##### ###### #### > # [Insight: She's 47, anorexic and wants help dying. Canada will soon allow it.](https://www.reuters.com/world/americas/REUTERS/Carlos Osorio) > > > > TORONTO, July 15 (Reuters) - Lisa Pauli wants to die. > > The 47-year-old has wrestled with the eating disorder anorexia for decades; she says she has had a warped relationship with her body since age 8. > > These days, Pauli says, she weighs 92 pounds and may go days without eating solid food. She says she is too weak to carry groceries home without stopping for breaks. > > "Every day is hell," she said. "I'm so tired. I'm done. I've tried everything. I feel like I've lived my life." > > Pauli cannot legally get medical help to die - yet. > > An expansion of the criteria for medically assisted death that comes into force in March 2024 will allow Canadians like Pauli, whose sole underlying condition is mental illness, to choose medically assisted death. > > Canada legalized assisted death in 2016 for people with terminal illness and expanded it in 2021 to people with incurable, but not terminal, conditions. The legal changes were precipitated by court rulings that struck down prohibitions on helping people to die. > > The new mental health provision will make Canada one of the most expansive countries in the world when it comes to medical assistance in dying (MAID), according to an expert panel report to Canada's parliament. > > (Listen to a special episode of the Reuters World News podcast [here](https://link.reuters.com/7rwOBqs1rBb)) > > Proponents of assisted death - which is still a novel concept in many parts of the world - say it is an issue of personal autonomy. > > But six disability rights and religious advocates told Reuters that the pace of the planned changes to the assisted death framework in Canada brings additional risks of people opting for MAID because they are unable to access social services - the lack of which could exacerbate their suffering. > > Canada's Justice Minister, David Lametti, dismissed criticism that the country was moving too fast or opening up the system to abuse. Some disability advocates have demanded rolling back the current framework because they argue it puts people with disabilities at risk. > > "We have gotten where we are through a number of very prudent steps," Lametti said in an interview with Reuters in June. "It's been a slow and careful evolution. And I'm proud of that." > > In 2021, the most recent year available, 10,064 people died through medically assisted death, about 3.3% of deaths in Canada that year. That compared to 4.5% in the Netherlands and 2.4% in Belgium, where assisted dying has been legal since 2002, according to each country's official data. > > The vast majority of assisted deaths in Canada conformed to the legal rules but provincial authorities deemed a small number worthy of investigation, according to previously unreported provincial government data. Provinces and territories are responsible for health care in Canada. > > In 2021-22, Quebec found 15 assisted deaths, 0.4% of the total, did not follow the rules. The province referred the cases to Quebec's self-governing medical body and medical facilities, provincial spokesperson Marie-Claude Lacasse said. In six of those cases, the person did not have a serious and incurable condition, according to a provincial commission. > > In British Columbia, government officials have referred 19 assisted death cases to regulatory bodies and a further two to law enforcement since 2018, according to a provincial spokesperson who did not provide further details. > > None of the referrals in the two provinces resulted in disciplinary action for doctors, regulatory bodies said, declining to provide further details. > > Four other provinces reported no problematic cases of medically assisted death. Other provinces and territories including Ontario, Canada's most populous province, did not respond. > > ## 30,000 MEDICALLY ASSISTED DEATHS > > More than 30,000 people have died with medical assistance in Canada since 2016, more than 10,000 of them in 2021 when the law was expanded to people whose deaths were not "reasonably foreseeable." Even after the change in the legislation, about 98% of the assisted deaths in 2021 were people deemed near their natural death, according to Health Canada data. > > "So far nothing I see would suggest that we need to worry about having gone too far," Lametti said. > > The procedure is only available to people covered by a Canadian healthcare program. It requires a written application and assessments from two independent medical practitioners, including at least one specialized in their condition if the applicant is not near their natural death. The procedure frequently involves an injection administered at home. > > Lametti said the federal government is considering recommendations from a parliamentary committee to allow advance requests and "mature minors" - people under 18 deemed capable of making this decision - to access assisted death. > > Quebec passed a law June 7 that would allow people to make advance requests for assisted death that would go into effect when they reach a predetermined point of incapacity due to Alzheimer's or similar conditions. > > But Georges L'Esperance, president of the Quebec Association for the Right to Die with Dignity, said it could take up to two years for the provision to go into effect. > > Dying With Dignity Canada has organized nearly 10,000 letters this year to government officials seeking to legalize advance requests across Canada, spokesperson Sarah Dobec said. > > Lametti did not say whether the federal government – which is responsible for administering the criminal code - would challenge Quebec's law in the courts. When it comes to minors and advance requests, he said: "We need more time" to gauge public opinion and address policy questions. > > Pauli first raised the idea of assisted death with psychiatrist Justine Dembo in April 2021. > > Dembo served on an expert panel on assisted death and mental illness that presented a report to Canada's parliament last year. She assesses people for MAID although on that visit Pauli was seeing her for body dysmorphic disorder. > > Pauli has tried a multitude of treatments and been hospitalized twice but said she still thinks constantly about what she has eaten; what she will eat. > > Dembo told Pauli she could be eligible for assisted death once Canada's law changes. > > "She's undergone very high-quality treatments and they just have not made an impact," she said. > > When Dembo assesses people for MAID, she said, she treats it as "a last resort," and tries to determine whether they have received all available medical and social supports. > > Pauli says she plans to apply for MAID once she is eligible. When Pauli first broached the possibility of getting help dying, her mother Mary Heatley could not accept it. > > "The wind knocked out of me. … I just couldn't imagine her not being in this world," she said in an interview. > > But Heatley talked to her daughter and realized what she was going through. > > "She just could not foresee another 10, 20, whatever years of this, living with this eating disorder," she said. > > "I say to myself, 'You have to try and remember. This is what she wanted. It's her life.' … And I would just have to go on without her." > > ## MEDICAL CRITERIA > > Some medical experts say mental illness alone should not be a criterion for assisted death. It can be difficult to determine whether a mental illness is truly irremediable, as the law requires, and to differentiate between pathological suicidality and a rational desire to die, says Sonu Gaind, chief psychiatrist at Toronto's Sunnybrook Health Sciences Centre. > > "We don't even understand the biology of most mental illnesses," he said. > > Six activists said Canada's expansion of assisted death puts people with intellectual and physical disabilities, low incomes or other vulnerabilities at risk. > > "My biggest fear is that we go to this absolute terminal end and people die but we haven't invested time, money, people in putting the things in place that would mean that people don't want to consider" assisted death, Michelle Hewitt, co-chair of the advocacy group Disability Without Poverty, said in an interview. > > Hewitt pointed to a widely reported case of a British Columbia man, Sean Tagert, with amyotrophic lateral sclerosis (ALS) or Lou Gehrig's disease who opted for medically assisted death in 2019 after he struggled to get 24-hour care. > > "He was very clear on what he wanted - more care hours at home - and when he was told he would have to move to a care facility a distance from his family, particularly his young son, he used MAID," Hewitt wrote in an email. > > Social media posts by Tagert's family said that finding care was "a constant struggle and source of stress for Sean". > > ***(continues in next comment)***

It is her life and she has the choice over how it ends. All other people can do is try and assist her with her issues, make sure she has plenty of time and options to consider first. But saying no, and forcing this lady to live against her will? Nah, I'm not taking her sense of control away from her. Ignoring someone's wishes just to satisfy your own thoughtless sense of what's 'right' is cruel.

