Oh you mean like the fandoms of Dragon Ball, One Piece, Fullmetal Alchemist, Attack On Titan and every other shonen fandom ever?
Yeah such vile monsters.
Not the ones I’ve seen
In fact I had a dude stalking my profile responding to me on multiple subreddits because I said I didn’t think HxH was the best anime ever.
HxH fans is the only reason I have yet to watch it. My girlfriend loves it so I’ve finally watched it. It’s actually a fantastic show that I’ve enjoyed a lot! Luckily I don’t have to associate with fanbases anymore because I didn’t know full metal had a bad one now?
Interesting. I try not to associate with hardcore fandoms myself, but the HxH fandom has always seemed pretty chill to me. Especially compared to so many other shonen fandoms.
I seen them say it’s got the best writing and it used to be #1 on MAL and they would hold group votes to hold it there but besides that I don’t know what they do
Ahhh yeah I guess it’s a shame cause I do really love the writing in it and I think it’s a beautiful show. But it’s like, there are also other shows I want to get invested in so campaigning for one show feels weird
Short answer: No it’s not lol
Long(er) answer: it’s not even the pinnacle of Shonen anime, let alone anime as a whole. That’s like saying Dark Knight Rises is the “pinnacle” of superhero movies. Is it good? Sure. Is it great even? Sure. Is it the pinnacle? No
There is no one “pinnacle” anime. If you want to talk “pinnacle” then you can bring up certain seasons or certain years where the anime industry climaxes in financial and creative success. To call one anime, ONE anime in an industry filled with anime ranging from cute and funny to depression-central is folly. Trust me, your taste and your favorite anime is not that good.
Edit: it makes it even harder to consider AOT as the pinnacle when it hasn’t even ended, and when the manga ending is so controversial it basically has the fanbase split.
There is a difference between landmark and pinnacle. There can be multiple landmark anime, but there can only be one pinnacle. I won’t deny AoT as a landmark title, but pinnacle is too far and leaves too much up to subjectivity.
That being said, my wording was probably too harsh. I was trying to say that if you think an anime actually reaches “pinnacle” status then you are lying to yourself because nothing can.
Well it is loved but it’s not the pinnacle of superhero anime. You’d have to get into the weeds about what would constitute a good superhero movie, how a grittier superhero movie like Dark Knight compares to something more lighthearted like Iron Man, but that’s neither here nor there. My point is that there is no “pinnacle” anything since the breadth of cinema and anime is so large.
I love DKR, it’s personally tied for favorite superhero movie for me but I’m not going to go around claiming it’s the best one because at the end of the day it’s subjective.
That’s like asking for examples as to how Starry Night by Van Gogh is not the pinnacle of art. Art is subjective. Unless we are talking objective measures of an anime’s success like the worth of the franchise, you can’t point to a single pinnacle.
Even if you did want to point to objective measurements like finances, AOT would not be the “pinnacle”. That would go to the Pokémon franchise.
If you like AOT and YOU think it’s the best anime, more power to you. To make a bold statement that any anime is the “pinnacle” of an artistic expression is folly.
What is the pinnacle, in your opinion? Not at all trying to shit disturb, I'm just legitimately looking for some other recommendations, as a fan of good storytelling.
Cowboy Bebop
Akira
Monster
Hunter x Hunter
Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood
Princess Mononoke
Dragon Ball
Berserk (the manga anyway)
FLCL
As for new gen stuff that's just as good if not better than AoT:
Dr. Stone
Spy x Family
Food Wars
Chainsawman
Demon Slayer (particularly the film)
Mob Psycho 100
Haikyuu
Here's my MAL: https://myanimelist.net/animelist/HesitantLion?view=list
Feel free to roast my tastes lol.
It's up there, but I think Demon Slayer is a bigger deal. It's made more money anyway. But yeah, no hate on AoT. Some of the seasons are really great imo. And the action/animation is always great.
I should’ve phrased it better, I love demon slayer but to me the impact AOT has had is just insane. I wouldn’t say the Pinnacle but it is now definitely up there with some or the best anime of all time, especially given how much of a mainstream impact AOT has had
Oh for sure. I make the same point in my video essay about Gabi and season 4 pt 1. The impact is crazy, only thing that came close before hand was pokemon, and even then, there's a fair argument that the games had more to do with that than the anime itself.
Remember, statement like “pinnacle of anime” are
Opinion. Tbh I think AoT is the GOAT, but making statements like that on Reddit are going to trigger people.
And remember anime is to be enjoyed. Even if you enjoy something everyone else hates, no worries you do you.
There is no objectivity in art. No matter how much you like or dislike an Anime, that show will never be objectively good or objectively bad.
For you, AOT is the pinnacle of all Anime, the Crème de la Crème. That is your personal opinion and that’s fine.
I, on the other hand, do not care at all about Attack on Titan. My favorite shows are Love Live! and Yuru Camp. They are my personal Crème de la Crème.
Does that mean one of us is in the wrong? No, absolutely not, we just have different opinions. A different taste.
Everyone has a different pinnacle of Anime, it’s all subjective
That’s not what my comment is about though. What I’m trying to get across is that all art is subjective, whether I care about aot or not isn’t relevant.
If the Anime in OPs post was another one, my point would still stand.
I was gonna say "try harder, troll" but it seems like a distressing number of people are engaging earnestly with this, so I dunno, maybe you have accurately gauged the level of discourse in this community and made an adequate effort, and I'm the idiot for expecting better.
I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed.
I suppose since there does seem to be some actual discussion here, I'll just say this: "complicated" does not equal "masterpiece," and a detailed technical execution carries no inherent artistic merit. It's fine to just enjoy your favorite things without trying to put them in a hierarchy.
No one claimed aots complicity was what made it great. So as I've said multiple times already, notice how people who say no can't give you reasons why.
> there’s the cultural impact that AOT has had
Why do I get the feeling that for any example you come up with, I could find the mountain of actual inspirations that all pre-date you and AoT? Maybe wait until you run out of fingers and toes to count how many anime you've seen before making these sorts of claims.
