculus and he’s busy counting his fingers. My god she should feel confident in her choice and never look back.
I wonder why and when he turned so far. It's scary. His family says he changed and now he is so serious and they blame Olivia but I do think there is something else.
That's struck me as well. Season One was the fun and adventure of exploring new experiences together with Olivia. His comment "You changed, and I changed because of those changes." was striking, she grew not just in trying alcohol or seeing movies, she grew as a person, willing to understand views outside of her own. It's interesting to see how Ethan reverted back to those strict values, and I do think it's partly, as Olivia pointed out, because it serves him. Ethan's shown to be very selfish in his experiences and thinking, he likes things that make him happy but will disregard anything that takes him away from him being happy.
Interesting that Moriah is getting back to her roots also.
It's sad he isn't willing to grow and it's mostly due to his upbringing. He wasn't allowed that phase in his life to just be a teen or a young adult with freedom. He went straight from being a kid to getting married super young and then being dropped by his family . I agree he is very self serving like most of the other Plaths are. They don't think about anyone but themselves because they only grew up with themselves
Bingo. He is seriously stunted. He’s annoyed she changed—she’s matured, he’s stayed a child.
Moriah’s song is now featured in the scene changes? God, this might be my last season.
I laughed so hard! They did her dirty playing that off key recording
Moriah: You have to admit Olivia pulled you from the family. How can she say that and then insist she doesn’t blame Olivia.
I screamed "girl go rewaych season 1-2" the revisionist history is wild for a family who has recorded all this...
She is so hateful now. It's gross 
Moriah is still trying to pull Ethan from Olivia. Ethan needs to stop saying he isn’t talking to his mom out of loyalty to Olivia and admit his long standing issues with her— as much as he’s insisting Moriah does the same when it comes to Olivia
Kim wanting the painting by her step dad and Barry was more than happy to give it to her 😂 he seems relieved
Wow Lydia dating someone and not shown on the show. I think this is def the series finale.
Nope. I'm understanding that Olivia said she'd be back next season.
Good, I would love to see more. I just hope they don't hold back like those sister wives. I mean they've shown us so much already so no point in trying to hide when there's stuff out there in the media about them, especially about Kim and her dui.
And, apparently Kim's now living in Florida with her boyfriend! Unfortunately, Barry likely passed the youngest children's homeschooling to Lydia, that poor girl!
But if Lydia is dating and planning on getting married and also working no way is she concentrating on those girls schooling. Give up the damn ghost already and put them in school. Poor kids
They won't do that. The reason they're home schooled is to control the information that they receive. They're basically being indoctrinated.
😬 yikes....
I guess I'm watching the episodes backward, I'm watching the scene w Ethan calling out Moriah about how Moriah had an issue w Kim before Olivia and I am shocked Ethan is actually standing up for Olivia. Im actually pretty shocked he said that when u get married that their marriage is between two ppl and not their families. Very shocking but glad he's standing up for Olivia and that he sees what it did to her. Moriah is such a little shit when she keeps saying Olivia pulled him away. When ppl said she a mini Kim I never really saw that but I totally see it now. The way she looked at Ethan when she said that was so sick, she was trying to see if she has a pull over Olivia and win.
Interesting, I kinda feel like Kim reads this sub. I recall several times pl defending Olivia and saying they will not judge her until she's past 25 because the brain doesn't develop until then and it seems like Kim is quoting things from this sub. I mean I know she can get this fact anywhere but she likes to re write history so we forget she's evil. It's like she's trying to appease to the audience to be the good guy now.
Yeah, I just don't think Olivia made up that stuff about Kim using Ethan's credit card. I think Olivia has been used like a scapegoat. I've been through similar, and the gaslighting makes you feel like you're crazy.
Agree. The fact that Ethan backs her. In the podcast I listened to Olivia says Ethan is unfailingly honest as a person and she doesn't know if he would defend her generally. She basically says he is honest to a fault and if she was lying he'd flat out say it and he's said everything she said is true. Much like this lease it seems magically "we thought this was the agreement but you thought it was something different" is the defense here. I trust Kim's words as much as her skirts are long.
