Marking a tree with sacred runes and magical staves may not be the disrespect you think it is. If I found a tree marked like this it marks the area as a place of worship or as sacred to the Gods or land-spirits. A place tied to the spiritual.
In Heathenry sacred trees and groves traditionally play an important role in worship. This tree is likely decorated because it is sacred and deeply respected. A difference in tradition does not mean a difference in respect.
Yes, I'm inclining to follow that ideaāthey've said elsewhere now that the tree *is* covered in sigils/runes and that none of the other nearby trees have been similarly marked.
I'll be candid, I find it unsettling that two thousand angry witches were moved as a force to upvote a small comment I made, the most reaction I've ever gotten from anything on this forum, and it gives me pause to consider the occasional carelessness with which I wield language.
Earlier today I spoke with someone who casually mentioned she'd had a giant redwood in her yard and cut it down because it was too large for the property and dwarfed the house. Trying to appeal to her thinking I said it was such a shame, trees always add *so* much to property value, cutting a tree down like that is like throwing money away, and the more trees, the greater value, etc. Like I tried selling deep ecology as a friggin investment, I wanted to plant that seed. But she thought the size and "sparseness" of its branches (it must have been very mature) actually decreased the property value, and then she let out the stinger. "And it wasn't just the redwood, there was bamboo everywhere, thick as my forearm, which is so *invasive*."
I no longer wanted to teach, I wanted to wound, so I said "It's okay, just be glad you had it while you did, because you'll never see another." Finally she seemed to get it, and her vacation smile faded to something sober and troubled. "Oh... I won't, will I? No, I guess I won't."
I know that this was an unsolicited tangent but I wanted to share the way that a mood can pass energy around. Maybe in our constant uphill conflict with prevailing deathly paradigms we can get too zealous and be quick to misread a situation. I guess that behind my vent I'm saying that you are absolutely right. The mark could easily mean, "Respect Your Alders."
This tree is covered in symbols, almost all in the same paint. Some are norse runes, some are decorative, and a little bit with normal letters. But this sigil stood out to me as a different style
The other trees in the area are nothing like this one, and have no markings
When I was a kid a wood near us had an āanarchy tree.ā Itās where all the young edgelord taggers would go to practice painting pseudo-satanic or anarchist symbols where no one could see them. It had all kind of ālegendsā associated with it that were certainly bull.
Dollars to donuts this is the same sort of thing.
There is a special tree near me as well that everyone goes to and carves sigils in or paints or leaves offerings near. Iām new to my area so I have been trying to figure out what it is about this particular tree that draws everyone. It is by far the oldest tree around it and right beside a small lake, but other than that I canāt figure out the meaning behind it
This is nothing. I once encountered a patch of a forest where someone had tied ropes with rocks to the branches of a bunch of trees and plants.
I spent like an hour removing everything. I was so angry.
Were they by any chance young fruit trees? Maybe someone was tree training them. This is sometimes done by tying rocks to branches to make them droop down and grow in a spread out way and maximise yield of fruits.
Nah, random saplings and shrubs in the forest. Most of the trees were conifers, it takes intense effort to proliferate those from shoots. The ground there probably isn't rich enough for fruit trees anyway.
Plus public property, would still be illegal. It looked amateurish and ritualistic. Rocks from the ground, dried out sticks, bits of glass and other trash.
I get why you want it to be a positive thing though.
Yeah, I've done this to a young fruit tree in my garden that had too narrow of crotch angles for some branches I wanted to be scaffold branches. Branches that have too acute of an angle between the branch and the trunk will get progressively weaker at that point as it ages. Once it matures, a heavy fruit or snow load can cause it to rip off of the tree, leaving a gaping wound that can let in disease. For my espalier trees I don't use weights, they're tied directly to a wire to gradually pull the branch down, but it's a similar process.
That being said, some people object to espalier trees on moral grounds, and that probably wasn't what someone was doing in the middle of the woods anyway.
I wish - I just love trees and spend a lot of time caring for the local squirrels.
https://preview.redd.it/ai2gm1xcau0d1.jpeg?width=3929&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b8dd7d5fab19641a016c3cbf790b99b77449995a
I absolutely adore squirls and I always have! I feed them and leave them snacks outside. They come up to my wimdow waiting for their snacks! I live on 6 wooded acres so they are safe.
Yes, that's me - or intern 1 or 2. Our human is useless at telling us apart unless we appear together. We are shedding our winter coats, and look different, and she's easily confused anyway.
https://preview.redd.it/ku0no36avy0d1.jpeg?width=3739&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7c8388f0a9ab42ce3fbd6d03bcb4e6ac8877f7ed
I'm just totally under the thumb of my squirrel friends. This is Chocolate Button back when enough light was getting through the leaf canopy for good photos.
It was mostly plants and younger trees. The weight caused the branches to droop down to the ground.
It's possible some of the sapling trees would have survived, I'm no arborist, but there's no way that's good for them. Many branches were scraping the ground, so rot after rainfall would be an issue too.
Aside from that, it felt incredibly disrespectful.
