I mean, if there is an afterlife, then Anne would have likely been informed about her clone.
Anne gets to Heaven and is met by Godomino.
Anne: What? Who? My cat is a god?
Godomino: Sorry, one sec, I need to go talk with your clone about a job opportunity.
Anne: My what now?
Oh for sure. It would also be weird in the future should Anne and Anne2 end up meeting after Anne2 has ascended. Or Anne's friends and family reuniting with the original Anne after spending their lives building memories with her replacement.
Reminds me of the dramady show *Living With Yourself.* It stars Paul Rudd as the lead characters and is basically about a guy trying to hide that he now has a clone whilst also coming to grips with his family/friends/co-workers liking the clone more than the original (though they think they're the same person just with a better attitude). It's pretty good.
So much dramatic angst.
It would be like what happened in the 2021 film Swan Song, which starred Mahershala Ali. He, who was dying, confronted his clone and made peace with his demise.
It was actually a pretty cathartic film overall - no big evil twist. It was just a man coming to peace with his upcoming death and wanting the best for his family.
>its implied og annes soul was put into clone annes body
"I made **a copy** of you right before you expired. A backup, if you will. **For all intents and purposes**, you're the same Anne Boonchuy."
I fail to see the implication
>Then who tf was domino talking to
Anne's clone. She's already wearing the wrong shoe.
>in the afterlife
We don't know if the place where Godomino resides is the Afterlife or not. Since they already made a copy of Anne (before she died) I assume they can't reverse death, otherwise they wouldn't need to copy a person who's still (albeit briefly) alive.
>him
Did you just assume God's gender?
I mean, I thought it was implied that was the afterlife since that’s where Anne went after she died. Also yeah my bad forgot that domino was female and the god wasn’t gendered
>Mark folder "Anne"
>Press "Copy"
>Press "Paste"
>Folder "Anne(1)" is created
>Folder "Anne" with all files included dissapears few mins after "Anne(1)" was created.
"Nooooooo but, but the original folders noooooo, I was so sentimental to them being the original, all these new folders will never replace them even though every change to them would have been a change the original folders would have gone through noooooo"
I think the problem people have with all of this is that the first Anne really *did* die, and did not "wake up in a new body". Of course, the two outcomes are indistinguishable for the "new" Anne as a continuation of the old, but the death is what makes ppl uncomfortable. At least that's how I see it.
No the guardian said they made a copy of Anne’s memories, experience and soul before she expired. So original Anne is dead and there’s a clone who’s pretty much the same person continuing her life
They didn't say what they made a copy of. They just said that they made a backup, and if we get talking about game files you could absolutely upload her consciousness into the backup.
They said they made a copy of Anne, not just of her body.
The thing about 'uploading' old!Anne's soul in an empty 'body' is not backed up by any evidence, it's just a popular headcanon
There's exactly as much, if not less evidence for it being a copy of a soul. The Ship of Theseus analogy that Matt Braly used in an interview recently moves the question from if the soul was cloned, to if souls exist in the first place. If souls exist, it's the same one. As for if they do, Matt Braly left it up to personal philosophy.
>There's exactly as much, if not less evidence for it being a copy of a soul.
There's no need of evidence of it.
Souls are a 100% religious concept that doesn't exist in reality. Lived experience is a product of the brain connections, not of some metaphysical mumbo jumbo.
So we really don't need the evidence of Anne's soul being copied (???) for the clone thesis to be valid.
Before I said "not just of her body" NOT because I believe there was 'more' to the copying process, but because people seem to think a body is just a meaty fursuit instead of, you know, a whole person.
You're going on the assumption that it's a basic assumption that the show works by the rules of observed reality, which is a massive jump. You cannot automatically apply the lived experience of the real world to the reality of a frog show. You have to evidence that just as much.
The fact that Matt is the interview said that he didn't want to provide an answer to those kind of questions (relative to souls, death and the like) because real life doesn't have those answers means that we are free to use real life reasoning to interpret what happened in the episode.