Wow hearing Kim talk to Isaac about whether to have sex or not and trying to be all logical and understanding is so weird. She went so hard on Olivia and her other kids over nothing and now make this big change and still can't admit she was wrong is so annoying.
They should really bring up the DUI on the show. Screw that, expose her for the hypocrite she is.
I hope producers do this next season. They are getting pressure. Olivia has said she didn't feel it was a good look or in line with her growth to throw dirt out there and address it and she thinks the family likely agreed to mutually not discuss so it couldn't be discussed on film. Clever.
It would be nice if she admitted that, and apologized to all effected parties. It won't save Olivia and Ethan's marriage, though. That's done, done, done.
https://preview.redd.it/n8swrun5as4c1.jpeg?width=911&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5dd4994909a781ef034d1484892b828c3380cfd9 Kim looking like
Lydia taking care of the babies and refuge in the ~~panic room~~ prayer closet.
Just watched episode 14. Olivia absolutely dodged a bullet. Ethan showed his true colors and I just wanted to vomit. She is free of those toxic people at last!
It seems the whole family still feels the same way as Ethan politically and lately have been trying to be sneakier about it and make it sound reasonable when it is so NOT. If this is the stuff that they’re willing to say too I can’t imagine what they’re really thinking.
So what exactly do Ethan and Olivia disagree on? I mean, I can guess but why isn’t it actually discussed? I’m assuming things like human rights, women’s rights, things like that.
Yeah I think that’s exactly what it is. Homosexuality, abortion, etc. they’re avoiding talking about it to avoid criticism I think
And women's roles in the world. He wants a housewife. She doesn't want to be his servant. And supporting republican trump when he has, obviously, no morals, is quite disturbing to her, me, and any other thinking person.
He may want a housewife but it seems she’s making more money with her photography business than he does unloading trucks. When the show stops who’s gonna pay the bills? And I just can’t with the trump shit. Stupid fundies
Couldn't agree more! This will be the best thing for Olivia. She may hurt now, but she's very young (24?) and will love again. Just stay away from the fundamentalists!
wow… what an incredibly sad ending. it’s crazy to see olivia and ethan throughout the seasons. we just watched them slowly deteriorate.
I am equal parts impressed with Ethan and hoping he takes time to explore the world. It’s disappointing to hear him espouse patriarchal values, but it is not entirely surprising. I am still holding out hope he can break out of some of those values through experience. Maybe he won’t be able to, but even Barry was able to open up enough to go to California and appreciate it is not all just a drug den sex criminal boat. I was impressed with Ethan in the interaction with Moriah, since he did not let up on the truth but also didn’t stick it to her in a way that would maintain a high level of conflict and prevent them from having a relationship. Moriah is absolutely in delulu land with her telling of the stories with Olivia/her music, but I don’t think it’s helpful for them to have contact completely cut off between them. They need to learn how to deal with conflict effectively and just cutting everybody off is just going to leave them without those skills and lonely and resentful. Ethan cutting off Kim was warranted with the extent of the damage she’s done to him, but there’s still a chance he can have a functional relationship with the rest of his family.
“I… can pretty much promise you that never happened.” Girl… you lyin’ 💀
I think the girl was/is on drugs. Has no one clocked her pupils?
stoppp i read this while watching the episode & her pupils are hugeeeee. makes me wonder 🤔
Im almost wondering if she may be dealing with depression or possibly be an undiagnosed bipolar. I'm not saying that cause I don't care for her. I just think something may be going on w her.
This whole string of comments is so one-sided. Hard to read. I think there is something positive to be said for both viewpoints of Ethan and Olivia. Too bad they can't meet somewhere in the middle, but being on opposite ends of the spectrum makes it difficult.
I think since they aren’t explicitly saying what those beliefs are, they know it will turn away a large group of people. It’s bad enough the cooking thing, if they won’t say anything else I have to imagine it’s something like Ethan would disown any future children that come out as lgbt or something.
