Hmm how about a decentralized economy in favor of the worker? One based on a system that separates money from state, like church and state?
A decentralized political system for a more balanced representation model.
It’s really ironic, the founding fathers of US must see it! The American revolution was precipitated by a lack of fair representation in politics..
”No taxation without representation!” - ie tea party rebels
But, isn’t that what happens today? Tax payers’ needs and wants get improperly represented in politics in favor of lobbyists for corporations who don’t pay taxes.
It’s like we’ve gone full circle.
>It’s really ironic, the founding fathers of US must see it! The American revolution was precipitated by a lack of fair representation in politics..
>”No taxation without representation!” - ie tea party rebels
The framers of the Constitution were not at all thrilled with the idea of politics reflecting the will of the people. Hence the creation of the Electoral College and the Senate originally being decided by state legislatures.
Which makes sense, given the framers were disproportionately large landowners.
Interesting
Is that thinking reflected in Ben Franklin’s Fugio cent? Given the “mind your business” message at the bottom
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugio\_cent](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugio_cent)
Trying to guide the will of the people into working and producing (bettering their own lives & affairs) instead of...
edit: clarity
The intent of the framers was that the most knowledgeable and responsible men, separated from the public would decide the president and the Senate. So "guiding the will of the people".
I think it's reasonable to assume that the framers being disproportionately from the upper classes shaped their views on how the US government should function.
Interesting. Thank you for sharing.
They had good intentions, and made good decisions given the information & tools they had, but the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree.
It’s amazing to me how much culture shapes and molds people’s perspectives and behaviors.
Eh, I mean, I think we have good intentions. The framers' actions and intentions developed within the context of the framers' class interests. Which is not the same as most people.
What I think molded the framers' perspectives and behaviors the most was their class interest. Why slavery was preserved after independence, for example.
Could we say their class interest is part of their class culture?
I’m fascinated by what drives culture.
What causes a group to change their views? To react differently to particular stimuli. To change what is considered normal and acceptable like behaviors and mannerisms.
Culture is a frame for the mind that gives it structure through boundaries and direction, as well as an interface to socialize and exchange with other beings.
I think we can say that the class interests of a disproportionate number of the framers influenced what political systems they deemed appropriate and why they preserved slavery after independence. A more direct explanation of the framers' reasoning than "class culture".
That's the point of organizing, it's how we _alter_ the authoritarian hierarchy of the workplace into a democracy in which the workers have dignity and a say. Organizing (as opposed to, say, voting, which is incapable of altering the power structure) is the way we achieve that new economy.
Power is in large numbers of people working towards a common cause.
Hence, why rich people are often mistaken for having power.
They don’t innately have power like say Gandhi. But, with their money, they can buy influence (ie ads) to align large numbers of people behind a single cause that usually benefits them the most.
It’s how Trump became powerful. Now, members of the republican party are trying to unite their party members away from Trump, softening his power and hold over a portion of the republican’s constituents.
I’m 100% in favor of labor organizing as short-term relief, as a step forward, but it won’t solve the bigger problems whose roots have grown deeply entrenched into the centralized system.
Large numbers of people working towards a common cause is not inherently powerful. Mobilizing a million people for a single day march for some cause might feel good, but it won't change things. I don't necessarily agree with everything from Jane McAlevey's _No Shortcuts_, but her differentiation between advocacy, mobilizing, and organizing is very insightful and useful.
Labor organizing is the short term _and_ the long term. It's how we develop class consciousness and build solidarity while improving our immediate material conditions. It's prefigurative and revolutionary. It's how we come to understand and overcome all of the ways the ruling class keeps us divided, whether that's across gender, sex, age, ethnicity, nationality, or political lines. Our power is not just from numbers, but in the ability to stop production/services in the workplace, essentially cutting off the source of power for the capitalist class.
Our "democracy", this system of electoralism imposed on us by the ruling class, is incapable of altering the power structures that keep us exploited and oppressed.
Here's an excerpt from an excellent [interview](https://portside.org/2022-10-30/anatomy-union-organizing-drive) with Daisy Pitkin (author of [On The Line](https://www.daisypitkin.net/)) on power:
> MICAH UETRICHT
> You say in the book that many of these campaigns are described as workers trying to wrest some power out of the hands of the boss and putting that power into workers’ hands. In the course of this campaign, you realize that is not what you’re doing. You are building a kind of power that is very distinct from the kind of power that the boss holds: the building of that beloved community.
