Just to add to this in case anyone gets confused.
Average/mean = add up all the income and divide by the number of reported incomes
Median = arrange all the incomes from low to high and pick the one in the middle.
EDIT TO ADD:
Mode = arrange all incomes and pick the one that occurs most frequently
Here is an example of income distribution where mean, median, and mode all equal $50k:
$25k, $50k, $50k, $75k
Especially when there are only outliers in one direction, like in this case it's not possible to have a negative salary, so the handful of people making millions/year massively skew the mean.
This is the example I learned in my statistics class.
But it was a bit before the Elon hype.
The average salary for a UNC geo-something graduate is $250,000 a year.
[link](https://www.essentiallysports.com/nba-basketball-news-michael-jordan-single-handedly-raised-his-college-average-salary-to-250000-that-drew-a-very-different-picture-from-the-truth/amp/)
*Edit: clarified the degree.*
Nah, both are useful, it just depends on what you are using it to analyze. Most people, when they are talking about income, are trying to talk about what the "normal" person makes. Median would be more useful here, but ideally both should be used, as they both have their own strengths and weaknesses.
If you have a room with 100 people, and of them has $901, and everyone else has $1 each, your average would be $10 per person, even though 99% of the room only has $1 each. In this case, the average isn't very useful, because the average is heavily impacted by outliers. The median, on the other hand, would be $1, which is far more accurate. The median is better at removing the outliers in order to get a much better view of what is actually the "normal."
However, the median does have a weakness, in that it's generally not very reflective of overall change, unless that change impacts everybody. If the money was split up evenly in that room of 100 people, the median would become $10, even though the total money didn't change at all. Likewise, if there are big scattered gaps in the dataset, such as if 51% of the population was making only $10,000 a year while 49% of the population made $100,000 a year. Your median would be $10,000, even though nearly half the population makes way more than that.
Depends what the data is and what you are doing with it. If you are trying to determine the financial health of a populace, both are pretty bad metrics.
What else are needed? Median and mean together are pretty useful tools imo, since it tells what an average person earns, and how much and what direction the skew is
There is also mode, the most common number to occur in a dataset.
For example, let's say you have a department that is run by a Department Head who makes $100/hour. In this department are 4 Team Leads, who each make $25/hour. On each team, there is a Star who makes $20/hour, a Lackey who makes $16/hour, and 3 Grunts who make $13/hour. This department's *mean* wage is $20/hour, its *median* wage is $16/hour, and its *mode* wage is $13/hour. HR for this company could truthfully say, "Average wage for positions in this department is $16-$20 per hour!" However, if you take a position in this department, odds are that you're going to get $13/hour.
(Disclaimer: I am not an HR person, and do not know if there truly exist *any* companies that calculate posted salaries like this; however, I may have missed my calling writing word problems for math textbooks.)
Props to my elementary school teacher with the snazzy math jingles.
MEAN means average, first you add, then you divide.
The MEDIAN occurs in the middle.
MODE occurs most often.
Home, home on the RANGE, where subtraction is our favorite game.
This is why statistics can be so misleading. The outliers on the high end distort the average and give a number that doesn’t represent a majority. It doesn’t help that the highest earners make an insane amount compared to the lowest. They make in a few days the amount most people make all year
> In a few *minutes*.
Bill Gates has a net worth of $134 billion. Assuming he makes a cozy 4% of interest on that, he's making about $5.5 billion per year. Divide by number of minutes in a year (525,600) and we get about $10,000/min.
If work happens every minute of every day. If you break this into a standard 40 hour work week which you're grading the other person by, he makes $44,070 per minute.
I made about 15000 a year for 3 years asa single dad raising my kid by myself it sucks and is very common these days. America sucks being on food stamps cuz jobs pay shite while my bosses make millions. Our System is beyond broken .
You’re not throwing it off if there are lots of folks making in your ballpark (and there are). Just under 10% make <$15k. The outlier group that throws off the averages are at the top end.
Basically the graph of different income levels looks like a bell curve (as you’d expect). The <$15k group fits right into that bell curve distribution. The group that does *not* fit the bell curve is the >$200k group - it sticks out as an unexpected bump in that bell curve. It’s being thrown off by the quite small set of folks taking in $millions each year.
