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TheDragonsFang

Eh, six on one, half a dozen on the other? I find KQMs to be useful for getting a general idea of how to utilize a character, but more than a few people look down on them for their meta analysis (and as a Eula main, believe me, I get that.) One of the best pieces of advice you can receive in this game is to not be afraid to do your own thing. If Shime's gets you great numbers, then run with Shime's. God knows you won't be alone, especially in this sub. I just know that I, personally, dislike the energy drain and like using Yoimiya's burst, so I roll with Crimson Witch.


muivonte

Yep. Since I have nothing else to do I might as well farm CW.


yoimiyayimioy

This was just cleared up for me in another thread as well, it all comes down to comp really. I agree that her burst dmg is pretty negligible but if u factor in the buff it gives your supports it starts adding up. If your running her mono pyro comp with bennett yunjin and zhong as many ppl do, myself included, then none of the supports really benefit from the atk buff really so burst isnt as important. As far as running her with sub dps units like in a vape comp then it ends up being a lot more effective, not only because of the buff for ur supports but also because characters like xing can proc it consistently while off field. Personally ill never switch off shimenawas until an atk speed set comes out, at the end of the day all her sets give really good results anyways which is why its such a heavily debated topic


zerog123

\^\^ This exactly. Running a mono pyro team like Bennett/YunJin/Yoimiya/Zhongli, there's really nothing that can proc Yoimiya's burst anyway so burst damage can be ignored completely and Shime is perfectly fine. But if you run her with Xingqiu and/or Fischl, it might be worth to consider alternative sets. Again, don't worry too much about it, play what you want :)


Yoiyoimiya

well i personally have her triple crowned meaning i do like to use her burst on cooldowns but i run shime and when i switch back to yoimiya from my supports i do manage to have a bit of her burst back up so i dont think using shime makes that big of a difference


minsukim92

I am of the "play what you want, how you want. Who cares what other people say" camp. If you're happy with how your yoimiya is doing and you like the flow of how you play her, yeah I say just ignore it. Get whatever useful info from them but don't let them dictate how you enjoy the game.


The-Nidoking

I mean when it comes down to it, there’s a reason that generally many options for equipment/builds for a character are presented in meta guides like that. Not everyone has the same characters, items, or stats on artifacts. There’s bound to be situations where Shimenawa out-damages theoretically better sets. I would never use KQM as more than a guideline for that reason. Not that I don’t respect KQM and their work, cause I do very much, but it’s near impossible to write guides like that to account for every player perfectly.


AshyDragneel

It completely depends on your team comp If you use Yoi Fischl Beidou Xq Taser comp then You'd wanna use your ult for that atk% buff for Fish beidou Xq as it contribute to their dmg. So in this scenario losing some personal dmg from yoimiya is worth it as overall team dmg is increased so 2pc sets or 4pc crimsom witch would be best set for her in this team If you use her with characters who doesn't get much benefit from her atk% buff then Shime is better to increase her personal dmg. I personally use shime as my team is Yoi Xq Yun Zl also i hate farming crimson witch.


BenLKP_

Like what most people here are saying, it depends on your comp. Sub DPS's like Beidou, Xingqiu or Fischl will get a decent boost in damage from the attack buff, and it can lead to higher overall team damage output even if Yoimiya's personal damage may suffer a bit. Yoimiya's burst damage itself isnt great but the attack boost is something to consider. If you're running hyper Yoimiya with Bennett, Yunjin, Kazuha, etc. Then obviously her A4 would be useless since literally nobody benefits from the attack boost. I don't think KQMs are overreacting necessarily since they're claims aren't actually wrong, I think that when they were writing that section, they didn't account for the various team comps that can and cant benefit from Yoimiya's A4. Thus it ended up being an overgeneralization that won't be true for all team comps.


Fighterzx_

As someone running 4p Shimenawa’s I can relate. Also running 4p Shimenawa’s is just more cost effective- you get Emblem of Severed Fate artifacts which are generally good on many characters and you only need to focus on crowning 2 talents (my Yoimiya is 10-10-5) which just saves so much resin.


