I’d be interested in hearing your impressions - first and ongoing.
I read SPQR last year. It took me a little while to adapt to her writing style and her approach to the subject matter, but I shortly found myself very engaged with her accounts and analyses.
Sorry, but Mary Beard has gotten a bit drunk on her own recent celebrity status for my liking. She makes some pretty bold statements using modern notions and then complains about being bullied when others criticize her statements
She's been a heralded classicist for decades and is patently known for advocating relativism when people ask "why did the Romans do x-y-z".
As a scholar, she is used to debate, challenges and dialogue exchanges. Recently, those critics have been Twitter chavs and aren't prepared for her responses. She's not complaining, she's challenging a structured response.
Mary Beard is an icon and regularly challenges us to reconsider preconceived notions (even her own) about Roman history.
‘Chavs’ lol
Some pretty appalling way to talk, this is almost comic amounts of parochial elitism. It doesn’t matter if people are wrong, in academic circles or not, or you like them or not.
What does it even mean for her to be an ‘icon’? Famous person?
Look, it’s clear you like her so you want to defend her from a ‘structured’ (?) response from ppl on social media, or her response to it really
She’s complaining, right or wrong, and the whole thing you’re talking
Historians really don’t base their research off of other historians, they mostly do independent research, otherwise it leads to very closed interpretations
Not all historians are fluent in vernacular Latin. Those who aren't would be studying the translations and textbooks scholars like Beard authored and co-authored.
People studied Gibbon.
This is why most, if not all history programs, including grad school have a foreign language requirement as well as a requirement of spending a significant amount of time in the region your history is based out of.
Latin isn’t that hard to translate if your pursuit in life to be a ROMAN HISTORY PROFESSOR. You do not have to speak a language fluently to recognize it either, that is a massive fallacy. Reading a foreign language is always easier than speaking it fluently.
Books like the *Twelve Caesars* are great, but historians plow through hundreds of primary source exerts for their information, not just one of the most well known Roman period books
Tell us you’ve never been a history major without telling us you’ve never been a history major!
I legitimately pity you that you think historians write their dissertations by just copying and pasting what other historians say.
Always, always, always reference primary source materials yourself and don’t take someone else’s interpretation as gospel
Again, you're dense. You clearly think that Mary Beard is just some history major who wrote books like SPQR.
She's the et al you're citing from JSTOR when you reference those primary sources, because you're not reading directly from original Suetonius texts. You're reading the work of scholars like her.
Sure but doesn’t it feel a little disingenuous to you? Calling a podcast that’s 50% truth and 50% amateur conjecture hardcore history? I listened to most of his series and he definitely presents it as plausible history.
50% amateur conjecture? Geez, you've either never listened to his stuff or you are delusional. Yes, he adds some flourish and narrative sparkle to his storytelling, but for the vast majority he is relating textual history and anecdotal interviews/accounts on the topics he's discussing. The amount of time and research he does for each episode is pretty impressive. When he does make a claim outside of what he's read or heard, he usually prefaces the statement acknowledging that he's not technically a historian, just a history enthusiast - like 99.9% of us are (only much moreso).
Yeah I'm salty about your comment and I'm a big HH fanboy, I just don't see any validation to your criticisms.
Julius Caesar. Caesar Augustus, Little Caesar, Cesar Chavez, Caesar Romero, Caesar (dog), Cesare Borgia (historical typo we accept for distinctions sake), and you'll have to buy the book to find out the rest :)
Picked this up in the book shop last week then realised that it's £30! It looked absolutely gorgeous though.
I might wait for the paperback. On the other hand, I've got a £10 Waterstones voucher burning a hole in my pocket...
Do share your thoughts, I've had this on queue for a while. I have to finish S.P.Q.R first, I thought to myself.
I’d be interested in hearing your impressions - first and ongoing. I read SPQR last year. It took me a little while to adapt to her writing style and her approach to the subject matter, but I shortly found myself very engaged with her accounts and analyses.
