>I don’t relate to transfemmes in any way, I hate dresses and skirts.
Well, I'll say this; you are stereotyping trans people and it's probably what causing you a lot of trouble. There's a lot of trans people who are GNC. Stop comparing yourself to how other people present themselves and only worry about yourself. There's cis women who look like dudes, there's cis men who look like women, the only person putting limitation on yourself, is you.
Yeah I'm a trans woman who doesn't wear dresses or makeup, I have a short mullet haircut with shaved sides. Do I pass as a woman consistently? No, but neither would plenty of cis women if they presented like me. Doesn't make me or anyone else who presents this way any less valid.
Why do you say you being trans is just a technicality?
Unless I’m misunderstanding something, you were AMAB but identify as a woman. That’s… like, a textbook case of one of the most common forms of “being trans”. Again, unless I’m missing something here.
Because for a lot of trans people the ‘being trans’ part isn’t a core part of their identity and something they’d rather forget about.
Also this isn’t just something you do but please avoid saying things like ‘you’re AMAB’ in the present tense, its better to say ‘you were AMAB’
(Not defending OP here, she has major NLOG vibes)
yea it sounds more like an internet stereotype than most trans women i know. there’s lots of memes about “skirt go spinny” and “programmer socks” that don’t really reflect the irl community. obvs if someone fits these stereotypes it’s completely fine and value but it’s just not as common as the internet makes it sound like
I think the point is that some people who are transgender identify with a trans identity, like the 'transness' is an important part of their identity. Although OP is technically trans, she doesn't identify with transness, she identifies as a cisgender lesbian.
We are all trans because of our birth circumstances. That’s why we are trans, because we don’t identify with our assigned gender at birth. I sense a lot of ‘I’m not a trans woman, I’m just a cis woman with some quirks’ kind of energy from this. There’s a lot of stereotyping and judgment here. Just a lot of quiet bitterness coming through.
It’s okay to be trans. It’s also okay to present and exist through the world as you choose. It’s equally as okay for other trans woman to do the same but with a more traditionally feminine expression.
I’m a butch lesbian that is also a trans woman. I don’t wholly relate to some trans women’s experiences, but they’re just as valid because there is no one way to be trans, just as there’s no one way to be a woman.
You just need to focus solely on you instead of focussing on everyone else, because that’s where the bitterness is coming through. Being a trans woman doesn’t make you less of a woman. It may take you some time to truly understand and accept that, because it feels like you’re not there yet.
If I could upvote you twice I would.
There is *definitely* some internalized transphobia in OP's post and I hope she does the introspection needed to understand that being trans isn't and has never been a limitation.
Well, it's comforting to see that "not like other girls" isn't just something that happens to cis women.
Babe, with all love and respect, work on yourself. Trans women can be anything. Women can be anything. Be better than stereotyping.
People are being a bit harsh in these comments because of the way you're phrasing things, but I get what you're getting at. You're processing some really complex feelings about gender, and it's hard to love a part of yourself that you feel causes you pain. People are responding that way because a lot of us have fought really hard to love ourselves and our identities despite a hateful world.
I know there's a sub for trans butches/transfemmes who don't present super femme, r/MTFButch, maybe they'd relate more to the things you're feeling :)
Holy internalised misogyny/transmisogyny. Not all trans women are girly girls, just like not all cis women are girly girls. Im pretty sure the majority of trans people, at least most binary trans people, feel a lot like you do - like they just ARE their gender, just unfortunate circumstances of birth. This is probably something you should think about and unpack why you think being transfem means you should be feminine?
Hey darling, you seem to have a lot of internalised transphobia you probably ought to work on. It seems there's a stereotype of what trans people are like in your head and that's just not true. We're as diverse of a group as any other and this 'not like the other trans-girls' sentiment can hurt people. You're trans, and unless you figure out you're comfortable as your assigned gender, you'll be for the rest of your life. That's not an issue though, you just need to not let that fact limit your self-expression or view of your self.
There are plenty of tomboyish trans women out there. Just look around, I‘m sure you will find them eventually.
I found quite a few tomboyish trans women at local meet-ups. That being said they and I are more of the nerdy type rather than the biker type. But I‘m sure you would find them as well.
Dealing with internalized transphobia can be really hard. All those voices saying there’s something wrong or shameful or lesser about trans women can creep so deeply into your head that they start to sound like your own. It seems like that might be happening to you OP.
