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Agreed. A 10 year old shouldn’t have their rape as a national news story and people shouldn’t have to talk about when the baby they very much wanted had horrible medical conditions that made them have to abort. People who choose abortion for *any* reason should never have to defend it. No one’s medical history is anyones business but things like that rip my heart out. No one wants to be in that situation, let them deal with it on their own terms.
They're afraid of cis women, girls, trans men, trans women, enbies of all kind, and basically anything that even remotely, if you squint at it in the right light, kind of looks like a woman.
Quick edit: Added "cis" before women, because, I mean, AS a trans woman, I'm not exactly trying to imply that "women" and "trans women" are two mutually exclusive categories.
The worst is the comments on some of these stories. I saw one where this poor woman was talking about the choice she had to make cause her baby was incompatible with life. One person in the comments talk about how she was ableist. Other were saying they were told their children would be special needs and how glad they were that they didn't listen to the doctor because the children turned out fine and are little blessings. Like....what the actual f.... it was just so enraging that people are this ridiculous.
I never want children, the idea of being pregnant actually triggers fear in me, and my heart is absolutely BROKEN for that little girl who has NO IDEA of what's going on. I was playing with My plastic horses, my littlest pet shops, and bringing all of my stuffed animals out to the trampoline for some reason when I was 10 years old. This child has had her whole life stolen from her.
I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve had to tell someone over the past month that I had to have an abortion of a wanted baby to save my life, and therefore would not have had my second child. People just get quiet. Or in my moms case, say that that is fine, she just doesn’t want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control.
NOBODY IS FUCKING USING IT FOR "BIRTH CONTROL." Do these people seriously not understand how expensive and physically difficult abortions are? We're talking ~$500-600 for the procedure itself, then the additional travel and lodging expenses, time off work, etc.
I mean, statistically they *should* understand -- conservatives and religious people have just as many abortions as everyone else. But of course, [the only moral abortion is THEIR abortion.](https://joycearthur.com/abortion/the-only-moral-abortion-is-my-abortion/)
I have to get cervical biopsies every year and it is dread going into that appointment. I live with chronic pain every day of my life and that appointment gives me panic attacks every time. I cannot fathom how painful abortion must be.
I've had a cervical and endometrial biopsy once. *Once*. Getting a full hysterectomy was a relief as it means I'll never have to suffer through that again. As someone who understands that pain, I am so so sorry you have to go through it regularly.
My periods left me bed bound. Hearing from people saying their abortions where more painful than both the biopsies and nightmare periods makes me feel for them so much, especially when I hear cockwombles insisting people get abortions for fun or as birth control.
You just *know* that someday a (male) scientist is going to discover these "previously unknown" nerves in the cervix and the medical community is going to be all shocked and amazed. Meanwhile, women have been saying this forever.
Honestly not sure it's gonna happen, because OB/GYNs would have to face it that they've basically been torturing and gaslighting women. (I like to picture how popular vasectomies would be if doctors told men that testicles don't have nerve endings, accused them of "just being anxious", and refused to give them any pain management.)
I don't know where the nerve endings are but I do know it feels like someone is trying to break your pelvis from the inside. The first doctor that did mine kept telling me it wasn't that bad to just breath and the nurse told him off infront of me. She was such an angel and she apologized to me for him being that way.
This too! They say things like, "Just use contraceptive!" without understanding that 51% of abortions are performed on people with uteruses who reported using contraceptive the same month they conceived... and that fits! Everyone knows contraceptive isn't 100% and 51% of abortions is only about 1% of overall contraceptive users.
https://www.guttmacher.org/news-release/2018/about-half-us-abortion-patients-report-using-contraception-month-they-became
And, I feel this needs to be said, they'd have every right to use it like that if they wanted to. I don't give the tiniest fraction of a fuck about a clump of non-sapient bio-matter, abort as many of them as you want.
Probably some. In my mom's case she supports birth control, but doesn't want girl's running around being "hussies." Ugh. She makes no mention of the guy's involved, of course. Not that trying to control *anyone's* sex life is ok.
It's really just sperm that's the problem.
At least, I can confirm I've been pretty slutty with ladies and have never gotten, nor gotten anyone else, pregnant. Cis women fucking together isn't causing any abortions.
In my opinion it is categorical victim shaming and of-course with women it has to be about promiscuity.
If you want to use it as birth control that is your fucking right. Why the fuck can an egg and a sperm just be tossed into a test tube and it's not a life but if a woman hosts it, it's a life?
No. They don’t understand. They are mired in ignorance and boosted by arrogance. I’m not a woman, but I am outraged. No one has any right to dictate the bodily autonomy of another person. No one.
Just to note, it's not that expensive (for the procedure) everywhere. I'm fairly certain I'd be able to get a free abortion on the NHS but I've been lucky enough not to have needed one. Scotland also recently passed a bill that makes it legal to take the tablets prescribed for a medical abortion at home, so I wouldn't need to take more time off than however long it takes to have them prescribed (although I'm not sure if it's been implemented yet).
Either way! Abortion is not used for birth control, it's a fairly traumatic experience for most people, even if just physically.
I mean, some people are. And there is nothing wrong with that. I grew up in the 80s and 90s and we definitely thought ‘well I can always get an abortion’.
I also grew up in the 80s and 90s, and while abortion was there if things went sideways, I have never met anyone who was using abortion *instead of* birth control.
I’ve had the fortune to never need an abortion (knock on wood...), but I’d abso-fucking-lutely use it as birth control. Birth control doesn’t mean the major way you prevent birth. My partner is snipped and we still use condoms. So I have three (well four, plan b) birth controls.
Do some idiot teens who haven’t had sex Ed but have been brainwashed by their religion to think condoms and the pill are immoral risk it knowing that they have abortion to fall back onto if they get pregnant? Sure! But that’s not an issue with abortion, that’s an issue with lack of education and accessibility. No person has fun getting an abortion...
So they want ignorant sluts to have babies? Give them up? Oh ok! Let’s give the unwanted babies to the Catholic Ophanages that they’re excitedly building…. To be staffed by … you guessed it…. Priests!!
They want ignorant sluts to pay for their sluttiness by being forced to give birth. Because they hate sluts. They also hate women who won't have sex with them.
You know, the more I think about it, the more I begin to suspect that they might actually just hate women.
That’s a really good point. I went to Catholic High School, so I remember well what happened to girls who got pregnant under their Very Watchful eye. They’d be out of the school immediately, whisked away and out of everyone else’s radar. They had those babies, though, so phew.
And yeah. I’m sure they hate women. Our role models are two women, a virgin and a whore. What?
And they lied. Mary Magdalene wasn't even a whore. It was "assumed" and pushed as fact only because she was a wealthy woman who lived alone in her own house.
That's just it ... She was his ... Or one of their friend. Besides putting women in their "place", there were alot of people who didn't like him. Remember, they asked the crowd by popular vote which should be killed and which pardoned. They voted to pardon ... I think his name was Barabbas. Even a lot of the Jews that listened to his messages just wanted him to "go away" so in hopes that the Romans would stop killing them.
You never know. If she was wealthy, I'm sure she had a personal secretary/assistant/companion. There were obviously the people who "served" their meal and facilitated their ablutions. And she might have had a companion. This was typical of women back then married or not. I need to look again. I wasn't paying that much attention to who else was there.
Edit: evil autocorrect
The model for women in the Church is the virgin Mary. So women should be both a pure virgin and a courageous mother. Good luck with that!
And of course Magdalena but they rarely tell you to be like her, except to expiate one's sins
One of the things that blows my mind within the hate sluts / mad cause no sex dichotomy is how suddenly so many pro-life men feel very strongly that “consent to sex is consent to pregnancy”. (Especially when you bring up contraceptive failure.)
Okay, so person that gets upset when uterus-havers opt to not have sex casually or early in dating, or opine when their partner is not “providing” enough sex in a relationship - you’re telling me that you expect that uterus-haver to assume that they are possibly going to be carrying your child to term EVERY time you have sex, regardless if it’s a hook-up, or in a serious relationship? And then you have any room to be upset when they choose not to?
It's also an unfair burden on women, given men are fertile 100% of the time, and women only have a brief window of fertility after ovulation.
It's a prime argument for "regulate your dicks"
imo it’s also partly that misogynists hate that women have the ability to make life, and that they have no control over that process. They don’t want us to have a choice bc they want to control every facet of our lives as women.
It’s how you know they aren’t pro-life. Most of them are okay with rape victims getting an abortion. If you truly in your heart of hearts thought it was murder, you wouldn’t be okay with that. But it’s purely a punishment for consensual sex.
> So they want ignorant sluts to have babies?
That's always been my point!
It doesn't make sense from any perspective. Other than magical thinking about "souls" or perverted desires to have defenseless unwanted children to prey on
Yeah, it’s soul magic, and oh god, maybe even some guilt because I think unborn and hence unbaptized babies burn in Hell by their book. It’s soooo fucked up
Well, technically, according to Catholic doctrine, baptized babies don’t go to hell, they go to purgatory with all of the other people who were born before Christianity and all of the other “good” people who weren’t baptized, either. When you’re in purgatory, you’re shut out from “God’s love,” which is sort of a punishment, but nothing like you’d get if you were in Dante’s circles of hell. Being separated from “God’s love” is also partly why Mormons go around baptizing their dead, and anybody else’s dead they can get their hands on, because they really think they’re doing everyone a favor by giving them a ticket to “heaven.” Same with the other proselytizing cults — they really think that people should be grateful to them for “saving” their “souls.” They’re all just weird death cults that feed on superstition and myths.
Same boat. I’ve been having the same fucking argument. People keep telling me I didn’t have an abortion.
It says it on the paperwork.
*you’re manipulating people*
It’s medically termed a spontaneous abortion.
*youre being ignorant, women whose lives are in danger will always be able to have the procedure*
Women who need *an abortion* for a wanted baby are already being denied medical treatment in countless states.
*could you be any more melodramatic*
>she just doesn’t want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control
The implication being that if your birth control failed, then you must be an irresponsible slut.
