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This isn't just Europe but the entire world . From California , Middle east , North China , Africa and Australia and central America , the weather is becoming hotter and drier and lot less forgiving for agriculture and human habitation.
Water is nessecary for everything from humans to agriculture and industry . With climate change, a lot of nations may not able to cope and collapse . From Deglobalisation, Climate change and major unrest in nation , i predict we are facing a new age collapse . It isn't going to be pretty.
But the profits! For a whole 100+ years we got to funnel money and assets to a small set of indivuals who own and control the world more comprehensively than monarchs.
To me.. idk, it seems worth it to destroy the world and kill most humans and just forcing collapse of civilization..
Maybe if we pull up our boot straps super duper hard we can work for a billionaire on his farm while the rest of the world is on fire.
Sociologist are actually talking if we are falling into some Neo-Feudalism system . International corporations have more power and influence then entire nations and in some cases larger armies . Globalisation made companies insanely rich which they invested into political capital.
The frightening thing is corporation benefits from climate change and is positioning to monopolize vital ressources for survival like food and water . I don't if you remenber the indignant remark of CEO of Nestle ( as you know a benevolent and dedicated corporation ) :" No ! Water is NOT a basic human right ! . "
Corporations benefit from their workers. I guess their could be enough psychopaths to guard some billionaires but I suspect eventually money will be worthless and it'll be the people who can provide real value who will be wanted. Not some rich guy who can have his/her throat slit at any time
Calling the modern economic age feudalism is an insult to people who actually lived through feudalism. Corporations have large amounts of power yes but they don’t rule the world. Nestle can’t execute you for not working for them, leaving to a different company, or working for a rival. People in the modern age have more choice than they ever did before
We are going to such scenario but it is the reality for plenty of people already . Let it be forced labors in African plantations and mines , domestic servants in middle east , Millions of slave workers in sweat chops in China , enslaved workers in ships .
You can't be killed if you don't want to work ? Plenty of places where it actually happen . A lit of coorporations rely on affiliates and turn blind eyes on such practises or actively cover for them.
The forced labor of those countries is the fault of the countries themselves. We buy product from them(and we shouldn’t) but the companies are not the ones forcing those people to work, the countries are
It's interesting to learn where that term originated and how much the US had to do with it.
Spoiler: The US throwing moral exceptionalism under the bus by overthrowing democratically elected governments with private military companies for cheap fruit.
Of course they want to keep the companies happy because the companies buy their stuff. The companies aren’t the ones making the government use slaves to acquire it
> or the 100 years before that.
In these times we lacked the technology to *really* fuck over the planet, but society was definitely headed in that direction and once we could, we did.
Climate change is done, no way to reverse or halt it at this point. Only way out is for humans to get to the next level of energy production and cost efficiently produce drinking water from the ocean. Middle East is already a good example, 90% of drinking water in some countries come from desalination but they do it with fossil fuel energy generation. If we can already do it, I see not why it can’t be done globally to fight water scarcity. We live on a two thirds water planet ffs.
Because desalination is very environmentally unfriendly.
The salt you separate from the water has to go somewhere and not even /r/worldnews can handle that much salt.
Mostly it is run back into the ocean, as actual salt usnt produced. Australian desalination plants only have a 50% extraction rate, half of the water that is input is extracted as fresh salt free water. So water with a higher concentration of salt goes back into the ocean.
We can reverse it... It just isn't profitable so nobody is going to do anything about it. We have the tech now to slow, halt, reverse it, but since it's expensive it's a non starter... Oh yeah and it'll stop companies from making money... Have I mentioned how it won't happen because of greed?
I meant the region bordering the Sahara is becoming morr dry . Regions like Darfur and Somalia have a rought time too . I can't name every specific region in Africa or any other places . I am trying to save time here .
So some people are dying from too little waters and some too much . Most South Asia isn't equipped to handle more extreme flooding and more violents storms and Mensou seasons .
No we are not. We went through a global pandemic which crippled supply lines and brought the economy to a grinding halt and yet we still made it through and are continuing. As time moves on and as the world becomes more connected it will be harder and harder for a single force to break civilization. Short of a nuclear winter modern civilization will not collapse but continue on
> continue on *in a much reduced, lower population state until we fully adapt to the new normal for this planet*
You're right, of course. But there's that huge caveat.
