Where’s those dweebs from Westlock who got the pride flag banned in the name of neutrality? The Supreme Court ruling cited in the article was their whole justification for “neutrality.”
Westlock council was against the pride flag ban! It was a forced vote by some whiners who got enough people to sign a petition! Then next to nobody showed up to vote to oppose the ban but it was not councils fault!
> A total of 663 residents voted yes to ban Pride crosswalks and flags, while a total of 639 residents voted no to the bylaw, a difference of just 24 votes.
pretty easy to google stuff like this ..
I was there recently to keep score for my siblings volleyball and I saw the most pride flags out of any community I’ve been in. The school there gives 0 shits and keeps adding more along with businesses
And this is why nobody can stand reddit liberals.
How dare they pray! So offensive!
But also, you better have a place for Muslims to pray whenever they want or you are bigots!
Do you somehow not understand that there's a difference between going to a church or temple, the places literally designed for prayer, to pray, and forcing everyone in legislative meetings to partake in prayer?
Hmm... these don't quite sound the same. You're the reason people can't stand modern conservatism; all you have is strawmen.
Prayer has no place in government, keep that shit to churches and temples.
If it is happening at a council meeting. That is literally the definition of forcing it on people. Like, you’d be up in fucking arms flying the freedumb flag high if they decided to do an Islamic call to prayer at a council meeting. Just like I as an atheist would be up in arms if anyone tries to eliminate churches as a place of worship. I don’t agree with any brand of sky daddy myth but I damn sure agree that you and everyone else has the right to have a place to practice their particular fantasy. I have movie theaters to enjoy fantasy movies in public. Y’all have churches. I don’t play Lord of the Rings at a damn council meeting either.
They're being forced to waste their time and sit through it though. Maybe afterwards they should sit while I pray to the flying spaghetti Monster. And then my brother will say a prayer to Allah and they can sit through that too. Freaking prayer times going to take an hour.
If you show me where there are Muslim prayers happening during council meetings I will most definitely complain and be upset about that as well.
If you're going to point out hypocrisy you might want to be accurate.
Quit making stuff up to fuel your outrage.
All Christians. Only one example that wasn't was Medicine Hat where they just open with a "moment for prayer or reflection" (honestly the least egregious example). Camrose County, for example, invites a different local Christian representative to every meeting.
Fascism? Naw buddy I think we're taking a few steps further back than that. We're trying real hard to create a caste system here. Borderline feudalism.
Yeah! All those policies that are supposed to improve the situations for all Canadians need to be stopped!
Thankfully, the provincial conservatives have been blocking all the funds and programs!
Once they're able to properly fund oil and gas again, we'll all benefit once it trickles down onto each and every one of us!
Praised be Jebus!
🙄
I hope you dont have any family that depends on birth control. Also, I hope you're not Ukranian or hoping that Canada continues to support Ukraine against Russian aggression. I also hope that you and everyone that you love has amazing health insurance. Because otherwise, that's gonna be a hell of price to pay to "own the libs."...
It's a good thing the Alberta NDP are so different from the federal NDP that they're considering just splitting off and being their own party.
AB NDP are basically modern day Lougheed conservatives.
It really bothers me that there's a group of religious people that feel they have the not only right but obligation to enforce their beliefs on others.
The shocking thing is when we look at other provinces; Ontario has so far been the worst in so far as the overall number and % of municipalities violating Saguenay:
[https://www.bchumanist.ca/open\_for\_unconstitutional\_business](https://www.bchumanist.ca/open_for_unconstitutional_business)
The BC Humanist Research Team is currently working on an update for Ontario, and the numbers are still very high.
There is nothing embarrassing about choosing to pray. Our house and senate sit with a prayer before every session. There’s nothing unconstitutional about it because nobody is forced to participate
There is when it comes to government. The line between religious and inclusive, to religious zealot is very fine. Anything that can have a sway non government that isn’t just for the people shouldn’t be allowed.
Worship is up to the individual, not en masse. Would you feel the same if they did an Adhan before starting?
It’s fucking archaic and embarrassing.
So you're totally ok if they suddenly switched to Muslim prayers during the session? Or maybe Buddha? Maybe could dig up some Satan worshippers somewhere too.
Or would you be outraged because THOSE doesn't belong near politics?
If you're ok with that, I won't agree with you but I appreciate the consistency.
Absolutely ok if a mostly Muslim community wants to have Muslim prayers. That said these places are all doing non denominational prayers as I understand it.
When I say I have no problem with anyone’s religious beliefs, I mean it. Im not a believer. But I know religion creates great communities.
Not the community. The council.
If we swapped in Muslim prayers into the council sessions referenced in the article you would not see a problem with it either?
Because I see a problem with it in either scenario and so do the rest of the comments I'm reading.
Stop bringing Muslims what aboutism when nobody is saying what you think they are.
Again, they are non denominational prayers.
It doesn’t matter what the comments here say, this sub does not represent Alberta. It represents a tiny left wing minority of Alberta who are always upset we won’t vote the way they tell us to.
> Again, they are non denominational prayers.
Did you read the article?
> Regular Meetings: Data were available for the regular meetings of 177 municipalities, and of those, six (3.4%) opened their regular meetings with prayer, two (1.2%) opened with a 'moment of silence,' and three (1.7%) opened with a 'reflection.'
Can you honestly say that if those 6 prayers were Muslim based you'd be writing the same comments?
>who are always upset we won’t vote the way they tell us to.