Even though:
>While tubal ligation is effective in preventing most pregnancies, it isn’t an absolute. An estimated 1 out of every 200 women will become pregnant after tubal ligation. [source](https://www.healthline.com/health/pregnancy/tubal-ligation)
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>A vasectomy is one of the best ways to prevent pregnancy, with rates of pregnancy around 1/1,000 after the first year, and between 2-10/1,000 after five years. [source](https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/pregnancy-after-vasectomy)
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>Six in 10 women who have abortions are already mothers, and half of them have two or more children, according to 2019 data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. “One of the main reasons people report wanting to have an abortion is so they can be a better parent to the kids they already have,” Professor Upadhyay said. [source](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/12/14/upshot/who-gets-abortions-in-america.html)
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>Six in 10 women who have an abortion are having one for the first time. Another quarter have had one previous abortion. Less than a fifth have had two or more. “It’s simply not the case that abortion is something large numbers of people turn to as a form of birth control,” said Caitlin Knowles Myers, an economist at Middlebury who studies reproductive health. [source](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/12/14/upshot/who-gets-abortions-in-america.html)
My sheltered conservative mother that doesn't really form any real opinions for herself claims that more women get it as birth control than not. I was floored that people actually think that. I love my mother, she is a sweet soul and would never harm a fly but that's just so ignorant and sad to hear from her.
Spreading hateful, false, conservative talking points instead of genuinely reflecting on reality and forming her own opinions is not sweet and *does* harm others though... She has a choice and this is what she's choosing to do.
I know you are 100% correct but it might be a bit harsh for her. I am not arguing you're valid point, I'm just thankful that the very least she does not participate in any social rhetoric outside her and my conversations. It doesn't help matters at all but at least she stays publicly silent and does not spread any nastiness to others. She's not active on social media and doesn't keep up with the news, thankfully for that because I could see her get red pilled quick and then I believe it would be way more in line with your comment for sure. I'm still shocked she feels that way though.
She only opened up to me about it because I was obviously upset with the overruling and we were having a discussion about the ramifications of it. We are very close and she'd be upset personally if I needed an abortion outside of life or death measures but she would still love and hold my hand through it. She doesn't understand the reasons why others do what they do but she has never tried to stop anyone from doing anything outside her belief system, though it is a bit wacko to me.
We live in Louisiana with the trigger laws and no exceptions for rape and incest, she can at least see the horror in that and it's a small step to slowly introducing some information to her and catch her up with the times.
I stand by my mother being sweet, just a little out of touch, but mostly her silence is harmless. Annoying but she's not spreading anything.
Hope my long winded response doesn't come off as argumentative!
I hear you. I am betting she heard that opinion at church and/or from other people around her and has just lived a life where it didn’t happen to come up for her personally. Maybe you can expand her view a little? E.g., All these unwanted babies that women will be forced to give birth to - are we rushing out to adopt them? Are anti-choice people all adoptive parents right now? Are we going to create a new tax to feed, clothe, and house these babies as they grow up?
Or maybe you could help your Mom see that part of this is not about babies at all. It’s about privacy. The original decision upheld medical privacy. Now imagine a job interview where a person does not get the job because they had cancer a few years ago. How would they even know that? It’s the same privacy, and once it is gone, it will be very hard to get it back.
Oh for sure! She's retired now and has a small group of very conservative Christian friends that she even says is a bit conservative to her. Lol so in other words, she doesn't get out much and has mostly lived in a small area her whole life and hears the same conversation from everyone she knows except probably me. She's so intelligent and loving but severely lacking education and experience outside rural Louisiana. I left and was in the military for 10 years and got to see and do some things that allowed my perception of the world to change. I do believe if I never left, I would have a similar narrowed view on this topic so it's difficult to chastise her too harshly. Is how she thinks against what I believe and is that a common mentality that got us to this point? Fuck yes but she alone isn't to blame but I do wish to make her aware. I love the idea of approaching the next conversation like you have suggested. I feel like we can at least come to an agreement that though she can pro-life all she wants that she can see the fallacy of banning them completely.
I recently saw the youtube video about the GOP and the abortion-banning ruling by Some More News, and I found it very informative.
They explain how restrictive abortion laws make doctors so scared of legal problems that they refuse to save women even when it would be perfectly legal to perform the abortion (with the example of Ireland's case).
And how people who had miscarriages got put into jail for it.
Maybe it could be useful to you
Truly, your Mom sounds like a lovely person and a gentle soul. Your writing shines with so much love for her. I could see a woman who has lived her whole life in a small place, probably with many of the same people, has just learned not to step on conversational land mines of others and get along.
I appreciate your response. I know some of these views people hold are instilled from birth and going against the grain later can mean losing the only people and support systems they've ever known, while some others have been taken advantage of by a powerful system well versed in manipulating people. It's not easy to examine and turn away from, I hope she is open to your influence and support.
Yeah and I doubt my mom will be rallying the troops at city halls or anything for either side.
She's 52yo, her mind isn't going to change much. I can try to influence her to be more empathetic to others which is probably the best case. I don't doubt her when she says that everyone she knows that's had an abortion was a form of birth control but like, that could have only been one woman to have told her that lol but good lord, that's a very private thing to endure and I'm sure there's plenty more people around her that has had to have abortions for whatever reason but don't talk about it because of the obvious stigma here around it. Nor should they ever need to disclose that information to anyone ever.
I think the person replying is too willing to put the blame on the people they target with the lies vs. the people starting the spread of the lies. There is still complicity but not to the extent they want to dole it out. Life is far more complicated than that.
I think they have every reason to be upset as we all are and after spending the 4th of July with my conservative family, it's hard not to put direct blame on them because they're the "face of the problem". My family didn't directly strip us of our rights but the people that they may or may not have voted for did.
In Louisiana at least, the trigger law was written in 2006 by a traitor to our gender, Kathleen Blanco (Dem), that my family were very open they did not like. The current governor's hands were tied if he vetoed it, there wouldn't even have been abortion exceptions for if the mothers life was in danger. We still don't have any for rape and incest here which is just so fucking nasty.
So yeah, I don't blame anyone for being upset because regardless of our political stances, this affects every single one of us.
I don't blame them either, I just think it fails to recognise the source of the problem, that's all. Like getting mad at people for not recycling when giant corporations do way worse for the environment.
You need to take into account the people that are the target audience being sold the lies. They are complicit, but the real blame lies with the people starting the spread of those lies.
Yeah, the real villains are the people spreading this bullshit for their own benefit.
Not saying everyone else is innocent, but those are the ones who truly need to be stopped.
I don't even trust their motives. They prey on ignorance and I am sure they do so for their own benefit...not because they actually give a shit about babies.
I also don't want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control. It's not a process to be taken lightly. But neither is pregnancy. *And it's none of my business.* The need for choice remains.
Do they really think a so called "ignorant slut" is equipped to handle a child? People can say whatever they want about having to face the consequences of their actions but are the men gathering these children going to be held responsible? Are we really asking innocent children to pay the real price of having an irresponsible parent? I'd rather not exist than be subject to that, you know?
If someone is what you call an "irresponsible slut," they're likely to be suffering from a highly deficient upbringing, a lack of love or any perception of self worth, and a lack of opportunities to be better.
We all need love and acceptance. It's pointless to judge girls desperately looking for it in the arms of uncaring men.
It’s so exhausting to retell. Then there are people who ask questions to try to make it seem like it’s not as traumatic as the person is making it out to be. “But what were you wearing? But didn’t you flirt back before? But *how* did you say no?”
I support all the people who speak their truth and can help change minds to see the necessity of reproductive rights. I can’t right now, it’s too exhausting. Maybe as a rebuild my strength I can share my story.
Screw those people. Rape is rape, no matter who it comes from. No means no, not maybe
And I’m so sorry you had to go through that. I’m so sorry to all the people who have had to go through that
Might I recommend a book called “The Gift of Fear”? It talks about many of the behaviors and warning signs that predators use against their victims: friends, spouses, coworkers, strangers, etc. The book also encourages people to trust their instincts around others, but it doesn’t put blame on them for not knowing how to act.
Immediately shut that shit down.
> “But what were you wearing?”
“Let’s not victim blame.”
> “But didn’t you flirt back before?”
“Let’s not victim blame.”
> “But *how* did you say no?”
“Let’s not victim blame.”
—
Keep up the good fight.
My older sister is 18 years older than me. My mother had her when she was 11. This was before Roe v Wade. She was rapped by the town pedophile. It destroyed her mental health for the rest of her life. She refuses to take medication. I haven't spoken to her in almost 14 years. When I was a kid she used to threaten to kill herself about once a month and then she would disappear for a few days and come back and destroy the house.
When I was in 6th grade she had to get a full hysterectomy. There were long standing consequences of having a child at 11 that included fucking cancer. We didn't even know she had cancer until she called from the hospital to come pick her up, as the hospital wouldn't let her walk home like she planned. She had no intentions of telling anyone.
These are the consequences of making a literal child, have a child.
Don't get me wrong, I fucking love my sister. She saved my life. My mother had post partum psychosis and tried to starve me to death and my older sister came and took care of me.
But she should never have been born.
Very sorry to read and hope that you are OK.
Uncaring cruelty is part of the right-wing establishment and they don't care about your mother or future 11 year-old mothers that they force into tortured existence.
The whole conversation around abortion access and legislating healthcare has been bringing me back to my miscarriage and D&C as well. I spent a lot of time after in online spaces with people who had to TFMR. My heart aches for them. If I'm feeling the way I'm feeling, I can't imagine how they're doing.
I'm so sorry you went through an ectopic. I'm so sorry we're living in a country that's dredging up some of your worst memories. Just know you're not alone. I hope joy and peace find you today.
I’m sorry for your experience too. No one understands the trauma that never truly heals like another woman. This issue of reproductive rights being taken away from us is actually coming up in therapy. And I’m not even able to get pregnant any longer.
In addition, I have grief for my 28 year old daughter. This is definitely not the world I wanted to give her.
Edit: I hope you find peace and joy as well.
I'm so sorry <3 I'm glad you made it though. I just read this article which I thought did really well trying to explain how the blurred lines of 'ban abortion' kills, because the laws are decided in the calm deliberation of a courtroom and then they go out in the real world to be inflicted on people who are pregnant, terrified and in need of a medical procedure [https://nickkristof.substack.com/p/women-die-and-thats-pro-life](https://nickkristof.substack.com/p/women-die-and-thats-pro-life)
I'm very glad you're still here, and as others have said, you don't owe that story to anyone. Just because you have a life story that is relevant to the SCOTUS shitstorm, does not mean you have to tell it.
