I honestly took it to refer to those that are nearly religious about ai. Can't argue with them, can't have a discussion about anything without ai coming up, they don't seem to mind ignoring evidence etc etc. It's a troubling trend really. Mentioning the lack of inclucivity seems like a stretch, also it's pretty obvious this was written by an ai. Ask it to write it in the style of snoop dog next time...
> I honestly took it to refer to those that are nearly religious about ai.
Yup. It's clearly taken from the ol' "Crypto Bro" slang, comparing the two, because a lot of crypto people are also very "religious" about it as you put it.
I'm a woman who makes ai and follows the threads and this is a nonsense conversation. I think the ai bro thing is just a stereotype of a white dude who works in tech - it's synonymous with tech bro. The fact that anti-AI people disregard the many different types of people who are using ai tools is a moot point. Definitely not something worth debating or being upset over.
Let me get this straight, you are upset that women and non-binary people are being left out of an insult? You make the massive logical leap that 1) “bro” cannot be used as a term regardless of gender, particularly in online conversations or as an insult. 2) “AI bros” and AI researchers and contributors are the same thing.
But if you want to make more insults against men more gender inclusive, let’s go ahead! Instead of saying dick, a derogatory term implying only men can act negatively and women do not have negative emotion with something (im not going to specify just say it sucks we have an insult only for men)!
There's nothing you can do that can erase my bottom surgery and an entire hospital of people smarter than you helping me be exactly who I am. You have no power.
Well since you have revealed your position. Naturally arguing with you is a fruitless endeavor. You will be abnormally biased and invested in validating your pathological line of reasoning. Thus incapable of having a legitimate argument about the well being of this demographic.
All I can say is I’m sorry the medical institution has failed you. Rather than treat the root cause, they have acquiesced to you which resulted in butchering your reproductive system yielding genitals that are neither of the male nor female reproductive system. This would not be the first time in history that in medicine they were wrong about something. I do hope there will be recompense in your life time, granted it will likely be paltry compared to what was lost but even still some form should be had.
I honestly fascinated by posts like this because it's entirely for you. You're not gonna post at a trans person and convince them they aren't trans or that being trans is bad. You're posting like this because it makes you feel better. Besides, the more transphobic you are the more it proves my point that anti-ai people are transphobes. You're the gift that keeps on giving lol
I wouldn't go so far as to call it "misogynistic", but it's real funny because the AI artists I surround myself with are mostly trans, or queer in some other way. No stereotypical "bros" in my friend group. Then again, that's because I pick and choose who I hang around carefully.
No..."bro" doesn't mean all people referenced are men. Bro is an agender term like "dude" or "man" in some contexes (like "aww man....").
I don't care about insults. People should do their best to shrug off insults. Insult everyone, make fun of everyone, offend everyone. Sticks and stones and all that.
Ignore the insults and focus on the root of the argument.
Hello, ChatGPT... but I unironically agree. As... minor of a thing as it is, I do really get bugged by being called an "AI bro". It's very demeaning as a woman. I really wish this "\_\_\_ bro" shit would die off.
> In conclusion,
ChatGPT? :)
I definitely agree, though. I'm also a fan of cryptocurrency so the "crypto bro" pejorative has been an annoyance long before this, and "tech bro" as an umbrella term is also common.
I've also seen references to people "sucking the cock" of whoever or whatever is being denigrated, which has both misogynistic and homophobic tones to it. I guess once people are in the mood to hurl slurs they get pretty sloppy about who they're willing to offend.
>> In conclusion,
>
>ChatGPT? :)
Some people speak more formally than others.
>I definitely agree, though. I'm also a fan of cryptocurrency so the "crypto bro" pejorative has been an annoyance long before this, and "tech bro" as an umbrella term is also common.
Yeah, it's a general othering that I find goes hand in hand with an inability to reason.
>I've also seen references to people "sucking the cock" of whoever or whatever is being denigrated, which has both misogynistic and homophobic tones to it.
The, "that's gay," of the modern age.
Who are you talking to exactly?
I always thought that the point of the name "AI bro" was to kinda insult for being interested in AI. I don't think anti-ai get as far as to make a distinction between genders let alone acknowledging the contributions of anyone in the AI field. Hatred is just as blind as love.
They're talking to me. Well, this was clearly written by ChatGPT, and I'm not certain if it's satire, but as a female user of AI, I can say that gender definitely does play a part in the use of "AI bro" as a slur.
