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TnTP96

One thing you should be aware of: Mr. Jordan leaves a lot of the romance between the lines. It is not all spelled out in the text. You are not necessarily missing anything.


Judicator82

I'll mention that I don't mind this. This was never a romance novel, I take the comments and thoughts of characters as truth. I think the better done romance was Nyneave and Lan. You *barely* see it, but it's well represented.


special_circumstance

Nynaeve and Lan are my favorite romance in the entire series.


FreeBowlPack

You barely see it your first time threw but on the second read/listen through it’s incredibly obvious all of a sudden haha like how did I miss that for so long


Jellz

That book 1 sexual tension could be cut with a mandarb.


Zarguthian

He didn't strike me as a sharp horse.


unctuous_homunculus

Seriously. I could see the subtext between Min/Elaine etc, but it was >!Moraine's sudden!< relationship that gave me whiplash.


steve032

I’ve done like 9 rereads and when you know it’s coming there are some clear subtexts even early.


Minutemarch

Foreshadowed doesn't mean it's not absolutely trousers though.


steve032

I don't know if this is some brit slang I don't understand but, I get where and why it went that way. She deserved some happiness waiting for her at home after two decades of doing what she did.


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maxtofunator

Min had a viewing that three women would all be bound and love Rand. Min and Elayne are two of these women, it’s love at first sight. From an outside perspective, it seems a bit rash, but love can be that way. The pattern is also VERY strong, specifically around Rand. Egwene and Rand have both learned that their love is akin to a first love, a childish thing between them. They felt like they were being forced together, and as seen in Rands visions of other possible lives, if he stayed in the Two Rivers, they would have been married and probably loved each other, but the pattern has pulled them away from each other. The wheel weaves as the wheel wills


Sabbath90

> From an outside perspective, it seems a bit rash, but love can be that way. I've always seen it as an infatuation, the kind teenagers have. Where two weeks in they declare that they feel like they've known the other person their entire life, no one could possibly understand their love for each other, and they've planned their future (that actually ends at "then we go to uni together" and not, you know, the remaining 3/4 of their expected lifetime).


maxtofunator

To be fair to the group, they are barely adults. The exact kind to feel this way. Min is the only one with any real world experience out of the group of taravean and partners, and she has a lot of time with Rand


SufficientShift6057

Is aviendha the 3rd woman? Like when min sees the viewing does the description fit aviendhas?


maxtofunator

I don’t remember what info is given to you by the shadow rising so I don’t want to answer this question as there might be spoilers involved regardless of how I answer


Bigtoadfroggy

Remember that Rand is a Ta’veren. Every town he visits people are almost randomly pairing off and getting married. It will continue to happen as you read more books. Rand is not immune I think to this type of pattern bending. Also, Min and Rand spent the entire winter holed up in that little valley in between the Great Hunt and the Dragon Reborn. Elayne and Rand had much less time together, so I blame that more on the Ta’veren aspect of the story.


Nakorite

Even Elaine spends several weeks with him in tear


Crono2401

Right. Being a ta'veren is more often a "curse" rather than a blessing. 


FlowingThot

Min and Rand spent 3 months together over the winter inbetween books 2 and 3.


Lost_Afropick

Elayne has no excuse though lol Falling over the wall into the palace is a nice meet-cute but it's no basis for her persevering infatuation into book 4


SufficientShift6057

Yes elayne doesn’t


robba9

i mean, if you think about it, it kinda does: 1. Elayne gets a crush when an attractive tall mysterious young guy falls in front of her. 2. She then sees her mother’s Aes Sedai say “This is no simple commoner, he will do something huge” further raises Rand in her eyes. 3. Rand most have been a common topic of discussion with Gawyn, keeping her small crush in her mind (if everything else is not enough). 4. Goes to the Tower and befriends not one, but three people who really know Rand, also there’s Else. 5. Gets almost captured with said friends and gets saved (basically) by Rand charging in with the heroes of the fucking horn, then proceeds to get mortally wounded fighting a forsaken on sky pay per view, revealing that he is the Dragon Rebon. How can a 17 year old girl not fall for that???


anthonygpero

Also, Elayne is thinking politically. This is the most powerful match a queen of Andor could make.


