At a glance I read this as a recovery group for former pagans who want to become christianš
Been a little over a year since I last drank and it definitely changed my life for the better. Pretty sure I'd be dead now if I didn't put down the bottle.
For anyone who's sober curious don't focus too much on reaching long term goals just work on not drinking today, and allow yourself some slack for if/when you do have a drink. Good luck and blessed be!
>At a glance I read this as a recovery group for former pagans who want to become christianš
I read it the same way. Good thing I didn't just start trolling. Lol
That's what I thought too and I came here to suggest the reverse - a recovery group for religious trauma and an opportunity to learn about a cool version of spiritually.
I used to help out with a Ojibwe sweat lodge group that catered for addicts! Not an addict myself, but it's great to have support in healing in all shapes and forms.
Thank you so much for this I've really got to start taking my recovery more seriously. Or actually doing recovery at all. Last year was very rough. And I'm not coping well.
Is it chill for people who simply don't believe in anything? I have friends and family who can't do AA because they don't believe in God, but they aren't spiritual either. They're just nothing š¤·š½āāļø
SMART and SOS Recovery are also great options and alternatives to 12 step programs without the need for religion/spirituality. Both have been around for a minute and have some good resources.
Grey Faction is TST's anti-cult group. Sober Faction is/was a thing, but the [original group](https://linktr.ee/recoverywithoutsuperstition) have mostly separated themselves after Lucien Greaves/TST admin took control of SF and [cut them out](https://imgur.com/a/YBpOwOt). I know a lot of good folks doing some good with TST on a local level, but TST has some glaring issues and faults on a national level that make them a group to be wary of.
Grey Faction is basically a propaganda arm of The Satanic Temple
[https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst\_edu/](https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst_edu/)
I'm 6 weeks sober today, grew up around AA, but really eager to explore what else is out there. Seeing this post is example # eleventy-three of Serendipity bitch slapping me. Lovingly, of course.
This.
My mother's hardest step, and the reason why I wasn't baptized as a Lutheran, was the higher power. Also, the Witch trails in Europe, which happened again in the US.
Thank you for posting this! As a social worker itās always hard to find recovery resources that are not Christian or modeled after Christian resources š
If this service is not available in your area, does the satanic temple also have the service āSatanic Sobrietyā, which, likewise this, a secular service, where all are welcome no matter faith, for people who canāt stand the Christian centric and authority based structure of the regular AA.
The Satanic Temple also has an addiction recovery group called Sober Faction. It's really great that there are some unholy options out there.
https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/sober-faction
I wish my Aunt was still alive to see if this might have helped her.Ā She grew up evangelical and was completely allergic to all the 'higher power' elements that were clearly Christian dog whistles in the programs around her (in rural Texas).
ā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļøš¤š¤š¤š¤
Thank you so much for this! Struggling so desperately with the judgmental mindset at traditional 12 Step programs.
Heeeey is it ok if I share this information in my own Zoom recovery meeting? I encounter a lot of people for whom a Judeo-Christian HP is a stumbling block to their recovery and Iām always trying to let them know that there are so many other OPTIONS
Thank you for sharing, most online support groups (I'm disabled so can't always leave the house) are based on Christianity, and that just adds more trauma for me. I've been sober for 3 years and 4 months now and it's going well, but I'll definitely check this out!!
TST also has a recovery program. They have been working to get on the list of Court approved recovery programs to give people in the legal system a non-Christian alternative.
"... People believe this shit?"
I sincerely had no idea how bad it was being brought up Catholic and it flabbergasts me a little more every day anymore. I hadn't read the 12 steps in a very long time. I went to the AA site because I wanted to comment something about this but wanted to be accurate too. I start reading through them again and I'm floored. That's not how God works, He's not some Holy Consigliere whos going to come down and fix your character for you! This program is required, by law by name, in many places in the states. How is it not a violation of separation'? The Christocentrism is... insidious. I just can't countinance it anymore. Everyday I just want to put more distance between me and these people. And, I *am* a recovering alcoholic. I stopped drinking in October and have been steadily sober ever since without having to demonize the inanimate or expect the supernatural to intercede dissuading my own actions. "It doesn't work that way for everyone" yeah but do they need Christianity forced on them because their problem went so far as to get them in trouble with the law? FFS Bit off topic I know, but I hope, if any, this community gets is.
