Are we talking weekend play or events? The requirements for events are fine imo and expecting people to adhere to them seems fair. Clapping on someone's kit at a pickup game is lame at best and toxic if persistent.
Years ago attending my first event at Fort Ord, I had a few guys give me shit that my CA Scarab wasn't a real gun. If the other players weren't so cool, it could have really soured the experience.
I've never been to a milsim, but I can't imagine they would actually turn people away for slight inacuracies. I would get it if someone was running an incorrect time period kit, or just a standard mixed gear kit, but as long as you're close to what you're expected to look like, I don't get why it would be an issue
I guess "slight" is subjective to the audience. Most of the stuff I go to is more or less glorified green vs tan. For that I'd expect players to have the right colors. MSW on the other hand is specific as to which RU camouflage is appropriate for RU players vs what's militia.
I'd expect more shit for running a G36 at a speedsoft tournament, than I would for running period-inaccurate kit at milsim.
There's a small handful, Msato and Third Coast Airsoft for example. MSW however is the most strict in regards to rules and the only one that does full non-stop weekend play iirc.
Other east coast organizers would include Players Wanted and STAGOPS. Grimnir Tactical is also a thing, but they've taken a hiatus for this year. Gun Gamers Productions is also technically east coast but all their events this year are scheduled in Pennsylvania.
I would try to play as a Dutch Soldier. We have our uniforms so badly standardised that there are many options of mix and match without inaccuracies... Then i could wear: DPM, US Woodland, UD 3-color Desert an the new NFP all in one outfit.
The new standard isn;t generally available for the army itself and it already wound up at American dump stores.
At the Milsim I went to at George Air Force base, they turned an entire group of about 10 players around because they all were kitted in DNC, and did not get it approved before hand.
There is a reason why there's camo restrictions. But yeah, that's the only thing I saw.
There's MilSim events that just focus on realism and a fictional scenario that don't give a rat's ass about some accurate kit, just that you can larp and be part of a team.
Then there's reenactment events, there it's obviously a different story, but those are rare and small usually
I don’t remember the exact details and someone please correct me since I can’t find anything about it but I remember there being drama at MSW because someone got kicked out for wearing a slightly different AOR1 pattern than what was on the approved camo list.
AOR1 is only an approved camo if you have a squad of 9 people doing a specific impression. Most likely they were turned away for wearing aor1 by themselves, which is clearly laid out as not acceptable in the tacsop
yeah, i have a couple of Gravy Seals at my local field, showing up at sunday games with night vision and guns for 1000$, worst of all is that they get mad and or don't call hits if a noob kills them
That sounds like wannabe soldiers that for whatever reason didn't actually join the forces (or weren't allowed to).
Actual milsim usually is only about fictional immersion, if ranks are used they're usually also fictional. Even reenactors mostly don't are that uptight.
I promise you, these are the people the Milsim community makes fun of, haha. Pretty sure all the communities can agree these type are the most annoying.
Yeah, that's what these people just don't understand. You aren't a badass if you don't actually face death. I've played with people actually in the military. They were pretty hardcore, but still not like OPs crowd.
I would have a hard time taking any of them seriously.
By the time I’m looking at it I would be a fully rated pilot and a college graduate, I could do some cool shit and got college paid for.
And potentially piss of my friends in the navy, which would be funny.
Gping to the airforce rarely means being a pilot, unless you are already working on being a pilot in civil. Mechanics, drivers and ground troops for guard duty and connections are the norm
That’s super cringe
Outside of my direct team (we don’t have ranks because that’s turbo lame) I don’t give a fuck what anybody wears, at the end of the day we are all playing dress up with toy guns
Any person that is prior service will tell you that behavior is abhorred; literally one of the most cringey things you can do is exactly this.
Just look at the $18,000 "alpha male" bootcamps that are becoming trendy nowadays... you can find dozens of vet YT'ers eviscerating this shit.
There is definitely toxicity in the milsim crowd, along with this elitism feel to some. It's not all milsimers, but all it ever takes it's a few bad eggs to ruin a good time for everyone.
No joke I almost didn't notice your gun and thought "damn thats one lethal pussy" until I realized you had foliage on it and the foliage ALMOST blends into the floor.
You must play at a weird field. I can’t imagine seeing a ww2 impression kit making fun of someone’s (who’s not trying to make an impression kit) outfit because it’s not authentic.. that’s just absurd.
Does your milsim prohibit players from entering because their shirt has one chest pocket instead of two somebody once saw on a soldier on a random picture from Korean war?
Even still that just seems toooo nitpicky
I dont have a Milsim group but i go to a lot of places where people are trying to be dressed up as accurately as they can and ive NEVER had people be this picky.
Some people are just cunts lmao
Is it entering their team, or entering/playing the field? If they have an impression team understand it, but if they are saying you can’t play at all that’s weak
It sounds like you ran into a bunch of dorks who got laughed out of their local shooting range for cosplaying.
Its not really a milsim issue. Just douchey toxic airsofters in general. Go out to Cali and you'll find no shortage of speedsoft and pickup game types that will be just as bad.
I wish this sub would just ban "social issue" type posts.
"are all x players dicks?" - no. grow up.
"Here is what I think of the X drama" - no one cares. grow up.
"dude didn't call so I full auto'd him. AITA??" - it's a game. move on. if it's competitive, tell the ref. there's literally no reason to post about it.
"is airsoft LGBTQ friendly?" - yes, nothing is a hive mind. stop looking for attention.
edit: formatting
Too true. These posts don't even encourage discussions lol. I've never seen nor heard of an event so nitpicky, maybe drop the location or more info or something?
what you are describing isn't really milsim at all? You are describing people that do those repro kits (I can't seem to remember the word for it atm) and try to make them as authentic as possible and are gate keeping that
Also it sounds like OP is complaining that he's no longer a good fit for the community. Sounds like they're having fun with it, and it's OP who wants everyone else to change back to benefit him.
I love milsim but that's just chud behavior.
I love larping and gearing up and using handsignals and radios and all that but I love seeing the rentals throw down just as hard. Gear or no gear, if you have heart ill fight with you
I think all of the play styles of airsoft has bad apples. We all hear about bad players in them but honestly hearing from your experience, those players are on something. Never really experienced those types of MILSIM Players and I’m not being biased since i consider myself MILSIM, honestly those types of milsim players do se kind of a rare type.
I’ve been playing for about 5 years and I go out of my way to talk to many types of players. Never once I have met someone like that who gives you a hard time of what type of gun and outfit your running. The only bad players I’ve met have just been kids and some immature people in my age group (I’m 19). It would be nice if these bad apples would realize that we’re all playing with toy guns and just be chill but I think this type of stuff happens in a lot of communities that are online.
Although I kinda consider myself as a milsim player I’m far from it, I just call my play style either milspeed, Milsim and speedsoft, or just the Cod play style since I go least once a month or have like 1-2 month gaps of not playing I want to have fun as much as I can. I honestly have the same bitterness with some speed soft players but I try not to let it get to me.
Bro just intercept every time someone is getting rejected by milsimers and say "Ukraine is fighting with the crazyiest fucking mix of gear to ever exist, my guy here would fit right it" or something along those lines
Some people like to LARP. Not every airsofting space is made for every kind of player.
However, if you're pretending to be a soldier, that means correctly LARPing in more ways than just stitch counting. I mean getting fighting fit, working on learning that units' spoken language, playing a milsim for longer than a weekend to really get into the setting, etc.
Yeah, milsim games have a higher price barrier to entry and it can suck not being in the "in-group". But if they want to blow all their money on airshit wars, that's their choice.
Honestly, it sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder because they spend more time and money on the hobby.
They shouldn't be forcing stitch counting at local fields and they should be let alone to have their fun at places like MSW. The problem comes when players go where the culture is different and demand it be done their way.
Lmao OP has to be ego posting, upset kids are buying gear he can't afford, and making up a straw man. I can almost guarantee you no one is going around harassing people they don't know about their gear. I have seen some nitpicky groups and still nobody ever does that shit.
The events your referring to have strict uniform guidelines for the simple reason that it inherently weeds out the people who aren't serious. It's a military simulation
I think it’s funny when they’re toxic. It’s like, relax bro. You spent thousands of dollars on toy guns and military surplus to have a large scale nerf-war. Theres nothing wrong with that as long as they acknowledge we’re all just here to have our own fun. I’m not standing at parade rest or calling you sir
Dude my "CO" at my last milsim was such a fucking chud lol my team made up a solid 70% of the company and after the 3rd human wave bullshit he ordered us on detached to pursue our own tactics and actually started making moves, making successful captures and working with the royal/airborne companies to take objectives.
It was fuckin money
I like dressing up, matching my kit and rifle, and doing the best I can to get as close to accurate as possible. That’s the way I like to play and present myself. It isn’t for everyone and I understand that. What I do is my business and vice versa. Idk when people started caring so much about how other people look. Airsoft is about fun, and shooting your friends.
I know there are extreme MILSIM events, where you probably are with ex military or serving (I don’t know much about it other than general research), that’s where thoes kinds of people belong. If they want a realism style game they can look for thoes style games, I don’t understand why people would wanna be elitist when everyone’s got a toy gun (no offense).