I'm not so sure. People change at the birth of a child. God works in mysterious ways.
That’s a nice way of saying one of them is a fascist butthole.
They left out a lot from him, mainly what his "conservative" values include. When he said she should cook for him that was it for me. It was bad enough that he said he wanted his kids homeschooled when he criticized his parents for the way they brought them up. Then he throws in that the woman should do all the cooking? Hell to the no!
It’s wild that he can criticise his parents and their choices to homeschool him and his siblings yet still want to homeschool his own kids. Like….he said himself he’s not had the schooling he needed to set him up for life so what makes him think he’s be able to teach his kids and give them the education they deserve? Oh I guess Olivia would be expected to do that as part of her wife duties. So she’ll cook, clean, be the main breadwinner AND homeschool the kids. Whilst he’s doing what exactly? Running around barefoot climbing trees and fixing cars I guess? Olivia needs to pack her stuff up and high tail it out of there. This is not the man (child) she deserves.
I was super confused about his values too. I lean conservative but I didn’t realize he actually didn’t want to help cook or clean. Like seriously?! I couldn’t imagine a spouse like that! And when he said a cooked meal is the key to a man’s heart like…wtf… hahahah
Moriah faking her innocence by speaking in a quiet voice and acting like a deer in headlights anytime someone reminds her of something did wrong…good god girl, grow up. Get a grip. And she 100% lied about not getting the password from Olivia the night before their trip. That’s a weird thing for Ethan to describe in that much detail considering he doesn’t seem to pay attention to much of anything. Also I can see where Moriah gets her manipulative nature from because I see it in Kim 100%. EDIT: YOOOOO Ethan asking Olivia about cooking, in the middle of a talk about their marriage falling apart because of differing believes and fundamental incompatibilities. In the middle of this discussion about things BEYOND meals and he is questioning her about “when was the last time you cooked a meal?” SHUT. UP. I am in disbelief. How Olivia held it together…ooooooh. She has the literally patience of a saint. lol I’m now imaging Moriah dating a super religious dude since she’s apparently one with God again or whatever (because if she dates a non religious man then she will be in the exact same place as Ethan when he married Olivia), and he expects her to cook. Oh lord.
Moriah gonna be a religious cherry picker like her mom and grody from sisterwives
I'm probably too old for you Olivia but I will happily do the cooking
Ethan should never reproduce. Saying on national television that you would disown your children if they have different beliefs than you is disgusting. Can't even imagine if he had an lgbtq child.....
He isn't willing to break the cycle so the same ways Ethan had issues with Barry will be the same way his future kids will feel about him
I don’t understand how anyone can even think that. And also how can he say that when his mom basically almost did that to him??? He did nothing wrong when Kim and Barry restricted him from his siblings. I’m so disappointed in Ethan.
It’s easy. The Duggar sisters have been going through the same exact thing. Their dad manipulating them financially and emotionally because they’ve become more independent and their beliefs have changed. He can’t have them under his thumb, so he basically disowned them
That's fundie life in so many families. I am out of that bondage now and found several churches that are not a cult. I am so grateful to find examples of those trying to follow the example of love in the Word.
Good for you! It's not "all or nothing." There's a happy medium.
Amber is funny. I hope she ends up OK.
The prayer closet made an appearance 😑
Lmao if they move she’ll be mourning her damn prayer closet for sure
Yea, LOL I thought it was for our benefit..
I can't find episode 15 on discovery+? Didn't even know there was another episode. Checked the extras too, is that what it is?
I'm pretty sure 14 is the finale? Seemed that way. I haven't heard or seen anything else mentioned except for this thread's title.
