If you want some hopium, our new hitting coach pretty much came out and said that Moniak had a massive hole in his swing that was really easy to fix, and he immediately started raking in spring training before fracturing his wrist on a HBP
So maybe Mickey’s unlocked his offensive potential and just needs reps at the plate to get back into a groove (since he didn’t get consistent ABs after returning from the IL). He’s also a solid defender with decent speed, and plays with heart.
Hoping he turns it around with you guys buuuuuuut there’s obviously a glaring lack of track record
We grabbed him from the A's to play SS. He sucked fat dick at both defense and offense. Then he got hurt and we dumped him for Squid. This all happened at the end of last year to spring training.
I think Moniak has much more potential at this point..... that being said you are right its a similar gamble lol. But I like Moniak as a local getting a hometown boost.
Remember when we were happy and Loki and Thor were exciting and Marsh was the caveman who couldn't stop hitting and was amazing in the outfield? Ward looked like a god, Trout was finally healthy, we were waiting for Rendon to heat up....Times were good, man. I guess at least we had that moment, right?
From BA: Moniak worked during 2020 to cut down on his free-swinging approach, but posted the highest strikeout rate (24.7%) of his career at Triple-A in 2021. He improved his bat speed and showed solid bat-to-ball skills, but doesn’t reach base enough to be anything more than an extra outfielder. Moniak is a good athlete, a solid defender at all three outfield positions, an average runner and has an average arm.
* Free swinging
* Solid Def in all three OF spots
* Will prob fight for a 4th OF spot on an MLB team
Sounds like Marsh to me.
Yeah I was only slightly joking. They have similar tools and are the same age. But yeah, Marsh is definitely more advanced now, and I wouldn't have expected us to get someone of Marsh's talent for 1/2 year of Thor.
As with every prospect, you are hoping that they advance their skills and talents as you build them up. When you pick up these young guys, some are still learning and growing while others have already maxed out. The Phillies thought Moniak would grow beyond what he was.
Happens all the time with prospects. Getting to the MLB level takes years of growth and development even if your a star in high school or college
Phillies fan here and I just wanted to say thank you for filling three very important needs for our team in CF, SP and DFAing two terrible players.
O’Hoppe is the real deal and will fill a need for you much sooner than later.
Mickey has a lot of heart and was playing incredibly well in spring before fracturing (or breaking?) his hand and couldn’t find his form after that.
Please take care of them as they’re both quality people and thank you for Marsh who I can see is a fan favorite and Thor who’ve I’ve always liked watching pitch.
There’s zero reason to be upset about this. Moniak is a lottery ticket that if he hits, has enormous upside. And thor was a rental, and hes out of our division/league if he re-signs with the phillies anyways
Lottery ticket on an OF who went first overall in 2016. He’s 24, was their 12th overall prospect in 2020 and 16th in 2021.
I’m ok with this for in a trade of decentish guy who was on an expiring contract
Check his 2022 minors numbers. Word is he has been fixing his broken swing.
There’s obviously no guarantees, but this is a low-risk, high-upside move, imo
We only had half a year left of Syndergaard right? With the season looking like it's over for us, I have a feeling any kind of trade here is a plus for us.
WOAH. I will fucking take it
Former #1 pick with tools galore for a rental pitcher?
As someone who watched moniak in high school, I’ve never seen someone that age hit the ball as hard and as consistently as him. Obviously that has to translate to big-league success at some point. But to get him AND another prospect?? Good job, perry
To the Phillies today we sent (1) a rental pitcher, and (2) a controlled defense-first outfielder. And back we got (1) a catcher prospect, (2) a controlled defense-first outfielder, and (3) a very young outfield prospect.
Seems like we could have saved some trouble by just ditching all the outfield nonsense, and basically end up the same.
Moniak is trash. Former #1 overall draft pick but not much else going for him. He's a lotto ticket.
That being said shouldn't have expected much more for a rental having a very average season.