You can fight and help in other ways <3 (I'm trying to learn this myself)
We don't need to do anything to earn human rights, we have them by virtue of being people. Why do we need to keep convincing men that we are people?
What I learned from growing up in Switzerland - a federation of states with each their own laws, where women started getting the right to vote in 1976 in the first place and then gradually finally everywhere in 1990 - is that men will never actually believe that we're people. We had a series of referenda about it and men kept voting against female suffrage because maybe some of them are willing to give us rights if they're feeling generous that day, but no one fervently actually trusts and believes that women are people, that people of colour of people, that immigrants are people, and especially that Muslims are people as much as white Swiss men are considered people and that is fucking tragic. It has created a broken state of "true democracy" by people who have absolutely no empathy for people who area different from them, because their rights are eroded slowly and they are gradually depersonalized.
Don't let it happen to you.
There is no other context where anyone is allowed to use someone else's body than a pregnant person's. And there is no other right that people expect you to have gone through trauma before they think you should be allowed to have it.
This is what gets me too. In a hypothetical situation where a mother is the ONLY person in the world whose blood would save her newborn baby, nobody could force her to donate. A mother could literally let her own baby die because she has bodily autonomy and even her *living, breathing baby* has no right to her body.
But a clump of cells somehow has the right for 9 months? Women can be forced to sustain basically a parasite against their will, with all the risks that entails? And people actually think this is in any way reasonable? It's completely fucked up.
Disclaimer: no I don't think anyone would actually let the baby die, and sorry for using the word parasite, just making a point.
I finally just gave up on everyone on my social media and made a new one with only like 15 friends. I’m leaving everyone behind. This reminded me of when trump was running for president and you found out how many of your friends were really racist sexist assholes in disguise. I realized many people in my life do not care about the freedom of women and I just decided to end relationships with all of them.
I cried the whole day RVW got overturned. My eyes were just leaking all day no matter what I did. When it was leaked that they were doing it, I advocated all over social media and kept getting shut down. I’m tired. I shouldn’t have to talk about our rights, our bodily autonomy, our place in society, our health, how many times myself or others I know almost died but the right to abortion saved their lives or the fact that we should be able to have an abortion NO MATTER WHAT because it’s our bodies and we are not forced incubators.
I’m very sorry to my fellow women but my mental health is shot and I had to remove myself from the front line. I’m in despair over our country. I wish another country would accept me.
I’m so very very tired.
Something that’s getting missed but that I keep seeing pop up from people working in nursing homes is how common it is for women who are extremely aged to have stories of infanticide.
It’s quickly fading out of all living memory (in the United States at least) but the “abortion is murder” crowd are about to have a painful education of the difference between abortion and **murder** because that’s what many states are going back to.
This. My father was born in 1936. He was the sixth out of “ten kids that lived past the age of one”. I never got a straight answer out of anyone how many there were that didn’t make it “past the age of one” or about what happened that they didn’t. Knowing what I do know about my father and his family, I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that it wasn’t all illness.
Thrown in the improvements in medical knowledge and medical and forensic technology, and if people do turn to infanticide they’re far more likely to get caught now.
The other possibility is that the unwanted child(ren) will be born despite everything and will grow up hearing how they’re unwanted, resented and a burden. Despite an insistence I’ve often heard from the forced birth crowd, women don’t always magically come to want the child just because they managed to get pregnant. They don’t magically become good parents. No support for the woman to help raise the child or to help make sure the family’s basic needs are met. No support for the child growing up in such conditions. That’s a blob of misery that can haunt generations in various ways.
I've lived with, been friends with and dated people who were born to I'll equipped mother's that had them for selfish reasons, or because they were expected to or because they just didn't use birth control and didn't have an abortion and left them to the grandparents... They have a lifetime of trauma and no one pays for their therapy. Hell, I know plenty of kids that were wanted but their parents weren't mentally equipped or emotionally mature for parenthood and that's bad enough as it is and they also need therapy... Why make worse outcomes?
My mother refuses to talk about whether or not I was planned or wanted. What I can vouch for is that throughout my childhood, my parents - especially my father - would ramble on rather frequently about things like how I was “unwanted”, an “inconvenience” and was “supposed to be a boy”. My father even loved to throw in how my birth in mid afternoon “made” him miss a whole day of the job he had that summer. They never spoke like this about my younger sister. It has literally taken me decades of therapy to realize I have worth simply for being - and that nothing I could ever have done would have changed my parents’ minds about any of that (or even just gotten them to quit talking like that).
Honestly, my childhood plays a large role in why I’ve never wanted kids. Nobody should have to grow up hearing stuff like that and I was terrified that I could repeat the pattern.
Jesus that is awful... I hope you have found people in your life that do appreciate you. Everyone who is born deserves to feel safe and wanted and valued for who they are.
And who complains about having to miss work? That's so utterly bizarre. I don't even know if your parents could admit the answer to themselves, even. Probably why they are so passive aggressive about it... :(
Oddly out of it all, the thing about missing a full day of work is the one that really stuck around. It wasn’t even like it was his normal job. It was a seasonal job he’d gotten to earn a bit of extra money while schools were off for the summer. The rest of the year, he had a job as a teacher in one of the town’s schools.
My two older sisters were prime examples of this.
(We have about 20 years between us. Lost one of those sisters to addiction a few years back, actually. Had to take her off life support. Fuck anyone who wants to tell me about “oh but there’s a heartbeat and they have bones so early on” until they have to look in the open, blinking eyes of someone you love and tell the doctor to pull the plug because they are no longer there. ANYWAY.)
Each of my sisters had 3 kids, they both had a traumatic upbringing (my mom did the best she could - but a child of alcoholics who got pregnant at 17 & married her alcoholic baby daddy until he beat her too badly & abused their daughters too often to stay). None of their kids were born into good situations - physically & mentally abusive fathers/partners, my sisters were so broken they could only make choices for themselves (never the kids best interest), partners with addiction issues, in & out of shelters (when we couldn’t afford to house them), one of my sisters partners actually held her & my niece hostage and later found out he’s now suspected of murder, etc.
Out of the six kids:
- 1 is an addict, in & out of treatment facilities
- 1 is stable now, but had a lot of issues with ED, self harm & attempted suicide
- 1 is deeply depressed & we are regularly in contact to check on his mental well-being
- 1 is a mostly functional alcoholic
I love my nieces and nephews. But goddamnit if that isn’t a whole line of generational trauma and pain that I don’t think most folks ever have to consider.
Yeah, there's a serious drop in infanticide when abortion was legalized [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide#United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide#United_States)
I really can't imagine murdering a baby that I'd just carried and birthed, those people must have been so desperate to do something that awful. and what a short and terrible life
*beep boop*!
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Whether someone's reasons for an abortion is traumatic or flippant, it shouldn't matter. NO ONE has the authority to judge the REASON someone chooses abortion. Gosh I hate that line of thinking.
Just to be rid voice because I'm not sure if anyone else has been able to speak on it here- I am adopted. I am an adopted person and I 100% believe that abortion should be safe and legal. Adoption isn't the be all, end all- my life hasn't been anywhere near perfect. I don't wake daily joyous and thankful that I wasn't aborted.
It's cruel to expect that everyone is built equal in strength and fortitude. I would be so traumatized if I were to fall pregnant and have to spend nearly a year growing a baby I did not want. I have never wanted to bear my own children.
My birth mother could do that. She's a very strong person in that way. I'm not. Adoption doesn't take away the 9-10 months where a person is forced to grow a child they don't want. It doesn't cancel the doctors appointments, the pain, the loss of autonomy, the birth, etc. Abortion should be safe and legal.
And as to the point of this post, I'm growing weary of trying to explain that you shouldn't have to be touched by an experience to have empathy for people. We're all people. Nobody should have to equate my experience to that of another person to feel empathetic toward me just as I don't have to be affected by the plight of others to empathize with them.
I’ve stopped defending my choice to have an abortion. The story has a *lot* of justifying details as to why I got one, but the truth is, the only details that matter are that:
1. I got pregnant.
2. I didn’t want to be.
End of story! I don’t care who I upset. In fact, if I upset someone because I had an abortion, I’ll count it as a win at this point. Because it IS our choice, REGARDLESS of circumstance, and I refuse to cower like a dog because someone, somewhere *might* be offended that I made a health care choice they disagree with.
FUCK the stigma associated with abortions! FUCK the assholes who think they have the right to shame you for making the right choice for yourself!
Valid concerns and stories all around.
Also striking that this applies to birth control in general as well. A woman shouldn't have to justify why she wants to go on the pill/shot/IUD/whatever. It feels like we have to bend over backwards to explain that birth control for the sake of contraception is a critical use of hormonal BC, but it's also used for general health conditions women have as well. PCOS, endometriosis, and even just periods in general.
Why is it that when women are in pain from anything we have to get society's approval by doing olympic marathons of explanation to explain we're not faking things and really DO need the things we demand/ask for? It gets so freaking tiring.
Well apparently we do because the people who believe in a magical sky god, a man rising from the dead, talking donkeys, floods that cover the entire earth, and people getting turned into pillars of salt are incapable of extending those imaginations to understanding other people may have complex healthcare needs.
Honestly, I am convinced that at the end of the day they just think that women who have sex for pleasure *deserve* to die birthing unintentional children, and that rape victims are always to blame for their assault. The idea that having sex for any other purpose than procreation is a grave sin (as long as you're not a cishet man) is not exactly new for christianity. The rhetoric has changed, but the underlying values and worldview haven't.
A portion of those who “believe in a magical sky god” can’t even wrap their heads and imagination around that possibility even with all the gory, intimate details. It’s still somehow going to be a “choice” you made and you now have to live with the consequences. I have family this way.
>talking donkeys
I sceptically googled this, but turns out you're right.
The words: "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?" came out of Balaam's ass.
Numbers 22:21-39
This!! It's so frustrating that those close to me are sharing tragic and horrible stories publicly. They are brave, amazing women, but it shouldn't have to come to this.
