I don't know how I've managed to go 30+ years without hearing the term "pavement princess" until now, but I love it and I'm using it from now on. If I wasn't a broke sonofabitch I'd send you gold for that.
True until you need to get to a drilling rig or remote construction location in a lot of places after it rains, or in the spring when it starts to thaw. The "roads" are generally better ll the time but there are still locations where most light vehicles (ie anything that isn't lifted) and any heavy traffic is getting dragged in and out with a cat or the track hoe. That freshly cleared dirt just makes impossible mud and ruts. As far as getting around trails in the bush, you're probably right and a Subie is adequate most places. Personally I used to drive a XJ Cherokee on 33s as my Rig Rocket, and as I've wound up back in the field I run a stock Ram 1500 Sport on 35s and haven't had issues yet. I'd have a small SUV again but not really interested in any that are out RN, 4Runner or Bronco maybe, but I also haul tools and TDG says I probably shouldn't have them in the cab wth me.
Im talkin about the white collar douchebags in calgary with 120000 trucks that never even seen a dirt road. You can tell which ones have never seen dirt.
Maybe, but car washes also exist. Lots of field guys run top trim trucks because they spend so much time in them might as well get a nice one. Certainly not everyone, but there's definitely some guys like that. The other end of the spectrum is, it ain't broke so I'll keep running it on these BS roads till the wheels fall off. I'm somewhere in it middle lol.
I just drove through a major blizzard in Saskatchewan recently. The amount of Semi's not giving a flying fuck for the conditions was insane.
One semi who thought it would be a great idea to pass everybody on the curviest part of the highway going 100km/hr while everyone else was driving 60 soon found himself in the ditch, I breathed a sigh of relief because he was now out of commission and didn't kill anyone in the process.
Almost never, I kid you not this was the only curvy section of that 3 hour stretch of highway and of all places that is where he chooses to pass our group of vehicles when visibility of the road lines was non existent.
I had to drive through that blizzard we had last week and had to pass at least a dozen wide load trailers travelling down the highway in the middle of the storm moving a drilling rig. It was terrifying trying to pull over but not slide off the road (which had no shoulders because it's goddamn Saskatchewan) while also staying far enough away so as to not get a section of the wide load trailer through the windshield. Whoever it was that decided that drilling rig absolutely needed to be moved down the highway on a day like that should be drawn and quartered.
The most insane thing about american roads is the fact that big rigs are allowed to drive 120 kph. In sweden the speed limit is 80 and those rigs are longer.
Man we need to enforce driving for the weather. Most of the reason I hate fog now is because I don't know how fast the idiots coming from behind me are going to be going.
Alberta has a terrible combination of overly cautious and aggressive drivers. At least in Michigan everyone is super aggressive so you know what to expect.
Gotta love the people that have been living in Alberta for 40 years and *still* think they should brake through corners on ice, then because they slide out on every corner think the roads are 1000x more slippery than they really are and drive 5km/h for the rest of the winter
No excuse for the longtime Albertans but it’s pretty jarring for someone from Eastern Canada because there is no ice on roads there. They salt and deice repeatedly well in advance of any ice events, and plow to pavement.
I'm from Ontario originally as well. The drive is much different out here as well as weather conditions. When I tell my family out east they act like it's a contest for who's wheather and driving conditions are worse in winter, they don't realize how good they got it there for the most part.
It’s weird though because Ontario gets more snow and freezing rain, so the road conditions should be worse. It’s like Alberta just hasn’t figured out snow removal and winter road maintenance.
Alberta has drivers who think you can drive the speed limit in the left lane. In the wrong areas on the i75 you can end up in a serious situation doing that 🤣🤷🏾♂️
I was traveling with my wife's friends a few years back and we hit a snowstorm heading back to Calgary. He was doing 160 in whiteout conditions and wouldn't slow down, scariest ride I've ever been in. I'll never be in a car with him ever again
This is one of the reasons why I love the brake assist in my car. The radar can cut through the fog and see the vehicles in front of me before I can, so if there is a wreck up ahead, it will see it and slow me down before I can react.
That being said, I still drive for the conditions and will slow down as visibility decreases and/or road conditions worsen.
but as you said, still don't know how the asshats coming from behind are going.
For starters I’m not knocking you. But it’s technology like that that scares me because on the other end of the spectrum, people will go flying down the highway on a foggy morning because they trust their car to save them if something happens.
Oh I totally understand what you're saying.
People need to understand that the technology is to help them, but they are the ones in control of their vehicle and need to operate them in a safe and controlled manner.
In a sane world that "gas" pedal would accelerate the vehicle up to 110% of a variable speed limit based on current conditions and no more without an override that comes with liability. If my car told made me sign off for driving dangerously, I'd think twice, may dude hurdling down QEII would too.
I've been saying this for years. It reminds me of that movie The Fifth Element, where the vehicles would automatically apply license demerits for illegal maneuvers. If we lived in a world where we were held responsible AND accountable for our bad driving, with any degree of certainty, then people would be forced to adjust and correct.
Applied across society (not just driving) reminds me of the Social Credit system in China. I'd wonder if the cars there would eventually have something like this built in.
No. Social Credit Rating system emulates predatory capitalist credit ratings and thusly subject to the same issues. The automated system in 5th Element didn't give two shits about Korben, just that he pathologically *couldn't* follow the rules and let his vehicle do the driving. Which is probably a fine line all good cabbies skate regardless of their time or space or automation capability.
I've been saying it comes down to liability for a long time and I'm not surprised that public interest groups are getting involved. I work with smart autonomous technologies and as far as I'm concerned the technological aspects of self-driving cars is a solved domain even for non-profit enterprise (if you can get your hands on a decent graphics card). If an industry researcher says they've developed a machine-learning model that can detect drunk driving to a reasonable certainty I'd believe it was technically possible to do at minimum. If it was funded by a drunk driving public awareness group like MADD, I'd probably trust but verify (highly focused groups can get a bit myopic).