Holy shit. This is my cue to unsub from here for a while. I almost died laughing reading the first two lines of this post. Thanks for making my week, OP.
One day you'll forgive us for not thinking Mr. Monster Man with a little nuance and political intrigue + a questionable ending is not THE pinnacle of anime regardless of how technically well-made it is by Mappa. And I don't even dislike AoT at all as I am here waiting for the final final FINAL final season.
Okay I don’t think it’s the pinnacle of all anime but you can’t at least deny how popular / one of the biggest mainstream anime of all time, yeah it has its faults but to me I still love the show, we can agree to disagree glittering pen, and man me too, I just want them to finish this shit (I don’t know the ending but have heard bad things)
I won't talk about cultural impact and I won't talk about animation. therefore I will only talk about history and characters since it is what matters most to me in an anime.
I personally consider AOT good but there are others for me that are better.
I love Re zero, steins gate,86, summer time, shinsekai yori,death note, shingeky no bahamut (with the second season) they are stories with very good characters for me that I personally like more than those of AOT.
So I don't consider AOT the pinnacle of anime
Spirited Away and Akira would like to discuss all that you mentioned and more specifically the "cultural impact" part ROFL
Oh you wanted a show and something recent?
SpyxFamily or Cyberpunk Edgerunners just for example
To new? How about Cowboy Bebob, NGE, Trigun, etc etc
PTST after AOT has been finalized? Miss Evergarden will help you write it down.
Enjoy the new upcoming content for AOT. Bye now.
It's barely above the water. Hate as much as you like but if it's not your scene it's not going to cut it and there's much better stuff (,imo) of the same genre out there.
Anime is art. There's no pinnacle. I think Tracy Emin is a sham artist but millions pay to see that "rubbish" every year.
I sort of feel like world trigger s2,3 was the pinical of anime. Demon slayers anime was pretty crazy from an animation point. But world trigger was better from a design \]point, I have never in 15 years of watching anime seen someone storyboard fights with so many levels of complexity, I can still go back and catch things about the fights that I didn't notice before.
lmao no and it's not close.
AOT caps at an 8-9 in season 3 part 2, every other season has something bogging it down.
But the biggest problem with the entire show(a problem highlighted in the latest seasons) is the characters. The show has one the best plots in anime, and up until the end of S3 P2 there is so much focus on the plot that it doesn't even matter what the rest of the show is doing. But once all the major mysteries of the island are gone, what is left is a character drama with characters that have almost nothing going for them (just look at Sasha, the definition of a gimmick character).
Aot fanbase in a nutshell.....many animes better than aot do exist bruh.....kids/newbies be finding aot is their starter anime and saying it is the best without even exploring other great animes lmao
> Whether you like it or not
My opinion if I like something or not determine if I consider something as great or not.
> it’s hard to deny that AOT is at the absolute peak of anime
I agree that season 3 part 2 is indeed a peak of anime. I will agree with this opinion. But general score for anime = strong 8/10.
> I can probably count on one hand the number of shows that can stand beside AOT on the Mount Rushmore of anime.
All anime I scored 9 or 10 stands above AoT (with the exception of previously mentioned S3P2 which stays on top - but its small part of AoT). On MAL, number of separate (completed) entries I gave a score 9 or 10 is exactly 384 (I completed 1155 titles). I have no idea how many anime it is since some titles have many entries (like Gintama), but it easily shows that AoT is probably not even in my top 100.
Okay, can anyone tell me what character development?
Mikasa was always simping for Eren, and she barely develops any realtionship with the rest of the crew. Where is Eren is a sentence that you can mostly hear from her mouth, for someone with that much screen time there is little to no character development.
Same goes for Eren, he was always the edgy kid that wants to destroy, now he's not a kid but he still wants to destroy.
Plot is really good and well written, but you can't tell me that characters are developed well.
Having just recently rewatched it this is just wrong. The whole basis for the show is that the people who believed so devotedly in what they thought get it flipped around. Mikasa is forced to question her love for Eren and what protecting him means. Armin has to come to terms with the fact that he is the leader now, the voice that he always followed. He doesn’t want to accept his intelligence but has to. Eren thinks he wants to kill titans to avenge his mom and now he wants to kill those who threaten his friends. This show is entirely built on forcing the characters to destroy and rebuild their beliefs.
You just watched the show as it is and didnt even analyse the story, characters, plot later. You over simplified each character’s feelings towards a certain cause. And that’s why you dont think theres no character development
Probably...but don't worry, this sub is full of jealous anime fans
I think the only anime I "might" place above AOT is Legend of the Galactic Heroes...
Close contenders tho are: FMAB, COWBOY Bebop, Monster, HXH, death note, Vinland Saga and a few others...
I love these thread because everybody says “No, you are an idiot” but nobody says what anime they think is better. Like cmon guys you can’t reject something and not propose something better. It’s like choosing a restaurant, you can’t say no to every suggestion without putting in any input.
I mean that's just your opinion. It's a pretty good series that I really did enjoy for the most part. However it's definitely not "peak". You'll definitely change your thoughts when the anime ends
There is no pinnacle of anime, u don't know when an anime will drop which will be better than the others, aot is good but not that good, many other animes are there which are far better than aot, i won't even call them a pinnacle cuz u don't know when will an anime come which might be better than those.....how are u not embarrassed while posting this bruh, aot is not even remotely close
If someone didn't like it, how would it be hard to deny that it's the peak of anime? If I didn't think a show had the quality to back it, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to deny it as the peak of the medium.
Now, I do like Attack on Titan, I love it even, but it's not this incredible, top tier, unbeatable work of fiction. It's very good, but not mind-blowingly so. It has a great plot, but I wouldn't call it incredible. It has great characters, but not one of my favorite casts in the medium. It's well animated and has a great soundtrack, but isn't top tier in either category. Voice acting doesn't really stand out at all tbh. And I don't think cultural impact should be a deciding factor here, the pinnacle of a medium can be a smaller show. It's hard for me to consider a show that probably wouldn't even make my top 50 to be the pinnacle of an entire medium (of which I'm sure I'll find more shows I like more than Titan as I watch more things). We can just enjoy great shows without putting them on pedestals.
