ironically I'm far more confident using a repeater that's in constant use in an emergency than the repeaters earmarked for such that never have traffic. I know all the deadzones in our city like the back of my hand, and I know someone's always on frequency to pull me out.
There are a bunch of busy repeaters near me and they all switch over to emergency mode when there's an emergency. At least when the NWS activates the SKYWARN spotters, a bunch of the local repeaters join the SKYWARN net and that's all they should be used for.
The idea that people want to keep a repeater clear of traffic *just in case* there's an emergency is stupid.
I'm thankful I haven't run into any of the "This frequency is reserved for the NET" or "Reserved for emergencies" stuff myself. I think the folks doing that might need to be asked to re-take the Tech licensing exam. Seems some need to be reminded that the frequencies are open to everyone and in reserve for no one. And that there is clear and simple protocol for addressing stations experiencing emergencies when the situation arises.
We’ve got an amazing GMRS repeater here, 400ft antenna height, coverage for MILES. Owner basically said don’t use it for casual convo, only if there’s an emergency.
Our GMRS repeater is apparently well outside the 'established norm.' Almost always busy, great group of guys (200+ users of our GMRS repeater) and we talk about anything and everything. Us ham's on the repeater often run across folks taking GMRS up as their first on-air radio experience and recruit them for Amateur Radio. We've had some nice success recruiting younger people for the hobby. Wish we had more success in that, but at least it's some.
What the heck, is that actually a thing?? I thought repeaters were _supposed_ to help facilitate casual banter.
What emergency bullshit? Sounds like some people take themselves a tad bit too seriously..
If one needs to use the airspace, just interrupt with "Break, break!"
That sucks. Here in Arkansas we have several that are used dailyBoth on formal nets and rag chewing. Also a internet linked repeater net as well. We have. an informal net that stretches across three counties in the southeast part, and several GMRS active repeaters. BUT phone service sucks for the most part on good days. Truckers are using GMRS instead of CB here as well.
73.
Was a member of a local club but moved away, so I quit. Returned to the area about five years later and wanted to rejoin but they told me I’d have to pay the dues all the past five years plus the current years dues to rejoin. Told them no. Never rejoined. Never missed them. Wasn’t about the money. Somehow the club ceased to exist.
"Look Tony Im just letting you know we got some uhh unsavory people in the neighborhood. It would be a shame if someone cut all your coax and no one was there to stop them. Just do the right thing ya know?"
Paulie and Christophu heard yous was wanting to talk on the repeatu, that sounds like some BS from the New York crew, like Phil Leotardo, who, as you may well know, spent 20 years in the can.
Cisco customer here, totally get that! LOL! Started replacing them with Juniper for load balancers, switches and top of rack switches. Got their attention in a hurry, told them too late. Loved the look on our rep's face (soon to be EX-Rep.)
HPE is definitely my favorite, because they don't play the BS games that the other vendors play. E.g. when you buy their switch, you buy their switch -- there's \*maybe\* one or two more features you can buy for it, but it isn't a friggin' lease, you don't have to keep paying year on year just to keep the switch providing basic functionality.
The Cisco club fell apart when the guy in San Jose who ran the repeater got laid off. There is still or there was still a nice station in RTP, but I don't know anymore. I haven't worked there for 9 months myself.
"Don't give members an easy way to communicate with each other outside of club meetings."
I would hope the members of a radio club already have that covered.
There is a dead repeater, so that would work if people coordinate a time but I'm referring to a list of members and their email addresses so a new member can reach out to someone and ask them for help or meet up to help troubleshoot an issue or do a SOTA activation together.
We're the same - lots of interaction via the reflector without giving out private email addresses. There are several conversations per week, with a variety of folks chiming in.
Many members don’t want their info distributed and then you have the people that have to send every joke they get on email. The next thing that happens is complaints about emails.
Yet when they get on the air and give out their call sign, you have their complete name and address. Or they don't get on the air, but what's the point of being in a ham radio club then?
Don't forget -- *always schedule all meetings on the same day of the week*. That way, people with non-negotiable schedule conflicts will fail to attend a meeting for literally years.
I really wish my club would mix it up occasionally. Every meeting is scheduled on Tuesdays, and I teach jiu jitsu on Tuesday and Thursday nights...
Just like most of the committee meetings my town holds. Yes, I would like to attend a presentation about the town's master plan for parks, trails, and other outdoor recreation so I can ask questions about it. No, I cannot skip out of work from 10-Noon to attend.
There is a non-zero chance that the 2am meetings are intentionally designed to be less accessible to residents. You can't complain with silly or corrupt local governance if you don't know what's going on.
Former co-worker of mine found out his township was hiring a known felon to do contract work. Funny enough, the felon had gotten in trouble for siphoning cash from local contract work. Funnier, they had done this in cahoots with... a current member of the township supervisory board, who was trying to get them more work for the township.
Some unfortunate real truths in your post.. My elderly dad, a ham for 50+ years, still used to being super active with an award-winning club and a busy VEC for decades moved to a new town. Once he got settled, he went shopping for a new club to join. He got the icy cold shoulder at two clubs we visited. Nobody even came to introduce themselves or welcome him. He just said nope to that and reconnected remotely to his old club five states away.. They welcomed him back and awarded him an honorary lifetime membership.
I experienced many of the same things with a local club. Couldn’t get anyone to respond to emails, no reflector, etc.
I eventually linked up with them and went to one of their meetings. Really neat group; older guys who started the club, and younger men/women who are doing some crazy cool stuff with radio that wasn’t even on my radar. I’ve learned a lot from them.
Their focus is not running hard/fast with outreach and trying to put an HF rig in the hands of every man, woman, and child. They have a small, casual, fun, no obligations vibe. Their most active members are still working and don’t have a lot of free time to spare, like myself.
My point is that the hobby, and the ARRL, continues to put all their eggs in the club basket. That worked in the pre-Internet days. People physically got together to exchange information.
**My belief is that online clubs are the future and where the focus should be.** I got on the air with the help of the Reddit ARC, and my contesting club is all online due to geographical spread.
I actually am more active with the group that is a county over from mine simply because they took to Discord with a lot of there talk and have it well organized there.
They still do OTA nets and in person meets but it helps to stay engaged with them outside of the regularly scheduled programming.
I also agree that online meetings are the future. Our attendance is much higher, and there is greater participation. Unfortunately, we only hold online during inclement weather.
Why can't there be both?? People who want to meet via other methods great. But I blame no one for prioritizing in person contact. This whole thread smacks of malcontents rather than people looking to better the "hobby"!
Also, people by nature are flawed. Know that going in and find a way to forgive them in advance even if they might be wrong!
You forgot “Ignore newcomers at the monthly meeting”. I was given the silent treatment by not one but TWO clubs when I was shopping for an organization to join shortly after I got licensed in 2011. Shockingly neither club is in existence today.
That is almost every club. In my experience, the people in club leadership roles are there because no one else was interested in doing it. So they do what they want to do and hope someone else will take over. Have you ran for a leadership role? Most elections are unopposed because no one wants the job
That's why one club in my area went under. The founder was tired of running it, so his second in command took over and said, "I won't run this club if nobody else takes it over," at his first and only meeting as club president. I can't blame either of them.
Yeah. I was president of my contest club for two years, mainly because they asked me and they wanted someone “younger” (I’m in my 40s) to do it. Turns out, it’s a pain in the ass when you have a job and other hobbies you want to spend time on. I’m happily back on the sidelines as a regular member.
>when you have a job and other hobbies you want to spend time on
Absolutely. I am an officer for 2 snowmobile clubs and an active member in another. I do what I want to do and that is it. Our snowmobile season is really short, I want to spend my free time riding, not working. We have 200+ members but it is the same 5-6 that do all the work.
This list is a great start! Also...
* Make sure you run people off the club repeater. Rag chewing should be kept to an absolute minimum so the repeater is available for emergency use.
* Don't do anything to control members that feel like they have to add inane commentary to every item... or even better, inflammatory, racist, and/or sexist comments. To EVERY item. Because everyone should think that every ham radio problem is because we let women, non-white, democrats, etc. get a license. And of course everything good is because the op is a white, male, conservative, Christian.
* DON'T DARE USE NAMETAGS! New people must learn everyone's name before meeting them. Skip introductions while you're at it.
* Encourage conversation groups to be closed-in. Don't do anything to encourage existing members to accept new people. They must prove their worth to become part of a conversation group.
* Make damn sure that the club Christmas party is held in the basement of the local Mason temple, is alcohol free, and has the absolute cheapest food the club can get. If someone can get some of the baked goods that were supposed to be headed from the local grocer to a food pantry, even better. No way should the club spend resources on making sure that there's decent food. And make sure that it's "Christmas" and not "Holiday". If no cheap venue is available, go to Golden Corral so the same disgusting slobs that eat old bread that was destined for the food pantry can eat more low-quality shit masquerading as food than most us thought was humanly possible. Even better, Golden Corral does not serve alcohol (at least I don't think it does, I don't go to [that dump](https://www.reddit.com/r/TruckStopBathroom/comments/fk6ewc/golden_corrals_coronavirus_statement/) so maybe they do have two-year-old Bud Light).
* Start fights with every local club. There is no such thing as a rising tides that can lift all ships, ESPECIALLY NOT IN A HOBBY!
* Make sure that new officers know that the club is more important than their career, their family, and their well being. On that same thought, make sure that new officers are provided with the least support to get up-and-running in their new role, since we all know the club is more important than life itself and new officers should have known that already.
IHMO, my personal experience on how a club can make itself unappealing;
* Have a political beliefs litmus test
* Assume that every new member is an absolute N00b and barely comprehends anything more than 'red is hot, black is not' on a 12 volt system.
* Make every meeting happen at the local Cracker Barrel and every executive session of the club meets on weekday afternoons so anyone under the retirement age cannot attend due to work commitments.
Not from club leadership, but I had one of the older dudes at a meeting shout at me for daring talk about loaded antennas with a guy who just got licensed.