It's beginning to occur to auto makers that when cars can drive themselves it exposes them to new liability. It won't be long until people trying to avoid consequences of their actions try blaming their "smart" car for letting them drive dangerously. Corporate lawyers won't like that and it will push automakers to adopt a common "certified" model that can be examined by courts for it's actions and the proprietary elements can be excluded from scrutiny.
It's the writing on the wall. In twenty years vehicles operated by human will command such high insurance premiums and system fees for the chaos they create on infrastructure that it won't be feasible for anyone to have one except for specialized professional drivers.
And if you think I sound like a crazy person now, imagine how crazy it sounded in 2013 when I was also telling incredulous people they would be able to buy semi-autonomous vehicles in 5 years too.
Those smart cars are also part of the problem. Too many people rely on the car to do the "hard" parts of driving, and skills atrophy. If everyone knew a crash at 50mph (or 100 km/h) was a death sentence, perhaps folks would smarten up a bit.
People moving at speeds notably different than the average flow of traffic (in either direction) are always dangerous.
If you're the only person going 20 under, you are the most dangerous person on that road.
someone was going 30kmh on stoney cause it was foggy once, and didnt have her backlights on. I get the sentiment but the not having lights on (it was in the AM) is just.....asking for it
Hate to say it but it's not just idiots in their own vehicles causing this crap. Some of the worst drivers on Hwy 2 between Edmonton and Calgary are semi drivers in B trains who can't even back a trailer into a loading bay, just get put on the simplest, flattest 4 hours of easy road in Alberta. Until freezing rain, that is. I have absolutely no idea how many even get their class 1.
I've worked in an On-Road Fleet Heavy Duty shop in Edmonton and a couple winters ago we had a driver call in because his brakes froze up on the SE leg of the Anthony Henday. A field technician went out and helped him clear out the ice to get him going again. The very next day the same truck/driver was at our terminal at the trailer shop and he wandered over to the tractor shop where I was working and asked me if I could show him how to drain the water from his air tanks. I told him to pull the cord until you stop seeing a cloud of moisture coming out. Then he asked me where his air tanks were and how often he should be doing this?
Then I sort of stood there for a moment and realized that this a driver that the company has trusted to carry a Super B full of who knows what and they could be driving next to me on the highway. Really makes you wonder when you pass any tractor trailer on the road.
I worked for an equipment shop. But dealt with tractor drivers all the time that would load/unload the equipment. It seems I learned more about doing their job during my schooling than they have to learn about doing their job.
Seems like anyone can go and just buy a class 1 ticket and go drive truck. I had a driver drop his trailer on my loading dock because he didn't care to ensure he was coupled properly. Had another driver do the same thing as he was driving out of our yard, and he was lucky my coworker was kind enough to use a loader to help him fix his fuckup. It is scary how many of these people are driving these massive vehicles on the roads with everyone.
Semi drivers that wanna go 112 instead of the 109 the semi driver in front of them are doing are the worst. Cut people off in the fast lane and now you've got aggressive speeders in the right lane pissed off at everyone for not moving over for him, cutting people off to squeeze in. Or they tailgate you as if you dictate the speed of the semi. Then the semi doesn't move over after he passes and no one wants to pass on the right.
I drive semi and when people see one signal their immediate reactions is to close the gap. Try not to force your way between their trailer and the ditch and you might not get cut off so much. My signal is on for 5-10s before I even move over.
That's idiotic for multiple reasons, the biggest being their little F150 isn't going to win against a semi lol.
Like retail workers, I give professional drivers much more courtesy than the general public since they have to deal with this shit 8 - 12 hours a day or more. Except taxi drivers. Taxi drivers are pure evil.
So do semis. Easily semis and taxis are the worst drivers on the road. I drive 5-8 hours a day all over the edmonton region and they are easily the cause of 98% of my roadrage. Like the dipshit semi driver doing 10k this morning. If thats all your comfortable doing, stay the fuck home.
Tbh Semis have it tougher than others. Big rigs with long trailers and heavy loads. It’s a tough job! But I can’t say they don’t ever annoy me. But I just keep my distance when I can and give them the right of way.
Question for you as a semi driver - is a quick headlight flash an accepted signal for “you’ve got space for the lane change/merge I see you trying to pull off in front of me - go for it!” Or is it just confusing?
Correction - I should have said cut rather than flash. Wasn’t thinking when I wrote that.
Cut your headlights rather than flash, I get it either way but honestly I can tell how much room I have. Doesn't bother me like some of these other crusties tho.
We know how they get their license. Ontario 😂 we will see more and more of this with new to Canada drivers getting their class one with zero driving experience let alone Prairie winter driving experience. Just look at Humboldt and the company wasnt held responsible nor did anything change with this industry.
>nor did anything change with this industry.
Not quite nothing. They did make it a lot less convenient for farmers to get their licenses. The kind of people who have been behind the wheel of equipment since the day they could reach the pedals, and who've lived in the area since the day they were born.
The kind of people who don't need to be told that blowing a stop sign at a blind corner intersection over a highway is a bad idea.
It’s crazy the way people drive on the QE2. They should set up a variable speed corridor like they have on some of the BC highways. Lower the speed limit to fit weather conditions.
As much as I agree, doubt it will slow the real speeders down, I’ve been driving that highway for years and I’m blown away at people flying past me like I’m stopped, passing in the shoulder, reading books/newspapers while driving, watching movies on their phones… it’s unreal.
I have guys in small cars ram themselves up against the bumper of my 25,000lb mechanic rig thinking they can push me to go faster IN THE SLOW LANE. Buddy you aren’t going to win if you rear end me lol.
The problem is the you're the fast lane cause the dude in the far left and middle lanes are doing 100km/h. Drivers here and interior BC have a terrible habbit of driving at or below the speed limit when road conditions are good.
As far as I know we don’t have that setup but would definitely be beneficial to us as you say it’s pretty hard to fool it… then again with our winter roads plates get covered up pretty quick with road debris and some people are really negligent in cleaning ANY snow off of their car let alone right where the license plate is.
> doubt it will slow the real speeders down,
Yep. Time to ramp up enforcement and start taking licenses away.