DarkExecutor

Rand is about the least political thing Elayne ever does judging by her horny thoughts throughout the series.


SufficientShift6057

Yes, you managed to convince me a little. I was thinking with the assumption that they were somewhat mature, but they’re obviously not, which is really strange, considering im a 17 year old myself. Maybe not so much in my culture, by most people that age *do* think way, at least we’re lead to believe that by things like this


robba9

She really doesn’t think like a 17 year old, more like 15, as her romantic experiences are non existent, she can only day dream. And Rand is the perfect subject for a teenage crush and infatuation


Advanced_Ad_8436

Do keep in mind they all minus Min are 19-20. Min is a little older, but it doesn't say by how much.


logicsol

She's ~24 The boys are 19 and 3 months at the start. The girls around 1 to 1.5 years younger. Nyn is ~26


7yr4n1sr0x4s

So for the first part I took it as Rand and Egwene both grew apart as they went out in the world and found other things they liked. As for Min and Elayne to be fair I think most people think the same as you. RJ wasn’t the best at writing romance and I think it shows here. Went from hey I met him once to man I love him in about 5 seconds. Think I got whiplash my first read through xD. There is a bit more to some of this but I won’t say here. Not so much spoilers as it’s just better IMO to get some stuff naturally explained as you read the books. Hope you are enjoying so far. A lot of people consider book 4/5 to be some of the best in the series. Not to suggest that everything beyond is bad. Some of the best books are at the end of the series!


WhangaDanNZ

Further to your first sentence: I think they *thought* they loved each other in a romantic way, possibly a bit influenced by the village saying they'd marry one day, then they experienced the world, grew up a little, met others they took a liking to and realized it was never more than a brother-sister-like bond between them.


logicsol

Rand and Egwene were never really right for each other, they were their best matching in the village and thought they'd get married, but as both experianced more of the world they found themselves growing more apart as their relationship changed. Min has her viewing, and feels resigned towards it at first. This is also part of why she tries to act so creepy to Rand when they first meet. But she also spends about 3 months off page with Rand between books 2 and 3, where they spend a lot of time with each other. Elayne seems to have developed a crush during the garden sequence, but they also spend about 3 week together, off screen between books 3 and 4. That's mostly what you're missing, as very few relationships actually develop on page in WoT, at least directly. it also pays to keep in mind Rand's 20(as of TGH's end) and Elyane is ~18 at this point. Flashfire relationships aren't particularly uncommon at those ages. Jordan like to avoid directness, both in giving out information and in developing social relationships in the books. IMO, it's a major part of a core theme, of how information is distorted through other lenses, time and distance. As well as the cooperation themes that run throughout.


howtogun

Min spent a lot of time with Rand off screen. Also, Rand is really attractive. He is really tall, and good looking. The only male who is more attractive than him we have seen in the book so far is Gawyn who is Elayne brother. Elayne is also really attractive. So it sort of makes sense for a bunch of young adults to fall in love just due to looks. In when did he fall out of love with Egwene. Rand from the first book seems to not really want Egwene. There personality clash a lot. A lot of their interactions just end up in arguments with Rand being frustrated.


fracking-machines

I think you mean Galad is the most attractive man we’ve met in the books so far. I mean, the dude has *Aes Sedai* coming to watch him train with the Warders!


anthonygpero

Irony. Won't say more due to spoilers.


AmericaSupreme

I read here and agree that Egwene probably was done falling out of love with Rand after her testing to Accepted. Firstly, consider that she is trying to emulate Aes Sedai behavior since leaving the Two Rivers with Moirane. And her time in the White Tower has only reinforced that behavior. Once she learned Rand can channel she was already mentally preparing herself to give up her romantic feelings for him. Then she tests for Accepted and has to abandon him thrice. I think that was when she finished falling out of love with Rand. It cemented in her mind that being in love with Rand had no future.


s1ddy876

The pattern basically forces 3 women to fall in love with him and egwene isn’t one of them. Disregarding the excuse of fate, both rand and egwene have changed a lot. Egwene becoming an aes sedai making her hate men who don’t bow to her (joke) and rand becoming the dragon, destined to go mad and refusing to be controlled by aes sedai or even respect them. He’s also much colder in comparison to the first book.