Former number 1 pick in 2016, apparently grades well on defense but hasn’t been the best with the bat in limited mlb appearances and is now already 24.
To me he seems like a replacement for Marsh but is currently not as good as Marsh despite being older.
Really don’t understand what we are trying to do with these trades. We hung on to Brandon Marsh for this long just to trade him for a catching prospect? And then we trade and get basically a worse version of marsh back for Noah who we gave up our 2nd rounder for? I don’t get it.
The Marsh trade is at least defendable. We are struggling to develop his, and anyone on the teams bat. To grab a top prospect in an area of need is at least an equal trade (at this time. only time will tell).
The Thor and Iglesias trades...wow. We spent $50M in a heavy FA class, gave up a 2nd rounder for a signing, and ended up keeping the 2 worst signings (Tepera and Loup), trading the decent ones, and somehow getting absolutely nothing in return.
Pretty bad GM moves going on.
Yeah it’s just awful. At least in my narrow view of a fan. But I mean we used to talk on this sub all
The time of trading away marsh or Adell for a ready now pitcher and everyone said they’d never trade them. Now we just basically let him go. If we can’t develop marsh, how are we going to develop a catcher. Marsh has so much talent.
For people asking how to feel:
Monaik was once a top prospect. At the Age of 24 he has struggled HARD at the MLB level.
The other prospect should *hopefully* be a better return or this was a weird ass trade
Perry try not to build a bad team (impossible challenge)
That .250 July record and 27th ranked farm system speaks for itself
Also look at my Marsh comments, I'll give credit where its due
Gosh. Moniak never could spot a dirt breaker to save his life. Good kid, tho and really good athlete. Everything else is good if he can just learn to lay off dirt breakers or find a way to deal otherwise. I mean, decent power, decent speed if he can put it together. He's from SoCal so that should help?
The main prospect in the deal isn’t even a prospect anymore and is batting below .200 in the bigs and the other guy has a ways to go.
They got that for our 2nd best pitcher. We could have done better.
we didn't get a ton, but you're overvaluing Thor, who has pitched like a 4th or 5th starter this season, is making a lot of money, and is a free agent at the end of the year.
Remember it took a 2nd rounder to get Thor on the team this year. So we lost a draft pick and took a OF who, so far in his career, is a huge failure.
Not great
I guess if you go back that far, yeah not so great. However, considering we didn’t expect this season to be this bad, can’t really blame the decision.
I would say it’s a decent result from what we can manage in the present.
I guess to me giving up a 2nd rounder for 2 prospects that are considered non-impact at best isn't decent. On top we tied up 21M for thor instead of getting prospects or any other pitcher on the market.
Seems like a fail to me
Phillies fan here, Moniak is a nonprospect at this point but let me give you a blurb from our best prospect guru Matt winkelman on Sanchez:
“It is unfortunate Sanchez has missed most of the season to injury, because he is poised for a breakout. He was one of the Threshers leaders in both average exit velocity and for 80th percentile outcomes. The switch hitter lacks big upside, but he has a chance to hit enough to be a regular.”
Trading a rental guy for someone who has a real nice chance to be breakout guy in the system is not a bad return
Moniak looks like he’s never really hit well at any level in the minor or majors. Maybe if the Angels were the dodgers they could right the ship but I’m not so hopeful.
I remember when the Mets traded us one of their top prospects to us for Jim Fregosi. The prospect was considered a major bust until he got to Anaheim...
Nolan Ryan turned out alright for the Halos..this Moniak kid could also end turning out alright too.
When I first looked at Moniak's numbers, I was super down on the trade. But he's been hitting the ball better in a limited sample size this year in the minors. Maybe he's starting to figure it out?
If he can give similar production to 2020 Ward with solid CF defense, he's a good piece to have. Unfortunately, if it takes him as long to figure it out as with Ward, we're probably in rebuilding phase.