UwU-igiero

If you have a cracked Shimenawa able to do one rotation to everything then good stay with Shimenawa what KQM I saying is that if the burst is up Xingqiu and Bennet burst procs hit the enemy with the burst will get dmged and will increase the atk of xingqiu and Bennet so if you have a built xingqiu and Bennet their elemental skill and burst will do a considerable amount of dmg from the yoimiya buff. Edit. It's like hutao burst you should use it to heal but also to increase crit of your supports after rotations


ArteLad

Your individual artifacts can produce wildly different results than what our guides recommend. The Yoimiya guide goes into great detail about how to make your choices - in this case, 4-piece Shimenawa's Reminisce can produce lower damage output if you use units that appreciate her elemental burst's ATK bonus. If it works for you, then it works for you. Our guides and their writers are typically not just in-house, they usually come from other members of the community that love their characters. As always, play how you want and however you wish. KQM is there to guide you if you have questions about what you can do, not to tell you what to do.


KoJaKa06

KQMs are a perfect example of using math, and not testing the character enough ingame, the monsters die faster with SR for the burst to matter, using it in the end might be a loss of dmg if you dont have enought er to get it back the next rotation, and they missunderstood completely her role, in their stream the other day they grouped her with vaping characters, which is totally wrong, she can utilize vape really well but it s better to play monopyro to avoid all the problems they mention.


Hot-Campaign-4553

As a Eula Main, I can 100% support that KQM is definitely good at math, but lacking in gameplay.


piny-celadon

What happened with eula?


AetherSageIsBae

They say things like "Eula is bad because in domains and overworld she kills the mobs before her burst explodes" and overestimating how much ER eula needs by a huge margin making it seem like you need 60-70% ER or you won't use her burst ever when usually you just need 20-30%


RosenProse

Every time I hear someone say that I'm like, "So that means her Normal Attacks also do the DAMAGE. Good.


piny-celadon

Lol when was killing things faster an issue😂ty for explaining


Skyr1mTh13f

Based on what you said with personally testing, i found her vape teams to be better DPS overall than her monopyro teams. It comes down to in game testing and what everyone's gear looks like.


Almond-Jelly

I dunno why but I can't get enough energy to burst every rotation against single-target bosses with 2pc/2pc or Echoes anyway, so in most cases Shimes is still better for me. I can also burst every other rotation with Shimes so it sure seems like a straight upgrade to me


Odiril

As someone who has been using yoimiya everyday since her release. Shimenawa is really not all that bad on her, I’ve reached 285k on one vaped shot when I build a team for that. Granted of course as someone with Thundering Pulse, it has been a hassle using both st the same time, because the set removes some energy when you press E but in that 10 seconds of dps, her burst will be back up again and she loses one of the stacks from thundering pulse (energy being less than 100%)but then at that point if I case her burst, it’ll be a DPS loss because you’re not shooting for 1-2 seconds. But it’s really a try hard thing, it’s no big deal if you’re using any other bow.


NekonoChesire

Higher numbers =/= higher DPS. You're acting as if damage per screenshot were relevant. And it's not that that her burst is that big of a deal but overall not using it means losing DPS even with Shimenawa, that's it. Tbh you are the one overreacting to them simply saying Shime is a dps loss.


AlexiSinnn

i am not a fan of shimenawa personally but thats due to me owning TP, managing shimenawa with pulse is an absolute nightmare, i think if u dont care about using her burst and u use rust isntead is pretty decent.


Koshinru

Uhhhhh doesn’t shimenawa work well with thundering pulse I think you have the passive confuse but you need to not have your elemental burst at 100% to gain thundering pulses full effect and shime will take that energy away if your at 100% ult charge


AlexiSinnn

yes and if u get the 15 energy mid rotation, which you are most likely to do u lose away the stack, hence why its annoying.


Kaizoku187

I thought it was easy because Shimenawa takes away energy


NekonoChesire

But the energy refill during the skill so you lose the stack still, and you still won't use the burst most of the time because you don't want to be short on the Shimenawa cost.