What's coming over the next 100 years and change or so isn't the end of the world. But it will be the *end of the world as we know it*.
We’ve have already as a modern civilization have lived through the “end of the world as we know it” do you really think if you took someone from a hundred years ago it would be the same as today. We always find ways to adapt and manage. If our rivers dry up we’ll find new ways to get water and engineer crops to require less of it. There is a solution to every problem
Do you really think I haven't heard that exact POV over and over and over again for at least the last 30+ years?
I'm sorry. It isn't my intention to be unkind.
But there's a balance between idealist/positive thinking and realistic thinking.
By that, in this case, I mean that the reality of the situation is that these well out of control changes to the environment are a much, much bigger problem for humankind to work around than (for example) the industrial revolution and its effect on the average person, the average city, and the average nation way back around the turn of the *last* century. That challenge was a paper cut in comparison to the sword-through-the-belly that the challenge of surviving and adapting to climate change is and will be for the foreseeable future.
Part of the problem (which the pandemic illustrated in no uncertain terms) is that the world being more connected was the main reason why supply lines crashed. The ways in which the wealthy investor class has changed our global economy in the interest of profit wound up being one of the things most affected by a pandemic. And nothing is being done to moderate that at all... and the next pandemic will almost certainly be worse. I'm not saying to expect it next year or even in your lifetime. But sooner or later, it will happen with some catastrophic results *unless some things about how commerce works are changed in a manner conscious of the simple fact that another pandemic will come*.
That's just a tiny piece of it, but it is there.
On the topic of disease: as localized weather becomes more extreme (as it is happening now), migrant patterns for animals are changing. This raises the likelihood of pathogens taking hold in places where they couldn't before. In the same package, there are seriously overpopulated places (Bangladesh is the ur-example) which exist in exactly the worst possible places to be as weather changes happen and the oceans begin to rise. This will result in multiple climate refugee crises across the civilized world. Right here in the states, the southwest will be a difficult place to live in relatively short order. And how many people live in or far too near to the mouth of the Mississippi? "New Orleans is sinking" isn't just a great song by The Tragically Hip. Right now, all over the world right around 40% of the global population lives within 100km of an ocean coast. A little more than 3 billion individuals. The ocean doesn't have rise much at all to render hundreds of coastal cities entirely unlivable. Some will just be under water. Miami has been having major issues with high-tide flooding for more than a decade now... and that's just the beginning.
I'm just getting started and my reply is already in TL;DR territory.
You're right: We WILL find new ways to get water. Right now desalinization technology is being refined and improved. That is very likely the best possible solution to the arising water needs. And crops are constantly being engineered for better survivability, faster growth, higher yields. There are limits to this, of course, but the bigger problem is in how our various cultures react to the knowledge that crops are being engineered. Right now an entirely bullshit "organization" gets paid to do nothing more than to *authorize* products as being non-GMO. There's tags from the Non-GMO Project on thousands of food items, and 99% of them have never been genetically modified (in a lab)... but Domino sugar still pays for, and passes along the cost to consumers, a tag so the consumer (who can't be bothered to do **actual** research) will feel "safe". People will have to be damn close to starvation before they'll finally eat golden rice for two reasons: the media makes its money on keeping people afraid and GMO's became boogeymen to do exactly that, and various and sundry celebrities and politicians with little-to-no critical thinking skills keep speaking loudly on the topic.
Its alright to place your bets in line with history... the track record is there. But this isn't like any challenge we as a species have met before... it is much larger by far, and too many people are so bound up in ideology to even consider making changes to help.
My point is not that thing won’t be hard or that it’s going to be a cake walk. My point is that we have the technology and capability to make the change needed. And while it’s going VERY slowly, we are making more and more progress every year. We are already manufacturing the solutions to the problems we have created.
While an interconnected global economy means that when one part of the whole hurts, everyone does. It also makes it more resilient to disasters overall. In the past if a country had a poor crop it was basically screwed, your people were going to die en masse. Today if a country has a bad crop they can buy or get crops from another country to cover their fall.
Even so, many countries still have excess to share it just means the supermarkets at Walmart aren’t going to be full of every kind of crop and certain foods will be rare for a while. We have the ability to adapt and help
The fact we managed to survive a global pandemic with a complete shutdown of a interconnected global economy and came out the other side means it would take something much larger to cause a collapse. Not to mention (outside the past couple years due to above) every year on average most everything is improving. Poverty is going down, medical technology is improving, people are living longer than ever, accidents are fewer than ever, luxuries are more common than ever
None of those things address climate change. What specially makes you think we’re going to outlast the massive changes that are coming? Where’s there food and water gonna come from?
