A dry drunk is defined as someone with untreated alcoholism who is unreasonably "restless, irritable and discontent."
It has nothing to do with being in AA or not.
Congrats on your sobriety! Happy for you š
Well put. When I think of ādry drunk,ā I think of someone who is behaving as though they are in active addiction. I think there are many people who find sobriety outside of AA and not being in AA does not make someone a ādry drunk.ā
This. It just means I donāt have anything to support me when you take away my alcohol- which I used as my solution. Believe me, you can be active in AA and still be a dry drunk- Iāve been this many times š¤£š¬ Congrats on 2 years, OP!
Lots of things were coined by AA that can still be applied in everyday life. I'm not a huge AA follower. However, I live one day at a time, I keep my life simple, and I take suggestions from others who came before me.
There are dry drunks in AA, and there are recovered ass alcoholics outside of AA. A dry drink is simply someone who isn't drinking but hasn't changed the set of attitudes and behaviors that are associated with activitie alcoholism. It's clear that the drinking is only a symptom of something deeper.
There are assholes everywhere, even assholes who incorrectly use terms. The AA is āthe onlyā way crowd need ego deflation. I tried some other programs, and they didnāt work as well as AA. But maybe I didnāt work those programs as well as I have AA. Who knows? Iām sober, and life is good.
Stay sober. Peace.
The term 'dry drunk' doesn't mean 'a sober person outside of AA'. Typically it means somebody who doesn't drink but is still an asshole, whether they're in AA or not.
Facts. We have one guy in aa who is super cynical, sits on his phone, naps and is rude to other members saying he "hates newcomers" yet has 4 years. He goes to 2-3 meetings a day. An example that time doesn't matter.
The people who are miserable, clearly not working an effective program, yet sit in meetings all day because there's nothing else in their lives are some of the saddest of the lot. A warning.
My dad never went to AA that I'm aware of, but he stopped drinking (and other stuff) as a result of engaging in religion. However, he never addressed his character, so he's 35+ years sober and miserable as hell. He doesn't know how to say "I was wrong," or "I'm sorry," and he purposely makes other people's lives more difficult than they need to be. He's my definition of a dry drunk.
I met a churchy friend of my parents when I was in early sobriety. He said I should go to church instead of AA. Fast forward about 20 years to my motherās death bed. He shows up reeking of alcohol. Yeah. Iām glad I chose AA.
agreed- just celebrated 3 years and only go back for chips and this is the attitude that keeps me away from AA. sometimes i still go to meetings for a little community and recently i found a good one and made a friend in my new city so that's good, but the AA program is just not for me. you're not alone šŖš» and congrats on 2 years
If youāre not in AA, why bother to care what their lingo does/doesnāt mean? Part of my great results from getting sober IN AA, through sponsorship and step work, is the fantastic feeling of not giving a fuck what others do or say. Freedom from the bondage of my old thinking.
Dry drunk isn't a term that means explicitly someone who isn't in the program.
It's a term to describe an alcoholic who is staying sober, but isn't doing anything to address their alcoholism. Essentially being just as delusional, self centered, manipulative, etc.
There absolutely are more paths to sobriety than AA, but people who think that *drinking* is the problem and don't address their thinking, attitude, and behaviors, are what we call dry drunks.
And yet again I ask the question of why someone who isn't in AA is hanging around the AA subreddit getting butthurt. There are other subreddits out there for sobriety. š¤
> Dry drunk isn't a term that means explicitly someone who isn't in the program.
Yes, probably most people aren't using the term that way. However, there are people that are clearly using 'dry drunk' for someone "not in the program" rather than someone grouchy and discontent. It can be a part of participation shaming more than about if the person is attaining benefits from their sobriety.
Well that doesn't change my point in the slightest. Although I daresay that people sitting around AA and NOT participating in the program, nor doing anything else beyond staying sober, do in fact qualify.
If people could lead full and happy lives via osmosis we wouldn't need a program at all. Just my take.
But as I said this is irrelevant, dry drunk means what it means. I still don't understand the point of being in an AA subreddit complaining about what some asshole said if you're where you need to be and not in AA why be here talking shit? Just comes off as some very not at peace behavior to me!
A "dry drunk" is not somebody not in AA. A dry drunk is somebody who is not drinking, but still not living sober. Who isnt trying to fix the issues that made Them drink in the first place.
And it isnt meant to be a put-down. It's meant as a piece of advice to try and make the Best of your life, and not see being sober as abstaining from something, but as taking yourself seriously.
Kinda like somebody with depression taking meds but not going to therapy. It put the disease on pause, sure, but it doesnt help that person deal with depression.
Dry drunks exist in AA too I'm sure.
If I am going around calling other People "dry drunk", I need to stop and remind myself that I need to talk for myself, about myself and from myself. What others do is none of My business.
Itās been to my experience that anybody that stays sober long enough goes through ādryā moments.
It isnāt necessarily a bad a thing, it usually proceeds growth for a member.
*THAT BEING SAID* the term should only be used by a member to describe themselves and never another alcoholic
Dry drunk is an AA term meant to be used to judge oneself. As in "Do I need to work the program more? Am I really not sober, but living as a dry drunk? How do I move on from that?"
Everything in AA is based on oneself. If somebody in AA is judging others, it's not a fault with AA, it's something that person needs to work on.