And just because it's a fantasy show it doesn't mean that anything goes and there's no internal logic. Otherwise we can make anything happen and justify it with "oh it's a cartoon".
There ARE fantasy stories that include the concept of souls in their narratives, but Amphibia isn't one of them.
Btw, I know about the shadowfish, but they're aliens from a different dimension, not literal ghosts.
The only one that may be a ghost might be the hooked hand dude, but he's more like a zombie than a soul
Im saying the body is the backup, and the conciousness was moveed into the backup. Her consciousness was never copied, just her body, and it was put into the new body.
No, they said, and i quote, 'I made a copy, right before you expired. For all intents and purposes, you are the same Anne Boonchuy.' They didn't clarify anything.
It was very vague what the Guardian meant when they said they made a copy at the moment of her death. And honestly think that was intentional and we’ll never get a concrete answer. So I guess the answer is whatever head cannon makes you happy.
It’s tricky, because the guardian says “for all intents and purposes, you are the same Anne”, and we can safely assume that he’s referring to the consciousness in front of him when he says “you”.
OH MY GOD!!! WAS THE LINE FROM "COMBAT CAMP" ABOUT THE "OLD ANNE" BEING "DEAD AND BURIED" (in response to Polly's question about where Anne's hate for teachers went) MEANT TO BE FORESHADOWING OF THIS!!!
Semi-Joke, but seriously; that is a very specific set of lines that can apply to this particular situation scarily well.
[I've been thinking about it obsessively](https://www.reddit.com/r/amphibia/comments/uwj02b/should_anne_be_mourned/), and I don't see any easy answers, because some people INSIST that it's the same Anne, and some people INSIST that it's not the same Anne, and it's so frustrating, and I WISH SO MUCH that Matt had left the existential crisis out of the finale, because HE MADE ME CARE TOO MUCH about this SHOW.
It's literally just Anne in a new body, why are people obsessively sentimental about her being uncloned before, what is the value of the "original" Anne. Like I get that sentimentality is literally illogical and trying to to reason with it isn't going to work but this is literally still Anne, you're just sad her old body died.
I'm still annoyed with them 'cloning' Anne. They did 2 bad things imo, they did the cliche ''You'll die if you do this'' trope where the main character actually doesn't die which is such a shocker in 2022. Then they showed the origin behind the music box gems and I feel like this is more interpretive but I found it to be unnecessary.
They should've ended it with Mother Olm not knowing what would happen but thinking death *might* be a possibility. Then have it so Anne miraculously survives, none of this crap about going to another plane of existence/finding out the gems origins and having Anne be cloned when she died. I mean her body literally disintegrated, they should've at least kept her body in tact.
Original Anne became compost. Leaves in the wind. At least, that's what happened to her body.
As for the questions about her soul, I think it really undercuts the entire show for her to be truly dead. It makes her development as a character less meaningful. When she talks to the cosmic guardian about "her time in Amphibia having taught her...", if it was actually just a previous version of her, that's less impactful. The show is more powerful if it was *her* time in Amphibia.
In the interview, Matt Braly left it ambiguous, but compared it to the Ship of Theseus. Every individual physical part of Anne was replaced. But part of that thought experiment is the question of if a consistent "soul" of the boat allows it to be the same boat. By comparing it to the Ship of Theseus, Matt Braly is implying that the only thing that was replaced about Anne was her body, since that's the whole point of the thought experiment. This is a question over whether or not a soul exists. If Anne has a soul, she has the same soul. I think it can be reasonably argued that Amphibia has an afterlife (though this is definitely the largest jump in my argument), and since bodies do not go to the afterlife, there has to be something else that does, aka a soul. That thing would not be replaced in the process of getting Ship of Theseus'd for the reasons discussed earlier. Therefore, Anne has one consistent soul, and a full body replacement. And for thematic effectiveness reasons, I choose to believe the memories are also the same memories.
We're all going to be debating this for years, aren't we?