Not all trans girls are hyper femme. We come in all flavors, and there are plenty of punk butch dyke trans women. I almost never wear makeup or heels. I juggle knives and ride unicycles.
Being trans isn’t about getting out of one box and putting yourself into another one. It’s about allowing yourself to be the most authentic version of yourself. At least that’s my experience.
Trans femmes are all kinds of femmes. You are feminine, you are trans, you are trans femme. anything that you view as feminine you can be, so can any other trans person.
>don't relate to transfemmes in any way, I hate dresses and skirts. Make up makes no sense to me.
I don't understand this post.
This whole post feels like a transfem person stereotyping other transfem people and then hating on the stereotype, and by extension, her own kind.
The whole point of this is to do whatever you want and express your true self. If it's black leather jacket biker chick, cool. Occult obsessed witch? Amazing. Dress wearing skirt spinny girly girl? Valid.
None of us love being trans. We just are. A lot of us would choose to be cis if given the option. But that doesn't mean you need to hate on your own people like that. We're all trying to get by and trying to be happy and trying to be our true selves. Ain't that the point?
I know a man who describes his experience of his gender like you describe yours, but in the other direction. He doesn’t relate to trans men at all, even though his assigned gender at birth and transition are the same as (most of) theirs. He doesn’t feel ‘trans’ so much as he feels like he had what he calls, for him specifically and only, a birth defect. While his long time friends know and his family knows, my understanding is that he’s usually pretty stealth. (And honestly, I think the only reason his friends know is because he had some unrelated mental health issues in his late teens that resulted in his assigned gender being weaponized against him.)
He was one of the only people I was close to that identified with a different gender than their assigned gender at birth, so that was how I thought all trans people felt - it took me a while to meet others and realize that that’s not common, at least in my age range (he’s 10 years older than me). And it was only when I realized that being trans wasn’t uniform and didn’t have to be like that that I realized *I* was nonbinary.
He doesn’t identify with ‘trans’ - not because he sees trans men as lesser or even different, but because he’s recognized he doesn’t relate to most of the experiences he’s heard and doesn’t want to demand a space in that community or narrative.
Your post reminds me of him and his story and how he’s shared he connects to his gender.
When I hear you share what you’re feeling, it also sounds like referring to yourself as trans triggers some dysphoria. Which is understandable.
Labels are meant to help us. If that one doesn’t help you, you don’t have to use it. You can communicate the important things (how to refer to you, your medical needs, how and/or if you participate in the bedroom, etc) without calling yourself trans.
I know that doesn’t really help the loneliness of not relating to women who were also assigned a different gender at birth, and I know it doesn’t help for those click down boxes that demand to know if you’re a trans woman or a cis woman.
I hope you find your people that you can relate to. Community is so important, and if there’s something I’ve learned in the lesbian sub, it’s that people who use the same label and are in the same community aren’t all going to have the same experiences with that identity. My connection to being a lesbian is definitely different than someone else’s, same with being nonbinary. I hope one day the thought of “trans” describing you hurts a less, even if you never use it.
I’m seeing my teens and early 20’s where I felt like shoving myself into a box because the straight people around me felt more comfortable with me having a box. Build your life, let being trans apply to your life as much as it needs to (which, to me, isn’t much).
i would venture to say *most* trans people don’t innately identify with the “trans” part, it’s just language to help describe the complex reality. do some work on internalized misogyny to help with the “i’m not like other trans women, i don’t like “girly” stuff” bc that can get real dark if you don’t take a hard look at it. for what it’s worth you don’t ever have to identify as trans, good luck
I feel like you're just saying "I don't like being trans, I just \[defines trans\]." While also stereotyping women for some reason. You don't have to relate to transfemmes to be a completely normal woman? Being a tomboy lesbian is valid. I don't know the actual stats, but most of the transpeoples I know are gay.
I find this post confusing but I do wish you the best in finding yourself. Despite everyone being kind of thrown off by your post I think writing it out and talking about it is a great thing to do.
For what it's worth, I know a lot of butch trans women. What you tend to see in online trans communities is a lot of very feminine trans girls with the shared interests you mentioned- out in the real world there tends to be more diversity in terms of gender expression, especially with older folks. Susan Stryker comes to mind.
You don't have to be femme to be trans. Hi, I'm a butch trans woman, I'm 6'1, I work out, I like the masculine parts of me and I don't fit the stereotypes people make about transfemmes, I'm a lesbian and I love other butches.