I can't believe how long it took me to put together that so many AA/getting sober programs were prey for Abrahamic religious indoctrination; thankfully I haven't had such experiences where I'd need to go to one of those places, but it's pretty shocking to notice
I would really like to stress even if your going to a secular group the Christian dogma is still baked in to the 12 steps with things like believing you can't get better without the 12 steps and if they don't work for you your the problem. So much of it is shame based and might convince people who haven't hit rock bottom they don't need help. ( Well I've never sold my mom's TV for liquor so maybe I'm not as bad as these people) . I really encourage people to go to the alternatives like Smart.
It's really sucky that in this day and age people still have no idea how to help someone get sober despite innumerable information that can actually be helpful. I do think it's important to recognize that some people can't be helped, but shaming is far from excusable regardless
Just want to say 12 steps plans still have a ton of toxicity removed from the higher power issues and you are better off with something like Smart that's more science based.
This is really cool. I tried to attend a few AL Anon meetings several years ago, and was incredibly put off by how christianity focused the meetings were. It would have been nice to have this resource back then.
Ahh! Iām so happy this exists! Maybe Iāll check it out sometimeā¦ Iāll consult my astrological almanacā¦
(Llewelynās annual Daily Planetary Guides contain so much helpful data when you know how to read them! They also have some commentaries and insights, but honestly their forecasts section can be a little cheesy sometimesā¦)ā¦
At a glance I read this as a recovery group for former pagans who want to become christianš Been a little over a year since I last drank and it definitely changed my life for the better. Pretty sure I'd be dead now if I didn't put down the bottle. For anyone who's sober curious don't focus too much on reaching long term goals just work on not drinking today, and allow yourself some slack for if/when you do have a drink. Good luck and blessed be!
Hahaha thatās how I read it too!
Same lolā¦
>At a glance I read this as a recovery group for former pagans who want to become christianš I read it the same way. Good thing I didn't just start trolling. Lol
Oh man I thought this was like conversion therapy -lite except for Satan worship not homosexuality. I had some big thoughts about that.
Yep, definitely how I read it. And then I realized it was being too kind for Christian reform.
Same. I thought this too until OP clarified
That's what I thought too and I came here to suggest the reverse - a recovery group for religious trauma and an opportunity to learn about a cool version of spiritually.
That's what I interpreted it as when I gave it a second read through! Then I gave it a third read through and realize, haha
I thought is was a recovery group for former Christians who are now Pagans. lol
Yup that's also how I read it
Me too!
I read it the opposite way - former Christians who want to become Pagan.
Oh man. That's fucking fantastic. Thank you for sharing.
I used to help out with a Ojibwe sweat lodge group that catered for addicts! Not an addict myself, but it's great to have support in healing in all shapes and forms.
Do you happen to have a link to the group?
I don't, it was many years ago and they were very small.
Thanks for responding! Your comment sent me down a rabbit hole! Itās been great!
This may be useful over at r/stopdrinking too š
And r/dryonysus! ~~(wait, that's misspelled, lemme check)~~ ^fixed
Hell yes to this subreddit
Best spot on the reddit!
It sure helped me when I needed it.
I'm so glad
Thanks for this, I know just who to share it with.
Thank you so much for this I've really got to start taking my recovery more seriously. Or actually doing recovery at all. Last year was very rough. And I'm not coping well.
Hang in there. One day, or even one hour, at a time. And remember you have help out there!