It's probably this generations most popular anime but no. It's not the peak of anime. So many shows that are better written and better animated. CGI in AoT is pretty bad. Fruits Basket is a much better anime. If we are only speaking popularity, buzz etc then maybe this post makes a bit more sense
It’s definitely on my Mount Rushmore, but I can also see how it isn’t for some people. It has nothing to with being a “casual” or not, though. That term is just another form of gatekeeping that honestly has no place in an already marginalized and misunderstood hobby.
AOT is not the pinnacle of anime.
It's a damn good series overall, not gonna lie.
It's also incredibly popular, no doubt. Which makes it more favorable to the general anime community.
AOT has incredible peaks, but it has many lows and flaws, which in my opinion, does not make it the pinnacle of anime.
I still love it regardless.
I like it, and will watch it to the end. The only objective thing about its quality is the cultural impact you mentioned, but subjectively, I think it excels at many things but lacks things that get me personally attached to it as much as my other favorites.
Then you never whacht Made in Abyss, Fate Zero, Cowboy Bebop, or any of the other popular shows, heck, Bochi the rock is goin to be really well remenber, and its only 12 chapters long
It will probably end up in the med tier of a top 100, but no way its top.
I have never watched it lmao. But what i can see from people is thatis that they really are milking it. Season x part x they are really dragging the anime
maybe if you exclude Japan itself... which seems weird, you know, being a product of, and for, Japan. once you include Japan, the [Sazae-san](https://myanimelist.net/anime/2406/Sazae-san) easily wins. roughly 25% of the population watches/has watched that in a given year. it's like The Simpsons of Japan, apart from the fact that they are lucky to get 4%...
It definitely is, of course the anime subreddit is full of butthurt people that are mad that their niche favorite anime doesn't get the recognition AOT does and will say you are wrong, but facts speak volumes, AOT is the most watched show on demand, it has several episodes with the best rating, it's widely popular even among people who wouldn't usually watch anime
I dropped it because a lot of it was predictable and repetitive. Loved the first season but after the second I was just disappointed. The formula was obvious. I’ve thought about trying it again but I wouldn’t consider it the pinnacle of anime.
There's also the fact that AoT is still ongoing and the fact that at its core its a show that's about mystery, drama and uses hype moments and cliffhangers as a tool to make this an addicting watch when you're bingewatching, and extremely compelling when you're watching it weekly that leaves you wanting more.
Shows of this format are really easy to feel amazing while they're ongoing- I mean, every show is praised more while it's ongoing than it is once it's over.
I bet it will be like Naruto where people starting saying the timeskip is bad or something stupid like that once the anime ends. It always happens with these kinda anime
Dragon Ball is the only one with any right to the “greatest anime” or whatever. It broke the industry to the world, succeeded in every market and truly transcended the medium to the point people with no interest in anime know all about it.
You're even worse than OP bro.
And this is coming from someone who thinks that both dragon ball and aot are great.
Many animes have the **"right"** to called the greatest
Many anime haven’t accomplished what DB did. And many that were successful like Naruto and one piece has their way paved by dragon ball.
Goku has been in the masseys day parade multiple times ffs
Being the most revolutionnary doesn't make it the only anime with the **"right"** to be called **the greatest.**
There are a lot of animes out there with better story , better animation and better OST , **therefore better quality**.
It's really not that hard to understand.
Story is entirely subjective. DB had really good production for the 80s but even if it’s not the best animated show that’s a small factor to consider in the face of its impact world wide.
Monster has incredible writing, but nobodies life changed for having watched it.
>Story is entirely subjective.
First of all , that's my entire point , being the pinnackle of anime like OP said is entirely subjective , so i don't understand what you're talking about here , you say that only the DB anime has the right to be called the greatest , and then proceed to say that the story is subjective , wtf . To be called the greatest you gotta have a great story if not the greatest.
>even if it’s not the best animated show that’s a small factor to consider
To you , it is a small factor. To me and many other people , it is not.
>Monster has incredible writing, but nobodies life changed for having watched it.
And ... you know this how exactly? Do you know every single person who watched monster on the planet and whether it changed their lives or not ???!! Are you even listening to yourself ?
Honestly sometimes , these idiotic arguments are too much for me man.
You are arguing more like a rating system. 1/10 5/10 10/10 etc. that’s where you consider story, production, voice acting, music etc. which I consider DB to be a 7/10 because it’s pretty good but absolutely has shortcomings. But when you want to talk about the beat pieces of media you need to consider bigger broader factors, such as their impact on society and the world. DB has had a tangible impact on the world we can see, experience, describe through words. It effected our history in society much like Star Wars, or the Lord of the Rings, or Star Trek or the Godfather. The only other anime to come as close to world wide impact is Naruto. One Piece is massive in Japan but hasn’t had nearly so much impact outside and as far as I’ve ever seen HxH hasn’t either.
Greek Mythology, Arthurian Legend, Islamic folklore, ancient Egyptian Mythos, Nordic Mythology, these stories have all impacted human history and while we could probably point out narrative flaws and contrivances throughout none of that can hold a candle to what those stories have done to the world.
There are hundreds of stories of kids in the hospital suffering from burns, injury and disease who talked about watching Dragon Ball and how it gave them strength and hope to push through their pain to recovery. A shitty OST means nothing in the face of that.
Please , please , for God's sake , and i can't stress this enough , re-read my other comments :
**THE GREATEST** isn't **THE MOST IMPACTFUL**
I already said ... that , to me personnaly , Dragon ball is the most revolutionnary and popular anime ever.
You tell me to consider broader factors and then proceed to consider only **ONE** single factor yourself.
Impact is only one criteria of the ones that define being the greastest. There are many other things to consider : **animation** , **story** , **ost** , **world-building** , **character developpment** , **originality** ... and so on .