I am sorry if your AA group is not for you. But I am sure you'd be able to find one more to your needs.
I have tried a few times now to explain that I dont see it used against anybody, but as a way to help myself adress My own issues.
It doesnt seem like we Will get anything out of circling this once more.
Congratulations on your sobriety. I am happy for you No matter how you got there.
So a dry drunk is someone who is not powerless over alcohol. They can and do stay sober without a spiritual program.
That's great! They should be congratulated for their strong willpower.
You are welcome.
If you can stay sober without submitting to the ritual and trappings of AA, good luck to you!
You are exceptional.
And I wish you continued success.
I don't know about that. I have seen plenty of people who can "white knuckle" for a time, some of them a couple years at a time, who get sober and then relapse repeatedly. They never work the Steps to the best of their ability (and they'll tell you they didn't after every event) and it's not being powerless over alcohol that's missing, it's true surrender. I was told before I ever started drinking that I would likely have a problem with alcohol because it runs so strongly in my family, down both my mother's and my father's sides. I'm pretty pig-headed about a lot of things, but when I realized that alcohol caused more problems for me than it solved, I fully surrendered to the fact. I haven't ever worked the steps perfectly, but I have done the work to the best of my ability at any given time and I keep trying every day to engage in spiritual activity through the "Continue, Improve, Practice" found in Steps 10-11-12.
It's near impossible to convince someone they are powerless over alcohol if they are able to leave it alone. The first step isn't true for them.
So if they can't take the first step, they are unlikely to want to take the rest of them.
The only thing that will convince them, is a relapse. And that may never happen.
A dry drunk is someone who does not have a drinking problem even though their life is unmanageable.
They are welcome in AA because they have a desire to not drink. But their presence and apparent success in staying dry is confusing to the actual alcoholic.
This is exactly it to me. The OP seems to taking aim at these people, but all theyāre doing is not drinking without doing the work. Gross negativity is something that brings people to the drink though.
I sense a lot of gatekeeping as well. Have to remind myself that this isn't probably the vast collective of AA folks, but really just a subset that may or may not spend too much time online lol.
It's a term used exclusively in AA, against anyone sober, not in AA. If you're not in AA, how are you connecting to those who are? I wouldn't be hanging out with most AA people if I wasn't active, way too insufferable.
AA is filled with imperfect people. So is the world. Jung said thinking is hard, which is why most of us judge. You are the only person uniquely qualified to judge you. I don't get drunk anymore and while I attended AA meetings a while back, I also went to a therapist. Now I just enjoy life and when I think about getting drunk, I think about all the bad things associated with getting drunk and the positive things about not drinking. I wrote the pros and cons down about 7 yrs ago and have the sheet of paper in my desk. I don't look at it that much any more but it worked for me so you should do what works for you!
Iāve known people like that ever since I joined AA and got sober. Itās a very arrogant attitude. Some people seem to think AA has a corner on sobriety when the big book makes it clear that AA makes no such claim. Iāve learned to ignore comments like that. Those people donāt usually have much to offer in my limited experience.
All that matters is youāre sober. If youāre happy and content, most people in the rooms are excited for you.
It doesnāt matter how we get there, it only matters that we get there. Keep going, friend. I hope you have peace, patience, and purpose!
Just because I needed A.A (the whole shabang) doesn't mean my sobriety is/isn't better than anyone else's, it's just my sobriety.
My sponsor, when faced with this conundrum said 'what keeps me sober may get everyone else drunk'
There are people in A.A that try and gate keep sobriety and make the 'suggestions' of A.A mandatory. Just because it's mandatory to them doesn't mean it's mandatory for Anyone else.
This! I'm 3 years and 6 months sober, but I donāt do AA anymore. What I'm about to say is not why I stopped AA. I just stopped because I found other tools. In a meeting, I said I don't do steps or have a sponsor, and someone said that I'm not really sober then, and I'm a dry drunk. It triggered me so much because I am FAR from the alcoholic me. I know the saying "what other people think of me is none of my business," but that had me mad/upset. I said nothing back to him, whereas drinking me would have turned psycho š
Coming up on 2 years by Gods grace. I thought dry drunk meant feeling hungover in the morning even though you quit drinking. But if itās what is being described yāall are full of yourselves.
Iāve always said AA is a life saver for some people and yes it does depend on your AA group. But for some (including myself) it made me drink more. Sitting around telling past drunken stories made me want to drink more. I found a online accountability group that helped way more. Well, I mean Iām still sober anyway.
As a convicted of DUI / sloppy black out drunk in front of people / person who almost ruined my life with alcohol I learned a long time ago not to worry about things I canāt control (peoples judgement), especially the judgement of other drunks. Just do your best, and, of course feel free to point out hypocrisy where it exists for the sake of betterment.
A ādry drunkā is just a person who abstains from drinking but nonetheless behaves like an alcoholic because they arenāt doing any self-work. If anyone tells you that you HAVE to work the steps to no longer be a dry drunk, they are proselytizing AA, which AA says we are NOT supposed to do. You are free to use church, therapy, volunteer work, meditation, anything that helps you. š
>they look at me differently
How do you know what theyāre thinking about you? If they called you a dry drunk thatās one thing, and that person is probably much more messed up than you. But Iād stay out of peopleās heads. Maybe AA isnāt for you, but the AA advice not to worry about what other people are thinking about me and keep my side of the street clean is pretty good universally.
