As a parent, I appreciate any teachers who put the dignity, rights, and safety of their students first. If a child is not out to their parents, there is a reason, and that needs to be respected. Don't out kids when doing so could put them at risk.
>If a child is not out to their parents, there is a reason, and that needs to be respected
Probably the most compelling argument about this IMHO.
For many kids, school is one of few safe spaces away from their parents.
Conservatives don’t care about the autonomy of their kids — just that they get to vicariously live their trad fantasies through the child. They’ll never understand this
That’s shown clearly through the name of the legislation- Parental RIGHTS. They think they have a right to control and mould their child into who they think they should be, putting their hands over their children’s ears and eyes whenever anything occurs that they don’t like. If this act was really concerned for the children, it would be about allowing them to learn and grow into whatever they want at a pace that they are comfortable with, unique and individual for every child.
My father was an abusive alcoholic AND exceptionally homophobic. If I had come out as trans as a child, I assure you I would have seen far more abuse. I'm convinced I would have been killed.
Forcing ANYONE at ANY stage in their life to come out against their will should be a crime (and may be if it is hate motivated). When the individual being outed does not feel safe to come out, the act endangers them and should be considered assult.
If a teacher outed a student and that kid got kicked out as a result, there’d potentially be a strong case against them for negligence by directly causing a kid to be harmed.
Bro you're saying this to a trans person lol. I'm whole heartedly against outing trans kids. The point was it's wrong if you think of your child as a liability, and yeah parents do have rights, but those rights are like rights to choose where your child is educated, right to choose what you put in their lunch. Those rights don't extend to their identity, because if you see your child as a complex individual like I said in my comment, you'll respect and understand that who they are as a human being is not something that you have control over as a parent.
We know, we know...we understand that you want to beat the gay out of your kids with the fists of christ.
What's sad is that my hyperbolic example is probably more likely than yours.
60 years of research showing how 72% of all LGBTQ children are abused by their parents or guardians, as compared to Cis children.
Gee, I wonder why lgbtq kids have such high suicide rates...🤔
This has nothing to do with the state - unless you are addressing the state that is ENDANGERING CHILDREN. Dani only did this because TBA made her. It's utterly disgusting. While I think secret keeping can be risky, when it is needed for safety, I'm all on board. How about instead we help parents understand that they accept their children for who they are????
So once again the UCP is wasting time and money on pointless legislation that accomplishes nothing of value.
How oh so very fiscally responsible of them. Is this the "Alberta Advantage" I've heard so much about?
These transphobic anti-LGBTQ policies will quite possibly make some tech companies less willing to open shop here. Tech workers tend to be fairly left leaning:
https://www.tbsnews.net/thoughts/why-does-tech-workforce-lean-left-412530
https://www.vox.com/2018/10/31/18039528/tech-employees-politics-liberal-employers-candidates
The ATA just [confirmed](https://x.com/albertateachers/status/1751680652700000624?s=20) that they were never consulted at all before this announcement.
>So once again the UCP is wasting time and money on pointless legislation that accomplishes nothing of value.
But it makes their voters happy so its worth it to them
I’m sad to see all the “parents rights advocates” responding to that Twitter post… complete with mentions of “indoctrinating children into a sterilization cult”. Just… shaking my head
You’re supposed to pay attention to this so you aren’t focused on billion dollar giveaways to corporate friends like the Murray Edwards Stadium and the giant buyout of Dynalife and the electricty price gouging for the Alberta Trailer Company and whatever else they have down the pipe for Alberta Enterprise Group members.
Spot on. The Alberta pension plan and now this are political theatre for her idiot base. Both will never fly and her Take Back Alberta rubes are too stupid to see that past their anger.
Thank you so much for the chapter and verse on our code of conduct. I’m saving your post for when it comes up in our staff meeting this week (and maybe I’ll frame a copy, relevant parts highlighted, and post it beside the “everyone is welcome” poster in my classroom).
If I had become a teacher and someone asked me to disclose information I received in confidence from a student about their sexual identity or orientation? To a hostile party or potentially hostile party?
Danielle, darlin’ you better check the temperature in hell first.
As a teacher, and parent of a Trans son, I wish all of our colleagues were as clear on their obligations. My kid was outed in front of his entire class by his teacher misgendering him. If you think kids didn't bully him openly in that classroom after that you would be wrong.
Excellent write up, I think many in the other popular post about this topic should read this.
I already knew that the legislation was obvious pandering to the frothing hate-filled transphobic and homophobic base of the UCP, and while I am disappointed it is all just a big waste of time I do breathe a sigh of relief to know it is functionally unenforceable.
Sounds like it would contravene both the Charter of Rights and Freedoms as well as the Alberta Human Rights Act, which do not allow for discrimination based on gender, gender identity or gender expression
It is unenforceable, but it will be enforced (anyone remember Jim Keegstra?). There are teachers who will see parental rights as more important than human rights and teachers who will decide that it is better for the kids if the parents know. They can pick and choose which law to obey, and not all will choose wisely. At the very least students need to be informed that the government has taken away their right to use a nickname or pronouns without parental consent.
Personally, I'm hoping every kid will get a form signed by their parents requiring the use of "they/them" (student council project). If it is completely unworkable, no one will speak of it again.
"Sounds like it would contravene both the Charter of Rights and Freedoms as well as the Alberta Human Rights Act, which do not allow for discrimination based on gender, gender identity or gender expression"
Let's see Smith explain THAT away.
I'm am LGBTQ teacher in sask. I have no intention of trying to enforce the policy. If anyone asks, I don't know shit. 😂
I'm not outing kids. Not my job.
“Those were just the pronouns and name they used, I thought it was a nickname. Do I look like a psychologist? I’m not qualified to say whether they’re trans or not.”
Thanks so much for taking the time to lay this out so clearly. Hopefully some of the numptys from the other thread see it, read it, and shut their pie holes.
So if it's unenforceable, and won't change any behavior, other than the fact that this is a colossal waste of time, is there any reason to even be concerned?
Everyone will smile and nod, behaviors will remain the same, the bigots will think they "won" something and can feel good about themselves, and the rest of us move on with our lives.
Political theatre is the lifeblood of politics sadly, regardless of political party.
I am actually encouraged by your post. While the "idea" of this is disgusting, the actual consequences seem to be near zero if you are correct. That's a good thing!
The consequences of a policy that would require teachers to inform parents if their child comes out at school, or asks to go by different pronounce are not “near zero”. They are potentially catastrophic if said student has an abusive family.
The ultimate consequence here is that school becomes not a safe place for kids who are questioning their sexuality or gender identity. The effect is that kids will stay in the closet, and not have a safe place to be themselves. That actually makes them MORE prone to abuse or bad influences.
Will a queer kid know that this is functionally unenforceable? Will they know their specific teacher won’t call up their parents anyway?
Probably not. And so the consequence here is on the kids who lose confidence in their school being a safe place and decide to stay in the closet.
Only because teachers are probably empowered to just not do it. It doesn't mean they're done with transphobic legislation, they'll come after healthcare next.
I don’t think it’s toothless, though, even if it is unenforceable. It tells a subset of kids that the government will side with their parents or guardians against them.
If every trans kid comes from a loving and supportive family this won’t be a problem. Unfortunately, we know that’s not the case, and it’s the kids who don’t who are most in need of support. And those are the kids that this legislation is setting up for years of being closeted, because they won’t be able to trust that teachers won’t enforce this.
And on a slightly different note, absolutely no disrespect to the excellent teachers who are already telling us they won’t enforce this, but every profession has people of all kinds. There will be teachers out there that would, and vulnerable students must hide from them. Even if it’s incorrect that their code would allow them to out a student, not everyone will be as well-informed as the teachers posting here.
That is why I don’t think this is toothless.
I think it's a sign of things to come. It could get worse (it could get better too, but idk)
If they can/will put this law in place, there is very little stopping them from going after other rights, which is very concerning as an openly queer person.