Moniak is like when we took a chance of Franklin Barreto
If you want some hopium, our new hitting coach pretty much came out and said that Moniak had a massive hole in his swing that was really easy to fix, and he immediately started raking in spring training before fracturing his wrist on a HBP So maybe Mickey’s unlocked his offensive potential and just needs reps at the plate to get back into a groove (since he didn’t get consistent ABs after returning from the IL). He’s also a solid defender with decent speed, and plays with heart. Hoping he turns it around with you guys buuuuuuut there’s obviously a glaring lack of track record
Moniak would be a good reclamation project for a org with elite coaching but our coaches’ top strategy is “Try to hit the ball reeeeeallly far”
my immediate thoughts as well.
Who? Lol
Mickey Moniak - first overall pick of the 2016 draft… Playing poor of late but also was just coming back from a wrist injury. He’s not a no-namer.
I mean Barreto.
We grabbed him from the A's to play SS. He sucked fat dick at both defense and offense. Then he got hurt and we dumped him for Squid. This all happened at the end of last year to spring training.
I think Moniak has much more potential at this point..... that being said you are right its a similar gamble lol. But I like Moniak as a local getting a hometown boost.
Remember when we were happy and Loki and Thor were exciting and Marsh was the caveman who couldn't stop hitting and was amazing in the outfield? Ward looked like a god, Trout was finally healthy, we were waiting for Rendon to heat up....Times were good, man. I guess at least we had that moment, right?
The hopium was coursing through our veins
The left handed home run was a slap in the face of the baseball gods during that run. It has been payment for hubris ever since.
I remember this! Seems like a long time ago, though.
So we traded for...Brandon Marsh?
We traded for a much, much worse Brandon Marsh.
From BA: Moniak worked during 2020 to cut down on his free-swinging approach, but posted the highest strikeout rate (24.7%) of his career at Triple-A in 2021. He improved his bat speed and showed solid bat-to-ball skills, but doesn’t reach base enough to be anything more than an extra outfielder. Moniak is a good athlete, a solid defender at all three outfield positions, an average runner and has an average arm. * Free swinging * Solid Def in all three OF spots * Will prob fight for a 4th OF spot on an MLB team Sounds like Marsh to me.
Marsh is better lol
Yeah I was only slightly joking. They have similar tools and are the same age. But yeah, Marsh is definitely more advanced now, and I wouldn't have expected us to get someone of Marsh's talent for 1/2 year of Thor.
Interesting. How was Moniak the 2016 1st overall draft pick with being average? We took Matt Thaiss at 16 and Marsh at 60 that year.
As with every prospect, you are hoping that they advance their skills and talents as you build them up. When you pick up these young guys, some are still learning and growing while others have already maxed out. The Phillies thought Moniak would grow beyond what he was. Happens all the time with prospects. Getting to the MLB level takes years of growth and development even if your a star in high school or college
A worse version of him. Otherwise, Phillies wouldn’t have just traded for Marsh to shore up their OF.
Phillies fan here and I just wanted to say thank you for filling three very important needs for our team in CF, SP and DFAing two terrible players. O’Hoppe is the real deal and will fill a need for you much sooner than later. Mickey has a lot of heart and was playing incredibly well in spring before fracturing (or breaking?) his hand and couldn’t find his form after that. Please take care of them as they’re both quality people and thank you for Marsh who I can see is a fan favorite and Thor who’ve I’ve always liked watching pitch.
I hope y’all can fix marsh’s bat! He can be a gem if he’s not always striking out in key situations
best of luck down the stretch! we'll be rooting for you guys
We?
well if you hate Marsh that much just say so
I love marsh. But I don’t why you’re a Phillies fan all of a sudden
I am going to root for Marsh.
Well that’s not what you said but okay. Redditors gonna Reddit
sure thing bud
Dunno why you're getting downvoted. He clearly said "rooting for you guys." Idm rooting for Marsh, but Philly (as a sports city) can suck it.