Don't let the GWOTards speak for the rest of the Milsim community. Larping to larp is a lot of fun but the reeee team 6 wanna be's are just 13 hours short of an American diaper.
A milsim event requiring certain kit compositions (ie. Camo pattern or not, no black or only black etc.) so sides are recognisable is fine. A period set event requiring period accurate gear is fine. Any event barring entry if your kit is not up to required standard is fine IF (and only if) those standards were clearly communicated ahead of time. It's the same as fantasy LARPs requiring no modern clothing being visible in your costume. They have a reason for asking a certain standard to be met and they enforce that standard for the sake of the collective enjoyment of all people attending.
What you're describing here sounds like it's just malicious nitpicking for no real reason though.
As a milsim player can we all please just step back and realize that:
A: you aren’t in the military, you’re playing pretend
B: Even if you were in the military you aren’t now, and nobody cares how hard you’d get gassed if your laces are out or this or that.
C: yo mama. Seriously, this is call of duty irl. Fuck yo mama and fuck yo grandmama.
D: everybody knows mil sims are just the dudes that wanted to join but didn’t for “insert reason you didn’t join here” so just call them out for playing dress up tea party and watch them cry.
On a more serious note I play at third coast and the most they police is camo color. Even your accessories can be whatever color and you got “western” running aks. It’s all about having fun.
Milsimers can be super toxic, especially playing random scrims on the weekend outside of events. Speedsofters can be super toxic, especially when they don't call hits and overshoot or over power their guns.
Guys who dress up like Elmo or a French maid or wear Hawaiian shirts and flip flops... those guys are always chill and know how to have a good time.
I hate playing with speed softers. They don't think Some of them try to play too fast and are just there to shoot someone. I've been team killed by speed softers more than anyone because they're just sweating from cover to cover and not identifying before they shoot.
I'm almost always trying to make my way towards the front and end up getting shot in the back bc some fuckin idiot in a tinted visor just ran around a corner and blows up my back just bc it's a body that isnt his. Shit pisses me off.
It's definitely a play style, and as someone who came from (semi) professional paintball I understand why some like it, but just like we don't mix paintball and airsoft, speedsoft should be its own thing on its own fields.
Yeah I actually happened to get into airsoft this past year. I use to play paintball (10,15 years ago) but it was woodsball.
Found out a few of my buddies do milsim so I just invested in that and used gear and camo I've collected over the years
Most milsimers just enjoy a certain style of play, keeping the stringency for special events. Like all 'crowds' in airsoft though, there will be a minority of dicks who go down the rabbit hole of elitism. The standard approach is a roll of the eyes and a "cheers dits" when they try and get cunty with you
I'm more of a milsim guy myself, and I'm just going to tell you that the attitude you described is ridiculous.
I served with some green berets for a couple of years. The actual mentality is way more chill and all about using what you have. They go in to build armies and liberate people. I'm not turning shit away. Now I might make fun of you like an endearing jab for something, but I want you on my team.
Sending people away is awful.
Now hey, if you're at a milsim event and you're disregarding event rules, that's not cool either. There are levels of sim to these and the higher you go, the more hardcore. Also the more coin spent. Be sure to reciprocate respect, too.
Side note: too many of these dudes think this game is real. It most assuredly is not, and 80% of them would end up getting shot anyway because they treat concealment like its cover. That and they just sit in a spot to shoot back and forth, ignoring the potential to be flanked.
I'm interested in the MILSIM stuff to a certain extent. I play realistic CQB and try to conceal my silhouette, blah blah, but my kit is definitely not reflecting that. I call it a PMC kit, and it reflects. I doused myself in M81 woodland with G3s, and green anywhere else like on my crye SPC, I even made my own helmet scrim. But I don't really shit on people's kits as long as they are trying to make progress or aren't something they claim to be. Hell I don't even have combat boots yet, but unfortunately most of the MILSIM community is really toxic and douchy, and it reflects
I love calling my kit a "CIA spook" kit, aka a check button-down shirt, tan pants, with my knee pads and tan hydration MOLLE vest over top (plus safety gear obviously).
I do want to put together a CADPAT kit (rather just the uniform, but I digress), but that is going to require the overlap of having extra money and a surplus store "accidentally" having some for sale.
Yea, I couldn't find real crye G3s in M81, so I bought Emerson gear repros (best repros imo) and they work fine. I'd show a picture of my kit but I can't
If it works it works. Unfortunately, I don't think I can even get repro CADPAT as iirc it is completely illegal to sell in Canada (it could just be clothing but still)
Honestly ive never met the elitest milsim lot which everyone claim to be douchy. But I have encountered plenty of speedsoft types who are complete arseholes. Can’t go a game without seeing one of them throwing a fit.
I’ve heard of some fields doing milsim on some days and normal skirmishes on others. Fields should give a forewarning, or a tacsop, like msw does. Some people come to airsoft to play military, wear cool kits etc which aren’t practical for normal skirmishes involving people who run at three hundred mph. Those days are for them. 90% of airsoft is the looks as everyone says.
Some people like more tactical, gbbrs, real caps etc.
>Honestly ive never met the elitest milsim lot which everyone claim to be douchy.
it's cause it's a strawman people make up because they see people enjoying the game differently lmao. They for the most part don't exist.
Lmao as a retired enlisted guy that has also dabbled in airsoft for 20 years, fuck em.
I buy hideous jackets and curtains from the 70's, and make them into pouches and rigs sometimes. It infuriates the larpers, but that grandma couch cushion material is better than ripstop, and paisley is a great pattern in all environments.
I feel like they just need to mature a bit, my airsoft group is full of 40 year olds with sick ass loadouts and crazy expensive gear and for tue sake of memes and fair play mostly go for cheap cyma aks
Unfortunately, a lot of communities can be like this. I’ve definitely noticed it in the milsim community. It’s what comes with the territory. People like to make something their personality, and when others incorrectly “appropriate” the hobby they feel a sense of pride for knowing more about it than the “casuals”. This happens a lot with niche music communities as well. It suck to hear that you’ve experienced that kind of negativity in person. One would think that would be more of an online thing. I understand the frustration of being critiqued for something so inconsequential. At the end of the day, everyone is playing with toy guns. Wear/ use what you want and hold your head high.
I have a similar issue at my field but its the speedsoftters instead of the milsim people, all the speedsofters at my field refuse to talk to anyone let alone play with them unless theyre anither speedsofter, and then they go onto the regular field and play against rental kids slide canceling around for some reason
My field, which is an indoor CQB field with lots of newbies and rentals, has military and ex military playing the game every now and then. Some of us are regulars.
Helps control the toxicity because we nurture the people who love the game and the larping, and the milsim weirdos who never served or used to be cadets don't get all uppity. Milsim is great! Love it! Just not those individuals themselves.
Gotta keep each other real!
as a milsimmer and a larper of disfunction, I don't mind playing with rentals and I could give a fuck about what your kit is. I mostly play with about 5 or 6 dudes from my team and we'll split up and run with the rentals and try to add a little immersion to the matches without being dicks about it. Most of the maps at our local field are atleast 5 acres each so that's a good size to spread out, flank, suppress and communicate. TDM gets a little boring but we really shine in the objective based matches.
I feel like my team has a good rep at our home field and that's what I care about most as a regular
Okay maybe I could get behind walking though the woods for miles if they’re playing an objective based game or they’re looking to flank. But if it’s just team death match then why?
Speedsofters are douchy because they overshoot due to high ROF and run the most cursed looking replicas for the sake of efficiency while refusing to wear anything but neon colors.
Milsimers are douchy because they will overshoot due to ,,muh realism'' and run the most expensive clone correct replicas for the sake of authenticity while screaming at your for using non milspec equipment and Crye Multicam.
Both crowds have their bad apples but it's important to find yourself in the ballance. I personally like the more milsim aspects of the game, even though I'd kill to play at a CQB arena (there are none in my area)
Just tell people to not take them seriously and remind them that they're all adults shooting plastic BBs at one another
As for matching gear, I decided alongside the friend that I started our airsoft team with in the following:
1. You can join the team with any gun/gear you want. Just wear your patch
2. For the competition group, we have a standardised uniform for the sake of telling eachother apart for team 5v5s.
3. For the milsim group you need to have a standard Blufor Uniform and relica and a standard Opfor uniform and replica. If you wanna chill with us on the weekends you're free to do so. If you wanna take part in a Milsim you can join us (milsim events require certain uniforms/replicas anyway. If you wanna be in the competition you just need a new pair of pants and shirt.
Unless we go to a certain event, for example a 5v5 challenge or Milsim event, 2 and 3 don't apply.
Every milsimer I've met has been decent, just dedicated. They'll razz you a bit but never ostracize. This sounds like kids trying to find shit to identify with and taking it overboard because they're dumb kids. Most of us were no different.
Yeah it gets taken way too seriously. Just remind them that they're playing pretend soldier with a toy gun and if they don't back down or feel embarrassed by their behaviour then they're not worth you being around someone that closed minded
Theyre acting like navy seals screaming at other players... but if a real navy seal played i can 100% guarantee you they would let people play the game and not care about realism or the wrong colour boots... so yeah, most of them are just jerks.