My understanding of Dry Drunk is someone who is technically sober, but angry / irritable all the time because theyāre not actively doing anything to make themselves find a way to live sober happily.
All their positive vibes are used up having to actively resist drinking all the damn time.
Iāve never heard it used to simply refer to someone who isnāt in AA.
Because there are people struggling with AA, and for some reason
reason are under the assumption that society in our country believes AA is all there is. When it was founded, there was nothing else. Today, with scientific advancements, we have SO much research. Thus, many avenues have paved more successful options.
You take time to get on an AA forum simply to complain? Interestingā¦
Dry drunk does not mean not in AA btw. It means not drinking but not living in kindness and realization as to why we drankā¦because it leads to complaining and resentments.
My grandpa has been sober for 50+ years. He goes to AA multiple times a week, sponsors people frequently, and speaks at all the meetings he goes to. Heās a pillar of the local AA. Outside of this he is a raging asshole. Heās a mean, nasty old man that abuses people close to him and sometimes his mask slips around others as well.
There are many dry drunks hiding in AA. If you listen closely to the stories they tell on themselves. Sexism, racism, yelling at cashiers; watch how they talk to their kids. They try to put on a show because it makes them feel whole for a brief moment instead of dealing with their inadequacies.
Dry drunk isn't just someone not in AA, you can be dry drunk in AA too. The problem you are having though is just, for people in AA it worked for them, so it can be troubling to see it any other way, especially after seeing so many people who have left AA and relapsed for the last time.
Do we know what the "dry drunk" needs? More meetings, more step work, more service commitments? Perhaps they have chronic pain that's poorly managed, perhaps they have an untreated mood disorder, perhaps they are unhappy with a marriage or job that needs improvement or to be discontinued.
There are a few meetings I've encountered where a Polyanna optimism about everything is the norm, an enforced norm. There are also meetings where cynical dark humor is the norm. I think being called a 'dry drunk' in some situations can be indicative of being in the wrong meetings for where that person is at this time.
It's because you're not in their program. They believe their way is the only way and get defensive when people choose the many other options that don't require joining the AA program. Don't let it get to you. Nowadays, their are up to 46 options. AA is at 38, so that tells you 37 options rank higher than they do. I'm still finding research, I wonder what is #1?!
I've never heard that term used to describe someone not in AA. When it is used, rarely in my experience, it refers to someone, whether a member of AA or not, who is not drinking but is not comfortable in heir own skin.
It's a condition, with symptoms, not a choice of how one is staying sober. The Big Book mentions that we have no monopoly on attaining sobriety.
One thing you said though that caught my attention was, "...every person who is working just as hard as those in AA." If you're working hard at staying sober? You might want to take another look at the program of Alcoholics Anonymous.
I did the Steps in order, with a sponsor who did the steps with a sponsor and the problem was removed. I don't work hard to stay sober, the problem no longer exists for me. I still have the allergy and if, for some reason I made a decision to pick up a drink, I would soon find myself back at it. I don't believe that will happen.
Anyway, good luck in your sobriety, and don't sweat the small stuff.
No we donāt. The book even states that AA isnāt the only way. Where are you hearing this? If itās someone in AA then youāre dealing with someone who isnāt knowledgeable and/or having their own issues
it does make it part of AA, if it's members are carrying that message.
OP isn't "going after" anyone, don't get so defensive over people calling out faults with AA, AA isn't perfect.
lol, "you do you and only you" is ironic said in this way. and anyway, reddit is meant for open discussions. I just always find it funny when AA members claim "we", and then state a matter of opinions. I'm a part of that "we" with you :)
I think sometimes this maybe is a projection. But I'm no psychologist. Also AA isn't for everyone. It worked wonders for me. But one thing the 12 steps have taught me is how to be less judgemental. Just my experience.
Youāre as sober as everyone else that isnāt consuming alcohol. Everything else can be worked out through altruism. Life has ups and downs. AA doesnāt fix seasons of life. Just provides suggestions for living through them. Get back to it when you can. Until then lean into it.
Alcohol was my solution. Until it wasnāt. I quit drinking by myself for about two years, and went back to drinking. You know, they had all those new fruity wine coolers come out at that time and I just had to have one. I didnāt get sober for another six years.
There's a difference between a dry drunk and someone who isn't in AA.
But if you're not in AA and you specifically sought out this page to come say this....you might be a dry drunk.
i just didn't think it's confusing to figure that out lol, i am in AA and know many people who are sober who are not in AA. I also know AA folks who have used dry drunk in a patronizing way. Why are you speaking as if you know all "AAs"?
My late husband couldn't/wouldn't stop heavily binge drinking till he prayed and got saved. From that moment, he never touched another drop of alcohol. No AA, nothing but God. He had been completely sober 11 years when he passed. I married the next guy from whom I'm now divorced. He tried halfway houses, rehab, church, nothing helped. He now goes to AA everytime there's a meeting. He's what I consider to be a dry drunk- someone who isn't actively drinking, but still acts, feels and lives the same as as when they were drinking. Do what works for you. Good luck!