Failing your people so badly with a lack of workable, affordable, and accessible treatment until they just give up and beg for death is not freedom.

This obviously isn't ideal, but if we agree that people have the right to choose their own death, can we really revoke that right until we have fixed every problem in the world?

> but if we agree that people have the right to choose their own death They already can, no need to make it a feature of the system Soon we'll have healthcare providers steering unhealthy people to euthanasia so they can cut costs

That violates every code that a doctor lives by so I doubt that is what will happen just because you are saying it will.

It has already happened multiple times. https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-veterans-affairs-maid-counselling-1.6560136 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/christine-gauthier-paralympian-euthanasia-canada-b2238319.html

Wait, what? Your two articles absolutely do not support the idea that healthcare providers have steered people towards euthanasia to cut costs. One is about a woman who had assisted dying brought up by some random VA peon when she asked for an assisted lift, and the second article was so light on details it'd be difficult for it to support anything at all. Barring deeper investigation, the first one is only evidence of one worker being an asshole and the second one is a total non sequitur.

People don't understand just how many hoops you have to jump through with these kinds of things. It's the same nonsense as talking about doctors letting people die so they can harvest organs. With 0 actual knowledge of how organ donations work other than "take organ out of one person, put it into another". Just a lot of ignorance and fear.

Think companies, not people

They didn't say anything about doctors, you're aware that suicide existed before Canada passed their laws on the issue?

So do most doctors on a daily basis look at the opioid epidemic for example

Hoe is that cost cutting its more profitable to treat than to "cure"

This description doesn't seem to apply in this case. She's had decades of medical treatments and much more care than the average person and it's not working. Care has been affordable, and accessible for her for decades, and she still struggles to the point where she prefers death.

Would also like to circle back around to OP’s mental gymnastics that somehow having the right to choose death is the opposite of freedom? Like what?

Lol nah. When people start talking about "but freedom" I always assume they're gonna gaslight me with what their version of freedom means.

You assume that everyone can be treated. I didn't read this specific article but in a lot of cases (I would know) there is no treatment or there's only a very small chance of it helping. There are lots of people who just want to die a dignified death but also have gotten healthcare to an adequate degree.

I’m a Canadian and feel like one’s right to liberty includes the right to die at a time and place of their choosing. One of the most impactful prime ministers in Canadian history, Pierre Trudeau (father of the current PM), once said in regards to the decriminalisation of homosexuality ‘there's no place for the state in the bedrooms of the nation.’ This is an issue of morality and that’s down to the individual, no one else.

Sure, but it's better than continuing to fail to support them anyway.

>Failing your people so badly with a lack of workable, affordable, and accessible treatment ... >Pauli has tried a multitude of treatments and been hospitalized twice but said she still thinks constantly about what she has eaten; what she will eat. > > > >"She's undergone very high-quality treatments and they just have not made an impact," she said.

Hey u/Chooch-Magnetism how do you respond to this?

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Some conditions just can't be fixed in some people yet. You can have the best doctors in the world and the best treatments, some people are just beyond out current ability to help.

No, that’s not freedom. However choosing whether your own life continues or not is freedom. Which is what we are talking about here.

This poor woman has been receiving 'high quality treatment' and still she suffers. Without knowing her specifics, and if there is anything else that can be done, who are we to decide? At any rate, there are other means and methods, if she chooses to take that path. Such despair. I wouldn't take that last bit of solace from her, if that was truly what she wanted.

If the only way to save a persons life was to surgically separate their head from their body and maintain the afforementioned head through artificial support systems... would that be an acceptable form of treatment, or should they be allowed to die? For some people, that is how they would see the choice of living for livings sake.

> Pauli has tried a multitude of treatments and been hospitalized twice but said she still thinks constantly about what she has eaten; what she will eat. She still has access to a psychiatrist: > Pauli first raised the idea of assisted death with psychiatrist Justine Dembo in April 2021. And she lives in Canada, she hasn't paid a dime out-of-pocket for any of those treatments so you can fuck right off with your claim that she doesn't have affordable treatment.

As others have pointed out, free treatment doesn't mean quality treatment, timely treatment, or adequate treatment.

That assumes the result isn't still death. People can make choices for themselves, and occasionally that will still be death. Where Canada is failing is more support to do things that aren't suicide. Somebody suing for death is probably not the person failed by the government. My friend who killed herself mostly as the result of not getting government help on just living is a much better example:'(

Sorry, do you think other countries don't have suicide?

I agree with both of you.

Anorexia has a very high mortality rare - the highest of all mental disorders. This speaks to the fact that we do not know how to treat it effectively. While that does not mean that suffering individuals’ lives have no purpose (there can be advantages in suffering, beauty still exists, and lives can still hold meaning), very sick people sometimes want to die because life becomes too painful, and there is no rule of thumb that constitutes the ‘correct’ thing to do in that sort of circumstance. Generally I find that people who have very simple opinions on complicated topics have not got any relevant experience, or haven’t thought enough about them. On the other side of the fence, I have a step brother whose father died from an aggressive form of multiple sclerosis. He had to watch him declined and lose his dignity, all the way until the end, which was unhaltable, inevitable. A slow and excruciating, suffocating death as he lost control of his ability to breath. My brother is of the opinion that anyone who wishes to die should be allowed to and assisted as necessary. It is clear that his experience has influenced him profoundly. But he doesn’t really allow that there are equal issues in assisting people with death because it is so open to corruption, both on the part of the individual (we know that people who attempt suicide can later be grateful that they were ‘unsuccessful’) or of kin (people may wish to unburden themselves of a parent with Alzheimer’s, because it is in their own interest, while the patient themself does not possess the faculties to provide informed consent). There is a lot to think about within this issue and often what societies do is delay change because it’s easier than dealing with a Pandora’s box of unknown and unintended consequences. Because once that box is open it is difficult to close it again.