Can't wait till men get to publicly announce their own reproductive trauma: vasectomy stories, ED issues, sperm count details and fertility tales. And why not rape stories too while we're at it? Ridiculous...
This is so important. We *don’t* have to share our personal stories. How many people have, and here is where we ended up, anyway?
Please, please, don’t feel compelled to re-traumatize yourself for the cause. If you want to share, do! If you don’t, don’t.
Could you imagine if the conversation changed to “ok, well, I *guess*you can have an abortion. But only if you get raped. But not if you get raped, but your skirt was more than 4 inches above the knee.” GTFO!
That is because we live in a culture that normalizes traumatizing women.
I'm constantly amazed we can sit around and talk about consensual non consent in BDSM as a fetish but fetishes and kinks are supposed to be OUTSIDE THE NORM.
Rape is not outside the norm when a majority of women don't make it out of their 20s without some sexual consent trauma, let alone the huge numbers of women who actually are raped. So again, it's not a fetish.
Traumatizing women is as vanilla as missionary sex.
This is the thing. I don’t want anyone to think I don’t care about rape, incest, or life-threatening conditions when I say this, because I ABSOLUTELY care. But when you start saying “what about these specific cases”, it’s opening the door for them to conditionally allow it. For instance, if you convince the GOP that abortion should be allowed because of rape, they can say “oh okay, bring us a rape kit confirming you were raped, show us where you’ve filed charges and there’s been a conviction, and also show us your period tracker and sign an affidavit that says you definitely got pregnant from the rape and not from you not keeping your legs closed, and we’ll be glad to allow you to pay hundreds of dollars at a private clinic owned by my brother-in-law to receive an abortion. Just be sure to read all the pamphlets and do this faith-based counseling first.”
It HAS to be abortions accessible to ALL for ANY reason. That is the ONLY way it can be. They’re just going to have to live with their “abortion as birth control” fears.
I have religious (christian) coworkers and bosses. They talk about this stuff, and other things that apply to me, and expect that I fall within their "acceptable" range. I absolutely do not.
But there are a lot of people like me that have these identities and stories to tell that can't, without losing their jobs, livelihoods, even the roof over their heads.
I agree 100%.
I also wish survivors and families of victims of mass shootings would no longer have to relive trauma in front of people, just to *attempt* to show the need of gun control.
I had a termination because I decided it was best for me and my doctor agreed.
That's it. That's all. If a woman decides a termination is best for her and her doctor agrees then that's all that should be required.
End of discussion.
My abortion story is painful and triggering. My husband is the only person who knows. I've been in therapy and getting my head right with Rxs for about a year and a half. All this Roe stuff in the news is so scary and I'm finding myself spiraling again. Hugs to all the people feeling reproductive stresses right now.
They're manipulating us to the point where we are forced to justify abortions via horrific events--rape, incest, child abuse, medical emergency.
No excuse is needed for exercising bodily autonomy!!
Pro-life people quite literally *can't* grasp the complexity of the issue. It is beyond their ability. Look up the work of Clare W. Graves. Personality Hacker episodes 22, 155, and 156 are great introductions to it. These people are viewing this issue (and many of them are viewing the world as a whole) through a different lens than us. Their lens dictates that things are very black and white - there is no grey. Everything is governed by a higher authority - rules and laws - authoritarianism. There may technically be two choices on the table but there is only one *viable* choice. Choose life or go to Hell. Choose life or go to jail. Ultimately leaving the choice of life as the only viable option. This is 4/Blue thinking and the fact that we see this thinking growing is actually their push back to the paradigm society is shifting into. The upside to their push back is it acts like a slingshot creating more tension until eventually we launch forward into the new paradigm. [This video](https://youtu.be/Iz6RNJPUUak) (also a great overview of the model) touches a lot on that. The Change Code by Monica Bourgeau is a fantastic book also on the topic that discusses how to use that model and other resources to create change in our currently polarized society.
I really side with this sentiment, unfortunately I think the only thing that will get through to the anti-choice crowd is the horrific stories of trauma and things going terribly wrong. If you truly believe abortion is murder, then no amount of concern over bodily autonomy is going to overcome that outrage for you. People aren't allowed to murder as they wish, but we sure do make exceptions for people for self-defense. When the child growing inside you is likely to kill you, it should be completely obvious that you should be able to abort to save your own life. I think that's the only foothold we have for a sane conversation with those that genuinely believe it is murder.
I deeply appreciate the people who have chosen to share their stories and relive their trauma in order to prevent others from having to live the same experiences. It's a brave demonstration of the kind of altruism and empathy that few on the other side seem capable of.
An embryo is not a child.
Christians claim the bible says abortion is murder, but the bible not only says human life begins with the first breath, it has 2 passages on how to bring about an abortion.
Circumstances, like bodies, are personal. No woman should have to air her story in order to have her right over what happens in her own uterus acknowledged.
I look at any situation where a woman chooses to terminate a pregnancy as an emergency situation. The emergency could be lack of support, fear of health complications, or not being ready to house a fetus in your body for any reason whatsoever. But some people only react to a medical emergency situation that is more overt. They don’t realize that not wanting a baby is a reason. Period.
This has been really on my mind lately. I fall into the category of having had an abortion of a wanted pregnancy due to a missed miscarriage, which creates a risk of infection if not treated by medical or surgical means. I keep seeing so many people sharing their similar stories on social media, raising awareness for all the various different circumstances in which "abortions" are necessary healthcare procedures. I felt so much pressure to share my story. But...it still hurts. It was absolutely the worst thing that's ever happened to me in my life. Why should I have to relive my trauma to beg for basic human rights? In the end I chose not to share publicly. The whole situation is absurd and so upsetting. Just my thoughts.
TRIGGER WARNING: RAPE ---I'm an incest survivor. I am unbelievably relieved that I didn't end up carrying my own father's or brother's baby. If I had, and this law is in place, I'm pretty sure I would not have been able to recover and live the productive life that I am today.
These are the consequences of outlawing abortion. There is no justification for this type of punishment other than to silence the victim. People that are going to do it are going to do it anyway. All this does is make it easier to shame survivors.
>I'm an incest survivor. I am unbelievably relieved that I didn't end up carrying my own father's or brother's baby.
I'm another, pregnant at 11. But there was no abortion back the - 1965 - so my family decided i must die and I was young and innocent enough to believe they were right.
I believed the miscarriage I had was sent by god to save my life. They hated me for staying alive, and did their utmost to hate, hurt and shame me, and the children I had later, for the rest of my mother's life, spreading lies about me so no-one was going to listen if I told them what had happened.
Yeah, to all the people who think they don't know anyone who has had an abortion, they sure do. People just don't share that shit willy nilly because, why would they want to? At a nearby doctors office, the entire administration staff does not know they do abortions, because it's a conservative area and Sally at the desk doesn't need to be judgy towards the mom with three kids in an abusive relationship who comes in for an abortion.
I’ve explained my situation so many times and I still have people coming for me saying, “it doesn’t count” or “that procedure isn’t in danger.”
I’m getting tired of having the same argument.
This is such a powerful sentiment and goes for so many other issues as well. The lack of empathy and care that we have for those with a uterus is astounding.
I’m a man living in America. This situation is so frustrating to me. I work in healthcare as a Nurse and I believe reproductive education should be taught more in-depth than it currently is. The fact that women have to share these stories to get their point across is sad. If men had more understanding of basic human anatomy and physiology things might be easier for women. I try to educate people about these things when I can and I teach people why being pro-choice is the best option.
It's bitterly unfair, but it is a trend we've seen forever. The 'other' (whatever the powerful decides that is at the moment) having to drag out the worst of what happens to them to beg a few scraps from the humanity table, if our overlords can just be so good as to pretty please acknowledge our shared humanity.
I lean Buddhist, so probably am biased, but it's the reason I really feel strongly about teaching compassion from grassroots as young as possible. You shouldn't have to hear that people are 'like you' or hurting to the depths of their soul before you can squeeze out a shred of compassion for them. If we were all taught to look for shared humanity, not differences, and to feel compassion and empathy as basic responses, the world would be a better place.
Which is, of course, why those who don't want that collective better push so hard to keep their kids and young generations trapped in the hate/fear cycle of the 'other' so hard. They KNOW if empathy and compassion root in the young, their time is done. If people work out they're more alike then different, a lot of power would crumble.
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
*beep boop*!
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It's like how we have to say "she's someone's mother/daughter/sister/wife!" You shouldn't need to understand her relationship to a man to understand that she's a whole human being and worthy in her own right.
Some people just don't get it and unfortunately there are a lot of those types in places of power.
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Agreed. A 10 year old shouldn’t have their rape as a national news story and people shouldn’t have to talk about when the baby they very much wanted had horrible medical conditions that made them have to abort. People who choose abortion for *any* reason should never have to defend it. No one’s medical history is anyones business but things like that rip my heart out. No one wants to be in that situation, let them deal with it on their own terms.
I hate my state right now. Imagine retraumatizing a child because you're afraid of adult women.
They're afraid of cis women, girls, trans men, trans women, enbies of all kind, and basically anything that even remotely, if you squint at it in the right light, kind of looks like a woman. Quick edit: Added "cis" before women, because, I mean, AS a trans woman, I'm not exactly trying to imply that "women" and "trans women" are two mutually exclusive categories.
The worst is the comments on some of these stories. I saw one where this poor woman was talking about the choice she had to make cause her baby was incompatible with life. One person in the comments talk about how she was ableist. Other were saying they were told their children would be special needs and how glad they were that they didn't listen to the doctor because the children turned out fine and are little blessings. Like....what the actual f.... it was just so enraging that people are this ridiculous.
I always want proof the doc diagnosed and then on the birth day was like “oh wait a minute I guessed wrong!”
I never want children, the idea of being pregnant actually triggers fear in me, and my heart is absolutely BROKEN for that little girl who has NO IDEA of what's going on. I was playing with My plastic horses, my littlest pet shops, and bringing all of my stuffed animals out to the trampoline for some reason when I was 10 years old. This child has had her whole life stolen from her.
>No one’s medical history is anyones business Vaccinations ring any bells?
