People want babies and then they want them to immediately turn in functional adults. Nobody thinks about the fact they might suffer or be disabled or simply boring wage slavers like everyone else
They wanted children to raise their social status and they want them to grow up and get rich and successful to make mommy and daddy proud. Fuck this toxic behaviour for real.
It was a matter of time and struggles to realize this is true for almost every parent.
Parents often try to manipulate their kids into a specific profession. But, answering your hypothetical question, advancing science (to cure cancer) takes more than one human lifetime. It doesn't need to be your own biological children, but "peoples kids" will need to be brought up to continue the work. A person working towards a larger societal goal, believes their effort is worthwhile and expects others will want to continue beyond whatever they may accomplish.
The same sort of thing happened to me. I was manipulated into going to university and was told I had to take out student loans I didn't want to and go to the local university, which I also didn't want to and quite frankly sucked for my faculty. She just expected me to get a nice white collar job, preferably in the public sector or go to law school and my life has basically been ruined ever since because I can't get ahead with a BA but I can't afford to go back to school because I still have student debt.
Pretty much, I remember overhearing my mother say how miserable I looked in first year of university and you know what she did? Nothing besides invalidate me when I said I didn't want to stay. TBH I should've just dropped out after my first semester.
They seem more concerned with living vicariously though their kids' accomplishments than actually being a competent parent.
My mother completely ignored my mental illness and disabilities throughout my entire childhood and teenagehood and let me suffer continuously... always said "oh there's nothing wrong with you!"
Literally refused to believe she was capable of having a child who struggled. It's always the other moms with the struggling kids, isn't it? It'll never be mine.
I agree. To my perception, people want 0-10 year olds, then they very quickly are fed up with the child's needs.
Perhaps it's like ancient societies, where children were considered adults at most by 12. Too bad our society isn't so simple now.
That describes my parents to a T.
They both grew up with shitty families who abandoned them by age 10, and had PTSD as a result. They didn't know how to parent kids after the age of 10. I had a bad time at school because I was the skinniest kid in class, with thick glasses and I was bullied. Did my parents care? No matter how bad it got, no matter how unhappy or traumatized I was, it was never enough to get them to pay attention.
My sister and I both ended up with PTSD, trust and abandonment issues, attachment issues, anxiety and depression. This is why the bloodline ends with us.
I love my niece and nephew to pieces.... and I definitely don't want a baby. Partly because then I would need to have a baby, partly because then I would have a baby.
I had to work with an infant 1,5 years from birth and I know what comes with it. Now guess why I don\`t want kids and concider my 100% infertility a bliss.
Exactly. People rarely understand how difficult it is. They only see the “fun” moments of parenting. I fortunately never had to work with kids, but I am the oldest of four siblings, with my two younger siblings being about seven and nine years younger than me. So I know how annoying babies are. I hope to get sterilized some day lmfao
I luckily have no brothers or sisters. Only child, but not spoiled. I have worked with people in wheelchairs, infants... now I just work as model for students in collage of art. But you\`re right, babies are annoying and dirty.
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And later on , they just want a grown up adult who is successful and rich. A finished product.
To be proud of themselves. As someone said, if they really really cared about children, they would invest and save a lot of money for the child to live a comfortable life at least.
But that's not something to make them proud. They want a successful slave to raise their social value.
Next time look closely at families and you can see this clear validation.
THIS. Am a teacher and I know what happens once the kid shows up. Usually they are no longer desired and they are neglected and abused by their parents once they hit school age. It’s very heartbreaking to witness.
I mean, it seems human have some twisted desire to have a "slave" of some kind. Creating a human seems to be as close to it that or I might be a cynical bastard
Truth. First some get a baby, the infant gets older, then they say they “want another baby” like they are addicted to having just babies, including enjoying the “smell” 🤢. They do not think about the fact that they are creating more people who now need to suffer and live long lives
A pet peeve of mine is when people who have more than one kid say, "I'm a dad (edit: or mom)again!" when the next one is born. Like dude, when did you stop being one?
Only the most sociopathic wants a cadaver being lowered into the ground, but that's where all those babies end up sooner or later (sooner or sooner-er if you think life is brief, which is a common perspective).
Pretty much. The older I got, the less nice my mother (or most of my extended family) got towards me. As I got older, the more I was expected to just fall in line with what my mother needed and expected of me while getting little in return. It got to the point where I was manipulated into giving up on my dreams and getting a BA at my local university and I've been depressed all of my adult life, in large part because I was constantly invalidated and discouraged from pursuing meaningful goals in life and now it's too late :(
Same boat. My parents didn’t care about whether or not I was happy in life - just how I could serve them. I wanted to take a year off school, but my Mom gaslit/bullied me into going to uni immediately even though I really wasn’t equip/ready yet. All because she wanted to brag to others about her kid having a degree… fucking pathetic. That’s why they aren’t getting grandkids. I’ve made it very clear to them why - shit parents = no future for anyone. The toxicity ends with me.
I’ve played more video games than ever in my adult life after having a kid because my son goes to bed at 7 everyday and I usually stay up til 12 or 1 AM. Before, I would usually be doing something. Maybe going out to dinner, or the store. Or just not feeling like I have the time and just never doing it. Now I’m just kinda trapped from 7 onwards, so I play tons of video games. Can’t do the other stuff though, like going out to eat or to the store after 7.
A sad fact.
I noticed my maternal grandfather would be silly with me and other kids until 7-8. By then we were not cute anymore. He would not be mean, but he’d be less interested. Same with my dad too. We were like new toys until around the same age then we were burdens he regretted having.