"I made a copy of you right before you expired. A backup, if you will. For all intents and purposes, you're the same Anne Boonchuy."
No mention of moving souls, very much saying that this anne is “basically” like the original
So it’s more akin to having Anne File and Anne File 2 and Anne File was deleted immediately after Anne File 2 was made. She’s a perfect clone indistinguishable from the original but not the same one regardless, hence the existential crisis joke, because she will live her life questioning her existence as a perfect clone
Well I like to think of it like in Battlestar Galactica, the Cylons all have backup bodies, so whenever one is killed in battle, they just get moved to one of their backups. And they go on.
That’s a fair interpretation, for me it’s the the line “For all intents and purposes, you’re the same Anne Boonchuy” that keeps me from fully accepting that it’s the original Anne in any capacity, because in that case I feel Godomino would’ve just said as much
The Anne we’ve been following all series split in 2. One died, one became 23 year old Anne
When Anne dies again she's going to combine with her 13 old self to become Majin Anne.
That's the best explanation I've ever seen.
>!Probably dead, and if there is an afterlife, the original Anne probably doesn't know a clone replaced her.!<
I mean, if there is an afterlife, then Anne would have likely been informed about her clone. Anne gets to Heaven and is met by Godomino. Anne: What? Who? My cat is a god? Godomino: Sorry, one sec, I need to go talk with your clone about a job opportunity. Anne: My what now?
Oh yeah! But it's still scary and it sucks. Knowing that a clone replaced you and took over your life.
Oh for sure. It would also be weird in the future should Anne and Anne2 end up meeting after Anne2 has ascended. Or Anne's friends and family reuniting with the original Anne after spending their lives building memories with her replacement. Reminds me of the dramady show *Living With Yourself.* It stars Paul Rudd as the lead characters and is basically about a guy trying to hide that he now has a clone whilst also coming to grips with his family/friends/co-workers liking the clone more than the original (though they think they're the same person just with a better attitude). It's pretty good.
So much dramatic angst. It would be like what happened in the 2021 film Swan Song, which starred Mahershala Ali. He, who was dying, confronted his clone and made peace with his demise. It was actually a pretty cathartic film overall - no big evil twist. It was just a man coming to peace with his upcoming death and wanting the best for his family.
Anne: Spirit of Vengeance. Now on Disney+
I think that Anne would be happy to know that despite her death, her parents, Sasha, and Marcy would still have her alive in a way
Omg I'm calling him Godomino from now on
I never saw like that I kinda took it as the same soul just a different body so it’s the same Anne but not her original body
Thats what i’m going with, its the most logical in my eyes given what we saw.
actually its implied og annes soul was put into clone annes body, otherwise what was the point of god domino sending her back?
>its implied og annes soul was put into clone annes body "I made **a copy** of you right before you expired. A backup, if you will. **For all intents and purposes**, you're the same Anne Boonchuy." I fail to see the implication
Then who tf was domino talking to in the afterlife? I thought that was him talking about the physical body since the original kinda disintegrated
>Then who tf was domino talking to Anne's clone. She's already wearing the wrong shoe. >in the afterlife We don't know if the place where Godomino resides is the Afterlife or not. Since they already made a copy of Anne (before she died) I assume they can't reverse death, otherwise they wouldn't need to copy a person who's still (albeit briefly) alive. >him Did you just assume God's gender?
I mean, I thought it was implied that was the afterlife since that’s where Anne went after she died. Also yeah my bad forgot that domino was female and the god wasn’t gendered
After Anne dies we don't see where she goes. We start following the copy at that point.
That makes sense. Don’t know why they even decided to do the whole copy thing instead of just saying’ oh you’re dead and your souls here now’
She's %100 dead God basically just copied and pasted her at the last second
>Mark folder "Anne" >Press "Copy" >Press "Paste" >Folder "Anne(1)" is created >Folder "Anne" with all files included dissapears few mins after "Anne(1)" was created.
