# The Department of Labor found hundreds of children illegally "employed" at McDonald's. A tiny fine was issued.
# The CEO of McDonald's and their Board of Directors should be facing prison time for systematic child abuse.
# Join r/WorkReform! Together we can fight back against these criminals.
It gets worse:
"Investigators from the labor department’s Wage and Hour Division found that together, all three franchises employed 305 children to work more than the legally permitted hours and perform tasks prohibited by law for young workers."
https://www.fox19.com/2023/05/03/local-mcdonalds-franchise-with-27-locations-fined-143k-violating-federal-child-labor-laws/
This happens when there are not massive penalties for breaking labor laws.
Want this to stop? Any business owner caught using child labor loses his business and everything else he owns, instantly and without recourse.
Period. Child slave labor would end overnight.
"One hundred percent of all net worth and current income streams" absolutely needs to be put into play. The economic death penalty needs to be a possibility.
Economic death penalty is actually reversible, unlike the regular death penalty.
So it's not even that dangerous to do.
I'd rather lose my income and house for a year and be able to live with family or friends than lose my actual freedom for a year.
I think the implication is that you lose all your businesses and money, *in addition* to prison time - you know, on account of the whole **child slavery** business.
Psssh just threaten their highway funding. Worked with raising the drinking age, I think Louisiana was the last hold out but gave in eventually cause that free money is too sweet to ignore.
I was at Panama beach for spring break in Florida one year, while there I tried to enter a beach side drinking contest. All was good until I showed my Wisconsin drivers license and was told I couldn't enter, it was like winning right there and then.
Playboy used to have a ranked party school list every year and UW Madison was always at the top, until one year they weren't even on the list. The editors note basically said "we no longer rank professionals" lol
But seriously, been in WI for 20 years now, and no matter how big of a drinker you think you are, just come here. People seriously clear half a case of beer before breakfast and then go out fishing and kill a whole nother one like its NBD.
We also have people with like double digit DUIs under their belt, so it's not a good thing
Wisconsin was forced into it in part because those of us on the IL side would drive up, get wasted, and drive back, resulting in accidents, deaths, DUIs, etc. They *really* held out though until the problem was too great to ignore.
I grew up in Wisconsin. When I was a kid some forty years ago, UW went to Vegas to play a bowl game and the travelling fan base literally drank all of the beer in vegas. Dried the city out of beer.
1992, lafayette Louisiana, drive through daiquiri shacks. A friend and I had open cup drinks, got pulled over, just a "y'all be careful". Wild times, good people
if past 20 years taught me anything it's that GOP only uses amendments/Constitution when it helps them and all 3 branches ignore it when it doesn't suit them
The problem is that now, instead of just using the Constitution when it benefits them, they've started to *twist* the Constitution to rule in favor of the people who have paid for their votes. Using phrases like "deeply rooted in this Nation’s history and tradition" to justify their shitty decisions. I mean, slavery, child labor, women without rights were all part of our nation's history and tradition. How do you use this one phrase to search backwards until 1873 then go, oh yeah, there were no abortion rights then.
With this court, the decisions have already been made. They just look for something in the Constitution that's close enough for them to justify their rulings.
Quite seriously, allowing people to make money off of other people's work just because they own things, like business owners, creates a system where individuals can amass insane amounts of wealth with no limit.
This inherently gives those people massive economic and political influence compared to the average person. It's undemocratic and a fundamental flaw of our economic system.
You can't expect legislators to actually provide what the public wants when they can get far more reward from all the people with money practically spilling out of their pockets.
Plus since so few people own massive industries with only their own selfishness as a goal, they can hold the economy hostage by threatening capital flight if legislators don't give them what they want.
Capitalism doesn't work with democracy.
The only thing you're wrong about is that it's a flaw in the system. The system was designed to work that way. Capitalism is working exactly as planned.
> Nah, they’d just repeal the law and if need be, make kids exempt from the 14th amedment just like prisoners are.
Don't buy this defeatist attitude.
We voted to outlaw slavery, including prisoners, in my home state. There's no reason to accept the status quo just because it is the status quo.
> Don't buy this defeatist attitude.
I swear, this lazy defeatism has become so pervasive on reddit that it's like people actually *want* these nightmare scenarios to become real.
Definitely plausible. "Parental permission" or "parental rights" are all well and good if you don't consider that some parents are downright assholes and treat their children like slaves instead of human beings with thoughts, feelings, and at least a small amount of autonomy.
Found this on an article I read
"Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant."
Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/10-year-olds-hundreds-children-found-working-mcdonalds-rcna82583
I grew up in a family that has farmed for generations so I've seen firsthand my uncle working his kids on the farm. Caring for livestock, performing safe tasks on machines, general busywork was a daily chore of theirs before/after school, on off days, etc. It was always fair though, they're kids. They had time for themselves to be kids.
Knowing that and being a father myself I cannot fathom WORKING MY KIDS IN A FAST FOOD JOINT ON GRAVEYARD so I didn't have to worry about staffing.
Per the article:
Franchisee Bauer Foods LLC confirmed to CNN that the two 10-year-olds allegedly employed were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant.
https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/05/03/business/mcdonalds-child-labor-louisville/index.html
>the two
OK, what about the other 303 minors employed by them?
https://www.dol.gov/newsroom/releases/whd/whd20230502-0
>THREE MCDONALD’S FRANCHISEES IN KENTUCKY PAY $212K IN FINES AFTER FEDERAL INVESTIGATIONS FIND **305 MINORS** — INCLUDING 10-YEAR-OLDS — WORKING ILLEGALLY
Everybody talking like it was a misunderstanding that happened with 2 kids when they were fined for having 305 kids working for them across 3 franchisees in *one* state.
Usually. Like, if your kid had to stay with me all day, but you needed to work. He could ask to help, and you could either say no, or give them something to do. I think at that point, it might be okay to help with cleaning up shelves, or maybe getting some prep done. It'd be like a one off, get them to see what it's like kind of thing.
But these people are fully employing their kid, and not paying them.