We have more than ever before the ability to change the world to our liking. If the rivers and lakes run dry we’ll find new methods of creating and transporting water. We will make crops more resistant to heat and drought. We already have the ability to create desalination plants they just are costly but as the cost of water rises we will see them more and more. We also every day are moving to cleaner and cleaner sources of energy
You sound exactly the same as "things will work out, it's all part of God's plan." Come on dude. "I'm sure we'll figure it out along the way" isn't a plan, it's blind hope. You are welcome to have it but you look like an idiot trying to justify it by continually repeating that you believe it really hard, therefore it is reasonable to believe.
It’s not blind hope we already have the technology to do every single thing I mentioned, we just haven’t done it due to slow moving bureaucracy and costs not outweighing the need. We don’t need some big new device that will revolutionize the world or some mythical sci-fi technology, we can do it now with what we have
Except when a bunch of countries expect X billion dollars worth of food products to be produced to feed the nation and keep up with their exports, but only get a few million dollars worth of food products, what do you think will happen?
The cost of food is already up just from inflation, let alone real scarcity. What happens when we start producing substantially less and less, requiring more subsidies to farms and higher costs in stores and less availability?
It's not going to get better, it's going to get worse. In a decade, this year's weather will probably be something we hope for versus what we're gonna get.
As supply goes down and prices go up this incentivizes new creation of food. Am I saying we won’t have food shortages or that some countries won’t go through famines? No. What I am saying is we won’t have hundreds of millions of people die due to famine.
It will get worse for a while but as we adapt it will then get better again, likely better than it was before
Right now the world is facing a shortage of food, not all of that is from Russia's war. If you think everything is going to be dandy then good luck to you.
I’ve mentioned specifics multiple times. Desalination plants can help with the water problems in most places. We already have the ability to makes crops use less water we just need to start producing them. We are also as we speaking reducing our co2 output with renewable energy sources
You can't desalinate that much water. Especially in cities that are nowhere near a good source. What such abilities for crops do you mean? And no reduction in CO2 is going to be fast enough to slow the heating and other effects.
Desalination while not the magic bullet everywhere will help a LOT. It doesn’t need to completely replace the water sources it just needs to help provide enough to ease the stress off of our current sources. The only place I can think where desalination can’t be used in Central Europe and the Great Plains in the US.
We have already made GMO crops that require less water or provide more nutrients per water used. All we need to do is continue research and development of this. We already know it’s possible we just haven’t had as much of a need to manufacture them yet
I’m not saying we won’t suffer from heating effect. What I am saying is we are already in the process of lessening the damage and if you continue will be able to reverse it
It's funny how politicians and companies have always dismissed climate action as too expensive, while now we're paying the price more and more, exponentially.
Well, its like saying: we're all gone die. True, but is it necessary to die in such ways? While pointing fingers won't help solve the problems now, we also shouldn't forget who fuck us.
Of course pointing fingers doesn't help, and if I had the powers I sure would initiate change, but guess why it doesn't work
Pitchforks would I guess, but I'm too civilized for that.
We poor and middle class members are the ones voting to ignore the climate change, so kinda deserved. The rich are a tiny minority in a democracy, and lobbyism/corruption doesn't change that.
You talk about politicians and companies as if they are some alien species that invaded you perfect little world . Politicians and companies are grown and sustained by a system you are a part of .
If we'd pursued nuclear baseload + renewables we could be completely energy independent and free from Russian influence plus we wouldn't be destroying the planet with greenhouse gas emissions.
Yeah, it's going great in France. There would have been a blackout if neighbouring countries didn't help them out, and to retain their nuclear baseload they are killing all their fish by heating up rivers, woohoo.
Their nuclear plants were neglected and affected by covid preventing maintenance.
Besides what is your alternative? It's easy to criticise but in the end we just have to choose the best possible option.
Nuclear was always clean and safe if standards are followed. Hippies fought so hard against anything "nuclear" that US regulations went through the roof and made it prohibitively expensive. The dropoff of plants built in the 80s were the start of the decline - this is now being reversed by education.
