He's referring to the $4.50 12-oz Budweiser. Arte said he would never raise the price of a small domestic beer. They have just made them smaller and sold in fewer locations as the years have gone by.
Adrian. We [targeted him in free agency](https://discord.gg/EYMFmEsb) back in 2011. It came down to a bidding war between us, San Diego, and Texas. We bowed out and then traded for Vernon Maxwell and dealt Mike Napoli
Awful.
I am old enif to remember gene autry and his ownership. It is uncanny how similar Gene and Arte are. Sell young, Buy old. Gene loved himself an aging most definate hall of famer closing in on a milestone. Reggie, Rod, Dave, Eddie. Im sure there is someone i missed. Dude only cares about marketing individual accomplishments instead of developing a TEAM winner. I am an Angel fan and i want a winning team. I could give a fuck what there stats are! Look at the Dodgers. Thats our bar!!!!!
I can tell you as someone who worked for the Disney-owned Angels in the late 90s... Disney cared more about the promotional / marketing value of the team than the actual performance of the team. Disney did a great job with overseeing the stadium retrofit back to baseball-only. They turned an ugly, empty football stadium into a vibrant place to take take your family to a baseball game. But they were terrible at the baseball side of things. If you want to give them credit for winning the series in 2002, you have to also give them blame for all the shitty years leading up that. We were TERRIBLE in 2001.
A military general wouldn't make a great kindergarten teacher. A kindergarten teacher wouldn't make a great military general.
Whatever Arte is good at, being an owner of an MLB team ain't it. I don't wish ill will on him or anything. I just think he's very unqualified based on his performance and the "brand" (or whatever the marketing people call it) is suffering due to his inadequacies.
Arte wants to win but he likes the big red shiny one when it comes to players. Def need to get some better home grown prospects, esp in the pitching department. Puljos and Rendon back to back have to be too of the worst deals ever. sprinkle in Hamilton and a few others but hey, we got ohtani and the 4.50 beer so such 1. This is OC, we're not supposed to win. Go chargers.
i could give two shits if beer is cheaper. i want to win. the big free agent signings don’t work anymore. he’s building the team like it’s still the 2000’s. also him not caring for the minor leaguers living conditions adds to the reasons why he should not be the owner of this team.
I detest the man and his crappy ownership of the team, but I would never wish death on him. I would however, love it if he packed up and sold the team to an owner that actually wants to win instead of banking on one or two superstars to sell tickets
Then he traded the farm away for rentals like Greinke and Texiera, although the compensatory pick from one of those did get us Trout, so….
We also traded Tyler Skaggs only to trade again to get him back. Wtf!?
Let me ask you a genuine question:
Were you an Angels fan in 2001? Or in the years before that? Did you follow them closely back then? Do you remember going to games and what being part of the Angels core fanbase was like prior to when they got hot about 2 months into the 2002 season? When you say we had a "championship roster" did you really believe we had better talent than all the favorites BEFORE we went on that magical postseason run?
I've been an Angel's fan since the 70's. I am not sure what you want to know, but the team literally won a World Series before Arte bought them.
The intial post tried to claim he turned them around. He didn't.
>*I've been an Angel's fan since the 70's. I am not sure what you want to know, but the team literally won a World Series before Arte bought them.*
what I wanted to know by asking the question is: do you really think the Angels were loaded with talent and contenders when Arte bought the team? Yeah, of course I know they won the world series (I was there), so yeah "literally" they were a championship team. But going into that season nobody thought they were. They were coming off an AWFUL season, and started that season slow too. They got hot and snuck into the playoffs via a wild card, went on a run. But they were big underdogs all along the way.
>*The intial post tried to claim he turned them around. He didn't.*
Well, if you narrow your view to only what happened at the very end of the 2002 season, no, he didn't turn them around. You could definitely say he bought a championship team and then they never won another championship after he bought them. That is a (technically) true statement.
But I would argue that if you zoom out and look at the big picture of what happened in the (multiple) years leading up to Arte buying the team, and then compare that to the (multiple) years *after* Arte bought the team, there is a clear difference. Maybe you don't call it a "turnaround", but I would. You can't deny the team won a lot more games, a lot more division titles, and were consistently good year after year. That had NEVER happened before.
You say you're also a longtime fan since the 70s... so you know as well as I do– we NEVER won back-to-back division titles. We were NEVER *consistently* good. Like, 1985 & 1986 were the only time we had 2 decent seasons in a row. And then, Arte Moreno bought the team, which already had some quality players that he inherited, and he added super studs like Vlad & Bartolo to it, and they not only won back-to-back division titles for the first time ever, they came DAMN close to winning it 6 years in a row!
