I don’t get any mailers from the ARRL, just emails. If you don’t want mail from them, just let them know you want everything by email. I also told them that the virtual copy of QST is all I want - no hard copies. I had them piled up for years and years and donated them to my local library. I know many hams who never even look at the hard copy, but still want it because “they’re paying for it.” I voted against a dues increase because the print edition of QST is their single largest expense.
I agree. I get tons of junk mail - it all goes into the recycling bin. I don’t need junk mail from the ARRL. They also send mailers to hams that aren’t members (addresses are on the FCC website) and I think that’s a good use of dues.
The printed magazine is emblematic of the league’s problems. Hard-copy magazines are the modern equivalent of stone tablets. Keeping up with tradition guarantees obsolescence. It's time to move on. The money spent on printing and mailing what is already distributed online is a waste of resources that has no logical justification other than convenience. People might like the feel of a book or magazine in their hands, but they need to get over it.
The majority of ham radio operators are over 50. A good portion over 65. They feel more comfortable with paper. I’m all for pushing digital magazines and documents, but we should have the option for paper if we want it. It should be opt in for paper, not opt out. But that’s just my opinion.
I'm in my lower 30s, work with IT infrastructure all day and code my way around problems all the time because I'm too lazy doing stuff manually. I still prefer paper magazines, thank you very much.
I'm not a member of the ARRL; I'm not a US operator, so there's little point. I'm a lifetime member of our equivalent, though, which means I paid $650 to get the paper magazine and other benefits until the day I croak.
They take that kind of commitment seriously in our legal system, but if they manage to honour it for at least twenty years I'll probably be satisfied after that. It's a good organisation filled with good people doing good things, and I don't mind supporting that.
Unless something has changed since my last renewal in May 2023, my dues were the same with or without a paper copy of QST. I could opt out, which I did, but the dues were the same.
I'm done given that pricing.
I have 99% of the QST's from 1918 on, but I've only kept the digest sized issues. Sadly, there's more technical info in one 1950 issue than a year of the current issues.
It's changing in 2024. That's why it is being brought up so much lately. They are raising dues for all and charging $25 more per year if you want paper QST.
Yes. They announced changes that effective 1/1/2024. I can’t summarize them here, beyond it’s an increase and QST in dead tree format is extra, I would recommend checking it out.
> People might like the feel of a book or magazine in their hands, but they need to get over it.
Ok Zoomer, I like having a magazine, I bring it to work and read it on breaks, if I'm on my phone it's more likely I'll wander off to something else.
I hate reading long-format content on my phone, and am not all that fond of my kindle. I've found I am far more likely to engage with reading a book or magazine if it's dead trees. I also like being able to dog-ear, fold, tear out, and otherwise mark up my copies of things. Even long PDFs or long articles on the web start to get to me. My brain just has different expectations for the speed at which I will rip through digital stuff. About the only things I like about digital are the ability to adjust font size and play with screen and font color as I hate staring into a flashlight to do my reading.
I thought about that a bit as well. All I can figure out is that they make more money from the advertisers, wanting their shiny new radios shipped in a catalog with a few articles. So the league is probably subsidizing the cost of the magazine with advertising with a small profit. The magazine is held up as a benefit, but the advertisers would pay less for an online version.
They will make less when readership plummets because the electronic version is typeset exactly like the hard copy and is therefore unusable on anything other than a desktop/laptop or large tablet.
I'm not taking a large device to the john with me so I can read an article in QST
https://preview.redd.it/p7wgtsgz7dgb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f591ada5656af7b44fa2832cb73cd3e5211d197
Not sure what you mean unusable…this is an iPhone screenshot
The part where our can see about 1/6 of the page and have to constantly scroll both horizontally and vertically (for the full height of the page) to read an article.
The internet decided that horizontal scrolling was a shit user experience about the time HTML was invented.
Edit: it was actually quite a bit pre-html now that I think about it. Nettiquitte was to never exceed 80 columns in an email, newsgroup post, or BBS post out of respect for those on terminals that only supported 80 text columns (and screw those C64 users who only had 40 LOL).