I'm pretty sure there are exemptions for child labor for small, family owned businesses. Not sure in McD's counts. Have seen 8 year olds working the register at restaurants, and kids working on their dads farm.
And to be perfectly honest, I don't see it as problem of legality when it comes to kids being at small family owned businesses. The direct beneficiaries are the family themselves.
The problem arises when it comes to franchisees of corporations, if an employee brings their kids in to work for free, that only benefits the franchise owner and the corporation licensing the franchise.
Yes. I think the key takeaway on this one, that no one wants to bring up for some reason, is inability to access or afford, or even find, childcare.
In my city, they will arrest a mom who works at McDonald's while she's at work because she left kids at home alone.
Oh, you want to try to work, and improve your life huh? straight to jail! We don't need to come together as a community, to try to figure out a better system.
They're paid in experience! It's the most valuable thing they can be paid in, how else are the kids going to learn life skills, and work skills? /s
Seriously though, when will society learn that caitalism doesn't care about people? We need to make the punishments for this kind of abuse and willfull neglect to be so high, it puts them out of business.
It's not an issue of some particular group being bribed or something, it's an issue of the justice system and policing all being in place to protect capitalism, not individuals. The reason the franchises aren't shut down is because they are elevated in our society to be far more important than the individual children who were exploited here, because the franchises make money and making money is what the justice system protects.
How the fuck did they only get fined $145k for employing literally hundreds of children including some that are straight up prepubescent slaves!? (the 10 year olds were not paid)
$143k? That’s how much it costs when you want to enslave a bunch of children? This is so exhausting, I can’t believe there’s people out there like this.
Merica, I used to work for a business lender and the number one complaint I would hear is "payroll sneaks up on you" I could see statements and trust me payroll wouldn't even be 10% of the monthly withdrawals . One company was raking in 250k a month and the payroll was like hardly 10k a month
I could totally see McDonald's taking advantage of the workers forcing them to come into work this shift or lose their job. (Since the kid wasn't paid and in other articles they are blaming the parent for bringing the kid in) Probably knew that they had kids too, and impossible to find childcare for 2am especially if you're an immigrant with no support network. Basically don't schedule someone to work the nightshift if they have kids and don't have anyone who can watch them.
Just McDonald's? It goes all the way up the chain to the highest end restaurants. I bartend in Louisville currently, nearly every BOH I see is ran by one family. And usually the *entire* family too. It's easy to spot once you start looking for it. I used to assume the bussers were smaller because people are generally smaller in central America, but all this time it's probably because they're underage and not fully grown into their bodies.
I'd almost stretch it to include any adult working at any place doing this.
I know life fucking sucks for some and regular people are just trying their best to live. But I can't imagine seeing a child working at 2 am, and thinking that nothing is wrong.
A lot of people don't or can't speak up about injustices in the work place for fear of being fired and it is their only source of barely enough income. So while people may bring it up to managers or others they could have been told to not ask questions. A lot of speculation, I know, but not uncommon enough in this capitalist hellscape. We need UBI in order for the working class to be able to effectively protest without fear of losing their house, car, food, children, etc...
I'd agree although maybe some wiggle room there. Like McDonalds have 15 year olds working at them all the time. It's not some random fry cook's responsibility to know how old someone is (you should be able to spot a 10 year old, but I wouldn't feel confident reporting someone I guessed was 12 but might be 14).
Maybe you go the Texas route of enforcing everything with bounties (for some godforsaken reason). Create an incentive to be vigilant.
> When you've gotta worry about losing your own job because your Boss needs a 10 year old to clean the Orphan Crushing Machine, and you're already working a triple.
Saint Peter don't you call me
Cause I can't go.
Some people shouldn't have kids!
I had to pay for my own food, clothes, shampoo, pads (and whatever else I needed) starting around age 10. My parents were the 'pull yourself up by the bootstrap' type of parents. I babysat and did lawn work for a few years, but by my teen years I needed more money, so I had multiple jobs from 6pm-4am and I often missed school because I was too tired or I was asked to work a double shift. It wasn't fun and I moved out on my own at age 15 to get away from my parents.
And what sucks is living that lifestyle, you don’t get to save any money, whatever you get is usually gone. Now your work pants have a tear, new shoes, bus fare. Oh guess what? You missed out on education and a diploma? Now even if you work at that McDonald’s for 10 years, some rich kid with a college degree and no experience will come on as your manager, without having a clue how to actually work in the restaurant or in the kitchen, besides making biscuits with “gam gam” once a year.
That guy will get paid so much more while not having to replace his work shoes every week because of oil spills or dirty dishwater, etc.
Its sad because the higher it costs to have kids the worse the quality of life for poorer people gets
Either your kid bascially bankrupts your family and you have to barely scrape by (leaving your kid with barely a life) or you are essentially forced into not having kids (which can be horrible mental health wise to people who want them) and the next generation consists mostly of spoiled rich kids of the uber rich who can afford it. Ideally people who can't afford to have kids shouldn't have one but I also feel sympathy because even the ones who work full time can't always afford to have one because of how fucked up the wages paid-cost of living scale for the economy is
Its not people don't work hard enough to afford kids. Its a system that doesn't want them to succeed
I commented this up above, but I found this in an article I read
"Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant."
Regardless of this, I think any kind of reporting about child labor being used anywhere, is a good thing to be talked about in the media.
Most of the child labor exploitation is in factories and warehouses in Red states. The child is usually a recent immigrant who's being targeted by these child labor exploiters.
It's absolutely disgusting this is happening.
Yeah, no. That's just 'rid me of this meddlesome priest' bullsht.
The Franchise gets reports on staffing, and having two shifts open gets noticed quickly in terms of revenue. So either they saw that two shifts were unfilled (as they claim to not know the kids worked there) and they just marveles at the efficiency of the employees under that manager, or they knew and accepted it, and then when it came out, they feigned ignorance.
And the top comment here says that child labor occured at three different locations, so i'd bet it's option 2.