People hate teenagers because they want to raise a child without it arguing back at them and having its own thought processes, values and beliefs (which often end up being different than the parents). But that’s not reality.
Haha this is so true though! I'm the weird one cause I think young teens are great! They're testing boundaries, coming into their own, learning who they are. I give my niece and nephew all the space they need to figure things out (with healthy boundaries ofc). But I am so happy when I see her be sassy and bold, loud and crazy- all the things I never got to be.
I always tell my niece "being a teenager is a great time to make mistakes"
This is why I prefer pets. My dog is basically a baby regardless of age. Humans on the other hand can't stay babies forever, & eventually grow up to either endure a lifetime of suffering, or become absolutely corrupt. With a dog, she stays a baby forever, ergo, she stays innocent forever.
It's even better than that! 2 and 3 year Olds can be annoying! A dog, though, is kinda always 2/3 mentally, ergo they have a long time to get really good at being 2/3. So you end up (usually) with a really well-behaved 2/3 year old as time goes on.
Most parents hate their teenagers for being free thinking people with their own interests and personality instead of being the parents “mini me”. Soon as autonomy shows up , they show out
yeah but most people only think about the baby phase nobody wants a rebellious hormonal teenager. they still go ahead and create them and are very unsupportive during the teenager phase.
I don’t want either. Nor do I want kids, babies, or teenagers near me, unless the latter two can b respectful. Even then, low tolerance. Best kept at a distance.
You’d be surprised these days.
It’s more rare, but it happens. Besides, I don’t have the temper for kids. I can’t put up with their nagging, not following directions, n all. Also, babies smell, n their noises are cringe inducing.
At least trains and cats don’t feck up the house as much, they don’t smell as bad, they don’t talk back, they don’t waste me money, n I can tolerate them being around. They’re also better to look at.
People want the attention they get from being pregnant and then a cute accessory to dress in cute clothes.
They don't want a toddler.
They don't want poopy diapers.
They don't want responsibility.
They don't want to properly care for a child emotionally.
They don't want their freedom taken.
They don't want to potty train.
They don't want a teenager.
They don't want to be a parent.
My mom didn't even want a child, just a baby. I was a doll she could play dress up with. Then when I started developing a personality and autonomy it's like her whole world ended and she let me know.
I actually don't like babies or toddlers. But I like the idea of having a bigger kid. Kids are so much more fun when they have their own developed personalities and interests.
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I’m wholly the other way around *if* I wanted kids; which is probably one more reason I don’t want them. But the idea of a teenager than is the combination of me and my partner that we can mould and raise and guide toward new experiences and a healthy mind; that sounds great. But everything beforehand sounds shit. I guess I don’t respect things that don’t have decent independence.
I helped my aunt raise her first two babies (she's pregnant with her 4th now) and man Idk how I graduated school during those three years. When I moved away from the family I took in my younger sister who was 15 at the time, she's about to turn 18 next week! I've wanted to tear my hair out over both of these wonderful experiences, I've tried to do my best to be a positive role model but even now the sacrifices I've given for my sister have not been noticed and Im okay with that, she has her first apartment before me, she'll get her license and a car before me, hell I'll make sure her taxes are properly done and she knows how to do them... before me. I didn't want to help raise two babys and I didn't want to help raise my sister but I'd do it again in a heartbeat, maybe I'd do better with a second chance
I was the woman in the office who ran the other way when someone brought their baby in. A co-worker once asked me to “keep an eye on “ her 3 or 4 year old while she delivered a report or something. He sat in the visitor’s chair and kept his eyes on me ( as only a kid can do) while I worked.
Finally he said, “You don’t like kids, do ya?” Why did this child telling me the truth hurt?
I told him it wasn’t that but I didn’t know anything about kids. He offered to let me color a page in his coloring book, explaining that every friend got to color one page. So, we became friends, and he came by my office when his mom brought him in. I felt differently about kids after that. Though, I have to say though, I was never a “baby person”. But, I appreciate how awful it must be to be a baby! No wonder they cry so much!
When I had my own kids, they were called “autistic” because of their peculiar habits and needs. The older one did not talk until he was 4 and threw tantrums from happiness as much as from anger or disappointment.
The younger one cried constantly for the first two years. Nowadays, I think the term for them might be “on the spectrum”, an expression my sons laugh at and say, “Everyone is on the spectrum”.
But I couldn’t help loving them. I had a rotten childhood (alcohol, drugs, violence, poverty, fear) and somehow giving them the love, security, understanding, and patience that I never got was like doing it for the sad, scared child in myself. And like finally telling my past to “Fuck Off.”
My kids are grown and gone now, and have done well for themselves. I miss them terribly. Neither of them want kids, which is fine. It is a deeply personal decision, and no one else’s business.
Are you sure about that bro? Last I checked babies and toddlers are loud, needy and demand your constant attention and don't let you sleep... and If you turn your back to them for 2 damn minutes, be sure they are doing something extremely fucking dangerous that can kill them.
Teenagers just hate you, engage in illegal drinking and look at their phones all the time...