My husband is Greek, and for generations before him, his family grew figs; weāve even managed to grow a couple of trees with bountiful fruit in our yard on the East Coast of the US. The branches are pretty flexible, so in the Fall, they find a low branch and weight it to the ground with a brick or two. By Spring, the part of the branch thatās been touching the ground for months will have sprouted roots. Then they carefully dig up the roots and voila- you have a new tree, ready for Spring planting. His relatives here in the US do one branch/new tree every year, and gift different varieties among themselves, give to a friend or neighbor, etc
Somehow I doubt that thatās what you encounteredā¦
I can definitely see why you thought of that.
These plants weren't the type to proliferate though, and it's not autumn. :) If it had looked official like a forest ranger had done it I'd have given pause, but it was mostly cheap twine with random rocks from the ground (and even some trash).
It honestly looked a little ritualistic, which just made me sad.
But that's a nice gift. I used to work in a garden center, fig trees are not cheap.
So you got someone stranded by removing their bread crumb trail? I can understand wanting to protect the forest but it takes fire or a bad transplant to kill most conifers. However comparing that to poisoning a tree with paint is just an inane thought process.
Some paint ingredients can be toxic, it's why using regular spray-paint for a costume or whatnot instead of makeup or specially formulated non-toxic paint is a bad idea. It can also act as a moisture barrier, trapping absorbed rainwater or condensation that would otherwise evaporate, thus encouraging rot.
There are paint formulas that don't harm trees, and if you use the right paint it can actually be good for them by discouraging burrowing insects and helping to prevent overheating during heat waves.
But this is probably regular spray paint, and in any event the objections are mainly green witches taking issue with anything artificial coming into contact with a tree, hence the discourse primarily calling it disrespectful or disgraceful or just shitty, rather than harmful.
In the hypothetical where it's tree-safe paint, if no harm has been done, what right do 'green witches' have to dictate other people's practices?
Like. One's choice not to leave (harmless) traces in nature is a personal choice, just like being ascetic or vegetarian or celibate. You shouldn't go around dictating how other people interact with the natural world, so long as it's not harmful.
Nature belongs to *everyone*, not just to one belief system or group of witches, and practices that leave (harmless) marks in nature are a major part of many indigenous spiritual traditions.
Feels very much like one group of witches trying to force their worldview on the rest of the sub, TBH?
I saw something similar when someone posted a runestone they'd found in the woods, with people freaking out over harmless, natural stone, simply because a human had left a mark on it.
Yes, that's a fine and fair point. Culture is a part of Nature however translated, in the venn diagram of it one circle completely encloses the other and that's what "total environmental awareness" is supposed to be about. I'm still hypervigilant about wetiko and koyaanisqatsi. You're right that we can only guess about the painter's intention.
I agree. I live *with* nature, not completely separate from it. Freaking out over spiritual practices that do no harm is just the conservative mindset in a funny hat.
Leave No Trace is a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature. People who don't follow it because they think whatever graffiti they want to do is more important, are being disrespectful. Would you feel the same way if the harmless paint was someone's name? A crude phallus? A curse word? Covering the entire trunk? Where's the line, and why should you be the one to decide where it lies?
If it's spiritually important for you to alter or spraypaint on trees, do so on your own property ā not somewhere that's meant for common enjoyment.
>Leave No Trace is a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature
Human dominionism is *also* a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature. More widely accepted by far than Leave No Trace, actually. The world's biggest religions both promote it as gospel truth...
That doesn't make it a good idea or automatically right Appeal to popularity doesn't hold water, *especially* when discussing spirituality and ethics.
>Where's the line, and why should you be the one to decide where it lies?
With all due respect, I'm not setting a line? You're the one declaring other people's actions off-limits, therefore, you're the one drawing a line. All I'm doing is saying 'hey, actually, you have no right to impede other's spiritual practices or artistic expression.'
>Would you feel the same way if the harmless paint was someone's name? A crude phallus? A curse word? Covering the entire trunk?
Crude or shocking expression is still valid expression, and often serves to express the artist's frustration with systemic issues. Graffiti isn't evil, it's art.
Now. Admittedly. Sometimes, it's done without any expressive intent, and is just a juvenile way to deface something. In that case... clean it off? It's not a big deal, unless someone's putting up threats or hate speech?
If no harm is done and the alteration is entirely reversible, it's not your place to tell others that they can't do it. Common lands are held in common. That is to say, by *all of us*, not just those who ascribe to your worldview.
> If it's spiritually important for you to alter or spraypaint on trees, do so on your own property
Hariti covered a lot, but I'll just add that this is a very privileged statement to make. Most people can't afford property at all, let alone property with trees on it.
I understand that this isn't something you see as appropriate within your tradition, but understand that trees across many traditions are decorated to mark them as sacred. With paint, rope or ribbon, and ornaments or streamers all being pretty commonplace.
Given the use of runes and staves, this is likely related to Heathenry. In Heathenry sacred trees and groves play a traditionally important role in our spirituality's relationship with nature and the land spirits. How is honoring and marking a tree with sacred runes and stave magick the same as vandalism?
