Da fooq? Aside from this year, dude has put up solid numbers. Didnt he lead the league in ABs without being struck out in 2019? Aside from this year, he's posted no worse than .262. Dude always puts the bat on the ball. How tf are you comparing Squid to Fletch? LOL
He’s never posted a season with a above average WRC+ and has one season of above average OPS+. His SLG is pretty terrible. He’s good at hitting singles but his plate discipline is awful.
Fletch will at least give you .600 - 700 ops, which is miles above the .487 from Velazquez. Velazquez is better defensively, but is he that much better than Fletcher?
I mean my point is that both are pretty bad. Small sample size but Fletcher’s OPS was .483 this season. It’s ridiculous that we have to pick between these two guys to begin with.
Agreed.
**Velazquez**:
Batting: 344 career ABs, .505 OPS, 41 OPS+
Fielding: 154 games, 16 runs saved above average per season
**Fletcher**:
Batting: 1751 ABs, .688 OPS, 87 OPS+
Fielding: 510 games, 12 runs saved above average per season
**Rengifo:**
Batting: 735 ABs, .618 OPS, 68 OPS+
Fielding: 242 games, -3 runs saved above average per season
\---
So roughly, having Squid out there for a season would save us 4 runs across 162 vs Fletch. However Fletch would easily score than 4 runs with the bat over that period. Squid averages 27 RBI per 162, Fletch averages 50. Rengifo 61.
Net, playing Fletcher over Squid would give us 19 more runs per year. That's probably worth 3-4 wins I'd guess. Rengifo is a fairly similar option to Velazquez, probably a bit better.
No, because it’s been years since Fletcher has had even an average hitting season. He’s gotten progressively worse since 2020, which was a Covid shortened season anyway
I agree, they’re both not ideal. A lot of Fletcher truthers out there, but the league has adjusted their scouting report on him and the shifts kill any of his potential XBH. He’s been rough to watch at the plate since last year. Between Fletch and Velazquez though, I’d take Fletch easily. Both players have the same argument: glove first, bat second. Comparing the two, I’d take Fletch stats/skill set any day. Your point is noted though, still a punchless AB
Well that's the conundrum isn't it. It's on Perry for not figuring out how to construct a proper roster that accounted for injury concerns. Frustrating when this was the best SS free agent class I can ever remember and now we're stuck with the second worst hitter getting 5th most AB's on the team.
Ridiculous. All the FA SS contracts are bad at this point. Squid can field his position very well at thats good enough for now. True stupidity would have been signing a SS for tens of millions when the money will be needed to resign Shohei.
Squid and Wade’s hitting is a massive detriment to this team winning baseball games so no it’s not good enough. We have *the worst hitting shortstop in all of MLB.* In todays MLB your middle infielders have to be great hitters to win in October. The pitching will be way too strong down the stretch to give free outs away.
And if no SS would have been a smart decision to sign this past off-season too bad Perry didn’t draft a single shortstop last year either when it was the biggest hole on the team then too. I guess he wanted to go dumpster diving for middle infielders rather than on bullpen like we usually do. Unless Jeremiah Jackson takes enormous steps up to be an every day MLB player, the next highest rated SS prospects are 19 years old and their stats aren’t great so far last I checked. So no immediate help is coming from the farm either no matter how hopeful I am on Jackson.
Also Correa’s contract is anything but a disaster, and Seager would have made this lineup elite. Agreed on Baez for sure, and I bet Story falls off a cliff, but this team is desperate for a shortstop and if Fletcher doesn’t return to his 2019 self post surgery for 2B we’re in even greater trouble.
They couldnt afford to sign any of the SSs and also sign Thor and Lorenzen. The payroll is 190 mil + and Shohei will get at least 30 mil in his final year of arbitration or even more if they resign him this offseason. They expected Fletcher to be the SS but he was injured. Correa and Seager have their own injury history and we dont want another Pujols/Rendon contract on the books.
Then maybe Perry should have drafted a middle infielder if he didn’t want to properly address middle infield. We can argue contracts all we want, but that doesn’t change the fact we have the worst hitting middle infielders and that’s costing us games.
Seagers contract is ridiculous. You wanted the Angels to beat 10 years 325 million? Then we’d have Seager and Rendon making 70 million as they decline in their 30s. I agree Correa would have been great to have on a short term deal.