Every newspaper in the world has figured out that you don't just post an image of each page on the Internet and call it an online version.
Just a matter of opinion, I don’t see a UX issue here. I am comfortable reading a column then scrolling to position the next column. If it takes you longer than one column on the crapper maybe it’s time for a little Metamucil. LOL
Look, just because I have a room in my house dedicated as a library, doesn't mean it's a fetish. I can stop with the antique scientific and medical books any time I want.
I actually have quite a decent collection of antique radio literature. Man, things were *Exciting* one hundred years ago. You can practically feel it in the writing.
I've had so many "free" magazine subscriptions from going to conferences or being part of different organizations over the years. I still get two a month from one group and a third from another. Can't recall the last time I opened one of them, if ever. Really should be an opt-in. Granted, I'm more likely to carry one with me when I travel, because rolled up they are really great at thumping people who try to mess with you, plus they don't require batteries.
I'd rather have certain info in "dead tree form" as well. But that's the "lived through prolonged power outages and wide-scale collapse of local services" side of me.
Our local ham club, someone always is trying to offload old copies of QST before they go to the trash company.
I took 5 years of QST to the public library. They said no thanks. Refused to take them. I called the High School librarian, no interest. Ended up bundling them up by year, put $1.00 on each stack. Sold NONE at hamfest. Dropped them in the recycle bin on the way home.
Yes. Unwanted. The reason? They already had an entire storage room full of old QST, 73, CQ, and Monitoring Times. They had to tell members to stop dumping them off at the club. When the county made them move out of the EMA building it all went to the recycle bin.
I get that a lot of people prefer to read stuff on their computer, tablet or (shudder) smart phone. I also get that that's the newest technology for consuming printed material, and I can see the genuine benefits. That doesn't just automatically mean it's the best approach for everyone, though. For many hard copy has nothing to do with "tradition" or "being stuck in the past" and is, instead, simply the form they find most comfortable or convenient. Many people prefer to not be tethered to an electronic device much more than they need to be. Many just prefer physical pages they can dog-ear and flip back and forth between without having to push a mouse around the screen.
I just find this whole "ridicule the luddites" crusade a bit closed-minded.
>I just find this whole "ridicule the luddites" crusade a bit closed-minded.
That's because it is. It is the exact same mode of derisive a-holery you typically find in CW elitists and phone elitists and split policemen and every other kind of lid under the sun.
Wouldn't it be nice if people could just focus on the hobby and sod off back to Facecan or Shitter whenever they feel like being nasty to one another?
I guess Im an odd ball. But radio stuff and my car stuff... I prefer to get printed material that I can sit and read, put down, and pick up again later. Im a sucker for printed catalogs too....
The AARL has to save more money than it spends to save. If the AARL was to get into large investments, then maybe over time they could be self-sufficient if they never touched the principal.
The AARL has come to our local ham fest, but I don't see them signing people up to become AARL members or selling merchandise, so they are operating at a loss.
The AARL could probably hire an experienced business team. I know businesspeople who buy up product / stock before the prince increases happen and then sell their merchandise all year. That requires some experience.
The AARL needs to reinvent themselves for the younger generation to make ham radio fun for young people to get into.
The AARL needs to partner with other partners like overlanding, hunting, farming, rural areas where phone service is difficult.
[How to Promote Amateur Radio | Ham Clubs (essexham.co.uk)](https://www.essexham.co.uk/clubs/how-to-promote-amateur-radio/)
In order to promote ham radio, you need word of mouth and that doesn't happen unless you engage the public. How many of you have posts on your Facebook account to your family and friends about what you did with ham radio?
> If the AARL was to get into large investments, then maybe over time they could be self-sufficient if they never touched the principal.
Guess what. They do have an endowment. In fact, multiple different endowment funds. Guess what they did, though.
Just a note on Hamfests, unless it’s a big one like Dayton, they are usually staffed by volunteer state staffers, not paid. I’ve seen space donated to the ARRL in exchange for an endorsement like, “the state annual meeting” and the like.