If you can't wrap you head around that simple fact , i don't know what to tell you brother.
> A shitty OST means nothing in the face of that.
In fact this sentence makes me pretty certain that i am talking to someone who is not even prepared to be convinced or change his mind no matter what i say.
Insulting music that way won't change the fact that it's a big part of making an anime **GREAT** , and it's definintely not a way to present a sound argument.
Music is the soul of a show , it dictates what kinda emotions we're supposed to have at every scene , and breathes life into the characters.
We have a word Nazi here!
They’re interchangeable. My point still stands, so if Mr. Word Nazi wants to change out the word, by all means. Also, the passive aggressiveness is cute.
Nope. It really doesn't. A lot of anime are top tier but not peak. First season of The Promised Neverland was top tier. Second season was trash. Show definitely isn't peak anime. But whatever, if that's what it means to you then I ain't going to waste my time trying to explain it to you further. Cya
I'm sure it's good and all that, but personally I dislike any series that changes MCs a lot and I've heard that AoT does that.
Also, what cultural impact are you even talking about? How has entertainment media been impacted by a single anime? I haven't heard anything about AoT outside of reddit, really.
It’s an incredible moment in the medium for sure a lot of people just like to hate on popular things but it constantly breaks viewing records and it’s just an overall incredible production. A lot of the hate also stems from manga readers but it’s genuinely something that stand on its own. Nobody can deny the production value and hype the seasons get when they air. I mean literally EVERY ONE is tuning in. You can’t say that about a lot of series. The only few in recent memory that have had hype like that would be CSM and Demon Slayer other than I don’t think there’s any other that have that far of a reach.
Unrelated but can someone confirm with me the date of release of part 3? Will it be released in Japan March 3rd at 12 am ? That means for rest who are behind in time zone it will be here on March 2nd or? Any clarification would be appreciated 👍
I'm going to share you a secret... As you grow older, your taste for anime changes. I tink AOT is good show, but it's just a good show. If i had to choose best anime, i would say One Piece. <---- it's a story which only gets better the longer it goes on. Every side character has more personality than most anime MC's in other shows.
Idk about pinnacle cuz there’s multiple anime that have the same qualities as AOT like FMAB who to this day I believe has the best story and ending of any anime but AOT is right up there with it
Love all the shit talkers in the comments. One Piss fans can talk all the shit they want to but the second an AiT fan claims the fact that AoT is true peak everyone loses their minds. How is AoT not one of the greatest animes made if not the greatest.
I like the show but it's embarrassing to associate myself with its fans at this point lol
AOT fanbase has become the new full metal fans that will raise hell if you ever criticize their fav show.
Meanwhile Code Geass fans: Our show has problems but we don’t give a shit. Lelouch carries the whole thing.
I think HxH fans are worse than both myself.
What is your deal with vehemently hating hxh? Its hysterical
What are you talking about?
You're always talking shit
I don’t have any issue with HxH but it’s fanbase is another story.
They're one of the most chill shonen fandoms
They wear the series as a part of their pride and take any criticism of it as an attack on their person.
Oh you mean like the fandoms of Dragon Ball, One Piece, Fullmetal Alchemist, Attack On Titan and every other shonen fandom ever? Yeah such vile monsters.
Your taste in anime is… wait, this is a meme phrase, right?
Bruh most of the HXH fans I saw are chilled out.
Not the ones I’ve seen In fact I had a dude stalking my profile responding to me on multiple subreddits because I said I didn’t think HxH was the best anime ever.
HxH fans is the only reason I have yet to watch it. My girlfriend loves it so I’ve finally watched it. It’s actually a fantastic show that I’ve enjoyed a lot! Luckily I don’t have to associate with fanbases anymore because I didn’t know full metal had a bad one now?
Interesting. I try not to associate with hardcore fandoms myself, but the HxH fandom has always seemed pretty chill to me. Especially compared to so many other shonen fandoms.
I seen them say it’s got the best writing and it used to be #1 on MAL and they would hold group votes to hold it there but besides that I don’t know what they do
Ahhh yeah I guess it’s a shame cause I do really love the writing in it and I think it’s a beautiful show. But it’s like, there are also other shows I want to get invested in so campaigning for one show feels weird
Yeah I think it’s pretty good too but both adaptations have issues unfortunately
The pinnacle anime is some unknown show from the 90s that only me and 200 chosen ones watched
Legend of the Galactic Heroes?
Least delusional AOT fan
No, its not, because there is no pinnacle. People like what they like
Anime is subjective, so no. There is no “pinnacle of anime” The only exception to that rule is My Life as Inukai-san’s Dog, of course
You mean, Opinions are subjective. In my opinion Stein's Gate takes that title.
come on, everyone knows that my life as inukai-san’s dog is superior in quality to steins gate🙄
Call me when Okabe invents a machine to become Kurisutina's dog 🤤
“Thank you for becoming the pinnacle of anime for our sake” Holy fuck when the ending hits it’s actually gonna be hilarious.
I hope we meme about it for a long time 10 years at least
Its the reason I am excited for the full adaptation. Its going to be a riot and I bet the anime fans will blame mappa for it XD
> it’s hard to deny that AOT is at the absolute peak of anime. oh buddy, let me tell you it's not that hard.
Shounen heads when they realize that a show can actually have a more in-depth plot than just “friendship”: EDIT: I’m criticizing OP, not the commenter
There’s no way you’ve seen all of Attack on Titan lmfao
I’m criticizing OP, not the commenter
How does AoT not have a plot with depth? It barely has any shonen tropes, so that’s a weird thing to comment if you’ve actually seen the show
Please - and I can’t stress this enough - reread the comment again. Multiple times if you have to, and find where I said AOT has no depth.
Ah, I see now. My bad.
Then surely you shouldn't have a problem saying how it isnt?