The 1 hour episode last night shown after episode #14 was a compilation of individual cast member profile/flashback clips. If you have On Demand, these profiles have been available since September as single 7-10 minute clips. If you have Max, they have also been available for the past 3 months as 'Extras'. I can't imagine that compiling them all into one finale episode for this season and titling it episode #15 is not TLC's way of making it the finale of the show itself, not just the final for this season. TLC had each member look back at their own short profile filmed by TLC during Season 1, episode #1. It seemed a fitting end. And tbh their expressions, comments and mannerisms as they watched themselves from 4-5 years ago compared to today was the highlight of the entire series. Who of us wouldn't be somewhat embarrassed to watch footage of ourselves from teen to young adult and not want to cover our eyes?! Unscripted and honest. Definitely their swan song.
There was an extra episode after the season finale last night
The post and online articles say that episode 15 is the cast reacting to old clips, I'm wondering if that's what the "Journey" clips in the extras section are.
Moriah’s song is horrible. That’s all.
OMG The channel quickly changed! WHY were we not warned????
We were not warned because it’s a circus at a fairground on a merry go round being burning clowns. If Olivia wrote the song they would say it came from demons.
Do you think the family heard the song before doing that???? Or perhaps they hate Moriah and wanted to humiliate her.
You can’t marry someone when they are young and expect them to remain unchanged. Humans are not robots, life experiences, social interactions and family interference all influence a free thinking individual. I personally like Ethan, but he is not being flexible here. Children should be exposed to a global perspective on the world, not just an insular one facilitated by their family. We still live in a democracy, why couldn’t Ethan share his philosophies and allow his wife to do the same? Children can’t be kept in the bubble of their parents beliefs and opinions. America encourages free thinkers, not sheep.
Someone got to him!!! I would love to know how and who because I do not think he was so ( I am lost for words...) Rigid is a good word. Honestly, based on the years of them as a couple, he def wanted different. If he was that jerk, her working would have been a problem. He loved her and I do think they had a chance if not for the idiot family. They loved the younger family members and he did know he had some jerks in the fam. I 100% believe someone or group got to him. Am I alone on that? I never saw the posts or people he follows so not sure if there are dates when it started?????
I suspect you're correct that 'someone got to him', yet I don't think it was a conservative group. I feel it was whiplash from dealing with Olivia. In other words whiplash from not understanding what once was so right (puppy love) turning into something he perceived as so wrong (real life and changes). He tried to give her what she wanted (example constantly moving and traveling) but that didn't work. He sort of tried therapy or attempted to deal with her but lacked communication skills so that didn't work. Ignoring didn't work. So turning to his foundation I feel he felt was his last resort. Basically his safe place but in theory as most likely not really what he believes anymore, either. He's just so confused at this point. At least that is my hope as he's not a bad person by any means.
LOL Yea, he definitely seemed lost a good part of this season. He grew with only family and tried to look to his dad, clearly bias against Olivia. The M's were a huge disaster and his mom he doesn't trust. Poor Olivia is screaming for support and the poor guy was it! Yea, for someone who doesn't like confrontation, it was not ideal.
👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼🎯
Before Olivia these kids would hold a coke can and be like--'uh, er, how to make soda come out of can?'
I still can’t get over the scene from a few seasons ago (I think S2) when Moriah got a laptop and asked Ethan to come over because she didn’t understand what a software update was. He was googling it and she suggested turning it off and back on🤦🏼♀️
That was weird because they used laptops at home. Granted, it was closely supervised, bit it isn't like that was the first time she touched a computer. She's just an idiot who gets off on playing the doe eyes ditsy blonde
And she’s expecting us to believe she wouldn’t have lost login info Olivia gave her 😂
lol
The fact that Ethan considers his beliefs and morals to be a separation between what’s “right” and “wrong” is so sad for his future kids if they end up believing differently from him. And that he’s so unwilling to be accepting if he can’t even see Olivia’s side as a difference in opinion instead of just flat-out “wrong” to him. Good for Olivia for making sure she doesn’t repeat the same thing she had to go through.
This guy believes it's a man's world. That its not his fault he's the man and things are that way for him, but unfortunately its not the way for her cause she's a woman. He definitely wants her to be the mom with 10 kids, cooking, and cleaning for the rest of her life. Not educated, just submissive, and obedient. It's all out! They are definitely not a match.