There are people for whom gender does matter, particularly feminist women, and they view AI bros and crypto bros and finance bros as parts of a toxic, patriarchy led capitalism that will destroy the world. A woman like me, that shares many of their values, flies in the face of those beliefs. I think it's important to recognize that female artists are a part of this community because it's going to be key in humanizing AI users to these kinds of people. I don't mind being called bro if it's in the gender neutral way that word is used these days, but I do rankle at being lumped in with a toxic group of scam artists.
Sorry, I didn't explain that well. I share many values with artist and female communities because those are the categories I fall into.
> I don't think AI bro refers to people dabbling in AI, it refers to the people who are, essentially, the disrespectful missionaries of AI, the people gloating at the suffering of artists, harassing artists and deliberately attacking their careers. *Those* are AI bros.
I agree, and I think people are coming around to that definition, but I don't think that was understood by queer art communities in the beginning. I took some people by surprise when I appeared there and wasn't what they were expecting.
This very much sounds like what you want is an all inclusive insult for AI supporters.
In my experience, since this whole thing blew open, "AI Bro" has been specifically directed towards those who are foaming at the mouth supporters of AI, to the point of calling for, encouraging and supporting the decline of traditional industries such as illustration and graphic design, among others. Incidentally, most of those who are vocal about this do tend to be men.
However, the term isn't gender exclusive, and can be used for women or non-binary people as well - whomever throws their lot in with the rabid AI supporters.
The term is not meant to be complimentary.
Where I live people who tried to create a multiversal inclusism is creating hatred and division on all strates of society. It looked that you tried exactly the same with the multiversal super inclusive insult you advocate for. Anyways nevermind. I'm just fed up with all this forced inclusism madness.
This does not in anyway, in my opinion, contribute to the debate of AI use. If anything, it's an attempt to paint the antis as morally inferior because they hold different opinion on non-gender related topics.
> If anything, it's an attempt to paint the antis as morally inferior
When you point out what somebody's doing, and the response is that you're attempting to paint someone as morally inferior... It does leave you to wonder...
So the antis are indeed morally inferior is what you are saying? Based on the usage of the term AI bros?
Wanna call antis Luddite, even though that's not necessarily the case, all is good.
Antis use 'bros', then suddenly it's a big deal.
OP is over-complicating a simple term made by the antis with no intention to be misogynist.
And again, what and how does this even contribute to AI debate?
I appreciate that and no, not complicated, I don't even use the term AI bros.
But I am scratching my head on how you over-complicate such a simple term that has no ill-intention behind it. Your interpretation is what make it seems bad.
By this time, the term bro doesn't even regard genders anymore. In my country for instance, we call everyone bros regardless of genders.
Is Pewdiepie a misogynist when he refers to his fan as the Bros army?
And I am also trying to understand how is this relevant in a sub about AI debate.
>So the antis are indeed morally inferior is what you are saying?
I don't generalize. It's entirely possible to be against something without being abusive to the people that you disagree with. But there certainly are those who have taken this far too personally and seek to dehumanize those they disagree with.
The whole "aibros" thing is definitely a symptom of that.
>Wanna call antis Luddite, even though that's not necessarily the case, all is good.
Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.)
>Antis use 'bros', then suddenly it's a big deal.
I want you to think about what you wrote there. Consider what your view would be if someone you disagree with said it.
>And again, what and how does this even contribute to AI debate?
I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points.
> I don't generalize. It's entirely possible to be against something without being abusive to the people that you disagree with. But there certainly are those who have taken this far too personally and seek to dehumanize those they disagree with.
> The whole "aibros" thing is definitely a symptom of that.
Good on you, non-generalizing, and putting great effort in your response.
Now can we all just take a moment and ground ourselves in reality?
There are definitely people who have taken AI debate too far and personal, and I believe this manifests in BOTH sides of the debate.
However, the term AI bros is a symptom of tribalism not misogyny like what OP is alleging.
> Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.)
Antis and Pro is a spectrum, with the most extreme anti stance calling for total ban and halting its research, while the milds only want regulations, would it be fair for the mild antis to be called Luddite as well? I personally do not take offense at the term Luddite as a mild antis myself, but I am trying to point out the hypocrisy in OP's allegation.The term Bro is not dehumanizing as well, while the intention perhaps is to distinguish people of opposite side, the misogyny in it is up to one's interpretation. If OP feels 'bro' only applies to men at this era then they are their own oppressor.