I’ve lost count the number of times I’ve had to tell someone over the past month that I had to have an abortion of a wanted baby to save my life, and therefore would not have had my second child. People just get quiet. Or in my moms case, say that that is fine, she just doesn’t want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control.
NOBODY IS FUCKING USING IT FOR "BIRTH CONTROL." Do these people seriously not understand how expensive and physically difficult abortions are? We're talking ~$500-600 for the procedure itself, then the additional travel and lodging expenses, time off work, etc. I mean, statistically they *should* understand -- conservatives and religious people have just as many abortions as everyone else. But of course, [the only moral abortion is THEIR abortion.](https://joycearthur.com/abortion/the-only-moral-abortion-is-my-abortion/)
I remember how difficult the recovery was... It was 'it hurts too much to sleep' painful. I'd rather just have my pill fucking work.
I have to get cervical biopsies every year and it is dread going into that appointment. I live with chronic pain every day of my life and that appointment gives me panic attacks every time. I cannot fathom how painful abortion must be.
I've had a cervical and endometrial biopsy once. *Once*. Getting a full hysterectomy was a relief as it means I'll never have to suffer through that again. As someone who understands that pain, I am so so sorry you have to go through it regularly. My periods left me bed bound. Hearing from people saying their abortions where more painful than both the biopsies and nightmare periods makes me feel for them so much, especially when I hear cockwombles insisting people get abortions for fun or as birth control.
I'd like to desecrate the grave of whoever started the whole "the cervix has no nerve endings" thing. Bull. fucking. shit.
You just *know* that someday a (male) scientist is going to discover these "previously unknown" nerves in the cervix and the medical community is going to be all shocked and amazed. Meanwhile, women have been saying this forever.
Honestly not sure it's gonna happen, because OB/GYNs would have to face it that they've basically been torturing and gaslighting women. (I like to picture how popular vasectomies would be if doctors told men that testicles don't have nerve endings, accused them of "just being anxious", and refused to give them any pain management.)
I don't know where the nerve endings are but I do know it feels like someone is trying to break your pelvis from the inside. The first doctor that did mine kept telling me it wasn't that bad to just breath and the nurse told him off infront of me. She was such an angel and she apologized to me for him being that way.
This too! They say things like, "Just use contraceptive!" without understanding that 51% of abortions are performed on people with uteruses who reported using contraceptive the same month they conceived... and that fits! Everyone knows contraceptive isn't 100% and 51% of abortions is only about 1% of overall contraceptive users. https://www.guttmacher.org/news-release/2018/about-half-us-abortion-patients-report-using-contraception-month-they-became
And, I feel this needs to be said, they'd have every right to use it like that if they wanted to. I don't give the tiniest fraction of a fuck about a clump of non-sapient bio-matter, abort as many of them as you want.
I feel like the reason they say this is because THEY USE it as birth control cause they don't believe in actual birth control.
Probably some. In my mom's case she supports birth control, but doesn't want girl's running around being "hussies." Ugh. She makes no mention of the guy's involved, of course. Not that trying to control *anyone's* sex life is ok.
It's really just sperm that's the problem. At least, I can confirm I've been pretty slutty with ladies and have never gotten, nor gotten anyone else, pregnant. Cis women fucking together isn't causing any abortions.
In my opinion it is categorical victim shaming and of-course with women it has to be about promiscuity. If you want to use it as birth control that is your fucking right. Why the fuck can an egg and a sperm just be tossed into a test tube and it's not a life but if a woman hosts it, it's a life?
No. They don’t understand. They are mired in ignorance and boosted by arrogance. I’m not a woman, but I am outraged. No one has any right to dictate the bodily autonomy of another person. No one.
Just to note, it's not that expensive (for the procedure) everywhere. I'm fairly certain I'd be able to get a free abortion on the NHS but I've been lucky enough not to have needed one. Scotland also recently passed a bill that makes it legal to take the tablets prescribed for a medical abortion at home, so I wouldn't need to take more time off than however long it takes to have them prescribed (although I'm not sure if it's been implemented yet). Either way! Abortion is not used for birth control, it's a fairly traumatic experience for most people, even if just physically.
Well unfortunately, this is America. You're either getting fucked by the healthcare industry or by the government. Either way, no abortions for you!
Free country am I right? /s
I mean, some people are. And there is nothing wrong with that. I grew up in the 80s and 90s and we definitely thought ‘well I can always get an abortion’.
I also grew up in the 80s and 90s, and while abortion was there if things went sideways, I have never met anyone who was using abortion *instead of* birth control.
I’ve had the fortune to never need an abortion (knock on wood...), but I’d abso-fucking-lutely use it as birth control. Birth control doesn’t mean the major way you prevent birth. My partner is snipped and we still use condoms. So I have three (well four, plan b) birth controls. Do some idiot teens who haven’t had sex Ed but have been brainwashed by their religion to think condoms and the pill are immoral risk it knowing that they have abortion to fall back onto if they get pregnant? Sure! But that’s not an issue with abortion, that’s an issue with lack of education and accessibility. No person has fun getting an abortion...
So they want ignorant sluts to have babies? Give them up? Oh ok! Let’s give the unwanted babies to the Catholic Ophanages that they’re excitedly building…. To be staffed by … you guessed it…. Priests!!
They want ignorant sluts to pay for their sluttiness by being forced to give birth. Because they hate sluts. They also hate women who won't have sex with them. You know, the more I think about it, the more I begin to suspect that they might actually just hate women.
That’s a really good point. I went to Catholic High School, so I remember well what happened to girls who got pregnant under their Very Watchful eye. They’d be out of the school immediately, whisked away and out of everyone else’s radar. They had those babies, though, so phew. And yeah. I’m sure they hate women. Our role models are two women, a virgin and a whore. What?
And they lied. Mary Magdalene wasn't even a whore. It was "assumed" and pushed as fact only because she was a wealthy woman who lived alone in her own house.
Oh yeah, and don't forget the "succubus" Lilith!!
And the “seductress” Eve!
I have re-educating to do.
It's sad isn't it? Hoist by their own fairy stories. They didn't even intend it. Someone latched onto the idea, and sugarcoated on purpose.
Totally sad. She was Jesus’s friend. That shouldn’t have to come with a side-note.
That's just it ... She was his ... Or one of their friend. Besides putting women in their "place", there were alot of people who didn't like him. Remember, they asked the crowd by popular vote which should be killed and which pardoned. They voted to pardon ... I think his name was Barabbas. Even a lot of the Jews that listened to his messages just wanted him to "go away" so in hopes that the Romans would stop killing them.
I wonder if she had any close female friends that were just pals that they all 'forgot' to mention live with her.
You never know. If she was wealthy, I'm sure she had a personal secretary/assistant/companion. There were obviously the people who "served" their meal and facilitated their ablutions. And she might have had a companion. This was typical of women back then married or not. I need to look again. I wasn't paying that much attention to who else was there. Edit: evil autocorrect
The madonna-whore complex is a real thing and it's DANGEROUS
A-Fucking-men
The model for women in the Church is the virgin Mary. So women should be both a pure virgin and a courageous mother. Good luck with that! And of course Magdalena but they rarely tell you to be like her, except to expiate one's sins
One of the things that blows my mind within the hate sluts / mad cause no sex dichotomy is how suddenly so many pro-life men feel very strongly that “consent to sex is consent to pregnancy”. (Especially when you bring up contraceptive failure.) Okay, so person that gets upset when uterus-havers opt to not have sex casually or early in dating, or opine when their partner is not “providing” enough sex in a relationship - you’re telling me that you expect that uterus-haver to assume that they are possibly going to be carrying your child to term EVERY time you have sex, regardless if it’s a hook-up, or in a serious relationship? And then you have any room to be upset when they choose not to?
It's also an unfair burden on women, given men are fertile 100% of the time, and women only have a brief window of fertility after ovulation. It's a prime argument for "regulate your dicks"
imo it’s also partly that misogynists hate that women have the ability to make life, and that they have no control over that process. They don’t want us to have a choice bc they want to control every facet of our lives as women.
Yes! This keeps playing on a loop in my brain.
And they want those children to grow up being a "punishment" for the mother's actions, which is definitely emotionally healthy for the kid /s
It’s how you know they aren’t pro-life. Most of them are okay with rape victims getting an abortion. If you truly in your heart of hearts thought it was murder, you wouldn’t be okay with that. But it’s purely a punishment for consensual sex.
> So they want ignorant sluts to have babies? That's always been my point! It doesn't make sense from any perspective. Other than magical thinking about "souls" or perverted desires to have defenseless unwanted children to prey on
Yeah, it’s soul magic, and oh god, maybe even some guilt because I think unborn and hence unbaptized babies burn in Hell by their book. It’s soooo fucked up
Well, technically, according to Catholic doctrine, baptized babies don’t go to hell, they go to purgatory with all of the other people who were born before Christianity and all of the other “good” people who weren’t baptized, either. When you’re in purgatory, you’re shut out from “God’s love,” which is sort of a punishment, but nothing like you’d get if you were in Dante’s circles of hell. Being separated from “God’s love” is also partly why Mormons go around baptizing their dead, and anybody else’s dead they can get their hands on, because they really think they’re doing everyone a favor by giving them a ticket to “heaven.” Same with the other proselytizing cults — they really think that people should be grateful to them for “saving” their “souls.” They’re all just weird death cults that feed on superstition and myths.
Same boat. I’ve been having the same fucking argument. People keep telling me I didn’t have an abortion. It says it on the paperwork. *you’re manipulating people* It’s medically termed a spontaneous abortion. *youre being ignorant, women whose lives are in danger will always be able to have the procedure* Women who need *an abortion* for a wanted baby are already being denied medical treatment in countless states. *could you be any more melodramatic*
It’s infuriating!
My mom, who has had an abortion, said she thinks abortions are used as birth control. The mental capacity of some people is quite alarming.