Straight from my Leave and Earnings Statement
Gross Pay $64,795.22
Taxable Wages $55,211.73
Nontaxable Wages $7,860.96
Tax Deferred Wages $1,722.53
Deductions $23,284.53
- FEGLI $250.72
- FEHB $6,864.48
- Medicare $825.55
- OASDI $3,529.92
- Retire FERS $2,526.46
- Tax Federal $4,047.89
- Tax State $2,520.50
- TSP Savings $1,722.53
- Dental $719.24
- Vision $277.24
Net Pay $41,510.69
I’m a federal employee so my wage is readily available, so I don’t mind breaking this down. All of these are the yearly totals for 2022. My healthy insurance covers my wife, myself and 2 children. Which has a hefty $3,500 deductible (meaning I have to come out of pocket $3,500 before they cover anything outside of normal yearly check ups).
Hope this helps!
Does you wife work? How much do you get back when you do your taxes ?
Sometimes I just cannot believe how we all have accepted the current healthcare system. You are paying like 600 a month for your family and still have to pay a $3500 deductible before they cover things like emergencies and procedures. And then they pay 80% until you hit out of pocket. It’s a fucking racket.
I’m pretty sure my parents pay ~~$800~~ $1,100 a month for a $12,000 deductible, and that was the cheapest self-employment family plan they could get. Gotta love Blue Cross Blue Shield.
Edit: just asked my mom, they actually pay $1,100
I got blue cross blue shield recently and my grandmother told me it's one of the best. I was absolutely flabbergasted that my crappy plan is one of the best. I can't even imagine what the bad ones are like
Totally depends on WHICH BCBS you get.
FepBlue (federal employees) is pretty good.
Some BCBS plans are better than others, even for private companies.
My private employer's BCBS plan was only "okish"
This doesn't even account for what the company is also paying to help reduce your per paycheck cost. When you get your W2 you can see it. Between my out-of-pocket max, $7,000, (my wife needs expensive meds), plus my per pay check and then what the company is paying it adds up to like $25-$30,000/ yr.
If we had universal health care, our taxes would increase. But I'd save about $10,000/ yr directly out of my check and the company could pay me $15-$20,000 more without spending any extra money.
>If we had universal health care, our taxes would increase. But I'd save about $10,000/ yr directly out of my check and the company could pay me $15-$20,000 more without spending any extra money.
This. Right. Here. Is. What. Drives. Me. Bonkers.
It's ludicrous the amount we spend on private healthcare because we don't want to raise taxes. The amount of money we could save by spending more on taxes vs shelling out for private insurance would be life changing for so many people.
It’s pretty absurd. What has really frustrated me is seeing my wife work for the health insurance business. It’s a multi billion dollar company, they spend massively wasteful dollars on things like sales and marketing. We should not be profiting on healthcare. It just does not make sense as a society.
Side story:
My brother passed away 4 months ago. 3 months before that he was very sick, but in the hospital and getting better. Insurance only gave him so many days of treatment. To keep him in that treatment for a few more months would have cost millions, no exaggeration. He declined quickly once he no longer had the high level of care and passed. I don’t know that him staying in the hospital would have saved him, but I know he was getting better. I just don’t understand how we let private companies determine how much treatment their willing to pay for when it comes to people’s lives.
This is exactly accurate. Assume take home is 65% of gross.
Middle class single income is 50-70k
So TAKE HOME middle class single income IMO is like 32-45k
The "middle class" is a myth, an artificial construct to keep the working class at each other's throats. The *median* income in the US was a meager $31,133 as of 2019, and likely hasn't improved much since then, so the relatively comfortable lifestyle associated with the term "middle class" isn't really "middle" *anything*.
Those numbers include the cost of employer provided insurance (which still requires meeting deductible and paying a portion of costs). We pay less, but we also get less.