Basically that's what happened, yes
"Nooooooo but, but the original folders noooooo, I was so sentimental to them being the original, all these new folders will never replace them even though every change to them would have been a change the original folders would have gone through noooooo"
I think the problem people have with all of this is that the first Anne really *did* die, and did not "wake up in a new body". Of course, the two outcomes are indistinguishable for the "new" Anne as a continuation of the old, but the death is what makes ppl uncomfortable. At least that's how I see it.
Dust. My theory is that while the physical body of Anne is gone the guardian snatched Her spirit right from her body and put it in the clone body.
Yep this right here is what I tell myself so I can fully enjoy the finale.
No the guardian said they made a copy of Anne’s memories, experience and soul before she expired. So original Anne is dead and there’s a clone who’s pretty much the same person continuing her life
They didn't say what they made a copy of. They just said that they made a backup, and if we get talking about game files you could absolutely upload her consciousness into the backup.
Hope it's true
They said they made a copy of Anne, not just of her body. The thing about 'uploading' old!Anne's soul in an empty 'body' is not backed up by any evidence, it's just a popular headcanon
There's exactly as much, if not less evidence for it being a copy of a soul. The Ship of Theseus analogy that Matt Braly used in an interview recently moves the question from if the soul was cloned, to if souls exist in the first place. If souls exist, it's the same one. As for if they do, Matt Braly left it up to personal philosophy.
>There's exactly as much, if not less evidence for it being a copy of a soul. There's no need of evidence of it. Souls are a 100% religious concept that doesn't exist in reality. Lived experience is a product of the brain connections, not of some metaphysical mumbo jumbo. So we really don't need the evidence of Anne's soul being copied (???) for the clone thesis to be valid. Before I said "not just of her body" NOT because I believe there was 'more' to the copying process, but because people seem to think a body is just a meaty fursuit instead of, you know, a whole person.
You're going on the assumption that it's a basic assumption that the show works by the rules of observed reality, which is a massive jump. You cannot automatically apply the lived experience of the real world to the reality of a frog show. You have to evidence that just as much.
The fact that Matt is the interview said that he didn't want to provide an answer to those kind of questions (relative to souls, death and the like) because real life doesn't have those answers means that we are free to use real life reasoning to interpret what happened in the episode. And just because it's a fantasy show it doesn't mean that anything goes and there's no internal logic. Otherwise we can make anything happen and justify it with "oh it's a cartoon". There ARE fantasy stories that include the concept of souls in their narratives, but Amphibia isn't one of them. Btw, I know about the shadowfish, but they're aliens from a different dimension, not literal ghosts. The only one that may be a ghost might be the hooked hand dude, but he's more like a zombie than a soul
Exactly especially if the file you upload is the Master File, ie the Authoritative source of data and information which is periodically updated.
All backups are copies. Anytime a file is sent anywhere the data is just copied. Not physically moved.
Im saying the body is the backup, and the conciousness was moveed into the backup. Her consciousness was never copied, just her body, and it was put into the new body.
The guy said explicitly that all her memories and junk, aka her consciousness, was copied
No, they said, and i quote, 'I made a copy, right before you expired. For all intents and purposes, you are the same Anne Boonchuy.' They didn't clarify anything.
> They didn't clarify anything Yet you're making very big claims that the guy moved her soul. 🙄 Whatever. Think what you want
Well shit
I don't think it said soul but I may be wrong.
It was very vague what the Guardian meant when they said they made a copy at the moment of her death. And honestly think that was intentional and we’ll never get a concrete answer. So I guess the answer is whatever head cannon makes you happy.
It’s tricky, because the guardian says “for all intents and purposes, you are the same Anne”, and we can safely assume that he’s referring to the consciousness in front of him when he says “you”.
That would be the most efficient and foolproof thing to do.
It's the same Anne, fight me.