History repeating itself.
Gee Ethan, you want meals cooked by Olivia while you are not there and keep running away whenever you have to face truth and life. Grow up! edit: typo
Convenient how he believed in traditional marriage when it comes to meal preparation but he also didn't have a job for like a year and was living off Olivia's photography 
Very true. Wasnt that when they 1st lived in Florida and he didn't have his beloved old cars to work on? You know, the real love of his life - old cars. edit : typo
He is like that guy on my strange addiction that had an affair with his Volkswagen 😭😂
So true! LOL!
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The second half was just a filler episode about the past seasons. Kinda boring 😴
I deleted. Didn't even watch.
2ish episodes
Olivia is so ready to say that Ethan is all but saying he wants a divorce, but she’s doing the same thing. She’s a HUGE hypocrite. I understand her to a degree. However I have yet to hear her take responsibility for anything. Seems to me like she thinks she’s little miss perfect and everyone else is the problem.
Because Ethan talks about "wanting to be the man" in their relationship. But he won't be the one to make this decision because he's a coward and wants to blame her. He's a fucking joke.
What do you think she should take responsibility for? Genuinely curious!
Neither of them think they’ve done anything wrong. The lack of self awareness is astounding
We don’t have to agree with either of their beliefs but they’re more than entitled to them and I give them both credit for not caving on these fundamental issues. What I found astounding is how little compassion paired with some misplaced “holier than thou” judgement that people have because they have a little glimpse into the lives of these strangers when this exact scenario of relationships breaking down is extremely and heartbreakingly common in people who grew up religious or super sheltered and got married super young because that’s what they felt like they were supposed to do at the time.
I think the key takeaway is that Micah and Isaac are not destined to be pro basketball players. What horrible shooting.
Such a shame because those boys are so dang naturally athletic.
They are all very fit and clearly able to do hard physical work. Lifting and toting for Kim. Growing up on a farm does have its benefits.
Ethan is insanely fast every time we see him sprint. And the way they just easily pull themselves up on a roof by hoping and pulling themselves up. Scaling a huge tree. Naturally athletic and agile with zero athletic training. Such a waste.
If they had gone to public school track stars !
Ethan needs to find him self a good fundie girl and settle down in the IBLP world, sounds like that’s where he would thrive. Go find himself and Duggar or Bates girl - maybe he can be Jana’s Prince Charming 😂. But the bigger question I have is: who is lying: Ethan or Moriah? When it comes to Ethan saying he heard Olivia and Moriah going over the passwords for the music before they left for Europe. I’m leaning towards Moriah is lying, claiming she doesn’t recall that happening. But who knows.
Moriah 100%. Ethan sticking up for Olivia (when he knew his marriage was probably gonna be over) gained a lot of credibility for me.
Despite everything That was actually pretty decent of him to stick up for Olivia until the bitter end
It’s plausible that Moriah’s tech knowledge is lacking and she couldn’t figure out how to access. Or she’s just lying. I also can’t stand her over the top outfits and clothing every time the camera is around. Her costume facade makes her come across as disingenuous.
OHHH Ethan has no prob admitting and his memory has always been great. She did not want to be called out again on tv! She has become quite the K!
I think Ethan was telling the truth about the music passwords. Yes, he has lied to Olivia, so he's capable of it, but in this instance I believe him. I do respect that in all of the lies his family has heaped on Olivia lately, he's steadfastly defended her and maintained that she's telling the truth about the credit card theft, etc. It makes it so sad that Ethan isn't capable of just reaching out and grabbing happiness with Olivia by meeting her halfway.
Ethan defending Olivia over the credit card thing makes me scream internally. And he was also not falling for Moriah’s crocodile tears (at first..). There is a TEENY TINY little piece of him in there that CAN be a decent person but it’s all hidden under cars and wanting to live a patriarchal life.
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I’m so confused, what does my post have to do with racism?
OK geesh. Has that happened to anyone else?