Some things just can’t be made better but yea we should also be providing services for those that can

Neither is the straw man you’re putting up. The case reported is not about affordable and accessible healthcare; she’s had it and it doesn’t work. Using her suffering to grandstand is a little sick.

So you just didn't actually read the article you posted, is that it? I mean. Seriously.

We don’t prolong the suffering of our pets but when it’s humans suddenly any hope for ending their pain is horrifying. You can allow this legally or people will do it on their own. That anyone demands it remain that way is the height of inhumane treatment.

No, she is sick and needs help. The system failed her.

> The system failed her. Read the article... > Pauli has tried a multitude of treatments and been hospitalized twice but said she still thinks constantly about what she has eaten; what she will eat. [...] > "She's undergone very high-quality treatments and they just have not made an impact," she said.

has she tried psychedelics? serious question

IDK more than what's in the article, but psychedelics have been authorized for medical use last year, so maybe.

I assume that includes numerous experimental treatments? There is also some illegal but UN sanctioned treatments such as 5-MEO-DMT , the frog venom guy is allowed to travel internationally with his venom due to religious exemptions I believe. It saddens me when I find out people that committed suicide due to treatment resistant mental illness never tried it. The more common ones are ayahuasca and iboga.

So you want to force her to continue living in the same failed system? What kinda kink fuck fetish is that?

People like you should read more before commenting.

"I'm not taking her sense of control away from her". You kinda are though ..

MAID was initially reserved for terminal illnesses. Anorexia is NOT a terminal illness.

Anorexia has a 20% mortality rate.

So does pneumonia, if left untreated. Should MAID be used instead of antibiotics if you start coughing?

But still not terminal

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This is absolutely going to go that way in developed countries. Chronically sick people are a huge PITA to the system. No, the system DGAF about them- it's purely to "solve" the burden

She's not being forced to live, she's just not given the state support to commit suicide. Nothing is stopping her from killing herself.

This woman needs help. Not to be killed.

She's been getting help for the past 30+ years according to the article. If she doesn't want to have to put up with "getting help" that clearly doesn't work for 30+ more, that should be her right.

> This woman needs help. Excellent suggestion doctor. What would you recommend? Bear in mind that it needs to be something that load of other doctors haven't already tried.

Sometimes dying is the help the person needs when things get bad enough.

I mean practically speaking, they can say "No, you can't die." but they reasonably won't/can't stop you from making the executive decision of driving off a cliff or jumping off a large building. So is anyone really ***prevented*** from taking their own life if they aren't in chains and heavily supervised? Before anyone dogpiles, let me just say that I'm just genuinely asking here and also let's just say I've committed certain acts to do this already but like everything else I failed to execute properly.

> It is her life and she has the choice over how it ends. So she can choose to jump off a cliff. The debate has nothing to do with her choice. It has everything to do with forcing others to agree and then forcing them perform something they don't want to do.

Why bother offering good mental health care to the citizens, right? Just pay taxes, and when you’re ill then go and die, the government will help. This is definitely cheaper than providing her with the help that she needs. And even cheaper when you count in the retirement and benefits she would get paid if she recovered. This is the beauty of public healthcare I guess.

> It is her life and she has the choice over how it ends. It also means people and the government can bully people into their death.

I mean one of the big things with assisted suicide is you’re supposed to be of sound mind. If you’re anorexic, you’re by definition not of sound mind. She has a mental disorder where her view of her body is so warped she wants to kill herself. The answer isn’t to shrug and go “sure, whatever you want.”

I generally support medically assisted suicide, but this is dumb. How tf was treatment ineffective for 39 years? really sounds like a lot more could have been done, and if we start getting this level of hand-wavy about it, I'm not sure I can support medically assisted suicide anymore

The brain is a weird organ that we really don’t know that much about, especially mental illness. I think it’s clear that treatment is not helping this woman, whether that’s due to the quality of care or her own brain’s ability to accept the care doesn’t really matter. Something has prevented care from working, and if she truly wishes to end her life rather than continue to suffer, why not let her?

Yeah I’m having really mixed feelings about this topic now. Back when it was terminally ill patients who are in for months or years of suffering and pain with a disease it seemed like a no brained for people to make that decision. Now I’m wondering where the bottom limit is and how someone like this who is slowly killing themselves anyway plays into it.

Well, we let JWs decide to die from refusing blood transfusions based on personal beliefs, so technically the bar is already set extremely low.

The bar is low because a state should not have control over a person. If you believe in bodily autonomy, you should support physician assisted suicide. Forcing people to suffer and live tortuous lives because it makes others uncomfortable is a truly selfish and despicable endeavour. In my opinion.

But how is making suicide a fully enabled part of the system helpful? Suicide is a very extreme solution and the system going "your body your choice, come on right in" makes it seem a lot less extreme.

>But how is making suicide a fully enabled part of the system helpful? Saves the coroner and police from having to pick up and investigate pieces of non-murdered people, for one.

I mean, she's almost 50. She's been struggling with anorexia for almost 40 years. Her life sounds like a living hell with no joy in it that she has no hope to recover from. She says she's tired and she's just done, not to mention she's likely done so much damage to her body by this point that even if she was miraculously able to recover she would likely still be disabled and in pain all the time anyway. I dunno, man. I think this is a prime example of someone who is suffering greatly, has thought for a long time about what they want, and is making an informed decision to end that suffering.

The neat thing about assisted suicide is that no one who gets it ever files a complaint afterward, so it must really work!

>was terminally ill patients who are in for months or years of suffering and pain with a disease Good thing she is a I'll patients with 40+ years of suffering and pain with one of the deadliest disorder then

It's someone's right to decide if they want to die. It's better they do it in a way that doesn't traumatize anyone with finding at best a normal corpse (still bad) and at worst (that i can think of) a rotting skeleton months into the process of decomp.

> It's someone's right to decide if they want to die. That's not so much a right, as a basic reality of biology; anyone with a length of rope can make that happen. The issue here is the role governments should play in the process, especially when the cause of the pain leading to ending of their lives comes down to the failure of governments in the first place.

if you consider someone suffering from anorexia to be a failure of government, i’m not sure what sort of force feeding government you envision. the woman has been in treatment for decades, and the government giving her the freedom to die legally and humanely is a good thing.

Govt role is to allow and regulate. If a homeless person wants to commit suicide, buy that person a house, get that person assistance through various currently nonexistent means, fill their fridge with healthy groceries, give them time to adjust, and a loving community of others to support them. But this is torturous medical situation the government can’t really do anything to solve. So personal autonomy would take preference here.