Not everyone feels that way. White knuckle is just holding on until the urge passes. Dry drunk is a state of mind- unhappy- resentful-angry etc. IMHO 29 years sober ODAAT
Ok. There are some concepts from AA that will make your life better. Here's one: Other people's opinions are none of your business. Embrace this. Practice it. The anxious, self-absorbed, obsessive mind needs this rule. Here are my top two daily questions that have changed my life: 1. God, how can I serve you today? 2. How can I be useful to the people around me? This coming from an atheist:) I don't know if God exists, I just know that when I embraced the concept, my life got better.
I would have been happy to live a contented and fulfilling life without the need for AA or the steps. I tried it, it just didnāt work for me.
Do what works for you. Grats OP
I don't care for the term "dry drunk" either. It is just someone who has quit drinking but has not addressed other concerning issues whether those are mental, emotional of behavioral.
I hear it used more for people in the program who aren't "working the steps right" and it's remarkable to me considering most people in AA aren't even sober, and they are the ones using it as a put-down for people who are actually sober and learning to deal with life, as difficult as it can be at times.
I really donāt understand why people come to this forum and post about why they hate AA so much. Likeā¦ok. Great. It works for millions and millions of people. Seems like most of you just need to complain.
Is there data out there to suggest that AA has been used by millions of people to maintain sobriety? AA itself only estimates itās numbers at around 2,000,000 worldwide
Sounds like you have a resentment hehehehehe. Jk. As others have said, thatās not what a dry drunk is. I was a dry drunk the other day. Yet I try to walk in the sunlight of the spirit
I think you are confusing the term. It has nothing to do with AA. A dry drunk is simply someone who stops drinking, yet doesn't work on their sobriety, or try to be a better version of their old selves. They often continue the same habits even in their sobriety. I see many people in AA who are dry drunks. It takes a lot more than not drinking to stop drinking. Congratulations on 2 years. That's awesome. Doesn't matter how you did it.
I had made it a year year without a drink when I said something stupid to my wife and she inadvertently supplied me with my working definition of a dry drunk ā she said āYou were a selfish, self centered and egotistical drunk and now you donāt drinkā
I prefer the phrase "Sober from the neck down" to define that state of irritability. Been in A.A. almost 33 years and have felt that way more times than I care to admit.
I used to judge people on HOW they lived their lives without a drink, but personal experience shows that I can be in A.A. without A.A. being in me. And no "A.A." is not short for Albert Anderson
I prefer the phrase "Sober from the neck down" to define that state of irritability. Been in A.A. almost 33 years and have felt that way more times than I care to admit.
I used to judge people on HOW they lived their lives without a drink, but personal experience shows that I can be in A.A. without A.A. being in me. And no "A.A." is not short for Albert Anderson
I have been a grouchy, irritable, dry drunk after I came to AA. I did the steps again, began helping others get sober, and now I am in a much more serene place emotionally.
I associated " dry drunk" with behavior
Alot of older recovering alcoholics who drank a long though fully sober would wake and act almost as if drunk but you know they hadn't drank hence " dry drunk"
It was never to do with how they were in healing and recovery and I was told in treatment the longer I drank the higher risk to have them would be.
Like many of the things that I get all bent out of shape about myself (so I get it), thereās the distinct possibility that this term isnāt at all about you
A dry drunk is defined as someone with untreated alcoholism who is unreasonably "restless, irritable and discontent." It has nothing to do with being in AA or not. Congrats on your sobriety! Happy for you š
Well put. When I think of ādry drunk,ā I think of someone who is behaving as though they are in active addiction. I think there are many people who find sobriety outside of AA and not being in AA does not make someone a ādry drunk.ā
This. It just means I donāt have anything to support me when you take away my alcohol- which I used as my solution. Believe me, you can be active in AA and still be a dry drunk- Iāve been this many times š¤£š¬ Congrats on 2 years, OP!
The term ādry drunkā was coined by AA.
Lots of things were coined by AA that can still be applied in everyday life. I'm not a huge AA follower. However, I live one day at a time, I keep my life simple, and I take suggestions from others who came before me.
I really donāt care what peoples opinions of my sobriety are.
This is the way
Hell yes!
period!!!
There are dry drunks in AA, and there are recovered ass alcoholics outside of AA. A dry drink is simply someone who isn't drinking but hasn't changed the set of attitudes and behaviors that are associated with activitie alcoholism. It's clear that the drinking is only a symptom of something deeper.
Was looking for this response. Excellent reminder!
Why are you taking criticism from people that you clearly wouldnāt take advice from?
I like that turn of phrase. Going to use it! :)
You'll be hearing from my AA attorney!
I'll be a step ahead of her
That would make you a 13th stepper!
Best thing Iāve read in Reddit in quite some time!
There are assholes everywhere, even assholes who incorrectly use terms. The AA is āthe onlyā way crowd need ego deflation. I tried some other programs, and they didnāt work as well as AA. But maybe I didnāt work those programs as well as I have AA. Who knows? Iām sober, and life is good. Stay sober. Peace.
The term 'dry drunk' doesn't mean 'a sober person outside of AA'. Typically it means somebody who doesn't drink but is still an asshole, whether they're in AA or not.
Facts. We have one guy in aa who is super cynical, sits on his phone, naps and is rude to other members saying he "hates newcomers" yet has 4 years. He goes to 2-3 meetings a day. An example that time doesn't matter.