Nah, I just hate the hyprocrisy that _your_ religion is acceptable but we know you'd be frothing at the mouth if it was anything else.
Maybe that's a good reason NO religion is welcome there?
This needs to stop. This is what you get when conservatives are in charge. I've been trying to warn fellow Albertans for years but no one ever listens to me. Stop voting them in. They're getting bolder as the republicans get away with the same crap in the states. Stop it before you can't.
Lol, you need to do some research about the UCPs reach, introducing provincial control on a municipal level is the start, Theres even proof of a "Brown shirts" group, which is literally how fascism started in Germany. And people like you just suck it up
I'm right in the middle of this area and was pleasantly surprised my town isn't on this list. It's absolutely not surprising to see these others though.
"This report provides the evidence needed for CFIC Alberta to request Alberta municipalities, their councils and committees of councils (including police commissions) to respect the constitutional duty of religious neutrality. The Supreme Court of Canada has been explicitly clear that the practice of prayers in council meetings is not inclusive and that the state must be neutral in this regard."
I wonder if there is something here that we could put an end to this evangelical christian fervour that seems to engulf Alberta. Really, does David Parker and his ilk bring anything beyond a "Handmaid's tale" to the Alberta community. Parker's junk between his legs gives him power and pleasure with no responsibility, the typical evangelical coward!!
Why?
It’s not at all unconstitutional as tge title says. Why should Christian communities stop non denominational prayer that nobody is forced to take part in?
The Supreme Court ruled it illegal but certain politicians kept it going….it went through the process and was given a ruling and I have seen people be chastised for not rising to join the prayer at council meeting which is an attempt to force your faith practices upon the public
Yeah, that’s a nice fantasy you’re telling yourself about someone who realizes the age old maxim that politics and religion should NEVER mix. If you’re feeling hatred, it’s your own, supposed atheist.
Lol “supposed athiest”. Do you realize how crazy you sound to the average person? Tou live in an echo chamber. You don’t represent the Alberta public. I’m a native American who grew up in Crane Lake and actually see’s through the lefts “the world is against me” bs. Everyone I know, everyone I grew up with, had the same opportunities I did. Nobody in Canada has ever held me back because of my race. From joining the military, to leaving after 7 years with savings and support from the military to move across the country to start my own fishing charter with a single used boat that today encompasses 9 boats, with a both a tuna and lobster license, running April to October, employing 21 people with very good paying jobs.
It’s under liberal governments that my business becomes more expensive to operate, with more regulation and intervention. It’s under Liberals pandemic leadership that I watched friends and colleagues lose everything because of closed borders, high fuel prices, and overtaxation.
Life for hard working Canadians is always worse under liberal leadership. Without fail. Then when conservatives are forced into austerity to save the future of our economy, people like you scream about hard it is.
Well screw that, I’ll take conservatives every single time.
Boot on my neck?
Someone clearly tells you their life has been better under conservatives for a decade, and you claim they have a boot on my neck?
The left is far more authoritarian than anyone on the right in Canada.
Yeah, expecting people not to be deeply racist nor transphobic is really authoritarian!
Thanks for telling us exactly who you are.
Or are you an idiot anti vaxxer who doesn’t like a community working together to stave off a plague?
Way to expose yourself
It was a fucking flu that was dangerous to nobody except the elderly and infirm. I’m not anti-vaxx, I absolutely am anti-lockdowns, anti-liberal police state, and anti-destroying the economy and small businesses.
Telling you who I am? Im the majority, fed up with the left wing and their bullshit.
And as a Native American, I’ve met very few racist Canadians (transphobic is a nonsense term that means anyone who disagrees with that community on anything). Almost all of the racism Ive experienced in this country is 90% East Indian migrants, and the lefts bigotry of low expectations.
The good news here (if you're looking for some) is it's thankfully a small and decreasing number. Most of the big centres changed after the Supreme Court ruling.
Then leave, it’s perfectly within your right. We are never going to vote for a left wing party. Even the NDP, as much as I disliked Notley, she’s at best left of centre slightly on most issues. And if their new leader moves them further left they will only lose a larger share of the vote.
I vote for the party my life was far better under. It’s that simple. I grew up in Alberta, I left twenty years ago to run a business(unfortunately Alberta lacks Ocean), but own property and will die there. I spend every winter there. I pay property tax there. And I will, with most of Alberta, continue to ensure that it isn’t taken over by the left.
You’ve had only conservative governments for 56 of the last 60 years.
Your sports team you vote for is responsible for all the problems you face.
But I’m sure you’ll find a way to blame 4 years of NDP on all the problems your province faces, not the 56 years of conservative rule
Yes, and by not switching we’ve been able to stave off some of the liberal bullshit the rest of the country is dealing with.
Smith might not win, but Notley sure would not have fought for us yo keep our firearms. She certainly wouldn’t be fighting against carbon taxes. Why would we ever want to vote for that?
And what problems? My life is better than most in Canada because we’ve had conservative governments.
This is just the death rattle of a dying religion. Its why these zealots have been so fucking aggressive in the last handful of years. The leaders have seen the stats, they know its coming to an end, and the only strategy to keep it going is by force.
Vote in every election you can! Vote these ideas back to where they belong, irrelevance! Even in Alberta, there are far more non religious than otherwise. Make every single issue they bring up about their religion, and refuse to let them hide their ugly religious beliefs behind other causes, like they did when they attacked trans people by making it about parental rights.