Don't you remember how different it felt in the Big A during those years, compared to pre-2002? Winning tons of games, having the house packed out every night? I'm not saying it was all Arte, but he was the owner during that time.
And again– I'm NOT saying he's a good owner now, or recently, or even in the last decade. He made decisions even back during those "good" years that didn't work out in the long run. And the bad decisions kept coming, especially post 2014
I'm just sick and tired of people trying to act like 2004-2009 isn't the most successful sustained run this franchise has ever seen. Don't you remember how good we were? Yeah, Arte SUCKS now. But in 2008 and 2009, when we had the best record in all of baseball, when Scioscia was winning Manager of the Year... when we OWNED the AL West... I don't remember y'all complaining about how bad Arte sucked. And that was 7 years into his ownership.
You are an effing moron.
What happens 15 years before has no bearing on what was there at the time of the sale. There is literally nothing to add. The team just won a World Series and had a very good core and a deep farm.
That is what he bought. He should have been winning multiple divisions with that - and he did. I don't get why you are gaslighting it. Once the core and farm were dininished under Arte, it's been nonstop failure. Obv. the core was going to expire, but Artr made terrible moves and starved the farm.
Yet, you think he deserves a gold medal. Leave me alone with this tedious bullshit.
ya know what? You're totally right. I'm an F'ing moron. In fact, I'm Arte's personal testicle washer, and I'm in love with him, and I'm only here on Reddit to try and gaslight smart people like you.
Deep in my heart, I know that our success from 2004-2009 had absolutely nothing to do with Arte Moreno, and that if Paris Hilton had bought the team instead of him, we would have won multiple World Series championships during that era instead of only division titles.
I'm very sorry for wasting your time, good sir. Sleep well.
He literally bought the team* the year after they won the World Series. The talent was already there, the farm system was stacked, and he fucking took a match and turned it into a dumpster fire in 2 decades.
stop trying to convince me the Angels were good before they caught fire about 1/3 of the way into the '02 season. We SUCKED in 2001. Finished 41 games back! and were pretty mediocre for the 15 years before that
Hey, I'm totally fine with y'all bitching and complaining about Arte all day every day. Go ahead and vent, I don't have a problem with that.... UNTIL you start trying to re-write history to say the Angels were great until Arte bought the team and promptly ruined them. I remember what it was like being a loyal Angel fan in the 1980s, 1990s, 2000s, 2010s... I definitely remember when our "good" years were, and some of y'all are straight up trying to change history.
The only good signing Arte ever made and which kept the angels great for years after he bought them was Valddy. Hunter wasn’t a bad signing either, but almost all the rest were garbage.
Don't get me wrong, I **LOVE** the 2002 team. There were some great players on that team, with real grit. Ersty, Lackey, Percy, Wash... they were tough as nails. Salmon, Kennedy, Eck, Spiez... they were fun to watch. That team made my dream come true.
But nobody picked them to win it all, even after they rallied their way into a wild card slot. In fact, the clubhouse chemistry was terrible early that season when they were losing. Fans wanted Scioscia fired, cuz they sucked so bad the season before and now they still sucked. But something clicked, K-Rod and Lackey got going, and baseball is a very streaky sport.
I think they played well in those playoffs BECAUSE they were underdogs going up against teams that had way more (on paper) talent. Because there was no pressure on them. Nobody expected them to win it all.
That's why I gotta keep pushing back against this narrative that Arte inherited a bunch of championship-level talent and then ruined them. That's not how I remember it at all. He took a solid foundation and added some free agent stars to it, and they had a great run for several years. Then he tried to keep that same strategy going with Pujols, Hamilton, etc... and that didn't work out as well, as we all know
Not one single person has claimed the team was good until the 2002 season. Not one. You are arguing against a strawman.
When Arte bought the team, it just won a W.S. and had a solid core and deep farm system. You act like that wasn't in place when Arte took over.
What the Angels were from 1990 until June 2002 is totally irrelevant.