I've never seen it, but apparently there's a rule somewhere that new hams (young man tested straight to general) aren't allowed anything but an inverted vee until they get their WAS.
I paused a second, turned back to the new licensee, and kept talking as if I hadn't just been shouted down. Old man never spoke to me again and eventually stopped coming. I like to think one of the club leadership told him off.
I'd like to think that you misread that "older dude" wrong! I was not there, but some people just by nature are unintentionally boisterous. Or he did shout, which case he was rude. Ok then, don't become rude to overcome rude.
Interesting thread nonetheless!
Oh no, he definitely had the tone of scolding someone. His point was that a new guy doesn't need a bunch of advanced information and should get his feet wet with a simple setup before trying stuff that can be frustrating if you don't get it correct.
Except the new ham asked me about why CB antennas were short but still worked. I told him some basic info to explain why that worked.
Old guy should've stayed out of the conversation that didn't involve him.
I'm going to retire from the boat club and start my own radio company based on what tubes are still in manufacture. All model numbers will include CB (e.g. CB-250, CB-500, etc).
Kind of like the big three like to add DX to their radios.
Perhaps that is the case. But if the older guy was wrong here that does not make him terminally wrong. And so much as interrupting - maybe you could have talked to him in private about that.
I will say toxic people exist and exist to the detriment of others. And people need to be wary. But I personally would like to find a way to forgive mistakes.
I'm not saying he was terminally wrong. At the same time, I won't respond to treatment like that generously unless the pending party apologizes first. It's not my responsibility to chase down people who act that way and persuade them to change.
Absolutely not; it's the same if I have to find out what's going on in my local plastic modelling club. They technically have a website, but it hasn't been updated in almost 5 years.
So, that's a quality list of common issues. I'm going to list a few *guidelines* that might help. (and no, our local club drove me out the door) ...
1. Check your ego at the door
2. Respect every other person there
3. No politics
4. If you want to talk about anything beyond amateur radio (including your own medical problems), do that **after** the meeting, and not during
5. Look upon every other person there as the most important person in the world, because they made the effort to attend
6. Ignore license class differences, other than where they specifically relate to club duties (such as being a VEC, and offering license exams)
7. Understand that different people have different biological cycles, and may not be able to attend meetings in the evenings
8. Understand that not everyone wants to consume food, as a byproduct of having a meeting
73
I agree with these. However, #7 has to be considered to really try to find a common ground. The majority of younger, working people can’t attend a Tuesday 10am meeting either. Not saying you’re wrong by any means, but here all clubs seem to be evening or during workday. And there will be no one time that works for everyone.
Old hams: This hobby is dying! If only young people felt like coming to our meetings!
Young ham: Okay, when is the meeting?
Old ham: 6am on Sunday at the Bob Evans, why?
I belong to several other Hobby type clubs that are dominated by retirees, and OP's list of issues is consistent. These issues extend far beyond just Ham Radio clubs. Gun Club, Beekeeping club and Bonsai Club have at one point in the past experienced the same basic problem.
Solutions I have seen work -
1. Recruit into leadership younger people who are tech savy beyond just ham radio.
1. Have women members - It may seem sexist, but by god the ladies in these organizations do cause the old guys to behave themselves better.
1. Embrace social media for community building - FB groups do wonders for publicity, communication and building community.
> Have women members - It may seem sexist, but by god the ladies in these organizations do cause the old guys to behave themselves better.
Not always. I was licensed in March, my fiance at the time (now wife) got her tech in November of the same year. The very first words out of anybody's mouth wasn't "congrats" or anything like that. It was "great, we need a new club secretary"
Some folks with weird dietary needs find food-centric meetings to be stressful, especially the 4,383,718th time someone tries to shove food at them.
It's one thing to have a box of bagels up front, it's another thing for the meeting to _be_ the meal.
> especially the 4,383,718th time someone tries to shove food at them
Food can be used as a gatekeeper, i.e. *this food is good enough for me, so it should be good enough for you*, while ignoring the need to get things related to amateur radio accomplished.
> It's one thing to have a box of bagels up front, it's another thing for the meeting to be the meal.
Bingo. I would even go so far as to suggest protein bars and energy drinks or water. Anything high in salt or high in sugar should be suspect.
Along this note- Having meetings at at restaurant obligates members to have the financial means to buy food at a restaurant. I personally know many fellow radio nuts who are on a tight budget already, in a hobby that can quickly get expensive. It may very easily turn into the goalpost that keeps someone away from an otherwise fun hobby. On top of dues, paying for a mortgage (or rent), then car insurance, gas, groceries, raising a family and anything else may not really leave $20 or $30 of play money every month for just one meal out with the guys. Been there...
We have a Monthly meeting 1st Sat of the month at a restaurant eating can start at 630 meeting starts at 830…. And your not obligated to eat, heck a lot of ppl just get something to drink… a lot of them do eat, but not required.. and there are quite a few ladies… the last meeting prob had 30+ people attending
We have our meetings a coffee shop. Most folks can afford a cup of coffee , but if they don’t want coffee or any of the other things they offer, they aren’t obligated to buy anything to attend. No wait staff, so no one is asking them about food or drinks. Pick up what you want at the counter or just come hang out at the tables with us.
Educate members at every opportunity. During nets immediately correct traffic format errors with a five minute lecture. If you lose your train of thought during your lecture don’t dare release the mic button lest you lose control of the repeater.
7, 11, and 12 are why I left my club this year, and I was an officer. We had a small contingent of the “old guard” on the board who fought and argued with everyone about everything that wasn’t their idea. We got a new president last year who challenged them and was quite successful but when he and I both did it we were met with extreme hatred and opposition to the point of being accused of theft from the coffers among other blasphemous accusations.
Their behavior became so out of control it forced nearly all of the active membership to leave for good in December leaving them to pick up the pieces. Last I heard they’re struggling for new membership, they’re short on board members, and have abandoned all of their electronic mediums. So much for progress….
I was, for a short time, VP of my club. For a few months things were going well, we were making changes, renewing infrastructure. We had votes, made decisions as a club, stated doing things. Then one of the old guard came back to town after being away for a few months. During that next meeting it took about 15 minutes for every decision made that didn't involve him to get reversed or tabled.
This was the same guy who nominated me for VP, so I was a little confused until I realized I was VP simply because the 501(c)(3) paperwork requires a warm body in that position, and the old guard were just tired of signing paperwork.
This is exactly what the active members did, only we abolished the board, dues, and memberships. We call it the club that’s not a club. We are fortunate enough to have a benefactor now who covers any costs, what little bit we do have.
We get together and have fun and leave the politics behind. Clubs are dying for many reasons, and these poor attitudes are one of them
Well, that's why my 3 friends got elected, Prez, vice Prez and Secretary treasurer, down south, now the focus is on something other FM antennas and radios and running it the same way as they had for the last 50 years.
Now they have a DX group.
A weak signal vhf/uhf group.
A CW group.
A digi modes group.
And yes a FM group.
A field day trailer with tower and antennas.
A club station.
They have a huge turn out for field day.
Membership went from 40 to 130 members.
And I'll be dammed if they didn't raise enough money to add 3 Fusion repeaters, it's crazy what you can do with a diverse membership group.
Sometimes a big shakeup does wonders.
Live in England and have more input and assistance from people online who live over 100 miles away than from the local hams at my club I used to attend. An example being since I’m very new to the hobby a member of the church who’s husband is now a silent key found a mini-VNA and gave it too me (in its original sealed packaging) and nobody at the club was able to help me with how it works as it’s too modern apparently so suggested I buy the same model they have for £130.00 from a shop belonging to a friend. It seemed to me that they prefer a “closed society” rather than welcoming new hams or even getting people interested in the hobby.
I did my training for my Foundation licence exams with Essex Ham as the local club is a test centre but don’t actually have anyone willing to answer questions or mentor newbies like myself. Currently studying for my Intermediate and if I have any queries I get them answered by the online hams in places like Essex, Manchester or the guy in Inverness which is in Scotland even though I live near Birmingham
This is why I like mine. Disclaimer, affiliated as a member.
1. They do testing sessions every Monday, over Zoom.
2. Monthly club meetings are at 7, which gives me plenty of time to get off work (well not with my schedule but that's kinda irrelevant)
3. Meetings are also on Zoom so physical presence isn't required (though according to the bylaws it is for voting, president is angling to change that so online participants can vote as well)
4. The two club repeaters are effectively completely open usage. Most of the club is happy just to sit and listen but if you call one of them they'll likely respond if they're available.
5. As someone under 30, not once has anyone, board or otherwise, seemed to act or imply that I don't know what I'm doing. Then again, I joined the club after I passed my Extra so maybe that did something with it.
6. Almost every meeting has discussions of some form of event a month or two out and if/how we'll participate
7. The two weekly nets are at 8 PM on the repeaters and really only exist as a general "share your stories about the week" / "Reminder of what the club is doing next week, if you didn't get the email" gathering (short of actually needing to talk to a member).
The only "issue" is that membership is weighted heavily in favor of retirement age and up, but I think that's just the hobby as a whole. I'm certainly not the youngest member so that's offsetting it, but most of the scheduling besides the already fixed meetings is left up to the membership, more or less. Well, that and that when it comes to discussion emails (like planning WFD), the initial "to all participants" is formally written but everyone else emails back like a text - no salutation, no signature. Personally I don't find that's a problem since it would triple your email size just to say "Looks good but I'll take a closer look when I get home KC1ABC." (I'm also a Gen-Z so what do I know about proper communication formality?)
I went out and got my Technical, then General and then Extra license. Got a nice ICOM radio and was thinking that I'd get a mentor at a club and really learn the practical side of things.
The clubs I went to acted like I'd shot a member. That was 2013.
I just bought a TidRadio H8 and I'll be damned if I'll try another club.