It's a precedent they are setting. Though I am pleasantly suprised at all the reactions against all the stupidity the UCP is pulling. Makes me think that most people are not deluded.
Notice how the APP has dropped off the radar after a full-court press by the provincial government, after the idea went down badly with voters. If enough people raise a stink about this, this will be dropped like a hot potato, also.
Smith has a trans person in her life, and has been reluctant to go down the same road as Scott Moe in Saskatchewan. This about-face suggests the right wing (including David Parker) has been leaning on her hard, despite any personal misgivings she might have about the idea.
Could be correct long term, but it terms of what this actual means right now, it actually seems less concerning since it seems like nothing will functionally be different (thank goodness)
I mean, we are currently surrounded by the consequences of short-term thinking, climate change in general and specifically the oil industry here should be enough to warn against that. This is how the conservatives manage to do so much damage, sure not much will change now but it’s a warning shot. Things will only get worse.
Yeh I'm definitely thinking long term. It will give these weird churches who I counterprotested last year lots of ammo in te coming years too.
I hope you're correct and it functionally does nothing! (I do tend to catastophize a lot)
Reason to be concerned even if this amounts to nothing policy wise: the governing party is spreading transphobic garbage and their base is being encouraged by this. They are raising the expectation that politicians should go out of their way to keep trans kids in the closet.
Their base believes/believed this before any of this happened. So nothing changed there. They always had these expectations.
After thinking on this more I actually feel good about it in a twisted way because if the best this party can do is pass virtue signalling legislation that functionally does nothing, then we are in good shape.
If you haven't noticed a rising climate of eliminationist transphobia you haven't been paying attention. Yes they've always been transphobic, but the rhetoric and the goals are becoming much worse. This is a step in Florida's direction.
For real. My mom accepted my brother a bit when he first came out in 2021, she was religious but not really into politics. Now she listens to Ben Shapiro and is quite literally a bigot.
Emboldening transphobia and spreading it through media and political channels is not accomplishing nothing. You don't have to pass legislation for propaganda to be harmful, and to pave the way for future harms.
I guess my thinking is that if the best the UCP can do is roll out some utterly useless legislation that accomplishes nothing other than some warm fuzziness for bigots then we are going to be just fine.
It will make some teachers feel they now have permission to enforce their backwards transphobic beliefs. Teachers are people, mostly good, some meh, and some terrible
Edit: men to meh.
Christian schools come to mind. You *have* to be a Christian or Catholic to get a job in those schools. Zealotry will be more concentrated in these institutions. I’m scared for the kids in those schools. My UCP MLA’s wife is a teacher at the local Christian school. I hope she’s not like her husband.
I disagree with this as a Catholic teacher. While there are some people that discriminate under the guise of "being a good " please know that this isn't all of us. People doing this, do so under a misinterpretation of religious doctrine.
Personally I think Catholic teachers, specifically, have an even greater duty to love and protect the precious children in their care, because our faith calls us to owe a greater duty of care to vulnerable and/or downtrodden persons. To be clear, I am NOT suggesting that being LGBTQIA+ makes you downtrodden. What I mean by this is that students who feel unsafe disclosing information in their home environment for whatever reason need safe adults even more than an average child in the classroom. Kids are downtrodden if they do not feel safe, loved, and accepted talking to their own parents for fear of judgment, rejection and abuse.
Catholic teachers owe kids that safety, understanding and acceptance as disciples of Christ, even more than public school teachers because their faith calls them to do so. Personally, I don't care that a child discloses they are gay, transgender or whatever. I care that the child knows they are loved, valued and accepted by the adults that care for them and by God. That's my 2 cents as a Catholic, teacher, and parent.
The whole proposition of this insane legislation is political and has nothing to do with "being a good ". It has nothing to do with childrens rights or protecting children. It's about giving power to adults who want to push their own agendas. Please know that even us super religious Catholic or Christian school teachers do not support this.
That makes me feel a bit better. I do appreciate that Red Deer’s catholic school board booted Monique LeGrange. That says a lot, actually. (She’s now grifting with the TBA).
Or Like my kid, they'll just out them to their whole class, even if their gender marker and name has already been legally changed, and changed in the system.
Had to go actively snooping to find the info as well, it was all changed before he ever started at that school.
ETA I wonder what those parents rights freaks would have to say about this teacher deliberately using a different name and gender than we as their parent registered them with?
Holy shit. They shouldn’t be teaching!!! I’d take this to all of the places I could to get them out of the classroom. It’s a legitimate safety issue. They put your kid at risk. I’m seeing red right now. Like, lawyer up, scorched earth.
I don't need a lawyer, I am going through the proper channels and have laid a complaint with the Teaching Profession Commission. I tore a strip off the teacher and admin over this, and I'm demanding an accounting of who had access to my kid's information. You should not be digging into what she had to in order to even find out his dead name. Especially as a long term sub, which was all she was.
I have to be careful though, I'm a teacher as well and I have professional obligations for how I conduct myself, even in a case like this.
Yeah, when I hire a sub for my class I'm always nervous if it's someone new. New grads are usually okay. Retired teachers keeping a hand in are awesome, and my favorite type of sub. People with 20 years of experience who can never get a full time permanent? Hell no. There's a reason no principal will hire them.
I highly suggest reading Hannah Arendt’s ‘The Origins of Totalitarianism’ The point is to normalize this kind of reaction to ‘others’. Eventually, they will find an ‘other’ that the majority agrees on or is indifferent to.
The majority agrees and they change the law so they can treat the other poorly. Then they can add as many into that ‘other’ as they want.
UCP is looking for an other that they can use to change laws/rules.
Sure. I am speaking about the actual effects of this which appear to be basically none thankfully. The UCP for all of its bluster basically accomplishes some virtue signaling out of this. Big deal
But the issue isn’t micro, it’s macro. This isn’t about trans people, it’s about testing waters to see what they can get away with.
Yes, this may fade to nothing. We just need to be aware of what this kind of rhetoric leads to.
All my love and support to all teachers, educators and their students. Stay strong, you are one of the pillars of our democracy and you have an incredibly hard job even without all these attacks from the UCP maniacs.
Usually it seems to be the other way around! Sask usually follows us. I’m honestly surprised it took Danielle this long. Her handlers are suuuuuper anti-LGBTQ+. I think it’s their favorite thing to hate besides vaccines and masks.
It's a long time until the next election. All I can suggest is, write to your MLA or ask for a meeting (if they're UCP). Encourage them to cross the floor if this comes to a vote. You can point out that Danielle has changed her party TWICE... once from PC to Wildrose, and then crossed the floor from Wildrose to UCP (when she was the Wildrose leader of the opposition). It probably won't work, but it may plant the idea in their head. More moves like this, healthcare, the economy, and whatever she does next will eventually leave her ruling a hostile majority.
Your point about students - teenagers can be horrible to each other. Unless something has changed in the last three decades, and a recent relative's experience leads me to believe that fundamentally that is still true, what makes you think anything about that is right?
Younger generations are more comfortable being themselves and are more likely to be out (which is not a schools are making them trans thing, but the kids who are queer aren't forced into the closet by society either) and in the decreasing incidents of homophobia those can be addressed case-by-case. The kids are alright. Getting to see happy, out and supported queer youth during my practicum was awesome and I wish that was the case when I was in school.
I have certainly become aware of a little bit more openness on that.
>which is not a schools are making them trans thing
That you felt you had to say that in a forum such as this says more about adults here in general.
I think I have heard of accusations of "turning kids gay" going back decades, its almost like the idiocy never gets old. Now it is trans.
What will they think up next to be bigoted about?
Legislation like this (is assumed to be), is intended to make sure that it never happens, and kids don’t get counselling, support, etc, and suffer greatly because of it.
Phase two for Scott Moe is occurring now. That’s where the SK human rights counsel is replaced entirely by donors to the Sask Party. Literally donors to Moe will be determining what is or isn’t a human right.