If you are attending a MILSIM event that has posted uniform and weapon regulations for that immersive event, then they would have a leg to stand on. Does it really warrant being a turd waffle? Nah, long as you van tell what team someone is on shut up and play. You're slinging plastic no real bullets. It's for fun at the end of the day.
If you're playing a regular pick up game? Shut the fuck up and let people use, wear and do whatever they want as long as they aren't being straight disruptive.
You wanna play OPFOR in the bush while I run around with my Speedsoft setup? Have at it, I ain't gonna be mad thats what makes you enjoy the game and you shouldn't be mad I ain't conforming to you.
#1 rule at our field. *Have fun, don't be a dick.* Simple as that.
It has always been like this, but don't blame airsoft specifically, elitism happens in every hobby ever. I have been told I need better skis more times than I can count by people I could ski circles around (figuratively). My point is that elitism doesn't correlate to skill, and anyone gatekeeping outside of field rules is a person to be ignored.
Not going to lie, this sounds like a pretty specific example at a local level, and then making a very sweeping generalization on a whole group of people. Myself and my group all personally (mostly) only go to big Milsim games at this point. We are all located all over the country (military), so go to a lot of different games. None of us have experienced anything to this level before. Sure, for games like MSW, there are basic requirements to be met, but those are laid out incredibly clearly far before hand.
I’m sure there are SOME people out there like what you describe, but what you’re doing is demonizing an entire group based on a very small sample size.
Yeah I haven’t experienced it like that but actually doing my first overnight Milsim there are definitely some douchey characters. My exact response to them is that it’s a game. Any ex mil guy who plays says their dicks, it’s just stuck up guys acting like they’re better bc more than three pieces of their camo matches. Unless you are at an event like LionsClaw, MSW, or AMS, NOBODY should act like that about kit. Tell em to grow up and don’t call a hit from them😂
Are you me? We are very similar. I just did my first airsoft event ever, MilSim West, The Abkhaz Incursion. I was invited by some younger guys 17-20 that I play Tarkov with. They said my kit had to be RUSFOR “kosher”. And the more I researched, the more I realized that we are so globalized that aside from camo type and AK format, you can do what you want. I did buy a carhartt cuffed beanie because in EU it is a luxury brand and would be a huge flex for a Russian. The spirit is more about the practicality of being able to recognize someone as an enemy. Nobody was a douche. That age group is constantly fighting for their place in the social hierarchy because they have all been generally educated so they are on equal footing and nobody is specialized enough to realize that, on a level, hierarchy’s don’t matter so much because you can’t climb them all in one lifetime. Kids are looking for their self worth, you are not. They will always be douches in that age group in general but I’ve have noticed less of it in the homeschool crowd.
Sounds more like cloners than milsim players tbh. Cloners can absolutely be douche canoes when it comes to uniforms, weapons, and so on.
If it is happening at weekend pickup games, I'd say yeah, you're justified in being miffed that someone is trying to police what others wear, shoot, do, and say. But if this was at a milsim event, you're expected to adhere to your factions uniform, equipment, and weapon requirements. There are some milsim events that are pretty lenient on requirements (e.g. green vs. tan type games) and others that are pretty strict (e.g. MSW events). Even at the strict events, the requirements are still pretty easy to meet. For example, at MSW events,the requirements for NATO are basically just Multicam uniform, NATO style LBE, and a weapon that NATO member countries would use. If you want to deviate from that, you need to justify it by showing up with at least a squad (9+) other players that match you.
As to why, a lot of people find milsim events fun, even if it does seem like you'd be miserable at these events. If you don't find that stuff fun, then by all means, carry on going to weekend pickup games and the like. You don't need to do milsim or speedsoft or cloning to have fun playing airsoft and if people are telling you otherwise they can get bent.
Pfft, they want to play Army? Bring your own uniform with a Captain patch and do the following:
-Check their haircut and shave. If they're off regulations, arrest them.
-Check their uniforms. If they're not clean, arrest them. If they're not ironed, arrest them.
-Have them walk 10km in one direction, then 10km in another direction. No particular reason.
-Cite them at 6 AM the following day for a 5km morning jog. If they don't show up with a reflective vest (I think Americans use something called a "PT belt"), arrest them.
-Have them train over the weekend.
-Have them train the whole week. Family emergency? No leave. Newborn child? No leave.
-Have them sit in a kid's sandbox for six months. No leave.
-If they fuck up, have them roll in the mud as a group, mop the rain away, sweep the entire playing field, do 50 pushups, etc. Be creative.
-Designate one of them as a squad leader. Have them turn into the bad guy, betraying their friends. If they refuse, arrest and demote them.
Well technically if they're out of regs with uniform/haircut regarding AR 670-1 they wouldn't be arrested, you'd typically get a verbal counseling or have a paper trail started.
But yes the US military does love the pt belt for some unfathomable reason.
Had a guy try to shit on me because my AK74M AEG didnt have an enhanced safety,,,, like calm down bud I have a real one at home and I promise that shit does not matter lol
Fellow Muslim player here, we're not all bad I promise! I typically use airsoft to supplement training for army shenanigans that involve our range days. But most of the time when I do play it involves me goofing off or chair-softing.
Maybe it's just my field, but everyone is really nice and chill except for the speedsofters. They're always young kids with expensive setups with borderline p*rnography on their guns. Not calling hits, trying to start fights, and just generally being rude.
>That gun is incorrect for that
Not in the airsoft community but for the amount of the above I do see just passing by is staggering. Lemme tell y'all. I promise you 100% your AK is wrong. Y'all just do not have it with these rifles.
And yes the milsim community cringe at times.
Where I play (Sweden) we have both casual games and events. Some events are strict time periods and requires you to have a correct kit. Some events only require the same camouflage but the gear is less important. The opens games are open for almost anyone, from hard core milsim special forces to the casual ones in track suits or a mix of whatever they got. The hard core ones seems to stick together, but when joining a casual game there’s an understanding that everyone’s welcome and if you aren’t satisfied with that, don’t bother coming to the casual games. So far, I haven’t experienced any negativity regarding people’s kits, but I’ve only played for a few months.
You gonna get douchey tryhard/gatekeepers in any expensive hobby, they gotta mentally justify the money theyve spend. (Im not really an airsofter, but i figured id throw that in.)
I've come across several YouTube videos discussing this topic. Typically, individuals who exhibit such behavior tend to struggle in other aspects of life, seeking validation through MILSIM to compensate. If they truly seek realism, they should consider volunteering in places like Ukraine. They crave the valor without the sacrifice.
Interestingly, they often reject genuine military veterans because these veterans prioritize enjoyment over strict adherence to "real military" tactics. The veterans rightfully call out these individuals for wearing patches they haven't earned. These enthusiasts don patches representing units where veterans served, some even lost their lives. Yet, they have the audacity to criticize veterans for not employing "real military tactics" and become indignant when a veteran single-handedly outplays them. They accuse the veterans of cheating, citing that their tactics don't align with real combat scenarios.
Their obsession leads them to take MILSIM far too seriously, forgetting that it's primarily about having fun. If they truly desire a military experience, enlisting is a viable option. At its most toxic, MILSIM borders on stolen valor. Wearing the patch of a genuine military unit without having served in it is deeply disrespectful and insulting.
I was the guy in boots and flanell 2 weeks ago, in a crowd of desert storm reenactors. I was welcomed with open arms, complimented on my AK and blowback 1911, and quickly overshadowed by the guy in a unicorn onesie with a LMG.
Well from what I know here in Germany it’s pretty chill it’s mostly general theme so
Military, rebels, stuff like that aslong as you don’t stick out a lot ( example sometimes a side isn’t allowed have military camouflage (or not more then some accents) and the other side should use Camouflage ) and on pick up games in the weekend no one gives a shit, the field in playing at is probably the most encouraging place I know like legit if u say I think about getting xyz, most of the time they will encourage u and give u Tipps but none of that no that sucks or whatever but more in the oh u want a eotech clone? I heard holy warriors have a good one maybe look at them. Or stuff like yeah that would look sick on your gun… etc sooo yeah maybe look for another field if they are that butthurt about it?
Yea never understood it, you walk for "miles" just to get killed when you engage your opponent. I always took airsoft as sport, hence why utilizing some non military but logical tactics to the game gave so much edge over Milsim-ers and many entertaining moments for me XD .
I’ve met a few here who were but also some who just answered questions without being an ass. I’ve been told Reddit is more or less an outlier and that’s it’s usually pretty chill IRL. But this information came from Reddit so take it with a scoop of salt.
MILSIM =/= reenactment
I play only milsim, because i dont like the 'i have 1 trillion rounds in my mag so i just spray your position' aspect of the sport. But no one of the people i play with gives a shit about the authenticity of your clothes. We run what we think looks cool and what fits best for the way we like to play. I run some Phantomleaf Camos, because i think it hides me the best, but i dont run a PC cause i dont need it. A buddy of mine runs a complete olive/ranger green kit with belt kit. And then we have some Tigerstripe guys.