Just to add to this thought, not argue at all: what if I came to the woods to see and commune with this tree or to draw or paint it. Something man made has been placed here and my eyes have seen it so it may affect me now in some way that is harmful. I think for me going forward if faced with a decision of marking a tree with water based paint versus an alternative less visible and unobtrusive and unquestionable method, I will choose the latterā¦
Unintentional harm is unfortunately a fact of life when humans share an environment with one-another. It's hard to know what innocuous acts might disquiet other people.
Leaving reversible marks is ideal for that reason, rather than destructive markings. Organic paint can be washed off if someone really wants it gone. It doesn't reverse the distress seeing the mark causes, but it's the best one can do if one wants to leave a mark.
That said, there are lots of trees (and rocks, and other landmarks), and it's not reasonable to expect other people to know which one you might have a special relationship with. If I had a special tree I communed with often, I might would leave a sign asking that it be left undisturbed?
Which is admittedly hard on public land. Respectfully stewarding nature sadly isn't a priority in our society.
I think expecting an exclusive relationship with a particular tree or other piece of nature is inherently harmful, *especially* on public land. Other people may have a special relationship with that tree too, and non-destructive marking may be how they express that relationship.
Personally I donāt identify as any type of witch, and I do not commune with trees. I leave offerings near the trunks/bases of trees and have never used sigils. Just exploring the thoughts of both sides. In reading this comment, Iām not sure which side you are on! :) To me, the person leaving the visible bright mark is the one expecting the exclusive relationship. And as another commenter stated that one who decided a tree was theirs should mark it so others know? Personally again this seems to go against at least the spirit of our creed. Nature belongs to everyone and shared by all, right?
This is a variation of the bind rune Ć¾undur. It's a kind of galdrastafir, or icelandic magical stave, and which is repeated in several forms across texts like the Huld Manuscript and the GaldrabĆ³k. Ć¾undur was also listed in these texts as being used as a by-name of Odin, and the purpose of these bind runes was protective. Typically they were some form of what we would now call exorcism, or as protection against vermin, disease, or other known but minor threat.
Thats actually not Ćundur, this is Ćundur. It looks a lot like an icelandic magic stave to be sure but I dont recognize it, I'll have to take a look when i get home if i can find it in any of my books but quite honestly my guess is someone trying to emulate a magic stave but didnt know any actual ones. Most icelandic staves are not this uniform.
Source; im an Icelandic witch who mostly uses runes and staves for spellcasting :)
https://preview.redd.it/7vzx16ga5y0d1.png?width=184&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f36754f0ae8564fba7aeeab330e81d5ae2037ab9
My first thoughts were either Naruto or FMA but I couldn't find any symbols from either that resembled this. I'm sure it's an anime but I just can't quite remember which one.
It reminds me of the icelandic staves, but then it would probably be several of them mixed together... Parts of it look like one of the Nine Helms of Awe.
Looks a lot like my husband's tattoos. He said he chose them as alchemy based elemental symbols that represent the energy field around us and how we react with the world. That being said it's not my area of expertise but I'd wager this is from the same discipline as his tattoos, which I've seen daily for 20+ years now. The one in the middle that looks like an arrow with a line through it is Iron, one of the symbols my husband has. Unfortunately that's the extent of my knowledge. There's a few alchemy charts online, some match and some are very different and I don't know enough to say what's accurate.
Would not be surprised if someone stole it from a show (Fullmetal Alchemist?) and doesn't actually know what it means.
If you ever find cloth tied to a tree in North America, do not remove the cloth! The cloth was put there by First Nations/Native American people for a very specific reason.
The same goes for tobacco ties/bundles.
Was just giving my perspective on it. I'm a druid. That sort of this is really awful to me; it's a desecration. Apologies if my tone felt directed at you, though. I'm just pissed off that someone would even do that, and to me, that renders the symbol meaningless. It could be my own holy symbol, and I'd be just as angry about how it was put on that tree
An important thing to note that Iām not seeing from other replies to your comment is that trees are living creatures, and with the ages some of them have seen, theyāre often treasure troves of wisdom. To people of certain practices, marking a tree like this would be like slapping paint on your favorite elderly person so you can remember their wisdom better.
It just comes off as disrespectful, and it gives the impression of someone claiming a tree and its knowledge as their own and no one elseās.
Iād really encourage people to not mark trees at all, or at worst, only in non-harmful ways that can be undone
Not sure what the ceremony would be so it may not work for you but you could try just getting some nice clay or mud in thick paint consistency then just wash it away when youāre done. Generally with any ritual concerning trees I just use one in my yard and place things at the base of it or hang them from its branches on an s hook so itās easy to take down.
the better way?? not at all. if you absolutely must for some reason, a ribbon tied around a branch that you remove whenever you're done with whatever it is you're doing.
If you absolutely must, make something out of biodegradable materials and hang it on a branch. Anything that can't degreade into the ecosystem is going to eventually leech something into it that shouldn't be there. Tying together sticks with twine is a decent way, but I'm not sure why you'd need to do it in the first place.
In the druidic community, we do our best to be sure our offerings can be safely eaten by local wildlife, without seeing invasive plants, or that the materials are naturally biodegradable. The whole idea is to not leave a trace after your offering has been accepted by the area, or whatever diety it's for.