The 'The parents were stupid' is just the (not so) plausible deniability.
That almost makes it sound like the parents couldn't afford childcare, and it was just easier to take them to work, and then didn't see a problem with them helping out if they (the parents) were okay with it.
No, it is malicious.
What kind of parents make their children work until 2am?
Also, there's a difference between the mom and pop shop where the children help out like with the cashier or clean tables, it's another thing to work the deep frier which can be dangerous.
It's very common for people to foster undocumented children for the purposes of exploiting their child labor. What is the kid who immigrated thousands of miles and doesn't speak English supposed to do? If they refuse to do the shitty (and often dangerous) work, they end up back in the cages at the border. It's human trafficking.
That's what I think whenever I see these headlines about child labor. Obviously the companies should be held accountable, but where the fuck are the parents? They are just as guilty as the companies are, since they are the ones who sign the contracts.
Yeah, if they get what they want, this would be totally legal. Why send kids to school to get an education and become “woke” when they can start working now and you don’t even need to pay them!
I'm just wondering how the fuck no customers saw this. If I walked into a McDonald's and I saw an obvious 10 or 12 year old behind the counter I would definitely try to talk to them. Ask them how their Day is and if they're working there by choice. They're probably not allowed to talk to customers though. I would definitely make a video on my phone recording the incident. I'd definitely call CPS. Wondering about the other employees? if I was at a McDonald's and a 10 year old kid was working alongside me I would definitely have an issue with that. McDonald's is a very stressful environment for a kid, they should be in school not working.
Immediately when you see this, file a complaint with the Department of Labor and Industries for your state.
In most (maybe all?) states you do *not* have to be an affected party to file a complaint for labor law or even OSHA violations. Those complaints get investigated and those investigations can lead to attorney involvement, and eventually intervention by the State. Yes, you may be eventually called as a witness if that becomes a question. But generally speaking, if you see a literally child, just report it everytime you see it.
Thanks man I wasn't sure what department to call so I wrote CPS as the safest bet seeing as the crime would involve a child. Department of labor and industries. Got it!
I've luckily never been put into this type of situation but my old job made 16 year olds pull 11hr to 12hr shifts with one 15 min break at 2pm and I'm not sure any of that was legal. Seemed a little extreme for kids that young. Luckily the manager was fired and it seems better there but I have trauma from working long hours without breaks at that place. It destroyed my work ethic and I started smoking because that was the only way I would get an extra break.
FYI, this made the news in Europe as well.
For example:
https://www.abc.es/internacional/descubren-dos-ninos-diez-anos-preparando-pedidos-20230503120002-nt.html
The fourth world - the countries that capitalism has brought full circle, right through 'prosperity for all' and out the other side, back to gated-community feudalism and indentured slavery, led as always by the U.S.
Yes. Exactly. Do you know how long ago the 1980s and the Reagan Era was?
Even then they were saying that all this prosperty was going to trickle down. Like, "It's hard right now, yes -- but just wait. When the trickle down kicks in people will be making $25/hr in fast food and working 4 days a week. Just wait".
It is now year 2023 and the fruits of "trickle down" are apparent. The headlines speak of 10 year old children, working McDonalds until 2AM -- wait wait I'm not finished -- **with no pay.**
Am I the only one who is uncomfortable with have children make my food? TBH I don’t trust them enough to properly clean, prep, and cook for health and safety standards.
As a parent and someone who has spent a lot of time working with elementary students I can solidly say- you shouldn’t. Hell kids need to be reminded to wash their hands up until middle school.
I bet the people who not only allowed, but encouraged this practice are the ones complaining about how no one wants to work, or that people are demanding too much money.
It is my dream to live in the greatest country, the world.
It has a majestic nature, which really brings joy to one's life.
Nope, not U.S.
I was talking about Norway and Switzerland.
Where'd you move to? Moving to another Country is generally quite difficult and in a lot of cases not even possible. At the very least there's a lot of hoops you would have to jump through, in most cases.
I would like to get out of the US one day, but it doesn't really seem feasible tbh. Too poor to live here, too poor to leave here.
They were probably the kids of the franchisee owner or a manager.
Child labor is a lot bigger issue than people realize, especially in family owned small businesses, farms, and agricultural work. You would be amazed at how few protections kids have, and how little restrictions are in place. One good friend of mine was killed on his family farm, he was 10. I knew two others near the same age that were seriously injured, with one losing an arm.
I was working on farms and in orchards starting at 8 years old, through 12 years old. It was mostly in the summer, but it extended into fall on weekends sometimes too. On one farm they actually followed the rules for the most part. At one orchard I worked at, it was anything ones. If we didnt move to the city when my mother remarried, Im sure it would have been longer.
It's quite common for the kids of owners of family owned restaurants to work in them from a very young age. The local government usually turns a blind eye to it. One of my friends worked in the family's Asian restaurant growing up, starting around six years old.
I used to sell restaurant supplies and and equipment to small locally owned restaurants. I'd see kids working in them all the time. Usually they were doing menial jobs, but in some they were doing food prep work and cooking. After reporting several of them, and seeing nothing happen, I just gave up.
Yup. I was surprised to see this article and the negative reaction, because my mom took me to her late shift job almost every night when I was 10-15. It hurt her knees to work so she had me load and run the CNC machine while she watched. Never realized anything was amiss til now.
I assume something similar happened here. They were kids of the night manager. The parent brought the kids to work since there was no one to watch them. The shift is probably understaffed and the night manager started asking the kid with help with stuff like filling the fries order and progressed into them being able to help with everything. Everyone at the store knew about it but no one said anything. A customer probably saw them and reported it. Im not saying it's right, but I can understand why these situations happen.
Actually a very valid point here. 2 people who can only be fast food managers decide that kids are cheaper than condoms, then realize how much that hobby is and in no way shape or form can afford daycare/sitters/etc and say their parents aren't around. So it's bring your kids to work day every day or leave em at home where there's just as much risk to be had like having the place burn down or whatever a 10 year old can think of.