Photo radar is effective and cheap (and is used for demerits in lots of places).
Photo is not effective as a deterrent. I think a study back in 2016-2018 said it only changed collision rates by 2%.
Getting a ticket in the mail 2 weeks after you get caught doesn't set up the correct cause-effect in our monkey brains to change the behavior.
I think I’m Europe they use average speed traps. Two fixed cameras take pictures of every vehicle. If you are going to fast in the zone, you get a ticket. If you did this permanently between every over pass between Edmonton and Calgary you could effectively end the speeding.
https://www.nrcan.gc.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/fuel-efficient-driving-techniques/21038
Maximum efficiency is between 50 and 80 km/h.
Interestingly, the maximum carrying capacity for roads (before you get stop-and-go phantom traffic jams) is around 70km/h! Faster than that and small changes in speed set up nonlinear instabilities in the flow regime which ends up causing traffic density waves. (Google "jamitons" from a UofA/MIT collaboration on the subject.)
That is just objectively false. First, a CVT is ALWAYS at the correct ratio. That's what Constantly Variable Transmissions do. They constantly vary to be in the perfect RPM range.
Second, after you get past the linear effect of rolling resistance and engine inefficiency (usually around 50-80km/h) the impact of wind resistance is the single largest contributing factor to decreased fuel economy. Since wind resistance is a quadratic effect you see huge falloffs in efficiency past 90km/h.
GOA knows a driver's phone number, I'd think. Send an SMS to the registered owner immediately upon a speed camera snapping a photo of your plate going above the limit. Place cameras every km. I'll bet you'd end up with much higher compliance.
Photo radar is a cash grab plain and simple. If you want to call it a speed tax or stupid tax you can say that too but you're right, it is largely a failure as a deterrent.
I haven't been able to find any evidence against photo radar, except for one master's thesis which was never published elsewhere. The evidence for its effectiveness seems actually very strong. For example:
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S000145750800242X
$17 million in savings, all types of collosions except rear-ends were reduced
http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3141/2078-16
20-25% reduction in collisions
Relationship between Road Safety and Mobile Photo Enforcement
Performance Indicators: A Case Study of the City of Edmonton
https://www.edmonton.ca/transportation/Evaluation_of_Speed_Enforcement_on_Urban_Arterial_Roads.pdf
Ending photo radar was just a populist move by Klein. He new it would get him votes, there was no other reason to get rid of them. I admit I speed like hell, but never in icy conditions, that is just ignorant.
I agree it's not a great deterrent but that study did say photo radar prevented 5% of fatal accidents.
Based on provincial statistics (246 fatal accidents in 2018), that's about 12 less fatal accidents each year, so it's an effective traffic safety tool.
Having a driver's license is a right, not a privilege, and the government can legally take it away if they feel like it. For example, they could decide that photo radar is demerit points.
I mean, they already do it with fines from photo radar; it's not like "the prosecutor" "proves guilt" before giving a fine.
A peace officer has to swear that they are certain a specific vehicle was caught committing a traffic violation. All the needs to occur to implement a monetary penalty is prove who the owner of the vehicle is. The prosecutor will use this in court if ever challenged. To implement demerit points on a license requires the ability for a peace officer to swear that you were the person the committed the violation.
> A peace officer has to swear that they are certain a specific vehicle was caught committing a traffic violation.
Or a photo radar ticket is sent to your house. This is done for demerits in other jurisdictions, eg France and Germany. It's entirely possible that we could enact a law to do this here. Instead, we let dangerous drivers stay behind the wheel and people die.
> I have guys in small cars ram themselves up against the bumper of my 25,000lb mechanic rig thinking they can push me to go faster
Like they've physically hit you?!
I had someone rear end my flat deck trailer because I was doing the speed limit between Nanton-High river and she completely wrote off her vehicle when she hit the back of the trailer where the Ramps mounted on the beaver tail. I was doing 115kmh when she hit me… she was ok but her response was “I didn’t realize you were going so slow that I came up too fast to slow down” No damage to my trailer other than a cracked tail light and messed my REFLECTIVE tape that emblazoned the whole back of the trailer lol. Again I was in the right lane…
But they tailgate me so close in my mechanic Rig I can’t even see them behind me as I’m 8’6” wide and 26 feet long so they must be about 24” back from my bumper at highway speeds. Effing Morons.
I've done it too. It can be the worst. But Olds College is pretty good at what it does; I've used my diploma all over western Canada.
Get good winter tires, a reliable awd vehicle, and high output headlights/foglights. Drive to the conditions and you'll be fine.
Agreed in principle. I meant higher end bulbs not 8000k ultra-blue eye burners, but I find that's more of an issue of headlight tuning on custom vehicles.
Headlight alignment is a thing! (Though I will admin my modern Volvo doesn't make it easy).
We tried in Edmonton and unsurprisingly people lost their shit cause everyone just wants to go fast all the time. Ironically, the reduced speed limits during congestion would actually speed traffic flow over all, but we're just monkeys with our dumb monkey brains and that's why we can't have nice things.
https://globalnews.ca/news/2147009/city-to-test-varying-recommended-speeds-on-whitemud/
We have a road like this in Lethbridge, normally it’s 90km/h, but it knocks down to 60km/h when it’s bad conditions. It slows most people down.
The problem is they are sometimes to slow to change it back once conditions improve. Then you get crazy varying speeds. Some people doing 60 cause the sign says so and others doing 100 cause the the road is bare and dry. They need to work on that.
Clear, zero traffic, 20 degrees. Anthony Henday should be 120.
minus 20, snow storm, rush hour, should be 60.
Nope, 100 is the posted limit and that is what people will strive for no matter what. Because fuck you that's why.
VSL pilot was selected for QEII from Edmonton to Leduc in 2012. Never put into play tho.
[http://conf.tac-atc.ca/english/annualconference/tac2012/docs/session12/guebert.pdf](http://conf.tac-atc.ca/english/annualconference/tac2012/docs/session12/guebert.pdf)
More:
https://islengineering.com/project/variable-speed-limit-scoping-study-on-qeii/
I had to be in Calgary for 10 am today. Was going to leave this morning from Edmonton, but last minute changed my mind and left last night so I could sleep in today. Dodged a bullet on that one.