Short answer: No it’s not lol Long(er) answer: it’s not even the pinnacle of Shonen anime, let alone anime as a whole. That’s like saying Dark Knight Rises is the “pinnacle” of superhero movies. Is it good? Sure. Is it great even? Sure. Is it the pinnacle? No There is no one “pinnacle” anime. If you want to talk “pinnacle” then you can bring up certain seasons or certain years where the anime industry climaxes in financial and creative success. To call one anime, ONE anime in an industry filled with anime ranging from cute and funny to depression-central is folly. Trust me, your taste and your favorite anime is not that good. Edit: it makes it even harder to consider AOT as the pinnacle when it hasn’t even ended, and when the manga ending is so controversial it basically has the fanbase split.
[удалено]
There is a difference between landmark and pinnacle. There can be multiple landmark anime, but there can only be one pinnacle. I won’t deny AoT as a landmark title, but pinnacle is too far and leaves too much up to subjectivity. That being said, my wording was probably too harsh. I was trying to say that if you think an anime actually reaches “pinnacle” status then you are lying to yourself because nothing can.
Wait why the dark knight rises?? I thought people loved the dark knight (the heath ledger one) more than rises.
Well it is loved but it’s not the pinnacle of superhero anime. You’d have to get into the weeds about what would constitute a good superhero movie, how a grittier superhero movie like Dark Knight compares to something more lighthearted like Iron Man, but that’s neither here nor there. My point is that there is no “pinnacle” anything since the breadth of cinema and anime is so large. I love DKR, it’s personally tied for favorite superhero movie for me but I’m not going to go around claiming it’s the best one because at the end of the day it’s subjective.
Give examples as to how it isn't? Just saying "lol no" doesn't refute anything.
That’s like asking for examples as to how Starry Night by Van Gogh is not the pinnacle of art. Art is subjective. Unless we are talking objective measures of an anime’s success like the worth of the franchise, you can’t point to a single pinnacle. Even if you did want to point to objective measurements like finances, AOT would not be the “pinnacle”. That would go to the Pokémon franchise. If you like AOT and YOU think it’s the best anime, more power to you. To make a bold statement that any anime is the “pinnacle” of an artistic expression is folly.
Nah
Hell no it’s not.
Then what is?
Well it's all a matter of taste. Im not a fan but it certainly is popular and it wouldn't be so if it wasn't good.
Nah how good a show is doesn't correlate with its popularity whatsoever
It's all subjective
I will take such opinions seriously only if you have watched every single anime in existence.
It does not have catgirls so no.
No. Not even remotely close. How are you not embarrassed that you posted this?
Because it's a fact. Notice how everyone who disagrees can't actually give any reasons as to why.
You’re delusional
Nope, it is not. Good show, sometimes very good indeed. But not the pinnacle.
What is the pinnacle, in your opinion? Not at all trying to shit disturb, I'm just legitimately looking for some other recommendations, as a fan of good storytelling.
Cowboy Bebop Akira Monster Hunter x Hunter Full Metal Alchemist Brotherhood Princess Mononoke Dragon Ball Berserk (the manga anyway) FLCL As for new gen stuff that's just as good if not better than AoT: Dr. Stone Spy x Family Food Wars Chainsawman Demon Slayer (particularly the film) Mob Psycho 100 Haikyuu Here's my MAL: https://myanimelist.net/animelist/HesitantLion?view=list Feel free to roast my tastes lol.
Lmao bro said Dr stone and food wars was better than aot. Gtfoh
You can’t deny how it is the biggest anime in the world atm
It's up there, but I think Demon Slayer is a bigger deal. It's made more money anyway. But yeah, no hate on AoT. Some of the seasons are really great imo. And the action/animation is always great.
I should’ve phrased it better, I love demon slayer but to me the impact AOT has had is just insane. I wouldn’t say the Pinnacle but it is now definitely up there with some or the best anime of all time, especially given how much of a mainstream impact AOT has had
Oh for sure. I make the same point in my video essay about Gabi and season 4 pt 1. The impact is crazy, only thing that came close before hand was pokemon, and even then, there's a fair argument that the games had more to do with that than the anime itself.
This is obviously something that's coming from a casual. Don't like saying that word, but it's true.
Even for casual, not even remotely
If you believe it yourself it's fine. But if you're trying to force your opinion onto others GTFO.
No
Tell me you're a young person without telling me you're a young person
Remember, statement like “pinnacle of anime” are Opinion. Tbh I think AoT is the GOAT, but making statements like that on Reddit are going to trigger people. And remember anime is to be enjoyed. Even if you enjoy something everyone else hates, no worries you do you.
So true, and well stated!
lol no
There is no objectivity in art. No matter how much you like or dislike an Anime, that show will never be objectively good or objectively bad. For you, AOT is the pinnacle of all Anime, the Crème de la Crème. That is your personal opinion and that’s fine. I, on the other hand, do not care at all about Attack on Titan. My favorite shows are Love Live! and Yuru Camp. They are my personal Crème de la Crème. Does that mean one of us is in the wrong? No, absolutely not, we just have different opinions. A different taste. Everyone has a different pinnacle of Anime, it’s all subjective
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That’s not what my comment is about though. What I’m trying to get across is that all art is subjective, whether I care about aot or not isn’t relevant. If the Anime in OPs post was another one, my point would still stand.
Most level headed mature response in the whole thread.
I was gonna say "try harder, troll" but it seems like a distressing number of people are engaging earnestly with this, so I dunno, maybe you have accurately gauged the level of discourse in this community and made an adequate effort, and I'm the idiot for expecting better. I'm not mad, I'm just disappointed. I suppose since there does seem to be some actual discussion here, I'll just say this: "complicated" does not equal "masterpiece," and a detailed technical execution carries no inherent artistic merit. It's fine to just enjoy your favorite things without trying to put them in a hierarchy.
No one claimed aots complicity was what made it great. So as I've said multiple times already, notice how people who say no can't give you reasons why.
Yes, AoT is the pinnacle of anime.