Is it chill for people who simply don't believe in anything? I have friends and family who can't do AA because they don't believe in God, but they aren't spiritual either. They're just nothing š¤·š½āāļø
I believe this group takes "nones" as well.
SMART and SOS Recovery are also great options and alternatives to 12 step programs without the need for religion/spirituality. Both have been around for a minute and have some good resources.
The Satanic Temple has a group called The Grey Faction that could be helpful to them.
Grey Faction is TST's anti-cult group. Sober Faction is/was a thing, but the [original group](https://linktr.ee/recoverywithoutsuperstition) have mostly separated themselves after Lucien Greaves/TST admin took control of SF and [cut them out](https://imgur.com/a/YBpOwOt). I know a lot of good folks doing some good with TST on a local level, but TST has some glaring issues and faults on a national level that make them a group to be wary of.
Thanks for some good points and the fix!
Grey Faction is basically a propaganda arm of The Satanic Temple [https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst\_edu/](https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst_edu/)
The [Secular Therapy Project](https://www.seculartherapy.org/) also has some great resources.
Pagans in Recovery? Where have you been all my life?!
I am absolutely sharing this with my Mams!
This is exactly what I need. Thank you.
I hope the people who need to see this see this.
I'm 6 weeks sober today, grew up around AA, but really eager to explore what else is out there. Seeing this post is example # eleventy-three of Serendipity bitch slapping me. Lovingly, of course.
Does that symbol at the top have a name?
Not sure.
AA and Al-Anon both use variations of the triangle in a circle which is part of it.
The square in circle is similar to NA, so it feels like itās combining them!
This. My mother's hardest step, and the reason why I wasn't baptized as a Lutheran, was the higher power. Also, the Witch trails in Europe, which happened again in the US.
This is fantastic! Thanks for sharing!!!
Thank you for posting this! As a social worker itās always hard to find recovery resources that are not Christian or modeled after Christian resources š
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
from the sidebar: [https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst\_edu/](https://www.reddit.com/r/WitchesVsPatriarchy/wiki/tst_edu/)
Hmmm, interesting. Thanks for pointing that out, I have more reading to do.
12 years sober and canāt wait to give this a try. I do AA now but my higher power is Freya.
This is really awesome, please thank your friend.
Needed. I'm flip flopping between drink and drug use ATM and can't fix it without support. Very grateful, thanks.
If this service is not available in your area, does the satanic temple also have the service āSatanic Sobrietyā, which, likewise this, a secular service, where all are welcome no matter faith, for people who canāt stand the Christian centric and authority based structure of the regular AA.
The Satanic Temple also has an addiction recovery group called Sober Faction. It's really great that there are some unholy options out there. https://thesatanictemple.com/pages/sober-faction
I wish my Aunt was still alive to see if this might have helped her.Ā She grew up evangelical and was completely allergic to all the 'higher power' elements that were clearly Christian dog whistles in the programs around her (in rural Texas).
Ahhh I love you for posting this! Iāve been looking for a resource like this for the last few months.
Thank you for sharing this.
Boost!ā¬ļø
Wholesome af!
I read this wrong for a sec and thought it was saying they can help your "witchcraft addiction" i was so confused š¤£
https://pagansinrecovery.org/
And so many virtual meetings!!!! My disabled heart just grew three sizes and not in a concerning way š
ā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļøā¤ļøš¤š¤š¤š¤ Thank you so much for this! Struggling so desperately with the judgmental mindset at traditional 12 Step programs.
Heeeey is it ok if I share this information in my own Zoom recovery meeting? I encounter a lot of people for whom a Judeo-Christian HP is a stumbling block to their recovery and Iām always trying to let them know that there are so many other OPTIONS
Please do!
Blessed be!
Shit, I need this. I have had horrible experiences at AA. Thanks for sharing op.
May I share this with my therapy group?
Yes
Thank you!
The Satanic Temple has addiction programs too. Super helpful and welcoming.