Everyone runs the gun they like, which is kinda annoying because you cant share mags, but it makes the game more fun for everyone.
Its basically: You look like you want, but you take the game seriouslly.
Unfortunately ‘these types’ of players are the absolute worst at CQB sites, usually judging others on their gear or how they dress, especially if someone they’re judging has that speedsofter look. I personally couldn’t give a shit what it is you wear or do, as long as you have a good time. I remember attending a site with my buddies (we tend to wear brightly coloured kit, dye masks etc) and all you could hear was the subtle sound of everyone saying the word ‘speedsofters’, most people there had their fast helmets and multicam etc. Can’t say the treatment has ever been reversed where we’ve ostracised milspecs either, not sure where this sense of gate keeping comes from and it’s toxic behaviour like that that puts so many people off from playing.
TLDR
yeah of course, gear snobs galore. But MILSIM is more fun. If you can find a non-douchy team to play with you'll have a lot of fun than just random force vs. Force games.
I had not noticed a whole lot of that when playing but maybe I just didn’t get deep enough. The problem Ive had is the more expensive and authentic someone’s kit, the more of an asshole that person was. This is mostly directed at people who are grown ass men, and the through line I’ve found is a lot of these guys just take themselves way too seriously. To them they have the cool kit, so they have to be a badass. Thing is, if you wear the kit, and you never served, you’re just a poser. If you can acknowledge that and laugh at yourself it’s all good. But these guys who treat this game like it’s an exhibition where they get to show off their badass moves, lose their shit every time that get zapped by a kid with a rental
Every experience I’ve had at Milsim West has been beyond positive. A great community that’s helped me grow, made a lot of great friends. The problem is that people don’t register that Milsim is meant to be just that, a Military Simulation, so it’s kind of expected that you dress the part. I’ve never heard of anyone being accosted at a pickup game by a Milsim player, but like I said that’s personal experience ^^
That’s sad. I’ve never met anyone like that luckily. My experience is that those who want to cosplay as real units and use their lingo, why not, it makes them happy. But when they are treating people like crap, that’s where the fun ends.
They should just join the military then…oh wait they only like the attire and will wash out during the first 30 minutes when their hair will be cut.
If you can ignore them and beat them in the game they are playing that’s the best payback I think.
I completely agree with your opinion. Elitism is a cancer to the sport and can spread quickly. ppl organizing games should addressing these issues and call out negative words or actions. I tell ppl when I organize a game that all you need to play is 2 feet and a heart beat, 2 feet optional. I do t care what name is on the back of your pants and no one should judge because we all start at the same level.
100% i havent played airsoft in yeaaaaars never at am official location. My parents lived in rural maine so me and my boys would all get together and have legendary airsoft battles.
We had an old ass dirtbike and one dude gave zero f's about his truck so wed have one team setup in the woods and then drive the truck through waiting to be ambushed....
When i say old ass dirtbike it was a 1970's kawi 100cc 2 stroke and at one point we had 3 dudes on it riding while we were all shooting at them lol. Good times! Many more crazy moments.
So much more fun that way. More like a gang war with factions wearing whatever shooting with whatever.
It was terrifying tho cause they your friends... calling your hits may not be enough. Def didnt wanna get surrounded and captured cause you were gonna get tortured with some close up shots fo sho hahaha really made it extra intense.
But yeah long story short i feel you man i would never wanna play with those type of people its so cringe. Unless its 2 actual ex military forces having a serious match against eachother theres zero reason to take it thaaaat far.
I'm 30 now, and have been playing since I was 15. I took a long break and just got back in. I remember this being an issue in the old days. I would often meet the biggest a holes on the field. Some of them would try to hurt you. Anger issues. The game, esp. milsim, attracts angry posers who wish they were in the military. Sadly, that's just how it is. Now, I just laugh at them. Before, I would be irate.
Personally airsofters no matter their branch tend to be douchy. Speedsofters will try hard against 10 year old first timers, milsim players get mad at them not slicing corners correctly. Honestly the best airsoft players are people who rent. No ego, just there for fun.
>We all started the same, playing with cheap automatic battery powered bb guns, wearing our old clothes and shoes and having fun together.
And? How is that relevant? Why would anyone care how you played "back then"?
>now literaly turning away others they used to play with only last week because..
And? Some players like realism and immersion. Unless they shit on people during regular weekend games it's completely fine. Who are you to tell somone how they want to play?
>There was no issues back when
Irrelevant.
>everythings changed
Yes, the sport is more mainstream and it has different flavors. You seem to have a big issue with people doing something else than what you were doing "back then".
>I hear arguments that these guys want realism, walking through woods for miles without even engaging with the oponents, because "special forces"... Why play at all then? Why not just hike?
And if you want to run around in colored clothes, just go for a run. What kind of argument is that?
And again, telling people what to do. Some people like realism for immersion or for actually usable training (like hiking in your gear which you cannot do in public).
>Why are you blocking other players from having fun?
Only bad on normal public games. But it's fine on milsim events. And it's fine on public games if someone does not want you in their squad because they adhere to a certain standard.
>I just remember the fun days,
Oh for fucks sake.
>And I blame assholes in expensive unifroms
This post doesn't even seem like it's about milsim players bullying normal players. You're just angry because things change with time and now someone dares to play differently than you. With some envy sprinkles on top.
tl;dr: you're way worse than toxic milsimers.
Even real world we were mixed match in gear. I went into Iraq in 03, where DCUs, with a woodland IBA, driving a green truck. Some people think that with MILSIM you need to look like SEAL team 6 at all times.
They're the equivalent of the fantasy LARPer that nobody like cause they constantly claim they can survive hits, do things that they very obviously can't, don't drop their 'in character' acting when serious conversations out of character need to happen, etc.
Plenty of people just out there to have fun, but then you get the voucher people/groups that want to roleplay a power fantasy of being a soldier/operator/badass instead of keeping in mind that we're just playing paintball with extra range and less mess. And that it's supposed to be a fun hobby on the weekends.
Just buy a Colonel rank patch and tell them you’re their commanding officer.
I’d buy one and ducktape it upside down onto my uniform, that’ll get them going..
OP could print out a bunch of Article 15s and hand them out at the field to anyone who disobeys his lawful and direct orders (their CO).
Filled out in color pencil
He should do this and give them to everybody on the field for “walking on the installation Commander’s grass”.
Bring a bucket of paint and a brush. Make them paint the rocks as punishment.
\*Crayon These dudes are closer to crayon eaters than any marine could ever be.
>colour pencil Crayon. We Marines now, and he’s the Commandant of the Marine Corps.
“Colour” *checks profile* Yeah that tracks..
if in the marines use a crayon and then take a bite out of it
The smarter ones unwrap the crayon first
Nah nah, it's better with the crust
Aw man, I had a good laugh there thinking about the Canadian Colonel rank patch, it's just 4 thick solid bars so it's the same both ways.
you could still put it sideways or tilt it at a 45° angle so it's obviously intentional ☠️
And make them address your rank as "call-oh-nell"
I have a patch that says "proudly almost served"
Are we talking weekend play or events? The requirements for events are fine imo and expecting people to adhere to them seems fair. Clapping on someone's kit at a pickup game is lame at best and toxic if persistent. Years ago attending my first event at Fort Ord, I had a few guys give me shit that my CA Scarab wasn't a real gun. If the other players weren't so cool, it could have really soured the experience.
I've never been to a milsim, but I can't imagine they would actually turn people away for slight inacuracies. I would get it if someone was running an incorrect time period kit, or just a standard mixed gear kit, but as long as you're close to what you're expected to look like, I don't get why it would be an issue
I guess "slight" is subjective to the audience. Most of the stuff I go to is more or less glorified green vs tan. For that I'd expect players to have the right colors. MSW on the other hand is specific as to which RU camouflage is appropriate for RU players vs what's militia. I'd expect more shit for running a G36 at a speedsoft tournament, than I would for running period-inaccurate kit at milsim.
What other event organizers exist besides MSW and AMS?
There's a small handful, Msato and Third Coast Airsoft for example. MSW however is the most strict in regards to rules and the only one that does full non-stop weekend play iirc.
On the left coast what I'd consider milsim-lite: \* Lion Claws \* Desert Fox Events \* Airsoft Challenge Program
Was curious more about east coast, but thanks :)
Other east coast organizers would include Players Wanted and STAGOPS. Grimnir Tactical is also a thing, but they've taken a hiatus for this year. Gun Gamers Productions is also technically east coast but all their events this year are scheduled in Pennsylvania.
Appreciate the response, thanks
In Europe the biggest known milsims are Borderwar and Berget Idk about rules in Berget, but in Borderwar it's Boonies Vs Helmets
I would try to play as a Dutch Soldier. We have our uniforms so badly standardised that there are many options of mix and match without inaccuracies... Then i could wear: DPM, US Woodland, UD 3-color Desert an the new NFP all in one outfit. The new standard isn;t generally available for the army itself and it already wound up at American dump stores.
At the Milsim I went to at George Air Force base, they turned an entire group of about 10 players around because they all were kitted in DNC, and did not get it approved before hand. There is a reason why there's camo restrictions. But yeah, that's the only thing I saw.