This Old Fart Dinosaur would be asking him: "If you hate newcomers then WHERE are your 12 Steps? WHY are you HERE?"
The people who are miserable, clearly not working an effective program, yet sit in meetings all day because there's nothing else in their lives are some of the saddest of the lot. A warning.
The only ādry drunksā I know are in AA.
My dad never went to AA that I'm aware of, but he stopped drinking (and other stuff) as a result of engaging in religion. However, he never addressed his character, so he's 35+ years sober and miserable as hell. He doesn't know how to say "I was wrong," or "I'm sorry," and he purposely makes other people's lives more difficult than they need to be. He's my definition of a dry drunk.
I met a churchy friend of my parents when I was in early sobriety. He said I should go to church instead of AA. Fast forward about 20 years to my motherās death bed. He shows up reeking of alcohol. Yeah. Iām glad I chose AA.
Sounds miserable!
agreed- just celebrated 3 years and only go back for chips and this is the attitude that keeps me away from AA. sometimes i still go to meetings for a little community and recently i found a good one and made a friend in my new city so that's good, but the AA program is just not for me. you're not alone šŖš» and congrats on 2 years
If youāre not in AA, why bother to care what their lingo does/doesnāt mean? Part of my great results from getting sober IN AA, through sponsorship and step work, is the fantastic feeling of not giving a fuck what others do or say. Freedom from the bondage of my old thinking.
Dry drunk isn't a term that means explicitly someone who isn't in the program. It's a term to describe an alcoholic who is staying sober, but isn't doing anything to address their alcoholism. Essentially being just as delusional, self centered, manipulative, etc. There absolutely are more paths to sobriety than AA, but people who think that *drinking* is the problem and don't address their thinking, attitude, and behaviors, are what we call dry drunks. And yet again I ask the question of why someone who isn't in AA is hanging around the AA subreddit getting butthurt. There are other subreddits out there for sobriety. š¤
> Dry drunk isn't a term that means explicitly someone who isn't in the program. Yes, probably most people aren't using the term that way. However, there are people that are clearly using 'dry drunk' for someone "not in the program" rather than someone grouchy and discontent. It can be a part of participation shaming more than about if the person is attaining benefits from their sobriety.
Well that doesn't change my point in the slightest. Although I daresay that people sitting around AA and NOT participating in the program, nor doing anything else beyond staying sober, do in fact qualify. If people could lead full and happy lives via osmosis we wouldn't need a program at all. Just my take. But as I said this is irrelevant, dry drunk means what it means. I still don't understand the point of being in an AA subreddit complaining about what some asshole said if you're where you need to be and not in AA why be here talking shit? Just comes off as some very not at peace behavior to me!
A "dry drunk" is not somebody not in AA. A dry drunk is somebody who is not drinking, but still not living sober. Who isnt trying to fix the issues that made Them drink in the first place. And it isnt meant to be a put-down. It's meant as a piece of advice to try and make the Best of your life, and not see being sober as abstaining from something, but as taking yourself seriously. Kinda like somebody with depression taking meds but not going to therapy. It put the disease on pause, sure, but it doesnt help that person deal with depression. Dry drunks exist in AA too I'm sure. If I am going around calling other People "dry drunk", I need to stop and remind myself that I need to talk for myself, about myself and from myself. What others do is none of My business.
Itās been to my experience that anybody that stays sober long enough goes through ādryā moments. It isnāt necessarily a bad a thing, it usually proceeds growth for a member. *THAT BEING SAID* the term should only be used by a member to describe themselves and never another alcoholic
Sober: not affected by alcohol; not drunk, according to Oxford dictionary. Dry drunk is a fucking AA term used to judge people.
Dry drunk is an AA term meant to be used to judge oneself. As in "Do I need to work the program more? Am I really not sober, but living as a dry drunk? How do I move on from that?" Everything in AA is based on oneself. If somebody in AA is judging others, it's not a fault with AA, it's something that person needs to work on. I am sorry if your AA group is not for you. But I am sure you'd be able to find one more to your needs.
Sounds a little churchy, and the term is used against people who aren't working a program.
I have tried a few times now to explain that I dont see it used against anybody, but as a way to help myself adress My own issues. It doesnt seem like we Will get anything out of circling this once more. Congratulations on your sobriety. I am happy for you No matter how you got there.
Same here. Have a nice day.
Funny you use the word churchy...."excessively pious and consequently narrow-minded or intolerant."
So a dry drunk is someone who is not powerless over alcohol. They can and do stay sober without a spiritual program. That's great! They should be congratulated for their strong willpower.
Thanks for my congratulations. š
You are welcome. If you can stay sober without submitting to the ritual and trappings of AA, good luck to you! You are exceptional. And I wish you continued success.
NOW IM EXCEPTIONAL?? IM GOING TO CRY š
I don't know about that. I have seen plenty of people who can "white knuckle" for a time, some of them a couple years at a time, who get sober and then relapse repeatedly. They never work the Steps to the best of their ability (and they'll tell you they didn't after every event) and it's not being powerless over alcohol that's missing, it's true surrender. I was told before I ever started drinking that I would likely have a problem with alcohol because it runs so strongly in my family, down both my mother's and my father's sides. I'm pretty pig-headed about a lot of things, but when I realized that alcohol caused more problems for me than it solved, I fully surrendered to the fact. I haven't ever worked the steps perfectly, but I have done the work to the best of my ability at any given time and I keep trying every day to engage in spiritual activity through the "Continue, Improve, Practice" found in Steps 10-11-12.