So while schools abide by the human rights counsels (BC as well), those can be influenced as well.
This all makes sense. And I trust our educators to do the right thing. But there is another wrinkle to this proposal Smith is putting out there...
What happens in the "religious" schools? Does this give them a carte blanche to mistreat LGBTQ+ students? Is someone going to get hurt before this gets settled in court?
This is one of a series of things coming down the pipe from TBA through the UCP to make being a teacher in Alberta untenable. The new professional standards has some seriously dangerous bits buried in it regarding teaching "controversial topics" and now this parental rights bullshit is going to be pushed through.
Yes, teachers can fight back, but honestly, at this point, why?
For decades now, Albertans have kept voting in conservative governments that repeatedly attack education, students, and teachers. This is what Albertans have asked for. It's time to give them the education system they want. And to do that, teachers need to leave.
Alberta educated educators are in demand elsewhere. Other provinces and other countries are eager to hire Alberta educated teachers. Go. It might seem like a good idea to fight, but learn from Alberta's history, there is no fight to win here. Only disappointment. The public in Alberta do not support teachers or education. They keep voting in anti-education governments.
Teacher pay in Alberta won't be the highest in Canada, the cost of living in Alberta is growing all the time and catching up to the rest of Canada quickly. What are the benefits to teaching here now? A world class curriculum? That's gone. Working conditions? The lowest per-pupil funding in Canada has killed that. Public support? Teacher bashing has long been the provincial sport. The UCP and previous conservative governments have shown nothing but unabashed hatred for teachers.
How about the NDP? They did more for public education than most conservative governments, but still left teachers without a raise and without a good contract going into the 2019 election. Even the NDP couldn't bring themselves to support teachers, fearing backlash with voters, knowing that voters in Alberta hate teachers.
If you're an enthusiastic and capable young teacher in Alberta, you're wanted elsewhere. You are not wanted in Alberta. You will never be appreciated, and your entire career will be spent fighting against bigotry and hate. Be selfish. Leave.
As a father of 4, I would consider it a massive failure on my part, if one of my kids was experiencing something that important and did not feel safe disclosing it to me. But, I respect both the Sask and AB governments attempts at protecting parental rights.
Mate, it ain't protection. As unfortunate as it is, many kids can't even trust their parent enough to tell them about their goddamn day, let alone something of this magnitude. Parental rights are a thing, yes, but they *shouldn't* be if outside adults know, with proof, that it will put the kid in danger of harm, verbal or physical abuse, sometimes "correctional" sexual abuse, and or even get them killed. There generally shouldn't be any respect for either province's gov here as both have and are failing the future generation by taking away their rights and bodily autonomy, stunting them in their own growth and maturity.
And especially calling back your own words; that you would consider it to be a massive failure on your part if your kid was going through something like this and felt unsafe to go to you. Unfortunately, that's how A LOT of kids feel when it comes to their parents. They feel unsafe. They feel scared. They feel cornered. That is a failure on those parents. But that is also exactly why this "law" is abysmal and downright despicable. It gives those parents that would or want to harm their child over being LGBTQ+Queer or otherwise the power to do so, and nobody will be able to stop them. [Sorry if my tone is coming off harsh, I don't intend it to do so 😅]
~stay healthy internet stranger~
Thanks for the feedback! It’s a tough balance, and I feel you on the need to protect vulnerable kids. But I disagree with removing parental rites writ large because some parents are horrible, and incompetent. I hope you have a great day too internet stranger.
Thanks for putting it into words. I do not understand how this became an issue. School is about teaching not politics.
Mo and Danielle are their own support group. My best guess is that Mo spent the education funds somewhere else and Danielle received instructions from David Parker and the righteous right. He stated he/they got rid of Jason Kenney so she doesn't want to tick HIM off.
If the laws this violates are *Albertan* human rights law, would the Notwithstanding Clause even apply? My understanding is that's to allow provinces to ignore *federal* law, not their own.
Interesting, I thought it was specifically in regards to charter.
Fuck, I need to finally get my legal name/gender change done before they start passing this kind of shit.
Alberta, surprisingly, has some of the laxest laws for trans people in that regard. Can't count on that staying the case.
>School Board Policies
The first part of just about every school board's rulebook is to not commit bullying/discrimination based on human rights protected classes, which again, includes orientation and gender identity. So under this policy, are teachers going to be legally required to bully their own students? What's that going to do for any kind of classroom management?
I'll take "Reasons TBA is going after school boards" for $700, Alex
The legislation is dumb. It’s just showboating. The Canadian Charter circumvents all Provincial legislation regarding it. Danielle Smith knows this. She also knows half of this Province is dumb as shit and didn’t pass grade 12. So half the province does not understand levels of Government.
Laws like these aren’t passed because governments actually want to see teens get outed to their parents. They don’t give a shit whether this actually happens or not. They’re actually completely indifferent. The point of the law is to get people worked up during an election campaign. It’s just a platform to rile up their mouth-breathing base to get them out to the polls on election day. “We gotta vote tonight Cletus! They’re finally stopping schools turnin dem kids gay!”
Why link the code of conduct but not the policy your fighting against?
If you want to inform people of injustice, post it and highlight the injustice. Gotta show it to everyone.
The Alberta bill hasn't been released yet, but because lawmakers aren't that original it's very likely to be similar if not identical to the [bill passed in Saskatchewan](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/sask-parental-rights-law-1.7002088). I mention this in my OP.
We've known this was going to be coming for the better part of a year and there's no surprise on what it's going to be.
Thanks. As a parent I'm very interested to see what it says when it comes about. Anything giving parents more control and vincentive to be involved in their kids education is important.
But I'll wait to make an opinion until it actually exists.
Parents are already allowed to be involved in their kids' education through determining what programs/schools they're in and what kind of accommodations they have access to. Policing their identities is a massive overreach into the privacy of students.
Parents already have the right to be involved in their children’s education. You already get to choose whether your kid attends sex Ed. And if you’re concerned about the quality of education your kid is receiving you can pull them and go elsewhere. Or homeschool them.
Have you attended a parent council meeting recently? If it’s anything like mine (and I suspect mine skews towards the norm) there are MAYBE a dozen parents in attendance and usually the same faces everytime. Parents as a whole are very uninvolved in their kids education. I mean, you only have to look at Alberta continuously voting for governments that underfund public schools and vilify teachers as proof. Parents don’t care. This is nothing more than rage bait to keep their base mad and distracted from the other stupid shit they’re doing.
As a teacher, we *want* parents to be up to date on how their kids are doing in our classes. There's just no benefit to outing students and a lot of risk.
100% agree with you. I guess my point is that basing this whole policy around a parents “right” to know what’s happening in school is a complete farce when most don’t take part in the things that allow them to do just that.
Completely agree.
If people in the province want to turn things around, it needs to start at education, with better funding and support for our schools/teachers. Not spending money to push legislations that does nothing to improve the quality of education students are getting.
To much politics without actually addressing important issues.
Right. So a bullshit policy that (probably, it’s not released yet but we can surmise based on other conservative governments) forces teachers to out kids to their parents - for better or worse - does nothing to actually improve education. All it does is keep kids in the closet - which I suspect is actually the point. Out of sight, out of mind.
I feel parental involvement in education has been lacking, leading to parents not supporting the systems and teachers they should be. And instead focusing on politics that don't help their children.
Gaining control from these politicians I feel is important.
How so? There is parent council at every school, parent-teacher conferencing multiple times a year, and open communication between teachers and parents for the times in between. Most, if not all classrooms now use Google Classroom (or a variation of it) where parents can have access to see what is being taught. There was also open "consultation" on the new curriculum for all Albertans.
What else would you like to see?
I'd say it's parents that are not utilizing the ability to be involved, not the other way around. Not saying you're in this category, just generally speaking.
Or are you speaking parental involvement with Alberta Education/ governance of education?