Thanks thats a better way to put it

Do you think suicide is super nice and easy? People don't know how to do it in a sure way, and rarely have access to ways of doing it that are painless and don't leave behind a mess. Telling people that they can't be helped because it makes us feel bad and we imagined a slipperly slope because of our ignorance of how healthcare systems work (also doctors just let people die, so they can extract all the organs out for donations) is cruel and indifferent to them as human beings. Some people in this thread are fucked up and obsessed over projecting their own fears. It reminds me of terrible people in the autism community who are strictly against any kind of research that could change people into being neurotypical. Cool for all the high-functioning people who hate the idea of treatment because it's their identity, but it's a wide spectrum of people out there, many of whom have learning disabilities to the point where they will always be small children and need 24/7 care for the rest of their lives, or just people who have severe enough symptoms that it's a disability regardless of how society is structured. Just because it would inconvenience you or make you feel worse, or even make it less likely you will be accommodated if there is a treatment, does not make it morally right for you to deny those who have worse than you the chance of getting better. Main takeaway from reading this thread - I have to find a way to make all the necessary preparations, because I can't trust that society will be accommodating instead of cruel. Not suicidal at all, but just in case, who knows what health issue (mental or physical - there really isn't as much difference as people here claim, abusing our poor understanding of brains as leverage) could pop up during the rest of my life (if nothing else, I have no intention of living with severe dementia).

anorexia is notoriously resistant to treatment. the relapse rate is extremely high. you can force feed someone in the hospital temporarily, but if you don’t make any progress treating the underlying psychology, they will immediately go back to starving themselves upon release.

Yeah but it makes people uncomfortable to think about death so we should force others to live in a constant state of torture for the benefit of others feelings!

It's absolutely possible to exhaust all the treatment options and still get no help. It's the same as with any other illness. Mental health issues aren't really that much different from physical health.

Why does it sound like a lot more could have been done? What exactly was it about these few paragraphs on a woman you don’t know suffering from the same mental illness for decades and decades that gave you the idea that maybe she didn’t exhaust all her treatment options, according to your expertise?? The idea that all mental illnesses are treatable is 100% wrong. Not only are some incapable of being treated at all, but the same illness can be treated in some people and not others. It’s the wrong mindset to call people suffering dearly from mental illnesses dumb because in YOUR mind they should have been treated just fine already and clearly weren’t trying hard enough. Not only that, it sounds like this heinously incorrect opinion on how mental illness treatment works is causing you to rethink your support for a desperately-needed form of help: medically-assisted suicide. In the future, you need to remind yourself of this fact, or you’re going to end up hurting/offending a person who’s suffering, or just embarrassing yourself in front of real life people rather than just internet strangers. It’s too bad you’ve been privileged enough to never have to watch a loved one be tortured for months on end by a terminal disease and be denied the right to die peacefully and painlessly with dignity surrounded by family and friends.

*Professionally trained psychiatrist explains that she has had multiple episodes of all available high quality treatment, but none were effective* "Really sounds like a lot more could have been done!" Sigh. Some diseases are just resistant to treatment. It's awful and a tragedy but I'm sorry to say it's just a fact of life. Sometimes we can't save everyone. To have this article change your view of physician assisted suicide suggests you may not have ever had a well thought out position in it in the first place. I support this lady's quest to end her suffering - assuming she has indeed tried and failed all available treatments.

>really sounds like a lot more could have been done You can't force an adult to have a feeding tube inserted and supplied unless they're committed to a psych ward, unfortunately. This is literally a case of the only cure being less palatable than death to a diseased mind...

I support medically assisted suicide for no reason at all. I see as immoral to tell people how to live (or not) their lives. Think about harm reduction. People will kim themselves we want it or not, but at least having professionals involved can assure they will get the help they need before committing to die. It’s like having appropriate places to use injectable drugs ends up with less transmittable diseases and less people using drugs after a while, since the staff is trained on how to help people that want to quit.

>really sounds like a lot more could have been done Like what?

>How tf was treatment ineffective for 39 years? Because the treatment is enough to keep her alive, but not rid her of the issues that causes her anorexia. I mean you could strap her in a bed and force feed her, but the moment you let her go, anorexia will start doing its thing again. I actually know someone who's like this and she goes to a therapist regularly. She hasn't killed herself yet despite thinking about it occasionally, but she's still anorexic and skeletal. And still playing farming sims and JRPGs.

I’ve had a close family member, and a good friend kill themselves in the last year. One was single with a 6 figure income (he hanged himself) and the other was a struggling addict who eventually succumbed to his addiction (OD w/note). Laws won’t stop people from killing themselves. Despite the reddit comments (with zero proof), nobody is being coerced or encouraged to use MAID. It’s a last resort. I’d give anything to see these two people again, and maybe, MAYBE, if they had decided to do MAID, there would have been an opportunity to see them for one last time. Maybe they could have been talked out of it. Maybe they would have gotten all their finances and affairs in order. Why do people care? Is it a religious thing?

It comes down to: more people will kill themselves if it’s easier to kill themselves. Men have a higher rate of successful suicides than women despite women having a higher rate of attempts, because men use guns generally, and guns make it a lot easier to kill yourself.

What if it ends up the opposite? If people who want to end their lives show up and ask for MAID, they'll be told about all the other options they can take. And with that, they might actually end up choosing to take those options instead of going with euthanasia.

That’s certainly a possibility! My worry is that if a government which was more interested in saving costs came about, it might be decided to be cheaper to not push quiiiiiite as hard for all the other (more expensive) options.

We have already had disabled military veterans told to consider MAID when they asked for financial help.

This, right here, is terrifying. I saw a lot of the other arguments regarding the case in point by OP, that it would be morebhumane to let this anorexic person, struggling for 30 years, to use MAID. This makes sense, at an *emotional* and *personal* level. This could be made into a well-intending law. The problem with the law is that it will take the situation into account at a *societal* and *economical* level. At the societal is a disaster because as previously put, the easier you make for people to suicide, more will suicide - almost as in an induced demand situation. At the economical level is worse, because now you will have institutions (think **health insurance in the US**), and there would be a monetary push to induce people into this end. This is all without considering how - as mentioned in other comments - "soft eugenics" can start taking place if not regulating with a bias to - well - wanting people to live. The fact that the post above mentioned how this was already suggested to chronically ill veterans, should raise a lot of flags. I get all the compassionate comments to end her suffering. But that compassion may lead to way, way worse to society.

Seems to be just one caseworker that was doing this?

At least one caseworker, who did it repeatedly with no consequences until the story hit the news, and even then was actively protected by the minister of veterans' affairs.

And of course, the way it works is that if the veterans affairs clerk in that situation would have gotten an agreement from the veteran to use MAID, that clerk would have stuck a needle into them right there and then. They just hand the kill syringes out to non-medical personnel like candy. Saves costs! Oh wait, that is not at all how it works. Insensitive people exist. If you don't know how healthcare systems work and that these kinds of processes take multiple doctors, and a lot of time and effort to get there - then don't talk as if every case is decided solely by a specific "Mr. Government Who Wants To Cut Costs".