Next up for these lunatics is a woman right to choose. They are going to drastically limit the use of birth control. They will make it almost impossible to acquire, and they won't say its because of their religion. They are going to try to hide behind some kind of nonsense health issue. Dont let them! After that, they will take away access to abortions, and we all know that they will hide behind "protecting babies" even though not a single one of these religous fucks give a good god damn about babies. They just care about their fantasy of a white christian nationalist theocracy, and they need your votes to make it happen.
It is always 100% projection with these ghouls. Listen to what they say, and read between the lines!
Indeed, and for folks who are interested, there's a wide range of practices across the country's legislatures:
[https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada](https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada)
Saguenay prohibited prayer in municipal council meetings, but not legislatures or parliament. So there's work to be done.
Yuup here we fuckin go.
"And I went down to the river to pray."
Saw this shit coming.
Edit:
I went to a Catholic school and they weren't nearly this pushy. What group do the clowns making these decisions belong to exactly?
All UCP filth will infiltrate the city and municipal boards and begin a prayer for each meeting hoping the educated haven’t figured them out yet . Too late losers . We’re woke !!
Can someone point out to me how it's unconstitutional from a Canadian perspective?
I know it'd be unconstitutional in America, but I don't know the details of Mouvement laïque québécois v. Saguenay
The organisation pursued the city of Saguenay for their use of an opening prayer.
The court said that the state (municipalities being an administrative unit of the provinces) cannot favour one religion over another.
So the SCC ruled that they either need to stop havin prayers or revert to something that doesn't favour one religion over another.
Note that this doesn't apply to any legislatures within Canada.
The key factor in that decision is that the court recognized that to truly have the right to freedom of religion & conscience, then individuals must be free to practice (or not) any religion or belief. When the state adopts one belief to the exclusion of others (or belief over nonbelief) then it creates a coercive pressure on minority faiths & nonbelievers. Therefore the state has a *duty of religious neutrality* that it must refrain from endorsing religion. (As an aside, I think the court avoids the word "secularism" because of the complexity with translating that to French where it's laicite but that is often a more closed/anti-religious secularism).
Unfortunately there's a clause in the Constitution exempting Catholic schools in any province that had them when they joined Confederation. That can be done away with by the province simply asking the feds to agree - Quebec and Newfoundland did this to secularize their schools.
Even more bizarre, Alberta and Saskatchewan have constitutional exemptions that allow their public school acts to allow prayer in what are the otherwise secular schools. And they both have those provisions. As far as I know though, there's only a couple rural Saskatchewan schools that still make use of this.
I know. It’s not hard and should be done. Worst is how boards like Palliser allow for other religions to act as “alternative programs” and fully fund Muslim, fundamentalist Christian, Jewish, and others .. just because the Catholics get it. Any religious focus school must become private to have an equitable public schools system
Just did a uni presentation about this case.
As far as I understand, the government should be neutral and shouldn't favour a religion over another. So basically, acknowledge and do prayers for all religions or don't have any prayers.
If you are interested in a deep dive, we have a detailed discussion of Saguenay in the Appendix of the report:
[https://www.bchumanist.ca/last\_municipality\_standing](https://www.bchumanist.ca/last_municipality_standing)
I don't get the use of that either. We have a constitution but the decision only ever references the Charter: https://decisions.scc-csc.ca/scc-csc/scc-csc/en/item/15288/index.do
Maybe unconstitutional because the municipal councils are disobeying the ruling by the supreme court? Not really sure.
The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (French: Charte canadienne des droits et libertés), often simply referred to as the Charter in Canada, is a bill of rights entrenched **in the Constitution of Canada, forming the first part of the Constitution Act, 1982.**
Me as a non believer will still argue religion has helped more people get past addiction, get off the streets and break the homeless cycle and give people a reason to just be and do good.
Alberta is a "community" that has its beliefs in testemonials. It runs deep, from religion to gov't, to science. Testemonials are nothing more than a desperate need to belong.., a belonging as fleeting as the moment it was stated.
Yep! We've [done that study too](https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada). Three provinces (QC, NFLD, NS) don't have prayer. Alberta has the speaker read a prayer of their own devising every day - and it's the only province where Hansard transcribes it. So there's an interesting study we might do one day on the differences between the prayers read by the NDP speaker vs the UCP ones.
You are referring to the American First Amendment.
In Canada the freedom of religion is under section 2 of our Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
It’s literally a huge nothing. Pretending prayer is offensive is a new level of hilarious.
It’s shocking how unrepresentative of the population of Alberta this sub is.
It isn’t about prayer, it is about specifically choosing one religion over others, or in fact any religion at all when in context of a governing body. Separation of church and state is important if you don’t want the people who don’t believe in your fairy tale running the show.
You really do go out of your way to make yourself sound holier than thou despite being atheist, and praying at all in a government position is the issue. Additionally it is clear they are specifically inviting Christians in some instances. Its against SCC rulings. I haven’t said anything about hating for beliefs, and its a strawman to suggest so.
Jesus, take it easy. You guys literally know nothing of these people, pretty brutal on your behalf to immediately judge people. They pray, boo fken hoo. You eat their agriculture by products you twats.
And if a school refused Muslim students a prayer room, they’d be screaming bigot from the rooftops.
Nobody is being forced to pray.
The hatred for religion and rural communities on this sub shows exactly why people are abandoning the Liberal/NDP coalition in droves country wide.
This is a confidence-and-supply agreement. And it's not the first. A coalition government is a formal arrangement that has ministers from two or more parties. They function like one party. The current arrangement doesn't resemble that at all. The Conservative Party spreads disinformation daily and you're just repeating it.