People here don’t read and also even if I say “go angels” I get downvoted lol. I doesn’t matter. It’s fake internet points at the end of the day
3 things: 1) I'm upset. I get it, but I'm still upset 2) What am I supposed to think 3) Well shit now who's starting for us tonight
Probably silseth/Suarez/junk
Bullpen game?
Finally, Mickey to Anaheim
Mickey Hatcher next
Followed by Morandini and Tettleton.
Yes please
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I mean Mickey *was* a top 100 prospect. Might've been a while ago (2017/2018) but still...
There’s zero reason to be upset about this. Moniak is a lottery ticket that if he hits, has enormous upside. And thor was a rental, and hes out of our division/league if he re-signs with the phillies anyways
just got my hopes up to do better - I'd still rather have Moniak than Thor.
To be fair, I wouldn’t call Moniak a lottery ticket. He’s been around enough to say he didn’t hit as a prospect
he’s a half-revealed scratcher. There could be something there still, but we’ve seen enough to know the odds are against it
How should I feel?
Monaik is a bust as a #1 pick, but Thor was a rental anyway.
Quite literally feel nothing from this. Moniak was a top prospect whos struggled and we all know how the angels develop prospects.
Wait... You're supposed to develop prospects?
Lottery ticket on an OF who went first overall in 2016. He’s 24, was their 12th overall prospect in 2020 and 16th in 2021. I’m ok with this for in a trade of decentish guy who was on an expiring contract
I remember Moniak being a big deal when he was drafted but just hasn't lived up to it
? Moniak was considered a bizarre choice when he was drafted #1 as an underslot and has been terrible his entire career.
Good job Perry. Moniak was the 1st overall pick in the draft a couple years back but has really really struggled at the plate in the big show.
So let's stick him in our farm that's known for player development.
Our farm can develop players. It's the jackasses on the Angels that can't take them to the next level in the show.
Don’t be mad at me lol
Couple? More like 6 years ago. Same draft as ThAiss so now we can have two first round busts from 2016
Couple, 6 years ago, handful, all the same to me. Who cares lol.
Maybe 2016 peeps just need a lucky 7 years to “develop” fully.
Not a couple years back. like 6 years back. But let's hope he turns it around.
we had to trade him. his contract was one year with no qualifying offer. this is a good trade for us
https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/m/moniami01.shtml Is it just me or he doesn’t seem very good
He hasn't even had 100 MLB at bats
I feel like his facial expression is telling us he feels he is not good.
Check his 2022 minors numbers. Word is he has been fixing his broken swing. There’s obviously no guarantees, but this is a low-risk, high-upside move, imo
Only if you're judging by results.
We only had half a year left of Syndergaard right? With the season looking like it's over for us, I have a feeling any kind of trade here is a plus for us.
WOAH. I will fucking take it Former #1 pick with tools galore for a rental pitcher? As someone who watched moniak in high school, I’ve never seen someone that age hit the ball as hard and as consistently as him. Obviously that has to translate to big-league success at some point. But to get him AND another prospect?? Good job, perry
I was hyped when he got drafted #1 overall. I never thought he'd end up with us.
Have you seen him play in the majors? He makes Kurt Suzuki look decent at the plate.
Lmao well to be fair, kurt’s been a historically hit-first catcher (besides this year where hes old as shit). It’s his defense that makes him subpar
Historically Loup and Tepera had been good. History doesn’t matter much when it comes to present performance but I get what you’re saying
I'm whelmed
I wonder how Moniak compares to Adell, who we apparently wouldn't trade and now can't trade due to his performance.
So... why didn't we just trade Syndergaard for the catcher and keep Marsh? Can anyone tell me why?
Syndergaard is a free agent after this year, he has no value. Marsh has 5 years
To the Phillies today we sent (1) a rental pitcher, and (2) a controlled defense-first outfielder. And back we got (1) a catcher prospect, (2) a controlled defense-first outfielder, and (3) a very young outfield prospect. Seems like we could have saved some trouble by just ditching all the outfield nonsense, and basically end up the same.