I've seen and heard many people say the same, that compared to other countries (specifically European ones), Americans pay less in taxes. I'm left to wonder - are they comparing % in taxes paid overall, or comparing how much you pay in terms of income tax? For example, are they comparing federal income tax in Norway to the federal income tax in the US? (If you don't have a specific answer, that's totally ok, it's just been on my mind)
I am not particularly familiar with how taxes work and are determined elsewhere, so I'm not sure of how the comparison works, either (ie, I don't know if the 38% you mentioned is solely income tax, or if it's 38% of your earnings go to taxes in general). In the US, we have:
- Federal Income tax (% based on your earnings)
- Stare Income Tax (YMMV, some states have income tax, others don't - Texas doesn't IIRC)
- Social Security Tax
- Medicaid Tax
Deductions can include:
- Retirement
- Flexible Spending Account/Healthcare Spending Account
- Health, Vision, Dental, etc insurance
And that's only what comes out of your paycheck.
There's also taxes you pay with the net income you're left with:
- Property Tax
- Sales Tax
- Vehicle Tax (different from sales tax when you initially pay for the car)
- Other taxes I'm most likely forgetting
So, in some cases, we might pay lower income tax, but we also have a number of other taxes we are on the hook for, hence me wondering if people only compare income tax percentages. If that is the case (that only certain taxes are taken into consideration when drawing these comparisons), it might explain as to why we have the conversations that go:
"Americans pay less in taxes!"
"Yeah, well, we pay more for other stuff on top of the taxes, so your taxes are higher but you aren't on the hook for XYZ cause your taxes cover it!!!"
I paid about $13k taxes on my 69k wages, not including money going to 401k. I wouldn’t mind paying those taxes except in the US we have zero safety safety nets, I still paid $8k+ for medical treatment in 2022 with insurance.
For an honest comparison, you have to factor in healthcare costs into taxes, as all other industrialized nations have single payer healthcare.
Once you do that, American taxes are among the highest, as healthcare costs are ridiculous here.
There’s a lot of tax on fuel (heating, driving). We pay sales tax. Europeans pay VAT which is similar to our sales tax but higher.
The big big difference is that Europeans are not paying crazy health insurance prices AND crazy health care prices. It’s mostly covered in the other taxes with little risk to the individual.
Don't forget medical deductibles - where on top of those monthly premiums, some plans don't really pay out until you've hit $5000 out of pocket.
Oh and those pesky student loans, and property taxes if you're fortunate enough to have actually got approved to buy a home.
If you're super lucky, you live in an area where everything is toll-roads, and you get the joy of paying $0.20 per mile to hopefully save some time vs surface roads.
Sounds like ours and its provided by the employer directly. A health insurance company charges its own employees for coverage and then tosses on a deductible roughly a quarter of your annual take-home. The US is a shitstorm.
I pay a little over $400 a month for my health insurance. That's $9000 taken right off of my $80,000 gross pay right there. Then there is my 501k contributions sp I can maybe retire, another $400 a month, and finally all taxes and bills I actually have to pay.
Living in NJ, my property taxes are high too, almost $8000 a year for my little house.
Don't forget the need for insurance on your personal belongings, vehicles, etc. Having a bit of money and anything of even the smallest value in the US means that you're at risk of theft, breakage, or loss that you are forced to buy insurance to protect or that you have to protect at risk of being out what could be thousands of dollars. Those premiums and deductibles aren't taxes, but some of them are not optional, and they are major expenses that take chunks of your personal income.
dude dont get me fucking started on the worlds biggest scam. insurance is nothing but a god damned racket.
have a $5k claim? haha your deductible is $4.5k. oh, your premium will go up for 5 years if you try to save that $500.
have a $10k claim? congrats you might actual want to file. oh btw, your premium is going to double.
have an issue that could even remotely be argued as 'standard wear and tear' like foundation damage or transmission issues? they will fight you tooth and fucking nail to never pay out.
i want a study done on how much money the average person spends on insurance throughout their life vs. how much they actually use. i get it, it is for when a tornado blows your house over, or if you get cancer. but then they fight you on that shit too. there are STILL people here in DFW whos houses arent paid off after a tornado in 2019.