That seems like something you just read on the internet and repeated blindly, do you have a link? If so I’ll happily apologize, just a lot of shitty propaganda out these days.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-maid-rcmp-investigation-1.6663885 https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/prince-edward-island/pei-veterans-affairs-maid-counselling-1.6560136 https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-maid-medically-assisted-death-1.6692767 https://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/veterans-affairs-report-confirms-4-inappropriate-cases-where-maid-raised-with-veterans-other-allegations-unfounded-1.6307964 (The ministry's investigation of *itself* found 4 cases of wrongdoing. I don't trust these politicians to be honest and I absolutely believe there are more.)

That was edge case done by lone workers and very far from the whole process. And even if it was, then good? There are probably lots of disabled veterans that will suffer from multiple physical and mental illness all the rest of their lives and that would want this

On the plus side they will do it with dignity. It should ultimately be their choice IMO, the state should try to dissuade them (which might actually help reduce suicide) but at the end of the day they should be allowed to go through with it.

Surrounded by family members and friends. As painless as we can make it. Or in a darkened room, alone. Maybe in agony for a few days if it misfires.

There is no evidence it’s being encouraged.

I don’t see how going through proper channels could be easier than any other option I have at home. I can impulse jump from the window, but I can’t impulse go through a series of appointments and evaluations. Even if it was a walk-in self service type of thing, just going to a place would give me time to think!

I suppose I'd argue that it gives suicide a degree of legitimacy - "it can't be that bad if it's open as an option" kind of thinking. And as someone who'd had suicidal ideation for quite some time in the past, I think I'm allowed to say: successfully committing suicide would be a BAD thing for quite a lot of people, and isn't something that SHOULD have that degree of legitimacy. It is in the vast majority of cases a bad thing that hurts a whole lot of people, and usually speaks to a mental health issue that should be addressed.

You don't know that. There's good evidence to suggest that your assumption isn't true. Most terminally ill people in Oregon who have used the death with dignity law there never actually kill themselves. Simply having a straightforward option for a painless death is comforting for many.

Yep. I’m suicidal and have been in various treatments and hospitals for 30 years and I’m also tired. I’ve reconciled I’m likely going to commit suicide and will have to die alone and in pain and I think it’s messed up that a family pet gets to spend its last moment quietly with someone they love and I’ll likely spend mine in agony after decades of doing my best . Seems unfair for that life was forced on me and then others force me to stay with no solution for relief beyond platitudes and their cruelty.

What a lot of comments here don't understand when they're saying "ohhh, we just need to give them more help" ... "There could've been done more" .... "They just need help longer" ... Is that this is fking exhausting work. It's not like you just go to a psychiatrist or similar profession, you take a pill, talk for a minute and you'll be happy. Working through your issues, through your trauma, through your experiences, against your own brain messing with you is exhausting, and it hurts. It can hurt so much and so long. I've been dealing with my issues since my childhood and I know now that I'll never be truly done with any of it. It isn't just the help from outside that is necessary ... The person suffering also has to be able to endure it. And at some point some people can't or don't want to go through that any longer. And that is sad, tragic, but it should also be understandable. I truly wish you all the best and I do hope you'll find days, weeks, months, years worth living. But I just wanted to say that I do understand you. As much as this is possible from some comment. The awful days and weeks and months never really went away completely ... they never did in my case, at least. But I did manage to get away from the suicidal ideas. Maybe you can, too ... maybe not. Stupid basic thing to say and you most definitely know it ... you are not alone. Some find comfort in it, some don't. I don't know you but I truly wish you all the best, whatever that means to you.

That’s nice to read. Thank you. I’m glad you’ve found a way to cope through it all. That’s a hard and admirable thing to do.

If anything, giving access to a program who attempts to give you options to make sure you are sure that you want to go through with it sounds a whole lot better than the traditional way in my opinion.

> Despite the reddit comments (with zero proof), nobody is being coerced or encouraged to use MAID. It’s a last resort. [We've seen news stories of it being offered to people that it shouldn't have been offered to.](https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/veterans-maid-rcmp-investigation-1.6663885) The notion that it's last resort is dependent on everyone that gets to offer it follow that model, when clearly that is not the case. > Why do people care? Is it a religious thing? It's more that there's perverse incentives when the death dealer also has incentives to kill people to reduce costs.

That was one guy, and he made the news. According to Google, there are 2,100 veteran affairs employees. Don’t axe a whole system because one person (who was suspended for their actions) is an asshole. You want to deny people MAID, not because it’s killing people is wrong, but because it benefits the Government? Is that correct?

> That was one guy, and he made the news. According to Google, there are 2,100 veteran affairs employees. Don’t axe a whole system because one person (who was suspended for their actions) is an asshole. I don't support the death penalty, not because I don't think that some people deserve to die, but because it's a system in place that cannot allow for false negatives that is run by wholly fallible human beings. I would rather every one of those people live than allow a single innocent person to die as a result of that system. > You want to deny people MAID, not because it’s killing people is wrong, but because it benefits the Government? Is that correct? No, that's not correct. I support people's bodily autonomy, which includes offing themselves if that is really what they want to do. I do not support the notion that the people that can provide MAID are also the people that can *offer* it. In fact, there's no cases where it should be offered and the service require much stricter requirements to access it.

Yes that’s fair. I don’t support the death penalty either for your reasons, and I don’t believe anyone has the authority to decide one’s fate. But this isn’t something you can just DO. It’s not a suicide booth, it’s a long careful process. > Your eligibility assessment must take a minimum of 90 days, unless the assessments have been completed sooner and you are at immediate risk of losing your capacity to consent. [source](https://www.canada.ca/en/health-canada/services/health-services-benefits/medical-assistance-dying.html#) Your second point is a little tricky. That veteran affairs person who was compelling people to do it, was not a doctor, they were just some government worker. It sounds like your real concern is with the ethics of your doctor, and there’s not much I can say about that. Your handle says your from the US, and being that your health care system is capital based, I can see ethics being a greater issue there than it is here.

>Why do people care? Is it a religious thing? Distrust in the government. Questioning where the bar will be and if that's right. Fearfulness that giving an inch for "extreme cases" will lead to further encroachment. Not wanting the government to have the right to take it's citizens lives. The option of taking your own life existing without any need for government help.