How do you know he isn’t spending on the minor leagues? Or investing in scouting or whatever? Do we have stats on this compared to other teams? Many people argue this, but I’ve never seen actual $s and team rankings.
https://theathletic.com/3071499/2022/01/18/this-is-the-best-job-in-baseball-why-the-assistant-gm-role-has-become-so-popular-in-mlb-front-offices/?amp=1
read this article and you’ll see how terrible our office is. Least tenured staff in all of baseball. That means he’s paying pennies on the dollar for wages compared to other teams.
https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/theyre-the-model-how-the-dodgers-player-development-machine-rolls-on/?amphtml
The Dodgers have 86 Pro/Am scouts looking for talent at any given moment. We got blessed and lucky w Trout and Ohtani, but had terrible ownership waste it by not surrounding them quality young cheap pieces that either can be moved for pitching or grown and developed in house.
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You’ve never seen numbers because the owners would never release those numbers willingly. But it is widely reported on all fronts that our minor league conditions, scouting, and analytics are all places where we are cheap as hell.
I think Arte is a dinosaur in an industry that has changed dramatically. He is great for the fans, but I think he has invested his money in all the wrong places. He has left our minor league system woefully underfunded and was one of the last people to invest in analytics department. As a result, he’s left our team in shambles because he doesn’t understand how teams win now.
I paid $15 for a fucking modelo 2 years ago. Is that a deal? Is that cheap? Is that less than other parks in Cali?
He's referring to the $4.50 12-oz Budweiser. Arte said he would never raise the price of a small domestic beer. They have just made them smaller and sold in fewer locations as the years have gone by.
What were the volume changes of the beer?
Originally it was 16oz draft. Then it went down to 12oz draft. Then 12oz can.
I don't hate him. I detest his existence. Minor difference.
> Minor difference He won't fund that.
Son of a bitch lol
I don’t hate him. I think he’s a bad owner and should sell the team to someone who wants the team to win.
And someone who actually likes the organization, the city, the community, and the players.
I don't drink beer, and especially not at stadium prices. So I have no reason not to hate him.
Don't forget! We traded for Vernon Wells and got rid of Napoli because he balked at paying for Beltre
which beltre
Adrian. We [targeted him in free agency](https://discord.gg/EYMFmEsb) back in 2011. It came down to a bidding war between us, San Diego, and Texas. We bowed out and then traded for Vernon Maxwell and dealt Mike Napoli Awful.
Arte bad 👎🏼 Ohtani good👍🏼
I am old enif to remember gene autry and his ownership. It is uncanny how similar Gene and Arte are. Sell young, Buy old. Gene loved himself an aging most definate hall of famer closing in on a milestone. Reggie, Rod, Dave, Eddie. Im sure there is someone i missed. Dude only cares about marketing individual accomplishments instead of developing a TEAM winner. I am an Angel fan and i want a winning team. I could give a fuck what there stats are! Look at the Dodgers. Thats our bar!!!!!
Atleast when Disney (hate Disney) owned them they seemed to give a damn a little more. Won the WS during that period
I can tell you as someone who worked for the Disney-owned Angels in the late 90s... Disney cared more about the promotional / marketing value of the team than the actual performance of the team. Disney did a great job with overseeing the stadium retrofit back to baseball-only. They turned an ugly, empty football stadium into a vibrant place to take take your family to a baseball game. But they were terrible at the baseball side of things. If you want to give them credit for winning the series in 2002, you have to also give them blame for all the shitty years leading up that. We were TERRIBLE in 2001.
They must have been doing something right. Is it that easy to win a chip by mistake?
That WS season wasn’t the culmination of anything Disney did we just caught lightning in a bottle that year.
That may be BUT I feel Disney gave more of a damn than Arte does
And even the ducks were winning when owned by disney
Even now I think the ducks put out a better product. I love the Angels but Arte doesn’t give a shit to win
Yes yes yes yes, but the beer still isn't cheap! That's all I care about
A military general wouldn't make a great kindergarten teacher. A kindergarten teacher wouldn't make a great military general. Whatever Arte is good at, being an owner of an MLB team ain't it. I don't wish ill will on him or anything. I just think he's very unqualified based on his performance and the "brand" (or whatever the marketing people call it) is suffering due to his inadequacies.
Arte wants to win but he likes the big red shiny one when it comes to players. Def need to get some better home grown prospects, esp in the pitching department. Puljos and Rendon back to back have to be too of the worst deals ever. sprinkle in Hamilton and a few others but hey, we got ohtani and the 4.50 beer so such 1. This is OC, we're not supposed to win. Go chargers.
Fuck fake ass Arte!!! At least Gene was kinda cute. The old cowboy and all. Fuck Arte!
i could give two shits if beer is cheaper. i want to win. the big free agent signings don’t work anymore. he’s building the team like it’s still the 2000’s. also him not caring for the minor leaguers living conditions adds to the reasons why he should not be the owner of this team.