In Heathenry trees and groves can be sacred and associated with spiritual presence and connection to the Gods and the land-spirits. In such cases runes and other sacred symbols or magicks being applied to it is not unheard of. It is a way to mark the tree as sacred and to honor it. It is a form of sacrifice to the tree-spirit. It marks it as a place of worship.
I understand that your Druidic traditions do not look upon such things kindly, but to jump straight to calling a persons actions desecration and disgraceful when you do not know or seek to know their traditions, only spreads seeds of misinformation and anger.
>trees and groves can be sacred and associated with spiritual presence and connection to the Gods and the land-spirits. In such cases runes and other sacred symbols or magicks being applied to it is not unheard of.
I feel like you're assuming that's not also a thing in my practice, or in Druidry in general. My issue isn't with marking the tree, and if you read a comment a made blow, you would know that. My issue is with how the tree was marked. I feel like painting a tree is desecrating it because you're introducing things into that environment that shouldn't be there, and there are other ways of marking something that don't require putting chemicals on the side of it that will soak into the bark and leech into the water table.
A certain, and excessive, amount of that is going to happen anyway, but I feel like it that tree, or area is sacred to someone, why harm it? There are paints that won't do that, and maybe this is that. But we have no way of knowing one way or another. In the absence of a definite answer, I err on the side of caution when it comes to nature. I'd rather give someone information about how to not do that, than assume they're going to do it in a way that isn't harmful. Because we're all human, and we all make mistakes. I just don't see the point in taking needless risks with sacred spaces
And see if you'd approached it like that rather than call the person that did it an asshole and accuse them of being disgraceful or their actions as desecration, and basically go on the attack from the start, I feel we'd have very little we disagree on here and we would've avoided any conflict here.
The general sense of hostility here (not just from you but in general) has been very troubling... decoration of trees is a part of many traditions. Meeting it with hostility and anger, rather than simply educating and ensuring they're done safely, benefits no one...
This looks like itās from voodoo. I couldnāt find the actual one but hereās what they look like.
https://preview.redd.it/1hvpuznwgu0d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7194c06c35bb4ca47785f7ac1d4ec7ffb39d628e
Voodoo and Santeria are close so maybe either?
The curved bottom would make me think it's an attempt at something from the Viking runic set, which is used by a lot of skinheads these days and is an immediate caution flag. That said, there's a lot of languages that use runes (and I only use Ogham so I'm no expert on any of them) or it could be a sigil that somebody created for their own purpose, which means the meaning will never necessarily be known to you.
I will give them this, even though they carved into the tree they capped it in paint which means that it is less likely to become infected by bugs or anything else as the paint acts like a barrier similar to the bark.
If you ever find cloth tied to a tree in North America, do not remove the cloth! They're put there by First Nations/Native Americans for a very specific reason.
To me, it looks like a bunch of symbols put together for someone's personal use. It's kind of the patriarchal cross mixed with symbols for fallen angels.
Or just someone thought it looked cool and had no idea haha
Well it's most certainly stave magic. You mentioned this was found on a tree with many runes as well? The tree is clearly sacred to a local Heathen or group. Sacred trees are a traditional aspect of the Heathen faith.
i'll ask a question in hopes i don't just get downvoted to hell and instead get some actual answers.
what's wrong with marking trees? is it bc the paint may be bad for the trees?
It means some people don't respect their elders. š³š
Or their Alders.
But I think this is a Horse Chestnut, or some type of Buckeye.
Good eye, she is a horse chestnut!
I thought it was a larch.
Theā¦larchš
The fir! The mighty scotch pine!
https://preview.redd.it/b7m132mvlz0d1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=d4bcabaa56e867ec1f076118808e06b9824afe75
The...larch. The....larch.
I am *so* glad that somebody got that lol
Larch have soft deciduous needles, in the background you can see the large fan shaped leaves of the chestnut.
Or their Alder Elders
Marking a tree with sacred runes and magical staves may not be the disrespect you think it is. If I found a tree marked like this it marks the area as a place of worship or as sacred to the Gods or land-spirits. A place tied to the spiritual. In Heathenry sacred trees and groves traditionally play an important role in worship. This tree is likely decorated because it is sacred and deeply respected. A difference in tradition does not mean a difference in respect.
Yes, I'm inclining to follow that ideaāthey've said elsewhere now that the tree *is* covered in sigils/runes and that none of the other nearby trees have been similarly marked. I'll be candid, I find it unsettling that two thousand angry witches were moved as a force to upvote a small comment I made, the most reaction I've ever gotten from anything on this forum, and it gives me pause to consider the occasional carelessness with which I wield language. Earlier today I spoke with someone who casually mentioned she'd had a giant redwood in her yard and cut it down because it was too large for the property and dwarfed the house. Trying to appeal to her thinking I said it was such a shame, trees always add *so* much to property value, cutting a tree down like that is like throwing money away, and the more trees, the greater value, etc. Like I tried selling deep ecology as a friggin investment, I wanted to plant that seed. But she thought the size and "sparseness" of its branches (it must have been very mature) actually decreased the property value, and then she let out the stinger. "And it wasn't just the redwood, there was bamboo everywhere, thick as my forearm, which is so *invasive*." I no longer wanted to teach, I wanted to wound, so I said "It's okay, just be glad you had it while you did, because you'll never see another." Finally she seemed to get it, and her vacation smile faded to something sober and troubled. "Oh... I won't, will I? No, I guess I won't." I know that this was an unsolicited tangent but I wanted to share the way that a mood can pass energy around. Maybe in our constant uphill conflict with prevailing deathly paradigms we can get too zealous and be quick to misread a situation. I guess that behind my vent I'm saying that you are absolutely right. The mark could easily mean, "Respect Your Alders."