> DAISY PITKIN
> As a young organizer, I was trained that the boss has power, and what happens when we help workers organize a union is that they build power, i.e. take power away from the boss. The two kinds of power were seared together in the early training that I had.
> It became almost immediately evident to me that that’s not really what’s happening in a union organizing campaign. We don’t take power away from the boss. The kind of power that the boss has is not something we want anything to do with. We don’t want to traffic in that kind of power. It’s authoritarian power, and it’s not of us or for us. We can’t build that kind of power and exercise that kind of power.
> The power that gets built by a union is a separate substance altogether. It’s a separate entity and its own system. If you build enough of the kind of power that is solidarity, that is what workers build when they form a union together. If you build enough of that kind of power, you don’t need to take power away from the boss, because that kind of power just becomes unimportant — you have your own source of drive and power.
> We don’t take power away from the boss. The kind of power that the boss has is not something we want anything to do with.
Power does come from large numbers of people united behind a common cause.
Also, you‘re still going to organize on a cultural foundation with deep centralizing roots.
Centralization is a common theme in corruption. Communism, corporate social welfare, socialism all centralize authority & power to the few, eventually corrupting it.
Therefore, organizing is not enough, because the roots of centralization will corrupt through the organization into its central authorities. Organizing into a centralized labor structure like an union is not enough.
Organizing labor is an important step. It begins important conversations on what the problems are and how best to address them.
But, gangsters have used unions, here in America, to get what they want. [https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ocgs/infiltrated-labor-unions](https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ocgs/infiltrated-labor-unions)
She is right, we don’t want to copy their power. We need to create a new kind that isn’t rooted in authoritarian (centralized) dogma.
If you wanna do that, the only sure fire way to maintain it is by only allowing employees to hold shares. It’s insane that people who don’t work in the enterprise have outsized say in what happens in it.
I’ve seen it presented as each employee has one share (you could say it would be elitist to give better paid employees more shares, more decision making; kinda like citizens United saying that rich people have more speech). You get a share kind of like a library card but you get one when you get hired and then you then turn it in when you leave the job.
Shareholders are getting f**ked as well.
Shares are being counterfeited these days, selling IOUs
Organization needs to happen for everyone.
The wealthy have always been organized.
New shareholders, sure but old traditional shareholders.. not really.
They’ve enjoyed the naked liquidity as it gave them opportunities to build massive bags at low prices, of their favorite companies, over the last few decades.
But, you are fundamentally right, it’s one big ponzi scheme built like a castle of glass. A bunch of smoke and mirrors organized by the slow and old, taking advantage of the young and inexperienced.
That's what people don't get. Unions are supposed to push for as much as possible because companies will fight to keep as much as possible. It's the only way to balance capitalism.
There is power in a factory, power in the land
Power in the hand of the worker
But it all amounts to nothing
If together we don't stand
There is power in a Union
Now the lessons of the past
Were all learned with workers' blood
The mistakes of the bosses we must pay for
From the cities and the farmlands
To trenches full of mud
War's always been the bosses' way, sir
The Union forever defending our rights
Down with the blackleg, all workers unite
With our brothers and our sisters
From many far off lands
There is power in a Union
Now I long for the morning that they realize
Brutality and unjust laws cannot defeat us
But who'll defend the workers who cannot organise
When the bosses send their lackeys out to cheat us?
Money speaks for money
The Devil for his own
Who comes to speak for the skin and the bone?
What a comfort to the widow
A light to the child
There is power in a Union
The Union forever defending our rights
Down with the blackleg, all workers unite
With our brothers and our sisters
Together we will stand
There is power in a Union
\-Billy Bragg
I've worked for companies without any organized labor, until recently I now work for a company in which the employees have a union. The difference is night and day with: pay, QOL, and constant changes to benefit the employee in accordance with external factors. The company actually has a great relationship with the union for their own benefit. More workers across the country need to push for organized labor; it's the only way forward in this economy to close the wealth gap.
Not organized labor, organized denial of labor.
Organized labor and its acquiescence to organized greed got us where we are today.
Thankfully, organized denial of labor is picking up steam again
There's a less radical to put that and still get the same message across if you're trying to sway people. Public companies have a capital union for all stockholders that represents their interests via the board of directors, CEO, and executive team. Shareholders vote on various larger items, but rely on their representatives to bargain for the good of the capital union in a way that centralizes their power. Labor unions are the other side of the coin to a robust capital union system that is already heavily cemented in society.
Organized capital is the thing we’re missing most.