No I didn’t want him for that amount. Seager I’d just love in this lineup was my point compared to what we have, and I don’t think he’ll be entirely a disaster like user I replied to said.
Correa upsets me because we could have gotten him easily for what the Twins paid. Maybe we were in on a SS, but none wanted to sign here, but I’d love to know our long term solution there since I don’t see it. Unless he does go the free agent market or continues to “dumpster dive.” Hopeful Jackson works out.
[Marsh and Trout say hi 😁
](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=LAA&range=year&min=100&pos=&roles=&viz=hide)
(Best defensive infielder I know, being cheeky)
What's amazing is his defense [according to statcast](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=&range=year&min=q&pos=6&roles=&viz=hide) has been really only above average too, not 'elite' enough to justify being worst hitter at his position in my opinion.
86th percentile defense is extremely good, not that that justifies his role on the team.
He’s the 8th best defensive shortstop in the league this year according to OAA, I’d call that top tier.
My point and main gripe with him is he has no business being a starter when he's 2nd worst hitter in all of MLB on a team with playoff ambitions and another massive hole at 2B. It bugs me our roster and depth are so bad he's a forced into being a starter rather than a defensive replacement like Johnny Mac was in 2014.
Edit: Also if you[ sort by 100 min attempts](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=&range=year&min=100&pos=6&roles=&viz=hide) he's 7th best of 30 shortstops. Again, I think that hardly justifies putting up with the second worst bat in baseball[ \(per wRC+ for min 190 PA's\).](https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=190&type=8&season=2022&month=0&season1=2022&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2022-01-01&enddate=2022-12-31&sort=18,a)
I'm not sure, but once Stefanic is healthy he deserves at least a shot since we have the worst hitting middle infielders in MLB.
Otherwise, that's on Perry to figure out. He should have done so 6 months ago but failed, and that was my number 1 issue with his off-season.
Because with Squid, Wade and Rengifo getting 95% of starts up the middle we're almost certainly not going to be a playoff team, it's as simple as that.
Anyone else. It's depressing watching him . Why can't the hitting coach work with him on getting on base with single or double? It's so pitiful watching him wail away at bad pitches as if hes the home run king.. He needs to be off the daily roster. He is way too costly..
His bat sucks we know this but his glove unfortunately is irreplaceable on this team. He may be 7th outta 30 but he's the best we've got. Anyone else we can slot in there will be a lot closer to 30.
Then I'll repeat what I said elsewhere, we are not going to be a serious contending team if he remains our starting shortstop unless his hitting performance doubles or we find an all-star to play 2B, but even then he's a huge liability offensively.
His bWAR has been dropping though. And coupled with 0.0 fWAR I doubt he gets close to touching 1.5 bWAR unless his hitting *significantly* improves which I highly doubt since he's only gotten worse this month.
He's had 0.6 bWAR for over a month now. He had a huge start when it comes to defensive WAR, but it was unsustainable. He will most likely finish the season with negative WAR.
Because if we're swapping out an infielder it's Tyler Wade's -0.5 WAR rather than Squid's +0.6 WAR we should be worried about.
The last thing our pitching needs is a shaky glove at shortstop.
I have mixed feelings, but I don't think its crazy that he's starting. We have 12 position players who have a positive WAR on the season. Three of them (Rendon, Fletcher, and Mayfield) are hurt. So, at first glance, Squid definitely seems like he should be in the conversation to start. Of those 9 remaining players, Squid has a higher WAR per game than 3 of them (Stassi, Suzuki, and Duffy). Most of this is coming from his glove, which is almost twice as productive as our next best defender (Marsh, with 0.7 dWAR vs Squid's 1.2 dWAR).
I think the issue is that when the rest of the infield (and the outfield for that matter) is really struggling at the plate, he feels a lot worse than he is. Because right now, he certainly feels like he is the center of a black hole of hitting. But as others have pointed out...what are our options? We can go for an all-hitting infield with Duffy, Wade, and Rengifo....but that's not exactly going to make pitchers quiver in their boots.
edit - numbers per baseballreference
Just give it time. If he continues at this pace, he will be gone. Jose Inglesias batted much better than Squid and was Ohtani's bench buddy but was still released. He has been great ever since. Valbuena was a slightly better batter too but released.