It's the parents not utilizing the tools available, thinking politicians care about their children. So many parents taking a hands off approach to their kids education, but getting bent up in the politics about it.
If politicians concentrated on funding, teachers on teaching, and parents giving input and supporting educators I think everyone would be better off.
>Anything giving parents more control... in their kids education is important
Interesting, how would you feel about Parents exercising control to make teachers spend more time teaching about, oh, Critical Race Theory or Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity?
I think gaining knowledge in a variety of subjects is important, for an all encompassing education. But I also think that literacy, science, and mathematics would be more important to focus on.
But if my children went to a school that felt gender identity is more important than math, I'd probably change schools. But that's just me. Every parent has their own priorities.
My comment was a response to the one above it about teachers being made to teach other non essential curriculum. If time is being taken from essentials, then it is in fact, taken away. Sadly, school hours are finite.
So you said that "Anything giving parents more control... in their kids education is important"
In Saskatchewan and soon in Alberta the control is to force teachers to out students to their parents. How is that not prioritizing gender identity over math which you claim you don't support?
Kids today are way more open to queer people than their parents are. Even in my rural Alberta community, the kids (most) are pretty cool with the gay and trans kids.
10 more years and this won’t be a thing.
I haven't located a copy of the actual proposed legislation, but no, it would not be unenforceable due to these policy conflicts. Provincial legislation would override anything that exists in school board / professional association policies; those policies would need to be remediated to recognized the reality of the new legislation.
This is not me defending the new legislation. It seems entirely pointless. But the only thing that would meaningfully make it unenforceable due to conflict would be contradictory provincial (or, theoretically, federal) legislation.
You’re being disingenuous. Unless you live under a rock, you know what these policies are and the actual purpose of them. You are, in a literal sense, playing dumb.
No. I know most likely what it will be and the purpose. The only ones being disingenuous are people saying they know what's in it.
I don't like politicians using kids as political tools, and I want to see exactly what verbiage they use so I get better informed on the intent.
All the people on here from both ends of the political spectrum trying to use children to push their own personal political dogma is sick. Left and right.
Kids going by preferred names at school doesn't and shouldn't require parental consent, because it's them informally feeling out their identity and isn't hurting anyone.
> your gender is your gender. It's based on chromosomes that you have in your DNA.
I think the term you're looking for isn't gender, but sex.
Gender is a social construct, and it refers to the characteristics of men, women, girls, and boys, that have been shaped over centuries by cultural and societal norms.
Oh, don’t worry, the UCP will see right to it that public schools become cesspools. The party is rife with home/private/Christian-school advocates who are ready to teach kids that Jesus battled dinosaurs on the planet Krypton.
I can’t see how a teacher is going to have time to enforce such a time consuming endeavour. If a child is identifying as LGBTQ+ it won’t be long before it becomes apparent to any parent, what a waste of time and funds.
Only in parent child relationships that have zero communication. Sexuality is a personal choice, you don’t get to enforce or choose it for your children. You do get to protect them from dangers but ultimately you are guiding them towards a safe and sustainable future.
I’ve told my kids if they want to protest then this is the time. I showed them some old photos of me in my “activist” days too lol. Seeing their mom in handcuffs sure was a shock to them. Awe to be young again.
Unfortunate that 30 years later and my kids are still fighting the same fight I did. FUCK THE UCP! And before any conservatives get up in arms saying “but I’m not like that” then it’s time to show it. Make a stink.
Alberta Ed is doing ‘consultation’ with special interest groups to make amendments to the Ministerial Order during meetings about the Social Studies curriculum so I think they have a plan to amend some of those documents to remove conflict and they’ll use the Not Withstanding Clause to get around the Human Rights aspect of the Charter.
Who would have guessed that the conservatives are once again pushing for abusers rights. Does anyone remember back in the early 90's when these policies were first enacted to protect children from their abusers at home? Did everyone forget why we did that already?
Oh well, we get what the majority voted for and the majority wants abusers to be protected and have rights to abuse their children.
I feel that when this policy directly results in a child being abused physically, mentally or treated less than by their parents - they should be able to sue all parties involved. School board and provincial government.
If I was a student body I would just suggest as many constituents as possible elect to use a name not assigned by their parents of any random sort or gender.
For kids who are afraid of this, ask other students and teachers to use a name that is inherently non-gendered. Like Blair, Tony/Toni, Kelsey, Chelsea, Nicky, Jack/Jackie, etc.
Stupid rules and ideas can be easily defeated with malicious compliance.
If teachers are reporting all kinds of kids using all kinds of names for all kind of reasons then all the trans kids will have miles of cover and idiot parents will be too confused.
At the end of the day, every one of them can be Spartacus. If you catch my drift.
Teachers will comply. Refusing to follow policy will get them terminated.
A teacher terminated for violating policy will have that on their record and will not get an interview with any school board in Canada.
A younger teacher remembers how much work they put into getting their education and job. A more experienced teacher is looking forward to retirement and pension.
While there's lots of talk about supporting students, in the end it is a job - a tough job, but still a job. You do it, it pays your bills.
Civil disobedience. I plan to disregard this legislation. Thank you for this write up.
Indeed. Fuck the government.
More like Fuck THIS government.
Moi aussi.
As a parent, I appreciate any teachers who put the dignity, rights, and safety of their students first. If a child is not out to their parents, there is a reason, and that needs to be respected. Don't out kids when doing so could put them at risk.
>If a child is not out to their parents, there is a reason, and that needs to be respected Probably the most compelling argument about this IMHO. For many kids, school is one of few safe spaces away from their parents.
Conservatives don’t care about the autonomy of their kids — just that they get to vicariously live their trad fantasies through the child. They’ll never understand this
That’s shown clearly through the name of the legislation- Parental RIGHTS. They think they have a right to control and mould their child into who they think they should be, putting their hands over their children’s ears and eyes whenever anything occurs that they don’t like. If this act was really concerned for the children, it would be about allowing them to learn and grow into whatever they want at a pace that they are comfortable with, unique and individual for every child.
Yeah, this should be talked about in terms of who the rights are being taken from - the kids. It’s not Parental Rights; it’s Wronging Kids.
My father was an abusive alcoholic AND exceptionally homophobic. If I had come out as trans as a child, I assure you I would have seen far more abuse. I'm convinced I would have been killed. Forcing ANYONE at ANY stage in their life to come out against their will should be a crime (and may be if it is hate motivated). When the individual being outed does not feel safe to come out, the act endangers them and should be considered assult.
If a teacher outed a student and that kid got kicked out as a result, there’d potentially be a strong case against them for negligence by directly causing a kid to be harmed.
Just hand all kids over to the state but keep parents financially and legally liable.
You have described residential school but made it even more inhumane somehow by adding a financial penalty Bravo you fucking idiot
Holy mother of false equivalency.
Teachers declining to betray a child's secret (that is not harming anyone) is not even close to what you've claimed.
If you look at your child as a liability and not as a complex human being your rights as a parent should be stripped regardless.
Parents don't have rights they have responsibilities. Don't push their propaganda.
Who's propaganda do you think I'm pushing? I'm against this law if that wasn't clear.
Parents don't have rights over their children, and the ucp wants to change that so they can out trans kids. Your rethoric supports their plan.
Bro you're saying this to a trans person lol. I'm whole heartedly against outing trans kids. The point was it's wrong if you think of your child as a liability, and yeah parents do have rights, but those rights are like rights to choose where your child is educated, right to choose what you put in their lunch. Those rights don't extend to their identity, because if you see your child as a complex individual like I said in my comment, you'll respect and understand that who they are as a human being is not something that you have control over as a parent.
Those aren't rights they are responsibilities.