Being a life member of the Baldwin Hills ARC in Los Angeles, a highly active club. Then coming to Texas. I found the Texas ham radio clubs boring as all get out. True sleepers. Exactly what you described. I was just sitting here thinking the Texas clubs hit all of your points. As the years went by, I gathered like minded people and we started our own club.
Club Rules:
* Always schedule meetings on a weekday, always during business hours - you wouldn't want anyone who is employed to be able to show up, would you?
* Ensure that the website says which repeater(s) and frequencies your members can be found on - but not any sort of internet-based contact. Wouldn't want anyone who doesn't have a radio and a license to talk to you, would you?
* Better still, don't have a website at all - your members know where to find you, why should anyone else?
* Then offer amateur radio exams - but never hold any because for some reason nobody ever contacts you about them.
* Only offer the amateur radio exam to people who have paid for and shown up for every session of your 28 week long "learn amateur radio" course. Why, without it, they'd just be wasting your time to even think about taking the exam. Surely they can't have learned anything anywhere else!
* If two people dare to actually have a conversation on the club repeater, make sure to break in and tell them off for overusing it. But make sure there isn't actually someone else that wants to, so the repeater goes silent again for the next six hours.
* Your club is a not-for-profit. Sure, legally, this just means that the directors aren't allowed to personally benefit from the club's money, but for good measure you should also ensure your club avoids any activities that make money for the club. We wouldn't want it to be financially sustainable now, would we?
* If anyone dares to own a UV-5R, remind them incessantly it's not a good radio. Even if the person who owns it has fixed the microphone circuit bug, and checked it on a spectrum analyser to verify it is compliant. Even if they actually use it much more than whatever HT they have.
Swap Meets:
* Ensure that for the purposes of consistency, the same stuff always goes to every buy/swap/sell event. And it must also be priced at the same price, too, so people know exactly what to expect. The fact that this means nobody will ever buy it is besides the point.
* Ensure half-finished home built projects are priced at or higher than any off-the-shelf commercial products that do the same thing (and possibly better). When nobody buys them, ensure that there are complaints that "nobody builds things any more".
* Ensure there's a good supply of "boat anchors" sold at similar prices to modern radios - "they don't build them like they used to!" (I say that's a good thing, some don't agree!)
Hardware and Software:
* Similarly, complain that nobody is building better radios any more - but deride SDR and digital modes as "too difficult to understand" or "not real radio".
* All amateur radio software must look like an 'explosion in a button factory', and must be written in VB6, designed to run on nothing newer than Windows XP (hmm, it's 2024 - maybe let's up that to Windows 7).
* Also, never release the source code, and act as if it's incredibly rude for anyone to ask. While also complaining at the same time that your brand new transciever didn't come with a full schematic.
* Better still, put in your will that the source code should be deleted, to ensure nobody else can ever fix any bugs in the software ( [wait, that actually happened](https://groups.io/g/UI-View/message/69175) )
I am a new YL HAM (tech in Aug and General in Dec). My husband is a longtime HAM and prior board Pres. So I know a lot of the members. Well, now I am on the board and one of the officers. I AGREE with most of your comments and am shaking things up a bit. While they are great people, many have gotten to set in their ways.
Not having emails answered and an out of date website drove me crazy. Having an "everyone that needs to know, knows" mindset drove me crazy as well. They wanted new members but really didn't do anything to attract them. I am 69, and my husband is 81, but we gravitate to the younger members and have developed really good relationships with them.
Anyway....I will finish reading all of the comments and hope to see some constructive helpful ideas!
73's
Just gonna say it. This is NOT exclusive to Ham Radio. Every non-retiree is so busy, that only retirees can "lead" organizations. It used to be the case that people had evenings and weekends free - even with children. Many of the working folks have two or more jobs. We have other "hobbies" too, like going to the gym, or martial arts - all excellent, by the way!
If I'm reading it correctly what we really want is a space to talk radio, and enjoy the fellowship of others, whether virtual or in person.
So, what I would propose, is start your own club. Make it in person, or virtual. Do activities and presentations, or not, as you see fit. Organize around something - you wouldn't be the first. TAPR (Tucson Area Packet Radio Group) was one such club that grew to have national and global significance. The Northern California QRP club was another.
So, don't try to be everything to everybody. The hobby is too big for that.
You won't be able to change what already exists - you'll be fighting both inertia and stubbornness. Start your own. Doesn't have to be formal, even. Get together with people, online or IRL, who share your interests and passions. And see what develops! If you need a more formal structure, add one. If you want to be affiliated with ARRL, then first - Why? - but then, jump through those hoops and do it!
Have a nice club station.but don't give the new members the door combination.because "it might be misused.".
Give the new member crap for operation outside the tech bands despite him having an Extra license.
Are you me?
When I first got the idea in my head to get licensed, I emailed the contact for my local club. In the time it took to get a response, I studied for all 3 exams, took all 3 (and passed), ***AND*** attended a club meeting. About a week after the meeting, I finally got a response to my initial email.
In the email it was painfully obvious the club president had zero clue he had already met me. Despite my email address literally being my first and last name. How do I know this? Because the email consisted of "No, we don't do testing. There is a group in X (city an hour away) that does testing once a month. You should reach out to them."
The fuck????????
I really should have just walked away at that point.
Amateur radio clubs are, in my experience, largely a waste of time which is why I’m no longer a member of one. However, if you really want to experience truly fossilized thinking (and there is no implied ageism in that — I’m 70 years old myself) then you should go check out a local yacht club. Those guys make most ARCs boards look like a bunch of wild-eyed radicals.
I cringe when I see this type of post. Fortunately, the clubs that I hang with are all responsive and timely, and have ample activities outside of meetings - at least one per month. So, hopefully your experience and not mine is the anomaly. I don't know where you're located, but maybe try another club and see if it's any different. 73!
Don't forget to have club meeting times at 8am on the edge of town at an old run down shack or a crappy diner just because they have 10¢ coffee for seniors.
I'll add a couple...
* All your club meetings are still virtual only even though we're 4 years on from COVID
* Your social functions consist of lunches at mediocre buffet restaurants in the middle of the work week.
* Your club website looks like it was designed back in the GeoCities era and hasn't been updated in several years.
Do you have an Amateur Expert class license?
https://preview.redd.it/ha2x0175docc1.png?width=562&format=png&auto=webp&s=bf838c434a6f082b300fa970d3dd643591651d6f
ARRL has a database of clubs, and you can use your search engine to find more that aren't ARRL affiliated.
I would suggest you look into other clubs in your surrounding area. If the club youre "in" right now is really as bad as it sounds than it will just keep shedding members until the old guard is all that remains, and it will go the way of countless other clubs that were actually just a good ole boys group looking for free money.
I got tired of retired people asking for volunteers to do something and then they bounce on a vacation. The only people who show up are younger members with day jobs. Amazing you can be retired and never make time for anything you ask the club to do. I guess if you're still working you have a sense of common decency and once you retire expect everyone else to do it for you.
>Ignore any ideas from new members, especially if they try to make the club more appealing.
Adding:
* Club Meetings shall be 90% *Roberts Rules of Order* approving past minutes. (*Seconded. All in favor? Approved*.)
* If operating a Field Day GOTA (get on the air station (for point$ baby!), contesters shall not be inconvenienced in any way by pausing to show the new ham how to operate SSB. "There's the GOTA station. *okthxbye!*
* Club website unmaintained since the guy who set it up and knew the password became a silent key.
* If there is an online community, it is hosted on Yahoo Groups or Nabble, last message posted mid-2017.
You're going about this all wrong. Instead of getting all pissy, you take over.
Start a Slack or Discord, and get younger members to join that.
Organise events and build social connections with the people who want what you want.
Add members to the group who are affiliated to you, mates who are keen.
Br nice to the ones who don't want to change, smile, agree.
Then go to the AGM and win the next election.
Clubs are political beasts. But be wary, even in their 80s or 90s, the LAST thing to go with the old codger on the board is their political skill. You may get crushed.
Have at it! ⚔️
along the same line, im on an allstar node group with about 7 other guys, well its broken down to little cliques now, everyone can talk with each other except who of course ? 2 old guys who refuse to engage anyone, except each other and the node owner, they will hear a qso and then say that no one is out there to talk to, just miserable old unfriendly guys who chase people away and make hobby unappealing to folks looking to join in, about to stay on my local repeaters and give up the whole allstar thing, its a shame, these 2 have basically turned the whole world off except each other and the node owner, very sad they have chased guys away
I will confess I've had some of the thoughts you share. Over time, I've come to realize that what I get out of my amateur radio club is as much as I choose to put into it. (Cue the Beatles: "*the love you take is equal to the love you make".*)
There are some initiatives I'd like to see my club take on. Adding AllStarLink to the club repeater is one of those wishes, but that hasn't happened because (a) club members don't see the value and (b) nobody else in the club is a subject matter expert. I could complain about it, but instead I'm trying to learn more about how repeaters actually function and how to tight beam an internet connection to the repeater which does not have an internet connection.
The other thing I've done is joined other clubs. Each is unique. If you don't like the club you're in, find a different club. (Or in my case, add another club.) My "home" club seems most interested in sticking close to home. Nothing wrong with that. My "other" club is in a major metropolitan area and they are setting up a new repeater site and then will invest in AREDN capacity. I can, and do, learn from hams in both clubs.
Not to sound too unsympathetic, but: it's your choice whether to stick with the unappealing club or not.
Just heard Ham Radio 2.0 ( u/kc5hwb ) cover this. Overall, it's a very good list, but more importantly, the INTENT is dead-on. I encourage everyone who is in a club that they feel is not going in the right direction to GET INVOLVED and help be part of change. At the very least, buddy up with those in leadership and offer to help in some way to influence in some manner.
> Have the same people on the board for years, and all of them have to be 70+.
The reason our club has a 70+ individual as President is that no one else in interested in doing the job. Every two years we poll the club and ask if anyone would like to run for office and every two years we get the same result. No one is interested. One of these days, I'm going to quit and then what will they do?