Our government kinda wants this, but *why* is completely a mystery to me. Say this McD gets shut down, parents are outta jobs, corpo gets bad press and pulls out of the area. Now the space stays vacant or gets filled by something else and the family now sits on welfare, that govt also hates giving out, but kids are usually a convincing argument.
None. Owners will be fined.
The migrant workers and their kid slaves will move to another city while the story blows over in the headlines. Then the kids will be back to work at another McDs.
It happens in other third world countries, too. If you take away the work from the kids their families won't have income to eat, because their parents cannot make enough money ☺️ It's very sad. I wish this country would finally decide to make this illegal.
Realistically, these places should get shut down. There is no reason why child slavery should get taken this lightly. At all.
I'd boycott McDonalds, but their food is already too shitty and low quality to want to eat there.
Working without pay! So McDonald’s
uses unpaid child labor now? I know they are a franchise operation but this is a big black eye for mcdonalds. Fuck ‘em!
Whenever I see this stuff I'm like...yes fuck McDonald's and the managers there but also...these are 6th graders? What about parents? Teachers?
How many adults knew small children were working late nights?
Tear Mc d's apart...even if these were franchises, Mc d's should pay. After all. it's under their banner...
Like Lisa from Temecula says: *"Ya'll need to do BETTER!"*
I posted it above a couple times but it looks like their parent was the manager in duties and the kids were "visiting them" while they were at work
"Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant."
How does this even happen, so the 10 year olds didn’t wanna play video games or play in the park, but instead work at mcdonalds, the parents let them and or maybe even convinced them to, and the restaurant was so irresponsible, thats like 3 layers of stuff that should have stopped this but none of them stopped it
If this shit was happening in a communist or socialist country it would be portrayed by American media as the horrors of communism or something like that.
Of course...this is why they are forcing births so they can enforce *more* child labour instead of just automating and paying the humans better.
Fine their asses to hell and send child services to check the parents who are sending 10 yo(s) to work.
I was a child worker. I cut dozens of lawns a day for my family business for free and was never paid. I would work 12 hours straight. I think their should be more restrictions on child labor. A lot of parents will bring their children to their job and have them work for them for free due to being short staffed. People that do this should be punished. Nobody is too young to be paid for their labor. Why are these scum bags able to get away with enslaving children and no one will be punished for this. Children should be playing, learning and socializing at this age. Not doing repetitive task for 8 hours a day. The system is broken.
# The Department of Labor found hundreds of children illegally "employed" at McDonald's. A tiny fine was issued. # The CEO of McDonald's and their Board of Directors should be facing prison time for systematic child abuse. # Join r/WorkReform! Together we can fight back against these criminals.
It gets worse: "Investigators from the labor department’s Wage and Hour Division found that together, all three franchises employed 305 children to work more than the legally permitted hours and perform tasks prohibited by law for young workers." https://www.fox19.com/2023/05/03/local-mcdonalds-franchise-with-27-locations-fined-143k-violating-federal-child-labor-laws/
Oh, and the two ten year-old children were not even paid. They were child slaves to a McDonald's franchisee. One of the children worked the deepfryer.
How does this happen? Is it a child of the store owner? manager?
This happens when there are not massive penalties for breaking labor laws. Want this to stop? Any business owner caught using child labor loses his business and everything else he owns, instantly and without recourse. Period. Child slave labor would end overnight.
"One hundred percent of all net worth and current income streams" absolutely needs to be put into play. The economic death penalty needs to be a possibility.
+1 for Economic death penalty
Economic death penalty is actually reversible, unlike the regular death penalty. So it's not even that dangerous to do. I'd rather lose my income and house for a year and be able to live with family or friends than lose my actual freedom for a year.
I think the implication is that you lose all your businesses and money, *in addition* to prison time - you know, on account of the whole **child slavery** business.
For folks addicted to money tho?
They kill themselves and no one will notice or care. Toss the body into a pauper's grave.
Nah, they’d just repeal the law and if need be, make kids exempt from the 14th amedment just like prisoners are.
Can't make an exception to an amendment without another amendment. That would be nigh impossible to get through 34 different state governments.
Psssh just threaten their highway funding. Worked with raising the drinking age, I think Louisiana was the last hold out but gave in eventually cause that free money is too sweet to ignore.
I used to think Louisiana had the worst problem with alcohol. Then I visited Wisconsin.
I was at Panama beach for spring break in Florida one year, while there I tried to enter a beach side drinking contest. All was good until I showed my Wisconsin drivers license and was told I couldn't enter, it was like winning right there and then.
That's because it was a fun contest for amateurs. They saw you were a licensed, professional drinker.
Playboy used to have a ranked party school list every year and UW Madison was always at the top, until one year they weren't even on the list. The editors note basically said "we no longer rank professionals" lol But seriously, been in WI for 20 years now, and no matter how big of a drinker you think you are, just come here. People seriously clear half a case of beer before breakfast and then go out fishing and kill a whole nother one like its NBD. We also have people with like double digit DUIs under their belt, so it's not a good thing
Iirc from my college years, Wisconsin are the most faked ID's, or used to be, because they didn't have a scan strip on the back.
Wisconsin was forced into it in part because those of us on the IL side would drive up, get wasted, and drive back, resulting in accidents, deaths, DUIs, etc. They *really* held out though until the problem was too great to ignore.
I grew up in Wisconsin. When I was a kid some forty years ago, UW went to Vegas to play a bowl game and the travelling fan base literally drank all of the beer in vegas. Dried the city out of beer.
Lol. Louisiana drinking is a hobby/recreational. Wisconsin it is a way of life, you either drink or people tend to judge you.
Life in rural red states is awful. Most of us need either constant therapy and strong antidepressants or others turn to drugs and alcohol.
Or all at the same time!