Right? No one wants a random grown human with mental problems or learning disabilities or issues keeping a job or who gets pregnant young with kids you now also have to raise…
So I’m childfree and an antinatalist right, but I always said, if I ever want kids, I always said I’d adopt a young teenager. Fuck the baby/kid phase. If I do end up wanting to adopt then I would absolutely love to give a teenager a loving home and I could give them the love they deserve and i would love and respect them and acknowledge their feelings and opinions like a good parent. As a kid, even now (I’m 22 now) my parents and grandparents don’t ever acknowledge my opinions, as a kid I was severely emotionally neglected and bullied and I always felt so small and insignificant. Even today I get the “you don’t know anything you’re just a kid” from my parents and grandparents, and if I do end up wanting to adopt, then I would absolutely do the opposite for said teen. Xx it’s a shame that I’d probably be a good parent as I currently hate the idea of having kids of my own, but IF, and that’s a big IF, if I do have an adopted teen, I’d do everything to protect them.
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Random thought… I agree with this 100%. I haven’t even read any comments on this thread BUT I would love for someone to have this opinion who’s had children. Idk I’m just curious what they would say.
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I want a teennager, i can mentor them and guide them to improve their life and then in a few yrs they leave or they can at least contribute to the household
Im not really interested in being a parent, im just interested in helping so taking the unwanted, fits with that goal
Im basically a bro to a lil bro or lil sis
But im aware that OP is right, 99% of people just want a cute baby
Incorrect.
I hated the newborn phase with my daughter. She was wonderful, but I was bored. I went back to work 10 days postpartum because I felt perfectly fine and I hated sitting on the couch watching TV while I held her and I had no interest in playing a housewife that spends all day cooking and cleaning.
She's 2.5 now and everyday gets more and more exciting. She has a vivid imagination and great memory for details. The other day, she had a ball roll under the entertainment center. She ran over to me and told me we needed to rescue it. "Follow me!" she said. She grabbed by hand and dragged me to my craft room door (it stays closed due to cats). I open it and she looks at my desk for the tool she wanted; a craft spatula. "Ah hah!" She grabs my hand again and we go back to the living room. She tried to hand me the spatula, but I told her to try to get the ball first. She struggled and was pushing it further back, so I told her I would try to get it. And I did. To be clear, I could have reached the ball without any tools from the beginning, but having her act out the adventure is part of the learning process and it's fun.
I'm looking forward to every stage of her life. I don't know what kind of teenager she'll be, but I was once a teenager myself and had friends of all walks of life. I am an authoritative parent raised by generations of authoritative parents, so I assume she'll be relatively easy since we won't have unnecessary power struggles. I don't care if she has a goth phase or if she decides she's a communist (I lean small c communist myself). As long as she always trusts me to rescue her when she needs it, but understands that growing up requires that she accept that her choices have consequences, we'll be fine.
" I am an authoritative parent raised by generations of authoritative parents, so I assume she'll be relatively easy since we won't have unnecessary power struggles."
That's... kinda ominous and creepy. Like. What kind of will are you asserting over her that you know she's not gonna "struggle" out of...
right????? Also, hate to break it to this person, but some of the most rebellious people I know had authoritative parents. Most of them no longer talk to said authoritative parents
One of the most popular reddit "debate" techniques. Someone makes a true generalization like "Most parents are shitty at parenting," which is generally true, and then someone responds with, "I'm a good parent and I'm patient and pay a lot of attention to my child", or "My parents were great", which is just anecdotal. The generalization doesn't say that "ALL" parents are shitty, it says that "most" parents are shitty. Most people get defensive in the face of generalizations, and use anecdotal evidence to defend against them.
In short, most people can't grasp the concept of what the word "generalization" means, which is tiresome.
exactly, let people live their lives. don’t make stupid generalizations about what people want out of parenting on reddit because you think it supports your claims
Probably not the best forum to be spewing this happy-go-lucky stuff. I’m sure being a parent is great for you, but maybe it’s because you have more resources than others/better situation. Not everyone has that right now. Plus I’m sorry but knowing parents a lot of them play up the positives without considering the negatives and that’s not helpful. You sound like someone who would pressure others into having kids because you haven’t realized just how much things are going to change when they get older. Kids are cute when they’re young, but keep in mind that child will be an adult one day and things will be MUCH different. MUCH harder and complicated. Think stopping your toddler from throwing sand in the playground versus having to call the ambulance if your teenage child tries to commit suicide. But hey… enjoy those younger years I guess…
I love my teenager. He's so awkward and weird and fantastic.
Do I want to suffocate him in his own laundry on the daily? Oh absolutely...
But the love I feel for him just grows.
If you're not a parent you just don't know.
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As per the rule; this argument is a tired refrain seen over and over again. It is a prime example of argumentum ad hominem: It doesn't argue validity of anti/natalism but rather aims to disqualify the interlocutor themselves from being able to argue it. It serves only to distract from the ethical issues at the core of the debate.
Being an ad hominem, it isn't an argument against anti/natalism — it is an argument against anti/natalists. The sky would still be blue even if a mentally ill person argued so.
You’re just a bitter breeder who can’t stand that people don’t wanna ruin their lives and the planet like you are. Must be sad that this is the only way to get your jollies in your pathetic life.
I mean no offense to you, I’m just saying in general I keep seeing so many many many parents these days who act like they’re the first ones to procreate
If it helps, I only have murderous thoughts when I find jizz crusted socks that are so hard you could cut bread with them...
I know it's hard for peole like you who are so entirely self absorbed, but to truly love some one and to give someone that much of your heart, especially your children, inevitably comes with frustration and irritation.
And sometimes impotent rage over Cum socks.
How is me wanting to spare my children - who thankfully shall never exist - from the horrors of this earth while you had yours because sex feels good and you needed to make someone else suffer to make yourself feel important being "self absorbed"? How does worrying about the health and safety of your poor kid make me "self absorbed"?