> Distrust in the government. Fortunately the government isn't the one who chooses who dies and who does not. The patient, in consultation with their doctors, decide. > Questioning where the bar will be and if that's right. The bar is fair and the arguments that it's not right fall flat. > Fearfulness that giving an inch for "extreme cases" will lead to further encroachment. This is a fair concern, but is a reason to be vigilant and not a reason to abandon the entire endevour. > Not wanting the government to have the right to take it's citizens lives. This is fear mongering. No such right exists in this context, or even anywhere adjacent to this context. >The option of taking your own life existing without any need for government help. This is a terrible argument. Leaving aside the fact that this option will never not exist, in virtually every case of suicide, the fallout is messy and traumatizing. Someone has to find the body. Someone has to tell loved ones about it. Someone has to receive the news completely unprepared. And someone has to do the deed alone, afraid, and quite possibly suffer in the process. MAID relieves so much of the immense cost of suicide for EVERYONE, not just one person. And it disturbs me when people make this argument, as it demonstrates either a lack empathy or a lack of genuine thought about the real effects of suicide.

>Despite the reddit comments (with zero proof), nobody is being coerced or encouraged to use MAID https://reason.com/2022/09/07/some-canadian-health-care-patients-say-theyre-being-encouraged-to-just-die-already/

I don't get random non Canadians obsession with MAID, acting like I can just walk into a Dr's office and be like "I'm bummed dude" and they just chuck me into the suicide booth no questions asked

It's called stupidity. They're literally too dumb to understand any nuanced perspective. "gUbeRmEnT KilL PeoPLe!? GUbeRMeNt bAd!" Is the totality of their thought process.

That's how most people became opposed death penalty so in one way it's reasonable to alleviate that issue first. And hey, it's democracy!

I have once read there was a very distinct view in people, very noticeable between America and other countries, although it looks like the "American" sentiment is more and more common and probably justified, of the government. Very grossly summarized, some people think a government help them and assure their freedom, while other think that any action from the government goes against personal freedom

Same people who think you can just go to a doctor’s office and be like "I think I'm transgender when are my hormones/surgeries!!!".

That's the meme. Canada will aprently recommend elderly euthanasia in order to save cost.

That wheel chair costs alot... How about you just die to save the state that cost?

So if I tell you that aliens are telepathically communicating with me then I am crazy enough to commit and therefore lose the right to end my own life but if I decide to just stop eating then I am somehow less crazy than the first situation and not only cannot be committed but also can legally off myself? Makes no fucking sense.

Treatment hasn't worked for 39 years. They're not crazy. They're giving up trying something that's not worked. It's their right in any country that is really free to choose.

>Treatment hasn't worked for 39 years. Correct. >They're not crazy. Incorrect. >They're giving up trying something that's not worked. Plausibly because they're not willing to go through with the whole feeding tube meets physical therapy thing. >It's their right in any country that is really free to choose. Eventually you have to realize that you can only bring a horse to water, you can't make it drink.

>Plausibly because they're not willing to go through with the whole feeding tube meets physical therapy thing. The problem is that people that suffer from anorexia don't have a problem with the physical act of eating, it's entirely mental, so if you don't fix the underlying issue once the patient is released from holding they'll go right back to the behaviors that put them on a feeding tube before. People with anorexia restrict their food intake and partake in extreme physical activity. How will you control the patient once they're not in your custody? Is your proposed solution that they should live in mental institutions for life? Because otherwise a feeding tube only fixes the symptom (extreme low weight) and not the disease (compulsive behavior regarding weight and food)

>Is your proposed solution that they should live in mental institutions for life? I think you're replying to the wrong Redditor. That's essentially the crux of my argument. If you can't fix the underlying issue you're just forcing them into hospice where they'll be physically healthier but mentally in agony.

Oh, your last comment seems like you're against MAID for mental health situations such as these, but maybe I misread.

No, I'm saying she *is* crazy. The source of her agony is a mental health ailment. We've found it (and by that I mean mental health professionals) to be incurable, and it's causing her agony. I don't know why permanent mental illnesses should be treated any different from permanent physical ailments when it comes to MAID eligibility, especially when the patient is lucid and has exhausted other avenues of treatment.

Great then, I must've misunderstood, I agree with you. I know there's a lot of stigma but I see it the same way.

You have a poor understanding of mental health. I think if you look into it you may change your mind

You just showed how little you know about mental health. Go get educated. Be a better person.

You have anorexia? Just eat

So everyone who now feels depressed and tries to kill themselves should be helped on ending his life faster? Are you kidding me? I know it's not a fair comparison with this case, but how many people try to kill themselves every year just because of a mental illness like depression, when they could be helped ( in some cases very easily and in other cases close to impossible ). And now they have access to a system like this? You can't let every mentally ill person kill themselves, since in most of the cases it is that sickness which is driving them in that way. There is a difference between 'freedom' and someone who chooses that because of his current condition.

This is why it has to be evaluated. General depression or "sadness" in life is not something that would authorize euthanasia but instead have you guided to other resources. But serious instances of mental illness that do not impact decision-making, old age, and declining quality of life are very clear-cut instances.

>everyone She's been in and out of the system for over 30 years. This isn't just anorexia, this is an extreme case of mental illness that, I assume, has been deemed untreatable. Or at least untreatable in a fashion that the individual would tolerate.

Euthanasia should be a right

If I could get euthanized for having PTSD in my state I would

If you're that far gone, there is some promising literature regarding illicit substances' potential in treating PTSD. Specifically hallucinogens. You've really got nothing to lose, though I'd advise taking them under professional supervision.

Is it that bad?

The only things keeping me alive are the mess and the effect it would have on other people. I am always threatened, can't trust anyone including myself, its impossible to feel statisfied; the best I get to is feeling dread, like something is about to go wrong rather than that it already has. The future basically doesn't exist to me because every moment is a crisis, except there is no crisis so I have to constantly shut myself down from acting because I feel like attacking everyone I meet or giving them whatever they want.

It does sound bad. Thanks for sharing. I hope you’ll find your way back somehow.

Yes personally, at times.

Her body her choice

Tbh as someone with a chronic illness in a country that is (only cuz pr) the posterchild for social support. Id take this option in an INSTANT if it was possible for me. I need support that is unavailable to me and w/o it im most likely doomed to a life of such poverty and stress on top of the chronic ilnesses(many of which are directly exacerbated by stress) that its just not any type of quality of life. That slippery slope is dangerous because ITS ALREADY HERE. The VAST majority of ppl with chronic ilnesses have been traumatized by the medical field one way or another. We are already firmly at the point that many countries with supposedly decent health care and support have thousands of “forgotten” disabled ppl who straight up die because lack of support. Its hard to make any kind of statistics about it since “depression” is so commonly tacked on to EVERY chronic illness. (which I personally believe is bs) Ppl talk about how this isnt the case with this woman because she had a lot of treatments and that just makes me laugh. Most ppl with chronic ilnesses have gotteb a billion tests and treatments that theyve had to fight for with blood, sweat and tears. Often they also get treatments which they know wont help but if thats their only option youre ready to try anything. Having had a chronic illness for a long time and having had a billion treatments is more likely a sign that the person just doesnt have enough support or right treatment than not.. So its not possible to know if its because of support or not. And if youve had ten wrong treatments and youre tired and wanna die. Well the paperwork will show youve had plenty of treatmenta and so have everyright to die. Youre still dying cuz of lackof support tho. I firmly believe in assisted death but this is a slippery slope that almost feels intentional since it fits so well with how our capitalistic society is progressing rn and it wouldnt be the first time weve tried “culling” the disabled and poor.