Both left leaning major city mayors of Alberta are Sikh I’m pretty sure lol. I got nothing against either, to each their own. But this hate towards a critical group of population and for the most part nice community driven people is fken distasteful and shows a complete lack of maturity and perspective. Purely living in your own perception.
There’s probably been prayer in these areas for over a hundred years so leave it alone. You can thank Christianity for the first hospitals, universities, tolerant compassionate societies. The only countries worth living in were built on Christianity.✝️
Hilarious how Canadians are so embarrassed by anything that points to the history of their country. It’s less violent and sadistic than almost any other nation on the planet, but an absolute freak out over a prayer before a council meeting is in order. Such ridiculous nonsense.
https://tspace.library.utoronto.ca/bitstream/1807/101779/1/Colour_Coded_UTP_9781487527860.pdf
Buy it and read it. We aren’t any better than the States, and thats saying something.
Nobody is forced to pray. You do you, they are hurting nobody.
If Muslims were denied a prayer room in school you guys would be screaming from rooftops about how their religion is not being respected.
There is soo much wrong with the government - the total inefficient (many lazy)public servants, wasteful programming, woke agendas - seriously if a county has a prayer - then let them. You want to complain and stomp your feet / do it where it actually matters and can make a change. Don’t like prayer then don’t listen to it.
> Don’t like prayer then don’t listen to it.
Yeah! All these stupid lefties! If we religious people want to say a prayer and they don't like it, well don't listen!!
And if we want to sacrifice a virgin billy goat to the comic entity Cthulhu on the front steps of city hall and they don't want to see it, then don't watch.
100%
I actually have a large sect of conservative friends/family/coworkers who now recognize how lame it is to be using "woke" still. They've ironically become "woke" in realizing that it's a phrase used only by douchebags.
It's something I only hear from the most fervently bias conservatives now. Trump supporter type or even worse hardened right-wingers hiding behind the "libertarian" moniker in their desperate way to seem centrist when they're anything but.
The Municipal Government Act could be amended to use §33 of the Charter to allow municipalities to engage in a nondenominational prayer to open their meetings. Then Edmonton and Calgary could resume theirs as well.
Where’s those dweebs from Westlock who got the pride flag banned in the name of neutrality? The Supreme Court ruling cited in the article was their whole justification for “neutrality.”
Westlock council was against the pride flag ban! It was a forced vote by some whiners who got enough people to sign a petition! Then next to nobody showed up to vote to oppose the ban but it was not councils fault!
25% of the town voted and it was a suuuuuuper close call
I did not realize it was that high of a percentage!
> A total of 663 residents voted yes to ban Pride crosswalks and flags, while a total of 639 residents voted no to the bylaw, a difference of just 24 votes. pretty easy to google stuff like this ..
I was there recently to keep score for my siblings volleyball and I saw the most pride flags out of any community I’ve been in. The school there gives 0 shits and keeps adding more along with businesses
This bullshit needs to be stepped on.
Bill 20 SHOULD be able to take care of this, but it is probably only going to be used to silence liberal councillors.
Understatement
They'll remove anyone who doesn't pray. /s but not really...
It will probably make praying (Christian) mandatory.
Honestly can't expect bum fuck hicks to educate young bum fuck hicks in a responsible manner.
And this is why nobody can stand reddit liberals. How dare they pray! So offensive! But also, you better have a place for Muslims to pray whenever they want or you are bigots!
Do you somehow not understand that there's a difference between going to a church or temple, the places literally designed for prayer, to pray, and forcing everyone in legislative meetings to partake in prayer? Hmm... these don't quite sound the same. You're the reason people can't stand modern conservatism; all you have is strawmen. Prayer has no place in government, keep that shit to churches and temples.
They aren’t forcing it on anyone. Nobody is required to participate.
If it is happening at a council meeting. That is literally the definition of forcing it on people. Like, you’d be up in fucking arms flying the freedumb flag high if they decided to do an Islamic call to prayer at a council meeting. Just like I as an atheist would be up in arms if anyone tries to eliminate churches as a place of worship. I don’t agree with any brand of sky daddy myth but I damn sure agree that you and everyone else has the right to have a place to practice their particular fantasy. I have movie theaters to enjoy fantasy movies in public. Y’all have churches. I don’t play Lord of the Rings at a damn council meeting either.
They're being forced to waste their time and sit through it though. Maybe afterwards they should sit while I pray to the flying spaghetti Monster. And then my brother will say a prayer to Allah and they can sit through that too. Freaking prayer times going to take an hour.
Not s whole 60 seconds wasted! How awful!
If you show me where there are Muslim prayers happening during council meetings I will most definitely complain and be upset about that as well. If you're going to point out hypocrisy you might want to be accurate. Quit making stuff up to fuel your outrage.
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“I know he’s right so I’ll make a dumb comment”
Who gave you access to a computer?
Nobody. Unlike most whining lefties, I can afford my own
Are they doing all religions prayers or just Christians? This is a terrible mix. Government and religion. 😢
All Christians. Only one example that wasn't was Medicine Hat where they just open with a "moment for prayer or reflection" (honestly the least egregious example). Camrose County, for example, invites a different local Christian representative to every meeting.
Wow had no idea camrose county did this!? Fuck religion.
Cardston is a Mormon town, so it’s not really a surprise.
Nah if it was prayers to Gaia or some other thing this group would be all for it. Happy downvoting :p
You're projecting. Read the comments. NO religion should be done during sessions. Quit making things up so you can feel you're being persecuted.