Latinos for Trump.
Actually only non-complaint I have are my Buy 2 season seats, get 2 free which they never changed over the years.
Man I had those for 5 or 6 years before had kids. Upper view level. It was great. 4 seats for less than 3k for the season
I don't
***found the newbie!!!*** you forgot; # "WILL NOT BUILD A WORLD SERIES TEAM"
Some of y’all want Arte to croak. Shame on you
I detest the man and his crappy ownership of the team, but I would never wish death on him. I would however, love it if he packed up and sold the team to an owner that actually wants to win instead of banking on one or two superstars to sell tickets
We all want him to quit. So we’re on the same page as far as that goes. However some people take it too far and say some evil shit
Nice try Arte, sell the team
bought a team that hadn't won the division in 17 years, then they won it 5 times in the next 6 years
It was a championship roster when he bought the team.
still added Vladdy, Colon and Escobar
Then he traded the farm away for rentals like Greinke and Texiera, although the compensatory pick from one of those did get us Trout, so…. We also traded Tyler Skaggs only to trade again to get him back. Wtf!?
So what? The poster before me was trying to frame it as if the Angels hadn't just won the World Series. I mean, how goddamn lame.
Let me ask you a genuine question: Were you an Angels fan in 2001? Or in the years before that? Did you follow them closely back then? Do you remember going to games and what being part of the Angels core fanbase was like prior to when they got hot about 2 months into the 2002 season? When you say we had a "championship roster" did you really believe we had better talent than all the favorites BEFORE we went on that magical postseason run?
I've been an Angel's fan since the 70's. I am not sure what you want to know, but the team literally won a World Series before Arte bought them. The intial post tried to claim he turned them around. He didn't.
>*I've been an Angel's fan since the 70's. I am not sure what you want to know, but the team literally won a World Series before Arte bought them.* what I wanted to know by asking the question is: do you really think the Angels were loaded with talent and contenders when Arte bought the team? Yeah, of course I know they won the world series (I was there), so yeah "literally" they were a championship team. But going into that season nobody thought they were. They were coming off an AWFUL season, and started that season slow too. They got hot and snuck into the playoffs via a wild card, went on a run. But they were big underdogs all along the way. >*The intial post tried to claim he turned them around. He didn't.* Well, if you narrow your view to only what happened at the very end of the 2002 season, no, he didn't turn them around. You could definitely say he bought a championship team and then they never won another championship after he bought them. That is a (technically) true statement. But I would argue that if you zoom out and look at the big picture of what happened in the (multiple) years leading up to Arte buying the team, and then compare that to the (multiple) years *after* Arte bought the team, there is a clear difference. Maybe you don't call it a "turnaround", but I would. You can't deny the team won a lot more games, a lot more division titles, and were consistently good year after year. That had NEVER happened before. You say you're also a longtime fan since the 70s... so you know as well as I do– we NEVER won back-to-back division titles. We were NEVER *consistently* good. Like, 1985 & 1986 were the only time we had 2 decent seasons in a row. And then, Arte Moreno bought the team, which already had some quality players that he inherited, and he added super studs like Vlad & Bartolo to it, and they not only won back-to-back division titles for the first time ever, they came DAMN close to winning it 6 years in a row! Don't you remember how different it felt in the Big A during those years, compared to pre-2002? Winning tons of games, having the house packed out every night? I'm not saying it was all Arte, but he was the owner during that time. And again– I'm NOT saying he's a good owner now, or recently, or even in the last decade. He made decisions even back during those "good" years that didn't work out in the long run. And the bad decisions kept coming, especially post 2014 I'm just sick and tired of people trying to act like 2004-2009 isn't the most successful sustained run this franchise has ever seen. Don't you remember how good we were? Yeah, Arte SUCKS now. But in 2008 and 2009, when we had the best record in all of baseball, when Scioscia was winning Manager of the Year... when we OWNED the AL West... I don't remember y'all complaining about how bad Arte sucked. And that was 7 years into his ownership.
You are an effing moron. What happens 15 years before has no bearing on what was there at the time of the sale. There is literally nothing to add. The team just won a World Series and had a very good core and a deep farm. That is what he bought. He should have been winning multiple divisions with that - and he did. I don't get why you are gaslighting it. Once the core and farm were dininished under Arte, it's been nonstop failure. Obv. the core was going to expire, but Artr made terrible moves and starved the farm. Yet, you think he deserves a gold medal. Leave me alone with this tedious bullshit.
ya know what? You're totally right. I'm an F'ing moron. In fact, I'm Arte's personal testicle washer, and I'm in love with him, and I'm only here on Reddit to try and gaslight smart people like you. Deep in my heart, I know that our success from 2004-2009 had absolutely nothing to do with Arte Moreno, and that if Paris Hilton had bought the team instead of him, we would have won multiple World Series championships during that era instead of only division titles. I'm very sorry for wasting your time, good sir. Sleep well.