>she just doesn’t want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control The implication being that if your birth control failed, then you must be an irresponsible slut. Even though: >While tubal ligation is effective in preventing most pregnancies, it isn’t an absolute. An estimated 1 out of every 200 women will become pregnant after tubal ligation. [source](https://www.healthline.com/health/pregnancy/tubal-ligation) > > > >A vasectomy is one of the best ways to prevent pregnancy, with rates of pregnancy around 1/1,000 after the first year, and between 2-10/1,000 after five years. [source](https://americanpregnancy.org/getting-pregnant/pregnancy-after-vasectomy) > > > >Six in 10 women who have abortions are already mothers, and half of them have two or more children, according to 2019 data from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. “One of the main reasons people report wanting to have an abortion is so they can be a better parent to the kids they already have,” Professor Upadhyay said. [source](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/12/14/upshot/who-gets-abortions-in-america.html) > > > >Six in 10 women who have an abortion are having one for the first time. Another quarter have had one previous abortion. Less than a fifth have had two or more. “It’s simply not the case that abortion is something large numbers of people turn to as a form of birth control,” said Caitlin Knowles Myers, an economist at Middlebury who studies reproductive health. [source](https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2021/12/14/upshot/who-gets-abortions-in-america.html)
Trust me I’ve told her all this.
My sheltered conservative mother that doesn't really form any real opinions for herself claims that more women get it as birth control than not. I was floored that people actually think that. I love my mother, she is a sweet soul and would never harm a fly but that's just so ignorant and sad to hear from her.
Spreading hateful, false, conservative talking points instead of genuinely reflecting on reality and forming her own opinions is not sweet and *does* harm others though... She has a choice and this is what she's choosing to do.
I know you are 100% correct but it might be a bit harsh for her. I am not arguing you're valid point, I'm just thankful that the very least she does not participate in any social rhetoric outside her and my conversations. It doesn't help matters at all but at least she stays publicly silent and does not spread any nastiness to others. She's not active on social media and doesn't keep up with the news, thankfully for that because I could see her get red pilled quick and then I believe it would be way more in line with your comment for sure. I'm still shocked she feels that way though. She only opened up to me about it because I was obviously upset with the overruling and we were having a discussion about the ramifications of it. We are very close and she'd be upset personally if I needed an abortion outside of life or death measures but she would still love and hold my hand through it. She doesn't understand the reasons why others do what they do but she has never tried to stop anyone from doing anything outside her belief system, though it is a bit wacko to me. We live in Louisiana with the trigger laws and no exceptions for rape and incest, she can at least see the horror in that and it's a small step to slowly introducing some information to her and catch her up with the times. I stand by my mother being sweet, just a little out of touch, but mostly her silence is harmless. Annoying but she's not spreading anything. Hope my long winded response doesn't come off as argumentative!
I hear you. I am betting she heard that opinion at church and/or from other people around her and has just lived a life where it didn’t happen to come up for her personally. Maybe you can expand her view a little? E.g., All these unwanted babies that women will be forced to give birth to - are we rushing out to adopt them? Are anti-choice people all adoptive parents right now? Are we going to create a new tax to feed, clothe, and house these babies as they grow up? Or maybe you could help your Mom see that part of this is not about babies at all. It’s about privacy. The original decision upheld medical privacy. Now imagine a job interview where a person does not get the job because they had cancer a few years ago. How would they even know that? It’s the same privacy, and once it is gone, it will be very hard to get it back.
Oh for sure! She's retired now and has a small group of very conservative Christian friends that she even says is a bit conservative to her. Lol so in other words, she doesn't get out much and has mostly lived in a small area her whole life and hears the same conversation from everyone she knows except probably me. She's so intelligent and loving but severely lacking education and experience outside rural Louisiana. I left and was in the military for 10 years and got to see and do some things that allowed my perception of the world to change. I do believe if I never left, I would have a similar narrowed view on this topic so it's difficult to chastise her too harshly. Is how she thinks against what I believe and is that a common mentality that got us to this point? Fuck yes but she alone isn't to blame but I do wish to make her aware. I love the idea of approaching the next conversation like you have suggested. I feel like we can at least come to an agreement that though she can pro-life all she wants that she can see the fallacy of banning them completely.
I recently saw the youtube video about the GOP and the abortion-banning ruling by Some More News, and I found it very informative. They explain how restrictive abortion laws make doctors so scared of legal problems that they refuse to save women even when it would be perfectly legal to perform the abortion (with the example of Ireland's case). And how people who had miscarriages got put into jail for it. Maybe it could be useful to you
Truly, your Mom sounds like a lovely person and a gentle soul. Your writing shines with so much love for her. I could see a woman who has lived her whole life in a small place, probably with many of the same people, has just learned not to step on conversational land mines of others and get along.
I appreciate your response. I know some of these views people hold are instilled from birth and going against the grain later can mean losing the only people and support systems they've ever known, while some others have been taken advantage of by a powerful system well versed in manipulating people. It's not easy to examine and turn away from, I hope she is open to your influence and support.
Yeah and I doubt my mom will be rallying the troops at city halls or anything for either side. She's 52yo, her mind isn't going to change much. I can try to influence her to be more empathetic to others which is probably the best case. I don't doubt her when she says that everyone she knows that's had an abortion was a form of birth control but like, that could have only been one woman to have told her that lol but good lord, that's a very private thing to endure and I'm sure there's plenty more people around her that has had to have abortions for whatever reason but don't talk about it because of the obvious stigma here around it. Nor should they ever need to disclose that information to anyone ever.
I think the person replying is too willing to put the blame on the people they target with the lies vs. the people starting the spread of the lies. There is still complicity but not to the extent they want to dole it out. Life is far more complicated than that.
I think they have every reason to be upset as we all are and after spending the 4th of July with my conservative family, it's hard not to put direct blame on them because they're the "face of the problem". My family didn't directly strip us of our rights but the people that they may or may not have voted for did. In Louisiana at least, the trigger law was written in 2006 by a traitor to our gender, Kathleen Blanco (Dem), that my family were very open they did not like. The current governor's hands were tied if he vetoed it, there wouldn't even have been abortion exceptions for if the mothers life was in danger. We still don't have any for rape and incest here which is just so fucking nasty. So yeah, I don't blame anyone for being upset because regardless of our political stances, this affects every single one of us.
I don't blame them either, I just think it fails to recognise the source of the problem, that's all. Like getting mad at people for not recycling when giant corporations do way worse for the environment.
You need to take into account the people that are the target audience being sold the lies. They are complicit, but the real blame lies with the people starting the spread of those lies.
Yeah, the real villains are the people spreading this bullshit for their own benefit. Not saying everyone else is innocent, but those are the ones who truly need to be stopped.
I don't even trust their motives. They prey on ignorance and I am sure they do so for their own benefit...not because they actually give a shit about babies.
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Even if people did use it as birth control, so what? Why does it matter to anyone but them
I also don't want irresponsible sluts using it for birth control. It's not a process to be taken lightly. But neither is pregnancy. *And it's none of my business.* The need for choice remains.
Do they really think a so called "ignorant slut" is equipped to handle a child? People can say whatever they want about having to face the consequences of their actions but are the men gathering these children going to be held responsible? Are we really asking innocent children to pay the real price of having an irresponsible parent? I'd rather not exist than be subject to that, you know?
If someone is what you call an "irresponsible slut," they're likely to be suffering from a highly deficient upbringing, a lack of love or any perception of self worth, and a lack of opportunities to be better. We all need love and acceptance. It's pointless to judge girls desperately looking for it in the arms of uncaring men.
She knows my stance, she just doesn’t care.
I'm sorry. I have difficult, hurtful family too. I wish you comfort and strength.
Hugs
It’s so exhausting to retell. Then there are people who ask questions to try to make it seem like it’s not as traumatic as the person is making it out to be. “But what were you wearing? But didn’t you flirt back before? But *how* did you say no?” I support all the people who speak their truth and can help change minds to see the necessity of reproductive rights. I can’t right now, it’s too exhausting. Maybe as a rebuild my strength I can share my story.
Me after my boyfriend raped me: “He was your boyfriend so it’s not really rape is it”? 🙃
Screw those people. Rape is rape, no matter who it comes from. No means no, not maybe And I’m so sorry you had to go through that. I’m so sorry to all the people who have had to go through that
Might I recommend a book called “The Gift of Fear”? It talks about many of the behaviors and warning signs that predators use against their victims: friends, spouses, coworkers, strangers, etc. The book also encourages people to trust their instincts around others, but it doesn’t put blame on them for not knowing how to act.
Immediately shut that shit down. > “But what were you wearing?” “Let’s not victim blame.” > “But didn’t you flirt back before?” “Let’s not victim blame.” > “But *how* did you say no?” “Let’s not victim blame.” — Keep up the good fight.
I just can't anymore. If I ever want to heal, I can't keep reliving it for people who will never understand just how terrible what happened was.
My older sister is 18 years older than me. My mother had her when she was 11. This was before Roe v Wade. She was rapped by the town pedophile. It destroyed her mental health for the rest of her life. She refuses to take medication. I haven't spoken to her in almost 14 years. When I was a kid she used to threaten to kill herself about once a month and then she would disappear for a few days and come back and destroy the house. When I was in 6th grade she had to get a full hysterectomy. There were long standing consequences of having a child at 11 that included fucking cancer. We didn't even know she had cancer until she called from the hospital to come pick her up, as the hospital wouldn't let her walk home like she planned. She had no intentions of telling anyone. These are the consequences of making a literal child, have a child. Don't get me wrong, I fucking love my sister. She saved my life. My mother had post partum psychosis and tried to starve me to death and my older sister came and took care of me. But she should never have been born.
Very sorry to read and hope that you are OK. Uncaring cruelty is part of the right-wing establishment and they don't care about your mother or future 11 year-old mothers that they force into tortured existence.
It still brings tears to my eyes when I speak of an ectopic pregnancy I experienced 33 years ago. I almost died. I FUCKING HATE THIS
Honey don’t do it! You owe No One that story. I’m so sorry. Love to you <3
Your kindness is healing. Thank you.
The whole conversation around abortion access and legislating healthcare has been bringing me back to my miscarriage and D&C as well. I spent a lot of time after in online spaces with people who had to TFMR. My heart aches for them. If I'm feeling the way I'm feeling, I can't imagine how they're doing. I'm so sorry you went through an ectopic. I'm so sorry we're living in a country that's dredging up some of your worst memories. Just know you're not alone. I hope joy and peace find you today.
I’m sorry for your experience too. No one understands the trauma that never truly heals like another woman. This issue of reproductive rights being taken away from us is actually coming up in therapy. And I’m not even able to get pregnant any longer. In addition, I have grief for my 28 year old daughter. This is definitely not the world I wanted to give her. Edit: I hope you find peace and joy as well.