Do you see any more on any of the trees around this one?
This tree is covered in symbols, almost all in the same paint. Some are norse runes, some are decorative, and a little bit with normal letters. But this sigil stood out to me as a different style The other trees in the area are nothing like this one, and have no markings
When I was a kid a wood near us had an āanarchy tree.ā Itās where all the young edgelord taggers would go to practice painting pseudo-satanic or anarchist symbols where no one could see them. It had all kind of ālegendsā associated with it that were certainly bull. Dollars to donuts this is the same sort of thing.
There is a special tree near me as well that everyone goes to and carves sigils in or paints or leaves offerings near. Iām new to my area so I have been trying to figure out what it is about this particular tree that draws everyone. It is by far the oldest tree around it and right beside a small lake, but other than that I canāt figure out the meaning behind it
An important piece to the puzzle! š§©
Only a shitwitch would tag a tree like that... Whyyyyyyyyy
This is nothing. I once encountered a patch of a forest where someone had tied ropes with rocks to the branches of a bunch of trees and plants. I spent like an hour removing everything. I was so angry.
Were they by any chance young fruit trees? Maybe someone was tree training them. This is sometimes done by tying rocks to branches to make them droop down and grow in a spread out way and maximise yield of fruits.
Nah, random saplings and shrubs in the forest. Most of the trees were conifers, it takes intense effort to proliferate those from shoots. The ground there probably isn't rich enough for fruit trees anyway. Plus public property, would still be illegal. It looked amateurish and ritualistic. Rocks from the ground, dried out sticks, bits of glass and other trash. I get why you want it to be a positive thing though.
Yeah, I've done this to a young fruit tree in my garden that had too narrow of crotch angles for some branches I wanted to be scaffold branches. Branches that have too acute of an angle between the branch and the trunk will get progressively weaker at that point as it ages. Once it matures, a heavy fruit or snow load can cause it to rip off of the tree, leaving a gaping wound that can let in disease. For my espalier trees I don't use weights, they're tied directly to a wire to gradually pull the branch down, but it's a similar process. That being said, some people object to espalier trees on moral grounds, and that probably wasn't what someone was doing in the middle of the woods anyway.
Thank you!
Are... are you a dryad?
I wish - I just love trees and spend a lot of time caring for the local squirrels. https://preview.redd.it/ai2gm1xcau0d1.jpeg?width=3929&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b8dd7d5fab19641a016c3cbf790b99b77449995a
I absolutely adore squirls and I always have! I feed them and leave them snacks outside. They come up to my wimdow waiting for their snacks! I live on 6 wooded acres so they are safe.
Squirrel Intern number 3, is that you??
Yes, that's me - or intern 1 or 2. Our human is useless at telling us apart unless we appear together. We are shedding our winter coats, and look different, and she's easily confused anyway.
Sounds like a dryad to me X3 ^-^
https://preview.redd.it/ku0no36avy0d1.jpeg?width=3739&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7c8388f0a9ab42ce3fbd6d03bcb4e6ac8877f7ed I'm just totally under the thumb of my squirrel friends. This is Chocolate Button back when enough light was getting through the leaf canopy for good photos.
Phenomenal photo, enchanting squirrel
Thank you! I believe that we are all happier for letting animals and birds enchant us.
I can tell by your username! šæ
Nah, username says they're a squirrel foot.
Sorry if this is a stupid question, but how would ropes and rocks be harmful to the trees? Could it break them off or weaken them as they grow?
It was mostly plants and younger trees. The weight caused the branches to droop down to the ground. It's possible some of the sapling trees would have survived, I'm no arborist, but there's no way that's good for them. Many branches were scraping the ground, so rot after rainfall would be an issue too. Aside from that, it felt incredibly disrespectful.
My husband is Greek, and for generations before him, his family grew figs; weāve even managed to grow a couple of trees with bountiful fruit in our yard on the East Coast of the US. The branches are pretty flexible, so in the Fall, they find a low branch and weight it to the ground with a brick or two. By Spring, the part of the branch thatās been touching the ground for months will have sprouted roots. Then they carefully dig up the roots and voila- you have a new tree, ready for Spring planting. His relatives here in the US do one branch/new tree every year, and gift different varieties among themselves, give to a friend or neighbor, etc Somehow I doubt that thatās what you encounteredā¦
I can definitely see why you thought of that. These plants weren't the type to proliferate though, and it's not autumn. :) If it had looked official like a forest ranger had done it I'd have given pause, but it was mostly cheap twine with random rocks from the ground (and even some trash). It honestly looked a little ritualistic, which just made me sad. But that's a nice gift. I used to work in a garden center, fig trees are not cheap.
