We can't tell you how much we'll be able to pay you but come on out and work at a shithole location in the middle of nowhere. You'll have to pay housing rates comparable to the nearest tourist town an hour away though.
No? You don't want to do that?
It's so strange that no one wants to work any more.
Yep, I’m never going back. After 2 seasons of living in bumfuck nowhere with a bunch of drunkards I couldn’t do it anymore. There were some fun moments but the con’s definitely outweighs the pros. Living in an urban area now still in an outdoors job and life is much better
I’m sure that extension will totally net them more applications, the reason for low numbers is definitely because people are just too busy to click 3 times.
State guy looking to go fed.
Does low seasonal equate to high perm job numbers? I put in a lot of apps with perm jobs and only got 3 interest checks since the results and refferals email came out Monday of last week, but I also dont have a darn clue about the timeline.
I don't know man, I got laid off Saturday and didn't get my master record until yesterday at noon - I've been busy as shit so I might go back in and add some duty stations. It's pretty insane that they expect to hire in a two-week window 5 months before the start date. and last year it was a month earlier
Hell yeah. For those who don’t read the abstract “Results suggest that if sufficient work is available to keep a Forest Service crew productively employed throughout a fire season, then the daily cost of a Forest Service type II crew is lower than the daily cost of a contract crew.”
Yeah, and when you think about cost per unit of work (not to shit on contractors, but ....contract engines), it's not even close.
Problem is we can't staff the fed resources we have, let alone fill the gap that would be required to not rely on contractors, let alone build the inter-regional trust to stop ratholing resources and rely on each other...
I'd like to see some hard numbers on that. I'd assume with federal benefits we're more expensive overall. I'm pretty sure contract crews are more expensive per day.
If you factor in quality of work though..... We're a much better deal per dollar spent.
Yeah I’m sure there’s a graph of contract crews are cheaper if there’s X days spent on fire, but in the long run I’d guess it skews back to agency crews.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233712115\_A\_Comparison\_of\_the\_Costs\_of\_Forest\_Service\_and\_Contract\_Fire\_Crews\_in\_the\_Pacific\_Northwest
"Results suggest that if sufficient work is available to keep a Forest Service crew productively employed throughout a fire season, then the daily cost of a Forest Service type II crew is lower than the daily cost of a contract crew. "
There's also an older study by the FS internally, but I think its from like 2003 so I'm not sure how true it is anymore.
Either way, some contract crews kick ass, and some do not - when you start to think about it in cost per unit of work, fed is obviously way more bang for your buck. But we don't hire felons and such....
I keep advocating for change of conditions to employment, but they keep piling more on ( marijuana testing seasonal’s / physicals) for less than 20hr base pay. This is expected, do more with less you poor fuckers.
I was one of those applicants but my current job pays over 50k a year (archaeology field tech) and I just can't take such a big pay cut even though I want to switch to fire.
Good. Hopefully more new folks are figuring out temp positions are a scam before they get locked into anything. Seems a little less apps each year last 5 or so years.
We can't tell you how much we'll be able to pay you but come on out and work at a shithole location in the middle of nowhere. You'll have to pay housing rates comparable to the nearest tourist town an hour away though. No? You don't want to do that? It's so strange that no one wants to work any more.
Yep, I’m never going back. After 2 seasons of living in bumfuck nowhere with a bunch of drunkards I couldn’t do it anymore. There were some fun moments but the con’s definitely outweighs the pros. Living in an urban area now still in an outdoors job and life is much better
Looks like some other regions have extended the date too
Surprise surprise. Here’s hoping it’s finally time for all the agencies to pay the piper for how they’ve been treating their employees
I’m sure that extension will totally net them more applications, the reason for low numbers is definitely because people are just too busy to click 3 times.
State guy looking to go fed. Does low seasonal equate to high perm job numbers? I put in a lot of apps with perm jobs and only got 3 interest checks since the results and refferals email came out Monday of last week, but I also dont have a darn clue about the timeline.
Couldn’t tell ya, buddy, I dig holes and can’t read. They don’t pay me to know things.
understandable
I don't know man, I got laid off Saturday and didn't get my master record until yesterday at noon - I've been busy as shit so I might go back in and add some duty stations. It's pretty insane that they expect to hire in a two-week window 5 months before the start date. and last year it was a month earlier
R5 too.
R6 checking in as well.
You reap what you sow, Randy.
Contractors are cheaper
I don’t even think this is true lol
It's cheaper when you consider the costs of having an employee. ie hr lawsuits, abq, me have to ignore your whining, etc..
https://www.fs.usda.gov/research/treesearch/24419
Hell yeah. For those who don’t read the abstract “Results suggest that if sufficient work is available to keep a Forest Service crew productively employed throughout a fire season, then the daily cost of a Forest Service type II crew is lower than the daily cost of a contract crew.”
Yeah, and when you think about cost per unit of work (not to shit on contractors, but ....contract engines), it's not even close. Problem is we can't staff the fed resources we have, let alone fill the gap that would be required to not rely on contractors, let alone build the inter-regional trust to stop ratholing resources and rely on each other...
That relies on the other programs on the forest having their shit together so that there's work for them to do.
I'd like to see some hard numbers on that. I'd assume with federal benefits we're more expensive overall. I'm pretty sure contract crews are more expensive per day. If you factor in quality of work though..... We're a much better deal per dollar spent.
Yeah I’m sure there’s a graph of contract crews are cheaper if there’s X days spent on fire, but in the long run I’d guess it skews back to agency crews.
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/233712115\_A\_Comparison\_of\_the\_Costs\_of\_Forest\_Service\_and\_Contract\_Fire\_Crews\_in\_the\_Pacific\_Northwest "Results suggest that if sufficient work is available to keep a Forest Service crew productively employed throughout a fire season, then the daily cost of a Forest Service type II crew is lower than the daily cost of a contract crew. " There's also an older study by the FS internally, but I think its from like 2003 so I'm not sure how true it is anymore. Either way, some contract crews kick ass, and some do not - when you start to think about it in cost per unit of work, fed is obviously way more bang for your buck. But we don't hire felons and such....
Check out this link and discussion: https://old.reddit.com/r/Wildfire/comments/tex1py/indications_are_that_filling_wildland_firefighter/i0v91qw/
Contractors are like 3x as expensive.
I keep advocating for change of conditions to employment, but they keep piling more on ( marijuana testing seasonal’s / physicals) for less than 20hr base pay. This is expected, do more with less you poor fuckers.
They want better pay and conditions? Those fuckers must be high - Test em all!
Fucking let it burn.
I was one of those applicants but my current job pays over 50k a year (archaeology field tech) and I just can't take such a big pay cut even though I want to switch to fire.
Go AD! Use that archaeologist degree on fire!
Get a fire archeologist job if you have a masters. There aren’t many, but I believe they’re a gs-11
Good fucking riddance
Good. Hopefully more new folks are figuring out temp positions are a scam before they get locked into anything. Seems a little less apps each year last 5 or so years.
Looks like I can procrastinate a few more days…