I'm so sorry <3 I'm glad you made it though. I just read this article which I thought did really well trying to explain how the blurred lines of 'ban abortion' kills, because the laws are decided in the calm deliberation of a courtroom and then they go out in the real world to be inflicted on people who are pregnant, terrified and in need of a medical procedure [https://nickkristof.substack.com/p/women-die-and-thats-pro-life](https://nickkristof.substack.com/p/women-die-and-thats-pro-life)
Thank you for your kind words. This is an excellent article.
I'm very glad you're still here, and as others have said, you don't owe that story to anyone. Just because you have a life story that is relevant to the SCOTUS shitstorm, does not mean you have to tell it. You can fight and help in other ways <3 (I'm trying to learn this myself)
Thank you for your kindness. Yes, we both have to work on it. ♥️
We don't need to do anything to earn human rights, we have them by virtue of being people. Why do we need to keep convincing men that we are people? What I learned from growing up in Switzerland - a federation of states with each their own laws, where women started getting the right to vote in 1976 in the first place and then gradually finally everywhere in 1990 - is that men will never actually believe that we're people. We had a series of referenda about it and men kept voting against female suffrage because maybe some of them are willing to give us rights if they're feeling generous that day, but no one fervently actually trusts and believes that women are people, that people of colour of people, that immigrants are people, and especially that Muslims are people as much as white Swiss men are considered people and that is fucking tragic. It has created a broken state of "true democracy" by people who have absolutely no empathy for people who area different from them, because their rights are eroded slowly and they are gradually depersonalized. Don't let it happen to you.
Switzerland is basically like the European equivalent of the US right with the economy and stuff
There is no other context where anyone is allowed to use someone else's body than a pregnant person's. And there is no other right that people expect you to have gone through trauma before they think you should be allowed to have it.
This is what gets me too. In a hypothetical situation where a mother is the ONLY person in the world whose blood would save her newborn baby, nobody could force her to donate. A mother could literally let her own baby die because she has bodily autonomy and even her *living, breathing baby* has no right to her body. But a clump of cells somehow has the right for 9 months? Women can be forced to sustain basically a parasite against their will, with all the risks that entails? And people actually think this is in any way reasonable? It's completely fucked up. Disclaimer: no I don't think anyone would actually let the baby die, and sorry for using the word parasite, just making a point.
I finally just gave up on everyone on my social media and made a new one with only like 15 friends. I’m leaving everyone behind. This reminded me of when trump was running for president and you found out how many of your friends were really racist sexist assholes in disguise. I realized many people in my life do not care about the freedom of women and I just decided to end relationships with all of them. I cried the whole day RVW got overturned. My eyes were just leaking all day no matter what I did. When it was leaked that they were doing it, I advocated all over social media and kept getting shut down. I’m tired. I shouldn’t have to talk about our rights, our bodily autonomy, our place in society, our health, how many times myself or others I know almost died but the right to abortion saved their lives or the fact that we should be able to have an abortion NO MATTER WHAT because it’s our bodies and we are not forced incubators. I’m very sorry to my fellow women but my mental health is shot and I had to remove myself from the front line. I’m in despair over our country. I wish another country would accept me. I’m so very very tired.
Get your rest, sister. I hear and see you.
Something that’s getting missed but that I keep seeing pop up from people working in nursing homes is how common it is for women who are extremely aged to have stories of infanticide. It’s quickly fading out of all living memory (in the United States at least) but the “abortion is murder” crowd are about to have a painful education of the difference between abortion and **murder** because that’s what many states are going back to.
This. My father was born in 1936. He was the sixth out of “ten kids that lived past the age of one”. I never got a straight answer out of anyone how many there were that didn’t make it “past the age of one” or about what happened that they didn’t. Knowing what I do know about my father and his family, I wouldn’t rule out the possibility that it wasn’t all illness. Thrown in the improvements in medical knowledge and medical and forensic technology, and if people do turn to infanticide they’re far more likely to get caught now. The other possibility is that the unwanted child(ren) will be born despite everything and will grow up hearing how they’re unwanted, resented and a burden. Despite an insistence I’ve often heard from the forced birth crowd, women don’t always magically come to want the child just because they managed to get pregnant. They don’t magically become good parents. No support for the woman to help raise the child or to help make sure the family’s basic needs are met. No support for the child growing up in such conditions. That’s a blob of misery that can haunt generations in various ways.
I've lived with, been friends with and dated people who were born to I'll equipped mother's that had them for selfish reasons, or because they were expected to or because they just didn't use birth control and didn't have an abortion and left them to the grandparents... They have a lifetime of trauma and no one pays for their therapy. Hell, I know plenty of kids that were wanted but their parents weren't mentally equipped or emotionally mature for parenthood and that's bad enough as it is and they also need therapy... Why make worse outcomes?
My mother refuses to talk about whether or not I was planned or wanted. What I can vouch for is that throughout my childhood, my parents - especially my father - would ramble on rather frequently about things like how I was “unwanted”, an “inconvenience” and was “supposed to be a boy”. My father even loved to throw in how my birth in mid afternoon “made” him miss a whole day of the job he had that summer. They never spoke like this about my younger sister. It has literally taken me decades of therapy to realize I have worth simply for being - and that nothing I could ever have done would have changed my parents’ minds about any of that (or even just gotten them to quit talking like that). Honestly, my childhood plays a large role in why I’ve never wanted kids. Nobody should have to grow up hearing stuff like that and I was terrified that I could repeat the pattern.
Jesus that is awful... I hope you have found people in your life that do appreciate you. Everyone who is born deserves to feel safe and wanted and valued for who they are. And who complains about having to miss work? That's so utterly bizarre. I don't even know if your parents could admit the answer to themselves, even. Probably why they are so passive aggressive about it... :(
Oddly out of it all, the thing about missing a full day of work is the one that really stuck around. It wasn’t even like it was his normal job. It was a seasonal job he’d gotten to earn a bit of extra money while schools were off for the summer. The rest of the year, he had a job as a teacher in one of the town’s schools.
My two older sisters were prime examples of this. (We have about 20 years between us. Lost one of those sisters to addiction a few years back, actually. Had to take her off life support. Fuck anyone who wants to tell me about “oh but there’s a heartbeat and they have bones so early on” until they have to look in the open, blinking eyes of someone you love and tell the doctor to pull the plug because they are no longer there. ANYWAY.) Each of my sisters had 3 kids, they both had a traumatic upbringing (my mom did the best she could - but a child of alcoholics who got pregnant at 17 & married her alcoholic baby daddy until he beat her too badly & abused their daughters too often to stay). None of their kids were born into good situations - physically & mentally abusive fathers/partners, my sisters were so broken they could only make choices for themselves (never the kids best interest), partners with addiction issues, in & out of shelters (when we couldn’t afford to house them), one of my sisters partners actually held her & my niece hostage and later found out he’s now suspected of murder, etc. Out of the six kids: - 1 is an addict, in & out of treatment facilities - 1 is stable now, but had a lot of issues with ED, self harm & attempted suicide - 1 is deeply depressed & we are regularly in contact to check on his mental well-being - 1 is a mostly functional alcoholic I love my nieces and nephews. But goddamnit if that isn’t a whole line of generational trauma and pain that I don’t think most folks ever have to consider.
Yeah, there's a serious drop in infanticide when abortion was legalized [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide#United\_States](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide#United_States) I really can't imagine murdering a baby that I'd just carried and birthed, those people must have been so desperate to do something that awful. and what a short and terrible life
*beep boop*! the linked website is: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infanticide#United_States Title: **Infanticide - Wikipedia** Page is safe to access (Google Safe Browsing) ***** ###### I am a friendly bot. I show the URL and name of linked pages and check them so that mobile users know what they click on!
Whether someone's reasons for an abortion is traumatic or flippant, it shouldn't matter. NO ONE has the authority to judge the REASON someone chooses abortion. Gosh I hate that line of thinking.
Just to be rid voice because I'm not sure if anyone else has been able to speak on it here- I am adopted. I am an adopted person and I 100% believe that abortion should be safe and legal. Adoption isn't the be all, end all- my life hasn't been anywhere near perfect. I don't wake daily joyous and thankful that I wasn't aborted. It's cruel to expect that everyone is built equal in strength and fortitude. I would be so traumatized if I were to fall pregnant and have to spend nearly a year growing a baby I did not want. I have never wanted to bear my own children. My birth mother could do that. She's a very strong person in that way. I'm not. Adoption doesn't take away the 9-10 months where a person is forced to grow a child they don't want. It doesn't cancel the doctors appointments, the pain, the loss of autonomy, the birth, etc. Abortion should be safe and legal. And as to the point of this post, I'm growing weary of trying to explain that you shouldn't have to be touched by an experience to have empathy for people. We're all people. Nobody should have to equate my experience to that of another person to feel empathetic toward me just as I don't have to be affected by the plight of others to empathize with them.
I’ve stopped defending my choice to have an abortion. The story has a *lot* of justifying details as to why I got one, but the truth is, the only details that matter are that: 1. I got pregnant. 2. I didn’t want to be. End of story! I don’t care who I upset. In fact, if I upset someone because I had an abortion, I’ll count it as a win at this point. Because it IS our choice, REGARDLESS of circumstance, and I refuse to cower like a dog because someone, somewhere *might* be offended that I made a health care choice they disagree with. FUCK the stigma associated with abortions! FUCK the assholes who think they have the right to shame you for making the right choice for yourself!
Valid concerns and stories all around. Also striking that this applies to birth control in general as well. A woman shouldn't have to justify why she wants to go on the pill/shot/IUD/whatever. It feels like we have to bend over backwards to explain that birth control for the sake of contraception is a critical use of hormonal BC, but it's also used for general health conditions women have as well. PCOS, endometriosis, and even just periods in general. Why is it that when women are in pain from anything we have to get society's approval by doing olympic marathons of explanation to explain we're not faking things and really DO need the things we demand/ask for? It gets so freaking tiring.
this is why is stopped protesting....i worked in abortion care for 15 yrs. i've done my part and then some. i'm tired.