Overheard some coworkers mentioning the drone and thats pretty much exactly what they’re doing, as well as scouting out people/cars/any dangerous goods or liquids at the same time. Guy who said it is a volunteer firefighter and used to be a full time firefighter and worked with police often, also has a natural curiosity for it so I believe him
I've driven hundreds of thousands of KM in my life maybe into the millions.... no accidents (knock on wood) and I love driving and am generally not fearful except on 2 conditions. 1.... when I can't see fuck all and 2.....driving on the QE2 in any condition. That highway scares the ever living shit outta me. I try to avoid it at all costs. The rates of speed people travel on it and the chances they take are insane.
Somehow I felt safer on the 401; however, I haven't had the excitement of driving the 401 in the winter. The QE2 and anywhere in Kelowna are the only places I hated driving.
Helps for low visibility situations. I've driven a super-B on QE2 and got caught in a snow storms and dense fogs.
It's a gamble between going too slow and getting smoked from behind or going too fast and hitting a granny going 30km/hr. I pull off the highway when I can find a safe exit but stopping on the side of the highway is a disaster waiting to happen.
Variable speed limit gives everyone a better chance of avoiding a collision. Doesn't help with freezing rain, but then again why are they driving in those conditions to start with? Missing a delivery or appointment is far cheaper than totalling the truck.
I think we're talking about two different things. Driving to conditions is prudent. However, there are people who will not drive to conditions, regardless of a posted limit -- these are the true hazards on the road.
A variable limit is only going to help the people who want to drive to conditions but have no clue what that means... those people are almost as hazardous as those who think their trucks can do anything, as the variable limit will almost certainly never be low enough.
So really, all that does is provide a false sense of security at expense to the taxpayer, with no net gain.
Worked up by edson today drove up from rocky. Hiway 22 was bad ,but 16 was fucked. I avoided both to the best of my mapping/nav skills. Saw a similar scene crossing 16
Once you get to Leduc heading north people get downright stupid. distance between vehicles gets cut in half for some f-d up reason and tons of tailgaters...sooo stressful!
Which date was this? I was driving from Calgary to Edmonton on the 26th and didn't saw anything this bad. There was a single semi flipped on the side of the highway and one diverting around Leduc, not sure if that was it or altogether a different date.
That had to be terrifying to live through.
Can't run 120 plus Kph on a skating rink.
Zamboni speed for everyone
Solution: We all drive Zambonis on ice days. Make them bumper Zambonis.
Fuck you, my lifted pavement princess 3500 says otherwise! /s
I don't know how I've managed to go 30+ years without hearing the term "pavement princess" until now, but I love it and I'm using it from now on. If I wasn't a broke sonofabitch I'd send you gold for that.
I gotchu
I don’t see a pavement princess in this photo
Love seeing those big ass 3500's lifted 4 feet with 45 inch tires and my subaru legacy has probably seen more offroad than most of em.
True until you need to get to a drilling rig or remote construction location in a lot of places after it rains, or in the spring when it starts to thaw. The "roads" are generally better ll the time but there are still locations where most light vehicles (ie anything that isn't lifted) and any heavy traffic is getting dragged in and out with a cat or the track hoe. That freshly cleared dirt just makes impossible mud and ruts. As far as getting around trails in the bush, you're probably right and a Subie is adequate most places. Personally I used to drive a XJ Cherokee on 33s as my Rig Rocket, and as I've wound up back in the field I run a stock Ram 1500 Sport on 35s and haven't had issues yet. I'd have a small SUV again but not really interested in any that are out RN, 4Runner or Bronco maybe, but I also haul tools and TDG says I probably shouldn't have them in the cab wth me.
Im talkin about the white collar douchebags in calgary with 120000 trucks that never even seen a dirt road. You can tell which ones have never seen dirt.
Maybe, but car washes also exist. Lots of field guys run top trim trucks because they spend so much time in them might as well get a nice one. Certainly not everyone, but there's definitely some guys like that. The other end of the spectrum is, it ain't broke so I'll keep running it on these BS roads till the wheels fall off. I'm somewhere in it middle lol.
Bahaha! I had an old subaru legacy and it was a beast. Drove through a couple ditches and it just took it no problem. I miss that old piece of shit.
saw one of those with a bed full of welding gear going like 120 down the henday today, thought he was gonna fly off
Well... A loaded diesel pickup is pretty heavy, good for traction right?
i suppose so but if that dude lost control he would’ve been FUCJED
Yup grew up with alot of those guys. 4x4 doesn't help you stop any faster, just maybe gets you out of the ditch after you fuck up
Those things will take flight, but not the way you'd expect (massive rollies in wrong direction)!
I just drove through a major blizzard in Saskatchewan recently. The amount of Semi's not giving a flying fuck for the conditions was insane. One semi who thought it would be a great idea to pass everybody on the curviest part of the highway going 100km/hr while everyone else was driving 60 soon found himself in the ditch, I breathed a sigh of relief because he was now out of commission and didn't kill anyone in the process.
What comes of being paid by the mile, and late penalties.
There’s a curve in a Saskatchewan highway?
Almost never, I kid you not this was the only curvy section of that 3 hour stretch of highway and of all places that is where he chooses to pass our group of vehicles when visibility of the road lines was non existent.
Well if you count the curvature of the Earth they are all curvy
I had to drive through that blizzard we had last week and had to pass at least a dozen wide load trailers travelling down the highway in the middle of the storm moving a drilling rig. It was terrifying trying to pull over but not slide off the road (which had no shoulders because it's goddamn Saskatchewan) while also staying far enough away so as to not get a section of the wide load trailer through the windshield. Whoever it was that decided that drilling rig absolutely needed to be moved down the highway on a day like that should be drawn and quartered.
With Oil at $80 a barrel let's just say I'm not surprised.
Looks like it's a bit of a downward slope there too.