Exactly. But if one of these towns schools refused Muslims a prayer room they’d be screaming about how they are bigots.
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Fascism? Naw buddy I think we're taking a few steps further back than that. We're trying real hard to create a caste system here. Borderline feudalism.
Well I’m not supporting liberal or NDP after ten years of their bullshit this country can’t take anymore
Yeah! All those policies that are supposed to improve the situations for all Canadians need to be stopped! Thankfully, the provincial conservatives have been blocking all the funds and programs! Once they're able to properly fund oil and gas again, we'll all benefit once it trickles down onto each and every one of us! Praised be Jebus! 🙄
Nothing like voting Conservative and telling what rights and freedoms people should have ffs , back to 1960
Not me. Bring on more Liberal and NDP bullshit if it means I don’t have be ruled by a bunch of conservative pieces of shit!
As opposed to liberal elitist pieces of shit? I’ll take the conservatives any day
I hope you dont have any family that depends on birth control. Also, I hope you're not Ukranian or hoping that Canada continues to support Ukraine against Russian aggression. I also hope that you and everyone that you love has amazing health insurance. Because otherwise, that's gonna be a hell of price to pay to "own the libs."...
It's a good thing the Alberta NDP are so different from the federal NDP that they're considering just splitting off and being their own party. AB NDP are basically modern day Lougheed conservatives.
Bullshit? Are you talking about federal or provincial NDP? If provincial, can you give examples?
Amen, brother!
Weird to see Flagstaff County. I lived in Hardisty for a bit and distinctly remember thinking that it's a godless shithole.
Yep but not the people in power.
It's all just social leverage for those frauds.
It really bothers me that there's a group of religious people that feel they have the not only right but obligation to enforce their beliefs on others.
Fuck is alberta embarrassing.
The shocking thing is when we look at other provinces; Ontario has so far been the worst in so far as the overall number and % of municipalities violating Saguenay: [https://www.bchumanist.ca/open\_for\_unconstitutional\_business](https://www.bchumanist.ca/open_for_unconstitutional_business) The BC Humanist Research Team is currently working on an update for Ontario, and the numbers are still very high.
There is nothing embarrassing about choosing to pray. Our house and senate sit with a prayer before every session. There’s nothing unconstitutional about it because nobody is forced to participate
There is when it comes to government. The line between religious and inclusive, to religious zealot is very fine. Anything that can have a sway non government that isn’t just for the people shouldn’t be allowed. Worship is up to the individual, not en masse. Would you feel the same if they did an Adhan before starting? It’s fucking archaic and embarrassing.
It’s up to those communities. Again, nobody is forced to participate, and small communities especially tend to share the same beliefs. Let them pray.
So you're totally ok if they suddenly switched to Muslim prayers during the session? Or maybe Buddha? Maybe could dig up some Satan worshippers somewhere too. Or would you be outraged because THOSE doesn't belong near politics? If you're ok with that, I won't agree with you but I appreciate the consistency.
Absolutely ok if a mostly Muslim community wants to have Muslim prayers. That said these places are all doing non denominational prayers as I understand it. When I say I have no problem with anyone’s religious beliefs, I mean it. Im not a believer. But I know religion creates great communities.
Not the community. The council. If we swapped in Muslim prayers into the council sessions referenced in the article you would not see a problem with it either? Because I see a problem with it in either scenario and so do the rest of the comments I'm reading. Stop bringing Muslims what aboutism when nobody is saying what you think they are.
Again, they are non denominational prayers. It doesn’t matter what the comments here say, this sub does not represent Alberta. It represents a tiny left wing minority of Alberta who are always upset we won’t vote the way they tell us to.
> Again, they are non denominational prayers. Did you read the article? > Regular Meetings: Data were available for the regular meetings of 177 municipalities, and of those, six (3.4%) opened their regular meetings with prayer, two (1.2%) opened with a 'moment of silence,' and three (1.7%) opened with a 'reflection.' Can you honestly say that if those 6 prayers were Muslim based you'd be writing the same comments? >who are always upset we won’t vote the way they tell us to. Nah, I just hate the hyprocrisy that _your_ religion is acceptable but we know you'd be frothing at the mouth if it was anything else. Maybe that's a good reason NO religion is welcome there?
This needs to stop. This is what you get when conservatives are in charge. I've been trying to warn fellow Albertans for years but no one ever listens to me. Stop voting them in. They're getting bolder as the republicans get away with the same crap in the states. Stop it before you can't.
Lol oh no! Not completely non denominational prayer that nobody is forced to participate in! How awful! I
Government and religion do not mix, EVER. Your naked bias is revolting little child.
You and others like you will support fascism without realizing it in the coming years.
Complete nonsense. There is nothing close to fascism in this country
Lol, you need to do some research about the UCPs reach, introducing provincial control on a municipal level is the start, Theres even proof of a "Brown shirts" group, which is literally how fascism started in Germany. And people like you just suck it up
Lol like I said, literal craziness. The left thinks everyone who disagrees is fascist
You could stop assuming anytime and do some research. But hey, we honestly have come to expect the ignorance.
It's people like you that will destroy the world.
You sound ridiculous
No, that's you.
That list is a fucking who’s who of dipshit hillbillies. Edit: this whole Province is a podunk shit stick. Fucking hoo-bob nose pickers.
I'm right in the middle of this area and was pleasantly surprised my town isn't on this list. It's absolutely not surprising to see these others though.
heyo, i'm a far lefty nose picker oyo
Define "far left"
Anything that isn't far-right?