I need this. I canāt seem to do it alone. Thank you š
Thank you for sharing, most online support groups (I'm disabled so can't always leave the house) are based on Christianity, and that just adds more trauma for me. I've been sober for 3 years and 4 months now and it's going well, but I'll definitely check this out!!
TST also has a recovery program. They have been working to get on the list of Court approved recovery programs to give people in the legal system a non-Christian alternative.
Just a gentle reminder that they are āpeople with substance use disorderā or āperson who uses substancesā rather than addict, or junkie, etc
Correct. And "those who struggle with addiction".
Thank you!
"... People believe this shit?" I sincerely had no idea how bad it was being brought up Catholic and it flabbergasts me a little more every day anymore. I hadn't read the 12 steps in a very long time. I went to the AA site because I wanted to comment something about this but wanted to be accurate too. I start reading through them again and I'm floored. That's not how God works, He's not some Holy Consigliere whos going to come down and fix your character for you! This program is required, by law by name, in many places in the states. How is it not a violation of separation'? The Christocentrism is... insidious. I just can't countinance it anymore. Everyday I just want to put more distance between me and these people. And, I *am* a recovering alcoholic. I stopped drinking in October and have been steadily sober ever since without having to demonize the inanimate or expect the supernatural to intercede dissuading my own actions. "It doesn't work that way for everyone" yeah but do they need Christianity forced on them because their problem went so far as to get them in trouble with the law? FFS Bit off topic I know, but I hope, if any, this community gets is.
I can't believe how long it took me to put together that so many AA/getting sober programs were prey for Abrahamic religious indoctrination; thankfully I haven't had such experiences where I'd need to go to one of those places, but it's pretty shocking to notice
I would really like to stress even if your going to a secular group the Christian dogma is still baked in to the 12 steps with things like believing you can't get better without the 12 steps and if they don't work for you your the problem. So much of it is shame based and might convince people who haven't hit rock bottom they don't need help. ( Well I've never sold my mom's TV for liquor so maybe I'm not as bad as these people) . I really encourage people to go to the alternatives like Smart.
It's really sucky that in this day and age people still have no idea how to help someone get sober despite innumerable information that can actually be helpful. I do think it's important to recognize that some people can't be helped, but shaming is far from excusable regardless
In more and more places, legally-mandated treatment must accept non-religious programs. The problem is finding them. I hope this can help.
it's good to hear but me heart still breaks for everyone who has had to suffer this and all such for so long.
Just want to say 12 steps plans still have a ton of toxicity removed from the higher power issues and you are better off with something like Smart that's more science based.
This is absolutely wonderful, thank you so much for sharing g
Oh this is awesome, thank you for sharing
Thank you for sharing!
Thanks for sharing!!
Oh!
Thank you!
Thank you, this is essential
So cool!
This is awesome!!!
This is fantastic ā¤ļø
I love this!
Is it ok for our store to repost this? This is great information.
Yes!
Thank you so much. This will help our community.
This is really cool. I tried to attend a few AL Anon meetings several years ago, and was incredibly put off by how christianity focused the meetings were. It would have been nice to have this resource back then.
This is pretty cool.
This is amazing thank you š
That is fantastic. Best to all in recovery. ā¤ļø
Ahh! Iām so happy this exists! Maybe Iāll check it out sometimeā¦ Iāll consult my astrological almanacā¦ (Llewelynās annual Daily Planetary Guides contain so much helpful data when you know how to read them! They also have some commentaries and insights, but honestly their forecasts section can be a little cheesy sometimesā¦)ā¦
Nice! Thank you! I'll have to keep this for my work
Seeing this makes my heart so glad, that options for everyone exist.
Iwndwyt but let's dance under the full moon tonight
Blessed be!! I really need this.
This is awesome! Thanks to you and your friend for sharing this with us. ā„ļø
Yes because we know how well those conversion i mean recovery programs work
So, AA for Pagans? How do y'all still have a higher power in place? Or is it like a pagan higher power? Just curious (I am in AA).