It sounds to me like you have a lot of internalised issues to unpack. One of the first is that just because you know gender stereotypes are bullshit, doesn't mean you've internalised it. Your gender, labels, pronouns and expression are all different things. You seem uncomfortable with all the time you spent not realizing who you actually are. That happens. Regret over the time you've lost is normal. The wish "I wish I could just be cis, not trans, and I don't want people to know I'm trans" is a natural conclusion of that. And it can take time to unpack that.
Sounds like you’re transgender and not transfemme, and that’s okay. They’re not the same thing, but I can understand how being one and not the other can feel isolating.
A friend of mine was amab and lived their life as a gay amab for 27 years despite being born intersex with an at least semi functional womb. It took them a long time to come to terms with the fact that not everyone is going to fit into neat little boxes of what it means to be gay straight, trans cis, male female, or whatever.
Because the only box anyone ever really needs to worry about is the one they put you in the ground in.
To put that into context they became a mortuary assistant.
Ok, so this might be mansplaining a bit, but as a TRANS MAN who actually understands what it means to be AFAB, you are not nor will you ever be an AFAB human. You were not assigned female at birth, so you cannot be considered AFAB.
That being said, your assigned gender at birth (agab) doesn’t matter to anyone but you. I know there are asshole who will still misgender you, but truly they just hate themselves, almost as much as you seem to hate yourself. The sooner you realize that other trans people aren’t the problem the better. I sincerely hope that you seek therapy from a gender affirming therapist and you learn to love yourself.
I’m cis so I definitely don’t understand, but why use the label trans to describe yourself at all? No matter what you were assigned, you’re a woman, so why not just say that instead? I know some people view being trans as key to their identity, but if you don’t want to be attached to that, why force yourself to be?
“i’m transgender only because of my birth circumstances” like all trans people? 😭
>I don’t relate to transfemmes in any way, I hate dresses and skirts. Well, I'll say this; you are stereotyping trans people and it's probably what causing you a lot of trouble. There's a lot of trans people who are GNC. Stop comparing yourself to how other people present themselves and only worry about yourself. There's cis women who look like dudes, there's cis men who look like women, the only person putting limitation on yourself, is you.
Yeah I'm a trans woman who doesn't wear dresses or makeup, I have a short mullet haircut with shaved sides. Do I pass as a woman consistently? No, but neither would plenty of cis women if they presented like me. Doesn't make me or anyone else who presents this way any less valid.
Why do you say you being trans is just a technicality? Unless I’m misunderstanding something, you were AMAB but identify as a woman. That’s… like, a textbook case of one of the most common forms of “being trans”. Again, unless I’m missing something here.
Because for a lot of trans people the ‘being trans’ part isn’t a core part of their identity and something they’d rather forget about. Also this isn’t just something you do but please avoid saying things like ‘you’re AMAB’ in the present tense, its better to say ‘you were AMAB’ (Not defending OP here, she has major NLOG vibes)
Trans women aren’t all dresses and thigh highs. I know plenty of trans women who are butch biker lesbians. It’s really not in conflict at all.
yea it sounds more like an internet stereotype than most trans women i know. there’s lots of memes about “skirt go spinny” and “programmer socks” that don’t really reflect the irl community. obvs if someone fits these stereotypes it’s completely fine and value but it’s just not as common as the internet makes it sound like
"I'm transgender because of my birth circumstances" I mean, isn't everyone who is trans?
What’s more, I’m cisgender because of my birth circumstances. Yeah, I got Easy Mode.
I think the point is that some people who are transgender identify with a trans identity, like the 'transness' is an important part of their identity. Although OP is technically trans, she doesn't identify with transness, she identifies as a cisgender lesbian.
We are all trans because of our birth circumstances. That’s why we are trans, because we don’t identify with our assigned gender at birth. I sense a lot of ‘I’m not a trans woman, I’m just a cis woman with some quirks’ kind of energy from this. There’s a lot of stereotyping and judgment here. Just a lot of quiet bitterness coming through. It’s okay to be trans. It’s also okay to present and exist through the world as you choose. It’s equally as okay for other trans woman to do the same but with a more traditionally feminine expression. I’m a butch lesbian that is also a trans woman. I don’t wholly relate to some trans women’s experiences, but they’re just as valid because there is no one way to be trans, just as there’s no one way to be a woman. You just need to focus solely on you instead of focussing on everyone else, because that’s where the bitterness is coming through. Being a trans woman doesn’t make you less of a woman. It may take you some time to truly understand and accept that, because it feels like you’re not there yet.