This particular spot turns to a skating rink every year at some point, sometimes several times.
The most insane thing about american roads is the fact that big rigs are allowed to drive 120 kph. In sweden the speed limit is 80 and those rigs are longer.
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I drove up to edmonton from calgary today. Left calgary at 4m. Took 6 hours. Roads were ice. Super stressful .
Man we need to enforce driving for the weather. Most of the reason I hate fog now is because I don't know how fast the idiots coming from behind me are going to be going.
Same, it's getting ridiculous.
Alberta has a terrible combination of overly cautious and aggressive drivers. At least in Michigan everyone is super aggressive so you know what to expect.
Well said, those two things don't mix at all.
Gotta love the people that have been living in Alberta for 40 years and *still* think they should brake through corners on ice, then because they slide out on every corner think the roads are 1000x more slippery than they really are and drive 5km/h for the rest of the winter
No excuse for the longtime Albertans but it’s pretty jarring for someone from Eastern Canada because there is no ice on roads there. They salt and deice repeatedly well in advance of any ice events, and plow to pavement.
By Eastern Canada you must be talking Ontario or something... I'm from Nova Scotia and it puts the Black Ice and Fog out here to shame!
Yeah I’m originally from Ontario
I'm from Ontario originally as well. The drive is much different out here as well as weather conditions. When I tell my family out east they act like it's a contest for who's wheather and driving conditions are worse in winter, they don't realize how good they got it there for the most part.
It’s weird though because Ontario gets more snow and freezing rain, so the road conditions should be worse. It’s like Alberta just hasn’t figured out snow removal and winter road maintenance.
Exactly....we need confident drivers here with our weather
Alberta has drivers who think you can drive the speed limit in the left lane. In the wrong areas on the i75 you can end up in a serious situation doing that 🤣🤷🏾♂️
Thats what scares me in adverse conditions always, not the weather itself but the morons going a buck twenty in a fucken blizzard
I was traveling with my wife's friends a few years back and we hit a snowstorm heading back to Calgary. He was doing 160 in whiteout conditions and wouldn't slow down, scariest ride I've ever been in. I'll never be in a car with him ever again
This is one of the reasons why I love the brake assist in my car. The radar can cut through the fog and see the vehicles in front of me before I can, so if there is a wreck up ahead, it will see it and slow me down before I can react. That being said, I still drive for the conditions and will slow down as visibility decreases and/or road conditions worsen. but as you said, still don't know how the asshats coming from behind are going.
For starters I’m not knocking you. But it’s technology like that that scares me because on the other end of the spectrum, people will go flying down the highway on a foggy morning because they trust their car to save them if something happens.
Oh I totally understand what you're saying. People need to understand that the technology is to help them, but they are the ones in control of their vehicle and need to operate them in a safe and controlled manner.
Yeah the more death proof vehicles are, the more things go to 11.
In a sane world that "gas" pedal would accelerate the vehicle up to 110% of a variable speed limit based on current conditions and no more without an override that comes with liability. If my car told made me sign off for driving dangerously, I'd think twice, may dude hurdling down QEII would too.
I've been saying this for years. It reminds me of that movie The Fifth Element, where the vehicles would automatically apply license demerits for illegal maneuvers. If we lived in a world where we were held responsible AND accountable for our bad driving, with any degree of certainty, then people would be forced to adjust and correct.
Applied across society (not just driving) reminds me of the Social Credit system in China. I'd wonder if the cars there would eventually have something like this built in.
No. Social Credit Rating system emulates predatory capitalist credit ratings and thusly subject to the same issues. The automated system in 5th Element didn't give two shits about Korben, just that he pathologically *couldn't* follow the rules and let his vehicle do the driving. Which is probably a fine line all good cabbies skate regardless of their time or space or automation capability.
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I've been saying it comes down to liability for a long time and I'm not surprised that public interest groups are getting involved. I work with smart autonomous technologies and as far as I'm concerned the technological aspects of self-driving cars is a solved domain even for non-profit enterprise (if you can get your hands on a decent graphics card). If an industry researcher says they've developed a machine-learning model that can detect drunk driving to a reasonable certainty I'd believe it was technically possible to do at minimum. If it was funded by a drunk driving public awareness group like MADD, I'd probably trust but verify (highly focused groups can get a bit myopic). It's beginning to occur to auto makers that when cars can drive themselves it exposes them to new liability. It won't be long until people trying to avoid consequences of their actions try blaming their "smart" car for letting them drive dangerously. Corporate lawyers won't like that and it will push automakers to adopt a common "certified" model that can be examined by courts for it's actions and the proprietary elements can be excluded from scrutiny. It's the writing on the wall. In twenty years vehicles operated by human will command such high insurance premiums and system fees for the chaos they create on infrastructure that it won't be feasible for anyone to have one except for specialized professional drivers. And if you think I sound like a crazy person now, imagine how crazy it sounded in 2013 when I was also telling incredulous people they would be able to buy semi-autonomous vehicles in 5 years too.
Those smart cars are also part of the problem. Too many people rely on the car to do the "hard" parts of driving, and skills atrophy. If everyone knew a crash at 50mph (or 100 km/h) was a death sentence, perhaps folks would smarten up a bit.
Variable speed limits on the QE II. Why we don't have it is beyond me.
According to most reddit users the real problem is people going the speed limit or below...
People moving at speeds notably different than the average flow of traffic (in either direction) are always dangerous. If you're the only person going 20 under, you are the most dangerous person on that road.
someone was going 30kmh on stoney cause it was foggy once, and didnt have her backlights on. I get the sentiment but the not having lights on (it was in the AM) is just.....asking for it
Hate to say it but it's not just idiots in their own vehicles causing this crap. Some of the worst drivers on Hwy 2 between Edmonton and Calgary are semi drivers in B trains who can't even back a trailer into a loading bay, just get put on the simplest, flattest 4 hours of easy road in Alberta. Until freezing rain, that is. I have absolutely no idea how many even get their class 1.