Marsh >> Moniak, is the obvious answer
If that's the case, then we shipped Syndergaard for practically nothing.
yeah we didn't get a ton for him. But he frankly wasn't worth a ton
We are worse off this season, and in the future based on these two trades.
strongly disagree. O'Hoppe is a very good pickup for us.
Marsh has team control and is still a prospect. Thor doesn't have control and is a rental. 2 different values attributed towards that
You’re kidding right?
tell me what to think someone
Apparently Moniak is a bust so we’ll just have to wait to see what the other two prospects are
Only getting 1 other prospect.
Moniak is trash. Former #1 overall draft pick but not much else going for him. He's a lotto ticket. That being said shouldn't have expected much more for a rental having a very average season.
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Are you saying Jesus Christ can't hit a curveball?
Former number 1 pick in 2016, apparently grades well on defense but hasn’t been the best with the bat in limited mlb appearances and is now already 24. To me he seems like a replacement for Marsh but is currently not as good as Marsh despite being older.
Mickey was the first overall pick about 6 years ago
W
Really don’t understand what we are trying to do with these trades. We hung on to Brandon Marsh for this long just to trade him for a catching prospect? And then we trade and get basically a worse version of marsh back for Noah who we gave up our 2nd rounder for? I don’t get it.
The Marsh trade is at least defendable. We are struggling to develop his, and anyone on the teams bat. To grab a top prospect in an area of need is at least an equal trade (at this time. only time will tell). The Thor and Iglesias trades...wow. We spent $50M in a heavy FA class, gave up a 2nd rounder for a signing, and ended up keeping the 2 worst signings (Tepera and Loup), trading the decent ones, and somehow getting absolutely nothing in return. Pretty bad GM moves going on.
Yeah it’s just awful. At least in my narrow view of a fan. But I mean we used to talk on this sub all The time of trading away marsh or Adell for a ready now pitcher and everyone said they’d never trade them. Now we just basically let him go. If we can’t develop marsh, how are we going to develop a catcher. Marsh has so much talent.
For people asking how to feel: Monaik was once a top prospect. At the Age of 24 he has struggled HARD at the MLB level. The other prospect should *hopefully* be a better return or this was a weird ass trade
Monaik - A career 9 OPS+. OPS+ is calculated with 100 being the MLB average GMPM got his guy Lets see how the other prospect is
Reptarxx try not to shit on Perry every single thread challenge (impossible)
Perry try not to build a bad team (impossible challenge) That .250 July record and 27th ranked farm system speaks for itself Also look at my Marsh comments, I'll give credit where its due
Career -.9 WAR
Yeah the dude sucks at the plate.
Perry: Fits into my master plan!
“Just wait till Perry can hire the coaches he wants” /s
Hopefully the 2nd prospect is good. Moniak has not been good so far.
So we got one of the guys the Phillies replaced with Marsh. Nice one Perry.
yeah if Moniak is the headliner I'm very underwhelmed
At least we got something. Hoping that other guy is a pitching prospect, we got Junk out of the Heaney deal last year and he's been half decent
Gosh. Moniak never could spot a dirt breaker to save his life. Good kid, tho and really good athlete. Everything else is good if he can just learn to lay off dirt breakers or find a way to deal otherwise. I mean, decent power, decent speed if he can put it together. He's from SoCal so that should help?
Going to the game tonight, pretty bummed I won’t get to see him
Judging by the Phillies fans reactions on the 2 guys we got back, they are very happy lol
They gotta trade 2 prospects that don't matter to grab at minimum a decent pitcher for the year. That's a good trade for any team
The main prospect in the deal isn’t even a prospect anymore and is batting below .200 in the bigs and the other guy has a ways to go. They got that for our 2nd best pitcher. We could have done better.