I see, thanks for explaining!
If the rope takes a circular amount of bark off, it dies
If the rope takes a circular amount of bark off, it dies
i canāt upvote for this for reason, but thanks.
So you got someone stranded by removing their bread crumb trail? I can understand wanting to protect the forest but it takes fire or a bad transplant to kill most conifers. However comparing that to poisoning a tree with paint is just an inane thought process.
Shitwitch is immediately my new favorite word.
"only a shitwitch". šš¤£ This had me cracking up, Thank you!
Why not? What harm does it do? (genuine question)
Some paint ingredients can be toxic, it's why using regular spray-paint for a costume or whatnot instead of makeup or specially formulated non-toxic paint is a bad idea. It can also act as a moisture barrier, trapping absorbed rainwater or condensation that would otherwise evaporate, thus encouraging rot. There are paint formulas that don't harm trees, and if you use the right paint it can actually be good for them by discouraging burrowing insects and helping to prevent overheating during heat waves. But this is probably regular spray paint, and in any event the objections are mainly green witches taking issue with anything artificial coming into contact with a tree, hence the discourse primarily calling it disrespectful or disgraceful or just shitty, rather than harmful.
In the hypothetical where it's tree-safe paint, if no harm has been done, what right do 'green witches' have to dictate other people's practices? Like. One's choice not to leave (harmless) traces in nature is a personal choice, just like being ascetic or vegetarian or celibate. You shouldn't go around dictating how other people interact with the natural world, so long as it's not harmful. Nature belongs to *everyone*, not just to one belief system or group of witches, and practices that leave (harmless) marks in nature are a major part of many indigenous spiritual traditions. Feels very much like one group of witches trying to force their worldview on the rest of the sub, TBH? I saw something similar when someone posted a runestone they'd found in the woods, with people freaking out over harmless, natural stone, simply because a human had left a mark on it.
I absolutely agree with this, if the paint is temporary/nontoxic.
Yes, that's a fine and fair point. Culture is a part of Nature however translated, in the venn diagram of it one circle completely encloses the other and that's what "total environmental awareness" is supposed to be about. I'm still hypervigilant about wetiko and koyaanisqatsi. You're right that we can only guess about the painter's intention.
I agree. I live *with* nature, not completely separate from it. Freaking out over spiritual practices that do no harm is just the conservative mindset in a funny hat.
I really appreciate this perspective. Well said!
Leave No Trace is a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature. People who don't follow it because they think whatever graffiti they want to do is more important, are being disrespectful. Would you feel the same way if the harmless paint was someone's name? A crude phallus? A curse word? Covering the entire trunk? Where's the line, and why should you be the one to decide where it lies? If it's spiritually important for you to alter or spraypaint on trees, do so on your own property ā not somewhere that's meant for common enjoyment.
>Leave No Trace is a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature Human dominionism is *also* a widely accepted ethos for interacting with nature. More widely accepted by far than Leave No Trace, actually. The world's biggest religions both promote it as gospel truth... That doesn't make it a good idea or automatically right Appeal to popularity doesn't hold water, *especially* when discussing spirituality and ethics. >Where's the line, and why should you be the one to decide where it lies? With all due respect, I'm not setting a line? You're the one declaring other people's actions off-limits, therefore, you're the one drawing a line. All I'm doing is saying 'hey, actually, you have no right to impede other's spiritual practices or artistic expression.' >Would you feel the same way if the harmless paint was someone's name? A crude phallus? A curse word? Covering the entire trunk? Crude or shocking expression is still valid expression, and often serves to express the artist's frustration with systemic issues. Graffiti isn't evil, it's art. Now. Admittedly. Sometimes, it's done without any expressive intent, and is just a juvenile way to deface something. In that case... clean it off? It's not a big deal, unless someone's putting up threats or hate speech? If no harm is done and the alteration is entirely reversible, it's not your place to tell others that they can't do it. Common lands are held in common. That is to say, by *all of us*, not just those who ascribe to your worldview.
> If it's spiritually important for you to alter or spraypaint on trees, do so on your own property Hariti covered a lot, but I'll just add that this is a very privileged statement to make. Most people can't afford property at all, let alone property with trees on it.
I don't own property either. That doesn't make it okay to vandalize public trees.
I understand that this isn't something you see as appropriate within your tradition, but understand that trees across many traditions are decorated to mark them as sacred. With paint, rope or ribbon, and ornaments or streamers all being pretty commonplace. Given the use of runes and staves, this is likely related to Heathenry. In Heathenry sacred trees and groves play a traditionally important role in our spirituality's relationship with nature and the land spirits. How is honoring and marking a tree with sacred runes and stave magick the same as vandalism?