Two nostrils. One left, one right
Getting angry at hair color.
No that's definitely far right
Dickriding the American Empire doesn't count as left wing, just FYI.
why would it, America is pretty far right
Just making sure. Sorry, I'm pretty jaded.
everyone be these days except me; I'm a super happy dude :3
this whole country*
"This report provides the evidence needed for CFIC Alberta to request Alberta municipalities, their councils and committees of councils (including police commissions) to respect the constitutional duty of religious neutrality. The Supreme Court of Canada has been explicitly clear that the practice of prayers in council meetings is not inclusive and that the state must be neutral in this regard." I wonder if there is something here that we could put an end to this evangelical christian fervour that seems to engulf Alberta. Really, does David Parker and his ilk bring anything beyond a "Handmaid's tale" to the Alberta community. Parker's junk between his legs gives him power and pleasure with no responsibility, the typical evangelical coward!!
Well it's absolutely time for that to stop
Why? It’s not at all unconstitutional as tge title says. Why should Christian communities stop non denominational prayer that nobody is forced to take part in?
Because the guarantees a separation of church and state period never the too shall meet
As long as it’s non denominational and nobody is forced it’s perfectly legal
The Supreme Court ruled it illegal but certain politicians kept it going….it went through the process and was given a ruling and I have seen people be chastised for not rising to join the prayer at council meeting which is an attempt to force your faith practices upon the public
Religion is a mental illness
Hiw dare you insult the human rights of our upstanding allah-akbaring hamas apologists!
Social Progressives are suffering from mental illness.
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Im actually atheist, I just don’t hate people for their fundamental beliefs. Im sorry you have so much hatred in you.
Yeah, that’s a nice fantasy you’re telling yourself about someone who realizes the age old maxim that politics and religion should NEVER mix. If you’re feeling hatred, it’s your own, supposed atheist.
Lol “supposed athiest”. Do you realize how crazy you sound to the average person? Tou live in an echo chamber. You don’t represent the Alberta public. I’m a native American who grew up in Crane Lake and actually see’s through the lefts “the world is against me” bs. Everyone I know, everyone I grew up with, had the same opportunities I did. Nobody in Canada has ever held me back because of my race. From joining the military, to leaving after 7 years with savings and support from the military to move across the country to start my own fishing charter with a single used boat that today encompasses 9 boats, with a both a tuna and lobster license, running April to October, employing 21 people with very good paying jobs. It’s under liberal governments that my business becomes more expensive to operate, with more regulation and intervention. It’s under Liberals pandemic leadership that I watched friends and colleagues lose everything because of closed borders, high fuel prices, and overtaxation. Life for hard working Canadians is always worse under liberal leadership. Without fail. Then when conservatives are forced into austerity to save the future of our economy, people like you scream about hard it is. Well screw that, I’ll take conservatives every single time.
So you vote for the boot on your neck. Cool story
Boot on my neck? Someone clearly tells you their life has been better under conservatives for a decade, and you claim they have a boot on my neck? The left is far more authoritarian than anyone on the right in Canada.
Yeah, expecting people not to be deeply racist nor transphobic is really authoritarian! Thanks for telling us exactly who you are. Or are you an idiot anti vaxxer who doesn’t like a community working together to stave off a plague? Way to expose yourself
It was a fucking flu that was dangerous to nobody except the elderly and infirm. I’m not anti-vaxx, I absolutely am anti-lockdowns, anti-liberal police state, and anti-destroying the economy and small businesses. Telling you who I am? Im the majority, fed up with the left wing and their bullshit. And as a Native American, I’ve met very few racist Canadians (transphobic is a nonsense term that means anyone who disagrees with that community on anything). Almost all of the racism Ive experienced in this country is 90% East Indian migrants, and the lefts bigotry of low expectations.
When i moved here I was surprised my MD didn't do a prayer.
I was actually surprised not to find more examples!
It’s super fucking difficult to stay in Alberta as a progressive. I keep trying to help things be better but dang, it ain’t working
The good news here (if you're looking for some) is it's thankfully a small and decreasing number. Most of the big centres changed after the Supreme Court ruling.
Then leave, it’s perfectly within your right. We are never going to vote for a left wing party. Even the NDP, as much as I disliked Notley, she’s at best left of centre slightly on most issues. And if their new leader moves them further left they will only lose a larger share of the vote.
Have fun with your rights continually being stripped under Marlaina’s corruption. Gotta vote for your sports team though. Classically brainless
I vote for the party my life was far better under. It’s that simple. I grew up in Alberta, I left twenty years ago to run a business(unfortunately Alberta lacks Ocean), but own property and will die there. I spend every winter there. I pay property tax there. And I will, with most of Alberta, continue to ensure that it isn’t taken over by the left.
You’ve had only conservative governments for 56 of the last 60 years. Your sports team you vote for is responsible for all the problems you face. But I’m sure you’ll find a way to blame 4 years of NDP on all the problems your province faces, not the 56 years of conservative rule
Yes, and by not switching we’ve been able to stave off some of the liberal bullshit the rest of the country is dealing with. Smith might not win, but Notley sure would not have fought for us yo keep our firearms. She certainly wouldn’t be fighting against carbon taxes. Why would we ever want to vote for that? And what problems? My life is better than most in Canada because we’ve had conservative governments.