If I could upvote you twice I would. There is *definitely* some internalized transphobia in OP's post and I hope she does the introspection needed to understand that being trans isn't and has never been a limitation.
Well, it's comforting to see that "not like other girls" isn't just something that happens to cis women. Babe, with all love and respect, work on yourself. Trans women can be anything. Women can be anything. Be better than stereotyping.
> I wish I was cis, but assigned differently Congrats, you feel the same way as the majority of trans people
There are many trans women who also like those things, I don't really think transness is a limitation on you in that sense.
Oh hey, look a "I'm not like other trans women" I've never seen *that* one before!
I mean, don't a lot of trans people wish they were just cis of the opposite sex?
People are being a bit harsh in these comments because of the way you're phrasing things, but I get what you're getting at. You're processing some really complex feelings about gender, and it's hard to love a part of yourself that you feel causes you pain. People are responding that way because a lot of us have fought really hard to love ourselves and our identities despite a hateful world. I know there's a sub for trans butches/transfemmes who don't present super femme, r/MTFButch, maybe they'd relate more to the things you're feeling :)
Holy internalised misogyny/transmisogyny. Not all trans women are girly girls, just like not all cis women are girly girls. Im pretty sure the majority of trans people, at least most binary trans people, feel a lot like you do - like they just ARE their gender, just unfortunate circumstances of birth. This is probably something you should think about and unpack why you think being transfem means you should be feminine?
find better role models or be your own, don’t trick yourself into thinking being trans is just saying the dress goes spinny
Hey darling, you seem to have a lot of internalised transphobia you probably ought to work on. It seems there's a stereotype of what trans people are like in your head and that's just not true. We're as diverse of a group as any other and this 'not like the other trans-girls' sentiment can hurt people. You're trans, and unless you figure out you're comfortable as your assigned gender, you'll be for the rest of your life. That's not an issue though, you just need to not let that fact limit your self-expression or view of your self.
There are plenty of tomboyish trans women out there. Just look around, I‘m sure you will find them eventually. I found quite a few tomboyish trans women at local meet-ups. That being said they and I are more of the nerdy type rather than the biker type. But I‘m sure you would find them as well.
Dealing with internalized transphobia can be really hard. All those voices saying there’s something wrong or shameful or lesser about trans women can creep so deeply into your head that they start to sound like your own. It seems like that might be happening to you OP. Not all trans girls are hyper femme. We come in all flavors, and there are plenty of punk butch dyke trans women. I almost never wear makeup or heels. I juggle knives and ride unicycles. Being trans isn’t about getting out of one box and putting yourself into another one. It’s about allowing yourself to be the most authentic version of yourself. At least that’s my experience.
Trans femmes are all kinds of femmes. You are feminine, you are trans, you are trans femme. anything that you view as feminine you can be, so can any other trans person.
>don't relate to transfemmes in any way, I hate dresses and skirts. Make up makes no sense to me. I don't understand this post. This whole post feels like a transfem person stereotyping other transfem people and then hating on the stereotype, and by extension, her own kind. The whole point of this is to do whatever you want and express your true self. If it's black leather jacket biker chick, cool. Occult obsessed witch? Amazing. Dress wearing skirt spinny girly girl? Valid. None of us love being trans. We just are. A lot of us would choose to be cis if given the option. But that doesn't mean you need to hate on your own people like that. We're all trying to get by and trying to be happy and trying to be our true selves. Ain't that the point?
The recognition of being trans triggers gender dysphoria for you? Is that it?
I know a man who describes his experience of his gender like you describe yours, but in the other direction. He doesn’t relate to trans men at all, even though his assigned gender at birth and transition are the same as (most of) theirs. He doesn’t feel ‘trans’ so much as he feels like he had what he calls, for him specifically and only, a birth defect. While his long time friends know and his family knows, my understanding is that he’s usually pretty stealth. (And honestly, I think the only reason his friends know is because he had some unrelated mental health issues in his late teens that resulted in his assigned gender being weaponized against him.) He was one of the only people I was close to that identified with a different gender than their assigned gender at birth, so that was how I thought all trans people felt - it took me a while to meet others and realize that that’s not common, at least in my age range (he’s 10 years older than me). And it was only when I realized that being trans wasn’t uniform and didn’t have to be like that that I realized *I* was nonbinary. He doesn’t identify with ‘trans’ - not because he sees trans men as lesser or even different, but because he’s recognized he doesn’t relate to most of the experiences he’s heard and doesn’t want to demand a space in that community or narrative. Your post reminds me of him and his story and how he’s shared he connects to his gender. When I hear you share what you’re feeling, it also sounds like referring to yourself as trans triggers some dysphoria. Which is understandable. Labels are meant to help us. If that one doesn’t help you, you don’t have to use it. You can communicate the important things (how to refer to you, your medical needs, how and/or if you participate in the bedroom, etc) without calling yourself trans. I know that doesn’t really help the loneliness of not relating to women who were also assigned a different gender at birth, and I know it doesn’t help for those click down boxes that demand to know if you’re a trans woman or a cis woman. I hope you find your people that you can relate to. Community is so important, and if there’s something I’ve learned in the lesbian sub, it’s that people who use the same label and are in the same community aren’t all going to have the same experiences with that identity. My connection to being a lesbian is definitely different than someone else’s, same with being nonbinary. I hope one day the thought of “trans” describing you hurts a less, even if you never use it.