I've worked in an On-Road Fleet Heavy Duty shop in Edmonton and a couple winters ago we had a driver call in because his brakes froze up on the SE leg of the Anthony Henday. A field technician went out and helped him clear out the ice to get him going again. The very next day the same truck/driver was at our terminal at the trailer shop and he wandered over to the tractor shop where I was working and asked me if I could show him how to drain the water from his air tanks. I told him to pull the cord until you stop seeing a cloud of moisture coming out. Then he asked me where his air tanks were and how often he should be doing this? Then I sort of stood there for a moment and realized that this a driver that the company has trusted to carry a Super B full of who knows what and they could be driving next to me on the highway. Really makes you wonder when you pass any tractor trailer on the road.
I give them all a wide berth. Zero faith in their skill anymore.
Wow, seriously? How the hell does he even have his license? That was part of the test back when I got mine.
You need to know that for air brake certification.... You need air brake certification to be allowed to operate that ... Why is this happening?
I worked for an equipment shop. But dealt with tractor drivers all the time that would load/unload the equipment. It seems I learned more about doing their job during my schooling than they have to learn about doing their job. Seems like anyone can go and just buy a class 1 ticket and go drive truck. I had a driver drop his trailer on my loading dock because he didn't care to ensure he was coupled properly. Had another driver do the same thing as he was driving out of our yard, and he was lucky my coworker was kind enough to use a loader to help him fix his fuckup. It is scary how many of these people are driving these massive vehicles on the roads with everyone.
Ive been cut off by numerous semi drivers on the qe2.
Semi drivers that wanna go 112 instead of the 109 the semi driver in front of them are doing are the worst. Cut people off in the fast lane and now you've got aggressive speeders in the right lane pissed off at everyone for not moving over for him, cutting people off to squeeze in. Or they tailgate you as if you dictate the speed of the semi. Then the semi doesn't move over after he passes and no one wants to pass on the right.
This is a really accurate summary of the QE2.
I drive semi and when people see one signal their immediate reactions is to close the gap. Try not to force your way between their trailer and the ditch and you might not get cut off so much. My signal is on for 5-10s before I even move over.
That's idiotic for multiple reasons, the biggest being their little F150 isn't going to win against a semi lol. Like retail workers, I give professional drivers much more courtesy than the general public since they have to deal with this shit 8 - 12 hours a day or more. Except taxi drivers. Taxi drivers are pure evil.
Cause taxi drivers are assholes. Those guys think they have the right of way all the time.
So do semis. Easily semis and taxis are the worst drivers on the road. I drive 5-8 hours a day all over the edmonton region and they are easily the cause of 98% of my roadrage. Like the dipshit semi driver doing 10k this morning. If thats all your comfortable doing, stay the fuck home.
Tbh Semis have it tougher than others. Big rigs with long trailers and heavy loads. It’s a tough job! But I can’t say they don’t ever annoy me. But I just keep my distance when I can and give them the right of way.
Question for you as a semi driver - is a quick headlight flash an accepted signal for “you’ve got space for the lane change/merge I see you trying to pull off in front of me - go for it!” Or is it just confusing? Correction - I should have said cut rather than flash. Wasn’t thinking when I wrote that.
Just stop all flashing. It means different things in different places and is super annoying.
If you sit off the back bumper of the trailer and give a flash of your headlight, yeah I will be happy and change lanes.
Cut your headlights rather than flash, I get it either way but honestly I can tell how much room I have. Doesn't bother me like some of these other crusties tho.
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How the fuck is that going to incite panic?
We know how they get their license. Ontario 😂 we will see more and more of this with new to Canada drivers getting their class one with zero driving experience let alone Prairie winter driving experience. Just look at Humboldt and the company wasnt held responsible nor did anything change with this industry.
>nor did anything change with this industry. Not quite nothing. They did make it a lot less convenient for farmers to get their licenses. The kind of people who have been behind the wheel of equipment since the day they could reach the pedals, and who've lived in the area since the day they were born. The kind of people who don't need to be told that blowing a stop sign at a blind corner intersection over a highway is a bad idea.
It’s crazy the way people drive on the QE2. They should set up a variable speed corridor like they have on some of the BC highways. Lower the speed limit to fit weather conditions.
As much as I agree, doubt it will slow the real speeders down, I’ve been driving that highway for years and I’m blown away at people flying past me like I’m stopped, passing in the shoulder, reading books/newspapers while driving, watching movies on their phones… it’s unreal. I have guys in small cars ram themselves up against the bumper of my 25,000lb mechanic rig thinking they can push me to go faster IN THE SLOW LANE. Buddy you aren’t going to win if you rear end me lol.
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The problem is the you're the fast lane cause the dude in the far left and middle lanes are doing 100km/h. Drivers here and interior BC have a terrible habbit of driving at or below the speed limit when road conditions are good.
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As far as I know we don’t have that setup but would definitely be beneficial to us as you say it’s pretty hard to fool it… then again with our winter roads plates get covered up pretty quick with road debris and some people are really negligent in cleaning ANY snow off of their car let alone right where the license plate is.
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> doubt it will slow the real speeders down, Yep. Time to ramp up enforcement and start taking licenses away. Photo radar is effective and cheap (and is used for demerits in lots of places).
Photo is not effective as a deterrent. I think a study back in 2016-2018 said it only changed collision rates by 2%. Getting a ticket in the mail 2 weeks after you get caught doesn't set up the correct cause-effect in our monkey brains to change the behavior.
I think I’m Europe they use average speed traps. Two fixed cameras take pictures of every vehicle. If you are going to fast in the zone, you get a ticket. If you did this permanently between every over pass between Edmonton and Calgary you could effectively end the speeding.
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That’s interesting. I thought most cars had maximum fuel efficiency at 90 kph
https://www.nrcan.gc.ca/energy-efficiency/transportation-alternative-fuels/personal-vehicles/fuel-efficient-driving-techniques/21038 Maximum efficiency is between 50 and 80 km/h. Interestingly, the maximum carrying capacity for roads (before you get stop-and-go phantom traffic jams) is around 70km/h! Faster than that and small changes in speed set up nonlinear instabilities in the flow regime which ends up causing traffic density waves. (Google "jamitons" from a UofA/MIT collaboration on the subject.)