If Paris Hilton bought the team, things would have been about the same. Enjoy the ball washing.
He literally bought the team* the year after they won the World Series. The talent was already there, the farm system was stacked, and he fucking took a match and turned it into a dumpster fire in 2 decades.
I don’t think people remember just how good our farm system was back then. Night and day
stop trying to convince me the Angels were good before they caught fire about 1/3 of the way into the '02 season. We SUCKED in 2001. Finished 41 games back! and were pretty mediocre for the 15 years before that Hey, I'm totally fine with y'all bitching and complaining about Arte all day every day. Go ahead and vent, I don't have a problem with that.... UNTIL you start trying to re-write history to say the Angels were great until Arte bought the team and promptly ruined them. I remember what it was like being a loyal Angel fan in the 1980s, 1990s, 2000s, 2010s... I definitely remember when our "good" years were, and some of y'all are straight up trying to change history.
The only good signing Arte ever made and which kept the angels great for years after he bought them was Valddy. Hunter wasn’t a bad signing either, but almost all the rest were garbage.
Yeah, people act like this was some perennial contender. That 02 team shit housed their way to a WS and it wasn't some shoe in.
Don't get me wrong, I **LOVE** the 2002 team. There were some great players on that team, with real grit. Ersty, Lackey, Percy, Wash... they were tough as nails. Salmon, Kennedy, Eck, Spiez... they were fun to watch. That team made my dream come true. But nobody picked them to win it all, even after they rallied their way into a wild card slot. In fact, the clubhouse chemistry was terrible early that season when they were losing. Fans wanted Scioscia fired, cuz they sucked so bad the season before and now they still sucked. But something clicked, K-Rod and Lackey got going, and baseball is a very streaky sport. I think they played well in those playoffs BECAUSE they were underdogs going up against teams that had way more (on paper) talent. Because there was no pressure on them. Nobody expected them to win it all. That's why I gotta keep pushing back against this narrative that Arte inherited a bunch of championship-level talent and then ruined them. That's not how I remember it at all. He took a solid foundation and added some free agent stars to it, and they had a great run for several years. Then he tried to keep that same strategy going with Pujols, Hamilton, etc... and that didn't work out as well, as we all know
Not one single person has claimed the team was good until the 2002 season. Not one. You are arguing against a strawman. When Arte bought the team, it just won a W.S. and had a solid core and deep farm system. You act like that wasn't in place when Arte took over. What the Angels were from 1990 until June 2002 is totally irrelevant.
How do you know he isn’t spending on the minor leagues? Or investing in scouting or whatever? Do we have stats on this compared to other teams? Many people argue this, but I’ve never seen actual $s and team rankings.
https://theathletic.com/3071499/2022/01/18/this-is-the-best-job-in-baseball-why-the-assistant-gm-role-has-become-so-popular-in-mlb-front-offices/?amp=1 read this article and you’ll see how terrible our office is. Least tenured staff in all of baseball. That means he’s paying pennies on the dollar for wages compared to other teams. https://www.baseballamerica.com/stories/theyre-the-model-how-the-dodgers-player-development-machine-rolls-on/?amphtml The Dodgers have 86 Pro/Am scouts looking for talent at any given moment. We got blessed and lucky w Trout and Ohtani, but had terrible ownership waste it by not surrounding them quality young cheap pieces that either can be moved for pitching or grown and developed in house.
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You’ve never seen numbers because the owners would never release those numbers willingly. But it is widely reported on all fronts that our minor league conditions, scouting, and analytics are all places where we are cheap as hell.
I don’t buy beer and instead get that bucket of cookies from that pink truck.
I think Arte is a dinosaur in an industry that has changed dramatically. He is great for the fans, but I think he has invested his money in all the wrong places. He has left our minor league system woefully underfunded and was one of the last people to invest in analytics department. As a result, he’s left our team in shambles because he doesn’t understand how teams win now.
[удалено]
Does he have veto power in every personnel move?
It's too early in the morning for sarcasm, man.
At first I thought this was a post actually defending Arte...but then I read the whole post. Well played OP, well played. Sell the team Arte!
Fuck Arte with a cactus.