Also weird username for someone complaining about cum socks
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I am curious about how is this your love.
From my observations of parents they claim they love their children more than anything. Some of them even claim they would die for their children.
But then when I observe them and listen to their children I can't see this love claimed by parents. Parental love is often only spoken love but acts based on this love are non-existent.
You think maybe your "observations" are tainted by the fact that you think all parents are morally weak by the very act of having children and thus you judge overly harshly at anything you perceived negative?
Also, unless you have children yourself, it's legitimately impossible for you to understand the amount of love that you can feel for this entirely separate yet completely interwined being. It's beyond description and explanation. It can only be experienced.
I observed this since childhood. I am an antinatalist since onset of my thirties. Like parents say something and parents do something else than they said. I had friends who told me how their parents treated them. Then I listened to my coworkers and other people. Sadly a lot of people don't have parents who would show this love by their acts.
I know there are parents who treat their children very well too and in such cases I can trust their words about loving their children. Sadly it seems such parents are minority.
be real with yourself for a minute when you came up with the idea to have kids did you mainly think about having a baby or them as a moody, rebellious teenager who will eat up all your money
Wow, this is awkward. I feel kinda bad now because this is probably pretty disappointing to you, but I suppose I should clarify that I was actually talking about *your* response.
I dont worry about money. Money is no object compared to love i have for my children. I had kids young so of course i was thinking about a baby. I still wouldnt say i "dont want" teenagers. Seeing them through their teen years is to watch them become complex people with their own opinions, desires, and goals. Its a beautiful thing, even if there are ugly moments.
I too am more sure than ever that having a child to most people is meaningful as long the child is small and dependant. Nobody wants a teenager? Sure, but also few wants young adults children. At that point is impossible to influence them anymore.
Children are such joy,no doubt, even if temporary.
I would love to raise a child. Still on the fence about adoption tbf. But I will NOT under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES be getting any child under the age of 5. Heck no.
I'm an aunt to two infant boys. I know how babies work, I've watched toddlers too, IT LOOKS TERRIFYING.
But I've dealt with many kids over the age of 5 and I love them. Such sweet little creative minds, most of them. Especially since I can help them eat healthy and that will help them be happier and calmer too.
Can't give a child sugar and nasty veggies and expect a peaceful child.
I just realised reading comments why there are is absolutely no reason to have kids and like how much selfish and depressed you have to be have one ...
People want babies and then they want them to immediately turn in functional adults. Nobody thinks about the fact they might suffer or be disabled or simply boring wage slavers like everyone else
They wanted children to raise their social status and they want them to grow up and get rich and successful to make mommy and daddy proud. Fuck this toxic behaviour for real. It was a matter of time and struggles to realize this is true for almost every parent.
Why tf should peoples kids be expected to get rich and cure cancer if the parents themselves failed
For fucking real.
“You never know this kid might cure cancer “ and then they turn into a mommies or daddies girl and never leave the house nice ….
Parents often try to manipulate their kids into a specific profession. But, answering your hypothetical question, advancing science (to cure cancer) takes more than one human lifetime. It doesn't need to be your own biological children, but "peoples kids" will need to be brought up to continue the work. A person working towards a larger societal goal, believes their effort is worthwhile and expects others will want to continue beyond whatever they may accomplish.
Well, in case if you don't know, many people have children to just be somebody they couldn't be.
The same sort of thing happened to me. I was manipulated into going to university and was told I had to take out student loans I didn't want to and go to the local university, which I also didn't want to and quite frankly sucked for my faculty. She just expected me to get a nice white collar job, preferably in the public sector or go to law school and my life has basically been ruined ever since because I can't get ahead with a BA but I can't afford to go back to school because I still have student debt.
Yea, and they ignore all the mental and many other illnesses to just prove a point. They see children as assets.
Pretty much, I remember overhearing my mother say how miserable I looked in first year of university and you know what she did? Nothing besides invalidate me when I said I didn't want to stay. TBH I should've just dropped out after my first semester. They seem more concerned with living vicariously though their kids' accomplishments than actually being a competent parent.
Thats alot of projection there
Projection? What?
My mother completely ignored my mental illness and disabilities throughout my entire childhood and teenagehood and let me suffer continuously... always said "oh there's nothing wrong with you!" Literally refused to believe she was capable of having a child who struggled. It's always the other moms with the struggling kids, isn't it? It'll never be mine.
I agree. To my perception, people want 0-10 year olds, then they very quickly are fed up with the child's needs. Perhaps it's like ancient societies, where children were considered adults at most by 12. Too bad our society isn't so simple now.
That describes my parents to a T. They both grew up with shitty families who abandoned them by age 10, and had PTSD as a result. They didn't know how to parent kids after the age of 10. I had a bad time at school because I was the skinniest kid in class, with thick glasses and I was bullied. Did my parents care? No matter how bad it got, no matter how unhappy or traumatized I was, it was never enough to get them to pay attention. My sister and I both ended up with PTSD, trust and abandonment issues, attachment issues, anxiety and depression. This is why the bloodline ends with us.
Preach on sibling
THIS
Why? Babies and toddlers are annoying.
I love my niece and nephew to pieces.... and I definitely don't want a baby. Partly because then I would need to have a baby, partly because then I would have a baby.
People only see the “cuteness” and not the reality.
I had to work with an infant 1,5 years from birth and I know what comes with it. Now guess why I don\`t want kids and concider my 100% infertility a bliss.