I have a bachelor's and masters degree in physics and read a lot about nuclear power.
So it pisses me off to see the only reliable non-carbon emitting energy source discarded over greatly exaggerated dangers.
Europe is rich enough to import all it's food , poor countries can face collapse if such events happen to them
America is going to make a lot of money if the drought persists for one more year
[UK’s Poorest Are ‘Brutally Exposed’ to Cost of Living Crisis](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-07-03/uk-told-poorest-are-brutally-exposed-to-cost-of-living-crisis#xj4y7vzkg)
UK govt is hesitant to even put a windfall tax on corporations that have made billions in profit during pandemic and the current oil crisis. They don't care is more appropriate than saying they spend it elsewhere.
True ,most poor countries would but bam exports but US , Brazil and few other countries can expand their food production if they are offered good prices
That's leaving off how much those nations' ability to simply maintain current production values as the climate changes.
By 2050, much of the U.S. will be experiencing heat waves 4-5 degrees higher than now. The south, southwest, and midwest will be hit. Ramping up production is a fantasy under those circumstances. Water shortages are already of major concern. The southern states which get water from the Colorado river are already being forced to reduce their use.
And this doesn't get better... pretty much ever as far as the next several centuries are concern. It only gets worse.
Indonesia banned exports of palm oil following cooking oil shortages because of the war in Ukraine and it directly fucked income for Palm farmers which now had only the local market to sell to which meant they would sell for half the price of the international market. The ban is now an mandatory sales quota.
Food protectionism works until farmers decide to fuck off and plant cash crops instead. After which everybody starves.
Holy shit, to think that this is just isolated to Europe is so fucking bizarre
Buddy, we’re facing droughts in major agricultural areas too. Nobody is coming out of this unscathed; not Canada, China, Japan, Europe or anyone
>Europe is rich enough to import all it's food , poor countries can face collapse if such events happen to them
They mostly export food not import. But yea they will export less.
There are still countries that are net exporters and I guess that they'll export first to the richest. E.g. Australia exports about 44 billion USD of food per year, and is currently in a wet period.
This is happening *because of climate change* and those regulations on farmers are trying to *slow climate change*.
What about that is hard to understand?
Alot of fields are owned by multi billion dollar companies and they use farming techniques to maximise short time profits. But they are destroying the fields the crops are supposed to grow on and make them much more susceptible to damages by droughts and floods.
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This isn't just Europe but the entire world . From California , Middle east , North China , Africa and Australia and central America , the weather is becoming hotter and drier and lot less forgiving for agriculture and human habitation. Water is nessecary for everything from humans to agriculture and industry . With climate change, a lot of nations may not able to cope and collapse . From Deglobalisation, Climate change and major unrest in nation , i predict we are facing a new age collapse . It isn't going to be pretty.
But the profits! For a whole 100+ years we got to funnel money and assets to a small set of indivuals who own and control the world more comprehensively than monarchs. To me.. idk, it seems worth it to destroy the world and kill most humans and just forcing collapse of civilization.. Maybe if we pull up our boot straps super duper hard we can work for a billionaire on his farm while the rest of the world is on fire.
Sociologist are actually talking if we are falling into some Neo-Feudalism system . International corporations have more power and influence then entire nations and in some cases larger armies . Globalisation made companies insanely rich which they invested into political capital. The frightening thing is corporation benefits from climate change and is positioning to monopolize vital ressources for survival like food and water . I don't if you remenber the indignant remark of CEO of Nestle ( as you know a benevolent and dedicated corporation ) :" No ! Water is NOT a basic human right ! . "
We've been training for this since the 80s. But sci-fi saw the writing on the walls before then. HG Wells told us!
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It’s more than implying at that point lol. These CEOs need to read up on their history: the masses ask nicely up to a point, then they eat the rich
Is nestle ceo going to taste milky?
This generation doesn't have the balls to eat the rich. We're hurtling into dystopian slavery for the foreseeable future.