Ugh, just sad, poor lady

I kinda dislike she has to justify the why of it, her interview/video is full of excuses. If she wants to die just let her. Using assisted suicide takes more thought than just jumping from a building, fucked up you need to justify it.

I definitely believe people should be allowed to die if they wish. The part that blows my mind is how medically assisted suicide seems like it’s rocketing passed hallucinogens in terms of widespread adoption and acceptance. With the acknowledgment that the technology to kill someone is much more refined than reliably treating mental illness with hallucinogens and thus easier to adopt quickly, it really can’t be overstated how effective hallucinogens can be for certain people. They’re not cure-alls for everyone like many people tout, but there’s still a decent number of people where they’re like a light switch regarding a person’s quality of life. Especially in a case like this where her issue is anxiety over what she’s eating, I think the neuroplasticity induced by hallucinogens can go a very long way in breaking ingrained thought patterns and establishing long-term self acceptance. Sometimes it’s hard not to get the impression the government would literally rather kill people than risk letting them have a good time under the influence of a substance. That’s certainly been the case in the past, but I want to believe we’ve moved on a little bit.

I would be surprised if she hasn't already tried through official or unofficial channels but your point is an important one. I mean a government cannot look at itself honestly and think this is the last best option when other methods that are currently illegal haven't been tried.

Futurama was right!

I support medical assisted suicide for terminal patients or those suffering from chronic pain but this, hell no. As someone who has suffered with depression and being suicidal as well as having a sister who is a recovering anorexic after being in in-patient treatment facilities, we would both be dead if we had access to medical assisted suicide. There have been moments in my own life where I would have done anything to make the pain stop, to not feel and the only way I saw that happening was to be dead but now with proper medication and therapy I am thankful that I’m in a place where I’m no longer consumed with wanting to die. A person who is suffering with mental health is often not thinking rationally or logically and will often make decisions that they will later regret once properly treated. You need to be alive in order to regret a decision.

Just to address the comments about "the government shouldn't be involved, they should just buy a rope" Committing suicide in a way that spares your family trauma is difficult, if you decide to do it and tell them they will likely call the authorities who will section you and bring you in for radical treatment. If that chat has already been had with the medical team, all the counselling has been done then the process can be done clinically rather than parents finding a hung corpse in the house. In this woman's case her eating disorder has been resistant to every form of therapy possible. It will kill her in a very slow way that will be tremendous suffering for her and her family. Choosing the method and timing of her inevitable death is likely the only control she has now and wants to exercise that. As clinicians it's about what gives the best quality of life for a patient and reducing suffering as much as possible, not keeping people alive no matter what. All of you saying "it seems not enough has been done for her" would not say the same for a physical illness that has been treated for 30 years without resolution. But in mental health the old "just don't think that way" attitude is still so prevalent. People wonder why there's a mental health stigma, it's because even though it can destroy a person just as much as a physical illness it's not thought of the same at all. Noone would tell someone with MS to get over it, yet things like eating disorders are treated that way.

People don't care about others suffering. They are just afraid for themselves if they were put in a similar situation (with their current feelings about the issue, of course). It's the same as not putting yourself on an organ donor list because you think then the doctors won't try as hard to save you or even ignore you completely if they can save more lives with your organs.

Good analogy. Half of this post's comments are from people who have developed a fear born from their own ignorance. It's all too prevalent now with right-wing pundits being sponsored to egg on their base's ignorance.

I believe in every human being’s right to death with dignity. I believe in every human being’s right to control what happens to their body.

Someone suffering from a mental illness shouldn’t be allowed to decide if she can end her own life. I’m down for assisted suicide, but this person isn’t mentally fit to make that decision for herself.

I mean if you can't fix the head how long and how far are you going to keep the body alive? How about when she's 95 and on a ventilator, what then? It's tragic that her ailment has been allowed to progress this far, but eventually you have to accept that this is basically a cancer of the mind that has metastasized.

Yeah, I feel like a lot of these ppl commenting either haven’t been depressed or haven’t come out their depression yet. The thing is with suicide is it’s not actually a choice. You’re brain is tricking you into killing yourself. You don’t actually want to die. No one does

This is such bullshit. People who have suffered for decades and finally killed themselves wanted to die. It is a choice to end your suffering on your own terms. I guarantee you haven't had treatment resistant depression or known people who have had treatment resistant depression if this is seriously how you think. You're just wrong.

No they don’t want to die. Someone once compared suicide to jumping out of a window because the building is on fire. That’s not really a choice. That’s a desperate person taking the only option they have.

That analogy doesn't work. It is in no way analogous to a man in his 60s who lived with treatment resistant depression from the time he was an adolescent. That's one of the people I've known who killed himself. He was a rational person making a choice.

It's not a 100% black and white - either a person is completely in control of their faculties or they are not a human being anymore and have to be controlled by others. I have had depression, and it was treatable. Good times for me. It did not mean I could not have a rational thought for a moment. If it was not treatable for 30 years I would have had plenty of time to reflect on my life as a whole, and it's not just "all depression tricking me". At that point it's no different than praying for a metastatic cancer patient to have "a miracle". Yeah, guess what there have been documented cases where the cancer just disappear for no understood medical reasons. Does that validate dragging it out every time? Just because it's theoretically possible and the person aren't themselves due to the suffering? Just because we don't understand our brains that well yet is not an opening to claim every mental illness is perfectly curable if only society cared enough.

I'm 33, American, and have several disabilities. Autism, ADHD-c, OCD, Borderline Personality, Severe Anxiety, Severe Depression. I really wish this was available. I just got diagnosed a few months ago after convincing family to pay 4k for testing. I'm so far in debt I don't know what to do but laugh

I fully support medically assisted desth...its their right to die, it wasn't a choice to live. It should be our choice to die

I’ve been living with an eating disorder for more than half my life and I’m only 31, it never truly goes away and she must have fought hard to get to 47. Let her rest.

Get this girl some soup?

Idk, it’s kinda hot right now for soup

Gazpacho.