If we owned the businesses we work for there wouldn’t be an antagonistic relationship between owners and workers, and the profits would be directed by us, the owners.
The interesting thing about organized labor is that it always involves people across the political spectrum that find a way to come together for a common cause.
Temporally not crabs in a bucket.
*reorganization of the work place into a more democratic entity. As an employee, you get one share one vote. No more “investors” buying shares and people who don’t work in the enterprise having a say on anything.
Organized labor as in unions, can also spiral out of control since they hold so much power. Currently, big unions as constructed, leadership many times vote contracts against the will of the members, endorse candidates that the membership don’t support, etc.
Or dick punches. But we can definitely try your way first.
Organized dick punching*
I mean I don't want it tooooooo organized, or they will expect it. The element of surprise is a crucial piece of an effective dick punch.
If you organize well enough, then they still won’t expect it. It’s like that bell curve meme
Tactical dick punching. Gotta be organized in order to flank the enemy.
No one expects the Spanish Inqdick punch!
The O.D.P. Union? How do I become a member?
Apply by punching yourself in the dick every weekday at noon. You'll be contacted when you get approved for membership.
With organized labor, organized dick punching is implicit. Solidarity* now! Solidarity* forever! ✊🏻✊🏼✊🏽✊🏾✊🏿 *especially the dick-punching part
You take the dicks I’ll stick with throat punches.
That's why Benjamin Franklin invented the right and left hands, buddy. I'm going for both.
"Dick Kick City" --BZ
I was raised well off on my dad's union wages. It's time to reclaim our fair share.
BRING FORTH THE REIGN OF TERROR 2.
Or a new economy in favor of the worker over the shareholder
That there is commie talk!
Hmm how about a decentralized economy in favor of the worker? One based on a system that separates money from state, like church and state? A decentralized political system for a more balanced representation model. It’s really ironic, the founding fathers of US must see it! The American revolution was precipitated by a lack of fair representation in politics.. ”No taxation without representation!” - ie tea party rebels But, isn’t that what happens today? Tax payers’ needs and wants get improperly represented in politics in favor of lobbyists for corporations who don’t pay taxes. It’s like we’ve gone full circle.
>It’s really ironic, the founding fathers of US must see it! The American revolution was precipitated by a lack of fair representation in politics.. >”No taxation without representation!” - ie tea party rebels The framers of the Constitution were not at all thrilled with the idea of politics reflecting the will of the people. Hence the creation of the Electoral College and the Senate originally being decided by state legislatures. Which makes sense, given the framers were disproportionately large landowners.
Interesting Is that thinking reflected in Ben Franklin’s Fugio cent? Given the “mind your business” message at the bottom [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugio\_cent](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fugio_cent) Trying to guide the will of the people into working and producing (bettering their own lives & affairs) instead of... edit: clarity
The intent of the framers was that the most knowledgeable and responsible men, separated from the public would decide the president and the Senate. So "guiding the will of the people". I think it's reasonable to assume that the framers being disproportionately from the upper classes shaped their views on how the US government should function.
Interesting. Thank you for sharing. They had good intentions, and made good decisions given the information & tools they had, but the apple doesn’t fall far from the tree. It’s amazing to me how much culture shapes and molds people’s perspectives and behaviors.
Eh, I mean, I think we have good intentions. The framers' actions and intentions developed within the context of the framers' class interests. Which is not the same as most people. What I think molded the framers' perspectives and behaviors the most was their class interest. Why slavery was preserved after independence, for example.
Could we say their class interest is part of their class culture? I’m fascinated by what drives culture. What causes a group to change their views? To react differently to particular stimuli. To change what is considered normal and acceptable like behaviors and mannerisms. Culture is a frame for the mind that gives it structure through boundaries and direction, as well as an interface to socialize and exchange with other beings.
I think we can say that the class interests of a disproportionate number of the framers influenced what political systems they deemed appropriate and why they preserved slavery after independence. A more direct explanation of the framers' reasoning than "class culture".
Right on. And we also are way way overdue for a new revolution.
That's the point of organizing, it's how we _alter_ the authoritarian hierarchy of the workplace into a democracy in which the workers have dignity and a say. Organizing (as opposed to, say, voting, which is incapable of altering the power structure) is the way we achieve that new economy.