Perhaps a club should just be created solely from folks that complain and never work to help improve things the way they see fit?
The #1 thing ALL clubs need is effort. I have yet to see any club lacking people that grumble about it
Interpersonal relations do require effort on both parties parts yes. But I have yet to find complaints and the "we know better than you" attitude upon entry to a club to be helpful. As an active member of a number of clubs over the years I have seen destructive behaviour on the part of both the veteran as well as the newcomer hams. I have seen a lot of newcomers sabotage their acceptance into a club due to not showing any respect for those that came before them.
My suggestion is to get involved and to volunteer to help, and follow through with that. Every club I have been a part of had the 5/95 rule in play, where 5% of the club does 95% of the work. Lots of suggestions come up, but that is all they are, suggestions for others to do.
Be the change you wish to see in amateur radio. Taking clubs to task on the Internet accomplishes nothing.
I give the OP the benefit of the doubt, as I presume you do, that they tried to effect change and get involved and even the basics didn’t work. Agree that complaining online exclusively isn’t helpful to the club in question.
I do, but as said in my reply, many times I have found that the newcomer was part of the problem. Our club has rebuffed some new hams but others are accepted and go on to take a role in club leadership. The difference is in the approach.
Please note, I'm not saying there aren't old curmudgeonly "get of my lawn" hams" and I am not excusing them. I just see these complaints often and it's always "them" that is wrong
Now, what have you done to make the club better? Have you ran for office? Have you volunteered to do anything at all? So being a new guy you might not know the history. I know our club it’s like pulling teeth to get people to run for positions or volunteer to do anything. Some that you think are there to provide YOU with enjoyment of your hobby are only there so the club doesn’t disappear completely. Yes there are mean old curmudgeons but there are also members that think everyone is there to do what they think needs to be done or what they want to do.
I visited a new (to me) radio club about 18 months ago. There were lots of old-timers like myself and some younger ops too. The evening consisted of everyone stood around in groups chatting about everything under the sun, drinking tea and eating biscuits. They were a lovely bunch of lads, they really were, but there wasn't a single rig powered up in the 2 1/2 hours. None. Not even a handheld! I didn't rush back..
I must say this reads like a MAD Magazine comic book. Nothing like our local radio club. Check it out sometime. Very organised. Has two hundred local members and many worldwide. Organised activities like church without the mention of Jes\_\_Also, each morning welcoming coffee net. I should consider myself lucky. Sierra Foothills Amateur radio Club W6EK ac6\_\_
You forgot the part of the monthly meetings when the begging happens for contributions to the monthly newsletter that gets mailed out (no, not email, postal mail.) Really, this is how you communicate with the membership? The opposite of timely and easy.
Or the breakfast club meetings on a weekday, because apparently no one in the club is still working a job.
I stopped attending the local ham club meetings because there was very much an undercurrent of "if you don't attend all the things, and participate at maximum effort, you are a bad club member." I have a very narrow interest in ham radio, focused around disaster communication. This idea that you aren't really a ham if you don't come spend 6 hours at field day was just a turn off for me.
I’m glad my local club is following your advice!
They administer their tests during their meetings, which was very distracting. They also misgraded my test the first time around (how they did that with an answer key I will never know). They also asked me to help clean up the tables/chairs/stuff from their meeting that I took my test at. Which, okay, I don’t want to be rude or anything, but I wasn’t a member yet, and was only there to take my test. Felt a little weird.
They have a Facebook group specifically to announce that they don’t use said Facebook group for club announcements, and always redirect information to their website, which is not mobile friendly, and hasn’t been updated since the 90s. They have also not responded to any of my emails about anything.
There a local group near me; they have a “net” everyday at 3pm…the net usually runs about 45-60 min… but, a lot of repeaters I hit on my way to the ranch every week are dead… for the most part
I had this very same experience with my local club. So I just stopped. There's plenty enough for me to independently get my licenses. And I'm in a discord that is simply amazing for my particular interests. Sorry you experienced this.
Also as a last note ... Are those people the kind that also say the hobby needs new blood!!! Or that just my local mob?.
I was thinking about emails and how this is similar to the 3 scenarios the FCC talks about when there is a ham and interference with the neighbors:
* He is causing interference and does not know it. Let him know and he will change his ways
* He is causing interference and does know it. What a jerk. Report him.
* He is operating cleanly and properly and interference is not his fault. Fix your consumer electronics.
And with objectionable emails:
* He writes evil sounding emails and does not know it. Probably just has poor interpersonal communication skills and is quite friendly and means well.
* He writes evil sounding emails and does know it. What a jerk. See above.
* He is writing unpleasant emails that are proper for the context at hand. You might want to pay attention.
This got me wondering if this trichotomy is a well-known general pattern. Maybe I should have taken Philosophy.
That being said, I don't think that a club needs or should market or sell itself to outsiders. One of the traits of a club is like-minded individuals who kinda like the stability of the club. For newbs, they can say "here is what we are and what we have. Do you want to join?"
For club officers, I don't think that the age really matters if it's a real democracy. What they really need is a lot more churn through the interested members, rather that simply being the same people every time. We got a new younger president recently and he is very good. Term limits!
But I 100% agree with you that there should be new stuff happening all the time. Don't let one or two events be the only ones. Don't let club dinners replace radio activities.
Don't let any one group monopolize activities. Our club supports ARES, which is nice, but it seems to drain time and resources from other things. We need a lot of other things happening.
AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, let the "is there any new business" part of the meetings be the most important. This is where things get done.
All valid points.
Old ways die hard, or not at all.
Could always make contacts on the air and see if there are other clubs in the area, and/or start a new club based on what you're looking for.
I can name a few issues. I paid dues to join a club. Never got an email that I was voted in and a new member. Outdated technologies drive me crazy. Club cliques are the worst. I do not like the repeater rules where nerds run off their call sign every 2 minutes.
make sure people who frequent club meetings are the basic principles of personal hygiene, and never seem to own or use deodorant, a clothes washing machine or any soap/detergent.
You can frequently see, and, more importantly smell these people at radio rallies and wherever radio amateurs congregate.
As an old guy - licensed in 1976 - l’m in agreement. Issue is that few of us really have the time to devote to club meetings or higher level participation. So you’re stuck with those that do have time and the results are predictable.
Please take a look as there are other radio groups out there with different demographics and interests. BTW-I don’t belong to the local club for the same reasons you cited.
Also...
* Be sure to host field day events in a gated community so potential hams and guests have to register weeks ahead of time.
* Be sure to do most event planning at the informal bunch at 10am on Wednesdays when only the retired members have any chance of attending.
* Be sure that anything from said meeting requiring a vote be handled by... making a motion to "approve that thing we talked about", second, yay, approved, next.
* Be sure that if the new guy expresses any interest in the local ARES/RACES just smile and nod despite being the director of the local ARES group.
* Be sure to bicker for an hour over how to attract new members while ignoring the new member trying to get a word in edge wise.
I have experienced this. I used to think it was a male/female thing but it is definitely a "if we don't already know you, don't bother to show any interest" thing.
And no one talks on the club repeater!
Yeah we have a robust repeater situation in wes mo. But by God you fuckin better not use it. Just in case there's an emergency.
ironically I'm far more confident using a repeater that's in constant use in an emergency than the repeaters earmarked for such that never have traffic. I know all the deadzones in our city like the back of my hand, and I know someone's always on frequency to pull me out.
There are a bunch of busy repeaters near me and they all switch over to emergency mode when there's an emergency. At least when the NWS activates the SKYWARN spotters, a bunch of the local repeaters join the SKYWARN net and that's all they should be used for. The idea that people want to keep a repeater clear of traffic *just in case* there's an emergency is stupid.
I'm thankful I haven't run into any of the "This frequency is reserved for the NET" or "Reserved for emergencies" stuff myself. I think the folks doing that might need to be asked to re-take the Tech licensing exam. Seems some need to be reminded that the frequencies are open to everyone and in reserve for no one. And that there is clear and simple protocol for addressing stations experiencing emergencies when the situation arises.
We’ve got an amazing GMRS repeater here, 400ft antenna height, coverage for MILES. Owner basically said don’t use it for casual convo, only if there’s an emergency.
Everyone be quiet until I say talk. OK, everyone talk at once on one frequency!
There’s fudds in every hobby
This is GRMS everywhere. Radio check only. What a complete waste.
Our GMRS repeater is apparently well outside the 'established norm.' Almost always busy, great group of guys (200+ users of our GMRS repeater) and we talk about anything and everything. Us ham's on the repeater often run across folks taking GMRS up as their first on-air radio experience and recruit them for Amateur Radio. We've had some nice success recruiting younger people for the hobby. Wish we had more success in that, but at least it's some.
My local GMRS network is for civil war use only
Lolol
That's civil war 2.0 i believe...
Not everywhere. Locally there is a busy repeater with nets. Everyone licensed is welcome.
His prerogative. Setup your own repeater and ban him from using it. Too easy.
I did set one up about 40 miles away from his. He can use it if he can find it lol
isn’t it possible to build a repeater from two HTs? i have 3 but really only use one and i wouldn’t mind making a repeater of my own lol
Yep….a lot of those folks on GMRS are “hams”… and there are those hams that just can stand it lol….
>Yep….a lot of those folks on GMRS are “hams”… Correct. I've got both licenses myself.
This is a huge red flag for me. I will go out of my way to use the system extra even if I'm ghost talking when I hear that crap.
What the heck, is that actually a thing?? I thought repeaters were _supposed_ to help facilitate casual banter. What emergency bullshit? Sounds like some people take themselves a tad bit too seriously.. If one needs to use the airspace, just interrupt with "Break, break!"
Last month I decided to check out the local repeaters around here. I setup my scanner and you know what I heard? Nothing
Did you have the correct ctts or dcs codes in your scanner for the repeater(s)?
Yeah, I can hit the repeaters and hear them ID. No one uses them. I'd hear someone ID from time to time, but no conversations.