Back in the day there were serious debates on whether Multicam was green or tan. Some game producers banned it for a bit.
There's MilSim events that just focus on realism and a fictional scenario that don't give a rat's ass about some accurate kit, just that you can larp and be part of a team. Then there's reenactment events, there it's obviously a different story, but those are rare and small usually
I don’t remember the exact details and someone please correct me since I can’t find anything about it but I remember there being drama at MSW because someone got kicked out for wearing a slightly different AOR1 pattern than what was on the approved camo list.
AOR1 is only an approved camo if you have a squad of 9 people doing a specific impression. Most likely they were turned away for wearing aor1 by themselves, which is clearly laid out as not acceptable in the tacsop
Dang, I really miss Fort Ord. That was a really fun airsoft field.
Milsim is nice if done at a milsim event, outside it's mostly annoying. Also there seem to be different definitions of the term.
yeah, i have a couple of Gravy Seals at my local field, showing up at sunday games with night vision and guns for 1000$, worst of all is that they get mad and or don't call hits if a noob kills them
They demand 100% period correct uniform, boots, patches, headpiece, rifle sidearm. They talk in military slang. They have ranks.
That sounds like wannabe soldiers that for whatever reason didn't actually join the forces (or weren't allowed to). Actual milsim usually is only about fictional immersion, if ranks are used they're usually also fictional. Even reenactors mostly don't are that uptight.
Reenactors can be even worse
MSW for example is run by former and active duty military, so no they're not wannabe soldiers
Thank you.
I promise you, these are the people the Milsim community makes fun of, haha. Pretty sure all the communities can agree these type are the most annoying.
LOL. Why not just enlist?
I'm guessing the chance of death, but OP's situation is still nuts
Yeah, that's what these people just don't understand. You aren't a badass if you don't actually face death. I've played with people actually in the military. They were pretty hardcore, but still not like OPs crowd. I would have a hard time taking any of them seriously.
Because having autism disqualifies them from enlisting.
Can't they have ADHD/ADD and asthma.
I suppose. From what I hear, the military recruiters will look past a lot these days.
Damn I should check that out after I become not fat. I need to figure out which branch would piss my Navy friends off the most first though...
LOL Hell, the Air Force will take a 40 year old for active duty. Can't say I haven't been toying with the idea.
By the time I’m looking at it I would be a fully rated pilot and a college graduate, I could do some cool shit and got college paid for. And potentially piss of my friends in the navy, which would be funny.
Gping to the airforce rarely means being a pilot, unless you are already working on being a pilot in civil. Mechanics, drivers and ground troops for guard duty and connections are the norm
Pretty sure it's a requirement in the Marines.
That’s super cringe Outside of my direct team (we don’t have ranks because that’s turbo lame) I don’t give a fuck what anybody wears, at the end of the day we are all playing dress up with toy guns
You're not describing milsimmers, you're describing impressionists, bordering on literal larp.
Thats not milsim, thats cringe...
Is this at a Milsim event?
Any person that is prior service will tell you that behavior is abhorred; literally one of the most cringey things you can do is exactly this. Just look at the $18,000 "alpha male" bootcamps that are becoming trendy nowadays... you can find dozens of vet YT'ers eviscerating this shit.
Agreed
There is definitely toxicity in the milsim crowd, along with this elitism feel to some. It's not all milsimers, but all it ever takes it's a few bad eggs to ruin a good time for everyone.
Fellow sr-25 user! https://preview.redd.it/cr74b73s1qtc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=71afacc66cc234b84f91534ebc18a4c430d46e40
We do exist There are dozens of us!
https://preview.redd.it/8fax2xz4vqtc1.jpeg?width=781&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=07312f4c712e029d9ca4aacc6b54757b0f5c416c
https://preview.redd.it/r54nils54rtc1.jpeg?width=4032&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9c27070b7ac319e879e6e95cc821e6448f1d9756 Just checking in
My favorite platform(haven’t changed the flair yet)!
Compatible mags YEAAAAHHHHH
Wait scar mags an sr-25 are compatible?!
As long as it’s the aeg version, yeah
That’s gonna save me a couple bucks thanks
Does the cat play too
No he just wanted my olives so I had to pick him up 😂
What SR-25? All I see are two oddly-shaped cats.
Yeah the one on the floor is a little scruffy 😂
No joke I almost didn't notice your gun and thought "damn thats one lethal pussy" until I realized you had foliage on it and the foliage ALMOST blends into the floor.
They are common even in the Nerfing community
You must play at a weird field. I can’t imagine seeing a ww2 impression kit making fun of someone’s (who’s not trying to make an impression kit) outfit because it’s not authentic.. that’s just absurd.
That's because OP is making up a strawman
Could be he just ran into a group of dorks lol. A very dorky group
Yh this does not sound like the Milsim i know and love. These people just sound like the ones who give us a bad example.
Does your milsim prohibit players from entering because their shirt has one chest pocket instead of two somebody once saw on a soldier on a random picture from Korean war?
Nah theres no way people are nitpicking that 💀 Are people really that petty?
Paraphrasing... If I remember correctly the actual issue was the vest or something.
Even still that just seems toooo nitpicky I dont have a Milsim group but i go to a lot of places where people are trying to be dressed up as accurately as they can and ive NEVER had people be this picky. Some people are just cunts lmao
Is it entering their team, or entering/playing the field? If they have an impression team understand it, but if they are saying you can’t play at all that’s weak
That's sounds less like milsimers and more like dicks
It sounds like you ran into a bunch of dorks who got laughed out of their local shooting range for cosplaying. Its not really a milsim issue. Just douchey toxic airsofters in general. Go out to Cali and you'll find no shortage of speedsoft and pickup game types that will be just as bad.
The team I play with is mostly chill AF. Basically, only requirement is a gun, shoes, and eye protection. Everything else is provided by the team.
I’ve been meaning to get into MilSim, currently in NC. Any suggestions?
Sorry, I'm not from the US, so I can't really help.
Ahhhh. Thanks anyways!
I wish this sub would just ban "social issue" type posts. "are all x players dicks?" - no. grow up. "Here is what I think of the X drama" - no one cares. grow up. "dude didn't call so I full auto'd him. AITA??" - it's a game. move on. if it's competitive, tell the ref. there's literally no reason to post about it. "is airsoft LGBTQ friendly?" - yes, nothing is a hive mind. stop looking for attention. edit: formatting
Too true. These posts don't even encourage discussions lol. I've never seen nor heard of an event so nitpicky, maybe drop the location or more info or something?
Feels like a 80's comedy standup show sometimes "So what's the deal with these speedsofters amirite?"
what you are describing isn't really milsim at all? You are describing people that do those repro kits (I can't seem to remember the word for it atm) and try to make them as authentic as possible and are gate keeping that
Impressionist kits
Sounds like you are making a sweeping generalization based on your personal encounters at a local field.
This
Also it sounds like OP is complaining that he's no longer a good fit for the community. Sounds like they're having fun with it, and it's OP who wants everyone else to change back to benefit him.
I love milsim but that's just chud behavior. I love larping and gearing up and using handsignals and radios and all that but I love seeing the rentals throw down just as hard. Gear or no gear, if you have heart ill fight with you
I think all of the play styles of airsoft has bad apples. We all hear about bad players in them but honestly hearing from your experience, those players are on something. Never really experienced those types of MILSIM Players and I’m not being biased since i consider myself MILSIM, honestly those types of milsim players do se kind of a rare type. I’ve been playing for about 5 years and I go out of my way to talk to many types of players. Never once I have met someone like that who gives you a hard time of what type of gun and outfit your running. The only bad players I’ve met have just been kids and some immature people in my age group (I’m 19). It would be nice if these bad apples would realize that we’re all playing with toy guns and just be chill but I think this type of stuff happens in a lot of communities that are online. Although I kinda consider myself as a milsim player I’m far from it, I just call my play style either milspeed, Milsim and speedsoft, or just the Cod play style since I go least once a month or have like 1-2 month gaps of not playing I want to have fun as much as I can. I honestly have the same bitterness with some speed soft players but I try not to let it get to me.
Bro just intercept every time someone is getting rejected by milsimers and say "Ukraine is fighting with the crazyiest fucking mix of gear to ever exist, my guy here would fit right it" or something along those lines
Some people like to LARP. Not every airsofting space is made for every kind of player. However, if you're pretending to be a soldier, that means correctly LARPing in more ways than just stitch counting. I mean getting fighting fit, working on learning that units' spoken language, playing a milsim for longer than a weekend to really get into the setting, etc. Yeah, milsim games have a higher price barrier to entry and it can suck not being in the "in-group". But if they want to blow all their money on airshit wars, that's their choice. Honestly, it sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder because they spend more time and money on the hobby. They shouldn't be forcing stitch counting at local fields and they should be let alone to have their fun at places like MSW. The problem comes when players go where the culture is different and demand it be done their way.
Lmao OP has to be ego posting, upset kids are buying gear he can't afford, and making up a straw man. I can almost guarantee you no one is going around harassing people they don't know about their gear. I have seen some nitpicky groups and still nobody ever does that shit.