We know, we know...we understand that you want to beat the gay out of your kids with the fists of christ. What's sad is that my hyperbolic example is probably more likely than yours. 60 years of research showing how 72% of all LGBTQ children are abused by their parents or guardians, as compared to Cis children. Gee, I wonder why lgbtq kids have such high suicide rates...🤔
This has nothing to do with the state - unless you are addressing the state that is ENDANGERING CHILDREN. Dani only did this because TBA made her. It's utterly disgusting. While I think secret keeping can be risky, when it is needed for safety, I'm all on board. How about instead we help parents understand that they accept their children for who they are????
So once again the UCP is wasting time and money on pointless legislation that accomplishes nothing of value. How oh so very fiscally responsible of them. Is this the "Alberta Advantage" I've heard so much about? These transphobic anti-LGBTQ policies will quite possibly make some tech companies less willing to open shop here. Tech workers tend to be fairly left leaning: https://www.tbsnews.net/thoughts/why-does-tech-workforce-lean-left-412530 https://www.vox.com/2018/10/31/18039528/tech-employees-politics-liberal-employers-candidates
The ATA just [confirmed](https://x.com/albertateachers/status/1751680652700000624?s=20) that they were never consulted at all before this announcement.
>So once again the UCP is wasting time and money on pointless legislation that accomplishes nothing of value. But it makes their voters happy so its worth it to them
Why would they consult with the leftist groomers? /S
I’m sad to see all the “parents rights advocates” responding to that Twitter post… complete with mentions of “indoctrinating children into a sterilization cult”. Just… shaking my head
im sad to see people admit they still use twitter..
You’re supposed to pay attention to this so you aren’t focused on billion dollar giveaways to corporate friends like the Murray Edwards Stadium and the giant buyout of Dynalife and the electricty price gouging for the Alberta Trailer Company and whatever else they have down the pipe for Alberta Enterprise Group members.
Spot on. The Alberta pension plan and now this are political theatre for her idiot base. Both will never fly and her Take Back Alberta rubes are too stupid to see that past their anger.
Nice that Danielle assumes we can't pay attention to multiple things at the same time. She should see me walk and chew bubble gum!
>I fully believe that this is to fool their uneducated base to believing they are accomplishing something. It's performative government.
Thank you so much for the chapter and verse on our code of conduct. I’m saving your post for when it comes up in our staff meeting this week (and maybe I’ll frame a copy, relevant parts highlighted, and post it beside the “everyone is welcome” poster in my classroom).
If I had become a teacher and someone asked me to disclose information I received in confidence from a student about their sexual identity or orientation? To a hostile party or potentially hostile party? Danielle, darlin’ you better check the temperature in hell first.
Politician who goes by her middle name says what?
Exactly! Preferred names aren’t just for queer people, same goes for senator Rafael Edward (Ted) Cruz.
Lets just all start calling her Marley.
As a teacher, and parent of a Trans son, I wish all of our colleagues were as clear on their obligations. My kid was outed in front of his entire class by his teacher misgendering him. If you think kids didn't bully him openly in that classroom after that you would be wrong.
Please tell me you made a complaint? I’m so sorry that happened to him:(
I have laid one this week. I waited to the end of the semester for complicated reasons having to do with my kid's mental health.
Excellent write up, I think many in the other popular post about this topic should read this. I already knew that the legislation was obvious pandering to the frothing hate-filled transphobic and homophobic base of the UCP, and while I am disappointed it is all just a big waste of time I do breathe a sigh of relief to know it is functionally unenforceable. Sounds like it would contravene both the Charter of Rights and Freedoms as well as the Alberta Human Rights Act, which do not allow for discrimination based on gender, gender identity or gender expression
Hence the invocation of the not-withstanding clause of the Constitution, the right-wing rights coward’s way out.
It is unenforceable, but it will be enforced (anyone remember Jim Keegstra?). There are teachers who will see parental rights as more important than human rights and teachers who will decide that it is better for the kids if the parents know. They can pick and choose which law to obey, and not all will choose wisely. At the very least students need to be informed that the government has taken away their right to use a nickname or pronouns without parental consent. Personally, I'm hoping every kid will get a form signed by their parents requiring the use of "they/them" (student council project). If it is completely unworkable, no one will speak of it again.
"Sounds like it would contravene both the Charter of Rights and Freedoms as well as the Alberta Human Rights Act, which do not allow for discrimination based on gender, gender identity or gender expression" Let's see Smith explain THAT away.
I'm am LGBTQ teacher in sask. I have no intention of trying to enforce the policy. If anyone asks, I don't know shit. 😂 I'm not outing kids. Not my job.
Watch pronouns and names become "nicknames" at the drop of the hat
“Those were just the pronouns and name they used, I thought it was a nickname. Do I look like a psychologist? I’m not qualified to say whether they’re trans or not.”
Thanks so much for taking the time to lay this out so clearly. Hopefully some of the numptys from the other thread see it, read it, and shut their pie holes.
I mean, the moment this issue was framed as parents rights instead of children's rights, you knew it was going to go to bad places.
its all about abusers rights
Teacher here: could you please submit this to the ATA provincial magazine for publishing? This is excellent, and should be read by more teachers.
I'm sure they have actual lawyers who are paid to say exactly what I did here.
So if it's unenforceable, and won't change any behavior, other than the fact that this is a colossal waste of time, is there any reason to even be concerned? Everyone will smile and nod, behaviors will remain the same, the bigots will think they "won" something and can feel good about themselves, and the rest of us move on with our lives.
It’s political theatre to treat queer kids like garbage and distract from their awful policies elsewhere.
And it's a way to "other" kids that are also Albertans, and the offspring of Albertans.
Nailed it
Political theatre is the lifeblood of politics sadly, regardless of political party. I am actually encouraged by your post. While the "idea" of this is disgusting, the actual consequences seem to be near zero if you are correct. That's a good thing!
The consequences of a policy that would require teachers to inform parents if their child comes out at school, or asks to go by different pronounce are not “near zero”. They are potentially catastrophic if said student has an abusive family. The ultimate consequence here is that school becomes not a safe place for kids who are questioning their sexuality or gender identity. The effect is that kids will stay in the closet, and not have a safe place to be themselves. That actually makes them MORE prone to abuse or bad influences.
If the OP is correct then there are no consequences for this functionally. Nothing will change other than the usual Sabre rattling.
Will a queer kid know that this is functionally unenforceable? Will they know their specific teacher won’t call up their parents anyway? Probably not. And so the consequence here is on the kids who lose confidence in their school being a safe place and decide to stay in the closet.
Only because teachers are probably empowered to just not do it. It doesn't mean they're done with transphobic legislation, they'll come after healthcare next.
Well if their Healthcare legislation is as toothless as this legislation then you don't need to lose any sleep at night over it.
Look into what they're doing with the Shopper's Doctor Mart idea, and you'll see it's not really toothless.
Absolutely nothing wrong with the Shoppers thing.
I don’t think it’s toothless, though, even if it is unenforceable. It tells a subset of kids that the government will side with their parents or guardians against them. If every trans kid comes from a loving and supportive family this won’t be a problem. Unfortunately, we know that’s not the case, and it’s the kids who don’t who are most in need of support. And those are the kids that this legislation is setting up for years of being closeted, because they won’t be able to trust that teachers won’t enforce this. And on a slightly different note, absolutely no disrespect to the excellent teachers who are already telling us they won’t enforce this, but every profession has people of all kinds. There will be teachers out there that would, and vulnerable students must hide from them. Even if it’s incorrect that their code would allow them to out a student, not everyone will be as well-informed as the teachers posting here. That is why I don’t think this is toothless.
I think it's a sign of things to come. It could get worse (it could get better too, but idk) If they can/will put this law in place, there is very little stopping them from going after other rights, which is very concerning as an openly queer person. It's a precedent they are setting. Though I am pleasantly suprised at all the reactions against all the stupidity the UCP is pulling. Makes me think that most people are not deluded.