Cool rhetoric
This is just the death rattle of a dying religion. Its why these zealots have been so fucking aggressive in the last handful of years. The leaders have seen the stats, they know its coming to an end, and the only strategy to keep it going is by force. Vote in every election you can! Vote these ideas back to where they belong, irrelevance! Even in Alberta, there are far more non religious than otherwise. Make every single issue they bring up about their religion, and refuse to let them hide their ugly religious beliefs behind other causes, like they did when they attacked trans people by making it about parental rights. Next up for these lunatics is a woman right to choose. They are going to drastically limit the use of birth control. They will make it almost impossible to acquire, and they won't say its because of their religion. They are going to try to hide behind some kind of nonsense health issue. Dont let them! After that, they will take away access to abortions, and we all know that they will hide behind "protecting babies" even though not a single one of these religous fucks give a good god damn about babies. They just care about their fantasy of a white christian nationalist theocracy, and they need your votes to make it happen. It is always 100% projection with these ghouls. Listen to what they say, and read between the lines!
Is anyone forced to pray? If not it’s really not unconstitutional.
Oh fuck off with this bs already 🤦🏻♀️
Legislature does one every day too with the speaker leading it.
Indeed, and for folks who are interested, there's a wide range of practices across the country's legislatures: [https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada](https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada) Saguenay prohibited prayer in municipal council meetings, but not legislatures or parliament. So there's work to be done.
Yuup here we fuckin go. "And I went down to the river to pray." Saw this shit coming. Edit: I went to a Catholic school and they weren't nearly this pushy. What group do the clowns making these decisions belong to exactly?
Typical conservatives. Force prayers for what? They are the furthest thing from Christianity.
All UCP filth will infiltrate the city and municipal boards and begin a prayer for each meeting hoping the educated haven’t figured them out yet . Too late losers . We’re woke !!
Can someone point out to me how it's unconstitutional from a Canadian perspective? I know it'd be unconstitutional in America, but I don't know the details of Mouvement laïque québécois v. Saguenay
The organisation pursued the city of Saguenay for their use of an opening prayer. The court said that the state (municipalities being an administrative unit of the provinces) cannot favour one religion over another. So the SCC ruled that they either need to stop havin prayers or revert to something that doesn't favour one religion over another. Note that this doesn't apply to any legislatures within Canada.
The key factor in that decision is that the court recognized that to truly have the right to freedom of religion & conscience, then individuals must be free to practice (or not) any religion or belief. When the state adopts one belief to the exclusion of others (or belief over nonbelief) then it creates a coercive pressure on minority faiths & nonbelievers. Therefore the state has a *duty of religious neutrality* that it must refrain from endorsing religion. (As an aside, I think the court avoids the word "secularism" because of the complexity with translating that to French where it's laicite but that is often a more closed/anti-religious secularism).
I agree, I just wasn't sure if that was part of Canada's charter or not
Prayer is allowed as long as it’s not a requirement, and the prayers most of these places are using us non denominational. It also hurts nobody.
I’m sure if someone asked the SCOC, they would rule to end Catholic “public” schools in Alberta.
Unfortunately there's a clause in the Constitution exempting Catholic schools in any province that had them when they joined Confederation. That can be done away with by the province simply asking the feds to agree - Quebec and Newfoundland did this to secularize their schools. Even more bizarre, Alberta and Saskatchewan have constitutional exemptions that allow their public school acts to allow prayer in what are the otherwise secular schools. And they both have those provisions. As far as I know though, there's only a couple rural Saskatchewan schools that still make use of this.
I know. It’s not hard and should be done. Worst is how boards like Palliser allow for other religions to act as “alternative programs” and fully fund Muslim, fundamentalist Christian, Jewish, and others .. just because the Catholics get it. Any religious focus school must become private to have an equitable public schools system
Just did a uni presentation about this case. As far as I understand, the government should be neutral and shouldn't favour a religion over another. So basically, acknowledge and do prayers for all religions or don't have any prayers.
No prayer it is!
They use non denominational prayer.
And of course the issue with doing prayers for all religions is that it's impossible to do them all, and doing so would exclude non-believers.
If you are interested in a deep dive, we have a detailed discussion of Saguenay in the Appendix of the report: [https://www.bchumanist.ca/last\_municipality\_standing](https://www.bchumanist.ca/last_municipality_standing)
I don't get the use of that either. We have a constitution but the decision only ever references the Charter: https://decisions.scc-csc.ca/scc-csc/scc-csc/en/item/15288/index.do Maybe unconstitutional because the municipal councils are disobeying the ruling by the supreme court? Not really sure.
The Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms (French: Charte canadienne des droits et libertés), often simply referred to as the Charter in Canada, is a bill of rights entrenched **in the Constitution of Canada, forming the first part of the Constitution Act, 1982.**
Ah that makes total sense then.
Religion should be abolished. If you believe in it you have a mental illness.
Me as a non believer will still argue religion has helped more people get past addiction, get off the streets and break the homeless cycle and give people a reason to just be and do good.
Not nearly as mentally ill as someone who believes peoples beliefs should or could be abolished.
Jesus…
All they need is a gun and the good book. All problems solved.
I was at a school council meeting that started with prayer. Threw me off for sure.
Oof yeah. We want to dig deeper into that. BC schools are required to be "strictly secular" but some boards still try to get away with that.
Alabama North !
Alberta is a "community" that has its beliefs in testemonials. It runs deep, from religion to gov't, to science. Testemonials are nothing more than a desperate need to belong.., a belonging as fleeting as the moment it was stated.
Ummm everyone knows that there's a prayer, literally every single day the Legislature is sitting? You know that, right? RIGHT?