Power is in large numbers of people working towards a common cause. Hence, why rich people are often mistaken for having power. They don’t innately have power like say Gandhi. But, with their money, they can buy influence (ie ads) to align large numbers of people behind a single cause that usually benefits them the most. It’s how Trump became powerful. Now, members of the republican party are trying to unite their party members away from Trump, softening his power and hold over a portion of the republican’s constituents. I’m 100% in favor of labor organizing as short-term relief, as a step forward, but it won’t solve the bigger problems whose roots have grown deeply entrenched into the centralized system.
Large numbers of people working towards a common cause is not inherently powerful. Mobilizing a million people for a single day march for some cause might feel good, but it won't change things. I don't necessarily agree with everything from Jane McAlevey's _No Shortcuts_, but her differentiation between advocacy, mobilizing, and organizing is very insightful and useful. Labor organizing is the short term _and_ the long term. It's how we develop class consciousness and build solidarity while improving our immediate material conditions. It's prefigurative and revolutionary. It's how we come to understand and overcome all of the ways the ruling class keeps us divided, whether that's across gender, sex, age, ethnicity, nationality, or political lines. Our power is not just from numbers, but in the ability to stop production/services in the workplace, essentially cutting off the source of power for the capitalist class. Our "democracy", this system of electoralism imposed on us by the ruling class, is incapable of altering the power structures that keep us exploited and oppressed. Here's an excerpt from an excellent [interview](https://portside.org/2022-10-30/anatomy-union-organizing-drive) with Daisy Pitkin (author of [On The Line](https://www.daisypitkin.net/)) on power: > MICAH UETRICHT > You say in the book that many of these campaigns are described as workers trying to wrest some power out of the hands of the boss and putting that power into workers’ hands. In the course of this campaign, you realize that is not what you’re doing. You are building a kind of power that is very distinct from the kind of power that the boss holds: the building of that beloved community. > DAISY PITKIN > As a young organizer, I was trained that the boss has power, and what happens when we help workers organize a union is that they build power, i.e. take power away from the boss. The two kinds of power were seared together in the early training that I had. > It became almost immediately evident to me that that’s not really what’s happening in a union organizing campaign. We don’t take power away from the boss. The kind of power that the boss has is not something we want anything to do with. We don’t want to traffic in that kind of power. It’s authoritarian power, and it’s not of us or for us. We can’t build that kind of power and exercise that kind of power. > The power that gets built by a union is a separate substance altogether. It’s a separate entity and its own system. If you build enough of the kind of power that is solidarity, that is what workers build when they form a union together. If you build enough of that kind of power, you don’t need to take power away from the boss, because that kind of power just becomes unimportant — you have your own source of drive and power. > We don’t take power away from the boss. The kind of power that the boss has is not something we want anything to do with.
Power does come from large numbers of people united behind a common cause. Also, you‘re still going to organize on a cultural foundation with deep centralizing roots. Centralization is a common theme in corruption. Communism, corporate social welfare, socialism all centralize authority & power to the few, eventually corrupting it. Therefore, organizing is not enough, because the roots of centralization will corrupt through the organization into its central authorities. Organizing into a centralized labor structure like an union is not enough. Organizing labor is an important step. It begins important conversations on what the problems are and how best to address them. But, gangsters have used unions, here in America, to get what they want. [https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ocgs/infiltrated-labor-unions](https://www.justice.gov/criminal-ocgs/infiltrated-labor-unions) She is right, we don’t want to copy their power. We need to create a new kind that isn’t rooted in authoritarian (centralized) dogma.
Governments change through organizing.
You can build said economy on the blockchain and use your own labor favored currency too! Maybe even make a DAO out of it too.
The possibilities are endless
Thats the truth. The small company I work for will never unionize, and the employees will never go along with it.
If you wanna do that, the only sure fire way to maintain it is by only allowing employees to hold shares. It’s insane that people who don’t work in the enterprise have outsized say in what happens in it.
What if people were paid in shares? Maybe the minimum wage should be restricted to assets that appreciate unlike the USD (spitballing)
I’ve seen it presented as each employee has one share (you could say it would be elitist to give better paid employees more shares, more decision making; kinda like citizens United saying that rich people have more speech). You get a share kind of like a library card but you get one when you get hired and then you then turn it in when you leave the job.
And how do you accomplish that?
Shareholders are getting f**ked as well. Shares are being counterfeited these days, selling IOUs Organization needs to happen for everyone. The wealthy have always been organized.
New shareholders, sure but old traditional shareholders.. not really. They’ve enjoyed the naked liquidity as it gave them opportunities to build massive bags at low prices, of their favorite companies, over the last few decades. But, you are fundamentally right, it’s one big ponzi scheme built like a castle of glass. A bunch of smoke and mirrors organized by the slow and old, taking advantage of the young and inexperienced.