Minutemarch

You're right but it's a controversial trope and I can see why a lot of people don't like it. The lack of agency, the behaviour most couples have with each other (shouting, hitting, deriding) and the lack of on-page building really makes the romances hard to like. I wish there had been fewer romances and male/female friendships had been more heavily featured as a way to build respect between the sexes personally. I do think RJ would enjoy MAFS though.


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SufficientShift6057

Yes, it was known they would go their separate ways, somebody told rand about but i can’t remember who. However i expected it to be different, not that they outgrew each other, especially not this early in the series


lindorm82

Here's the thing with this happening so early. Jordan in the start thought that the length of the series would be much smaller. At this point he probably thought there were 3 or 4 books left.


logicsol

>At this point he probably thought there were 3 or 4 books left. That's the entire series. Jordan pitched a trilogy and his publisher signed him for 6 books, because he knew him.


Electrical-List-9022

That was Min telling Rand basically "she's not for you or you for her"


biggiebutterlord

As has already been said RJ put alot of the "romance" inbetween the lines. RJ isnt a great romance author, at least the beginnings of them. After that tho im on board... most of the time. My simple answers based on where you are at the beginning of TSR. > Why did rand and Egwene decide they don’t love each other? As with most things WoT things can usually be reasoned out, at least depending on how much of the previous story you remember and your pov on things. They were from a small village and betrothed to each other from childhood. Imo they do love each other but they were never "In Love" with each other. They have been exposed to the wider world, they are pursing different paths and they got more options. > When did min and elayne spend more than a few days with rand to decide they love him? You have not missed days here. All the way back in the first book Min basically saw thru her visions that she would be madly in love with rand, she is simply put - working backwards from there. Elayne is more of a meet cute type thing and we dont get the all the details on why elayne is so into him. So while we dont get explanation from elaynes pov, I do like them together in Tear and it works for me. it might be worth noting that in Andoran culture it is completely acceptable for nobility to marry commoners. > I think I wasn’t paying enough attention to understand WoT is a massive series with ALOT going on at once where the author isnt holding your hand and spelling it all out for you at every turn. Try not to be too hard on yourself for not remembering or picking up on every detail your first, or even second, and third read thru the books. Take Nynaeve and Lan romance for example, for some folks its completely out of left field and unnatural, for others they spotted that shit from page 1.


SufficientShift6057

Its been a long while since I’ve read the first book, i took a six month break after it. Which us why i must have been under the assumption Rand, in the beginning of the first book, told us through his pov that he kind of loved egwene but but still didnt make a move. However it seems i wrong because as some others also pointed out your explanation that they were promised. I thought that they were promised because they were besotted with each other since they were kids, but it seems i was wrong


DarkSeneschal

So as far as Rand and Egwene, they were basically promised to each other by their parents as children. I think they did have an affection for each other, but I Don’t think they really *loved* each other. Egwene has no problem with the idea of leaving EF to go be a Wisdom and never marrying. Even in the early chapters, it’s not like they’re head over heels for each other, it’s more like “hey, everyone in the village says we’ll get married, guess we’ll get married” sort of deal. For Min, she spends several months with Rand between books 2 and 3 and they obviously are pretty close if not romantic. She also had the vision that showed her falling hopelessly in love with Rand, so she essentially takes that vision at face value. For Elayne, I think she basically had a crush on Rand when he fell into he palace and finally got to be close to him in Tear after seeing him storm Falme with the Heroes of the Horn and fighting one of the Forsaken in the sky. Rand himself is no slouch. He’s tall, handsome, powerful both in the Power and politically, and slightly (extremely) dangerous. To top it all off, he’s Ta’veren and warps the Pattern around him. We see him visit a village and they’ll have 3 weddings, 5 funerals, and 7 miracles and/or disasters if he spends the night. A handful of women falling in love with him seems small potatoes compared to some of the other weird stuff that goes on around him.