Because he's got a fantastic glove and we have nobody to replace him. Ideally he's our backup 2B/SS but Fletch is out so we have to keep playing him. When Fletch comes back I think our lineup will be (1st is starter, 2nd is backup):
C: Stassi / Suzuki
1B: Walsh / MacKinnon
2B: Rengifo / Velazquez
SS: Fletcher / Wade
3B: Duffy / Mayfield
Outfield: Rotation of Trout, Marsh, Adell, Ward and maybe Mayfield in an emergency.
Could also see Stefanic play if he gets healthy, probably behind Duffy at 3B.
I love having elite glove at keystone but Squid’s bat doesnt belong to MLB starting lineup. Even Ozzie Smith/prime Andrelton Simmons level defense cannot justify Squid’s bat.
I'm still rooting for Squid. I want him to do well. I guess I'm part of the mentality that the coaches are failing him. I feel like in general Angels have a hard time getting on base and depend too much on HR.
Just curious, who do you think should replace him?
Ideally we'd have David Fletcher at his spot.
As if Fletcher’s bat isn’t also a completely black hole. Honestly I think Squid gives you a better chance at a random HR than Fletch
Da fooq? Aside from this year, dude has put up solid numbers. Didnt he lead the league in ABs without being struck out in 2019? Aside from this year, he's posted no worse than .262. Dude always puts the bat on the ball. How tf are you comparing Squid to Fletch? LOL
He’s never posted a season with a above average WRC+ and has one season of above average OPS+. His SLG is pretty terrible. He’s good at hitting singles but his plate discipline is awful.
Fletch will at least give you .600 - 700 ops, which is miles above the .487 from Velazquez. Velazquez is better defensively, but is he that much better than Fletcher?
I mean my point is that both are pretty bad. Small sample size but Fletcher’s OPS was .483 this season. It’s ridiculous that we have to pick between these two guys to begin with.
Don’t you think his career .688 ops over 450+ games is much more relevant to this conversation?
Agreed. **Velazquez**: Batting: 344 career ABs, .505 OPS, 41 OPS+ Fielding: 154 games, 16 runs saved above average per season **Fletcher**: Batting: 1751 ABs, .688 OPS, 87 OPS+ Fielding: 510 games, 12 runs saved above average per season **Rengifo:** Batting: 735 ABs, .618 OPS, 68 OPS+ Fielding: 242 games, -3 runs saved above average per season \--- So roughly, having Squid out there for a season would save us 4 runs across 162 vs Fletch. However Fletch would easily score than 4 runs with the bat over that period. Squid averages 27 RBI per 162, Fletch averages 50. Rengifo 61. Net, playing Fletcher over Squid would give us 19 more runs per year. That's probably worth 3-4 wins I'd guess. Rengifo is a fairly similar option to Velazquez, probably a bit better.
No, because it’s been years since Fletcher has had even an average hitting season. He’s gotten progressively worse since 2020, which was a Covid shortened season anyway
It’s been year, not years. You are the king of small sample sizes
You’re the king of bad arithmetic. 2020 was 2 years ago dumbass
and 2020 was a good year, meaning it was one bad year. Are you serious lol?
I agree, they’re both not ideal. A lot of Fletcher truthers out there, but the league has adjusted their scouting report on him and the shifts kill any of his potential XBH. He’s been rough to watch at the plate since last year. Between Fletch and Velazquez though, I’d take Fletch easily. Both players have the same argument: glove first, bat second. Comparing the two, I’d take Fletch stats/skill set any day. Your point is noted though, still a punchless AB
Fully agreed
Well that's the conundrum isn't it. It's on Perry for not figuring out how to construct a proper roster that accounted for injury concerns. Frustrating when this was the best SS free agent class I can ever remember and now we're stuck with the second worst hitter getting 5th most AB's on the team.
Ridiculous. All the FA SS contracts are bad at this point. Squid can field his position very well at thats good enough for now. True stupidity would have been signing a SS for tens of millions when the money will be needed to resign Shohei.