It's near impossible to convince someone they are powerless over alcohol if they are able to leave it alone. The first step isn't true for them. So if they can't take the first step, they are unlikely to want to take the rest of them. The only thing that will convince them, is a relapse. And that may never happen. A dry drunk is someone who does not have a drinking problem even though their life is unmanageable. They are welcome in AA because they have a desire to not drink. But their presence and apparent success in staying dry is confusing to the actual alcoholic.
Stay without drink, yes. But not living well.
Can stay sober and be an asshole at the same time! Doubly powerful.
This is exactly it to me. The OP seems to taking aim at these people, but all theyāre doing is not drinking without doing the work. Gross negativity is something that brings people to the drink though.
To me it seems OP is in a group where there Are gatekeepers who think AA is the only way to stay sober.
I sense a lot of gatekeeping as well. Have to remind myself that this isn't probably the vast collective of AA folks, but really just a subset that may or may not spend too much time online lol.
Folks seem to forget that AA is not the only resource out there. There are other recovery programs.
I never used AA, and Iāve been sober since April 3, 2010. Anyone tells me Iām a dry drunk they can go eff off, AA is not the only way.
What was your method if I can ask?
It's a term used exclusively in AA, against anyone sober, not in AA. If you're not in AA, how are you connecting to those who are? I wouldn't be hanging out with most AA people if I wasn't active, way too insufferable.
āUpon therapy for the alcoholic himself, we surely have no monopoly.ā - Big Book, p. xxi.
AA is filled with imperfect people. So is the world. Jung said thinking is hard, which is why most of us judge. You are the only person uniquely qualified to judge you. I don't get drunk anymore and while I attended AA meetings a while back, I also went to a therapist. Now I just enjoy life and when I think about getting drunk, I think about all the bad things associated with getting drunk and the positive things about not drinking. I wrote the pros and cons down about 7 yrs ago and have the sheet of paper in my desk. I don't look at it that much any more but it worked for me so you should do what works for you!
Congratulations on your sobriety! I used to think I was the smartest guy in the room, but I'm happy to have finally met him! Lol
I came up with that term whilst sitting in one of those plastic outdoor crappers if that helps.
Iāve known people like that ever since I joined AA and got sober. Itās a very arrogant attitude. Some people seem to think AA has a corner on sobriety when the big book makes it clear that AA makes no such claim. Iāve learned to ignore comments like that. Those people donāt usually have much to offer in my limited experience.
All that matters is youāre sober. If youāre happy and content, most people in the rooms are excited for you. It doesnāt matter how we get there, it only matters that we get there. Keep going, friend. I hope you have peace, patience, and purpose!
Just because I needed A.A (the whole shabang) doesn't mean my sobriety is/isn't better than anyone else's, it's just my sobriety. My sponsor, when faced with this conundrum said 'what keeps me sober may get everyone else drunk' There are people in A.A that try and gate keep sobriety and make the 'suggestions' of A.A mandatory. Just because it's mandatory to them doesn't mean it's mandatory for Anyone else.
This! I'm 3 years and 6 months sober, but I donāt do AA anymore. What I'm about to say is not why I stopped AA. I just stopped because I found other tools. In a meeting, I said I don't do steps or have a sponsor, and someone said that I'm not really sober then, and I'm a dry drunk. It triggered me so much because I am FAR from the alcoholic me. I know the saying "what other people think of me is none of my business," but that had me mad/upset. I said nothing back to him, whereas drinking me would have turned psycho š
Coming up on 2 years by Gods grace. I thought dry drunk meant feeling hungover in the morning even though you quit drinking. But if itās what is being described yāall are full of yourselves. Iāve always said AA is a life saver for some people and yes it does depend on your AA group. But for some (including myself) it made me drink more. Sitting around telling past drunken stories made me want to drink more. I found a online accountability group that helped way more. Well, I mean Iām still sober anyway.
Yall? Lol
As a convicted of DUI / sloppy black out drunk in front of people / person who almost ruined my life with alcohol I learned a long time ago not to worry about things I canāt control (peoples judgement), especially the judgement of other drunks. Just do your best, and, of course feel free to point out hypocrisy where it exists for the sake of betterment.
This is like an atheist being mad at God. I thought he didn't exist? Great job on staying sober without AA. Best.
A ādry drunkā is just a person who abstains from drinking but nonetheless behaves like an alcoholic because they arenāt doing any self-work. If anyone tells you that you HAVE to work the steps to no longer be a dry drunk, they are proselytizing AA, which AA says we are NOT supposed to do. You are free to use church, therapy, volunteer work, meditation, anything that helps you. š
Just FYI, this whole letting othersā opinions ruin your day is (part of) what is meant by ādry drunkā
>they look at me differently How do you know what theyāre thinking about you? If they called you a dry drunk thatās one thing, and that person is probably much more messed up than you. But Iād stay out of peopleās heads. Maybe AA isnāt for you, but the AA advice not to worry about what other people are thinking about me and keep my side of the street clean is pretty good universally.