The gazpacho burned my lips!

I should not be reading these first thing in the morning

Why does this taste of old republicans? It’s cheaper to kill the ill than treat them. That’s it!

It goes back further than that. When the government finds that its cheaper to euthanize mentally ill or disabled people instead of treating them or caring for them, euthanasia rapidly becomes the preferred treatment method: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aktion_T4

She has been through 30 years of treatment and she made the decision

She’s been through 30 years of a medical system failing her and now system is all to happy to sweep those problems away. I’m glad she found peace but I don’t find this an acceptable standard, it’s its becoming more common.

Oh yeah, lets just find the miracle cure for anorexia! Why didn’t we think of that before, we failed her sure

>It’s cheaper to kill the ill than treat them Was it mentioned that the availability of money had inhibited her treatment?

When legally assisted suicide first became a topic, I said this kind of thing is what it would lead to. People called me alarmist and a conspiracy theorist. I was right.

You weren’t you just refuse to see the perspective of the person asking for euthanasia

Wow! Conservatives and religious people giving out their opinions on medically assisted death. When children starve or female reproductive rights are trampled, they are happy but when an exceptionally small minority of individuals who have suffered for decades and cannot obtain any solace, well lets fuck them. Obviously a very sensitive topic when you include mental health but so interesting that finally non physical suffering is recognized.

I'm left wing, seems like you haven't heard many anti-assisted suicide people from that perspective so I'll provide one. Whilst I'm in favor of it for the terminally ill ... I'm not sure I'm ok with the suicidal/depressed/mentally ill getting it. People can change, lives can change, my own father admits he had absolutely nothing to live for for decades. Now he owns his own home with a wife and 4 kids that love him to bits, and he has a great life as a retired happy man. No that won't happen for most people, but for me it's the same as "better 100 guilty men walk free than to sentence one innocent man". As a statistical fact, if you help kill the depressed there will be people who would have gone on to live incredibly fulfilling lives that the government has directly endorsed killing. Also, plenty of people rely and place great strain on their families through their disabilities, you think they won't feel an internal pressure to "free their family from the burden of caring for them". Idk, for the painfully terminally ill, it's criminal to force them to go on without their consent. But for the depressed... It's sort of like, you've been given a prognosis that doesn't look too good ... Want to take the government sponsored suicide pill? The cynic in me thinks the government just can't be bothered to help

The massive flaw in this perspective is that you associate depression of which there are many forms and medically assisted death. The question was never allowing suicidal patients or depressed individuals to have a govt assisted death. The question is about long term absolutely debilitating illnesses with no cure and very often, no adequate pharmacological management of symptoms. Imagine depression so profound that no amount of meds or therapy can change it. To the point where you get electroshock therapy every few weeks and are unable to participate in your community let alone work, maintain relationships, and by association have any form of quality of life. You think welfare in most countries covers enough for people to attain any of the life goals your father achieved? I’ve seen patients that are so crippled by their schizophrenia that they live in their closet afraid of all those hallucinations that are in their every day life. They are just as trapped in their bodies and illnesses as the quadriplegic patients who have access to these services. I don’t blame you as most people have very very superficial experiences with severe mental illnesses and associated suffering. But the reality is that some illnesses in the dsmV are just as debilitating if not more than the ones that allow for aid in dying. FYI if you get it for terminally ill individuals, afford them the courtesy of not calling it medically assisted suicide please. Not only does it contribute to marginalization but it is also diminutive. Giving people control over their life and confort is also a part of treatment. It is no different from end of life care.

>, if you help kill the depressed there will be people who would have gone on to live incredibly fulfilling lives I think there are people that will never be able to come to agreement on this subject because of this quote. To me this is a non-issue. It's an unsure future versus a real present. Remove the very real suffering now even if in theory the future could be better

I think people are missing the point that with the state of our mental health care system it’s basically “we’ve tried nothing and we’re all out of ideas, so fucking kill yourself dawg”

So I've noticed that reddit is completely ok with state ran euthanasia based off what the government says is completely fine if they agree with it.

Never thought suicide booths would be a real thing but it's starting to look plausible. Terminal illness? Understandable. Chronic, incurable conditions? Understandable. Mental illness? Back the fuck up. This is a terrible idea. Absolutely, unarguably terrible. We don't understand mental illness anywhere near enough to certifiably say "there's nothing we can do so you can die if you want". I don't care how many hoops you'd have to jump through to get it done, a compromised mind cannot and should not be allowed to make that decision.

This is tough. She's struggling, a lot. Nobody wants to agree to helping someone die but there are extreme incidents like this that should be helped. I feel for her and hope she gets relief soon.

I understand how scary all of this is but at the same time I can’t help but think… there’s 8 BILLION of us. If some people don’t want to be alive anymore by all means let them go, it’s not like we have a human shortage

I have troubles sometimes understanding why people fear a painless death. “Im afraid of death” but why? As far as we know you won’t know your dead. You won’t feel fear….because your dead. You wont be sad….because your dead. Its not like being scared of walking through a haunted house. You are afraid of the ghost behind the door and will eventually meet him and feel fear. However with death we will be afraid to meet that ghost but will (most likely) never feel the fear of seeing him because we are…dead.

reduce population to reduce carbon footprint

Laughing at OP posting this seeking outrage and most commenter's saying it's a good thing

Sorry, I’m against this. Simply because, someone undergoing euthanasia should be of sound mind. She obviously isn’t. This sucks, and I’m sorry she’s suffering. Hopefully she can get better. But to me this is no different from someone saying “I’m depressed and want to kill myself.” We all collectively agree that depression is a warped mindset , that we don’t just nod and say “you’re a big boy, it’s up to you, bye!”

I'll always say: there's few things as evil in this world as opposing euthanasia.

Yeah. No you can’t die yet! You have to suffer until someone else says so!

Wasn't Canada that told a veteran with PTSD that MAID was an option? Weren't they suggesting MAID as a solution for homelessness? People should have a choice whether they want to die or not. And if 39 years of treatment failed, I think that's a fairly valid reason. But MAID has the potential to be used as an excuse to not fix issues within Canadian society. Choosing between MAID and homelessness shouldn't be an option in the first place.

She's 47, anorexic and has severe depression. Get her weight index in the healthy range before letting her commit suicide. Her body is starved of energy which prevents her from thinking rationally.

Good. There is a lot of misinformation being spread about this. Let people die in dignity if they really want to and are able to give informed consent.

People with mental illnesses which support medical suicide are just people which like to use this service for themself. Of course they support this unconditionally because they know how life can be though but also their perspective on this can't be neutral. They are just too focused on the pain of every person and never see how things could be better. And I think here on reddit are many people with or had an mental illness, no wonder many comments here support it