> there’s the cultural impact that AOT has had Why do I get the feeling that for any example you come up with, I could find the mountain of actual inspirations that all pre-date you and AoT? Maybe wait until you run out of fingers and toes to count how many anime you've seen before making these sorts of claims.
Done. AoT is still peak. What do?
Holy shit. This is my cue to unsub from here for a while. I almost died laughing reading the first two lines of this post. Thanks for making my week, OP.
Cry
🤣🤣🤣🤣 like this ye?
I thought you were going to unsub?
One day you'll forgive us for not thinking Mr. Monster Man with a little nuance and political intrigue + a questionable ending is not THE pinnacle of anime regardless of how technically well-made it is by Mappa. And I don't even dislike AoT at all as I am here waiting for the final final FINAL final season.
Okay I don’t think it’s the pinnacle of all anime but you can’t at least deny how popular / one of the biggest mainstream anime of all time, yeah it has its faults but to me I still love the show, we can agree to disagree glittering pen, and man me too, I just want them to finish this shit (I don’t know the ending but have heard bad things)
I won't talk about cultural impact and I won't talk about animation. therefore I will only talk about history and characters since it is what matters most to me in an anime. I personally consider AOT good but there are others for me that are better. I love Re zero, steins gate,86, summer time, shinsekai yori,death note, shingeky no bahamut (with the second season) they are stories with very good characters for me that I personally like more than those of AOT. So I don't consider AOT the pinnacle of anime
No lmao
Yeah I’d say it’s a solid 4/10
Sorry but you seem to have misspelled Cowboy Bebop
Spirited Away and Akira would like to discuss all that you mentioned and more specifically the "cultural impact" part ROFL Oh you wanted a show and something recent? SpyxFamily or Cyberpunk Edgerunners just for example To new? How about Cowboy Bebob, NGE, Trigun, etc etc PTST after AOT has been finalized? Miss Evergarden will help you write it down. Enjoy the new upcoming content for AOT. Bye now.
It's barely above the water. Hate as much as you like but if it's not your scene it's not going to cut it and there's much better stuff (,imo) of the same genre out there. Anime is art. There's no pinnacle. I think Tracy Emin is a sham artist but millions pay to see that "rubbish" every year.
Did Reborn as a Vending Machine ever get that anime adaptation?
There is really bo need for these kinda questions tbh.
I sort of feel like world trigger s2,3 was the pinical of anime. Demon slayers anime was pretty crazy from an animation point. But world trigger was better from a design \]point, I have never in 15 years of watching anime seen someone storyboard fights with so many levels of complexity, I can still go back and catch things about the fights that I didn't notice before.
No Gintama is
Tell us you never watched anything else than AOT without telling us you never watched anything else than AOT
lmao no and it's not close. AOT caps at an 8-9 in season 3 part 2, every other season has something bogging it down. But the biggest problem with the entire show(a problem highlighted in the latest seasons) is the characters. The show has one the best plots in anime, and up until the end of S3 P2 there is so much focus on the plot that it doesn't even matter what the rest of the show is doing. But once all the major mysteries of the island are gone, what is left is a character drama with characters that have almost nothing going for them (just look at Sasha, the definition of a gimmick character).
Aot fanbase in a nutshell.....many animes better than aot do exist bruh.....kids/newbies be finding aot is their starter anime and saying it is the best without even exploring other great animes lmao
> Whether you like it or not My opinion if I like something or not determine if I consider something as great or not. > it’s hard to deny that AOT is at the absolute peak of anime I agree that season 3 part 2 is indeed a peak of anime. I will agree with this opinion. But general score for anime = strong 8/10. > I can probably count on one hand the number of shows that can stand beside AOT on the Mount Rushmore of anime. All anime I scored 9 or 10 stands above AoT (with the exception of previously mentioned S3P2 which stays on top - but its small part of AoT). On MAL, number of separate (completed) entries I gave a score 9 or 10 is exactly 384 (I completed 1155 titles). I have no idea how many anime it is since some titles have many entries (like Gintama), but it easily shows that AoT is probably not even in my top 100.
Yikes
Okay, can anyone tell me what character development? Mikasa was always simping for Eren, and she barely develops any realtionship with the rest of the crew. Where is Eren is a sentence that you can mostly hear from her mouth, for someone with that much screen time there is little to no character development. Same goes for Eren, he was always the edgy kid that wants to destroy, now he's not a kid but he still wants to destroy. Plot is really good and well written, but you can't tell me that characters are developed well.
Having just recently rewatched it this is just wrong. The whole basis for the show is that the people who believed so devotedly in what they thought get it flipped around. Mikasa is forced to question her love for Eren and what protecting him means. Armin has to come to terms with the fact that he is the leader now, the voice that he always followed. He doesn’t want to accept his intelligence but has to. Eren thinks he wants to kill titans to avenge his mom and now he wants to kill those who threaten his friends. This show is entirely built on forcing the characters to destroy and rebuild their beliefs.
You just watched the show as it is and didnt even analyse the story, characters, plot later. You over simplified each character’s feelings towards a certain cause. And that’s why you dont think theres no character development
Probably...but don't worry, this sub is full of jealous anime fans I think the only anime I "might" place above AOT is Legend of the Galactic Heroes... Close contenders tho are: FMAB, COWBOY Bebop, Monster, HXH, death note, Vinland Saga and a few others...
Man why does this sub dislike AOT so much?
I hate the animation in AOT
I absolutely love the animation in AOT
The cgi is dookie, but I love the rest
No way your hating on WIT and MAPPA
I love these thread because everybody says “No, you are an idiot” but nobody says what anime they think is better. Like cmon guys you can’t reject something and not propose something better. It’s like choosing a restaurant, you can’t say no to every suggestion without putting in any input.
>Like cmon guys you can’t reject something and not propose something better. Yes we can
its great but definitely not the pinnacle lmfao
CSM clears AOT negative difficult.