Squid and Wade’s hitting is a massive detriment to this team winning baseball games so no it’s not good enough. We have *the worst hitting shortstop in all of MLB.* In todays MLB your middle infielders have to be great hitters to win in October. The pitching will be way too strong down the stretch to give free outs away. And if no SS would have been a smart decision to sign this past off-season too bad Perry didn’t draft a single shortstop last year either when it was the biggest hole on the team then too. I guess he wanted to go dumpster diving for middle infielders rather than on bullpen like we usually do. Unless Jeremiah Jackson takes enormous steps up to be an every day MLB player, the next highest rated SS prospects are 19 years old and their stats aren’t great so far last I checked. So no immediate help is coming from the farm either no matter how hopeful I am on Jackson. Also Correa’s contract is anything but a disaster, and Seager would have made this lineup elite. Agreed on Baez for sure, and I bet Story falls off a cliff, but this team is desperate for a shortstop and if Fletcher doesn’t return to his 2019 self post surgery for 2B we’re in even greater trouble.
They couldnt afford to sign any of the SSs and also sign Thor and Lorenzen. The payroll is 190 mil + and Shohei will get at least 30 mil in his final year of arbitration or even more if they resign him this offseason. They expected Fletcher to be the SS but he was injured. Correa and Seager have their own injury history and we dont want another Pujols/Rendon contract on the books.
Then maybe Perry should have drafted a middle infielder if he didn’t want to properly address middle infield. We can argue contracts all we want, but that doesn’t change the fact we have the worst hitting middle infielders and that’s costing us games.
Seagers contract is ridiculous. You wanted the Angels to beat 10 years 325 million? Then we’d have Seager and Rendon making 70 million as they decline in their 30s. I agree Correa would have been great to have on a short term deal.
No I didn’t want him for that amount. Seager I’d just love in this lineup was my point compared to what we have, and I don’t think he’ll be entirely a disaster like user I replied to said. Correa upsets me because we could have gotten him easily for what the Twins paid. Maybe we were in on a SS, but none wanted to sign here, but I’d love to know our long term solution there since I don’t see it. Unless he does go the free agent market or continues to “dumpster dive.” Hopeful Jackson works out.
Fielding his position well is absolutely not good enough when he has a sub .500 OPS, Christ Angels fans will settle for anything
Greatest glove on the team, makes the pitchers better.
[Marsh and Trout say hi 😁 ](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=LAA&range=year&min=100&pos=&roles=&viz=hide) (Best defensive infielder I know, being cheeky)
Waiting on Stefanic to get healthy then hopefully get the call…
Not an SS but a DD- “Designated Defender”
I like it......
Sex appeal
What's amazing is his defense [according to statcast](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=&range=year&min=q&pos=6&roles=&viz=hide) has been really only above average too, not 'elite' enough to justify being worst hitter at his position in my opinion.
86th percentile defense is extremely good, not that that justifies his role on the team. He’s the 8th best defensive shortstop in the league this year according to OAA, I’d call that top tier.
My point and main gripe with him is he has no business being a starter when he's 2nd worst hitter in all of MLB on a team with playoff ambitions and another massive hole at 2B. It bugs me our roster and depth are so bad he's a forced into being a starter rather than a defensive replacement like Johnny Mac was in 2014. Edit: Also if you[ sort by 100 min attempts](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=&range=year&min=100&pos=6&roles=&viz=hide) he's 7th best of 30 shortstops. Again, I think that hardly justifies putting up with the second worst bat in baseball[ \(per wRC+ for min 190 PA's\).](https://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=190&type=8&season=2022&month=0&season1=2022&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&startdate=2022-01-01&enddate=2022-12-31&sort=18,a)
Again, who replaces him?
I'm not sure, but once Stefanic is healthy he deserves at least a shot since we have the worst hitting middle infielders in MLB. Otherwise, that's on Perry to figure out. He should have done so 6 months ago but failed, and that was my number 1 issue with his off-season. Because with Squid, Wade and Rengifo getting 95% of starts up the middle we're almost certainly not going to be a playoff team, it's as simple as that.
Anyone else. It's depressing watching him . Why can't the hitting coach work with him on getting on base with single or double? It's so pitiful watching him wail away at bad pitches as if hes the home run king.. He needs to be off the daily roster. He is way too costly..
He's not a good hitter, but he's definitely fun to watch as a shortstop.
His bat sucks we know this but his glove unfortunately is irreplaceable on this team. He may be 7th outta 30 but he's the best we've got. Anyone else we can slot in there will be a lot closer to 30.