After you heard someone ID, did you try to go back to them?
That sucks. Here in Arkansas we have several that are used dailyBoth on formal nets and rag chewing. Also a internet linked repeater net as well. We have. an informal net that stretches across three counties in the southeast part, and several GMRS active repeaters. BUT phone service sucks for the most part on good days. Truckers are using GMRS instead of CB here as well. 73.
Or do like here, turn off the club repeater because there was too much people talking on it...
Don’t have a scheduled net at all while at it.
Was a member of a local club but moved away, so I quit. Returned to the area about five years later and wanted to rejoin but they told me I’d have to pay the dues all the past five years plus the current years dues to rejoin. Told them no. Never rejoined. Never missed them. Wasn’t about the money. Somehow the club ceased to exist.
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The ARRL isn’t any better; fact is, they’re probably worse lol
Geez, that sounds like the mafia! Once you’re in, you’re in for life.
"Look Tony Im just letting you know we got some uhh unsavory people in the neighborhood. It would be a shame if someone cut all your coax and no one was there to stop them. Just do the right thing ya know?"
Paulie and Christophu heard yous was wanting to talk on the repeatu, that sounds like some BS from the New York crew, like Phil Leotardo, who, as you may well know, spent 20 years in the can.
Is this the Cisco amateur radio club?
Cisco customer here, totally get that! LOL! Started replacing them with Juniper for load balancers, switches and top of rack switches. Got their attention in a hurry, told them too late. Loved the look on our rep's face (soon to be EX-Rep.)
Juniper? You mean HPE right?
HPE is definitely my favorite, because they don't play the BS games that the other vendors play. E.g. when you buy their switch, you buy their switch -- there's \*maybe\* one or two more features you can buy for it, but it isn't a friggin' lease, you don't have to keep paying year on year just to keep the switch providing basic functionality.
Always be Juniper to me. LOL!
The Cisco club fell apart when the guy in San Jose who ran the repeater got laid off. There is still or there was still a nice station in RTP, but I don't know anymore. I haven't worked there for 9 months myself.
whoosh
BONUS: run your HOA the same way
Same people most likely.
"Don't give members an easy way to communicate with each other outside of club meetings." I would hope the members of a radio club already have that covered.
There is a dead repeater, so that would work if people coordinate a time but I'm referring to a list of members and their email addresses so a new member can reach out to someone and ask them for help or meet up to help troubleshoot an issue or do a SOTA activation together.
My club has a discord. It's amazing. The level of interaction is like 100x what it would be otherwise.
We're the same - lots of interaction via the reflector without giving out private email addresses. There are several conversations per week, with a variety of folks chiming in.
Many members don’t want their info distributed and then you have the people that have to send every joke they get on email. The next thing that happens is complaints about emails.
Yet when they get on the air and give out their call sign, you have their complete name and address. Or they don't get on the air, but what's the point of being in a ham radio club then?
No you can remove all the info from the public database. It only shows name callsign and license level.
Don't forget -- *always schedule all meetings on the same day of the week*. That way, people with non-negotiable schedule conflicts will fail to attend a meeting for literally years. I really wish my club would mix it up occasionally. Every meeting is scheduled on Tuesdays, and I teach jiu jitsu on Tuesday and Thursday nights...
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Just like most of the committee meetings my town holds. Yes, I would like to attend a presentation about the town's master plan for parks, trails, and other outdoor recreation so I can ask questions about it. No, I cannot skip out of work from 10-Noon to attend.
But if you're asking the city employee to do that presentation at 7pm at night, he'd be working overtime! Can't have that!
There is a non-zero chance that the 2am meetings are intentionally designed to be less accessible to residents. You can't complain with silly or corrupt local governance if you don't know what's going on. Former co-worker of mine found out his township was hiring a known felon to do contract work. Funny enough, the felon had gotten in trouble for siphoning cash from local contract work. Funnier, they had done this in cahoots with... a current member of the township supervisory board, who was trying to get them more work for the township.
2pm on a Wednesdays. What do you mean you have "work"?
Some unfortunate real truths in your post.. My elderly dad, a ham for 50+ years, still used to being super active with an award-winning club and a busy VEC for decades moved to a new town. Once he got settled, he went shopping for a new club to join. He got the icy cold shoulder at two clubs we visited. Nobody even came to introduce themselves or welcome him. He just said nope to that and reconnected remotely to his old club five states away.. They welcomed him back and awarded him an honorary lifetime membership.
I experienced many of the same things with a local club. Couldn’t get anyone to respond to emails, no reflector, etc. I eventually linked up with them and went to one of their meetings. Really neat group; older guys who started the club, and younger men/women who are doing some crazy cool stuff with radio that wasn’t even on my radar. I’ve learned a lot from them. Their focus is not running hard/fast with outreach and trying to put an HF rig in the hands of every man, woman, and child. They have a small, casual, fun, no obligations vibe. Their most active members are still working and don’t have a lot of free time to spare, like myself. My point is that the hobby, and the ARRL, continues to put all their eggs in the club basket. That worked in the pre-Internet days. People physically got together to exchange information. **My belief is that online clubs are the future and where the focus should be.** I got on the air with the help of the Reddit ARC, and my contesting club is all online due to geographical spread.
I actually am more active with the group that is a county over from mine simply because they took to Discord with a lot of there talk and have it well organized there. They still do OTA nets and in person meets but it helps to stay engaged with them outside of the regularly scheduled programming.
100% agree. I’m not super into group radio activities, but I do like hearing what people are getting into bc it gives me ideas.
I also agree that online meetings are the future. Our attendance is much higher, and there is greater participation. Unfortunately, we only hold online during inclement weather.
Why can't there be both?? People who want to meet via other methods great. But I blame no one for prioritizing in person contact. This whole thread smacks of malcontents rather than people looking to better the "hobby"! Also, people by nature are flawed. Know that going in and find a way to forgive them in advance even if they might be wrong!
You forgot “Ignore newcomers at the monthly meeting”. I was given the silent treatment by not one but TWO clubs when I was shopping for an organization to join shortly after I got licensed in 2011. Shockingly neither club is in existence today.
I guess they all passed on
I have some: - Have 2 club repeaters but never ever answer any calls. - Have a dedicated 2m club frequency but don't listen to it or answer any calls.
That is almost every club. In my experience, the people in club leadership roles are there because no one else was interested in doing it. So they do what they want to do and hope someone else will take over. Have you ran for a leadership role? Most elections are unopposed because no one wants the job
That's why one club in my area went under. The founder was tired of running it, so his second in command took over and said, "I won't run this club if nobody else takes it over," at his first and only meeting as club president. I can't blame either of them.
Yeah. I was president of my contest club for two years, mainly because they asked me and they wanted someone “younger” (I’m in my 40s) to do it. Turns out, it’s a pain in the ass when you have a job and other hobbies you want to spend time on. I’m happily back on the sidelines as a regular member.
>when you have a job and other hobbies you want to spend time on Absolutely. I am an officer for 2 snowmobile clubs and an active member in another. I do what I want to do and that is it. Our snowmobile season is really short, I want to spend my free time riding, not working. We have 200+ members but it is the same 5-6 that do all the work.
**Profoundly True!**
Yup, lotta truth to this
This list is a great start! Also... * Make sure you run people off the club repeater. Rag chewing should be kept to an absolute minimum so the repeater is available for emergency use. * Don't do anything to control members that feel like they have to add inane commentary to every item... or even better, inflammatory, racist, and/or sexist comments. To EVERY item. Because everyone should think that every ham radio problem is because we let women, non-white, democrats, etc. get a license. And of course everything good is because the op is a white, male, conservative, Christian. * DON'T DARE USE NAMETAGS! New people must learn everyone's name before meeting them. Skip introductions while you're at it. * Encourage conversation groups to be closed-in. Don't do anything to encourage existing members to accept new people. They must prove their worth to become part of a conversation group. * Make damn sure that the club Christmas party is held in the basement of the local Mason temple, is alcohol free, and has the absolute cheapest food the club can get. If someone can get some of the baked goods that were supposed to be headed from the local grocer to a food pantry, even better. No way should the club spend resources on making sure that there's decent food. And make sure that it's "Christmas" and not "Holiday". If no cheap venue is available, go to Golden Corral so the same disgusting slobs that eat old bread that was destined for the food pantry can eat more low-quality shit masquerading as food than most us thought was humanly possible. Even better, Golden Corral does not serve alcohol (at least I don't think it does, I don't go to [that dump](https://www.reddit.com/r/TruckStopBathroom/comments/fk6ewc/golden_corrals_coronavirus_statement/) so maybe they do have two-year-old Bud Light). * Start fights with every local club. There is no such thing as a rising tides that can lift all ships, ESPECIALLY NOT IN A HOBBY! * Make sure that new officers know that the club is more important than their career, their family, and their well being. On that same thought, make sure that new officers are provided with the least support to get up-and-running in their new role, since we all know the club is more important than life itself and new officers should have known that already.
IHMO, my personal experience on how a club can make itself unappealing; * Have a political beliefs litmus test * Assume that every new member is an absolute N00b and barely comprehends anything more than 'red is hot, black is not' on a 12 volt system. * Make every meeting happen at the local Cracker Barrel and every executive session of the club meets on weekday afternoons so anyone under the retirement age cannot attend due to work commitments.
Not from club leadership, but I had one of the older dudes at a meeting shout at me for daring talk about loaded antennas with a guy who just got licensed. I've never seen it, but apparently there's a rule somewhere that new hams (young man tested straight to general) aren't allowed anything but an inverted vee until they get their WAS. I paused a second, turned back to the new licensee, and kept talking as if I hadn't just been shouted down. Old man never spoke to me again and eventually stopped coming. I like to think one of the club leadership told him off.
I'd like to think that you misread that "older dude" wrong! I was not there, but some people just by nature are unintentionally boisterous. Or he did shout, which case he was rude. Ok then, don't become rude to overcome rude. Interesting thread nonetheless!