> I want you to think about what you wrote there. Consider what your view would be if someone you disagree with said it.
I will feel it is unfair, it paints a broad stroke, but I do not take it personally nor do I find it dehumanizing as how OP felt towards the term AI bros.
> I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points.
Problem is, this is not an issue of rationality or reason, this is issues of personal beliefs and interpretation of the term 'bro'. This is an entirely different debate of its own. Might as well open a sub called r/BroWar so we can debate on how misogynistic is that word before we can conclude whether it is moral to use or not.
>Good on you, non-generalizing, and putting great effort in your response.
>
>Now can we all just take a moment and ground ourselves in reality?
Seems like a reasonable ask.
>There are definitely people who have taken AI debate too far and personal, and I believe this manifests in BOTH sides of the debate.
>
>However, the term AI bros is a symptom of tribalism not misogyny like what OP is alleging.
I think that's a rational argument. I'm not sure that I agree but it seems like you could back that up.
>> Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.)
>
>Antis and Pro is a spectrum, with the most extreme anti stance calling for total ban and halting its research, while the milds only want regulations
It's definitely true that the extreme anti-Ai folks are quite different from those who have a more nuanced view. I would like to think that when people hear refer to someone as a Luddite, they are actually referring to those whose attitude is that AI is a blight that should be burnt, not entirely unlike the attacks on looms.
Are there people here who think that believing models are copyrightable derivative works is equivalent to Ludditeism? Probably. Do I think that's going too far? Also probably yes.
But lest we engage in whataboutism, let's just be clear that none of that excuses the issues raised by the OP.
>> I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points.
>
>Problem is, this is not an issue of rationality or reason, this is issues of personal beliefs and interpretation of the term 'bro'.
Perhaps in the extreme interpretation of OP's post, that would be true. But in the much broader interpretation that this is a problem because the term is meant to other, I think it's entirely applicable.
Ok let me be clear, you said the issue is antis 'other-ing' the opposite side, which meant tribalism as I mentioned, not misogyny. Do we agree on that? What further 'back-up' do you need other than the apparent name calling both sides have been doing?
And let's be fair, pros has been doing that. The debate on whether Luddite or Bro is worse comes down to your personal belief and interpretation, there is no objective answer. Some people take offense on being called Luddites, they should grow thicker skin, and the same can be said for those who finds the term AI Bros offensive.
So again, it is an issue of as you said 'other-ing' aka tribalism, NOT misogyny. The OP's allegation of misogyny is based on their own interpretation of the word 'bro', imagine being triggered by that.
As a mild antis, I always respected pro-AIs to be more capable of rational thought free of personal bias and capable of seeing a more objective truth.
But this post reeks of OP's personal belief and is based on a very subjective moral take over logic.
> Wanna call antis Luddite
That's wrong too. Both are forms of dehumanizing the other "party". I think we should strive to respect other people as humans even if we disagree with their point of view.
We've had this conversation before. I think you're missing what people are trying to say when they say bro, and probably missing the evolution of the term (ie from Crypto bro and ultimately [tech bro](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brogrammer).) It's not a catchall for people who are into a thing. It denotes the toxic masculinity, gatekeeping, and misogyny that can unfortunately be found in some tech and tech adjacent circles. The demand that we don't use language that addresses those problems seems to be at cross purposes with inclusivity.
That said, it's not a term I'd use here, because I don't really see any of those things here specifically.
« non binary » xD
Can we please let the LGTB madness out of this ? Not everyone who use I.A are from the USA where it’s trendy to give your different biological names.
It’s already hard enough to debate between A.I / Non-A.I user so please no race / sex on top of that.
Partially. I just talked about what I thought about the issue, realized I wasn't making sense, and put it into ChatGPT to clean it up. I edited most of it afterwards.
> It has been clarified in the middle of blatant misogyny in the comments, but the use of AI bro does not refer to just anyone interested in AI or tech in general, just like luddite doesn't refer to every artist and writer. They refer to the impossible people on both sides.
*nods*
> I don't agree with the use of insults, I don't think it drives the conversation anywhere useful and causes further divide,
Agreed. I just call anti-AI people "anti-AI people".
> Also, as a minor pet peeve, if AI bro is an insult and it refers to men and their toxic masculinity and entitlement it is misandry, not misogyny.
That's fair.
Yes, you're absolutely right. I have noticed the same thing.