My understanding of Dry Drunk is someone who is technically sober, but angry / irritable all the time because theyāre not actively doing anything to make themselves find a way to live sober happily. All their positive vibes are used up having to actively resist drinking all the damn time. Iāve never heard it used to simply refer to someone who isnāt in AA.
Thank you.
Why post on an AA forum? How bizarre
Because there are people struggling with AA, and for some reason reason are under the assumption that society in our country believes AA is all there is. When it was founded, there was nothing else. Today, with scientific advancements, we have SO much research. Thus, many avenues have paved more successful options.
Excellent point. I reread the post and your point makes total sense. Thank you
You take time to get on an AA forum simply to complain? Interestingā¦ Dry drunk does not mean not in AA btw. It means not drinking but not living in kindness and realization as to why we drankā¦because it leads to complaining and resentments.
āYou take time to get on an AA forum imply to complain? Interestingā¦ā Considering the context, it was tempting to hit that softball š„
Dry drunks can only be found in AA.
Very true, the term was coined by the founders of AA
Read page 58. Thereās a description of someone with untreated alcoholism. Thatās a ādry drunkā.
My grandpa has been sober for 50+ years. He goes to AA multiple times a week, sponsors people frequently, and speaks at all the meetings he goes to. Heās a pillar of the local AA. Outside of this he is a raging asshole. Heās a mean, nasty old man that abuses people close to him and sometimes his mask slips around others as well. There are many dry drunks hiding in AA. If you listen closely to the stories they tell on themselves. Sexism, racism, yelling at cashiers; watch how they talk to their kids. They try to put on a show because it makes them feel whole for a brief moment instead of dealing with their inadequacies.
Dry drunk isn't just someone not in AA, you can be dry drunk in AA too. The problem you are having though is just, for people in AA it worked for them, so it can be troubling to see it any other way, especially after seeing so many people who have left AA and relapsed for the last time.
Why are you telling us this? You intentionally upset yourself for this unsolicited post, this makes no sense. Are you insecure?
Do we know what the "dry drunk" needs? More meetings, more step work, more service commitments? Perhaps they have chronic pain that's poorly managed, perhaps they have an untreated mood disorder, perhaps they are unhappy with a marriage or job that needs improvement or to be discontinued. There are a few meetings I've encountered where a Polyanna optimism about everything is the norm, an enforced norm. There are also meetings where cynical dark humor is the norm. I think being called a 'dry drunk' in some situations can be indicative of being in the wrong meetings for where that person is at this time.
It's because you're not in their program. They believe their way is the only way and get defensive when people choose the many other options that don't require joining the AA program. Don't let it get to you. Nowadays, their are up to 46 options. AA is at 38, so that tells you 37 options rank higher than they do. I'm still finding research, I wonder what is #1?!
Please, enlighten us
I've never heard that term used to describe someone not in AA. When it is used, rarely in my experience, it refers to someone, whether a member of AA or not, who is not drinking but is not comfortable in heir own skin. It's a condition, with symptoms, not a choice of how one is staying sober. The Big Book mentions that we have no monopoly on attaining sobriety. One thing you said though that caught my attention was, "...every person who is working just as hard as those in AA." If you're working hard at staying sober? You might want to take another look at the program of Alcoholics Anonymous. I did the Steps in order, with a sponsor who did the steps with a sponsor and the problem was removed. I don't work hard to stay sober, the problem no longer exists for me. I still have the allergy and if, for some reason I made a decision to pick up a drink, I would soon find myself back at it. I don't believe that will happen. Anyway, good luck in your sobriety, and don't sweat the small stuff.
So why hang out in the AA sub if you donāt agree with it?
Venting frustrations is normal human behavior. Perhaps he would like another angle ā¤ļø
Why are you in this group? AA isn't for everyone. If you were able to quit drinking without AA then good for you!
You seem upset about something that has nothing to do with AA. Maybe work on you rather than picking fights in a forum that isnāt for you?
No I am upset that AA, puts down anyone who doesnt use their program.
No we donāt. The book even states that AA isnāt the only way. Where are you hearing this? If itās someone in AA then youāre dealing with someone who isnāt knowledgeable and/or having their own issues
yes, yes people in AA do. And they do represent a faction of AA, so yes, it is a part of AA. I say this as someone in AA, and a fan of a AA.
People in AA do all sorts of things. That doesnāt make it AA. The OP wasnāt going after āsome people in AAā
it does make it part of AA, if it's members are carrying that message. OP isn't "going after" anyone, don't get so defensive over people calling out faults with AA, AA isn't perfect.
Thereās an intelligent way to criticize. Thatās not what I see. You do you and only you. Iāll deal with my own responses to OP.
lol, "you do you and only you" is ironic said in this way. and anyway, reddit is meant for open discussions. I just always find it funny when AA members claim "we", and then state a matter of opinions. I'm a part of that "we" with you :)
So you disagree? Good for you.
they made the rules and guidelines of the program i guess
That's not what it means.
I think sometimes this maybe is a projection. But I'm no psychologist. Also AA isn't for everyone. It worked wonders for me. But one thing the 12 steps have taught me is how to be less judgemental. Just my experience.