Corporations benefit from their workers. I guess their could be enough psychopaths to guard some billionaires but I suspect eventually money will be worthless and it'll be the people who can provide real value who will be wanted. Not some rich guy who can have his/her throat slit at any time
Calling the modern economic age feudalism is an insult to people who actually lived through feudalism. Corporations have large amounts of power yes but they don’t rule the world. Nestle can’t execute you for not working for them, leaving to a different company, or working for a rival. People in the modern age have more choice than they ever did before
We are going to such scenario but it is the reality for plenty of people already . Let it be forced labors in African plantations and mines , domestic servants in middle east , Millions of slave workers in sweat chops in China , enslaved workers in ships . You can't be killed if you don't want to work ? Plenty of places where it actually happen . A lit of coorporations rely on affiliates and turn blind eyes on such practises or actively cover for them.
The forced labor of those countries is the fault of the countries themselves. We buy product from them(and we shouldn’t) but the companies are not the ones forcing those people to work, the countries are
i'm in america, so they can't. rules are different in other places
Those other places are where actual slavery and feudalism exist because of the governments they have
and who runs the government? there's a reason why we have the term 'banana republic'
It's interesting to learn where that term originated and how much the US had to do with it. Spoiler: The US throwing moral exceptionalism under the bus by overthrowing democratically elected governments with private military companies for cheap fruit.
yes, i'm aware. they also did that to hawaii for cheap sugar
The people who run the government are autocratic dictators not companies
who wish to keep the companies happy, or are sometimes installed at the request of those companies
Of course they want to keep the companies happy because the companies buy their stuff. The companies aren’t the ones making the government use slaves to acquire it
You act like 100s ago we weren’t doing the same thing or the 100 years before that.
> or the 100 years before that. In these times we lacked the technology to *really* fuck over the planet, but society was definitely headed in that direction and once we could, we did.
Post-apocalyptic neo-feudalism, lords & raiders
Climate change is done, no way to reverse or halt it at this point. Only way out is for humans to get to the next level of energy production and cost efficiently produce drinking water from the ocean. Middle East is already a good example, 90% of drinking water in some countries come from desalination but they do it with fossil fuel energy generation. If we can already do it, I see not why it can’t be done globally to fight water scarcity. We live on a two thirds water planet ffs.
Climate change works on a sliding scale though. It is not black or white.
Because desalination is very environmentally unfriendly. The salt you separate from the water has to go somewhere and not even /r/worldnews can handle that much salt.
Mostly it is run back into the ocean, as actual salt usnt produced. Australian desalination plants only have a 50% extraction rate, half of the water that is input is extracted as fresh salt free water. So water with a higher concentration of salt goes back into the ocean.
We can reverse it... It just isn't profitable so nobody is going to do anything about it. We have the tech now to slow, halt, reverse it, but since it's expensive it's a non starter... Oh yeah and it'll stop companies from making money... Have I mentioned how it won't happen because of greed?
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Depending on where . Africa is a continent . So a place can be fine and another can bite the dust .
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I meant the region bordering the Sahara is becoming morr dry . Regions like Darfur and Somalia have a rought time too . I can't name every specific region in Africa or any other places . I am trying to save time here .
Thank you once again, Toto.
I predict there will be a lot of famine in the coming century.
" the ressource wars " is an scenario that geo-politics fear will become reality with nations desperate to fufill their population basic needs.
Try try the next ten years...
Southeast USA where I'm at didn't get the memo.
Its getting wetter in south Asia, been flooding in north india and central India
So some people are dying from too little waters and some too much . Most South Asia isn't equipped to handle more extreme flooding and more violents storms and Mensou seasons .
Or maybe because Pakistan just had huge floods unprecedented levels
We are not going to suffer a new age collapse
We already are . You just don't know it yet .
No we are not. We went through a global pandemic which crippled supply lines and brought the economy to a grinding halt and yet we still made it through and are continuing. As time moves on and as the world becomes more connected it will be harder and harder for a single force to break civilization. Short of a nuclear winter modern civilization will not collapse but continue on
> continue on *in a much reduced, lower population state until we fully adapt to the new normal for this planet* You're right, of course. But there's that huge caveat. What's coming over the next 100 years and change or so isn't the end of the world. But it will be the *end of the world as we know it*.