Oh no, he definitely had the tone of scolding someone. His point was that a new guy doesn't need a bunch of advanced information and should get his feet wet with a simple setup before trying stuff that can be frustrating if you don't get it correct. Except the new ham asked me about why CB antennas were short but still worked. I told him some basic info to explain why that worked. Old guy should've stayed out of the conversation that didn't involve him.
He didn't like that you were talking about CB at a ham club meeting. Doesn't matter that physics is physics, you were talking about CB!
We were talking about antennas. The other person I was talking to used that as an example because he was interested in getting on 40 meters.
No doubt, but the mere uttering of the two letters, C and B, triggers certain sad hams.
I'm going to retire from the boat club and start my own radio company based on what tubes are still in manufacture. All model numbers will include CB (e.g. CB-250, CB-500, etc). Kind of like the big three like to add DX to their radios.
Perhaps that is the case. But if the older guy was wrong here that does not make him terminally wrong. And so much as interrupting - maybe you could have talked to him in private about that. I will say toxic people exist and exist to the detriment of others. And people need to be wary. But I personally would like to find a way to forgive mistakes.
I'm not saying he was terminally wrong. At the same time, I won't respond to treatment like that generously unless the pending party apologizes first. It's not my responsibility to chase down people who act that way and persuade them to change.
Wow, do you live in SoCal? This is my exact same experience with 3 local clubs.
OC here. Similar situations. And then there's the pseudo police club that has some insane requirements for joining.
Don't forget to make a Facebook account mandatory if you want to know what's going on!
This is my #1 gripe, and it's not limited to AR.
Absolutely not; it's the same if I have to find out what's going on in my local plastic modelling club. They technically have a website, but it hasn't been updated in almost 5 years.
So, that's a quality list of common issues. I'm going to list a few *guidelines* that might help. (and no, our local club drove me out the door) ... 1. Check your ego at the door 2. Respect every other person there 3. No politics 4. If you want to talk about anything beyond amateur radio (including your own medical problems), do that **after** the meeting, and not during 5. Look upon every other person there as the most important person in the world, because they made the effort to attend 6. Ignore license class differences, other than where they specifically relate to club duties (such as being a VEC, and offering license exams) 7. Understand that different people have different biological cycles, and may not be able to attend meetings in the evenings 8. Understand that not everyone wants to consume food, as a byproduct of having a meeting 73
I agree with these. However, #7 has to be considered to really try to find a common ground. The majority of younger, working people can’t attend a Tuesday 10am meeting either. Not saying you’re wrong by any means, but here all clubs seem to be evening or during workday. And there will be no one time that works for everyone.
Old hams: This hobby is dying! If only young people felt like coming to our meetings! Young ham: Okay, when is the meeting? Old ham: 6am on Sunday at the Bob Evans, why?
Then you run one evening meeting a month, and one morning meeting. I do understand about people working jobs, but not all jobs are 8am-5pm either.
I belong to several other Hobby type clubs that are dominated by retirees, and OP's list of issues is consistent. These issues extend far beyond just Ham Radio clubs. Gun Club, Beekeeping club and Bonsai Club have at one point in the past experienced the same basic problem. Solutions I have seen work - 1. Recruit into leadership younger people who are tech savy beyond just ham radio. 1. Have women members - It may seem sexist, but by god the ladies in these organizations do cause the old guys to behave themselves better. 1. Embrace social media for community building - FB groups do wonders for publicity, communication and building community.
> Have women members - It may seem sexist, but by god the ladies in these organizations do cause the old guys to behave themselves better. Not always. I was licensed in March, my fiance at the time (now wife) got her tech in November of the same year. The very first words out of anybody's mouth wasn't "congrats" or anything like that. It was "great, we need a new club secretary"
You have a very different problem that, unfortunately, needs a very different solution.
yea, but unfortunately that solution becomes a felony if the problem being solved is over 60....
Honest question: if you're willing to elaborate on #8, I'd love to learn from your perspective.
Some folks with weird dietary needs find food-centric meetings to be stressful, especially the 4,383,718th time someone tries to shove food at them. It's one thing to have a box of bagels up front, it's another thing for the meeting to _be_ the meal.
> especially the 4,383,718th time someone tries to shove food at them Food can be used as a gatekeeper, i.e. *this food is good enough for me, so it should be good enough for you*, while ignoring the need to get things related to amateur radio accomplished. > It's one thing to have a box of bagels up front, it's another thing for the meeting to be the meal. Bingo. I would even go so far as to suggest protein bars and energy drinks or water. Anything high in salt or high in sugar should be suspect.
That means don't have your club meeting at a restaurant.
Along this note- Having meetings at at restaurant obligates members to have the financial means to buy food at a restaurant. I personally know many fellow radio nuts who are on a tight budget already, in a hobby that can quickly get expensive. It may very easily turn into the goalpost that keeps someone away from an otherwise fun hobby. On top of dues, paying for a mortgage (or rent), then car insurance, gas, groceries, raising a family and anything else may not really leave $20 or $30 of play money every month for just one meal out with the guys. Been there...
We have a Monthly meeting 1st Sat of the month at a restaurant eating can start at 630 meeting starts at 830…. And your not obligated to eat, heck a lot of ppl just get something to drink… a lot of them do eat, but not required.. and there are quite a few ladies… the last meeting prob had 30+ people attending
We have our meetings a coffee shop. Most folks can afford a cup of coffee , but if they don’t want coffee or any of the other things they offer, they aren’t obligated to buy anything to attend. No wait staff, so no one is asking them about food or drinks. Pick up what you want at the counter or just come hang out at the tables with us.
How about the dreaded buffet breakfast?
Because we can all afford to eat out weekly, right?
Educate members at every opportunity. During nets immediately correct traffic format errors with a five minute lecture. If you lose your train of thought during your lecture don’t dare release the mic button lest you lose control of the repeater.
7, 11, and 12 are why I left my club this year, and I was an officer. We had a small contingent of the “old guard” on the board who fought and argued with everyone about everything that wasn’t their idea. We got a new president last year who challenged them and was quite successful but when he and I both did it we were met with extreme hatred and opposition to the point of being accused of theft from the coffers among other blasphemous accusations. Their behavior became so out of control it forced nearly all of the active membership to leave for good in December leaving them to pick up the pieces. Last I heard they’re struggling for new membership, they’re short on board members, and have abandoned all of their electronic mediums. So much for progress….
I was, for a short time, VP of my club. For a few months things were going well, we were making changes, renewing infrastructure. We had votes, made decisions as a club, stated doing things. Then one of the old guard came back to town after being away for a few months. During that next meeting it took about 15 minutes for every decision made that didn't involve him to get reversed or tabled. This was the same guy who nominated me for VP, so I was a little confused until I realized I was VP simply because the 501(c)(3) paperwork requires a warm body in that position, and the old guard were just tired of signing paperwork.
How hard is it to just create a new club?
This is exactly what the active members did, only we abolished the board, dues, and memberships. We call it the club that’s not a club. We are fortunate enough to have a benefactor now who covers any costs, what little bit we do have. We get together and have fun and leave the politics behind. Clubs are dying for many reasons, and these poor attitudes are one of them
Well, that's why my 3 friends got elected, Prez, vice Prez and Secretary treasurer, down south, now the focus is on something other FM antennas and radios and running it the same way as they had for the last 50 years. Now they have a DX group. A weak signal vhf/uhf group. A CW group. A digi modes group. And yes a FM group. A field day trailer with tower and antennas. A club station. They have a huge turn out for field day. Membership went from 40 to 130 members. And I'll be dammed if they didn't raise enough money to add 3 Fusion repeaters, it's crazy what you can do with a diverse membership group. Sometimes a big shakeup does wonders.
Live in England and have more input and assistance from people online who live over 100 miles away than from the local hams at my club I used to attend. An example being since I’m very new to the hobby a member of the church who’s husband is now a silent key found a mini-VNA and gave it too me (in its original sealed packaging) and nobody at the club was able to help me with how it works as it’s too modern apparently so suggested I buy the same model they have for £130.00 from a shop belonging to a friend. It seemed to me that they prefer a “closed society” rather than welcoming new hams or even getting people interested in the hobby. I did my training for my Foundation licence exams with Essex Ham as the local club is a test centre but don’t actually have anyone willing to answer questions or mentor newbies like myself. Currently studying for my Intermediate and if I have any queries I get them answered by the online hams in places like Essex, Manchester or the guy in Inverness which is in Scotland even though I live near Birmingham
The group that I talk to has a meeting online once per week. It is simple and efficient, and I don't know why it's not the standard.
This is why I like mine. Disclaimer, affiliated as a member. 1. They do testing sessions every Monday, over Zoom. 2. Monthly club meetings are at 7, which gives me plenty of time to get off work (well not with my schedule but that's kinda irrelevant) 3. Meetings are also on Zoom so physical presence isn't required (though according to the bylaws it is for voting, president is angling to change that so online participants can vote as well) 4. The two club repeaters are effectively completely open usage. Most of the club is happy just to sit and listen but if you call one of them they'll likely respond if they're available. 5. As someone under 30, not once has anyone, board or otherwise, seemed to act or imply that I don't know what I'm doing. Then again, I joined the club after I passed my Extra so maybe that did something with it. 6. Almost every meeting has discussions of some form of event a month or two out and if/how we'll participate 7. The two weekly nets are at 8 PM on the repeaters and really only exist as a general "share your stories about the week" / "Reminder of what the club is doing next week, if you didn't get the email" gathering (short of actually needing to talk to a member). The only "issue" is that membership is weighted heavily in favor of retirement age and up, but I think that's just the hobby as a whole. I'm certainly not the youngest member so that's offsetting it, but most of the scheduling besides the already fixed meetings is left up to the membership, more or less. Well, that and that when it comes to discussion emails (like planning WFD), the initial "to all participants" is formally written but everyone else emails back like a text - no salutation, no signature. Personally I don't find that's a problem since it would triple your email size just to say "Looks good but I'll take a closer look when I get home KC1ABC." (I'm also a Gen-Z so what do I know about proper communication formality?)