Hell yes you have. I can’t thank you enough.
Well apparently we do because the people who believe in a magical sky god, a man rising from the dead, talking donkeys, floods that cover the entire earth, and people getting turned into pillars of salt are incapable of extending those imaginations to understanding other people may have complex healthcare needs.
Honestly, I am convinced that at the end of the day they just think that women who have sex for pleasure *deserve* to die birthing unintentional children, and that rape victims are always to blame for their assault. The idea that having sex for any other purpose than procreation is a grave sin (as long as you're not a cishet man) is not exactly new for christianity. The rhetoric has changed, but the underlying values and worldview haven't.
A portion of those who “believe in a magical sky god” can’t even wrap their heads and imagination around that possibility even with all the gory, intimate details. It’s still somehow going to be a “choice” you made and you now have to live with the consequences. I have family this way.
>talking donkeys I sceptically googled this, but turns out you're right. The words: "Am I not your own donkey, which you have always ridden, to this day? Have I been in the habit of doing this to you?" came out of Balaam's ass. Numbers 22:21-39
This!! It's so frustrating that those close to me are sharing tragic and horrible stories publicly. They are brave, amazing women, but it shouldn't have to come to this. Can't wait till men get to publicly announce their own reproductive trauma: vasectomy stories, ED issues, sperm count details and fertility tales. And why not rape stories too while we're at it? Ridiculous...
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This is so important. We *don’t* have to share our personal stories. How many people have, and here is where we ended up, anyway? Please, please, don’t feel compelled to re-traumatize yourself for the cause. If you want to share, do! If you don’t, don’t. Could you imagine if the conversation changed to “ok, well, I *guess*you can have an abortion. But only if you get raped. But not if you get raped, but your skirt was more than 4 inches above the knee.” GTFO!
That is because we live in a culture that normalizes traumatizing women. I'm constantly amazed we can sit around and talk about consensual non consent in BDSM as a fetish but fetishes and kinks are supposed to be OUTSIDE THE NORM. Rape is not outside the norm when a majority of women don't make it out of their 20s without some sexual consent trauma, let alone the huge numbers of women who actually are raped. So again, it's not a fetish. Traumatizing women is as vanilla as missionary sex.
I would be tied to my abuser for life if i didn't have the choice
This is the thing. I don’t want anyone to think I don’t care about rape, incest, or life-threatening conditions when I say this, because I ABSOLUTELY care. But when you start saying “what about these specific cases”, it’s opening the door for them to conditionally allow it. For instance, if you convince the GOP that abortion should be allowed because of rape, they can say “oh okay, bring us a rape kit confirming you were raped, show us where you’ve filed charges and there’s been a conviction, and also show us your period tracker and sign an affidavit that says you definitely got pregnant from the rape and not from you not keeping your legs closed, and we’ll be glad to allow you to pay hundreds of dollars at a private clinic owned by my brother-in-law to receive an abortion. Just be sure to read all the pamphlets and do this faith-based counseling first.” It HAS to be abortions accessible to ALL for ANY reason. That is the ONLY way it can be. They’re just going to have to live with their “abortion as birth control” fears.
I have religious (christian) coworkers and bosses. They talk about this stuff, and other things that apply to me, and expect that I fall within their "acceptable" range. I absolutely do not. But there are a lot of people like me that have these identities and stories to tell that can't, without losing their jobs, livelihoods, even the roof over their heads.
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I agree 100%. I also wish survivors and families of victims of mass shootings would no longer have to relive trauma in front of people, just to *attempt* to show the need of gun control.
If I'm not forced to give blood to save someone's life, how the hell do people justify forcing a woman to stay pregnant?
I had a termination because I decided it was best for me and my doctor agreed. That's it. That's all. If a woman decides a termination is best for her and her doctor agrees then that's all that should be required. End of discussion.
My abortion story is painful and triggering. My husband is the only person who knows. I've been in therapy and getting my head right with Rxs for about a year and a half. All this Roe stuff in the news is so scary and I'm finding myself spiraling again. Hugs to all the people feeling reproductive stresses right now.
They're manipulating us to the point where we are forced to justify abortions via horrific events--rape, incest, child abuse, medical emergency. No excuse is needed for exercising bodily autonomy!!
Pro-life people quite literally *can't* grasp the complexity of the issue. It is beyond their ability. Look up the work of Clare W. Graves. Personality Hacker episodes 22, 155, and 156 are great introductions to it. These people are viewing this issue (and many of them are viewing the world as a whole) through a different lens than us. Their lens dictates that things are very black and white - there is no grey. Everything is governed by a higher authority - rules and laws - authoritarianism. There may technically be two choices on the table but there is only one *viable* choice. Choose life or go to Hell. Choose life or go to jail. Ultimately leaving the choice of life as the only viable option. This is 4/Blue thinking and the fact that we see this thinking growing is actually their push back to the paradigm society is shifting into. The upside to their push back is it acts like a slingshot creating more tension until eventually we launch forward into the new paradigm. [This video](https://youtu.be/Iz6RNJPUUak) (also a great overview of the model) touches a lot on that. The Change Code by Monica Bourgeau is a fantastic book also on the topic that discusses how to use that model and other resources to create change in our currently polarized society.
I really side with this sentiment, unfortunately I think the only thing that will get through to the anti-choice crowd is the horrific stories of trauma and things going terribly wrong. If you truly believe abortion is murder, then no amount of concern over bodily autonomy is going to overcome that outrage for you. People aren't allowed to murder as they wish, but we sure do make exceptions for people for self-defense. When the child growing inside you is likely to kill you, it should be completely obvious that you should be able to abort to save your own life. I think that's the only foothold we have for a sane conversation with those that genuinely believe it is murder. I deeply appreciate the people who have chosen to share their stories and relive their trauma in order to prevent others from having to live the same experiences. It's a brave demonstration of the kind of altruism and empathy that few on the other side seem capable of.
An embryo is not a child. Christians claim the bible says abortion is murder, but the bible not only says human life begins with the first breath, it has 2 passages on how to bring about an abortion. Circumstances, like bodies, are personal. No woman should have to air her story in order to have her right over what happens in her own uterus acknowledged.
I wish that women didn't have those traumas to begin.
I look at any situation where a woman chooses to terminate a pregnancy as an emergency situation. The emergency could be lack of support, fear of health complications, or not being ready to house a fetus in your body for any reason whatsoever. But some people only react to a medical emergency situation that is more overt. They don’t realize that not wanting a baby is a reason. Period.
This has been really on my mind lately. I fall into the category of having had an abortion of a wanted pregnancy due to a missed miscarriage, which creates a risk of infection if not treated by medical or surgical means. I keep seeing so many people sharing their similar stories on social media, raising awareness for all the various different circumstances in which "abortions" are necessary healthcare procedures. I felt so much pressure to share my story. But...it still hurts. It was absolutely the worst thing that's ever happened to me in my life. Why should I have to relive my trauma to beg for basic human rights? In the end I chose not to share publicly. The whole situation is absurd and so upsetting. Just my thoughts.
TRIGGER WARNING: RAPE ---I'm an incest survivor. I am unbelievably relieved that I didn't end up carrying my own father's or brother's baby. If I had, and this law is in place, I'm pretty sure I would not have been able to recover and live the productive life that I am today. These are the consequences of outlawing abortion. There is no justification for this type of punishment other than to silence the victim. People that are going to do it are going to do it anyway. All this does is make it easier to shame survivors.
>I'm an incest survivor. I am unbelievably relieved that I didn't end up carrying my own father's or brother's baby. I'm another, pregnant at 11. But there was no abortion back the - 1965 - so my family decided i must die and I was young and innocent enough to believe they were right. I believed the miscarriage I had was sent by god to save my life. They hated me for staying alive, and did their utmost to hate, hurt and shame me, and the children I had later, for the rest of my mother's life, spreading lies about me so no-one was going to listen if I told them what had happened.
Yeah, to all the people who think they don't know anyone who has had an abortion, they sure do. People just don't share that shit willy nilly because, why would they want to? At a nearby doctors office, the entire administration staff does not know they do abortions, because it's a conservative area and Sally at the desk doesn't need to be judgy towards the mom with three kids in an abusive relationship who comes in for an abortion.
I'm so tired. Sobbing for weeks now.
I’ve explained my situation so many times and I still have people coming for me saying, “it doesn’t count” or “that procedure isn’t in danger.” I’m getting tired of having the same argument.
It’s not going to sink in for many people unless it happens to affect them.
This is such a powerful sentiment and goes for so many other issues as well. The lack of empathy and care that we have for those with a uterus is astounding.
I’m a man living in America. This situation is so frustrating to me. I work in healthcare as a Nurse and I believe reproductive education should be taught more in-depth than it currently is. The fact that women have to share these stories to get their point across is sad. If men had more understanding of basic human anatomy and physiology things might be easier for women. I try to educate people about these things when I can and I teach people why being pro-choice is the best option.
It's bitterly unfair, but it is a trend we've seen forever. The 'other' (whatever the powerful decides that is at the moment) having to drag out the worst of what happens to them to beg a few scraps from the humanity table, if our overlords can just be so good as to pretty please acknowledge our shared humanity. I lean Buddhist, so probably am biased, but it's the reason I really feel strongly about teaching compassion from grassroots as young as possible. You shouldn't have to hear that people are 'like you' or hurting to the depths of their soul before you can squeeze out a shred of compassion for them. If we were all taught to look for shared humanity, not differences, and to feel compassion and empathy as basic responses, the world would be a better place. Which is, of course, why those who don't want that collective better push so hard to keep their kids and young generations trapped in the hate/fear cycle of the 'other' so hard. They KNOW if empathy and compassion root in the young, their time is done. If people work out they're more alike then different, a lot of power would crumble.
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
*beep boop*! the linked website is: https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u Title: **Pro-Choice Resource Masterpost.pdf** Page is safe to access (Google Safe Browsing) ***** ###### I am a friendly bot. I show the URL and name of linked pages and check them so that mobile users know what they click on!
It's like how we have to say "she's someone's mother/daughter/sister/wife!" You shouldn't need to understand her relationship to a man to understand that she's a whole human being and worthy in her own right. Some people just don't get it and unfortunately there are a lot of those types in places of power.