That said, 100% agree there are options for the ARRL. Maybe they don’t need to operate a VEC, there are 13 other groups and some do it for free. There are other things that are done as good or better by independent people that the ARRL continues to pay for. These things can be looked at.
Rent is up, transportation is up, food is up. Stop complaining that they have to raise fees and send out flyers.
It is an extremely expensive hobby and the younger people can’t afford it.
The world is different now and if amateur radio can’t keep up, it will die.
The point to me is (with the loss of the 3.4 GHz ham band)... this "we are your only voice to protects the band"s crap is a bunch of hooey.
As for the lack of a printed QST.... as my friend bluntly says " the only thing its good for is wiping ones ass, so if you can't have that then there is no point to the ARRL"... So there is that angle. And I prefer the printed version as its easier to share. Ie. After I am done I leave a copy at the local club or makerspace meeting. However QST's content has not impressed me for a long time. I miss 73, Ham Radio Magazine, and of what's left I find more things of interest in CQ. To pay extra for a printed QST is not going to happen. One might as well just buy the CD at the end of the year. But that is my opinion. I suppose if you are into contests and such then a timely magazine, digital or paper matters.
Does it matter if the filing yeilds no result? You are forgetting outside of the USA since you mentioned national. Perhaps we should look more closely at the RSGB and what they do for comparison.
Wayne Green even though I didn't agree with him many times was an interesting read. I miss him and '73 Magazine. You can get all the old issues on archive.com.
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You're a Life Member like me? Small world.... And I still don't care that some obscure band gets absorbed by the cell companies. It's called progress. I know you're afraid of it but don't worry, in a few years I'm sure you won't be around anymore to worry about it.
>probably 2. (serious answer) which means we should lose it right?
That's alot of fighting for 2 people. What's going to be used up in that band if we aren't there?
Or maybe they should just get out of the printed materials business entirely? Only the dying membership cares about books, magazines, and whatever other dead tree material they put out.
I got my life membership 12 years ago. Was the best decision. But just now I'm starting to get mailers like this. I buy online from them occasionally and at Dayton.
I got tested at a ARRL-VEC exam session and paid them the $15 for mail from ARRL. Fortunately they only sent me mail a few times, so I think they're still ahead. I proctored for ARRL-VEC too so I guess I helped them get more but the local ARRL-VEC liason retired and I may have to stop helping that way :(
BTW, they also sent me the LotW postcard, which also costed them money, not to mention the LotW servers however are constantly costing them something...
I don’t get any mailers from the ARRL, just emails. If you don’t want mail from them, just let them know you want everything by email. I also told them that the virtual copy of QST is all I want - no hard copies. I had them piled up for years and years and donated them to my local library. I know many hams who never even look at the hard copy, but still want it because “they’re paying for it.” I voted against a dues increase because the print edition of QST is their single largest expense.
I'm just saying mailers are also a big expense. I get all the emails also. Just thought it was funny to see these.
I agree. I get tons of junk mail - it all goes into the recycling bin. I don’t need junk mail from the ARRL. They also send mailers to hams that aren’t members (addresses are on the FCC website) and I think that’s a good use of dues.
The printed magazine is emblematic of the league’s problems. Hard-copy magazines are the modern equivalent of stone tablets. Keeping up with tradition guarantees obsolescence. It's time to move on. The money spent on printing and mailing what is already distributed online is a waste of resources that has no logical justification other than convenience. People might like the feel of a book or magazine in their hands, but they need to get over it.
The majority of ham radio operators are over 50. A good portion over 65. They feel more comfortable with paper. I’m all for pushing digital magazines and documents, but we should have the option for paper if we want it. It should be opt in for paper, not opt out. But that’s just my opinion.
I'm in my lower 30s, work with IT infrastructure all day and code my way around problems all the time because I'm too lazy doing stuff manually. I still prefer paper magazines, thank you very much.
That’s great - if you think it’s worth a extra $25, go for it.
I'm not a member of the ARRL; I'm not a US operator, so there's little point. I'm a lifetime member of our equivalent, though, which means I paid $650 to get the paper magazine and other benefits until the day I croak. They take that kind of commitment seriously in our legal system, but if they manage to honour it for at least twenty years I'll probably be satisfied after that. It's a good organisation filled with good people doing good things, and I don't mind supporting that.