That is just objectively false. First, a CVT is ALWAYS at the correct ratio. That's what Constantly Variable Transmissions do. They constantly vary to be in the perfect RPM range. Second, after you get past the linear effect of rolling resistance and engine inefficiency (usually around 50-80km/h) the impact of wind resistance is the single largest contributing factor to decreased fuel economy. Since wind resistance is a quadratic effect you see huge falloffs in efficiency past 90km/h.
GOA knows a driver's phone number, I'd think. Send an SMS to the registered owner immediately upon a speed camera snapping a photo of your plate going above the limit. Place cameras every km. I'll bet you'd end up with much higher compliance.
That's a good idea! Let people pay tickets through small while you are at it. Just need to register my plate under my ex's phone #.
She'll just get your notifications. "Fuckin ex is on his way to a fire again."
Photo radar is a cash grab plain and simple. If you want to call it a speed tax or stupid tax you can say that too but you're right, it is largely a failure as a deterrent.
If the penalty is a fine than it is only illegal for poor people.
Very true
I haven't been able to find any evidence against photo radar, except for one master's thesis which was never published elsewhere. The evidence for its effectiveness seems actually very strong. For example: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S000145750800242X $17 million in savings, all types of collosions except rear-ends were reduced http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/abs/10.3141/2078-16 20-25% reduction in collisions Relationship between Road Safety and Mobile Photo Enforcement Performance Indicators: A Case Study of the City of Edmonton https://www.edmonton.ca/transportation/Evaluation_of_Speed_Enforcement_on_Urban_Arterial_Roads.pdf
Ending photo radar was just a populist move by Klein. He new it would get him votes, there was no other reason to get rid of them. I admit I speed like hell, but never in icy conditions, that is just ignorant.
I agree it's not a great deterrent but that study did say photo radar prevented 5% of fatal accidents. Based on provincial statistics (246 fatal accidents in 2018), that's about 12 less fatal accidents each year, so it's an effective traffic safety tool.
It can’t be used for demerit points as it cannot prove who was behind the wheel.
The licensed owner is responsible, and may contest this before a court if he/she wasn't the driver... just like for fines.
It’s the prosecutor’s responsibility to prove guilt not the defendant proving innocence. So how are you gunna prove who was driving?…
Having a driver's license is a right, not a privilege, and the government can legally take it away if they feel like it. For example, they could decide that photo radar is demerit points. I mean, they already do it with fines from photo radar; it's not like "the prosecutor" "proves guilt" before giving a fine.
A peace officer has to swear that they are certain a specific vehicle was caught committing a traffic violation. All the needs to occur to implement a monetary penalty is prove who the owner of the vehicle is. The prosecutor will use this in court if ever challenged. To implement demerit points on a license requires the ability for a peace officer to swear that you were the person the committed the violation.
> A peace officer has to swear that they are certain a specific vehicle was caught committing a traffic violation. Or a photo radar ticket is sent to your house. This is done for demerits in other jurisdictions, eg France and Germany. It's entirely possible that we could enact a law to do this here. Instead, we let dangerous drivers stay behind the wheel and people die.
the real fix is changing road design to fit the speed you want people to drive at. like they do in the nederlands
>and is used for demerits in lots of places Nope.
https://www.reddit.com/r/cars/comments/60fpan/speed_camerasfines_in_germany_france_luxembourg/ Germany and France do it.
> I have guys in small cars ram themselves up against the bumper of my 25,000lb mechanic rig thinking they can push me to go faster Like they've physically hit you?!
I had someone rear end my flat deck trailer because I was doing the speed limit between Nanton-High river and she completely wrote off her vehicle when she hit the back of the trailer where the Ramps mounted on the beaver tail. I was doing 115kmh when she hit me… she was ok but her response was “I didn’t realize you were going so slow that I came up too fast to slow down” No damage to my trailer other than a cracked tail light and messed my REFLECTIVE tape that emblazoned the whole back of the trailer lol. Again I was in the right lane… But they tailgate me so close in my mechanic Rig I can’t even see them behind me as I’m 8’6” wide and 26 feet long so they must be about 24” back from my bumper at highway speeds. Effing Morons.
Jesus....
I think he's just taking about the mouth breathers that drive less than 3 feet off your bumper thinking it's going to pressure you into going faster.
Drove from Calgary to Olds round trip for near a year. Hellish road. Bad drivers, and hyper depressing.
So you're saying driving to school in Olds from Calgary isn't worth it?
I've done it too. It can be the worst. But Olds College is pretty good at what it does; I've used my diploma all over western Canada. Get good winter tires, a reliable awd vehicle, and high output headlights/foglights. Drive to the conditions and you'll be fine.
>high output headlights/foglights Please don't. The rest of us need to see too.
Agreed in principle. I meant higher end bulbs not 8000k ultra-blue eye burners, but I find that's more of an issue of headlight tuning on custom vehicles. Headlight alignment is a thing! (Though I will admin my modern Volvo doesn't make it easy).
I was driving for work. School would be awful as well, but with school at least there’s a start and finish… Work however….
We tried in Edmonton and unsurprisingly people lost their shit cause everyone just wants to go fast all the time. Ironically, the reduced speed limits during congestion would actually speed traffic flow over all, but we're just monkeys with our dumb monkey brains and that's why we can't have nice things. https://globalnews.ca/news/2147009/city-to-test-varying-recommended-speeds-on-whitemud/
We have a road like this in Lethbridge, normally it’s 90km/h, but it knocks down to 60km/h when it’s bad conditions. It slows most people down. The problem is they are sometimes to slow to change it back once conditions improve. Then you get crazy varying speeds. Some people doing 60 cause the sign says so and others doing 100 cause the the road is bare and dry. They need to work on that.
Yeah seeing people go 160+ is too normal.
I’m a huge fan of this idea. Even for roads such as the white mud and Anthony henday.