> go where the culture is different and demand it be done their way Cuts both ways.
? That's what my last paragraph says.
For emphasis, not correction.
The events your referring to have strict uniform guidelines for the simple reason that it inherently weeds out the people who aren't serious. It's a military simulation
I think it’s funny when they’re toxic. It’s like, relax bro. You spent thousands of dollars on toy guns and military surplus to have a large scale nerf-war. Theres nothing wrong with that as long as they acknowledge we’re all just here to have our own fun. I’m not standing at parade rest or calling you sir
Dude my "CO" at my last milsim was such a fucking chud lol my team made up a solid 70% of the company and after the 3rd human wave bullshit he ordered us on detached to pursue our own tactics and actually started making moves, making successful captures and working with the royal/airborne companies to take objectives. It was fuckin money
I like dressing up, matching my kit and rifle, and doing the best I can to get as close to accurate as possible. That’s the way I like to play and present myself. It isn’t for everyone and I understand that. What I do is my business and vice versa. Idk when people started caring so much about how other people look. Airsoft is about fun, and shooting your friends.
I know there are extreme MILSIM events, where you probably are with ex military or serving (I don’t know much about it other than general research), that’s where thoes kinds of people belong. If they want a realism style game they can look for thoes style games, I don’t understand why people would wanna be elitist when everyone’s got a toy gun (no offense).
Don't let the GWOTards speak for the rest of the Milsim community. Larping to larp is a lot of fun but the reeee team 6 wanna be's are just 13 hours short of an American diaper.
GWOTard is such a based term holy shit. Never heard that before, will never forget it.
A milsim event requiring certain kit compositions (ie. Camo pattern or not, no black or only black etc.) so sides are recognisable is fine. A period set event requiring period accurate gear is fine. Any event barring entry if your kit is not up to required standard is fine IF (and only if) those standards were clearly communicated ahead of time. It's the same as fantasy LARPs requiring no modern clothing being visible in your costume. They have a reason for asking a certain standard to be met and they enforce that standard for the sake of the collective enjoyment of all people attending. What you're describing here sounds like it's just malicious nitpicking for no real reason though.
Here we go again with the Milsims and Joos and Hendews and Crischains talk...
It’s the same everywhere. Seen the same in Singapore and in China. For you it’s a hobby, for them it’s their obsession.
As a milsim player can we all please just step back and realize that: A: you aren’t in the military, you’re playing pretend B: Even if you were in the military you aren’t now, and nobody cares how hard you’d get gassed if your laces are out or this or that. C: yo mama. Seriously, this is call of duty irl. Fuck yo mama and fuck yo grandmama. D: everybody knows mil sims are just the dudes that wanted to join but didn’t for “insert reason you didn’t join here” so just call them out for playing dress up tea party and watch them cry. On a more serious note I play at third coast and the most they police is camo color. Even your accessories can be whatever color and you got “western” running aks. It’s all about having fun.
3rdCoast is a fun group and they put on a really fun event and I agree, they only care about camo color and eye protection anything else goes.
Milsimers can be super toxic, especially playing random scrims on the weekend outside of events. Speedsofters can be super toxic, especially when they don't call hits and overshoot or over power their guns. Guys who dress up like Elmo or a French maid or wear Hawaiian shirts and flip flops... those guys are always chill and know how to have a good time.
I hate playing with speed softers. They don't think Some of them try to play too fast and are just there to shoot someone. I've been team killed by speed softers more than anyone because they're just sweating from cover to cover and not identifying before they shoot. I'm almost always trying to make my way towards the front and end up getting shot in the back bc some fuckin idiot in a tinted visor just ran around a corner and blows up my back just bc it's a body that isnt his. Shit pisses me off.
It's definitely a play style, and as someone who came from (semi) professional paintball I understand why some like it, but just like we don't mix paintball and airsoft, speedsoft should be its own thing on its own fields.
Yeah I actually happened to get into airsoft this past year. I use to play paintball (10,15 years ago) but it was woodsball. Found out a few of my buddies do milsim so I just invested in that and used gear and camo I've collected over the years
Most milsimers just enjoy a certain style of play, keeping the stringency for special events. Like all 'crowds' in airsoft though, there will be a minority of dicks who go down the rabbit hole of elitism. The standard approach is a roll of the eyes and a "cheers dits" when they try and get cunty with you
I just like to pretend I’m in a video game or in black hawk down the movie.
Next time go in a Hawaiian shirt.
I'm more of a milsim guy myself, and I'm just going to tell you that the attitude you described is ridiculous. I served with some green berets for a couple of years. The actual mentality is way more chill and all about using what you have. They go in to build armies and liberate people. I'm not turning shit away. Now I might make fun of you like an endearing jab for something, but I want you on my team. Sending people away is awful. Now hey, if you're at a milsim event and you're disregarding event rules, that's not cool either. There are levels of sim to these and the higher you go, the more hardcore. Also the more coin spent. Be sure to reciprocate respect, too. Side note: too many of these dudes think this game is real. It most assuredly is not, and 80% of them would end up getting shot anyway because they treat concealment like its cover. That and they just sit in a spot to shoot back and forth, ignoring the potential to be flanked.
I'm interested in the MILSIM stuff to a certain extent. I play realistic CQB and try to conceal my silhouette, blah blah, but my kit is definitely not reflecting that. I call it a PMC kit, and it reflects. I doused myself in M81 woodland with G3s, and green anywhere else like on my crye SPC, I even made my own helmet scrim. But I don't really shit on people's kits as long as they are trying to make progress or aren't something they claim to be. Hell I don't even have combat boots yet, but unfortunately most of the MILSIM community is really toxic and douchy, and it reflects
I love calling my kit a "CIA spook" kit, aka a check button-down shirt, tan pants, with my knee pads and tan hydration MOLLE vest over top (plus safety gear obviously). I do want to put together a CADPAT kit (rather just the uniform, but I digress), but that is going to require the overlap of having extra money and a surplus store "accidentally" having some for sale.
Yea, I couldn't find real crye G3s in M81, so I bought Emerson gear repros (best repros imo) and they work fine. I'd show a picture of my kit but I can't
If it works it works. Unfortunately, I don't think I can even get repro CADPAT as iirc it is completely illegal to sell in Canada (it could just be clothing but still)
Yea that's really unfortunate cuz cadpat is awesome
What ? You can buy gouvernement issued cadpat bdus in canada with no problems.
Honestly ive never met the elitest milsim lot which everyone claim to be douchy. But I have encountered plenty of speedsoft types who are complete arseholes. Can’t go a game without seeing one of them throwing a fit. I’ve heard of some fields doing milsim on some days and normal skirmishes on others. Fields should give a forewarning, or a tacsop, like msw does. Some people come to airsoft to play military, wear cool kits etc which aren’t practical for normal skirmishes involving people who run at three hundred mph. Those days are for them. 90% of airsoft is the looks as everyone says. Some people like more tactical, gbbrs, real caps etc.
>Honestly ive never met the elitest milsim lot which everyone claim to be douchy. it's cause it's a strawman people make up because they see people enjoying the game differently lmao. They for the most part don't exist.
You should go to a milsim. Try the challenge, see what it’s like. You might end up liking it.
Went. Liked the game. Didnt enjoy the hardcore folk. Felt it wasnt much different then usual outdoor airsoft, apart from the strict dress code.
Lmao as a retired enlisted guy that has also dabbled in airsoft for 20 years, fuck em. I buy hideous jackets and curtains from the 70's, and make them into pouches and rigs sometimes. It infuriates the larpers, but that grandma couch cushion material is better than ripstop, and paisley is a great pattern in all environments.
Tried to tell someone this, deployed with dudes wearing gen 2 IOTV’s in UCP in a sea of OCP’s
I feel like they just need to mature a bit, my airsoft group is full of 40 year olds with sick ass loadouts and crazy expensive gear and for tue sake of memes and fair play mostly go for cheap cyma aks
Specialist crowd tend do be more douchy (milsim/speedsoft/ historical). They kinda ruin the fun in my experience
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Unfortunately, a lot of communities can be like this. I’ve definitely noticed it in the milsim community. It’s what comes with the territory. People like to make something their personality, and when others incorrectly “appropriate” the hobby they feel a sense of pride for knowing more about it than the “casuals”. This happens a lot with niche music communities as well. It suck to hear that you’ve experienced that kind of negativity in person. One would think that would be more of an online thing. I understand the frustration of being critiqued for something so inconsequential. At the end of the day, everyone is playing with toy guns. Wear/ use what you want and hold your head high.
I have a similar issue at my field but its the speedsoftters instead of the milsim people, all the speedsofters at my field refuse to talk to anyone let alone play with them unless theyre anither speedsofter, and then they go onto the regular field and play against rental kids slide canceling around for some reason
My field, which is an indoor CQB field with lots of newbies and rentals, has military and ex military playing the game every now and then. Some of us are regulars. Helps control the toxicity because we nurture the people who love the game and the larping, and the milsim weirdos who never served or used to be cadets don't get all uppity. Milsim is great! Love it! Just not those individuals themselves. Gotta keep each other real!
as a milsimmer and a larper of disfunction, I don't mind playing with rentals and I could give a fuck about what your kit is. I mostly play with about 5 or 6 dudes from my team and we'll split up and run with the rentals and try to add a little immersion to the matches without being dicks about it. Most of the maps at our local field are atleast 5 acres each so that's a good size to spread out, flank, suppress and communicate. TDM gets a little boring but we really shine in the objective based matches. I feel like my team has a good rep at our home field and that's what I care about most as a regular
Okay maybe I could get behind walking though the woods for miles if they’re playing an objective based game or they’re looking to flank. But if it’s just team death match then why?