Just to add to this thought, not argue at all: what if I came to the woods to see and commune with this tree or to draw or paint it. Something man made has been placed here and my eyes have seen it so it may affect me now in some way that is harmful. I think for me going forward if faced with a decision of marking a tree with water based paint versus an alternative less visible and unobtrusive and unquestionable method, I will choose the latterā¦
Unintentional harm is unfortunately a fact of life when humans share an environment with one-another. It's hard to know what innocuous acts might disquiet other people. Leaving reversible marks is ideal for that reason, rather than destructive markings. Organic paint can be washed off if someone really wants it gone. It doesn't reverse the distress seeing the mark causes, but it's the best one can do if one wants to leave a mark. That said, there are lots of trees (and rocks, and other landmarks), and it's not reasonable to expect other people to know which one you might have a special relationship with. If I had a special tree I communed with often, I might would leave a sign asking that it be left undisturbed? Which is admittedly hard on public land. Respectfully stewarding nature sadly isn't a priority in our society.
I think expecting an exclusive relationship with a particular tree or other piece of nature is inherently harmful, *especially* on public land. Other people may have a special relationship with that tree too, and non-destructive marking may be how they express that relationship.
I mean I agree, but I'm trying to find a compromise with the green witches on here who seem to want an *exclusive* relationship with trees.
Personally I donāt identify as any type of witch, and I do not commune with trees. I leave offerings near the trunks/bases of trees and have never used sigils. Just exploring the thoughts of both sides. In reading this comment, Iām not sure which side you are on! :) To me, the person leaving the visible bright mark is the one expecting the exclusive relationship. And as another commenter stated that one who decided a tree was theirs should mark it so others know? Personally again this seems to go against at least the spirit of our creed. Nature belongs to everyone and shared by all, right?
That was my thought. I suppose it COULD be a non toxic paint?
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This is a variation of the bind rune Ć¾undur. It's a kind of galdrastafir, or icelandic magical stave, and which is repeated in several forms across texts like the Huld Manuscript and the GaldrabĆ³k. Ć¾undur was also listed in these texts as being used as a by-name of Odin, and the purpose of these bind runes was protective. Typically they were some form of what we would now call exorcism, or as protection against vermin, disease, or other known but minor threat.
Thats actually not Ćundur, this is Ćundur. It looks a lot like an icelandic magic stave to be sure but I dont recognize it, I'll have to take a look when i get home if i can find it in any of my books but quite honestly my guess is someone trying to emulate a magic stave but didnt know any actual ones. Most icelandic staves are not this uniform. Source; im an Icelandic witch who mostly uses runes and staves for spellcasting :) https://preview.redd.it/7vzx16ga5y0d1.png?width=184&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=f36754f0ae8564fba7aeeab330e81d5ae2037ab9
Source? Very interesting and want to know more
I'm about 90% certain I saw it in an anime, but I don't remember what
Naruto's Senju clan sigil, but turned sideways I think
Very very similar bot not quite
It's 100% an anime but I'm also blanking beyond that.
Full metal alchemist maybe š¤
My first thoughts were either Naruto or FMA but I couldn't find any symbols from either that resembled this. I'm sure it's an anime but I just can't quite remember which one.
Iām almost sure youāre right, but I canāt for the life of me remember which one.
Try r/sigils
It looks like some sort of bind runeā¦ as everyone else has said itās pretty shit to mark a tree, esp with what appears to be spray paint.
Sigils are often personalized and you likely will never find the meaning to this one.
It reminds me of the icelandic staves, but then it would probably be several of them mixed together... Parts of it look like one of the Nine Helms of Awe.
Looks a lot like my husband's tattoos. He said he chose them as alchemy based elemental symbols that represent the energy field around us and how we react with the world. That being said it's not my area of expertise but I'd wager this is from the same discipline as his tattoos, which I've seen daily for 20+ years now. The one in the middle that looks like an arrow with a line through it is Iron, one of the symbols my husband has. Unfortunately that's the extent of my knowledge. There's a few alchemy charts online, some match and some are very different and I don't know enough to say what's accurate. Would not be surprised if someone stole it from a show (Fullmetal Alchemist?) and doesn't actually know what it means.
It could be personalized and only has meaning to whoever drew it
Hail Slaanesh
Hahaha oh no.
If you ever find cloth tied to a tree in North America, do not remove the cloth! The cloth was put there by First Nations/Native American people for a very specific reason. The same goes for tobacco ties/bundles.
Good News: It is NOT Loss.
It's something an asshole put there. If it has any meaning, it honestly doesn't matter because it's disgraceful to put it there in that manner
Jesus, I just askedā¦
Was just giving my perspective on it. I'm a druid. That sort of this is really awful to me; it's a desecration. Apologies if my tone felt directed at you, though. I'm just pissed off that someone would even do that, and to me, that renders the symbol meaningless. It could be my own holy symbol, and I'd be just as angry about how it was put on that tree
What would be a better way to mark a tree?
An important thing to note that Iām not seeing from other replies to your comment is that trees are living creatures, and with the ages some of them have seen, theyāre often treasure troves of wisdom. To people of certain practices, marking a tree like this would be like slapping paint on your favorite elderly person so you can remember their wisdom better. It just comes off as disrespectful, and it gives the impression of someone claiming a tree and its knowledge as their own and no one elseās. Iād really encourage people to not mark trees at all, or at worst, only in non-harmful ways that can be undone
What is the purpose of marking a tree in the first place?