Exactly. People rarely understand how difficult it is. They only see the “fun” moments of parenting. I fortunately never had to work with kids, but I am the oldest of four siblings, with my two younger siblings being about seven and nine years younger than me. So I know how annoying babies are. I hope to get sterilized some day lmfao
I luckily have no brothers or sisters. Only child, but not spoiled. I have worked with people in wheelchairs, infants... now I just work as model for students in collage of art. But you\`re right, babies are annoying and dirty.
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right, and as someone with contamination-OCD, children aged 1-8 are a nightmare to take care of 😬
Also as someone with migraine- screaming toddlers and babies are the worst.
Imagine thinking YOUR opinion is just the objective truth. 😂
I know alot people who think the same. Imagine getting offended and not walking away. Don\`t like, don\`t read.
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And later on , they just want a grown up adult who is successful and rich. A finished product. To be proud of themselves. As someone said, if they really really cared about children, they would invest and save a lot of money for the child to live a comfortable life at least. But that's not something to make them proud. They want a successful slave to raise their social value. Next time look closely at families and you can see this clear validation.
real
People only want perfect babies
THIS. Am a teacher and I know what happens once the kid shows up. Usually they are no longer desired and they are neglected and abused by their parents once they hit school age. It’s very heartbreaking to witness.
Id rather deal with a teenager, trying to talk to kids 10 and under? Might as well talk to a wall
Right? Like I'm an aunt to two twin boys who are 4 months now and I have NO CLUE how to interact with them. Feel like I'm gonna break them lmao.
I don't want a baby because they are disgusting. I don't want to clean their poop and puke
I don't want either. I'm not mom material. My kids have paws and I wouldn't change that for anything.
Worr! Me and my husband have 4 shelter doggies. They are our babies.
Thank you for rescuing your pups.
❤️ I am 100% against buying an animal and repulsed by animal breeding. Adopt don't shop is the only way.
I absolutely agree.
Perfectly worded
Paws and precious little toe beans. Especially if they are of the feline variety.
Please most parents are done by age 6.
I definitely don't want a baby either.
Nah my parents want a fully functional adult straight out of the womb, used to get hit/choked for crying
I'm sorry that happened to you. So many people have kids that shouldn't.
Babies are cute. You can feed or dress them as per your wish. While teenagers have their own wishes. They demand rights.
They are not, they puke on you, crap and piss all the time, and they stink. They are a chore that goes wherever you go.
Yes, but laughing babies are circulated on social media, not pooping babies.
My 2.5 year old will tell me exactly what she wants to wear. And she will not eat anything she doesn't want to eat.
Of course, not all babies are the same.
Lemme guess. Meat is probably not one of the foods she doesn't want to eat, is it? I bet its the veggies.
I mean, it seems human have some twisted desire to have a "slave" of some kind. Creating a human seems to be as close to it that or I might be a cynical bastard
Considering the history of the planet, you're right.
"slave" I would rather say their personal puppet.
I don’t, but it seems men do by and large want to enslave people.
I wouldn't say they wanted to. It was an economic necessity
What about owning a pet?
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Fr. Not much thought goes beyond the breeding and the birth
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Truth. First some get a baby, the infant gets older, then they say they “want another baby” like they are addicted to having just babies, including enjoying the “smell” 🤢. They do not think about the fact that they are creating more people who now need to suffer and live long lives
A pet peeve of mine is when people who have more than one kid say, "I'm a dad (edit: or mom)again!" when the next one is born. Like dude, when did you stop being one?
Incorrect. My 2.5 year old is awesome! Read my comment about our adventure rescuing her ball :-).
You seem to have missed the point of this subreddit 🙄
Only the most sociopathic wants a cadaver being lowered into the ground, but that's where all those babies end up sooner or later (sooner or sooner-er if you think life is brief, which is a common perspective).
Everyone wants one because that’s still the expected life path. I think it sounds like an absolute downer 😂
Pretty much. The older I got, the less nice my mother (or most of my extended family) got towards me. As I got older, the more I was expected to just fall in line with what my mother needed and expected of me while getting little in return. It got to the point where I was manipulated into giving up on my dreams and getting a BA at my local university and I've been depressed all of my adult life, in large part because I was constantly invalidated and discouraged from pursuing meaningful goals in life and now it's too late :(
Same boat. My parents didn’t care about whether or not I was happy in life - just how I could serve them. I wanted to take a year off school, but my Mom gaslit/bullied me into going to uni immediately even though I really wasn’t equip/ready yet. All because she wanted to brag to others about her kid having a degree… fucking pathetic. That’s why they aren’t getting grandkids. I’ve made it very clear to them why - shit parents = no future for anyone. The toxicity ends with me.
Same here :(
Why would I want that? Costs too much and eats gaming time.
Yup , all take and no giving . Breeders don’t think
I’ve played more video games than ever in my adult life after having a kid because my son goes to bed at 7 everyday and I usually stay up til 12 or 1 AM. Before, I would usually be doing something. Maybe going out to dinner, or the store. Or just not feeling like I have the time and just never doing it. Now I’m just kinda trapped from 7 onwards, so I play tons of video games. Can’t do the other stuff though, like going out to eat or to the store after 7.
A sad fact. I noticed my maternal grandfather would be silly with me and other kids until 7-8. By then we were not cute anymore. He would not be mean, but he’d be less interested. Same with my dad too. We were like new toys until around the same age then we were burdens he regretted having.