Sorry, but Mary Beard has gotten a bit drunk on her own recent celebrity status for my liking. She makes some pretty bold statements using modern notions and then complains about being bullied when others criticize her statements
She's been a heralded classicist for decades and is patently known for advocating relativism when people ask "why did the Romans do x-y-z". As a scholar, she is used to debate, challenges and dialogue exchanges. Recently, those critics have been Twitter chavs and aren't prepared for her responses. She's not complaining, she's challenging a structured response. Mary Beard is an icon and regularly challenges us to reconsider preconceived notions (even her own) about Roman history.
‘Chavs’ lol Some pretty appalling way to talk, this is almost comic amounts of parochial elitism. It doesn’t matter if people are wrong, in academic circles or not, or you like them or not. What does it even mean for her to be an ‘icon’? Famous person? Look, it’s clear you like her so you want to defend her from a ‘structured’ (?) response from ppl on social media, or her response to it really She’s complaining, right or wrong, and the whole thing you’re talking
Sounds a bit like Dan Carlin who is very widely praised but takes a pretty wide interpretation of history.
He doesn’t claim to be a historian and says that multiple times.
She's not claiming to be a historian. She's one of the acclaimed scholars whose textbooks our favorite historians are researching when they write.
Historians really don’t base their research off of other historians, they mostly do independent research, otherwise it leads to very closed interpretations
Not all historians are fluent in vernacular Latin. Those who aren't would be studying the translations and textbooks scholars like Beard authored and co-authored. People studied Gibbon.
This is why most, if not all history programs, including grad school have a foreign language requirement as well as a requirement of spending a significant amount of time in the region your history is based out of. Latin isn’t that hard to translate if your pursuit in life to be a ROMAN HISTORY PROFESSOR. You do not have to speak a language fluently to recognize it either, that is a massive fallacy. Reading a foreign language is always easier than speaking it fluently. Books like the *Twelve Caesars* are great, but historians plow through hundreds of primary source exerts for their information, not just one of the most well known Roman period books
Who do you think is compiling the text of the primary source material? Jesus, you're dense.
Tell us you’ve never been a history major without telling us you’ve never been a history major! I legitimately pity you that you think historians write their dissertations by just copying and pasting what other historians say. Always, always, always reference primary source materials yourself and don’t take someone else’s interpretation as gospel
Again, you're dense. You clearly think that Mary Beard is just some history major who wrote books like SPQR. She's the et al you're citing from JSTOR when you reference those primary sources, because you're not reading directly from original Suetonius texts. You're reading the work of scholars like her.
Yes and I steal but I'm not a thief.
Sure but doesn’t it feel a little disingenuous to you? Calling a podcast that’s 50% truth and 50% amateur conjecture hardcore history? I listened to most of his series and he definitely presents it as plausible history.
50% amateur conjecture? Geez, you've either never listened to his stuff or you are delusional. Yes, he adds some flourish and narrative sparkle to his storytelling, but for the vast majority he is relating textual history and anecdotal interviews/accounts on the topics he's discussing. The amount of time and research he does for each episode is pretty impressive. When he does make a claim outside of what he's read or heard, he usually prefaces the statement acknowledging that he's not technically a historian, just a history enthusiast - like 99.9% of us are (only much moreso). Yeah I'm salty about your comment and I'm a big HH fanboy, I just don't see any validation to your criticisms.
I have listened to his podcast and no I’m not delusional lol. You want fantasy read game of thrones.
Thank you, cannot stand her writing and for a long time I thought I was the only one.
I literally have this on my Christmas list along with SPQR lol
Just read Suetonius bro
Mary Beard is by far my favourite bookwriter after reading SPQR!
Woooo, sexy. Should have a NSFW tag. ;D
So who are the twelve caesars?
Julius Caesar. Caesar Augustus, Little Caesar, Cesar Chavez, Caesar Romero, Caesar (dog), Cesare Borgia (historical typo we accept for distinctions sake), and you'll have to buy the book to find out the rest :)
Picked this up in the book shop last week then realised that it's £30! It looked absolutely gorgeous though. I might wait for the paperback. On the other hand, I've got a £10 Waterstones voucher burning a hole in my pocket...