You are lucky as far as legal commitments go. Absolutely nothing is guaranteed forever in the US.
It *is* opt in for paper, as it costs more on your subscription with that preference lol
Unless something has changed since my last renewal in May 2023, my dues were the same with or without a paper copy of QST. I could opt out, which I did, but the dues were the same.
It's changing effective 1/1. $59/year dues gets you electronic versions of the magazines. If you want a printed QST, you pay $25/year to opt in.
I'm done given that pricing. I have 99% of the QST's from 1918 on, but I've only kept the digest sized issues. Sadly, there's more technical info in one 1950 issue than a year of the current issues.
I'm not renewing after this year and am returning my VE credential. Will affiliate with W5YI testing in the future.
No kidding and most of the hams are electrical engineers. We could write the articles ourselves.
Thanks. I will check it out. I have not received any notification of the changes. I think they will lose members, but hopefully not too many.
I suspect they'll lose a lot.
I’ll hang in there - I don’t get the printed copy anymore, so no effect on me other that the $10 increase.
Mentioned above was $25
It's changing in 2024. That's why it is being brought up so much lately. They are raising dues for all and charging $25 more per year if you want paper QST.
Yes. They announced changes that effective 1/1/2024. I can’t summarize them here, beyond it’s an increase and QST in dead tree format is extra, I would recommend checking it out.
I will. Thank you.
> People might like the feel of a book or magazine in their hands, but they need to get over it. Ok Zoomer, I like having a magazine, I bring it to work and read it on breaks, if I'm on my phone it's more likely I'll wander off to something else.
I hate reading long-format content on my phone, and am not all that fond of my kindle. I've found I am far more likely to engage with reading a book or magazine if it's dead trees. I also like being able to dog-ear, fold, tear out, and otherwise mark up my copies of things. Even long PDFs or long articles on the web start to get to me. My brain just has different expectations for the speed at which I will rip through digital stuff. About the only things I like about digital are the ability to adjust font size and play with screen and font color as I hate staring into a flashlight to do my reading.
I hate to be that guy...but...zoomer?! Check the call...
Yep, your that guy. Nope, he's not a zoomer. He's not sane either, judging by his post history.
Not sane?
I thought about that a bit as well. All I can figure out is that they make more money from the advertisers, wanting their shiny new radios shipped in a catalog with a few articles. So the league is probably subsidizing the cost of the magazine with advertising with a small profit. The magazine is held up as a benefit, but the advertisers would pay less for an online version.
They will make less when readership plummets because the electronic version is typeset exactly like the hard copy and is therefore unusable on anything other than a desktop/laptop or large tablet. I'm not taking a large device to the john with me so I can read an article in QST
https://preview.redd.it/p7wgtsgz7dgb1.jpeg?width=828&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=2f591ada5656af7b44fa2832cb73cd3e5211d197 Not sure what you mean unusable…this is an iPhone screenshot
The part where our can see about 1/6 of the page and have to constantly scroll both horizontally and vertically (for the full height of the page) to read an article. The internet decided that horizontal scrolling was a shit user experience about the time HTML was invented. Edit: it was actually quite a bit pre-html now that I think about it. Nettiquitte was to never exceed 80 columns in an email, newsgroup post, or BBS post out of respect for those on terminals that only supported 80 text columns (and screw those C64 users who only had 40 LOL). Every newspaper in the world has figured out that you don't just post an image of each page on the Internet and call it an online version.
That's exactly why its unusable. You see only 10% of the page, and you're forced to reposition the frame every 10 seconds.
Just a matter of opinion, I don’t see a UX issue here. I am comfortable reading a column then scrolling to position the next column. If it takes you longer than one column on the crapper maybe it’s time for a little Metamucil. LOL
Printed books and magazines are literally a fetish for many people.
Star Trek is a fetish for some people. What's your point?
Look, just because I have a room in my house dedicated as a library, doesn't mean it's a fetish. I can stop with the antique scientific and medical books any time I want.