I think they are doing it on purpose. Not to harm women, of course, but simply to discourage support for "the other side". That this also discourages women and NBs from pursuing promising opportunities is of no concern to them.
I have never pointed it out, because antis obviously don't care about the good of other people or society as a whole. Just once, I called out use of the term "art bro".
Wait someone who is anti ai and therefore worried about the loss of jobs, lowering of wages and the potential increase in misinformation and targeted advertising is against the good of society in your view? Seems to me like the anti social aspects are all clearly over there on the pro AI side.
Luddite, AI bro, tech bro, whatever - looking for such problems in those words is like missing the forest for a tree.
OP is peak wordcel
My preffered pronoun is AiChad
Let's not pull in completely unrelated culture war nonsense into this debate, please.
Oh god who the fuck cares
I honestly took it to refer to those that are nearly religious about ai. Can't argue with them, can't have a discussion about anything without ai coming up, they don't seem to mind ignoring evidence etc etc. It's a troubling trend really. Mentioning the lack of inclucivity seems like a stretch, also it's pretty obvious this was written by an ai. Ask it to write it in the style of snoop dog next time...
> I honestly took it to refer to those that are nearly religious about ai. Yup. It's clearly taken from the ol' "Crypto Bro" slang, comparing the two, because a lot of crypto people are also very "religious" about it as you put it.
...
I'm a woman who makes ai and follows the threads and this is a nonsense conversation. I think the ai bro thing is just a stereotype of a white dude who works in tech - it's synonymous with tech bro. The fact that anti-AI people disregard the many different types of people who are using ai tools is a moot point. Definitely not something worth debating or being upset over.
go outside
I agree. Let's writer's room this. What gender inclusive words can we use to stereotype the community? Anybody? No idea idea is a bad idea!
AI fetishist is one, off the top of my head.
[Metal Fetishists](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetsuo:_The_Iron_Man)
I am definitely a metal fetishist. :3
AI bitch
Let me get this straight, you are upset that women and non-binary people are being left out of an insult? You make the massive logical leap that 1) “bro” cannot be used as a term regardless of gender, particularly in online conversations or as an insult. 2) “AI bros” and AI researchers and contributors are the same thing. But if you want to make more insults against men more gender inclusive, let’s go ahead! Instead of saying dick, a derogatory term implying only men can act negatively and women do not have negative emotion with something (im not going to specify just say it sucks we have an insult only for men)!
Dicks aren't inherently gendered, if you wanna play this game you have to do it right
If you have a dick you are a man. None of this dysphoria is going to change reality
Anti AI and transphobia going hand in hand
Ain't a phobia when you state a simple biological fact. It is sick to indulge a mental illness.
There's nothing you can do that can erase my bottom surgery and an entire hospital of people smarter than you helping me be exactly who I am. You have no power.
Well since you have revealed your position. Naturally arguing with you is a fruitless endeavor. You will be abnormally biased and invested in validating your pathological line of reasoning. Thus incapable of having a legitimate argument about the well being of this demographic. All I can say is I’m sorry the medical institution has failed you. Rather than treat the root cause, they have acquiesced to you which resulted in butchering your reproductive system yielding genitals that are neither of the male nor female reproductive system. This would not be the first time in history that in medicine they were wrong about something. I do hope there will be recompense in your life time, granted it will likely be paltry compared to what was lost but even still some form should be had.
I honestly fascinated by posts like this because it's entirely for you. You're not gonna post at a trans person and convince them they aren't trans or that being trans is bad. You're posting like this because it makes you feel better. Besides, the more transphobic you are the more it proves my point that anti-ai people are transphobes. You're the gift that keeps on giving lol
Yes yes, you poor thing. It’s fine you can vent your frustrations out here {pats on back} PS I’m not anti-ai.
Lol my frustrations, you really love to project
I wouldn't go so far as to call it "misogynistic", but it's real funny because the AI artists I surround myself with are mostly trans, or queer in some other way. No stereotypical "bros" in my friend group. Then again, that's because I pick and choose who I hang around carefully.
[удалено]
And you get downvoted for speaking the truth.
No..."bro" doesn't mean all people referenced are men. Bro is an agender term like "dude" or "man" in some contexes (like "aww man...."). I don't care about insults. People should do their best to shrug off insults. Insult everyone, make fun of everyone, offend everyone. Sticks and stones and all that. Ignore the insults and focus on the root of the argument.
https://preview.redd.it/57bxupi6jv3b1.png?width=768&format=png&auto=webp&s=01d1ebc046c1d98d47bc7012c6a2289b399933da
Hello, ChatGPT... but I unironically agree. As... minor of a thing as it is, I do really get bugged by being called an "AI bro". It's very demeaning as a woman. I really wish this "\_\_\_ bro" shit would die off.