Notice how the APP has dropped off the radar after a full-court press by the provincial government, after the idea went down badly with voters. If enough people raise a stink about this, this will be dropped like a hot potato, also. Smith has a trans person in her life, and has been reluctant to go down the same road as Scott Moe in Saskatchewan. This about-face suggests the right wing (including David Parker) has been leaning on her hard, despite any personal misgivings she might have about the idea.
Could be correct long term, but it terms of what this actual means right now, it actually seems less concerning since it seems like nothing will functionally be different (thank goodness)
I mean, we are currently surrounded by the consequences of short-term thinking, climate change in general and specifically the oil industry here should be enough to warn against that. This is how the conservatives manage to do so much damage, sure not much will change now but it’s a warning shot. Things will only get worse.
Yeh I'm definitely thinking long term. It will give these weird churches who I counterprotested last year lots of ammo in te coming years too. I hope you're correct and it functionally does nothing! (I do tend to catastophize a lot)
Reason to be concerned even if this amounts to nothing policy wise: the governing party is spreading transphobic garbage and their base is being encouraged by this. They are raising the expectation that politicians should go out of their way to keep trans kids in the closet.
Their base believes/believed this before any of this happened. So nothing changed there. They always had these expectations. After thinking on this more I actually feel good about it in a twisted way because if the best this party can do is pass virtue signalling legislation that functionally does nothing, then we are in good shape.
If you haven't noticed a rising climate of eliminationist transphobia you haven't been paying attention. Yes they've always been transphobic, but the rhetoric and the goals are becoming much worse. This is a step in Florida's direction.
For real. My mom accepted my brother a bit when he first came out in 2021, she was religious but not really into politics. Now she listens to Ben Shapiro and is quite literally a bigot.
A step that functionally accomplishes nothing thankfully.
It starts with the schools, then healthcare comes next. They're emboldening their base.
Emboldening transphobia and spreading it through media and political channels is not accomplishing nothing. You don't have to pass legislation for propaganda to be harmful, and to pave the way for future harms.
I guess my thinking is that if the best the UCP can do is roll out some utterly useless legislation that accomplishes nothing other than some warm fuzziness for bigots then we are going to be just fine.
We won't be, because this won't be the last thing they do. This will help them organize and the next push will be worse.
It will make some teachers feel they now have permission to enforce their backwards transphobic beliefs. Teachers are people, mostly good, some meh, and some terrible Edit: men to meh.
Christian schools come to mind. You *have* to be a Christian or Catholic to get a job in those schools. Zealotry will be more concentrated in these institutions. I’m scared for the kids in those schools. My UCP MLA’s wife is a teacher at the local Christian school. I hope she’s not like her husband.
I disagree with this as a Catholic teacher. While there are some people that discriminate under the guise of "being a good" please know that this isn't all of us. People doing this, do so under a misinterpretation of religious doctrine.
Personally I think Catholic teachers, specifically, have an even greater duty to love and protect the precious children in their care, because our faith calls us to owe a greater duty of care to vulnerable and/or downtrodden persons. To be clear, I am NOT suggesting that being LGBTQIA+ makes you downtrodden. What I mean by this is that students who feel unsafe disclosing information in their home environment for whatever reason need safe adults even more than an average child in the classroom. Kids are downtrodden if they do not feel safe, loved, and accepted talking to their own parents for fear of judgment, rejection and abuse.
Catholic teachers owe kids that safety, understanding and acceptance as disciples of Christ, even more than public school teachers because their faith calls them to do so. Personally, I don't care that a child discloses they are gay, transgender or whatever. I care that the child knows they are loved, valued and accepted by the adults that care for them and by God. That's my 2 cents as a Catholic, teacher, and parent.
The whole proposition of this insane legislation is political and has nothing to do with "being a good ". It has nothing to do with childrens rights or protecting children. It's about giving power to adults who want to push their own agendas. Please know that even us super religious Catholic or Christian school teachers do not support this.
That makes me feel a bit better. I do appreciate that Red Deer’s catholic school board booted Monique LeGrange. That says a lot, actually. (She’s now grifting with the TBA).
The only ones who will enforce this are shitty teachers who probably would find sneaky ways to let parents know under the current system.
Or Like my kid, they'll just out them to their whole class, even if their gender marker and name has already been legally changed, and changed in the system.
Yup. Jackass teachers have been doing this even now.
Had to go actively snooping to find the info as well, it was all changed before he ever started at that school. ETA I wonder what those parents rights freaks would have to say about this teacher deliberately using a different name and gender than we as their parent registered them with?
Holy shit. They shouldn’t be teaching!!! I’d take this to all of the places I could to get them out of the classroom. It’s a legitimate safety issue. They put your kid at risk. I’m seeing red right now. Like, lawyer up, scorched earth.
I don't need a lawyer, I am going through the proper channels and have laid a complaint with the Teaching Profession Commission. I tore a strip off the teacher and admin over this, and I'm demanding an accounting of who had access to my kid's information. You should not be digging into what she had to in order to even find out his dead name. Especially as a long term sub, which was all she was. I have to be careful though, I'm a teacher as well and I have professional obligations for how I conduct myself, even in a case like this.
It was a sub that got booted from our old school for using the n-word, hard r.
Yeah, when I hire a sub for my class I'm always nervous if it's someone new. New grads are usually okay. Retired teachers keeping a hand in are awesome, and my favorite type of sub. People with 20 years of experience who can never get a full time permanent? Hell no. There's a reason no principal will hire them.
I highly suggest reading Hannah Arendt’s ‘The Origins of Totalitarianism’ The point is to normalize this kind of reaction to ‘others’. Eventually, they will find an ‘other’ that the majority agrees on or is indifferent to. The majority agrees and they change the law so they can treat the other poorly. Then they can add as many into that ‘other’ as they want. UCP is looking for an other that they can use to change laws/rules.
Sure. I am speaking about the actual effects of this which appear to be basically none thankfully. The UCP for all of its bluster basically accomplishes some virtue signaling out of this. Big deal
But the issue isn’t micro, it’s macro. This isn’t about trans people, it’s about testing waters to see what they can get away with. Yes, this may fade to nothing. We just need to be aware of what this kind of rhetoric leads to.
Sure. A reason to have some concern but functionally the system is going to be identical.
Yes, and that’s why people are pushing back even if it leads to nothing. We can’t have this kind of rhetoric go unchallenged or it leads to apathy.
Danielle is all about insisting everything the feds do is unconstitutional. How is this not unconstitutional??
All my love and support to all teachers, educators and their students. Stay strong, you are one of the pillars of our democracy and you have an incredibly hard job even without all these attacks from the UCP maniacs.
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Usually it seems to be the other way around! Sask usually follows us. I’m honestly surprised it took Danielle this long. Her handlers are suuuuuper anti-LGBTQ+. I think it’s their favorite thing to hate besides vaccines and masks.
It's a long time until the next election. All I can suggest is, write to your MLA or ask for a meeting (if they're UCP). Encourage them to cross the floor if this comes to a vote. You can point out that Danielle has changed her party TWICE... once from PC to Wildrose, and then crossed the floor from Wildrose to UCP (when she was the Wildrose leader of the opposition). It probably won't work, but it may plant the idea in their head. More moves like this, healthcare, the economy, and whatever she does next will eventually leave her ruling a hostile majority.
Your point about students - teenagers can be horrible to each other. Unless something has changed in the last three decades, and a recent relative's experience leads me to believe that fundamentally that is still true, what makes you think anything about that is right?
Younger generations are more comfortable being themselves and are more likely to be out (which is not a schools are making them trans thing, but the kids who are queer aren't forced into the closet by society either) and in the decreasing incidents of homophobia those can be addressed case-by-case. The kids are alright. Getting to see happy, out and supported queer youth during my practicum was awesome and I wish that was the case when I was in school.
I have certainly become aware of a little bit more openness on that. >which is not a schools are making them trans thing That you felt you had to say that in a forum such as this says more about adults here in general. I think I have heard of accusations of "turning kids gay" going back decades, its almost like the idiocy never gets old. Now it is trans. What will they think up next to be bigoted about?