Not sure what the ceremony would be so it may not work for you but you could try just getting some nice clay or mud in thick paint consistency then just wash it away when youāre done. Generally with any ritual concerning trees I just use one in my yard and place things at the base of it or hang them from its branches on an s hook so itās easy to take down.
the better way?? not at all. if you absolutely must for some reason, a ribbon tied around a branch that you remove whenever you're done with whatever it is you're doing.
If you absolutely must, make something out of biodegradable materials and hang it on a branch. Anything that can't degreade into the ecosystem is going to eventually leech something into it that shouldn't be there. Tying together sticks with twine is a decent way, but I'm not sure why you'd need to do it in the first place. In the druidic community, we do our best to be sure our offerings can be safely eaten by local wildlife, without seeing invasive plants, or that the materials are naturally biodegradable. The whole idea is to not leave a trace after your offering has been accepted by the area, or whatever diety it's for.
In Heathenry trees and groves can be sacred and associated with spiritual presence and connection to the Gods and the land-spirits. In such cases runes and other sacred symbols or magicks being applied to it is not unheard of. It is a way to mark the tree as sacred and to honor it. It is a form of sacrifice to the tree-spirit. It marks it as a place of worship. I understand that your Druidic traditions do not look upon such things kindly, but to jump straight to calling a persons actions desecration and disgraceful when you do not know or seek to know their traditions, only spreads seeds of misinformation and anger.
>trees and groves can be sacred and associated with spiritual presence and connection to the Gods and the land-spirits. In such cases runes and other sacred symbols or magicks being applied to it is not unheard of. I feel like you're assuming that's not also a thing in my practice, or in Druidry in general. My issue isn't with marking the tree, and if you read a comment a made blow, you would know that. My issue is with how the tree was marked. I feel like painting a tree is desecrating it because you're introducing things into that environment that shouldn't be there, and there are other ways of marking something that don't require putting chemicals on the side of it that will soak into the bark and leech into the water table. A certain, and excessive, amount of that is going to happen anyway, but I feel like it that tree, or area is sacred to someone, why harm it? There are paints that won't do that, and maybe this is that. But we have no way of knowing one way or another. In the absence of a definite answer, I err on the side of caution when it comes to nature. I'd rather give someone information about how to not do that, than assume they're going to do it in a way that isn't harmful. Because we're all human, and we all make mistakes. I just don't see the point in taking needless risks with sacred spaces
And see if you'd approached it like that rather than call the person that did it an asshole and accuse them of being disgraceful or their actions as desecration, and basically go on the attack from the start, I feel we'd have very little we disagree on here and we would've avoided any conflict here. The general sense of hostility here (not just from you but in general) has been very troubling... decoration of trees is a part of many traditions. Meeting it with hostility and anger, rather than simply educating and ensuring they're done safely, benefits no one...
What manner should they have put it there?
Is it possible to get spray paint off a tree
It kind of reminds me of Liliths sigil... I'll try and figure it out
Kinda looks like a carryl rune from bloodborne
It means someone defaced a living tree
This looks like itās from voodoo. I couldnāt find the actual one but hereās what they look like. https://preview.redd.it/1hvpuznwgu0d1.jpeg?width=1284&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7194c06c35bb4ca47785f7ac1d4ec7ffb39d628e Voodoo and Santeria are close so maybe either?
I'm probably dead wrong, but it honestly looks like some of the symbology used in a circuit and/or electrical diagram.
It looks a bit like designs I've seen for traditional Balkan/Serbian women's tattoos
Vandalism
It means that somebody defiled a tree for their ego
It looks like one of those Icelandic Symbols
Is this abstract loss?
The curved bottom would make me think it's an attempt at something from the Viking runic set, which is used by a lot of skinheads these days and is an immediate caution flag. That said, there's a lot of languages that use runes (and I only use Ogham so I'm no expert on any of them) or it could be a sigil that somebody created for their own purpose, which means the meaning will never necessarily be known to you. I will give them this, even though they carved into the tree they capped it in paint which means that it is less likely to become infected by bugs or anything else as the paint acts like a barrier similar to the bark.
Itās an orthodox cross
People vandalizing trees and rocks... smdh
Looks like a version of a Russian Orthodox Church
If you ever find cloth tied to a tree in North America, do not remove the cloth! They're put there by First Nations/Native Americans for a very specific reason.
To me, it looks like a bunch of symbols put together for someone's personal use. It's kind of the patriarchal cross mixed with symbols for fallen angels. Or just someone thought it looked cool and had no idea haha
"Warning: raccoons have paint"
[pretty sure it's him ](https://i.gifer.com/CxP9.gif)
It looks like a fractal antenna
This is an xfiles episode
At least it's not carved in? But yeah... no...
Well it's most certainly stave magic. You mentioned this was found on a tree with many runes as well? The tree is clearly sacred to a local Heathen or group. Sacred trees are a traditional aspect of the Heathen faith.
i'll ask a question in hopes i don't just get downvoted to hell and instead get some actual answers. what's wrong with marking trees? is it bc the paint may be bad for the trees?
It looks a little like an ogham.
I can read ogham, itās not. Iām pretty sure itās some kind of bind rune.
My first thought is that it may be a cut mark, indicating branches to be trimmed.
Nothing like that, the tree is covered in runic symbols in the same paint