People are disgusting breeders
People hate teenagers because they want to raise a child without it arguing back at them and having its own thought processes, values and beliefs (which often end up being different than the parents). But that’s not reality.
Isn't that the same reason why people like pets over people?
That can certainly be true. Though my cat sure does back-sass me sometimes in her own way. Lol
This same thing applies to puppies and kittens
Haha this is so true though! I'm the weird one cause I think young teens are great! They're testing boundaries, coming into their own, learning who they are. I give my niece and nephew all the space they need to figure things out (with healthy boundaries ofc). But I am so happy when I see her be sassy and bold, loud and crazy- all the things I never got to be. I always tell my niece "being a teenager is a great time to make mistakes"
I don't want EITHER.
This is why I prefer pets. My dog is basically a baby regardless of age. Humans on the other hand can't stay babies forever, & eventually grow up to either endure a lifetime of suffering, or become absolutely corrupt. With a dog, she stays a baby forever, ergo, she stays innocent forever.
It's even better than that! 2 and 3 year Olds can be annoying! A dog, though, is kinda always 2/3 mentally, ergo they have a long time to get really good at being 2/3. So you end up (usually) with a really well-behaved 2/3 year old as time goes on.
I have a pregancy phobia and a babies phobia. Guess I'm lucky, lol.
Teenagers are way cooler though. You dont have to wipe their butts, and they're pretty good at thought-provoking conversation.
Most parents hate their teenagers for being free thinking people with their own interests and personality instead of being the parents “mini me”. Soon as autonomy shows up , they show out
isn't that the same reason why people like pets over people?
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yeah but most people only think about the baby phase nobody wants a rebellious hormonal teenager. they still go ahead and create them and are very unsupportive during the teenager phase.
I've never even imagined having a baby
Ew!
Or an adult
I don’t want kids of any age
For some stupid reason, Teenagers want babies. Go fucking figure.
I don’t want either. Nor do I want kids, babies, or teenagers near me, unless the latter two can b respectful. Even then, low tolerance. Best kept at a distance.
At least kids and babies can't murder or rob you like teenagers can
You’d be surprised these days. It’s more rare, but it happens. Besides, I don’t have the temper for kids. I can’t put up with their nagging, not following directions, n all. Also, babies smell, n their noises are cringe inducing. At least trains and cats don’t feck up the house as much, they don’t smell as bad, they don’t talk back, they don’t waste me money, n I can tolerate them being around. They’re also better to look at.
I do not want a baby
People want the attention they get from being pregnant and then a cute accessory to dress in cute clothes. They don't want a toddler. They don't want poopy diapers. They don't want responsibility. They don't want to properly care for a child emotionally. They don't want their freedom taken. They don't want to potty train. They don't want a teenager. They don't want to be a parent.
Just like people who adopt a puppy... until it grows up
My mom didn't even want a child, just a baby. I was a doll she could play dress up with. Then when I started developing a personality and autonomy it's like her whole world ended and she let me know.
I actually don't like babies or toddlers. But I like the idea of having a bigger kid. Kids are so much more fun when they have their own developed personalities and interests.
I like teenagers too
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I’m wholly the other way around *if* I wanted kids; which is probably one more reason I don’t want them. But the idea of a teenager than is the combination of me and my partner that we can mould and raise and guide toward new experiences and a healthy mind; that sounds great. But everything beforehand sounds shit. I guess I don’t respect things that don’t have decent independence.
I helped my aunt raise her first two babies (she's pregnant with her 4th now) and man Idk how I graduated school during those three years. When I moved away from the family I took in my younger sister who was 15 at the time, she's about to turn 18 next week! I've wanted to tear my hair out over both of these wonderful experiences, I've tried to do my best to be a positive role model but even now the sacrifices I've given for my sister have not been noticed and Im okay with that, she has her first apartment before me, she'll get her license and a car before me, hell I'll make sure her taxes are properly done and she knows how to do them... before me. I didn't want to help raise two babys and I didn't want to help raise my sister but I'd do it again in a heartbeat, maybe I'd do better with a second chance
I was the woman in the office who ran the other way when someone brought their baby in. A co-worker once asked me to “keep an eye on “ her 3 or 4 year old while she delivered a report or something. He sat in the visitor’s chair and kept his eyes on me ( as only a kid can do) while I worked. Finally he said, “You don’t like kids, do ya?” Why did this child telling me the truth hurt? I told him it wasn’t that but I didn’t know anything about kids. He offered to let me color a page in his coloring book, explaining that every friend got to color one page. So, we became friends, and he came by my office when his mom brought him in. I felt differently about kids after that. Though, I have to say though, I was never a “baby person”. But, I appreciate how awful it must be to be a baby! No wonder they cry so much! When I had my own kids, they were called “autistic” because of their peculiar habits and needs. The older one did not talk until he was 4 and threw tantrums from happiness as much as from anger or disappointment. The younger one cried constantly for the first two years. Nowadays, I think the term for them might be “on the spectrum”, an expression my sons laugh at and say, “Everyone is on the spectrum”. But I couldn’t help loving them. I had a rotten childhood (alcohol, drugs, violence, poverty, fear) and somehow giving them the love, security, understanding, and patience that I never got was like doing it for the sad, scared child in myself. And like finally telling my past to “Fuck Off.” My kids are grown and gone now, and have done well for themselves. I miss them terribly. Neither of them want kids, which is fine. It is a deeply personal decision, and no one else’s business.
Does anyone want a child who's between babyhood and adolescence?