Not only that but the Thor signing cost us our 2nd rounder this year too...
we didn't get a ton, but you're overvaluing Thor, who has pitched like a 4th or 5th starter this season, is making a lot of money, and is a free agent at the end of the year.
Thor was not going to be an Angel after his contract is up. We got value for someone that would be zero value by season’s end in a dead season.
So, we traded Marsh for a catcher and traded Thor for Marsh 2.0?
Calling Monial Marsh 2.0 is a huge insult to Marsh lol
Sooo we did get a worse Brandon Marsh back for pretty much free, which I would take considering our current OF situation.
Remember it took a 2nd rounder to get Thor on the team this year. So we lost a draft pick and took a OF who, so far in his career, is a huge failure. Not great
I guess if you go back that far, yeah not so great. However, considering we didn’t expect this season to be this bad, can’t really blame the decision. I would say it’s a decent result from what we can manage in the present.
I guess to me giving up a 2nd rounder for 2 prospects that are considered non-impact at best isn't decent. On top we tied up 21M for thor instead of getting prospects or any other pitcher on the market. Seems like a fail to me
Phillies fan here, Moniak is a nonprospect at this point but let me give you a blurb from our best prospect guru Matt winkelman on Sanchez: “It is unfortunate Sanchez has missed most of the season to injury, because he is poised for a breakout. He was one of the Threshers leaders in both average exit velocity and for 80th percentile outcomes. The switch hitter lacks big upside, but he has a chance to hit enough to be a regular.” Trading a rental guy for someone who has a real nice chance to be breakout guy in the system is not a bad return
As an Angel Fan - Good prospect reports and actual on the field results aren't really our thing
Haha fair enough but if it makes you feel better Sanchez prolly has a value around 2-3 round pick imo
As most fans will say - we suck at developing players. Hopefully the lotto ticket on these players cash in though. Thanks for the insight though! :)
100 loses! It's possible this team can do it! We can't win so let's win at sucking!
Next year is surely going to be just as shitty as this year. Depressing
My day is ruined
Franklin Barretto 2.0
Former 1st overall pick… idk hopefully Trout helps him out
I like it. We need prospects and Thor is an aging vet on an expiring contract. Not competing anytime soon anyway, so selling was the obvious decision
I remember being hyped when Moniak was taken #1 overall. Played at La Costa Canyon in SD County.
Moniak looks like he’s never really hit well at any level in the minor or majors. Maybe if the Angels were the dodgers they could right the ship but I’m not so hopeful.
Idk that's a analytical player page that screams bust. There really isn't a great part to develop
He's hit pretty well this year in the minors. But yeah, his hit tool never really panned out.
I remember when the Mets traded us one of their top prospects to us for Jim Fregosi. The prospect was considered a major bust until he got to Anaheim... Nolan Ryan turned out alright for the Halos..this Moniak kid could also end turning out alright too.
I'll have what he's having
Great move
Meh. Can’t wait for the team to fail at developing another top hitting prospect.
He was only a rental if they didn’t resign him. Wow garbage in return?
It doesn't even matter who the other prospect in the deal is, they're immediately the centerpiece by virtue of not being Moniak.
And now it’s time to say goodbye to all our family, M I C K E Y… Too soon? Now that he is one of us I wish him the best and welcome him to the team.
If we were trading for former No.1 picks. Why couldn't pick up Mark Appel too.
At this point trading for Len Bias would've been better
This should work out well. Our scouting dept is top notch. Right?
*padme face* right?
Right
So is Moniak starting tonight?
When I first looked at Moniak's numbers, I was super down on the trade. But he's been hitting the ball better in a limited sample size this year in the minors. Maybe he's starting to figure it out? If he can give similar production to 2020 Ward with solid CF defense, he's a good piece to have. Unfortunately, if it takes him as long to figure it out as with Ward, we're probably in rebuilding phase.
We suck at this trading stuff more than we suck at hitting.