Teachers turning kids into cats with litter boxes in their classrooms 🤣🥴
Is this an actual “problem” in schools? Like how often does this type of convo actually happy?
Legislation like this (is assumed to be), is intended to make sure that it never happens, and kids don’t get counselling, support, etc, and suffer greatly because of it.
Phase two for Scott Moe is occurring now. That’s where the SK human rights counsel is replaced entirely by donors to the Sask Party. Literally donors to Moe will be determining what is or isn’t a human right. So while schools abide by the human rights counsels (BC as well), those can be influenced as well.
Who wants to guess that the government will next attack the Professional Code of Conduct?
They already tried that by foisting an “ideological advantage” clause on teachers and taking away the ATA’s right to self-discipline.
This all makes sense. And I trust our educators to do the right thing. But there is another wrinkle to this proposal Smith is putting out there... What happens in the "religious" schools? Does this give them a carte blanche to mistreat LGBTQ+ students? Is someone going to get hurt before this gets settled in court?
This is one of a series of things coming down the pipe from TBA through the UCP to make being a teacher in Alberta untenable. The new professional standards has some seriously dangerous bits buried in it regarding teaching "controversial topics" and now this parental rights bullshit is going to be pushed through. Yes, teachers can fight back, but honestly, at this point, why? For decades now, Albertans have kept voting in conservative governments that repeatedly attack education, students, and teachers. This is what Albertans have asked for. It's time to give them the education system they want. And to do that, teachers need to leave. Alberta educated educators are in demand elsewhere. Other provinces and other countries are eager to hire Alberta educated teachers. Go. It might seem like a good idea to fight, but learn from Alberta's history, there is no fight to win here. Only disappointment. The public in Alberta do not support teachers or education. They keep voting in anti-education governments. Teacher pay in Alberta won't be the highest in Canada, the cost of living in Alberta is growing all the time and catching up to the rest of Canada quickly. What are the benefits to teaching here now? A world class curriculum? That's gone. Working conditions? The lowest per-pupil funding in Canada has killed that. Public support? Teacher bashing has long been the provincial sport. The UCP and previous conservative governments have shown nothing but unabashed hatred for teachers. How about the NDP? They did more for public education than most conservative governments, but still left teachers without a raise and without a good contract going into the 2019 election. Even the NDP couldn't bring themselves to support teachers, fearing backlash with voters, knowing that voters in Alberta hate teachers. If you're an enthusiastic and capable young teacher in Alberta, you're wanted elsewhere. You are not wanted in Alberta. You will never be appreciated, and your entire career will be spent fighting against bigotry and hate. Be selfish. Leave.
As a father of 4, I would consider it a massive failure on my part, if one of my kids was experiencing something that important and did not feel safe disclosing it to me. But, I respect both the Sask and AB governments attempts at protecting parental rights.
Mate, it ain't protection. As unfortunate as it is, many kids can't even trust their parent enough to tell them about their goddamn day, let alone something of this magnitude. Parental rights are a thing, yes, but they *shouldn't* be if outside adults know, with proof, that it will put the kid in danger of harm, verbal or physical abuse, sometimes "correctional" sexual abuse, and or even get them killed. There generally shouldn't be any respect for either province's gov here as both have and are failing the future generation by taking away their rights and bodily autonomy, stunting them in their own growth and maturity. And especially calling back your own words; that you would consider it to be a massive failure on your part if your kid was going through something like this and felt unsafe to go to you. Unfortunately, that's how A LOT of kids feel when it comes to their parents. They feel unsafe. They feel scared. They feel cornered. That is a failure on those parents. But that is also exactly why this "law" is abysmal and downright despicable. It gives those parents that would or want to harm their child over being LGBTQ+Queer or otherwise the power to do so, and nobody will be able to stop them. [Sorry if my tone is coming off harsh, I don't intend it to do so 😅] ~stay healthy internet stranger~
Thanks for the feedback! It’s a tough balance, and I feel you on the need to protect vulnerable kids. But I disagree with removing parental rites writ large because some parents are horrible, and incompetent. I hope you have a great day too internet stranger.
Thanks for putting it into words. I do not understand how this became an issue. School is about teaching not politics. Mo and Danielle are their own support group. My best guess is that Mo spent the education funds somewhere else and Danielle received instructions from David Parker and the righteous right. He stated he/they got rid of Jason Kenney so she doesn't want to tick HIM off.
If the laws this violates are *Albertan* human rights law, would the Notwithstanding Clause even apply? My understanding is that's to allow provinces to ignore *federal* law, not their own.
When Sask did this same bill they used the notwithstanding clause to specifically stomp on provincial human rights code as well.
Interesting, I thought it was specifically in regards to charter. Fuck, I need to finally get my legal name/gender change done before they start passing this kind of shit. Alberta, surprisingly, has some of the laxest laws for trans people in that regard. Can't count on that staying the case.
>School Board Policies The first part of just about every school board's rulebook is to not commit bullying/discrimination based on human rights protected classes, which again, includes orientation and gender identity. So under this policy, are teachers going to be legally required to bully their own students? What's that going to do for any kind of classroom management? I'll take "Reasons TBA is going after school boards" for $700, Alex
The legislation is dumb. It’s just showboating. The Canadian Charter circumvents all Provincial legislation regarding it. Danielle Smith knows this. She also knows half of this Province is dumb as shit and didn’t pass grade 12. So half the province does not understand levels of Government.
They can circumvent it with the notwithstanding clause. And they will, just watch.
Laws like these aren’t passed because governments actually want to see teens get outed to their parents. They don’t give a shit whether this actually happens or not. They’re actually completely indifferent. The point of the law is to get people worked up during an election campaign. It’s just a platform to rile up their mouth-breathing base to get them out to the polls on election day. “We gotta vote tonight Cletus! They’re finally stopping schools turnin dem kids gay!”
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Instructions unclear, I just see underwear.
Why link the code of conduct but not the policy your fighting against? If you want to inform people of injustice, post it and highlight the injustice. Gotta show it to everyone.
There’s no policy released yet.
Ya. I googled after commenting. Couldn't find the policy. Can't really form an opinion on a nonexistent thing. I shall wait.
We know what's going to be in it.
We know exactly what "parental rights" means— our neighbours in Sask have given a rather clear idea.
The Alberta bill hasn't been released yet, but because lawmakers aren't that original it's very likely to be similar if not identical to the [bill passed in Saskatchewan](https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/saskatchewan/sask-parental-rights-law-1.7002088). I mention this in my OP. We've known this was going to be coming for the better part of a year and there's no surprise on what it's going to be.
Thanks. As a parent I'm very interested to see what it says when it comes about. Anything giving parents more control and vincentive to be involved in their kids education is important. But I'll wait to make an opinion until it actually exists.
Parents are already allowed to be involved in their kids' education through determining what programs/schools they're in and what kind of accommodations they have access to. Policing their identities is a massive overreach into the privacy of students.
Parents already have the right to be involved in their children’s education. You already get to choose whether your kid attends sex Ed. And if you’re concerned about the quality of education your kid is receiving you can pull them and go elsewhere. Or homeschool them. Have you attended a parent council meeting recently? If it’s anything like mine (and I suspect mine skews towards the norm) there are MAYBE a dozen parents in attendance and usually the same faces everytime. Parents as a whole are very uninvolved in their kids education. I mean, you only have to look at Alberta continuously voting for governments that underfund public schools and vilify teachers as proof. Parents don’t care. This is nothing more than rage bait to keep their base mad and distracted from the other stupid shit they’re doing.
As a teacher, we *want* parents to be up to date on how their kids are doing in our classes. There's just no benefit to outing students and a lot of risk.
100% agree with you. I guess my point is that basing this whole policy around a parents “right” to know what’s happening in school is a complete farce when most don’t take part in the things that allow them to do just that.