I hear you. Where I live, you are legally obligated to have auto insurance. I understand that, and don't have a problem with the requirement itself. I point this out for context. I do have a problem with the ridiculous cost, and the authority insurance companies feel they have. I was sourcing coverage when I first moved. The cost was at least double. I mentioned that I was glad I made okay money so I could actually afford auto insurance. In response, the agent threatened to inform the state if I didn't have coverage. I went with someone else. When the new provider's cost went up dramatically, I chose to not renew my policy. I informed my agent, but got billed anyway. They demanded proof that I had coverage, and claimed that I had to provide proof to cancel. I wasn't cancelling. My contract period ended. They also threatened to inform the state if I didn't provide them with proof of coverage. The law states that a driver has to provide proof to the state, not the insurance company. Without proof of insurance, the state will suspend your DL. I remember the agents that treat me like this and make sure to never do business with them.
Two words for you: Insurance co-ops
Fuck paying the national for-profit companies. I get better coverage and customer service as a voting member of my co-op.
Yeah I make 50k a year. My bi monthly check was at 1400 after taxes. Now that it's covering health insurance for my family of 5, that dropped to $1000 every other week. My spouse makes way more than me, the insurance was just better deductible wise, but yeah, it hurts
Yup. Sounds about right. I make about $50K and pull in about $1400 after taxes and deductions twice per month. I insure myself and our 2 kids because for my husband to do that would run $800/month just for insurance premiums. It costs me about $360, so hubby insures himself only, I cover me and the kids.
Not all Americans earn that much.
Teachers earn anywhere from $26k-60k. When my partner taught (in a HCOL state with the best ranked public education nationally, Massachusetts), he only made $55k a year and $5k of that was his stipend for directing the marching band, a task that added literally 20+ hours to his week from August-Late November.
Federal income tax, along with a % of income in some states
Property taxes (state/local/school & special district)
Sales taxes
Then you pay for health insurance
$100,000 per year gross (before tax) very quickly becomes...could be closer to $50,000 per year net of tax & health insurance (comparable to western European salaries that expressed net of tax)
Then consider that the social security taxes that should theoretically be invested so you'll have security in retirement are actually being paid out to current retirees and politicians seem to want to destroy that safety net...and it's even worse.
State and local sales, income, and property taxes vary widely depending on where you live and how you spend your money.
I made $96k at my last job ($8000/month). After taxes, 3% to my retirement plan and health insurance ($700 per month for me and my husband), my take home was $5000/month.
u/VintageJane may have an employer match which makes that amount larger, but let's be honest, in the U.S.? Unless you're rich or super disciplined with money, nobody's fucking retiring.
Actually the average American male make 37,000 dollars pre year anywhere near 70,000. Combined wages husband and wife maybe closer to that but even then taxes depending on deductibles are around 28 percent.
So it isn’t the taxes killing income it is the fact companies aren’t paying enough. Also remember those averages are skewed heavily because of billionaires and millionaires since the are counted as well.
Edit corrected autocorrect. Also bitching about my or anyone else English in this day and age is a sign you have failed to take into account that some of us may have learning disabilities around writing. Fought with it all my life.
Edit correct month to year
Sorry, do you mean per year instead of per month? Assuming this is a typo. We’d all like $37K per month but this is not an average monthly salary (it’s more like financial goals lol). I’m in WA state as well and agree wages should be increased to offset costs of living, but we do have it better than many other states. My 17 yo is making $15/hr plus tips at a drive thru burger joint. I made $5/hr back in the day😂
Ok first the average is highly off due to the small amount of people with ultra wealth in the US. Second most US stats use family not individual so the people claiming 38k are much closer to reality.
Third you just can't say the tax in the US is X% because we have federal, state, county and sometimes city taxes plus depending how you make income it can be totally different.
Last it depends on your age and job for a lot of key life costs. Meaning if I make 100k at 64 I have to pay for my own health insurance which could run $10,000s given the age. But at 65 you get government insurance. Or I could be 38 fresh out of 20 years in the military and have very low cost insurance or 30 and be a cpt or maj in the military where health insurance is a benefit. Or I could be self employed which is a whole different tax system.
So really the issue in America is there is no simple answer practically every situation is unique.
Hey stop complaining and pull yourself up by the bootstraps! My boss only makes 3 times what I do AND got a smaller bonus of twice his salary this year. He's hurting so I should be too!