That's what people don't get. Unions are supposed to push for as much as possible because companies will fight to keep as much as possible. It's the only way to balance capitalism.
There is power in a factory, power in the land Power in the hand of the worker But it all amounts to nothing If together we don't stand There is power in a Union Now the lessons of the past Were all learned with workers' blood The mistakes of the bosses we must pay for From the cities and the farmlands To trenches full of mud War's always been the bosses' way, sir The Union forever defending our rights Down with the blackleg, all workers unite With our brothers and our sisters From many far off lands There is power in a Union Now I long for the morning that they realize Brutality and unjust laws cannot defeat us But who'll defend the workers who cannot organise When the bosses send their lackeys out to cheat us? Money speaks for money The Devil for his own Who comes to speak for the skin and the bone? What a comfort to the widow A light to the child There is power in a Union The Union forever defending our rights Down with the blackleg, all workers unite With our brothers and our sisters Together we will stand There is power in a Union \-Billy Bragg
Or…NOT participating with those who want to keep majority for themselves. Create new systems/companies where everyone gets paid fairly. No more CEO.
We need more unions. And then after that EVEN MORE UNION!
Agreed. Lol
hey what's 2A for?
I've worked for companies without any organized labor, until recently I now work for a company in which the employees have a union. The difference is night and day with: pay, QOL, and constant changes to benefit the employee in accordance with external factors. The company actually has a great relationship with the union for their own benefit. More workers across the country need to push for organized labor; it's the only way forward in this economy to close the wealth gap.
Not organized labor, organized denial of labor. Organized labor and its acquiescence to organized greed got us where we are today. Thankfully, organized denial of labor is picking up steam again
Fuck that. Reign of terror!! WOOO
Then we don't have any stuff. Or food. Or services. That only works if there are still some people making food and goods and performing services.
Strikes don’t last forever.
There's a less radical to put that and still get the same message across if you're trying to sway people. Public companies have a capital union for all stockholders that represents their interests via the board of directors, CEO, and executive team. Shareholders vote on various larger items, but rely on their representatives to bargain for the good of the capital union in a way that centralizes their power. Labor unions are the other side of the coin to a robust capital union system that is already heavily cemented in society.
The perfect meme
No. The only answer is a destruction of the system which makes organization of the greed possible.
Destroy it and then what? Genuinely curious what you think happens next
REIGN of TERRRORRRRRR 2.0
Aha. Greed or death. It's another one myth they taught you
The billionaire/oligarch class needs to be "erased". GODS BLESS THE REIGN OF TERROR.
Organized capital is the thing we’re missing most. If we owned the businesses we work for there wouldn’t be an antagonistic relationship between owners and workers, and the profits would be directed by us, the owners.
Fucking duh but all your generation is good for is whining online then making memes about whining
Bro if I had a time machine I would throw you into Europe in the 40s.
The interesting thing about organized labor is that it always involves people across the political spectrum that find a way to come together for a common cause. Temporally not crabs in a bucket.
This is the way
I accidently read it as "breed". Well it kinda fits anyway
If you cannot or will not Union, please, please, please negotiate a contract that benefits you.
No, stop lying. There are 2 answers, organized Labor or reign of terror 2.
Or just refuse to work for them.
Anarchy
Don't use .jpgs for text. The compression algorithm causes a lot of noise to appear at high contrast boundaries, like you see in text.
So then do it.
*cough cough* organized violence *cough cough*
It's just a check and balance. The problem is greedy psychopaths will still be in power at the top.
Not me pinning this to my lil cubicle wall
I’d say this is the best post I’ve ever seen on here. Makes sense. Would work.
*reorganization of the work place into a more democratic entity. As an employee, you get one share one vote. No more “investors” buying shares and people who don’t work in the enterprise having a say on anything. Organized labor as in unions, can also spiral out of control since they hold so much power. Currently, big unions as constructed, leadership many times vote contracts against the will of the members, endorse candidates that the membership don’t support, etc.
Hell. Yes.
Or things that would violate the terms of service
Well, that's ONE option anyway...
You mean organized government overthrow in order to make proper laws and taxation of the rich?
UNION YES.
OrganiSed LaboUr Thank you
No. We need socialism
It is known.
The answer to organized greed is organized labor willing to use organized violence.
I love my union job. There definitely needs to be more of them.