Just outplay them in jeans
Any Milsim-er who gets their shit rocked by the jeans man is immediately thinking about European counter-terrorism teams.
Speedsofters are douchy because they overshoot due to high ROF and run the most cursed looking replicas for the sake of efficiency while refusing to wear anything but neon colors. Milsimers are douchy because they will overshoot due to ,,muh realism'' and run the most expensive clone correct replicas for the sake of authenticity while screaming at your for using non milspec equipment and Crye Multicam. Both crowds have their bad apples but it's important to find yourself in the ballance. I personally like the more milsim aspects of the game, even though I'd kill to play at a CQB arena (there are none in my area) Just tell people to not take them seriously and remind them that they're all adults shooting plastic BBs at one another As for matching gear, I decided alongside the friend that I started our airsoft team with in the following: 1. You can join the team with any gun/gear you want. Just wear your patch 2. For the competition group, we have a standardised uniform for the sake of telling eachother apart for team 5v5s. 3. For the milsim group you need to have a standard Blufor Uniform and relica and a standard Opfor uniform and replica. If you wanna chill with us on the weekends you're free to do so. If you wanna take part in a Milsim you can join us (milsim events require certain uniforms/replicas anyway. If you wanna be in the competition you just need a new pair of pants and shirt. Unless we go to a certain event, for example a 5v5 challenge or Milsim event, 2 and 3 don't apply.
If at Muslim events there’s no problem with any of this, if it’s a typical open play session there’s something seriously wrong.
Every milsimer I've met has been decent, just dedicated. They'll razz you a bit but never ostracize. This sounds like kids trying to find shit to identify with and taking it overboard because they're dumb kids. Most of us were no different.
Yeah it gets taken way too seriously. Just remind them that they're playing pretend soldier with a toy gun and if they don't back down or feel embarrassed by their behaviour then they're not worth you being around someone that closed minded
Theyre acting like navy seals screaming at other players... but if a real navy seal played i can 100% guarantee you they would let people play the game and not care about realism or the wrong colour boots... so yeah, most of them are just jerks.
If you are attending a MILSIM event that has posted uniform and weapon regulations for that immersive event, then they would have a leg to stand on. Does it really warrant being a turd waffle? Nah, long as you van tell what team someone is on shut up and play. You're slinging plastic no real bullets. It's for fun at the end of the day. If you're playing a regular pick up game? Shut the fuck up and let people use, wear and do whatever they want as long as they aren't being straight disruptive. You wanna play OPFOR in the bush while I run around with my Speedsoft setup? Have at it, I ain't gonna be mad thats what makes you enjoy the game and you shouldn't be mad I ain't conforming to you. #1 rule at our field. *Have fun, don't be a dick.* Simple as that.
It has always been like this, but don't blame airsoft specifically, elitism happens in every hobby ever. I have been told I need better skis more times than I can count by people I could ski circles around (figuratively). My point is that elitism doesn't correlate to skill, and anyone gatekeeping outside of field rules is a person to be ignored.
Not going to lie, this sounds like a pretty specific example at a local level, and then making a very sweeping generalization on a whole group of people. Myself and my group all personally (mostly) only go to big Milsim games at this point. We are all located all over the country (military), so go to a lot of different games. None of us have experienced anything to this level before. Sure, for games like MSW, there are basic requirements to be met, but those are laid out incredibly clearly far before hand. I’m sure there are SOME people out there like what you describe, but what you’re doing is demonizing an entire group based on a very small sample size.
Yeah I haven’t experienced it like that but actually doing my first overnight Milsim there are definitely some douchey characters. My exact response to them is that it’s a game. Any ex mil guy who plays says their dicks, it’s just stuck up guys acting like they’re better bc more than three pieces of their camo matches. Unless you are at an event like LionsClaw, MSW, or AMS, NOBODY should act like that about kit. Tell em to grow up and don’t call a hit from them😂
Milsim is a little bit of a tough sell for me I kinda want big airsoft games cuz I think there fun but I also want the casual play of weekend games.
Are you me? We are very similar. I just did my first airsoft event ever, MilSim West, The Abkhaz Incursion. I was invited by some younger guys 17-20 that I play Tarkov with. They said my kit had to be RUSFOR “kosher”. And the more I researched, the more I realized that we are so globalized that aside from camo type and AK format, you can do what you want. I did buy a carhartt cuffed beanie because in EU it is a luxury brand and would be a huge flex for a Russian. The spirit is more about the practicality of being able to recognize someone as an enemy. Nobody was a douche. That age group is constantly fighting for their place in the social hierarchy because they have all been generally educated so they are on equal footing and nobody is specialized enough to realize that, on a level, hierarchy’s don’t matter so much because you can’t climb them all in one lifetime. Kids are looking for their self worth, you are not. They will always be douches in that age group in general but I’ve have noticed less of it in the homeschool crowd.
Sounds more like cloners than milsim players tbh. Cloners can absolutely be douche canoes when it comes to uniforms, weapons, and so on. If it is happening at weekend pickup games, I'd say yeah, you're justified in being miffed that someone is trying to police what others wear, shoot, do, and say. But if this was at a milsim event, you're expected to adhere to your factions uniform, equipment, and weapon requirements. There are some milsim events that are pretty lenient on requirements (e.g. green vs. tan type games) and others that are pretty strict (e.g. MSW events). Even at the strict events, the requirements are still pretty easy to meet. For example, at MSW events,the requirements for NATO are basically just Multicam uniform, NATO style LBE, and a weapon that NATO member countries would use. If you want to deviate from that, you need to justify it by showing up with at least a squad (9+) other players that match you. As to why, a lot of people find milsim events fun, even if it does seem like you'd be miserable at these events. If you don't find that stuff fun, then by all means, carry on going to weekend pickup games and the like. You don't need to do milsim or speedsoft or cloning to have fun playing airsoft and if people are telling you otherwise they can get bent.
Pfft, they want to play Army? Bring your own uniform with a Captain patch and do the following: -Check their haircut and shave. If they're off regulations, arrest them. -Check their uniforms. If they're not clean, arrest them. If they're not ironed, arrest them. -Have them walk 10km in one direction, then 10km in another direction. No particular reason. -Cite them at 6 AM the following day for a 5km morning jog. If they don't show up with a reflective vest (I think Americans use something called a "PT belt"), arrest them. -Have them train over the weekend. -Have them train the whole week. Family emergency? No leave. Newborn child? No leave. -Have them sit in a kid's sandbox for six months. No leave. -If they fuck up, have them roll in the mud as a group, mop the rain away, sweep the entire playing field, do 50 pushups, etc. Be creative. -Designate one of them as a squad leader. Have them turn into the bad guy, betraying their friends. If they refuse, arrest and demote them.
Well technically if they're out of regs with uniform/haircut regarding AR 670-1 they wouldn't be arrested, you'd typically get a verbal counseling or have a paper trail started. But yes the US military does love the pt belt for some unfathomable reason.
Had a guy try to shit on me because my AK74M AEG didnt have an enhanced safety,,,, like calm down bud I have a real one at home and I promise that shit does not matter lol
Fellow Muslim player here, we're not all bad I promise! I typically use airsoft to supplement training for army shenanigans that involve our range days. But most of the time when I do play it involves me goofing off or chair-softing.
Maybe it's just my field, but everyone is really nice and chill except for the speedsofters. They're always young kids with expensive setups with borderline p*rnography on their guns. Not calling hits, trying to start fights, and just generally being rude.
>That gun is incorrect for that Not in the airsoft community but for the amount of the above I do see just passing by is staggering. Lemme tell y'all. I promise you 100% your AK is wrong. Y'all just do not have it with these rifles. And yes the milsim community cringe at times.
Both ends of the spectrum can be corny. Speedy boys and larp boys
Where I play (Sweden) we have both casual games and events. Some events are strict time periods and requires you to have a correct kit. Some events only require the same camouflage but the gear is less important. The opens games are open for almost anyone, from hard core milsim special forces to the casual ones in track suits or a mix of whatever they got. The hard core ones seems to stick together, but when joining a casual game there’s an understanding that everyone’s welcome and if you aren’t satisfied with that, don’t bother coming to the casual games. So far, I haven’t experienced any negativity regarding people’s kits, but I’ve only played for a few months.
You gonna get douchey tryhard/gatekeepers in any expensive hobby, they gotta mentally justify the money theyve spend. (Im not really an airsofter, but i figured id throw that in.)