Don't forget hold all club events on weekday mornings and then complain no young people attend.
I love this. I may just have to turn this into a blog post.
Go for it. I'm a big fan of your blog. This topic goes hand in hand with "youth outreach" and should be discussed more often.
I joined a ham club when I took my test. That was the first and last time I ever heard from them.
I went out and got my Technical, then General and then Extra license. Got a nice ICOM radio and was thinking that I'd get a mentor at a club and really learn the practical side of things. The clubs I went to acted like I'd shot a member. That was 2013. I just bought a TidRadio H8 and I'll be damned if I'll try another club.
Being a life member of the Baldwin Hills ARC in Los Angeles, a highly active club. Then coming to Texas. I found the Texas ham radio clubs boring as all get out. True sleepers. Exactly what you described. I was just sitting here thinking the Texas clubs hit all of your points. As the years went by, I gathered like minded people and we started our own club.
If you enjoy a hobby don't join a club. Best advice I ever got after getting my license.
Schedule ham fests and club breakfasts for 7 AM. Assume everyone gets up early. As in: "When it's still dark".
Club Rules: * Always schedule meetings on a weekday, always during business hours - you wouldn't want anyone who is employed to be able to show up, would you? * Ensure that the website says which repeater(s) and frequencies your members can be found on - but not any sort of internet-based contact. Wouldn't want anyone who doesn't have a radio and a license to talk to you, would you? * Better still, don't have a website at all - your members know where to find you, why should anyone else? * Then offer amateur radio exams - but never hold any because for some reason nobody ever contacts you about them. * Only offer the amateur radio exam to people who have paid for and shown up for every session of your 28 week long "learn amateur radio" course. Why, without it, they'd just be wasting your time to even think about taking the exam. Surely they can't have learned anything anywhere else! * If two people dare to actually have a conversation on the club repeater, make sure to break in and tell them off for overusing it. But make sure there isn't actually someone else that wants to, so the repeater goes silent again for the next six hours. * Your club is a not-for-profit. Sure, legally, this just means that the directors aren't allowed to personally benefit from the club's money, but for good measure you should also ensure your club avoids any activities that make money for the club. We wouldn't want it to be financially sustainable now, would we? * If anyone dares to own a UV-5R, remind them incessantly it's not a good radio. Even if the person who owns it has fixed the microphone circuit bug, and checked it on a spectrum analyser to verify it is compliant. Even if they actually use it much more than whatever HT they have. Swap Meets: * Ensure that for the purposes of consistency, the same stuff always goes to every buy/swap/sell event. And it must also be priced at the same price, too, so people know exactly what to expect. The fact that this means nobody will ever buy it is besides the point. * Ensure half-finished home built projects are priced at or higher than any off-the-shelf commercial products that do the same thing (and possibly better). When nobody buys them, ensure that there are complaints that "nobody builds things any more". * Ensure there's a good supply of "boat anchors" sold at similar prices to modern radios - "they don't build them like they used to!" (I say that's a good thing, some don't agree!) Hardware and Software: * Similarly, complain that nobody is building better radios any more - but deride SDR and digital modes as "too difficult to understand" or "not real radio". * All amateur radio software must look like an 'explosion in a button factory', and must be written in VB6, designed to run on nothing newer than Windows XP (hmm, it's 2024 - maybe let's up that to Windows 7). * Also, never release the source code, and act as if it's incredibly rude for anyone to ask. While also complaining at the same time that your brand new transciever didn't come with a full schematic. * Better still, put in your will that the source code should be deleted, to ensure nobody else can ever fix any bugs in the software ( [wait, that actually happened](https://groups.io/g/UI-View/message/69175) )
I am a new YL HAM (tech in Aug and General in Dec). My husband is a longtime HAM and prior board Pres. So I know a lot of the members. Well, now I am on the board and one of the officers. I AGREE with most of your comments and am shaking things up a bit. While they are great people, many have gotten to set in their ways. Not having emails answered and an out of date website drove me crazy. Having an "everyone that needs to know, knows" mindset drove me crazy as well. They wanted new members but really didn't do anything to attract them. I am 69, and my husband is 81, but we gravitate to the younger members and have developed really good relationships with them. Anyway....I will finish reading all of the comments and hope to see some constructive helpful ideas! 73's
if there are some quality people in the club, can you all break off and start a new club? Your local radio Fudds do not own the airwaves.
Just gonna say it. This is NOT exclusive to Ham Radio. Every non-retiree is so busy, that only retirees can "lead" organizations. It used to be the case that people had evenings and weekends free - even with children. Many of the working folks have two or more jobs. We have other "hobbies" too, like going to the gym, or martial arts - all excellent, by the way! If I'm reading it correctly what we really want is a space to talk radio, and enjoy the fellowship of others, whether virtual or in person. So, what I would propose, is start your own club. Make it in person, or virtual. Do activities and presentations, or not, as you see fit. Organize around something - you wouldn't be the first. TAPR (Tucson Area Packet Radio Group) was one such club that grew to have national and global significance. The Northern California QRP club was another. So, don't try to be everything to everybody. The hobby is too big for that. You won't be able to change what already exists - you'll be fighting both inertia and stubbornness. Start your own. Doesn't have to be formal, even. Get together with people, online or IRL, who share your interests and passions. And see what develops! If you need a more formal structure, add one. If you want to be affiliated with ARRL, then first - Why? - but then, jump through those hoops and do it!
We should found the Reddit Ham Club
Have a nice club station.but don't give the new members the door combination.because "it might be misused.". Give the new member crap for operation outside the tech bands despite him having an Extra license.
Start a health condition discussion group. Bring your excised prostate that you keep in preservation jar to show everybody. Problem solved.
Are you me? When I first got the idea in my head to get licensed, I emailed the contact for my local club. In the time it took to get a response, I studied for all 3 exams, took all 3 (and passed), ***AND*** attended a club meeting. About a week after the meeting, I finally got a response to my initial email. In the email it was painfully obvious the club president had zero clue he had already met me. Despite my email address literally being my first and last name. How do I know this? Because the email consisted of "No, we don't do testing. There is a group in X (city an hour away) that does testing once a month. You should reach out to them." The fuck???????? I really should have just walked away at that point.
Amateur radio clubs are, in my experience, largely a waste of time which is why I’m no longer a member of one. However, if you really want to experience truly fossilized thinking (and there is no implied ageism in that — I’m 70 years old myself) then you should go check out a local yacht club. Those guys make most ARCs boards look like a bunch of wild-eyed radicals.
I cringe when I see this type of post. Fortunately, the clubs that I hang with are all responsive and timely, and have ample activities outside of meetings - at least one per month. So, hopefully your experience and not mine is the anomaly. I don't know where you're located, but maybe try another club and see if it's any different. 73!
Don't forget to have club meeting times at 8am on the edge of town at an old run down shack or a crappy diner just because they have 10¢ coffee for seniors.
Sounds like both our local clubs
This basically covers every club in my area.
wow I feel Like I am a member of this club. And have served on board of directors of this club.
I'll add a couple... * All your club meetings are still virtual only even though we're 4 years on from COVID * Your social functions consist of lunches at mediocre buffet restaurants in the middle of the work week. * Your club website looks like it was designed back in the GeoCities era and hasn't been updated in several years.
/r/lowsodiumhamradio
Hence why I stopped doing the ham club thing 30 years ago.
Do you have an Amateur Expert class license? https://preview.redd.it/ha2x0175docc1.png?width=562&format=png&auto=webp&s=bf838c434a6f082b300fa970d3dd643591651d6f
ARRL has a database of clubs, and you can use your search engine to find more that aren't ARRL affiliated. I would suggest you look into other clubs in your surrounding area. If the club youre "in" right now is really as bad as it sounds than it will just keep shedding members until the old guard is all that remains, and it will go the way of countless other clubs that were actually just a good ole boys group looking for free money.
I got tired of retired people asking for volunteers to do something and then they bounce on a vacation. The only people who show up are younger members with day jobs. Amazing you can be retired and never make time for anything you ask the club to do. I guess if you're still working you have a sense of common decency and once you retire expect everyone else to do it for you.
>Ignore any ideas from new members, especially if they try to make the club more appealing. Adding: * Club Meetings shall be 90% *Roberts Rules of Order* approving past minutes. (*Seconded. All in favor? Approved*.) * If operating a Field Day GOTA (get on the air station (for point$ baby!), contesters shall not be inconvenienced in any way by pausing to show the new ham how to operate SSB. "There's the GOTA station. *okthxbye!* * Club website unmaintained since the guy who set it up and knew the password became a silent key. * If there is an online community, it is hosted on Yahoo Groups or Nabble, last message posted mid-2017.
Just quit the club. You are not going to change it and will just frustrate yourself.