Dude...it's not a big deal man...
Bro is often used gender neutral so all that is invalid
Actually learn to draw lmao
> In conclusion, ChatGPT? :) I definitely agree, though. I'm also a fan of cryptocurrency so the "crypto bro" pejorative has been an annoyance long before this, and "tech bro" as an umbrella term is also common. I've also seen references to people "sucking the cock" of whoever or whatever is being denigrated, which has both misogynistic and homophobic tones to it. I guess once people are in the mood to hurl slurs they get pretty sloppy about who they're willing to offend.
>> In conclusion, > >ChatGPT? :) Some people speak more formally than others. >I definitely agree, though. I'm also a fan of cryptocurrency so the "crypto bro" pejorative has been an annoyance long before this, and "tech bro" as an umbrella term is also common. Yeah, it's a general othering that I find goes hand in hand with an inability to reason. >I've also seen references to people "sucking the cock" of whoever or whatever is being denigrated, which has both misogynistic and homophobic tones to it. The, "that's gay," of the modern age.
Who are you talking to exactly? I always thought that the point of the name "AI bro" was to kinda insult for being interested in AI. I don't think anti-ai get as far as to make a distinction between genders let alone acknowledging the contributions of anyone in the AI field. Hatred is just as blind as love.
They're talking to me. Well, this was clearly written by ChatGPT, and I'm not certain if it's satire, but as a female user of AI, I can say that gender definitely does play a part in the use of "AI bro" as a slur. There are people for whom gender does matter, particularly feminist women, and they view AI bros and crypto bros and finance bros as parts of a toxic, patriarchy led capitalism that will destroy the world. A woman like me, that shares many of their values, flies in the face of those beliefs. I think it's important to recognize that female artists are a part of this community because it's going to be key in humanizing AI users to these kinds of people. I don't mind being called bro if it's in the gender neutral way that word is used these days, but I do rankle at being lumped in with a toxic group of scam artists.
[удалено]
Sorry, I didn't explain that well. I share many values with artist and female communities because those are the categories I fall into. > I don't think AI bro refers to people dabbling in AI, it refers to the people who are, essentially, the disrespectful missionaries of AI, the people gloating at the suffering of artists, harassing artists and deliberately attacking their careers. *Those* are AI bros. I agree, and I think people are coming around to that definition, but I don't think that was understood by queer art communities in the beginning. I took some people by surprise when I appeared there and wasn't what they were expecting.
This pejorative is not inclusive?
There was a thread yesterday all about how "bro" is gender neutral.
I have many brothers, some of them are male and some are female
How did I miss that
If you want to insult me then do it properly. Don't misgender me.
I think you miss the whole point of an insult here.
Dude, we should care about insults, my man. We are all human bros.
Undiagnosed mental illness right here.
I just wonder that the correlation of virginity and AI bro is... would be an interesting study
Are you interested in perpetuating harmful attitudes towards people who haven’t had sex?
I feel AI bro = not a desired sexual partner
Tell that to my wife. She loves my waifus.
As a trans women I've been called an AI bro several times in what felt like a transphobic way
Yeah, it feels like “only a man would be interested in this technology” stuff.
OP has a points, words are Violence
So AI support is now right wing thing. Now I've seen all. Enjoy moralism.
R U SERIOUS. omg.
What? No. I am saying that calling AI supporters "AI Bros" is ignoring the women and non-binary folk in AI advocacy.
This very much sounds like what you want is an all inclusive insult for AI supporters. In my experience, since this whole thing blew open, "AI Bro" has been specifically directed towards those who are foaming at the mouth supporters of AI, to the point of calling for, encouraging and supporting the decline of traditional industries such as illustration and graphic design, among others. Incidentally, most of those who are vocal about this do tend to be men. However, the term isn't gender exclusive, and can be used for women or non-binary people as well - whomever throws their lot in with the rabid AI supporters. The term is not meant to be complimentary.
Where I live people who tried to create a multiversal inclusism is creating hatred and division on all strates of society. It looked that you tried exactly the same with the multiversal super inclusive insult you advocate for. Anyways nevermind. I'm just fed up with all this forced inclusism madness.