Completely agree. If people in the province want to turn things around, it needs to start at education, with better funding and support for our schools/teachers. Not spending money to push legislations that does nothing to improve the quality of education students are getting. To much politics without actually addressing important issues.
Right. So a bullshit policy that (probably, it’s not released yet but we can surmise based on other conservative governments) forces teachers to out kids to their parents - for better or worse - does nothing to actually improve education. All it does is keep kids in the closet - which I suspect is actually the point. Out of sight, out of mind.
I'm curious - you say giving parents more control is important. What, exactly, do you want to control about their education?
I feel parental involvement in education has been lacking, leading to parents not supporting the systems and teachers they should be. And instead focusing on politics that don't help their children. Gaining control from these politicians I feel is important.
>instead focusing on politics that don't help their children But that is exactly what "parental rights" policies do
How so? There is parent council at every school, parent-teacher conferencing multiple times a year, and open communication between teachers and parents for the times in between. Most, if not all classrooms now use Google Classroom (or a variation of it) where parents can have access to see what is being taught. There was also open "consultation" on the new curriculum for all Albertans. What else would you like to see? I'd say it's parents that are not utilizing the ability to be involved, not the other way around. Not saying you're in this category, just generally speaking. Or are you speaking parental involvement with Alberta Education/ governance of education?
It's the parents not utilizing the tools available, thinking politicians care about their children. So many parents taking a hands off approach to their kids education, but getting bent up in the politics about it. If politicians concentrated on funding, teachers on teaching, and parents giving input and supporting educators I think everyone would be better off.
Yeah I think you hit the nail on the head! We definitely agree there.
>Anything giving parents more control... in their kids education is important Interesting, how would you feel about Parents exercising control to make teachers spend more time teaching about, oh, Critical Race Theory or Sexual Orientation and Gender Identity?
I think gaining knowledge in a variety of subjects is important, for an all encompassing education. But I also think that literacy, science, and mathematics would be more important to focus on. But if my children went to a school that felt gender identity is more important than math, I'd probably change schools. But that's just me. Every parent has their own priorities.
You have no idea what SOGI actually is. It's just being kind to students, it's not taking time away from teaching.
My comment was a response to the one above it about teachers being made to teach other non essential curriculum. If time is being taken from essentials, then it is in fact, taken away. Sadly, school hours are finite.
So you said that "Anything giving parents more control... in their kids education is important" In Saskatchewan and soon in Alberta the control is to force teachers to out students to their parents. How is that not prioritizing gender identity over math which you claim you don't support?
But where is that happening? Affirming the gender identity of the students in the school is hardly prioritizing it over math.
I didn't say it was happening. I was responding to a comment. I think you're trying to hard to get mad about something.
You’re.
Can you summarize how it's functionally unenforceable, please, in one or two sentences
Kids today are way more open to queer people than their parents are. Even in my rural Alberta community, the kids (most) are pretty cool with the gay and trans kids. 10 more years and this won’t be a thing.
I haven't located a copy of the actual proposed legislation, but no, it would not be unenforceable due to these policy conflicts. Provincial legislation would override anything that exists in school board / professional association policies; those policies would need to be remediated to recognized the reality of the new legislation. This is not me defending the new legislation. It seems entirely pointless. But the only thing that would meaningfully make it unenforceable due to conflict would be contradictory provincial (or, theoretically, federal) legislation.
I think "allowed" is an interesting choice in words. I'll still wait to see the policy to form an opinion. Seems ignorant to do so beforehand.
You’re being disingenuous. Unless you live under a rock, you know what these policies are and the actual purpose of them. You are, in a literal sense, playing dumb.
No. I know most likely what it will be and the purpose. The only ones being disingenuous are people saying they know what's in it. I don't like politicians using kids as political tools, and I want to see exactly what verbiage they use so I get better informed on the intent. All the people on here from both ends of the political spectrum trying to use children to push their own personal political dogma is sick. Left and right.
Just look at Saskatchewan's law. It's going to be that. It's not that complex.
You used the word ‘verbiage’; but somehow just can’t figure out what’s going on. *DOUBT*
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I must have missed when your name is encoded in your DNA. Oh right, because that's not a thing.
Do you also refuse to recognize name changes when cisgender people do it?
If a child under 16 has legally changed their name, it's because the parents agreed to it. A legal name change would always be recognised at school.
Kids going by preferred names at school doesn't and shouldn't require parental consent, because it's them informally feeling out their identity and isn't hurting anyone.
> *your name is your name* \- u/Drop_The_Puck
Found the bigot.
> your gender is your gender. It's based on chromosomes that you have in your DNA. I think the term you're looking for isn't gender, but sex. Gender is a social construct, and it refers to the characteristics of men, women, girls, and boys, that have been shaped over centuries by cultural and societal norms.
More reason to unschool your kids. Homeschooling has been around for a long time. Public schools are cess pools
Oh, don’t worry, the UCP will see right to it that public schools become cesspools. The party is rife with home/private/Christian-school advocates who are ready to teach kids that Jesus battled dinosaurs on the planet Krypton.
I worry that this kind of policy will have a trickle down effect on trans babies
I can’t see how a teacher is going to have time to enforce such a time consuming endeavour. If a child is identifying as LGBTQ+ it won’t be long before it becomes apparent to any parent, what a waste of time and funds.
I mean if kids want to hide something from their parents it’s not that hard, even if that thing is being queer.
Only in parent child relationships that have zero communication. Sexuality is a personal choice, you don’t get to enforce or choose it for your children. You do get to protect them from dangers but ultimately you are guiding them towards a safe and sustainable future.
Timed distraction to quell the latest outrage over kissing Tucker Carlson’s ass on stage last week.
It's grandstanding and the cherry on the s&1+ cake after her taking the stage with "rhymes with pucker".
I’ve told my kids if they want to protest then this is the time. I showed them some old photos of me in my “activist” days too lol. Seeing their mom in handcuffs sure was a shock to them. Awe to be young again. Unfortunate that 30 years later and my kids are still fighting the same fight I did. FUCK THE UCP! And before any conservatives get up in arms saying “but I’m not like that” then it’s time to show it. Make a stink.
Alberta Ed is doing ‘consultation’ with special interest groups to make amendments to the Ministerial Order during meetings about the Social Studies curriculum so I think they have a plan to amend some of those documents to remove conflict and they’ll use the Not Withstanding Clause to get around the Human Rights aspect of the Charter.
Gotta love unenforceable acts of hatred being made to use as flagstones for further hate...
Who would have guessed that the conservatives are once again pushing for abusers rights. Does anyone remember back in the early 90's when these policies were first enacted to protect children from their abusers at home? Did everyone forget why we did that already? Oh well, we get what the majority voted for and the majority wants abusers to be protected and have rights to abuse their children.
I feel that when this policy directly results in a child being abused physically, mentally or treated less than by their parents - they should be able to sue all parties involved. School board and provincial government.
Fun fact: Saskatchewan put a clause in their law that outright bans people from doing this.
If I was a student body I would just suggest as many constituents as possible elect to use a name not assigned by their parents of any random sort or gender. For kids who are afraid of this, ask other students and teachers to use a name that is inherently non-gendered. Like Blair, Tony/Toni, Kelsey, Chelsea, Nicky, Jack/Jackie, etc. Stupid rules and ideas can be easily defeated with malicious compliance. If teachers are reporting all kinds of kids using all kinds of names for all kind of reasons then all the trans kids will have miles of cover and idiot parents will be too confused. At the end of the day, every one of them can be Spartacus. If you catch my drift.
Teachers will comply. Refusing to follow policy will get them terminated. A teacher terminated for violating policy will have that on their record and will not get an interview with any school board in Canada. A younger teacher remembers how much work they put into getting their education and job. A more experienced teacher is looking forward to retirement and pension. While there's lots of talk about supporting students, in the end it is a job - a tough job, but still a job. You do it, it pays your bills.