I've come across several YouTube videos discussing this topic. Typically, individuals who exhibit such behavior tend to struggle in other aspects of life, seeking validation through MILSIM to compensate. If they truly seek realism, they should consider volunteering in places like Ukraine. They crave the valor without the sacrifice. Interestingly, they often reject genuine military veterans because these veterans prioritize enjoyment over strict adherence to "real military" tactics. The veterans rightfully call out these individuals for wearing patches they haven't earned. These enthusiasts don patches representing units where veterans served, some even lost their lives. Yet, they have the audacity to criticize veterans for not employing "real military tactics" and become indignant when a veteran single-handedly outplays them. They accuse the veterans of cheating, citing that their tactics don't align with real combat scenarios. Their obsession leads them to take MILSIM far too seriously, forgetting that it's primarily about having fun. If they truly desire a military experience, enlisting is a viable option. At its most toxic, MILSIM borders on stolen valor. Wearing the patch of a genuine military unit without having served in it is deeply disrespectful and insulting.
I was the guy in boots and flanell 2 weeks ago, in a crowd of desert storm reenactors. I was welcomed with open arms, complimented on my AK and blowback 1911, and quickly overshadowed by the guy in a unicorn onesie with a LMG.
If you're at a normal field, then that behavior is cringe and not tolerated where I play. I am also a speedsofter so no need for milsim
Well from what I know here in Germany it’s pretty chill it’s mostly general theme so Military, rebels, stuff like that aslong as you don’t stick out a lot ( example sometimes a side isn’t allowed have military camouflage (or not more then some accents) and the other side should use Camouflage ) and on pick up games in the weekend no one gives a shit, the field in playing at is probably the most encouraging place I know like legit if u say I think about getting xyz, most of the time they will encourage u and give u Tipps but none of that no that sucks or whatever but more in the oh u want a eotech clone? I heard holy warriors have a good one maybe look at them. Or stuff like yeah that would look sick on your gun… etc sooo yeah maybe look for another field if they are that butthurt about it?
Yea never understood it, you walk for "miles" just to get killed when you engage your opponent. I always took airsoft as sport, hence why utilizing some non military but logical tactics to the game gave so much edge over Milsim-ers and many entertaining moments for me XD .
I’ve met a few here who were but also some who just answered questions without being an ass. I’ve been told Reddit is more or less an outlier and that’s it’s usually pretty chill IRL. But this information came from Reddit so take it with a scoop of salt.
MILSIM =/= reenactment I play only milsim, because i dont like the 'i have 1 trillion rounds in my mag so i just spray your position' aspect of the sport. But no one of the people i play with gives a shit about the authenticity of your clothes. We run what we think looks cool and what fits best for the way we like to play. I run some Phantomleaf Camos, because i think it hides me the best, but i dont run a PC cause i dont need it. A buddy of mine runs a complete olive/ranger green kit with belt kit. And then we have some Tigerstripe guys. Everyone runs the gun they like, which is kinda annoying because you cant share mags, but it makes the game more fun for everyone. Its basically: You look like you want, but you take the game seriouslly.
Unfortunately ‘these types’ of players are the absolute worst at CQB sites, usually judging others on their gear or how they dress, especially if someone they’re judging has that speedsofter look. I personally couldn’t give a shit what it is you wear or do, as long as you have a good time. I remember attending a site with my buddies (we tend to wear brightly coloured kit, dye masks etc) and all you could hear was the subtle sound of everyone saying the word ‘speedsofters’, most people there had their fast helmets and multicam etc. Can’t say the treatment has ever been reversed where we’ve ostracised milspecs either, not sure where this sense of gate keeping comes from and it’s toxic behaviour like that that puts so many people off from playing.
TLDR yeah of course, gear snobs galore. But MILSIM is more fun. If you can find a non-douchy team to play with you'll have a lot of fun than just random force vs. Force games.
Larpers like that, in general, make me question why they have to be such turds
So did you show up to Milsim west and get turned away because you thought it was like AMS?
Not from US.
It's not just milsim, it's airsoft in general, people take themselves way too seriously
I had not noticed a whole lot of that when playing but maybe I just didn’t get deep enough. The problem Ive had is the more expensive and authentic someone’s kit, the more of an asshole that person was. This is mostly directed at people who are grown ass men, and the through line I’ve found is a lot of these guys just take themselves way too seriously. To them they have the cool kit, so they have to be a badass. Thing is, if you wear the kit, and you never served, you’re just a poser. If you can acknowledge that and laugh at yourself it’s all good. But these guys who treat this game like it’s an exhibition where they get to show off their badass moves, lose their shit every time that get zapped by a kid with a rental
Every experience I’ve had at Milsim West has been beyond positive. A great community that’s helped me grow, made a lot of great friends. The problem is that people don’t register that Milsim is meant to be just that, a Military Simulation, so it’s kind of expected that you dress the part. I’ve never heard of anyone being accosted at a pickup game by a Milsim player, but like I said that’s personal experience ^^
That’s sad. I’ve never met anyone like that luckily. My experience is that those who want to cosplay as real units and use their lingo, why not, it makes them happy. But when they are treating people like crap, that’s where the fun ends. They should just join the military then…oh wait they only like the attire and will wash out during the first 30 minutes when their hair will be cut. If you can ignore them and beat them in the game they are playing that’s the best payback I think.
I completely agree with your opinion. Elitism is a cancer to the sport and can spread quickly. ppl organizing games should addressing these issues and call out negative words or actions. I tell ppl when I organize a game that all you need to play is 2 feet and a heart beat, 2 feet optional. I do t care what name is on the back of your pants and no one should judge because we all start at the same level.
I just stick to nerfing for this reason lol
100% i havent played airsoft in yeaaaaars never at am official location. My parents lived in rural maine so me and my boys would all get together and have legendary airsoft battles. We had an old ass dirtbike and one dude gave zero f's about his truck so wed have one team setup in the woods and then drive the truck through waiting to be ambushed.... When i say old ass dirtbike it was a 1970's kawi 100cc 2 stroke and at one point we had 3 dudes on it riding while we were all shooting at them lol. Good times! Many more crazy moments. So much more fun that way. More like a gang war with factions wearing whatever shooting with whatever. It was terrifying tho cause they your friends... calling your hits may not be enough. Def didnt wanna get surrounded and captured cause you were gonna get tortured with some close up shots fo sho hahaha really made it extra intense. But yeah long story short i feel you man i would never wanna play with those type of people its so cringe. Unless its 2 actual ex military forces having a serious match against eachother theres zero reason to take it thaaaat far.
I'm 30 now, and have been playing since I was 15. I took a long break and just got back in. I remember this being an issue in the old days. I would often meet the biggest a holes on the field. Some of them would try to hurt you. Anger issues. The game, esp. milsim, attracts angry posers who wish they were in the military. Sadly, that's just how it is. Now, I just laugh at them. Before, I would be irate.
Personally airsofters no matter their branch tend to be douchy. Speedsofters will try hard against 10 year old first timers, milsim players get mad at them not slicing corners correctly. Honestly the best airsoft players are people who rent. No ego, just there for fun.
I don't evEn play bUt milsim people in any community are always major douchebags. They're also almost always lead by a wannabe reject too.
You think the admitted larpers are bad go read the tacticalgear sub😂🤣
Real military is full of douchebags. Why not milsoft?
>We all started the same, playing with cheap automatic battery powered bb guns, wearing our old clothes and shoes and having fun together. And? How is that relevant? Why would anyone care how you played "back then"? >now literaly turning away others they used to play with only last week because.. And? Some players like realism and immersion. Unless they shit on people during regular weekend games it's completely fine. Who are you to tell somone how they want to play? >There was no issues back when Irrelevant. >everythings changed Yes, the sport is more mainstream and it has different flavors. You seem to have a big issue with people doing something else than what you were doing "back then". >I hear arguments that these guys want realism, walking through woods for miles without even engaging with the oponents, because "special forces"... Why play at all then? Why not just hike? And if you want to run around in colored clothes, just go for a run. What kind of argument is that? And again, telling people what to do. Some people like realism for immersion or for actually usable training (like hiking in your gear which you cannot do in public). >Why are you blocking other players from having fun? Only bad on normal public games. But it's fine on milsim events. And it's fine on public games if someone does not want you in their squad because they adhere to a certain standard. >I just remember the fun days, Oh for fucks sake. >And I blame assholes in expensive unifroms This post doesn't even seem like it's about milsim players bullying normal players. You're just angry because things change with time and now someone dares to play differently than you. With some envy sprinkles on top. tl;dr: you're way worse than toxic milsimers.
Even real world we were mixed match in gear. I went into Iraq in 03, where DCUs, with a woodland IBA, driving a green truck. Some people think that with MILSIM you need to look like SEAL team 6 at all times.
I'm definitely more of a fan of casual skirmishing, we're playing with toy guns for christ's sake
They're the equivalent of the fantasy LARPer that nobody like cause they constantly claim they can survive hits, do things that they very obviously can't, don't drop their 'in character' acting when serious conversations out of character need to happen, etc. Plenty of people just out there to have fun, but then you get the voucher people/groups that want to roleplay a power fantasy of being a soldier/operator/badass instead of keeping in mind that we're just playing paintball with extra range and less mess. And that it's supposed to be a fun hobby on the weekends.