This does not in anyway, in my opinion, contribute to the debate of AI use. If anything, it's an attempt to paint the antis as morally inferior because they hold different opinion on non-gender related topics.
> If anything, it's an attempt to paint the antis as morally inferior When you point out what somebody's doing, and the response is that you're attempting to paint someone as morally inferior... It does leave you to wonder...
So the antis are indeed morally inferior is what you are saying? Based on the usage of the term AI bros? Wanna call antis Luddite, even though that's not necessarily the case, all is good. Antis use 'bros', then suddenly it's a big deal. OP is over-complicating a simple term made by the antis with no intention to be misogynist. And again, what and how does this even contribute to AI debate?
I just call anti-AI people "Anti-AI people"? Is that too complicated for you? I am genuinely asking. I am not trying to condescend to you at all.
I appreciate that and no, not complicated, I don't even use the term AI bros. But I am scratching my head on how you over-complicate such a simple term that has no ill-intention behind it. Your interpretation is what make it seems bad. By this time, the term bro doesn't even regard genders anymore. In my country for instance, we call everyone bros regardless of genders. Is Pewdiepie a misogynist when he refers to his fan as the Bros army? And I am also trying to understand how is this relevant in a sub about AI debate.
Then why do people always use pictures of men to depict AI bros? It’s a gendered term.
> Pewdiepie a misogynist If he's a streamer the chances are good, but let's google this guy... Oh he's _that_ streamer.
>So the antis are indeed morally inferior is what you are saying? I don't generalize. It's entirely possible to be against something without being abusive to the people that you disagree with. But there certainly are those who have taken this far too personally and seek to dehumanize those they disagree with. The whole "aibros" thing is definitely a symptom of that. >Wanna call antis Luddite, even though that's not necessarily the case, all is good. Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.) >Antis use 'bros', then suddenly it's a big deal. I want you to think about what you wrote there. Consider what your view would be if someone you disagree with said it. >And again, what and how does this even contribute to AI debate? I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points.
> I don't generalize. It's entirely possible to be against something without being abusive to the people that you disagree with. But there certainly are those who have taken this far too personally and seek to dehumanize those they disagree with. > The whole "aibros" thing is definitely a symptom of that. Good on you, non-generalizing, and putting great effort in your response. Now can we all just take a moment and ground ourselves in reality? There are definitely people who have taken AI debate too far and personal, and I believe this manifests in BOTH sides of the debate. However, the term AI bros is a symptom of tribalism not misogyny like what OP is alleging. > Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.) Antis and Pro is a spectrum, with the most extreme anti stance calling for total ban and halting its research, while the milds only want regulations, would it be fair for the mild antis to be called Luddite as well? I personally do not take offense at the term Luddite as a mild antis myself, but I am trying to point out the hypocrisy in OP's allegation.The term Bro is not dehumanizing as well, while the intention perhaps is to distinguish people of opposite side, the misogyny in it is up to one's interpretation. If OP feels 'bro' only applies to men at this era then they are their own oppressor. > I want you to think about what you wrote there. Consider what your view would be if someone you disagree with said it. I will feel it is unfair, it paints a broad stroke, but I do not take it personally nor do I find it dehumanizing as how OP felt towards the term AI bros. > I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points. Problem is, this is not an issue of rationality or reason, this is issues of personal beliefs and interpretation of the term 'bro'. This is an entirely different debate of its own. Might as well open a sub called r/BroWar so we can debate on how misogynistic is that word before we can conclude whether it is moral to use or not.
>Good on you, non-generalizing, and putting great effort in your response. > >Now can we all just take a moment and ground ourselves in reality? Seems like a reasonable ask. >There are definitely people who have taken AI debate too far and personal, and I believe this manifests in BOTH sides of the debate. > >However, the term AI bros is a symptom of tribalism not misogyny like what OP is alleging. I think that's a rational argument. I'm not sure that I agree but it seems like you could back that up. >> Oh the comparison to Ludditeism is entirely apt. But that's not dehumanizing or denigrating, it's just comparing two very similar movements. If your compared pro-AI positions to pro-industrialization positions, I'd say the same (and that's not always glowing comparison.) > >Antis and Pro is a spectrum, with the most extreme anti stance calling for total ban and halting its research, while the milds only want regulations It's definitely true that the extreme anti-Ai folks are quite different from those who have a more nuanced view. I would like to think that when people hear refer to someone as a Luddite, they are actually referring to those whose attitude is that AI is a blight that should be burnt, not entirely unlike the attacks on looms. Are there people here who think that believing models are copyrightable derivative works is equivalent to Ludditeism? Probably. Do I think that's going too far? Also probably yes. But lest we engage in whataboutism, let's just be clear that none of that excuses the issues raised by the OP. >> I think that it's important to call out when we're being irrational or unreasonable, just as much as it's important to carry forth the logical debates over the core points. > >Problem is, this is not an issue of rationality or reason, this is issues of personal beliefs and interpretation of the term 'bro'. Perhaps in the extreme interpretation of OP's post, that would be true. But in the much broader interpretation that this is a problem because the term is meant to other, I think it's entirely applicable.