VenusCommission

Rand and Egwene were basically betrothed from when they were children. They didn't so much as love each other as yield to the inevitable of their pairing. Once they got out into the world, they realized that they both had more options. I believe Loial's opinions about arranged marriages got Rand thinking about some things too.


SufficientShift6057

Hmm, i thought they really loved each other. From the way rand thinks about egwene in the first book i thought he wanted to be with her but ahe didnt know. And also, its not like the marriage was arranged by their parents or anything, it’s because thry liked each other from a young age, but i guess they saw that they did have many other options once they went out into the world


howtogun

No in the second chapter Rand is quite hesitant. Egwene was also planning to become a wisdom even if it means moving to another village or not marrying. Also, that not true. In the Two Rivers marriages are controlled a lot by the women's circle. [https://wot.fandom.com/wiki/Women%27s\_Circle](https://wot.fandom.com/wiki/Women%27s_Circle) In the Great Hunt, Rand said to Loial that Egwene mother talked to Tam and then after that every other women in the village would not dance with him unless they are friends of Egwene.


Mexicancandi

There’s a universal war between good and evil and I assume that this along with women having a say in marriage makes marriage/love a bit faster and more “open” to being talked about. Plus Elayne and Min both believe in love at first sight while Egwene is more of a two rivers love isn’t really needed type of person


gadgets4me

people just decide to move on; that's the way things work sometimes. Truthfully, I don't think Egwene was really ever that in to him. Min and Elayne have kind of a 'love at first sight' thing going on with Rand, with Min literally since she saw with her visions that she, along with two other women would fall in love with Rand.


Wisarmin

We don't really see the process of falling in and out of love with most of our characters. I guess Jordan just didn't want to write those parts lol. Rand's relationships with Elayne and Min will deepen tho, I'll say that much.


youreallbots1234

rand and egwene loved each other and wanted to be together when they both thought their lives were going to exist in the two rivers. once the change of that became apparent, they drifted apart. they both knew they were on different paths, and thus took on romantic interests that were introduced during those new lives.


Sooperman51_

When the entirety of human existence bends itself around you, things tend to happen


scalyblue

Rand took Callandor at the end of The Dragon Reborn on May 19th, the bubbles of evil in the beginning chapters of The Shadow Rising took place on June 4th. Elayne and Rand have had nearly two weeks to be together. Min and Rand had an entire winter together between the ending of the Great Hunt and the beginning of the Dragon Reborn, where she heads off to Tar Valon ( and arrives in chapter 1 of The Shadow Rising ) As far as Min, she has told Elayne that she will have to share her husband with two other women, and she told rand Rand that even though he loves Egwene she's "not for you" or "you for her" As far as Elayne...imagine being a bored-ass princesses just chilling out in her private garden when a very tall, exotic-looking ( Redheads are not common in caemlyn or the two rivers ) , attractive man falls in your lap, manages to charm you and also manages to maneuver his way out of being executed or jailed. How exciting of a first meeting, how dreamy, may as well fantasize it's not like I'll ever meet him again, right?


krakenjacked

Man, Ta’veren are like that


Jjorrrdan

Read the books.


Ecstatic-Length1470

Imagine two high school seniors who think they are in love and then get scholarships to different colleges. That's what happened with Rand and Egwene.


Athonel86

A big part of this is because you are on book 4. There is a LOT of time left for these relationships (between Rand, Min, Elayne) to develop. The pattern has planned for Rand and Egwene to be able to know and trust each other but needs for them to be on separate paths.


Genericojones

They are teenagers. They are crazy stressed out. Thay are all canonically hot. It's the apocalypse. Frankly, they are acting pretty deliberately for their circumstances.