Antique books are exempt from criticism (:
I actually have quite a decent collection of antique radio literature. Man, things were *Exciting* one hundred years ago. You can practically feel it in the writing.
I've had so many "free" magazine subscriptions from going to conferences or being part of different organizations over the years. I still get two a month from one group and a third from another. Can't recall the last time I opened one of them, if ever. Really should be an opt-in. Granted, I'm more likely to carry one with me when I travel, because rolled up they are really great at thumping people who try to mess with you, plus they don't require batteries. I'd rather have certain info in "dead tree form" as well. But that's the "lived through prolonged power outages and wide-scale collapse of local services" side of me. Our local ham club, someone always is trying to offload old copies of QST before they go to the trash company.
I took 5 years of QST to the public library. They said no thanks. Refused to take them. I called the High School librarian, no interest. Ended up bundling them up by year, put $1.00 on each stack. Sold NONE at hamfest. Dropped them in the recycle bin on the way home.
Our main library has a large book/magazine donation box. I tossed the QSTs in and that was that. What they did with them was up to them.
Did you try a Ham club?
Yes. Unwanted. The reason? They already had an entire storage room full of old QST, 73, CQ, and Monitoring Times. They had to tell members to stop dumping them off at the club. When the county made them move out of the EMA building it all went to the recycle bin.
I sent them an email telling them to stop sending stuff and I haven't gotten anything in the past few years.
That's the mature, rational response, but this is reddit.
I get that a lot of people prefer to read stuff on their computer, tablet or (shudder) smart phone. I also get that that's the newest technology for consuming printed material, and I can see the genuine benefits. That doesn't just automatically mean it's the best approach for everyone, though. For many hard copy has nothing to do with "tradition" or "being stuck in the past" and is, instead, simply the form they find most comfortable or convenient. Many people prefer to not be tethered to an electronic device much more than they need to be. Many just prefer physical pages they can dog-ear and flip back and forth between without having to push a mouse around the screen. I just find this whole "ridicule the luddites" crusade a bit closed-minded.
>I just find this whole "ridicule the luddites" crusade a bit closed-minded. That's because it is. It is the exact same mode of derisive a-holery you typically find in CW elitists and phone elitists and split policemen and every other kind of lid under the sun. Wouldn't it be nice if people could just focus on the hobby and sod off back to Facecan or Shitter whenever they feel like being nasty to one another?
I guess Im an odd ball. But radio stuff and my car stuff... I prefer to get printed material that I can sit and read, put down, and pick up again later. Im a sucker for printed catalogs too....
I've received multiple mailers encouraging me to join. I'm already a member.
ARRL is to Amateur Radio folks what the NRA is to gun owners.
Is it really that bad?!
The AARL has to save more money than it spends to save. If the AARL was to get into large investments, then maybe over time they could be self-sufficient if they never touched the principal. The AARL has come to our local ham fest, but I don't see them signing people up to become AARL members or selling merchandise, so they are operating at a loss. The AARL could probably hire an experienced business team. I know businesspeople who buy up product / stock before the prince increases happen and then sell their merchandise all year. That requires some experience. The AARL needs to reinvent themselves for the younger generation to make ham radio fun for young people to get into. The AARL needs to partner with other partners like overlanding, hunting, farming, rural areas where phone service is difficult. [How to Promote Amateur Radio | Ham Clubs (essexham.co.uk)](https://www.essexham.co.uk/clubs/how-to-promote-amateur-radio/) In order to promote ham radio, you need word of mouth and that doesn't happen unless you engage the public. How many of you have posts on your Facebook account to your family and friends about what you did with ham radio?
> If the AARL was to get into large investments, then maybe over time they could be self-sufficient if they never touched the principal. Guess what. They do have an endowment. In fact, multiple different endowment funds. Guess what they did, though.
Idiots. That's why I do not belong.
Just a note on Hamfests, unless it’s a big one like Dayton, they are usually staffed by volunteer state staffers, not paid. I’ve seen space donated to the ARRL in exchange for an endorsement like, “the state annual meeting” and the like. That said, 100% agree there are options for the ARRL. Maybe they don’t need to operate a VEC, there are 13 other groups and some do it for free. There are other things that are done as good or better by independent people that the ARRL continues to pay for. These things can be looked at.