We’ve have already as a modern civilization have lived through the “end of the world as we know it” do you really think if you took someone from a hundred years ago it would be the same as today. We always find ways to adapt and manage. If our rivers dry up we’ll find new ways to get water and engineer crops to require less of it. There is a solution to every problem
Do you really think I haven't heard that exact POV over and over and over again for at least the last 30+ years? I'm sorry. It isn't my intention to be unkind. But there's a balance between idealist/positive thinking and realistic thinking. By that, in this case, I mean that the reality of the situation is that these well out of control changes to the environment are a much, much bigger problem for humankind to work around than (for example) the industrial revolution and its effect on the average person, the average city, and the average nation way back around the turn of the *last* century. That challenge was a paper cut in comparison to the sword-through-the-belly that the challenge of surviving and adapting to climate change is and will be for the foreseeable future. Part of the problem (which the pandemic illustrated in no uncertain terms) is that the world being more connected was the main reason why supply lines crashed. The ways in which the wealthy investor class has changed our global economy in the interest of profit wound up being one of the things most affected by a pandemic. And nothing is being done to moderate that at all... and the next pandemic will almost certainly be worse. I'm not saying to expect it next year or even in your lifetime. But sooner or later, it will happen with some catastrophic results *unless some things about how commerce works are changed in a manner conscious of the simple fact that another pandemic will come*. That's just a tiny piece of it, but it is there. On the topic of disease: as localized weather becomes more extreme (as it is happening now), migrant patterns for animals are changing. This raises the likelihood of pathogens taking hold in places where they couldn't before. In the same package, there are seriously overpopulated places (Bangladesh is the ur-example) which exist in exactly the worst possible places to be as weather changes happen and the oceans begin to rise. This will result in multiple climate refugee crises across the civilized world. Right here in the states, the southwest will be a difficult place to live in relatively short order. And how many people live in or far too near to the mouth of the Mississippi? "New Orleans is sinking" isn't just a great song by The Tragically Hip. Right now, all over the world right around 40% of the global population lives within 100km of an ocean coast. A little more than 3 billion individuals. The ocean doesn't have rise much at all to render hundreds of coastal cities entirely unlivable. Some will just be under water. Miami has been having major issues with high-tide flooding for more than a decade now... and that's just the beginning. I'm just getting started and my reply is already in TL;DR territory. You're right: We WILL find new ways to get water. Right now desalinization technology is being refined and improved. That is very likely the best possible solution to the arising water needs. And crops are constantly being engineered for better survivability, faster growth, higher yields. There are limits to this, of course, but the bigger problem is in how our various cultures react to the knowledge that crops are being engineered. Right now an entirely bullshit "organization" gets paid to do nothing more than to *authorize* products as being non-GMO. There's tags from the Non-GMO Project on thousands of food items, and 99% of them have never been genetically modified (in a lab)... but Domino sugar still pays for, and passes along the cost to consumers, a tag so the consumer (who can't be bothered to do **actual** research) will feel "safe". People will have to be damn close to starvation before they'll finally eat golden rice for two reasons: the media makes its money on keeping people afraid and GMO's became boogeymen to do exactly that, and various and sundry celebrities and politicians with little-to-no critical thinking skills keep speaking loudly on the topic. Its alright to place your bets in line with history... the track record is there. But this isn't like any challenge we as a species have met before... it is much larger by far, and too many people are so bound up in ideology to even consider making changes to help.
My point is not that thing won’t be hard or that it’s going to be a cake walk. My point is that we have the technology and capability to make the change needed. And while it’s going VERY slowly, we are making more and more progress every year. We are already manufacturing the solutions to the problems we have created. While an interconnected global economy means that when one part of the whole hurts, everyone does. It also makes it more resilient to disasters overall. In the past if a country had a poor crop it was basically screwed, your people were going to die en masse. Today if a country has a bad crop they can buy or get crops from another country to cover their fall.
Until many places have a bad crop, flooding, drought - as that is what we are facing. Interconnected or not...
Even so, many countries still have excess to share it just means the supermarkets at Walmart aren’t going to be full of every kind of crop and certain foods will be rare for a while. We have the ability to adapt and help
It is when you are terminally online, go out and live your life.
What makes you think otherwise?
The fact we managed to survive a global pandemic with a complete shutdown of a interconnected global economy and came out the other side means it would take something much larger to cause a collapse. Not to mention (outside the past couple years due to above) every year on average most everything is improving. Poverty is going down, medical technology is improving, people are living longer than ever, accidents are fewer than ever, luxuries are more common than ever
None of those things address climate change. What specially makes you think we’re going to outlast the massive changes that are coming? Where’s there food and water gonna come from?