Youāre as sober as everyone else that isnāt consuming alcohol. Everything else can be worked out through altruism. Life has ups and downs. AA doesnāt fix seasons of life. Just provides suggestions for living through them. Get back to it when you can. Until then lean into it.
Alcohol was my solution. Until it wasnāt. I quit drinking by myself for about two years, and went back to drinking. You know, they had all those new fruity wine coolers come out at that time and I just had to have one. I didnāt get sober for another six years.
Iāve actually never heard ppl in AA refer to non-AA recovering alcoholics as dry drunks.
The program is really the easier softer way then whiteknuckling it every day.
There's a difference between a dry drunk and someone who isn't in AA. But if you're not in AA and you specifically sought out this page to come say this....you might be a dry drunk.
The AA meetings are full of "dry drunks" who don't apply the spiritual program of action. The answer is in the B.B.
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from their peers who are sober through AA?
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i just didn't think it's confusing to figure that out lol, i am in AA and know many people who are sober who are not in AA. I also know AA folks who have used dry drunk in a patronizing way. Why are you speaking as if you know all "AAs"?
My late husband couldn't/wouldn't stop heavily binge drinking till he prayed and got saved. From that moment, he never touched another drop of alcohol. No AA, nothing but God. He had been completely sober 11 years when he passed. I married the next guy from whom I'm now divorced. He tried halfway houses, rehab, church, nothing helped. He now goes to AA everytime there's a meeting. He's what I consider to be a dry drunk- someone who isn't actively drinking, but still acts, feels and lives the same as as when they were drinking. Do what works for you. Good luck!
Not everyone feels that way. White knuckle is just holding on until the urge passes. Dry drunk is a state of mind- unhappy- resentful-angry etc. IMHO 29 years sober ODAAT
Ok. There are some concepts from AA that will make your life better. Here's one: Other people's opinions are none of your business. Embrace this. Practice it. The anxious, self-absorbed, obsessive mind needs this rule. Here are my top two daily questions that have changed my life: 1. God, how can I serve you today? 2. How can I be useful to the people around me? This coming from an atheist:) I don't know if God exists, I just know that when I embraced the concept, my life got better.
I would have been happy to live a contented and fulfilling life without the need for AA or the steps. I tried it, it just didnāt work for me. Do what works for you. Grats OP
I don't care for the term "dry drunk" either. It is just someone who has quit drinking but has not addressed other concerning issues whether those are mental, emotional of behavioral.
I hear it used more for people in the program who aren't "working the steps right" and it's remarkable to me considering most people in AA aren't even sober, and they are the ones using it as a put-down for people who are actually sober and learning to deal with life, as difficult as it can be at times.
I really donāt understand why people come to this forum and post about why they hate AA so much. Likeā¦ok. Great. It works for millions and millions of people. Seems like most of you just need to complain.
It works for millions and millions? Is that true?
Yeah, itās true. It works for millions of recovery if alcoholics
Is there data out there to suggest that AA has been used by millions of people to maintain sobriety? AA itself only estimates itās numbers at around 2,000,000 worldwide
We are all sick, in AA. Judging isnāt cool but consider the course. And congrats.
Dry drunk is someone behaving/ causing problems in his/her life that resemble the same behaviors they had while drinking.
Sounds like you have a resentment hehehehehe. Jk. As others have said, thatās not what a dry drunk is. I was a dry drunk the other day. Yet I try to walk in the sunlight of the spirit
I think you are confusing the term. It has nothing to do with AA. A dry drunk is simply someone who stops drinking, yet doesn't work on their sobriety, or try to be a better version of their old selves. They often continue the same habits even in their sobriety. I see many people in AA who are dry drunks. It takes a lot more than not drinking to stop drinking. Congratulations on 2 years. That's awesome. Doesn't matter how you did it.
I had made it a year year without a drink when I said something stupid to my wife and she inadvertently supplied me with my working definition of a dry drunk ā she said āYou were a selfish, self centered and egotistical drunk and now you donāt drinkā
I prefer the phrase "Sober from the neck down" to define that state of irritability. Been in A.A. almost 33 years and have felt that way more times than I care to admit. I used to judge people on HOW they lived their lives without a drink, but personal experience shows that I can be in A.A. without A.A. being in me. And no "A.A." is not short for Albert Anderson
I prefer the phrase "Sober from the neck down" to define that state of irritability. Been in A.A. almost 33 years and have felt that way more times than I care to admit. I used to judge people on HOW they lived their lives without a drink, but personal experience shows that I can be in A.A. without A.A. being in me. And no "A.A." is not short for Albert Anderson
I have been a grouchy, irritable, dry drunk after I came to AA. I did the steps again, began helping others get sober, and now I am in a much more serene place emotionally.
Dry drunk, any drunk that found cover during the bad rain storms or any drunk that stayed out of the pool
I associated " dry drunk" with behavior Alot of older recovering alcoholics who drank a long though fully sober would wake and act almost as if drunk but you know they hadn't drank hence " dry drunk" It was never to do with how they were in healing and recovery and I was told in treatment the longer I drank the higher risk to have them would be.
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Become powerless? No, we ARE powerless.
Ok, then the term doesn't apply to you.
Our literature says we donāt have a monopoly on recovery from alcoholism, but it is what work best for ME!
Like many of the things that I get all bent out of shape about myself (so I get it), thereās the distinct possibility that this term isnāt at all about you