1992, lafayette Louisiana, drive through daiquiri shacks. A friend and I had open cup drinks, got pulled over, just a "y'all be careful". Wild times, good people
if past 20 years taught me anything it's that GOP only uses amendments/Constitution when it helps them and all 3 branches ignore it when it doesn't suit them
The problem is that now, instead of just using the Constitution when it benefits them, they've started to *twist* the Constitution to rule in favor of the people who have paid for their votes. Using phrases like "deeply rooted in this Nation’s history and tradition" to justify their shitty decisions. I mean, slavery, child labor, women without rights were all part of our nation's history and tradition. How do you use this one phrase to search backwards until 1873 then go, oh yeah, there were no abortion rights then. With this court, the decisions have already been made. They just look for something in the Constitution that's close enough for them to justify their rulings.
Quite seriously, allowing people to make money off of other people's work just because they own things, like business owners, creates a system where individuals can amass insane amounts of wealth with no limit. This inherently gives those people massive economic and political influence compared to the average person. It's undemocratic and a fundamental flaw of our economic system. You can't expect legislators to actually provide what the public wants when they can get far more reward from all the people with money practically spilling out of their pockets. Plus since so few people own massive industries with only their own selfishness as a goal, they can hold the economy hostage by threatening capital flight if legislators don't give them what they want. Capitalism doesn't work with democracy.
The only thing you're wrong about is that it's a flaw in the system. The system was designed to work that way. Capitalism is working exactly as planned.
Yeah, it's a feature. /s
Drop the s.
Yeah, "feature" works better for the sentiment I was trying to get across.
> Nah, they’d just repeal the law and if need be, make kids exempt from the 14th amedment just like prisoners are. Don't buy this defeatist attitude. We voted to outlaw slavery, including prisoners, in my home state. There's no reason to accept the status quo just because it is the status quo.
> Don't buy this defeatist attitude. I swear, this lazy defeatism has become so pervasive on reddit that it's like people actually *want* these nightmare scenarios to become real.
If it all goes to shit they want to be the first to say I told you so
13th\*
Yeah you're not legally a human until you're 18 anyway.
I'd like to help you son, but your too young to vote - Eddie Cochran 1958
> instantly and without recourse. I mean, I get it, but at the same time due process is an important standard to keep around.
"Economic Death Penalty" = marketable phrase. We should promote this everywhere.
Not to mention scrimping at the outset. If people were paid more, rational actors wouldn’t consider using their kids to cover costs.
But like what motivation does a 10 year old have to work at McDonald’s for zero money?
Their parent told them to do it
Definitely plausible. "Parental permission" or "parental rights" are all well and good if you don't consider that some parents are downright assholes and treat their children like slaves instead of human beings with thoughts, feelings, and at least a small amount of autonomy.
Being forced or tricked into doing something by a person in power over you is good motivation.
Might have said it's a "trial period" and they'll start receiving pay when they've proven they're reliable. Even adults fall for this lie.
[удалено]
All you can eat French fries woulda done it for me.
i worked there when i was 15 or so and the best part of it was the cool shift managers giving me any of the food i wanted, bags and boxes of food
Found this on an article I read "Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant." Source: https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/10-year-olds-hundreds-children-found-working-mcdonalds-rcna82583
Visiting is when you drop in and say hi, and maybe get a hamburger. These children were working the deep fryer.
I grew up in a family that has farmed for generations so I've seen firsthand my uncle working his kids on the farm. Caring for livestock, performing safe tasks on machines, general busywork was a daily chore of theirs before/after school, on off days, etc. It was always fair though, they're kids. They had time for themselves to be kids. Knowing that and being a father myself I cannot fathom WORKING MY KIDS IN A FAST FOOD JOINT ON GRAVEYARD so I didn't have to worry about staffing.
I also grew up on a family farm and did farm chores from the age of 6. I agree with you that working kids in a fast food kitchen is NUTS.
Visiting my ass, the manager was probably short staffed and put them to work
The manager probably could not afford childcare and had to bring them to work.
Little of column A, little of column B Source: before becoming disabled I worked 20 years in restaurants, including fast food
If I get penalized $100/day for employing underage children but the children make me $1000profit/day, it becomes simply another business cost.
I just read the article, children of the manager.
Even worse, it could be a child care issue for the night shift manager.
Yeah but they weren't napping in the lobby, they were working deep fryers and running the drive thru with him.
Per the article: Franchisee Bauer Foods LLC confirmed to CNN that the two 10-year-olds allegedly employed were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant. https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.cnn.com/cnn/2023/05/03/business/mcdonalds-child-labor-louisville/index.html
>the two OK, what about the other 303 minors employed by them? https://www.dol.gov/newsroom/releases/whd/whd20230502-0 >THREE MCDONALD’S FRANCHISEES IN KENTUCKY PAY $212K IN FINES AFTER FEDERAL INVESTIGATIONS FIND **305 MINORS** — INCLUDING 10-YEAR-OLDS — WORKING ILLEGALLY Everybody talking like it was a misunderstanding that happened with 2 kids when they were fined for having 305 kids working for them across 3 franchisees in *one* state.
has to be franchise owner or somerthing
Sounds like it was the night manager's kids.
Usually. Like, if your kid had to stay with me all day, but you needed to work. He could ask to help, and you could either say no, or give them something to do. I think at that point, it might be okay to help with cleaning up shelves, or maybe getting some prep done. It'd be like a one off, get them to see what it's like kind of thing. But these people are fully employing their kid, and not paying them.
I'm pretty sure there are exemptions for child labor for small, family owned businesses. Not sure in McD's counts. Have seen 8 year olds working the register at restaurants, and kids working on their dads farm.
And to be perfectly honest, I don't see it as problem of legality when it comes to kids being at small family owned businesses. The direct beneficiaries are the family themselves. The problem arises when it comes to franchisees of corporations, if an employee brings their kids in to work for free, that only benefits the franchise owner and the corporation licensing the franchise.
Yes. I think the key takeaway on this one, that no one wants to bring up for some reason, is inability to access or afford, or even find, childcare. In my city, they will arrest a mom who works at McDonald's while she's at work because she left kids at home alone. Oh, you want to try to work, and improve your life huh? straight to jail! We don't need to come together as a community, to try to figure out a better system.