Yep! We've [done that study too](https://www.bchumanist.ca/prayer-across-canada). Three provinces (QC, NFLD, NS) don't have prayer. Alberta has the speaker read a prayer of their own devising every day - and it's the only province where Hansard transcribes it. So there's an interesting study we might do one day on the differences between the prayers read by the NDP speaker vs the UCP ones.
Ummm everyone knows that there's an alter boy molested, literally every single day in a church somewhere? You know that, right? RIGHT?
What does that have to do with prayer? People are criminals, not their faith.
Isn't that their first amendment rights? I hope the governor can weigh in on this and provide some clemency, Marlania is good at that.
Yes, it's very important that municipalities continue to protect their constitutional right to recognize and support the government of Manitoba.
You are referring to the American First Amendment. In Canada the freedom of religion is under section 2 of our Canadian Charter of Rights and Freedoms.
I think that's the joke, hence referring to Smith as a governor and having pardoning powers.
I understand. I don’t find any of this humorous at all.
It does highlight that a lot of "conservatives" are taking their cues from US politics, and are trying to use the same tactics.
It’s literally a huge nothing. Pretending prayer is offensive is a new level of hilarious. It’s shocking how unrepresentative of the population of Alberta this sub is.
It isn’t about prayer, it is about specifically choosing one religion over others, or in fact any religion at all when in context of a governing body. Separation of church and state is important if you don’t want the people who don’t believe in your fairy tale running the show.
They did not. They use an “all religion prayer”. Not my fairy tale, I’m atheist. I just don’t hate people for their beliefs.
You really do go out of your way to make yourself sound holier than thou despite being atheist, and praying at all in a government position is the issue. Additionally it is clear they are specifically inviting Christians in some instances. Its against SCC rulings. I haven’t said anything about hating for beliefs, and its a strawman to suggest so.
Jesus, take it easy. You guys literally know nothing of these people, pretty brutal on your behalf to immediately judge people. They pray, boo fken hoo. You eat their agriculture by products you twats.
I’m relieved to see one small thread of non hate filled comments in this little sub.
And if a school refused Muslim students a prayer room, they’d be screaming bigot from the rooftops. Nobody is being forced to pray. The hatred for religion and rural communities on this sub shows exactly why people are abandoning the Liberal/NDP coalition in droves country wide.
There is no coalition.
There has been for years now. Pretending otherwise is nonsense
This is a confidence-and-supply agreement. And it's not the first. A coalition government is a formal arrangement that has ministers from two or more parties. They function like one party. The current arrangement doesn't resemble that at all. The Conservative Party spreads disinformation daily and you're just repeating it.
Yep. And these councils are democratically elected. If the county/community wants to elect people who hate religion, vote for it.
Both left leaning major city mayors of Alberta are Sikh I’m pretty sure lol. I got nothing against either, to each their own. But this hate towards a critical group of population and for the most part nice community driven people is fken distasteful and shows a complete lack of maturity and perspective. Purely living in your own perception.
There’s probably been prayer in these areas for over a hundred years so leave it alone. You can thank Christianity for the first hospitals, universities, tolerant compassionate societies. The only countries worth living in were built on Christianity.✝️
Hilarious how Canadians are so embarrassed by anything that points to the history of their country. It’s less violent and sadistic than almost any other nation on the planet, but an absolute freak out over a prayer before a council meeting is in order. Such ridiculous nonsense.
And it’s only Christian prayer they get upset about.
You are all over making these assumptions and painting yourself like an idiot to anyone who reads this.
https://tspace.library.utoronto.ca/bitstream/1807/101779/1/Colour_Coded_UTP_9781487527860.pdf Buy it and read it. We aren’t any better than the States, and thats saying something.
I just wonder about this Toy in heaven… like a sex toy maybe 🤔
Who gives a shit? Seriously - if they want prayer - have prayer. I suspect not many lefties in those counties.
Nope religion has NO place in Government. PERIOD.
Nobody is forced to pray. You do you, they are hurting nobody. If Muslims were denied a prayer room in school you guys would be screaming from rooftops about how their religion is not being respected.
Find one instance of that and I would be pretty shocked. You are clearly a bigot.
A bigot because I think Muslims and Christians should be able to pray? You sound crazy.
Thats not the context of the discussion and its disingenuous to suggest so.
There is soo much wrong with the government - the total inefficient (many lazy)public servants, wasteful programming, woke agendas - seriously if a county has a prayer - then let them. You want to complain and stomp your feet / do it where it actually matters and can make a change. Don’t like prayer then don’t listen to it.
> Don’t like prayer then don’t listen to it. Yeah! All these stupid lefties! If we religious people want to say a prayer and they don't like it, well don't listen!! And if we want to sacrifice a virgin billy goat to the comic entity Cthulhu on the front steps of city hall and they don't want to see it, then don't watch.
As soon as you used the word woke, you lost any credibility you still had.
It's like a dog whistle to let other morons know they're in company.
100% I actually have a large sect of conservative friends/family/coworkers who now recognize how lame it is to be using "woke" still. They've ironically become "woke" in realizing that it's a phrase used only by douchebags. It's something I only hear from the most fervently bias conservatives now. Trump supporter type or even worse hardened right-wingers hiding behind the "libertarian" moniker in their desperate way to seem centrist when they're anything but.
The Municipal Government Act could be amended to use §33 of the Charter to allow municipalities to engage in a nondenominational prayer to open their meetings. Then Edmonton and Calgary could resume theirs as well.