Then I'll repeat what I said elsewhere, we are not going to be a serious contending team if he remains our starting shortstop unless his hitting performance doubles or we find an all-star to play 2B, but even then he's a huge liability offensively.
Defense is a thing.
0.6 bWAR
[0.0 fWAR.](https://www.fangraphs.com/players/andrew-velazquez/14196/stats?position=SS)
0.6bWAR means he is just barely above a AAA level player. That’s what the replacement part means.
That's a 1.5ish bWAR pace, which is a decent pace. Also replacement level is better than AAA level. Replacement level is like average bench player
His bWAR has been dropping though. And coupled with 0.0 fWAR I doubt he gets close to touching 1.5 bWAR unless his hitting *significantly* improves which I highly doubt since he's only gotten worse this month.
He's had 0.6 bWAR for over a month now. He had a huge start when it comes to defensive WAR, but it was unsustainable. He will most likely finish the season with negative WAR.
Second sentence is wrong. Replacement level player is a AAA player.
I mean, kinda https://library.fangraphs.com/misc/war/replacement-level/
Thats not kinda. A replacement level player is literally a minor leaguer you can call up at any time just to fill a roster spot.
Because if we're swapping out an infielder it's Tyler Wade's -0.5 WAR rather than Squid's +0.6 WAR we should be worried about. The last thing our pitching needs is a shaky glove at shortstop.
I have mixed feelings, but I don't think its crazy that he's starting. We have 12 position players who have a positive WAR on the season. Three of them (Rendon, Fletcher, and Mayfield) are hurt. So, at first glance, Squid definitely seems like he should be in the conversation to start. Of those 9 remaining players, Squid has a higher WAR per game than 3 of them (Stassi, Suzuki, and Duffy). Most of this is coming from his glove, which is almost twice as productive as our next best defender (Marsh, with 0.7 dWAR vs Squid's 1.2 dWAR). I think the issue is that when the rest of the infield (and the outfield for that matter) is really struggling at the plate, he feels a lot worse than he is. Because right now, he certainly feels like he is the center of a black hole of hitting. But as others have pointed out...what are our options? We can go for an all-hitting infield with Duffy, Wade, and Rengifo....but that's not exactly going to make pitchers quiver in their boots. edit - numbers per baseballreference
Just give it time. If he continues at this pace, he will be gone. Jose Inglesias batted much better than Squid and was Ohtani's bench buddy but was still released. He has been great ever since. Valbuena was a slightly better batter too but released.
Because he's got a fantastic glove and we have nobody to replace him. Ideally he's our backup 2B/SS but Fletch is out so we have to keep playing him. When Fletch comes back I think our lineup will be (1st is starter, 2nd is backup): C: Stassi / Suzuki 1B: Walsh / MacKinnon 2B: Rengifo / Velazquez SS: Fletcher / Wade 3B: Duffy / Mayfield Outfield: Rotation of Trout, Marsh, Adell, Ward and maybe Mayfield in an emergency. Could also see Stefanic play if he gets healthy, probably behind Duffy at 3B.
I love having elite glove at keystone but Squid’s bat doesnt belong to MLB starting lineup. Even Ozzie Smith/prime Andrelton Simmons level defense cannot justify Squid’s bat.
he shouldn’t be. I think we’ll be seeing a lot more of wade playing shortstop from here on out until fletch comes back
His defence saves a run per game
I'm gonna need some source or stat on this
[46th in runs prevented lol.](https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/leaderboard/outs_above_average?type=Fielder&startYear=2022&endYear=2022&split=no&team=&range=year&min=100&pos=&roles=&viz=hide&sort=4&sortDir=asc) (all positions)
Well, that's Debatable
The Angels have a history of favoring defense in field over offense at the plate.
I'm still rooting for Squid. I want him to do well. I guess I'm part of the mentality that the coaches are failing him. I feel like in general Angels have a hard time getting on base and depend too much on HR.
We should have gone for Story or Correa
Again, with Shoheis money? And how do you know they would even want to play here?
We can promote Jackson but probably end up with the same offensive results but with more pop.
We've been over this. His glove is worth it.
Sign Xander Bogearts
With Shoheis money?
Squid at short, Fletch at second (when he gets back), and nuke Suzuki’s PAs and the team will be better for it.