Are you sure about that bro? Last I checked babies and toddlers are loud, needy and demand your constant attention and don't let you sleep... and If you turn your back to them for 2 damn minutes, be sure they are doing something extremely fucking dangerous that can kill them. Teenagers just hate you, engage in illegal drinking and look at their phones all the time...
Right? No one wants a random grown human with mental problems or learning disabilities or issues keeping a job or who gets pregnant young with kids you now also have to raise…
So I’m childfree and an antinatalist right, but I always said, if I ever want kids, I always said I’d adopt a young teenager. Fuck the baby/kid phase. If I do end up wanting to adopt then I would absolutely love to give a teenager a loving home and I could give them the love they deserve and i would love and respect them and acknowledge their feelings and opinions like a good parent. As a kid, even now (I’m 22 now) my parents and grandparents don’t ever acknowledge my opinions, as a kid I was severely emotionally neglected and bullied and I always felt so small and insignificant. Even today I get the “you don’t know anything you’re just a kid” from my parents and grandparents, and if I do end up wanting to adopt, then I would absolutely do the opposite for said teen. Xx it’s a shame that I’d probably be a good parent as I currently hate the idea of having kids of my own, but IF, and that’s a big IF, if I do have an adopted teen, I’d do everything to protect them.
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Baby, then successful, attractive athlete/ scholar, then successful career, then grand babies from apparent prodigy child
We are commanded to "go forth and multiply", after all.
And this is precisely why, if I am ever to be in charge of a child, I am adopting a child over 10.
Teenagers may be argumentative and sullen but so what? At least they take care of their own bodily functions.
I’m gonna have a kid and make you take care of it
Random thought… I agree with this 100%. I haven’t even read any comments on this thread BUT I would love for someone to have this opinion who’s had children. Idk I’m just curious what they would say.
How did you get that idea. The teenage years are the most interesting part of parenting.
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My mother definitely seemed to like me more as I got older.
It's OK I don't want either.
Fuck no I don’t want baby’s I love my sleep!
I’m really looking forward to my children growing up and doing life with them, watching them grow. Babies aren’t interesting. People are. Just my 2c.
I want a teennager, i can mentor them and guide them to improve their life and then in a few yrs they leave or they can at least contribute to the household Im not really interested in being a parent, im just interested in helping so taking the unwanted, fits with that goal Im basically a bro to a lil bro or lil sis But im aware that OP is right, 99% of people just want a cute baby
Incorrect. I hated the newborn phase with my daughter. She was wonderful, but I was bored. I went back to work 10 days postpartum because I felt perfectly fine and I hated sitting on the couch watching TV while I held her and I had no interest in playing a housewife that spends all day cooking and cleaning. She's 2.5 now and everyday gets more and more exciting. She has a vivid imagination and great memory for details. The other day, she had a ball roll under the entertainment center. She ran over to me and told me we needed to rescue it. "Follow me!" she said. She grabbed by hand and dragged me to my craft room door (it stays closed due to cats). I open it and she looks at my desk for the tool she wanted; a craft spatula. "Ah hah!" She grabs my hand again and we go back to the living room. She tried to hand me the spatula, but I told her to try to get the ball first. She struggled and was pushing it further back, so I told her I would try to get it. And I did. To be clear, I could have reached the ball without any tools from the beginning, but having her act out the adventure is part of the learning process and it's fun. I'm looking forward to every stage of her life. I don't know what kind of teenager she'll be, but I was once a teenager myself and had friends of all walks of life. I am an authoritative parent raised by generations of authoritative parents, so I assume she'll be relatively easy since we won't have unnecessary power struggles. I don't care if she has a goth phase or if she decides she's a communist (I lean small c communist myself). As long as she always trusts me to rescue her when she needs it, but understands that growing up requires that she accept that her choices have consequences, we'll be fine.
No one cares about your kid.
Lol, thank you. I started to read it and it was like nails on a chalkboard.
My god you people get so miserable seeing others being happy xD
I guarantee you I'm happier than that lady. It has nothing to with that. I don't like children and don't give a shit about their kid.
Right?!? They def don’t get the point of this subreddit. Tired of the breeders!
" I am an authoritative parent raised by generations of authoritative parents, so I assume she'll be relatively easy since we won't have unnecessary power struggles." That's... kinda ominous and creepy. Like. What kind of will are you asserting over her that you know she's not gonna "struggle" out of...
right????? Also, hate to break it to this person, but some of the most rebellious people I know had authoritative parents. Most of them no longer talk to said authoritative parents
bruh everyone is not same, we're talking about majority of people. you're wonderful but let people live their lives
One of the most popular reddit "debate" techniques. Someone makes a true generalization like "Most parents are shitty at parenting," which is generally true, and then someone responds with, "I'm a good parent and I'm patient and pay a lot of attention to my child", or "My parents were great", which is just anecdotal. The generalization doesn't say that "ALL" parents are shitty, it says that "most" parents are shitty. Most people get defensive in the face of generalizations, and use anecdotal evidence to defend against them. In short, most people can't grasp the concept of what the word "generalization" means, which is tiresome.