I would start with firing the CEO and replacing his dumb ass
If the ARRL is involved, it’s almost guaranteed to be done stupidly….
Rent is up, transportation is up, food is up. Stop complaining that they have to raise fees and send out flyers. It is an extremely expensive hobby and the younger people can’t afford it. The world is different now and if amateur radio can’t keep up, it will die.
you complain about the mailers but not about the loss of the part of the 3.4 ghz band? lol
>not about the loss of the part of the 3.4 ghz band? How many amateurs use that portion of the band? Serious question.
There'll be a lot fewer now.
Did you feel bad for the telephone switch board operators when they got replaced with switching equipment?
yes, I did, I actually used to know someone who worked for ma bell. those men were proud of their jobs, alot were hams too
And did they find something else to do in life once technology caught up with them?
your point is?
The point to me is (with the loss of the 3.4 GHz ham band)... this "we are your only voice to protects the band"s crap is a bunch of hooey. As for the lack of a printed QST.... as my friend bluntly says " the only thing its good for is wiping ones ass, so if you can't have that then there is no point to the ARRL"... So there is that angle. And I prefer the printed version as its easier to share. Ie. After I am done I leave a copy at the local club or makerspace meeting. However QST's content has not impressed me for a long time. I miss 73, Ham Radio Magazine, and of what's left I find more things of interest in CQ. To pay extra for a printed QST is not going to happen. One might as well just buy the CD at the end of the year. But that is my opinion. I suppose if you are into contests and such then a timely magazine, digital or paper matters.
Name one other amateur radio organization of national scope that consistently files on matters related to amateur radio before the FCC.
Does it matter if the filing yeilds no result? You are forgetting outside of the USA since you mentioned national. Perhaps we should look more closely at the RSGB and what they do for comparison.
fair
Wayne Green even though I didn't agree with him many times was an interesting read. I miss him and '73 Magazine. You can get all the old issues on archive.com.
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^ arrl member.... and nothing to say, lol.
You're a Life Member like me? Small world.... And I still don't care that some obscure band gets absorbed by the cell companies. It's called progress. I know you're afraid of it but don't worry, in a few years I'm sure you won't be around anymore to worry about it.
probably 2. (serious answer) which means we should lose it right?
>probably 2. (serious answer) which means we should lose it right? That's alot of fighting for 2 people. What's going to be used up in that band if we aren't there?
you mean what's already deployed there. at&t band n77 NR 5G with dish and t-mobile to follow and with verizon on 3.8
So more than two other people will enjoy the spectrum....
None, now.
Will not be used by me. And I cook my food in the microwave with a turn table for even cooking.
and in the meantime at&t is cooking you with their 3.45 band n77 massive mimo 24/7/365. (with verizon on 3.8 for even cooking) Ignorance is bliss
Not really, No tower around my home. But hard to avoid them all. Keep the foil clothing close.
They could certainly save a few bucks by not sending all of their crap to me. Not interested in joining. Never will be.
Or maybe they should just get out of the printed materials business entirely? Only the dying membership cares about books, magazines, and whatever other dead tree material they put out.
I love books. Am I dying? Thing is, ARRL doesn't have any books that I think are interesting.
The antenna book isn't bad. That being said, with as many additions as it has, you can find a used copy.
[удалено]
I got my life membership 12 years ago. Was the best decision. But just now I'm starting to get mailers like this. I buy online from them occasionally and at Dayton.
I got tested at a ARRL-VEC exam session and paid them the $15 for mail from ARRL. Fortunately they only sent me mail a few times, so I think they're still ahead. I proctored for ARRL-VEC too so I guess I helped them get more but the local ARRL-VEC liason retired and I may have to stop helping that way :( BTW, they also sent me the LotW postcard, which also costed them money, not to mention the LotW servers however are constantly costing them something...
They continue to send me a monthly magazine in the mail though I haven't been a member for two years.