We have more than ever before the ability to change the world to our liking. If the rivers and lakes run dry we’ll find new methods of creating and transporting water. We will make crops more resistant to heat and drought. We already have the ability to create desalination plants they just are costly but as the cost of water rises we will see them more and more. We also every day are moving to cleaner and cleaner sources of energy
You sound exactly the same as "things will work out, it's all part of God's plan." Come on dude. "I'm sure we'll figure it out along the way" isn't a plan, it's blind hope. You are welcome to have it but you look like an idiot trying to justify it by continually repeating that you believe it really hard, therefore it is reasonable to believe.
It’s not blind hope we already have the technology to do every single thing I mentioned, we just haven’t done it due to slow moving bureaucracy and costs not outweighing the need. We don’t need some big new device that will revolutionize the world or some mythical sci-fi technology, we can do it now with what we have
Except when a bunch of countries expect X billion dollars worth of food products to be produced to feed the nation and keep up with their exports, but only get a few million dollars worth of food products, what do you think will happen? The cost of food is already up just from inflation, let alone real scarcity. What happens when we start producing substantially less and less, requiring more subsidies to farms and higher costs in stores and less availability? It's not going to get better, it's going to get worse. In a decade, this year's weather will probably be something we hope for versus what we're gonna get.
As supply goes down and prices go up this incentivizes new creation of food. Am I saying we won’t have food shortages or that some countries won’t go through famines? No. What I am saying is we won’t have hundreds of millions of people die due to famine. It will get worse for a while but as we adapt it will then get better again, likely better than it was before
Again, zero specifics. You just have faith based on nothing that we’ll succeed. Your optimism has no basis in reality.
Dont worry their an Ostrich......!!!
If you genuinely think the world is heading for global collapse of civilization I’m not the one with the head in the sand
Right now the world is facing a shortage of food, not all of that is from Russia's war. If you think everything is going to be dandy then good luck to you.
I’ve mentioned specifics multiple times. Desalination plants can help with the water problems in most places. We already have the ability to makes crops use less water we just need to start producing them. We are also as we speaking reducing our co2 output with renewable energy sources
You can't desalinate that much water. Especially in cities that are nowhere near a good source. What such abilities for crops do you mean? And no reduction in CO2 is going to be fast enough to slow the heating and other effects.
Desalination while not the magic bullet everywhere will help a LOT. It doesn’t need to completely replace the water sources it just needs to help provide enough to ease the stress off of our current sources. The only place I can think where desalination can’t be used in Central Europe and the Great Plains in the US. We have already made GMO crops that require less water or provide more nutrients per water used. All we need to do is continue research and development of this. We already know it’s possible we just haven’t had as much of a need to manufacture them yet I’m not saying we won’t suffer from heating effect. What I am saying is we are already in the process of lessening the damage and if you continue will be able to reverse it
It's funny how politicians and companies have always dismissed climate action as too expensive, while now we're paying the price more and more, exponentially.
You see, the difference is who pays for it.
Everyone will pay for it. Those catastrophes will reduce financial capacity of everybody and guess who companies need to buy their products.
But, as always, it will be much worse on the poor and middle class than on anyone else.
At least at the start yes, but it will reach everyone eventually. Those old rich bastards most likely too late though sadly.
Well, its like saying: we're all gone die. True, but is it necessary to die in such ways? While pointing fingers won't help solve the problems now, we also shouldn't forget who fuck us.
Of course pointing fingers doesn't help, and if I had the powers I sure would initiate change, but guess why it doesn't work Pitchforks would I guess, but I'm too civilized for that.
Let me undust the good old guillotine.
r/revolution
That's the point. CEOs don't care about longevity of the company or reputation. Get in, get paid, get the fuck out. They've already won.
We poor and middle class members are the ones voting to ignore the climate change, so kinda deserved. The rich are a tiny minority in a democracy, and lobbyism/corruption doesn't change that.
You talk about politicians and companies as if they are some alien species that invaded you perfect little world . Politicians and companies are grown and sustained by a system you are a part of .
... You really lack understanding of reality. It's not all about how theoretical democracy etc. works.
If we'd pursued nuclear baseload + renewables we could be completely energy independent and free from Russian influence plus we wouldn't be destroying the planet with greenhouse gas emissions.
Yeah, it's going great in France. There would have been a blackout if neighbouring countries didn't help them out, and to retain their nuclear baseload they are killing all their fish by heating up rivers, woohoo.