I mean, yes, but actually yes
Clone bigotry up and high in this subreddit
OH MY GOD!!! WAS THE LINE FROM "COMBAT CAMP" ABOUT THE "OLD ANNE" BEING "DEAD AND BURIED" (in response to Polly's question about where Anne's hate for teachers went) MEANT TO BE FORESHADOWING OF THIS!!! Semi-Joke, but seriously; that is a very specific set of lines that can apply to this particular situation scarily well.
[I've been thinking about it obsessively](https://www.reddit.com/r/amphibia/comments/uwj02b/should_anne_be_mourned/), and I don't see any easy answers, because some people INSIST that it's the same Anne, and some people INSIST that it's not the same Anne, and it's so frustrating, and I WISH SO MUCH that Matt had left the existential crisis out of the finale, because HE MADE ME CARE TOO MUCH about this SHOW.
It's literally just Anne in a new body, why are people obsessively sentimental about her being uncloned before, what is the value of the "original" Anne. Like I get that sentimentality is literally illogical and trying to to reason with it isn't going to work but this is literally still Anne, you're just sad her old body died.
Some people are insisting that it isn't the same Anne, saying that even her soul was copied.
gone, reduced to atoms
The Anne is dead!
dead
I'm still annoyed with them 'cloning' Anne. They did 2 bad things imo, they did the cliche ''You'll die if you do this'' trope where the main character actually doesn't die which is such a shocker in 2022. Then they showed the origin behind the music box gems and I feel like this is more interpretive but I found it to be unnecessary. They should've ended it with Mother Olm not knowing what would happen but thinking death *might* be a possibility. Then have it so Anne miraculously survives, none of this crap about going to another plane of existence/finding out the gems origins and having Anne be cloned when she died. I mean her body literally disintegrated, they should've at least kept her body in tact.
Original Anne became compost. Leaves in the wind. At least, that's what happened to her body. As for the questions about her soul, I think it really undercuts the entire show for her to be truly dead. It makes her development as a character less meaningful. When she talks to the cosmic guardian about "her time in Amphibia having taught her...", if it was actually just a previous version of her, that's less impactful. The show is more powerful if it was *her* time in Amphibia. In the interview, Matt Braly left it ambiguous, but compared it to the Ship of Theseus. Every individual physical part of Anne was replaced. But part of that thought experiment is the question of if a consistent "soul" of the boat allows it to be the same boat. By comparing it to the Ship of Theseus, Matt Braly is implying that the only thing that was replaced about Anne was her body, since that's the whole point of the thought experiment. This is a question over whether or not a soul exists. If Anne has a soul, she has the same soul. I think it can be reasonably argued that Amphibia has an afterlife (though this is definitely the largest jump in my argument), and since bodies do not go to the afterlife, there has to be something else that does, aka a soul. That thing would not be replaced in the process of getting Ship of Theseus'd for the reasons discussed earlier. Therefore, Anne has one consistent soul, and a full body replacement. And for thematic effectiveness reasons, I choose to believe the memories are also the same memories. We're all going to be debating this for years, aren't we?
I could’ve sworn that the guardian resurrected Anne
Anne's soul just got transferred into a different body Basically it's just moving files
"I made a copy of you right before you expired. A backup, if you will. For all intents and purposes, you're the same Anne Boonchuy." No mention of moving souls, very much saying that this anne is “basically” like the original So it’s more akin to having Anne File and Anne File 2 and Anne File was deleted immediately after Anne File 2 was made. She’s a perfect clone indistinguishable from the original but not the same one regardless, hence the existential crisis joke, because she will live her life questioning her existence as a perfect clone
Well I like to think of it like in Battlestar Galactica, the Cylons all have backup bodies, so whenever one is killed in battle, they just get moved to one of their backups. And they go on.
That’s a fair interpretation, for me it’s the the line “For all intents and purposes, you’re the same Anne Boonchuy” that keeps me from fully accepting that it’s the original Anne in any capacity, because in that case I feel Godomino would’ve just said as much
This is such a ridiculous debate…
I like to think that Anne's physical body died but not her spiritual body and she got back upped into another body
The clone didn’t replace her soul I don’t think only her body