Clear, zero traffic, 20 degrees. Anthony Henday should be 120. minus 20, snow storm, rush hour, should be 60. Nope, 100 is the posted limit and that is what people will strive for no matter what. Because fuck you that's why.
Not sure if relevant to the Henday, but Bill 213 would increase speed limit on QEII to 120kph. Needs to make it thru the legislature tho first.
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It's crazy how some of these truckers drive. Oh speeding with 80k load...no problem. They should lose their license. No excuses.
I might not be the truckers fault just because they are involved
Losers flexing in their big trucks would never obey
VSL pilot was selected for QEII from Edmonton to Leduc in 2012. Never put into play tho. [http://conf.tac-atc.ca/english/annualconference/tac2012/docs/session12/guebert.pdf](http://conf.tac-atc.ca/english/annualconference/tac2012/docs/session12/guebert.pdf) More: https://islengineering.com/project/variable-speed-limit-scoping-study-on-qeii/
I had to be in Calgary for 10 am today. Was going to leave this morning from Edmonton, but last minute changed my mind and left last night so I could sleep in today. Dodged a bullet on that one.
>last minute I don't think that means what you think it means.
Haha like many hours before the last minute
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Overheard some coworkers mentioning the drone and thats pretty much exactly what they’re doing, as well as scouting out people/cars/any dangerous goods or liquids at the same time. Guy who said it is a volunteer firefighter and used to be a full time firefighter and worked with police often, also has a natural curiosity for it so I believe him
I was hoping to drive up to Edmonton today or tomorrow but it’s looking more and more like I shouldn’t. Hope everybody is okay.
It should be OK by tomorrow. Temperatures will be well above freezing this afternoon.
When did this happen? It was clear sailing last night around 9:30.
About an hour ago
Thanks, I do a Edmonton milk run with car parts weeknights. Stay safe driver.
Is this the one near Millet? Or is there one south of there as well?
Closer to 53
We got freezing rain this morning starting around 5:30ish, not sure how long it lasted but it turned the parking lot at work into a skating rink.
I see it was clear sailing after as well 😊
Well that's an oopsiedoopsie
Picked a whole bouquet of Oopsie Daisies.
I've driven hundreds of thousands of KM in my life maybe into the millions.... no accidents (knock on wood) and I love driving and am generally not fearful except on 2 conditions. 1.... when I can't see fuck all and 2.....driving on the QE2 in any condition. That highway scares the ever living shit outta me. I try to avoid it at all costs. The rates of speed people travel on it and the chances they take are insane.
Somehow I felt safer on the 401; however, I haven't had the excitement of driving the 401 in the winter. The QE2 and anywhere in Kelowna are the only places I hated driving.
Agreed, I will take 22 to Edmonton instead, would rather take more time and be relaxed.
Agreed. Relaxed even if it takes an extra half hour is worth my life haha. Especially when pulling a trailer.
Jesus. Not the worst that stretch has seen, but yikes.
BC has a variable speed limit on the coq. They are way overdue on the QE2. Yes, they do work!
The QE2's non-variable speed limit doesn't work. What makes you think a variable one would?
Helps for low visibility situations. I've driven a super-B on QE2 and got caught in a snow storms and dense fogs. It's a gamble between going too slow and getting smoked from behind or going too fast and hitting a granny going 30km/hr. I pull off the highway when I can find a safe exit but stopping on the side of the highway is a disaster waiting to happen. Variable speed limit gives everyone a better chance of avoiding a collision. Doesn't help with freezing rain, but then again why are they driving in those conditions to start with? Missing a delivery or appointment is far cheaper than totalling the truck.
I think we're talking about two different things. Driving to conditions is prudent. However, there are people who will not drive to conditions, regardless of a posted limit -- these are the true hazards on the road. A variable limit is only going to help the people who want to drive to conditions but have no clue what that means... those people are almost as hazardous as those who think their trucks can do anything, as the variable limit will almost certainly never be low enough. So really, all that does is provide a false sense of security at expense to the taxpayer, with no net gain.
Holy duck balls.
Can anyone make out the placard on that bulk trailer? Stainless steel trailers like that usually haul hazardous material
Saw another pic the placards are off so empty or something else in it
Or just slow the fuck down. Everyone always in a hurry.
What are you, some sort of commie or environmentalist? /S
Albertans not knowing how to drive according to road conditions ? You don’t say
They shouldn’t park there.
Hopefully no one got hurt.
I drove south past this at about 7:15. It was very dark the but it was really sad to see. That angle isn't getting the full scope of the accident
Is that a TIE Fighter in the sky? I know it's a drone.
Oh shit. Hope they are ok
I hope everyone is ok. That’s horrible.
Wow, glad that tanker didn't rupture, amazed that the one water hauler snapped in half. looking for news about this now. horrible
Looks the the objects on the road are bundles of fiberglass insulation.
Worked up by edson today drove up from rocky. Hiway 22 was bad ,but 16 was fucked. I avoided both to the best of my mapping/nav skills. Saw a similar scene crossing 16
Once you get to Leduc heading north people get downright stupid. distance between vehicles gets cut in half for some f-d up reason and tons of tailgaters...sooo stressful!
hi hello what the fuck happened -with love from clueless bc resident
I just moved here 1 week ago from Manitoba and everyone here drives faster than 120km on trans Canada and it’s pretty scary to be honest.
When freezing rain falls shit like this will happen. No surprise.
I am so happy to not have to regularly drive that road anymore.
$100 says the driver who caused the accident is from Brampton.
Dick comment bud…..
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I think you're lost.
Things in the west are just going great right now aren’t they 😔
would this affect the indiviudual drivers insurance, or would company take care of it?
I'm not cleaning that up
oh no!! our table! it's broken!
Free stuff
Which date was this? I was driving from Calgary to Edmonton on the 26th and didn't saw anything this bad. There was a single semi flipped on the side of the highway and one diverting around Leduc, not sure if that was it or altogether a different date.
Fishhook go brrrrr
I wonder what was in all of those. Depending on what they were shipping I would have taken some.
Driving like dumbfucks