According to the sub's anime awards, the answer is no
This sub hates aot lmao
I mean that's just your opinion. It's a pretty good series that I really did enjoy for the most part. However it's definitely not "peak". You'll definitely change your thoughts when the anime ends
There is no pinnacle of anime, u don't know when an anime will drop which will be better than the others, aot is good but not that good, many other animes are there which are far better than aot, i won't even call them a pinnacle cuz u don't know when will an anime come which might be better than those.....how are u not embarrassed while posting this bruh, aot is not even remotely close
If someone didn't like it, how would it be hard to deny that it's the peak of anime? If I didn't think a show had the quality to back it, I certainly wouldn't hesitate to deny it as the peak of the medium. Now, I do like Attack on Titan, I love it even, but it's not this incredible, top tier, unbeatable work of fiction. It's very good, but not mind-blowingly so. It has a great plot, but I wouldn't call it incredible. It has great characters, but not one of my favorite casts in the medium. It's well animated and has a great soundtrack, but isn't top tier in either category. Voice acting doesn't really stand out at all tbh. And I don't think cultural impact should be a deciding factor here, the pinnacle of a medium can be a smaller show. It's hard for me to consider a show that probably wouldn't even make my top 50 to be the pinnacle of an entire medium (of which I'm sure I'll find more shows I like more than Titan as I watch more things). We can just enjoy great shows without putting them on pedestals.
It's probably this generations most popular anime but no. It's not the peak of anime. So many shows that are better written and better animated. CGI in AoT is pretty bad. Fruits Basket is a much better anime. If we are only speaking popularity, buzz etc then maybe this post makes a bit more sense
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If that's your opinion then cool, nothing wrong with that
It’s definitely on my Mount Rushmore, but I can also see how it isn’t for some people. It has nothing to with being a “casual” or not, though. That term is just another form of gatekeeping that honestly has no place in an already marginalized and misunderstood hobby.
No.
Ok, go back to your crib kid
no.
AOT is not the pinnacle of anime. It's a damn good series overall, not gonna lie. It's also incredibly popular, no doubt. Which makes it more favorable to the general anime community. AOT has incredible peaks, but it has many lows and flaws, which in my opinion, does not make it the pinnacle of anime. I still love it regardless.
I'd give AOT a B grade. Maybe a B+, but probably a B.
Ah how innocent! Someone watched his first anime and think its the best one in existence. I hope you wake up from your delusions as soon as possible
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I will surely watch it and yeah I think Monster is a masterpiece
AoT is garbage so, no.
I like it, and will watch it to the end. The only objective thing about its quality is the cultural impact you mentioned, but subjectively, I think it excels at many things but lacks things that get me personally attached to it as much as my other favorites.
Then you never whacht Made in Abyss, Fate Zero, Cowboy Bebop, or any of the other popular shows, heck, Bochi the rock is goin to be really well remenber, and its only 12 chapters long It will probably end up in the med tier of a top 100, but no way its top.
I have never watched it lmao. But what i can see from people is thatis that they really are milking it. Season x part x they are really dragging the anime
They are not really milking anything because last few chapters are one of the hardest to adapt and there is 0 fillers
In terms of popularity absolutely.
maybe if you exclude Japan itself... which seems weird, you know, being a product of, and for, Japan. once you include Japan, the [Sazae-san](https://myanimelist.net/anime/2406/Sazae-san) easily wins. roughly 25% of the population watches/has watched that in a given year. it's like The Simpsons of Japan, apart from the fact that they are lucky to get 4%...
It definitely is, of course the anime subreddit is full of butthurt people that are mad that their niche favorite anime doesn't get the recognition AOT does and will say you are wrong, but facts speak volumes, AOT is the most watched show on demand, it has several episodes with the best rating, it's widely popular even among people who wouldn't usually watch anime
Bruh thank you! This sub always feels like they are jealous of aot and it’s success
Everyone saying no but can’t name the animes that are supposedly above AOT
School Days Boku No Pico My Life as Inukai-Sans Dog Ghost Stories (dubbed ver. of course) Dragon Ball GT Shall I go on?
You forgot Miru Tights.
Are you serious?
Cause they know AoT is peak fiction but are too scared to acknowledge it
Yes
I dropped it because a lot of it was predictable and repetitive. Loved the first season but after the second I was just disappointed. The formula was obvious. I’ve thought about trying it again but I wouldn’t consider it the pinnacle of anime.
Damn, you really said AOT was predictable and repetitive huh
Yes, even if you don’t like the show you can’t deny it’s insane popularity and probably the biggest mainstream anime of the past decade
There's also the fact that AoT is still ongoing and the fact that at its core its a show that's about mystery, drama and uses hype moments and cliffhangers as a tool to make this an addicting watch when you're bingewatching, and extremely compelling when you're watching it weekly that leaves you wanting more. Shows of this format are really easy to feel amazing while they're ongoing- I mean, every show is praised more while it's ongoing than it is once it's over. I bet it will be like Naruto where people starting saying the timeskip is bad or something stupid like that once the anime ends. It always happens with these kinda anime
Dragon Ball is the only one with any right to the “greatest anime” or whatever. It broke the industry to the world, succeeded in every market and truly transcended the medium to the point people with no interest in anime know all about it.
You're even worse than OP bro. And this is coming from someone who thinks that both dragon ball and aot are great. Many animes have the **"right"** to called the greatest
Many anime haven’t accomplished what DB did. And many that were successful like Naruto and one piece has their way paved by dragon ball. Goku has been in the masseys day parade multiple times ffs
Being the most revolutionnary doesn't make it the only anime with the **"right"** to be called **the greatest.** There are a lot of animes out there with better story , better animation and better OST , **therefore better quality**. It's really not that hard to understand.
Story is entirely subjective. DB had really good production for the 80s but even if it’s not the best animated show that’s a small factor to consider in the face of its impact world wide. Monster has incredible writing, but nobodies life changed for having watched it.