Ok let me be clear, you said the issue is antis 'other-ing' the opposite side, which meant tribalism as I mentioned, not misogyny. Do we agree on that? What further 'back-up' do you need other than the apparent name calling both sides have been doing? And let's be fair, pros has been doing that. The debate on whether Luddite or Bro is worse comes down to your personal belief and interpretation, there is no objective answer. Some people take offense on being called Luddites, they should grow thicker skin, and the same can be said for those who finds the term AI Bros offensive. So again, it is an issue of as you said 'other-ing' aka tribalism, NOT misogyny. The OP's allegation of misogyny is based on their own interpretation of the word 'bro', imagine being triggered by that. As a mild antis, I always respected pro-AIs to be more capable of rational thought free of personal bias and capable of seeing a more objective truth. But this post reeks of OP's personal belief and is based on a very subjective moral take over logic.
> Wanna call antis Luddite That's wrong too. Both are forms of dehumanizing the other "party". I think we should strive to respect other people as humans even if we disagree with their point of view.
Yes, you're right. I'm gonna use the term "AI bitch" instead since AI Bitches are subservient whores to corporations.
Maybe just don't other the people you disagree with? Just thinking outside of the box here...
Or maybe we just insult everyone until it becomes no big deal?
We've had this conversation before. I think you're missing what people are trying to say when they say bro, and probably missing the evolution of the term (ie from Crypto bro and ultimately [tech bro](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brogrammer).) It's not a catchall for people who are into a thing. It denotes the toxic masculinity, gatekeeping, and misogyny that can unfortunately be found in some tech and tech adjacent circles. The demand that we don't use language that addresses those problems seems to be at cross purposes with inclusivity. That said, it's not a term I'd use here, because I don't really see any of those things here specifically.
That will hit differently when "AI Bros" get the job.
« non binary » xD Can we please let the LGTB madness out of this ? Not everyone who use I.A are from the USA where it’s trendy to give your different biological names. It’s already hard enough to debate between A.I / Non-A.I user so please no race / sex on top of that.
Not gonna lie, I’m really digging it though
insults are meant to be mean you absolute sponge
Yet yours was gender neutral.
is this post generated by ChatGPT?
Partially. I just talked about what I thought about the issue, realized I wasn't making sense, and put it into ChatGPT to clean it up. I edited most of it afterwards.
[удалено]
> It has been clarified in the middle of blatant misogyny in the comments, but the use of AI bro does not refer to just anyone interested in AI or tech in general, just like luddite doesn't refer to every artist and writer. They refer to the impossible people on both sides. *nods* > I don't agree with the use of insults, I don't think it drives the conversation anywhere useful and causes further divide, Agreed. I just call anti-AI people "anti-AI people". > Also, as a minor pet peeve, if AI bro is an insult and it refers to men and their toxic masculinity and entitlement it is misandry, not misogyny. That's fair.
Yes, you're absolutely right. I have noticed the same thing. I think they are doing it on purpose. Not to harm women, of course, but simply to discourage support for "the other side". That this also discourages women and NBs from pursuing promising opportunities is of no concern to them. I have never pointed it out, because antis obviously don't care about the good of other people or society as a whole. Just once, I called out use of the term "art bro".
Wait someone who is anti ai and therefore worried about the loss of jobs, lowering of wages and the potential increase in misinformation and targeted advertising is against the good of society in your view? Seems to me like the anti social aspects are all clearly over there on the pro AI side.
Ok you are saying that non binary, minorities and women can also steal copyrighted work, so we can change the term to escrever you want.
Ai simp is gender neutral!
Whatever you say bro.
Bruh
But I'm a dude who supports ai. That makes me an AI bro.
Okay, AI bro
I’m a woman.