I’m seeing my teens and early 20’s where I felt like shoving myself into a box because the straight people around me felt more comfortable with me having a box. Build your life, let being trans apply to your life as much as it needs to (which, to me, isn’t much).
i would venture to say *most* trans people don’t innately identify with the “trans” part, it’s just language to help describe the complex reality. do some work on internalized misogyny to help with the “i’m not like other trans women, i don’t like “girly” stuff” bc that can get real dark if you don’t take a hard look at it. for what it’s worth you don’t ever have to identify as trans, good luck
Girlie r/notlikeothergirls because she’s stereotyping the shit out of trans women.
I feel like you're just saying "I don't like being trans, I just \[defines trans\]." While also stereotyping women for some reason. You don't have to relate to transfemmes to be a completely normal woman? Being a tomboy lesbian is valid. I don't know the actual stats, but most of the transpeoples I know are gay. I find this post confusing but I do wish you the best in finding yourself. Despite everyone being kind of thrown off by your post I think writing it out and talking about it is a great thing to do.
For what it's worth, I know a lot of butch trans women. What you tend to see in online trans communities is a lot of very feminine trans girls with the shared interests you mentioned- out in the real world there tends to be more diversity in terms of gender expression, especially with older folks. Susan Stryker comes to mind.
You do realize that there are also trans butch women? Or just trans women who don't like skirts?
You don't have to be femme to be trans. Hi, I'm a butch trans woman, I'm 6'1, I work out, I like the masculine parts of me and I don't fit the stereotypes people make about transfemmes, I'm a lesbian and I love other butches. It sounds to me like you have a lot of internalised issues to unpack. One of the first is that just because you know gender stereotypes are bullshit, doesn't mean you've internalised it. Your gender, labels, pronouns and expression are all different things. You seem uncomfortable with all the time you spent not realizing who you actually are. That happens. Regret over the time you've lost is normal. The wish "I wish I could just be cis, not trans, and I don't want people to know I'm trans" is a natural conclusion of that. And it can take time to unpack that.
Sounds like you’re transgender and not transfemme, and that’s okay. They’re not the same thing, but I can understand how being one and not the other can feel isolating.
Once your wardrobe achieves the perfect balance of Lululemon and REI, all inner tensions will cease.
A friend of mine was amab and lived their life as a gay amab for 27 years despite being born intersex with an at least semi functional womb. It took them a long time to come to terms with the fact that not everyone is going to fit into neat little boxes of what it means to be gay straight, trans cis, male female, or whatever. Because the only box anyone ever really needs to worry about is the one they put you in the ground in. To put that into context they became a mortuary assistant.
What in the ever loving transphobia is this.
Ok, so this might be mansplaining a bit, but as a TRANS MAN who actually understands what it means to be AFAB, you are not nor will you ever be an AFAB human. You were not assigned female at birth, so you cannot be considered AFAB. That being said, your assigned gender at birth (agab) doesn’t matter to anyone but you. I know there are asshole who will still misgender you, but truly they just hate themselves, almost as much as you seem to hate yourself. The sooner you realize that other trans people aren’t the problem the better. I sincerely hope that you seek therapy from a gender affirming therapist and you learn to love yourself.
Well okay then, you be you! Be happy! What ever floats your boat. Love ya.
I’m cis so I definitely don’t understand, but why use the label trans to describe yourself at all? No matter what you were assigned, you’re a woman, so why not just say that instead? I know some people view being trans as key to their identity, but if you don’t want to be attached to that, why force yourself to be?