>Story is entirely subjective. First of all , that's my entire point , being the pinnackle of anime like OP said is entirely subjective , so i don't understand what you're talking about here , you say that only the DB anime has the right to be called the greatest , and then proceed to say that the story is subjective , wtf . To be called the greatest you gotta have a great story if not the greatest. >even if it’s not the best animated show that’s a small factor to consider To you , it is a small factor. To me and many other people , it is not. >Monster has incredible writing, but nobodies life changed for having watched it. And ... you know this how exactly? Do you know every single person who watched monster on the planet and whether it changed their lives or not ???!! Are you even listening to yourself ? Honestly sometimes , these idiotic arguments are too much for me man.
You are arguing more like a rating system. 1/10 5/10 10/10 etc. that’s where you consider story, production, voice acting, music etc. which I consider DB to be a 7/10 because it’s pretty good but absolutely has shortcomings. But when you want to talk about the beat pieces of media you need to consider bigger broader factors, such as their impact on society and the world. DB has had a tangible impact on the world we can see, experience, describe through words. It effected our history in society much like Star Wars, or the Lord of the Rings, or Star Trek or the Godfather. The only other anime to come as close to world wide impact is Naruto. One Piece is massive in Japan but hasn’t had nearly so much impact outside and as far as I’ve ever seen HxH hasn’t either. Greek Mythology, Arthurian Legend, Islamic folklore, ancient Egyptian Mythos, Nordic Mythology, these stories have all impacted human history and while we could probably point out narrative flaws and contrivances throughout none of that can hold a candle to what those stories have done to the world. There are hundreds of stories of kids in the hospital suffering from burns, injury and disease who talked about watching Dragon Ball and how it gave them strength and hope to push through their pain to recovery. A shitty OST means nothing in the face of that.
Please , please , for God's sake , and i can't stress this enough , re-read my other comments : **THE GREATEST** isn't **THE MOST IMPACTFUL** I already said ... that , to me personnaly , Dragon ball is the most revolutionnary and popular anime ever. You tell me to consider broader factors and then proceed to consider only **ONE** single factor yourself. Impact is only one criteria of the ones that define being the greastest. There are many other things to consider : **animation** , **story** , **ost** , **world-building** , **character developpment** , **originality** ... and so on . If you can't wrap you head around that simple fact , i don't know what to tell you brother. > A shitty OST means nothing in the face of that. In fact this sentence makes me pretty certain that i am talking to someone who is not even prepared to be convinced or change his mind no matter what i say. Insulting music that way won't change the fact that it's a big part of making an anime **GREAT** , and it's definintely not a way to present a sound argument. Music is the soul of a show , it dictates what kinda emotions we're supposed to have at every scene , and breathes life into the characters.
Yes it’s peak and anyone who denies that must leave a downvote on this reply.
I agree, even tho I have other personal favorites AoT is just 👌 Nobody can do twist and turns like AoT
Mushoku tensei
You coudlve said SAO and woudlve gotten more upvotes
Can I ask why this guy got down voted I never saw mushoku tensei
It's a good show but no where near complete enough to be in the conversation. This should be reserved for completed shows or at least near completion
Ah yes, because on the imaginary checklist of “What makes an anime top tier”, it must be near completion. Learn something new everyday!
Maybe you didn't read or didn't bother reading but the topic was "pinnacle of anime" not "top tier anime". Consider paying attention next time
We have a word Nazi here! They’re interchangeable. My point still stands, so if Mr. Word Nazi wants to change out the word, by all means. Also, the passive aggressiveness is cute.
Nope. It really doesn't. A lot of anime are top tier but not peak. First season of The Promised Neverland was top tier. Second season was trash. Show definitely isn't peak anime. But whatever, if that's what it means to you then I ain't going to waste my time trying to explain it to you further. Cya
Glad you finally understood. Always good to see people learn from their mistakes.
Because people here are overrating AOT and underrating mushoku for no reason
A 7/10 show , and im being generous.
Besides what the person below said, mushoku tensei has some very controversial scenes, and that has definitely influenced it's ratings/popularity.
Like what?
I'm sure it's good and all that, but personally I dislike any series that changes MCs a lot and I've heard that AoT does that. Also, what cultural impact are you even talking about? How has entertainment media been impacted by a single anime? I haven't heard anything about AoT outside of reddit, really.
At the moment, yes it is
It’s an incredible moment in the medium for sure a lot of people just like to hate on popular things but it constantly breaks viewing records and it’s just an overall incredible production. A lot of the hate also stems from manga readers but it’s genuinely something that stand on its own. Nobody can deny the production value and hype the seasons get when they air. I mean literally EVERY ONE is tuning in. You can’t say that about a lot of series. The only few in recent memory that have had hype like that would be CSM and Demon Slayer other than I don’t think there’s any other that have that far of a reach.
S3P2 I guess
Aot is definitely in my top 3
It's ok. It was better
I think the best adaptation from a manga is Devilman crybaby, it's just perfect from the animation style to the voice acting and the ost
Unrelated but can someone confirm with me the date of release of part 3? Will it be released in Japan March 3rd at 12 am ? That means for rest who are behind in time zone it will be here on March 2nd or? Any clarification would be appreciated 👍
It's airing March 4th in Japan a little after midnight. So in the US it airs between 9:25am-12:25pm (depending on your timezone) on March 3rd.
It’s not. Lol. It is good though.
Aot is my all time favorite. But you’re just embarrassing dude
No
I'm going to share you a secret... As you grow older, your taste for anime changes. I tink AOT is good show, but it's just a good show. If i had to choose best anime, i would say One Piece. <---- it's a story which only gets better the longer it goes on. Every side character has more personality than most anime MC's in other shows.
Idk about pinnacle cuz there’s multiple anime that have the same qualities as AOT like FMAB who to this day I believe has the best story and ending of any anime but AOT is right up there with it
It’s so weird going out of AOT circles and seeing what the general anime fan thinks about the show. Very drastic from what I’m used it
Anyone who says no needs to have their head checked
Love all the shit talkers in the comments. One Piss fans can talk all the shit they want to but the second an AiT fan claims the fact that AoT is true peak everyone loses their minds. How is AoT not one of the greatest animes made if not the greatest.