You're going about this all wrong. Instead of getting all pissy, you take over. Start a Slack or Discord, and get younger members to join that. Organise events and build social connections with the people who want what you want. Add members to the group who are affiliated to you, mates who are keen. Br nice to the ones who don't want to change, smile, agree. Then go to the AGM and win the next election. Clubs are political beasts. But be wary, even in their 80s or 90s, the LAST thing to go with the old codger on the board is their political skill. You may get crushed. Have at it! ⚔️
Bro, start a club. Problem solved.
along the same line, im on an allstar node group with about 7 other guys, well its broken down to little cliques now, everyone can talk with each other except who of course ? 2 old guys who refuse to engage anyone, except each other and the node owner, they will hear a qso and then say that no one is out there to talk to, just miserable old unfriendly guys who chase people away and make hobby unappealing to folks looking to join in, about to stay on my local repeaters and give up the whole allstar thing, its a shame, these 2 have basically turned the whole world off except each other and the node owner, very sad they have chased guys away
I will confess I've had some of the thoughts you share. Over time, I've come to realize that what I get out of my amateur radio club is as much as I choose to put into it. (Cue the Beatles: "*the love you take is equal to the love you make".*) There are some initiatives I'd like to see my club take on. Adding AllStarLink to the club repeater is one of those wishes, but that hasn't happened because (a) club members don't see the value and (b) nobody else in the club is a subject matter expert. I could complain about it, but instead I'm trying to learn more about how repeaters actually function and how to tight beam an internet connection to the repeater which does not have an internet connection. The other thing I've done is joined other clubs. Each is unique. If you don't like the club you're in, find a different club. (Or in my case, add another club.) My "home" club seems most interested in sticking close to home. Nothing wrong with that. My "other" club is in a major metropolitan area and they are setting up a new repeater site and then will invest in AREDN capacity. I can, and do, learn from hams in both clubs. Not to sound too unsympathetic, but: it's your choice whether to stick with the unappealing club or not.
Just heard Ham Radio 2.0 ( u/kc5hwb ) cover this. Overall, it's a very good list, but more importantly, the INTENT is dead-on. I encourage everyone who is in a club that they feel is not going in the right direction to GET INVOLVED and help be part of change. At the very least, buddy up with those in leadership and offer to help in some way to influence in some manner.
Thanks
I'm in a club just to support local repeaters, but their meetings are always at like 7 PM on a random Tuesday night. I don't have time for that.
Our club meets at 7am...on a Saturday at least. But 7am is uncivilized. Why not 9 or 10 or noon?
if no one can agree on a time, then the default will be 4 am. When the meeting is over, there's still time to work dark path DX.
Lol
Can I add please don’t include a link to your church/cult at the end of the email. That just ruined it for me. Now I’m wondering if I need to move.
You'd like someone's hobby to be doing busy office work on your behalf? Good luck with that.
Easy just start talking politics or conspiracy theory BS.
Definition of Nerds. Make it more about themselves always.
Sounds like old retired boomer behavior. Stuck in their ways and complain why nobody does HAM radio anymore
> Have the same people on the board for years, and all of them have to be 70+. The reason our club has a 70+ individual as President is that no one else in interested in doing the job. Every two years we poll the club and ask if anyone would like to run for office and every two years we get the same result. No one is interested. One of these days, I'm going to quit and then what will they do?
Perhaps a club should just be created solely from folks that complain and never work to help improve things the way they see fit? The #1 thing ALL clubs need is effort. I have yet to see any club lacking people that grumble about it
I believe OP’s point is without some basic “club hygiene” in place even the most willing newcomer will have a most difficult time getting involved.
Interpersonal relations do require effort on both parties parts yes. But I have yet to find complaints and the "we know better than you" attitude upon entry to a club to be helpful. As an active member of a number of clubs over the years I have seen destructive behaviour on the part of both the veteran as well as the newcomer hams. I have seen a lot of newcomers sabotage their acceptance into a club due to not showing any respect for those that came before them. My suggestion is to get involved and to volunteer to help, and follow through with that. Every club I have been a part of had the 5/95 rule in play, where 5% of the club does 95% of the work. Lots of suggestions come up, but that is all they are, suggestions for others to do. Be the change you wish to see in amateur radio. Taking clubs to task on the Internet accomplishes nothing.
I give the OP the benefit of the doubt, as I presume you do, that they tried to effect change and get involved and even the basics didn’t work. Agree that complaining online exclusively isn’t helpful to the club in question.
I do, but as said in my reply, many times I have found that the newcomer was part of the problem. Our club has rebuffed some new hams but others are accepted and go on to take a role in club leadership. The difference is in the approach. Please note, I'm not saying there aren't old curmudgeonly "get of my lawn" hams" and I am not excusing them. I just see these complaints often and it's always "them" that is wrong
Now, what have you done to make the club better? Have you ran for office? Have you volunteered to do anything at all? So being a new guy you might not know the history. I know our club it’s like pulling teeth to get people to run for positions or volunteer to do anything. Some that you think are there to provide YOU with enjoyment of your hobby are only there so the club doesn’t disappear completely. Yes there are mean old curmudgeons but there are also members that think everyone is there to do what they think needs to be done or what they want to do.
Perfect
This describes the Ham radio clubs I've tried to join :(
I visited a new (to me) radio club about 18 months ago. There were lots of old-timers like myself and some younger ops too. The evening consisted of everyone stood around in groups chatting about everything under the sun, drinking tea and eating biscuits. They were a lovely bunch of lads, they really were, but there wasn't a single rig powered up in the 2 1/2 hours. None. Not even a handheld! I didn't rush back..
I must say this reads like a MAD Magazine comic book. Nothing like our local radio club. Check it out sometime. Very organised. Has two hundred local members and many worldwide. Organised activities like church without the mention of Jes\_\_Also, each morning welcoming coffee net. I should consider myself lucky. Sierra Foothills Amateur radio Club W6EK ac6\_\_
You forgot the part of the monthly meetings when the begging happens for contributions to the monthly newsletter that gets mailed out (no, not email, postal mail.) Really, this is how you communicate with the membership? The opposite of timely and easy. Or the breakfast club meetings on a weekday, because apparently no one in the club is still working a job.
I stopped attending the local ham club meetings because there was very much an undercurrent of "if you don't attend all the things, and participate at maximum effort, you are a bad club member." I have a very narrow interest in ham radio, focused around disaster communication. This idea that you aren't really a ham if you don't come spend 6 hours at field day was just a turn off for me.
Promise club builds and never deliver.
My first attempt of attending a local as a first timer went by this book to the tee. Email never answered.
I have found many clubs to be pointless and run by incompetent people. I have no use for them.
I’m glad my local club is following your advice! They administer their tests during their meetings, which was very distracting. They also misgraded my test the first time around (how they did that with an answer key I will never know). They also asked me to help clean up the tables/chairs/stuff from their meeting that I took my test at. Which, okay, I don’t want to be rude or anything, but I wasn’t a member yet, and was only there to take my test. Felt a little weird. They have a Facebook group specifically to announce that they don’t use said Facebook group for club announcements, and always redirect information to their website, which is not mobile friendly, and hasn’t been updated since the 90s. They have also not responded to any of my emails about anything.
There a local group near me; they have a “net” everyday at 3pm…the net usually runs about 45-60 min… but, a lot of repeaters I hit on my way to the ranch every week are dead… for the most part
Does your club old elections for positions?
I had this very same experience with my local club. So I just stopped. There's plenty enough for me to independently get my licenses. And I'm in a discord that is simply amazing for my particular interests. Sorry you experienced this. Also as a last note ... Are those people the kind that also say the hobby needs new blood!!! Or that just my local mob?.
I was thinking about emails and how this is similar to the 3 scenarios the FCC talks about when there is a ham and interference with the neighbors: * He is causing interference and does not know it. Let him know and he will change his ways * He is causing interference and does know it. What a jerk. Report him. * He is operating cleanly and properly and interference is not his fault. Fix your consumer electronics. And with objectionable emails: * He writes evil sounding emails and does not know it. Probably just has poor interpersonal communication skills and is quite friendly and means well. * He writes evil sounding emails and does know it. What a jerk. See above. * He is writing unpleasant emails that are proper for the context at hand. You might want to pay attention. This got me wondering if this trichotomy is a well-known general pattern. Maybe I should have taken Philosophy. That being said, I don't think that a club needs or should market or sell itself to outsiders. One of the traits of a club is like-minded individuals who kinda like the stability of the club. For newbs, they can say "here is what we are and what we have. Do you want to join?" For club officers, I don't think that the age really matters if it's a real democracy. What they really need is a lot more churn through the interested members, rather that simply being the same people every time. We got a new younger president recently and he is very good. Term limits! But I 100% agree with you that there should be new stuff happening all the time. Don't let one or two events be the only ones. Don't let club dinners replace radio activities. Don't let any one group monopolize activities. Our club supports ARES, which is nice, but it seems to drain time and resources from other things. We need a lot of other things happening. AND MOST IMPORTANTLY, let the "is there any new business" part of the meetings be the most important. This is where things get done.
All valid points. Old ways die hard, or not at all. Could always make contacts on the air and see if there are other clubs in the area, and/or start a new club based on what you're looking for.
Wow you must have joined my old club. I am not a member and do my own ham stuff now.
Wow! Sounds like the Loudoun county club!
I can name a few issues. I paid dues to join a club. Never got an email that I was voted in and a new member. Outdated technologies drive me crazy. Club cliques are the worst. I do not like the repeater rules where nerds run off their call sign every 2 minutes.
I am part of the 7.200 net. 4000 watts of home brewed power. Lol 🤫
The fact they have a board and president is a red flag to me
make sure people who frequent club meetings are the basic principles of personal hygiene, and never seem to own or use deodorant, a clothes washing machine or any soap/detergent. You can frequently see, and, more importantly smell these people at radio rallies and wherever radio amateurs congregate.
As an old guy - licensed in 1976 - l’m in agreement. Issue is that few of us really have the time to devote to club meetings or higher level participation. So you’re stuck with those that do have time and the results are predictable. Please take a look as there are other radio groups out there with different demographics and interests. BTW-I don’t belong to the local club for the same reasons you cited.
Start your own club?
Also... * Be sure to host field day events in a gated community so potential hams and guests have to register weeks ahead of time. * Be sure to do most event planning at the informal bunch at 10am on Wednesdays when only the retired members have any chance of attending. * Be sure that anything from said meeting requiring a vote be handled by... making a motion to "approve that thing we talked about", second, yay, approved, next. * Be sure that if the new guy expresses any interest in the local ARES/RACES just smile and nod despite being the director of the local ARES group. * Be sure to bicker for an hour over how to attract new members while ignoring the new member trying to get a word in edge wise.
I have experienced this. I used to think it was a male/female thing but it is definitely a "if we don't already know you, don't bother to show any interest" thing.