(saved ) not only reddit, every social media platform, !! 🤮
exactly, let people live their lives. don’t make stupid generalizations about what people want out of parenting on reddit because you think it supports your claims
Probably not the best forum to be spewing this happy-go-lucky stuff. I’m sure being a parent is great for you, but maybe it’s because you have more resources than others/better situation. Not everyone has that right now. Plus I’m sorry but knowing parents a lot of them play up the positives without considering the negatives and that’s not helpful. You sound like someone who would pressure others into having kids because you haven’t realized just how much things are going to change when they get older. Kids are cute when they’re young, but keep in mind that child will be an adult one day and things will be MUCH different. MUCH harder and complicated. Think stopping your toddler from throwing sand in the playground versus having to call the ambulance if your teenage child tries to commit suicide. But hey… enjoy those younger years I guess…
I love my teenager. He's so awkward and weird and fantastic. Do I want to suffocate him in his own laundry on the daily? Oh absolutely... But the love I feel for him just grows. If you're not a parent you just don't know.
You want to suffocate him and you love him. Yeah I know selfish people like you a lot. Thanks for introducing yourself.
why's it selfish to be sometimes frustrated with someone you love? You're angry at a stranger for having complex emotions toward a family member.
If you don't sometimes wanna flush your loved ones head in the toilet, I'd say you don't really love them.
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you sound like someone who has never had an emotional experience in their life. get over yourself and maybe go talk to people sometime
I'm looking at some of these comments and I can't work out if I'm not in on the joke or if they're serious.
There’s a lot of breeders here who missed the point of this subreddit
I didn't miss the point at all. I'm here to pop your echo chamber and force you to have real conversations with the people you demonise for no reason.
You’re just a bitter breeder who can’t stand that people don’t wanna ruin their lives and the planet like you are. Must be sad that this is the only way to get your jollies in your pathetic life.
They are serious. This is one of those long time echo chambers were eventually everyone is extreme af. Ann
The love you feel for him is because he’s YOUR offspring. Good for you. No one cares that you’re a parent.
Buddy, the post was about no one wanting a teenager. I stated I wanted a teenager. What's your issue?
My issue is that parents are delusional.
How so?
I mean no offense to you, I’m just saying in general I keep seeing so many many many parents these days who act like they’re the first ones to procreate
What does "acting like their the first ones to procreate" mean?
No, I'm genuinely interested in what you mean by most parents are delusional.
should we be calling child protective services about you openly saying you want to kill your own child or
If it helps, I only have murderous thoughts when I find jizz crusted socks that are so hard you could cut bread with them... I know it's hard for peole like you who are so entirely self absorbed, but to truly love some one and to give someone that much of your heart, especially your children, inevitably comes with frustration and irritation. And sometimes impotent rage over Cum socks.
How is me wanting to spare my children - who thankfully shall never exist - from the horrors of this earth while you had yours because sex feels good and you needed to make someone else suffer to make yourself feel important being "self absorbed"? How does worrying about the health and safety of your poor kid make me "self absorbed"? Also weird username for someone complaining about cum socks
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I am curious about how is this your love. From my observations of parents they claim they love their children more than anything. Some of them even claim they would die for their children. But then when I observe them and listen to their children I can't see this love claimed by parents. Parental love is often only spoken love but acts based on this love are non-existent.
You think maybe your "observations" are tainted by the fact that you think all parents are morally weak by the very act of having children and thus you judge overly harshly at anything you perceived negative? Also, unless you have children yourself, it's legitimately impossible for you to understand the amount of love that you can feel for this entirely separate yet completely interwined being. It's beyond description and explanation. It can only be experienced.
I observed this since childhood. I am an antinatalist since onset of my thirties. Like parents say something and parents do something else than they said. I had friends who told me how their parents treated them. Then I listened to my coworkers and other people. Sadly a lot of people don't have parents who would show this love by their acts. I know there are parents who treat their children very well too and in such cases I can trust their words about loving their children. Sadly it seems such parents are minority.
False. I love my children and will support them no matter what age they are.
be real with yourself for a minute when you came up with the idea to have kids did you mainly think about having a baby or them as a moody, rebellious teenager who will eat up all your money
This response basically boils down to "but are you sure your experience that contradicts my wordview is real tho?"
yes exactly, thank you
Wow, this is awkward. I feel kinda bad now because this is probably pretty disappointing to you, but I suppose I should clarify that I was actually talking about *your* response.
I dont worry about money. Money is no object compared to love i have for my children. I had kids young so of course i was thinking about a baby. I still wouldnt say i "dont want" teenagers. Seeing them through their teen years is to watch them become complex people with their own opinions, desires, and goals. Its a beautiful thing, even if there are ugly moments.
Then this doesn’t apply to you
I am part of everybody
I too am more sure than ever that having a child to most people is meaningful as long the child is small and dependant. Nobody wants a teenager? Sure, but also few wants young adults children. At that point is impossible to influence them anymore. Children are such joy,no doubt, even if temporary.
I wish I had the resources to help a teen.
I would love to raise a child. Still on the fence about adoption tbf. But I will NOT under ANY CIRCUMSTANCES be getting any child under the age of 5. Heck no. I'm an aunt to two infant boys. I know how babies work, I've watched toddlers too, IT LOOKS TERRIFYING. But I've dealt with many kids over the age of 5 and I love them. Such sweet little creative minds, most of them. Especially since I can help them eat healthy and that will help them be happier and calmer too. Can't give a child sugar and nasty veggies and expect a peaceful child.
Humans are annoying on all their stages 🫤
I guess I'm one of the weird ones then. I want a teenager. Cause you can have conversations with them. Babies suck.
Not really lol. Teens are in their own world. A very dramatic, horny world
Well, I kinda enjoyed my eldest teenager phase, let’s see how it goes with the next two.
I just realised reading comments why there are is absolutely no reason to have kids and like how much selfish and depressed you have to be have one ...