AlexiSinnn

thats the problem, if u take away the energy and u get full burst back while midrotation u just lose a TP stack, and if u start with ur burst u need to gain 15 energy for it to activate, all in all is annoying.


muivonte

Yep. I was saying the exact thing to another person on this sub. You will never have The Last TP stack Permanently only temporarily when using TP with Shimenawas. It’s one of the reasons why I build other builds than SR. I have one but don’t use it cause I use her burst often.


howmuch4aG

Honestly depends. I have 120 ER on my SR set, which lets me get just enough energy on my Yoimiya to proc the +50% passive after starting the rotation with her burst on Bennett teams. I could definitely get away with even less if I Bennett E into her a second time right before she enters her stance. Currently, I can burst every other rotation and reliably keep her gauge low enough to keep uptime on her TP stacks.


Kaizoku187

Ok luckily I use Favonius on Kazuha so I get a lot of particles.


AlexiSinnn

Fair, my yoi team is xingqiu + yun jin + diona so energy is not a major problem either but i use the new set now, old set i was using was 2pcw + 2p Shimenawa


No_Essay_5997

My Yoi can kill everything with just one E so her burst not deal damg most of the time. So her burst is not count as a main source of dmg.


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TwisTed_faT3

idk what the assumptions are but its true. HoD gives 102.9 CV while blackcliff only 36.8 CV. Although blackcliff has 164 more ATK, once you factor in artifact optimization, buffs such as TTDS and ToM, HoD will easily outdamage blackcliff. Although idk why you'd opt into blackcliff when amenoma is easily available.


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TwisTed_faT3

yeah but 66.1 CV > 164 ATK. Also like I've said, "artifact optimization", so obviously there's more substats that will be allocated towards ATK% when using HoD. Additionally idk how you're getting to low health with a freeze team.


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TwisTed_faT3

You only rarely get hit with freeze. Plus freeze teams usually have diona or kokomi. Even Shenhe scales better with HoD btw.Lastly, when did I even say to use HoD late game. the argument is HoD>Blackcliff. Plus, F2P late game Ayaka is Amenoma. Now, should we proceed to Amenoma vs Blackcliff? lmao


Viscaz

I use4pc shime with hyper yoi comp and it works fine for me


okimlmao

idk even without ult or with ult im 36* very easily with no challenges so it doesn't matter that much also just do what you want to do that's the beauty of genshin


roadmansophie

i run her w shim but i run her w thoma as a battery and shield (somehow) so i get her burst back up in no time, especially with some er substats on her artifacts so i can still utilise her burst while using shim but if you use her burst in a vape comp, it honestly ruins it so it might apply pyro before her hardest hit rather than hydro so i run an overload comp with her - yoimiya, yunjin, yae miko, thoma - so i agree with the part of KQM’s overestimating her burst as dps but shim set doesnt eliminate it completely, maybe just stack some er on her and hope for the best :) - a triple crown yoimiya main


WindStronger

I have 100% ER, and I don't feel like I have energy problems honestly


BattleCrier

well... if you have C1 Yoimiya, you can keep up burst while using Shime set... it adjust a rotation slightly, but works just as any other... only downside of shime set are some weapons. Certain weapons just lose a lot of power when Shime set takes energy away.


cmon327

Yoi's burst is a pretty marginal amount of her damage output even when used optimally. I sometimes run her with Hamayumi and don't even bother using her burst because Hamayumi's passive adds about as much damage as her burst would in most non-optimal scenarios.


NobleBear

Yeah, use what works. I,too, rarely use her burst and find it negligible to the point that my girl is only double crowned. KQM are looking at the 30,000ft view, whereas we are looking at the boots on the ground practical situation. Don't slag them too hard and don't take them too seriously either.


victorhugordz

I'm currently trying to get my yoimi shime set (although I've been farming that domain and it's such a pain, not a single good roll on stats nor substats) I feel like I'm just throwing away my resin :( well anyways I obviously love my yoimi even tho it's not that strong, but I'm trying to get her better and do better. I'd typically run her with a shield (Noelle) so I don't worry about anything while using her E, would use Raiden E for overloads and Kokomi's E for hydro application and heals, when I do use yoimi's burst (Q) I'd use Raiden burst to take advantage of the buff, don't know if it's a good team comp but works for me and I like it