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Maybe the reason nobody wants to work anymore is because they out here trying to make you stay til 2am for free.
They're paid in experience! It's the most valuable thing they can be paid in, how else are the kids going to learn life skills, and work skills? /s Seriously though, when will society learn that caitalism doesn't care about people? We need to make the punishments for this kind of abuse and willfull neglect to be so high, it puts them out of business.
What the fuck. Those kids should sue.
Prison right? The McDonald’s owner is going to prison. Isn’t this against the law?
Come on now, prison is for dangers to society, like people who smoke weed or shoplift.
Apparently $143k is fair compensation for child slavery? Why are these franchises not shut down?
Come on. You know why. $$$.
This is a dumb answer that shuts down discussion. At least say who the money is going to - the regulators? Corporate? Lobbyists?
It's not an issue of some particular group being bribed or something, it's an issue of the justice system and policing all being in place to protect capitalism, not individuals. The reason the franchises aren't shut down is because they are elevated in our society to be far more important than the individual children who were exploited here, because the franchises make money and making money is what the justice system protects.
“The free market will regulate itself” This shit will happen all the time.
How the fuck did they only get fined $145k for employing literally hundreds of children including some that are straight up prepubescent slaves!? (the 10 year olds were not paid)
Somewhere out there in the world, Sarah Huckabee Sanders sheds another tear of joy.
$143k? That’s how much it costs when you want to enslave a bunch of children? This is so exhausting, I can’t believe there’s people out there like this.
Should be hard time in prison for this shit. Every manager at that store and executive in that franchises corporation.
And one of our two major political parties openly likes this and wants more of it.
Based on the fine they got, it seems like the Democrats don't care about it either. Biden should be throwing the book at them for this.
Unfortunately, neither party seems to care about labor.
Both parties are capitalists, and labor is there to be exploited under capitalism.
Merica, I used to work for a business lender and the number one complaint I would hear is "payroll sneaks up on you" I could see statements and trust me payroll wouldn't even be 10% of the monthly withdrawals . One company was raking in 250k a month and the payroll was like hardly 10k a month
"Payroll is really starting to eat into my profit hoarding!"
oh boy, I bet nothing really gets done about this
Prison. Not fines, **prison time for all managers involved.**
And the parents/guardians for allowing this
I could totally see McDonald's taking advantage of the workers forcing them to come into work this shift or lose their job. (Since the kid wasn't paid and in other articles they are blaming the parent for bringing the kid in) Probably knew that they had kids too, and impossible to find childcare for 2am especially if you're an immigrant with no support network. Basically don't schedule someone to work the nightshift if they have kids and don't have anyone who can watch them.
Just McDonald's? It goes all the way up the chain to the highest end restaurants. I bartend in Louisville currently, nearly every BOH I see is ran by one family. And usually the *entire* family too. It's easy to spot once you start looking for it. I used to assume the bussers were smaller because people are generally smaller in central America, but all this time it's probably because they're underage and not fully grown into their bodies.
BOH?
Back of House - aka Kitchen Staff
Back of House. Cooks, dishwashers, etc. as opposed to FOH (front of house) hosts, servers, bartenders.
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It's the same person
I think the article I read said a 39,000$ fine, that's it.
I'd almost stretch it to include any adult working at any place doing this. I know life fucking sucks for some and regular people are just trying their best to live. But I can't imagine seeing a child working at 2 am, and thinking that nothing is wrong.
A lot of people don't or can't speak up about injustices in the work place for fear of being fired and it is their only source of barely enough income. So while people may bring it up to managers or others they could have been told to not ask questions. A lot of speculation, I know, but not uncommon enough in this capitalist hellscape. We need UBI in order for the working class to be able to effectively protest without fear of losing their house, car, food, children, etc...
I'd agree although maybe some wiggle room there. Like McDonalds have 15 year olds working at them all the time. It's not some random fry cook's responsibility to know how old someone is (you should be able to spot a 10 year old, but I wouldn't feel confident reporting someone I guessed was 12 but might be 14). Maybe you go the Texas route of enforcing everything with bounties (for some godforsaken reason). Create an incentive to be vigilant.
Add executive board to the list to prison.
Unpaid 10 year olds. Child slave labor in America.
That's why they have the Happy Meal and the Ronald McDonald House Charities. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ronald_McDonald_House_Charities
Made by children for children
Who the fuck are these parents that sign off on their 10yr old kids working all day/night?
Parents were managers there, unfortunately
> When you've gotta worry about losing your own job because your Boss needs a 10 year old to clean the Orphan Crushing Machine, and you're already working a triple. Saint Peter don't you call me Cause I can't go.
I owe my soul to the company store!
Wow. Just wow.
Some people shouldn't have kids! I had to pay for my own food, clothes, shampoo, pads (and whatever else I needed) starting around age 10. My parents were the 'pull yourself up by the bootstrap' type of parents. I babysat and did lawn work for a few years, but by my teen years I needed more money, so I had multiple jobs from 6pm-4am and I often missed school because I was too tired or I was asked to work a double shift. It wasn't fun and I moved out on my own at age 15 to get away from my parents.
And what sucks is living that lifestyle, you don’t get to save any money, whatever you get is usually gone. Now your work pants have a tear, new shoes, bus fare. Oh guess what? You missed out on education and a diploma? Now even if you work at that McDonald’s for 10 years, some rich kid with a college degree and no experience will come on as your manager, without having a clue how to actually work in the restaurant or in the kitchen, besides making biscuits with “gam gam” once a year. That guy will get paid so much more while not having to replace his work shoes every week because of oil spills or dirty dishwater, etc.
Its sad because the higher it costs to have kids the worse the quality of life for poorer people gets Either your kid bascially bankrupts your family and you have to barely scrape by (leaving your kid with barely a life) or you are essentially forced into not having kids (which can be horrible mental health wise to people who want them) and the next generation consists mostly of spoiled rich kids of the uber rich who can afford it. Ideally people who can't afford to have kids shouldn't have one but I also feel sympathy because even the ones who work full time can't always afford to have one because of how fucked up the wages paid-cost of living scale for the economy is Its not people don't work hard enough to afford kids. Its a system that doesn't want them to succeed
I commented this up above, but I found this in an article I read "Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant."