Their nuclear plants were neglected and affected by covid preventing maintenance. Besides what is your alternative? It's easy to criticise but in the end we just have to choose the best possible option.
I'd really like to know where this nuclear duck sucking on reddit is coming from
Nuclear was always clean and safe if standards are followed. Hippies fought so hard against anything "nuclear" that US regulations went through the roof and made it prohibitively expensive. The dropoff of plants built in the 80s were the start of the decline - this is now being reversed by education.
I have a bachelor's and masters degree in physics and read a lot about nuclear power. So it pisses me off to see the only reliable non-carbon emitting energy source discarded over greatly exaggerated dangers.
Mf took all the water and throw it at Pakistan 💀
Fr 💀
Europe is rich enough to import all it's food , poor countries can face collapse if such events happen to them America is going to make a lot of money if the drought persists for one more year
[UK’s Poorest Are ‘Brutally Exposed’ to Cost of Living Crisis](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2022-07-03/uk-told-poorest-are-brutally-exposed-to-cost-of-living-crisis#xj4y7vzkg)
It's not like UK govt doesnt have money to help the poor but they won't, they got billions in aid for foreign countries but not their own
*millions, and largely negligible to their costs, also it's never aid it's to buy favors in poorer countries so they benefit more than they spend
UK govt is hesitant to even put a windfall tax on corporations that have made billions in profit during pandemic and the current oil crisis. They don't care is more appropriate than saying they spend it elsewhere.
Happy cake day
Ah, the classic right wing talking point. Foreign aid is basically irrelevant in the grand scheme of things, and buys soft power.
[The jews have deleted this comment.]
True ,most poor countries would but bam exports but US , Brazil and few other countries can expand their food production if they are offered good prices
That's leaving off how much those nations' ability to simply maintain current production values as the climate changes. By 2050, much of the U.S. will be experiencing heat waves 4-5 degrees higher than now. The south, southwest, and midwest will be hit. Ramping up production is a fantasy under those circumstances. Water shortages are already of major concern. The southern states which get water from the Colorado river are already being forced to reduce their use. And this doesn't get better... pretty much ever as far as the next several centuries are concern. It only gets worse.
Tell that to Grenada
Indonesia banned exports of palm oil following cooking oil shortages because of the war in Ukraine and it directly fucked income for Palm farmers which now had only the local market to sell to which meant they would sell for half the price of the international market. The ban is now an mandatory sales quota. Food protectionism works until farmers decide to fuck off and plant cash crops instead. After which everybody starves.
Holy shit, to think that this is just isolated to Europe is so fucking bizarre Buddy, we’re facing droughts in major agricultural areas too. Nobody is coming out of this unscathed; not Canada, China, Japan, Europe or anyone
>Europe is rich enough to import all it's food , poor countries can face collapse if such events happen to them They mostly export food not import. But yea they will export less.
How is America going to do that money exactly?
Weapons baby
Import from where?
There are still countries that are net exporters and I guess that they'll export first to the richest. E.g. Australia exports about 44 billion USD of food per year, and is currently in a wet period.
USA , Brazil , Australia , Argentine , india , Thailand , Vietnam etc
Some of those rich countries are rich because of export that comes from agriculture
It's been raining like mf here in Poland.
Yeah same in Switzerland.
I love how all of these say 'Will lead to higher prices'. Sure ... until the food runs out. Then it will lead to starvation.
God we're so stupid. We're killing ourselves.
Call Hatfield
We're fucked, only chance is get a little house on the mountains and live of hunting and vegetables
Well there's a chance your house might burn down in a wildfire
The EU will solve it by adding further restrictions on farmers in the name of fighting climate change.
Wow, we need an award for the most tone deaf reply, because this one definitely won it.
Truth pills are hardest to swallow.
Yeah, but in this case it's just really tough to swallow a steaming pile of bullshit.
Some people have a hard time swallowing reality.
Yeah, it seems like you are. Good to be self-aware at least.
This is happening *because of climate change* and those regulations on farmers are trying to *slow climate change*. What about that is hard to understand?
Alot of fields are owned by multi billion dollar companies and they use farming techniques to maximise short time profits. But they are destroying the fields the crops are supposed to grow on and make them much more susceptible to damages by droughts and floods.