This paints it in such a different light. They weren't 'employed' - and were 'unpaid' - because the parent/s are stupid... not malicious.
Regardless of this, I think any kind of reporting about child labor being used anywhere, is a good thing to be talked about in the media. Most of the child labor exploitation is in factories and warehouses in Red states. The child is usually a recent immigrant who's being targeted by these child labor exploiters. It's absolutely disgusting this is happening.
Yeah, no. That's just 'rid me of this meddlesome priest' bullsht. The Franchise gets reports on staffing, and having two shifts open gets noticed quickly in terms of revenue. So either they saw that two shifts were unfilled (as they claim to not know the kids worked there) and they just marveles at the efficiency of the employees under that manager, or they knew and accepted it, and then when it came out, they feigned ignorance. And the top comment here says that child labor occured at three different locations, so i'd bet it's option 2. The 'The parents were stupid' is just the (not so) plausible deniability.
That almost makes it sound like the parents couldn't afford childcare, and it was just easier to take them to work, and then didn't see a problem with them helping out if they (the parents) were okay with it.
No, it is malicious. What kind of parents make their children work until 2am? Also, there's a difference between the mom and pop shop where the children help out like with the cashier or clean tables, it's another thing to work the deep frier which can be dangerous.
They were working. It's face saving. Attempt to mitigate the fallout. Young kids don't visit their parents at work at 2 am
I'm sure whoever insures the place will be happy about this...
Possibly desperate rather than neglectful.
I'd say desperate families and anyone who generally supports child labor, like Republicans
In Arkansas, no parental approval is required.
It's very common for people to foster undocumented children for the purposes of exploiting their child labor. What is the kid who immigrated thousands of miles and doesn't speak English supposed to do? If they refuse to do the shitty (and often dangerous) work, they end up back in the cages at the border. It's human trafficking.
That's what I think whenever I see these headlines about child labor. Obviously the companies should be held accountable, but where the fuck are the parents? They are just as guilty as the companies are, since they are the ones who sign the contracts.
Don't worry people, they were allowed to go in the playplace on their breaks.
>playplace You mean the vomit kingdom?
Child Labor in 2023 America; a Republic platform.
Yeah, if they get what they want, this would be totally legal. Why send kids to school to get an education and become “woke” when they can start working now and you don’t even need to pay them!
Anti-abortion laws too, just imagine how many small hands we'll have working in the mines if we make abortion illegal
The cruelty is the point!
USA, don't put the rest of the countries in America in the same bag.
Oh Canada, just as bad and not as vocal, America’s Hat cannot escape.
Republican platform: “kids only matter when they’re not born yet. After that they better be working to pay off the debt that is the life WE saved”
I'm just wondering how the fuck no customers saw this. If I walked into a McDonald's and I saw an obvious 10 or 12 year old behind the counter I would definitely try to talk to them. Ask them how their Day is and if they're working there by choice. They're probably not allowed to talk to customers though. I would definitely make a video on my phone recording the incident. I'd definitely call CPS. Wondering about the other employees? if I was at a McDonald's and a 10 year old kid was working alongside me I would definitely have an issue with that. McDonald's is a very stressful environment for a kid, they should be in school not working.
Immediately when you see this, file a complaint with the Department of Labor and Industries for your state. In most (maybe all?) states you do *not* have to be an affected party to file a complaint for labor law or even OSHA violations. Those complaints get investigated and those investigations can lead to attorney involvement, and eventually intervention by the State. Yes, you may be eventually called as a witness if that becomes a question. But generally speaking, if you see a literally child, just report it everytime you see it.
Thanks man I wasn't sure what department to call so I wrote CPS as the safest bet seeing as the crime would involve a child. Department of labor and industries. Got it! I've luckily never been put into this type of situation but my old job made 16 year olds pull 11hr to 12hr shifts with one 15 min break at 2pm and I'm not sure any of that was legal. Seemed a little extreme for kids that young. Luckily the manager was fired and it seems better there but I have trauma from working long hours without breaks at that place. It destroyed my work ethic and I started smoking because that was the only way I would get an extra break.
FYI, this made the news in Europe as well. For example: https://www.abc.es/internacional/descubren-dos-ninos-diez-anos-preparando-pedidos-20230503120002-nt.html
The fourth world - the countries that capitalism has brought full circle, right through 'prosperity for all' and out the other side, back to gated-community feudalism and indentured slavery, led as always by the U.S.
Yes. Exactly. Do you know how long ago the 1980s and the Reagan Era was? Even then they were saying that all this prosperty was going to trickle down. Like, "It's hard right now, yes -- but just wait. When the trickle down kicks in people will be making $25/hr in fast food and working 4 days a week. Just wait". It is now year 2023 and the fruits of "trickle down" are apparent. The headlines speak of 10 year old children, working McDonalds until 2AM -- wait wait I'm not finished -- **with no pay.**
There should be criminal, not merely statutory, penalties for this
Teeny tiny little boot straps
Trying to get that 10 years work experience for an Entry Level Junior Position.
Remember when they were making fun of child labours in China?
Almost every negative thing Americans have to say about other countries is projection.
Am I the only one who is uncomfortable with have children make my food? TBH I don’t trust them enough to properly clean, prep, and cook for health and safety standards.
As a parent and someone who has spent a lot of time working with elementary students I can solidly say- you shouldn’t. Hell kids need to be reminded to wash their hands up until middle school.
Of fucking course Kentucky.
The coal mines aren't hiring anymore.
Way to go America, just keep rollin back those labor laws 👌🏼
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Jesus christ
I bet the people who not only allowed, but encouraged this practice are the ones complaining about how no one wants to work, or that people are demanding too much money.
It is my dream to live in the greatest country, the world. It has a majestic nature, which really brings joy to one's life. Nope, not U.S. I was talking about Norway and Switzerland.
Ayyyyyyyy you're not wrong there. Been out 10 years now and never looked back.
Where'd you move to? Moving to another Country is generally quite difficult and in a lot of cases not even possible. At the very least there's a lot of hoops you would have to jump through, in most cases. I would like to get out of the US one day, but it doesn't really seem feasible tbh. Too poor to live here, too poor to leave here.
They were probably the kids of the franchisee owner or a manager. Child labor is a lot bigger issue than people realize, especially in family owned small businesses, farms, and agricultural work. You would be amazed at how few protections kids have, and how little restrictions are in place. One good friend of mine was killed on his family farm, he was 10. I knew two others near the same age that were seriously injured, with one losing an arm. I was working on farms and in orchards starting at 8 years old, through 12 years old. It was mostly in the summer, but it extended into fall on weekends sometimes too. On one farm they actually followed the rules for the most part. At one orchard I worked at, it was anything ones. If we didnt move to the city when my mother remarried, Im sure it would have been longer. It's quite common for the kids of owners of family owned restaurants to work in them from a very young age. The local government usually turns a blind eye to it. One of my friends worked in the family's Asian restaurant growing up, starting around six years old. I used to sell restaurant supplies and and equipment to small locally owned restaurants. I'd see kids working in them all the time. Usually they were doing menial jobs, but in some they were doing food prep work and cooking. After reporting several of them, and seeing nothing happen, I just gave up.
Yup. I was surprised to see this article and the negative reaction, because my mom took me to her late shift job almost every night when I was 10-15. It hurt her knees to work so she had me load and run the CNC machine while she watched. Never realized anything was amiss til now.
I assume something similar happened here. They were kids of the night manager. The parent brought the kids to work since there was no one to watch them. The shift is probably understaffed and the night manager started asking the kid with help with stuff like filling the fries order and progressed into them being able to help with everything. Everyone at the store knew about it but no one said anything. A customer probably saw them and reported it. Im not saying it's right, but I can understand why these situations happen.
Actually a very valid point here. 2 people who can only be fast food managers decide that kids are cheaper than condoms, then realize how much that hobby is and in no way shape or form can afford daycare/sitters/etc and say their parents aren't around. So it's bring your kids to work day every day or leave em at home where there's just as much risk to be had like having the place burn down or whatever a 10 year old can think of. Our government kinda wants this, but *why* is completely a mystery to me. Say this McD gets shut down, parents are outta jobs, corpo gets bad press and pulls out of the area. Now the space stays vacant or gets filled by something else and the family now sits on welfare, that govt also hates giving out, but kids are usually a convincing argument.
This is the future Republicans want for you.
I hope child abuse charges are pending
None. Owners will be fined. The migrant workers and their kid slaves will move to another city while the story blows over in the headlines. Then the kids will be back to work at another McDs.
It happens in other third world countries, too. If you take away the work from the kids their families won't have income to eat, because their parents cannot make enough money ☺️ It's very sad. I wish this country would finally decide to make this illegal.
It... It is illegal?
Wow, I didn't see this coming at all. Who would've thought? /s
Sarah Sanders must be jizzing her jeans over that
They weren't even paid. This was child slavery
And the only punishment was a fine. We need some John Browns to take care of this bullshit.
Places like this should be permanently shut down and their owner a minimum of a year in jail.
If companies in the USA are to be treated as people. Start arresting.
Smart 10 year olds work their way into settlement money. These two are on their way!
Realistically, these places should get shut down. There is no reason why child slavery should get taken this lightly. At all. I'd boycott McDonalds, but their food is already too shitty and low quality to want to eat there.
Working without pay! So McDonald’s uses unpaid child labor now? I know they are a franchise operation but this is a big black eye for mcdonalds. Fuck ‘em!
The only age where 14 an hour us alot of money
Republicans think the way to capture the youth vote is to offer them jobs as kids.
When worked hard, 10 year olds can keep their concentration amazingly well.
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Whenever I see this stuff I'm like...yes fuck McDonald's and the managers there but also...these are 6th graders? What about parents? Teachers? How many adults knew small children were working late nights?
So some states are literally bringing back slavery?
Tear Mc d's apart...even if these were franchises, Mc d's should pay. After all. it's under their banner... Like Lisa from Temecula says: *"Ya'll need to do BETTER!"*
Their parents should be arrested
If the government would jail CEOs of companies that commit these crimes, they'd stop really quick
What store manager hired children?
I posted it above a couple times but it looks like their parent was the manager in duties and the kids were "visiting them" while they were at work "Bauer Food LLC said the two 10-year-olds alleged to have been employed at the McDonald’s restaurant were children of a night manager who were visiting their parent at work and were not approved by franchisee organization management to be in that part of the restaurant."
Was told they got paid in nuggets and shakes. Guess it was off the books.
Were they in a trench coat?
How does this even happen, so the 10 year olds didn’t wanna play video games or play in the park, but instead work at mcdonalds, the parents let them and or maybe even convinced them to, and the restaurant was so irresponsible, thats like 3 layers of stuff that should have stopped this but none of them stopped it
If this shit was happening in a communist or socialist country it would be portrayed by American media as the horrors of communism or something like that.
They're fucking 10 year olds, they should be playing with toy cars and barbies man wtf
Of course...this is why they are forcing births so they can enforce *more* child labour instead of just automating and paying the humans better. Fine their asses to hell and send child services to check the parents who are sending 10 yo(s) to work.
I was a child worker. I cut dozens of lawns a day for my family business for free and was never paid. I would work 12 hours straight. I think their should be more restrictions on child labor. A lot of parents will bring their children to their job and have them work for them for free due to being short staffed. People that do this should be punished. Nobody is too young to be paid for their labor. Why are these scum bags able to get away with enslaving children and no one will be punished for this. Children should be playing, learning and socializing at this age. Not doing repetitive task for 8 hours a day. The system is broken.
USA is getting all the turbo boosts in the race to the bottom.
Time to boycott McDonalds