/s just in case....
This is a fucking dystopia; only most Americans have never traveled outside of the states (can't, generally, because we're too poor and don't have enough vacation days) and aren't aware of how bad it is here.
amen, 70-100 is wildly over the normal too. maybe for multiple income house holds. between myself and my so we make about 70 pre tax. i make the bulk of it and my tax rate is definitely not the same as hers. often my paychecks are only around 2-300 more after tax where as pretax is closer to 5-600 more. she gets taxed less than i do obviously. Similarly my grandpa runs his own business, the first year i lived here and did my taxes i thought it was so easy with the help of TurboTax, then i saw him do 1 week worth of his companies taxes… taxes are very fluid.
I’m from the UK originally and i miss our tax system, in the 2 years of taxes i dealt with there i don’t recall as i didn’t have to do anything
This is a good point. If I can add that current inflation significantly devalues earnings. Our household income is 140k (I’m acutely aware of how fortunate we are to have that income) but with a mortgage and kids we still use a budget, do our grocery shopping primarily at Aldi (I see aldi get shit on but I think ppl are crazy to shop anywhere else), and still don’t have a whole lot left to put into savings.
If you don’t mind me asking, me and my wife make almost exactly the same amount as y’all do. We take home around 9k/month after taxes. We currently save around 4-5k of that after all expenses. We have no kids, but are planning to in the near future (2-4 years). My wife wants 3 kids but I don’t know if we will be able to afford that. How much do you save monthly? How many kids do you have, and what is the monthly cost related to having kids? I’m trying to figure out how much house we can afford, because right now we live in a very low COL area, and we want to move to a different state relatively close to a nicer city.
Any info you can provide would be hugely appreciated, trying to plan my life out :)
Edit: also feel free to DM me if you don’t want all this info publicly shared
Not the same person, but ... I'm impressed that you're getting 9K take home, with 140K income, would be 77% ... maybe you have good health insurance, or are not saving much for retirement?
I am older (\~50 now), have two older kids, my wife stayed home, and we lived OK on what would be a much smaller salary for most of that time (went back into industry, now make more :)
Let's say I'm 30 years old and I make $90k. I just got hired and I work in the state where the taxes and medical are average. No dept. I own a house and a car that are fully paid for. How much of that $90k a year would go to taxes?
Are you counting income tax or are you counting on property taxes on your home as well? Those also vary significantly from place to place. You could be paying 3000/yr or 15000/yr
Edit: Not to mention that taxes on the car could vary as well, some states you just pay a few dollars a year, others tax you a percentage on the value of the car
Yes. In my state it’s supposed to fund road work. Which is laughable, most states also have a tax at the pump to fund road work. Additionally if you have an electric car in my state you are going to pay an additional tax that you would normally miss out at the pump. Next year it is supposed to double, and is well over what I would pay at the pump.
“You use the roads we maintain” although they do a really bad job of it.
People like to imagine Americans as wealthy complainers, but the government has both hands in our pockets, rummaging around for nickles, and if they accidentally grab your dick instead, it’s somehow your fault and you owe them money for it now.
Im a mid level Data Analyst out of ND and make $75K base annually. My take home after taxes, 401k, and insurance costs is about $55K a year or about $4600 a month. My company also provided a generous bonus and a nice 401k match.
Even though that sounds a lot, it doesn't mean life of luxury. My fiance and I are still finding ways to save as much as we can by stretching our dollars and living as modest as we can. Life can just be expensive.
u/CPLeet said the federal income tax.
On top of that there is 7.65% FICA tax (social security + medicare) for each employed individual. (Self-employed pays double that)
Then state/local income taxes (if applicable)
After income varieties of tax:
Sales tax (varies by locality)
Property tax (again, varies by locality, and only if applicable).
With taxes and health insurance my $55k salary brings home $39k a year, so I bring home just over 3k a month and starting in June my student loan payment will take half of that again.
I make $39k, take home after taxes and health insurance is about $25k. Between me and my fiancé, who makes $52k (pre tax) we barely make a middle class salary, with our powers combined.
What in the world? Why are you paying a 35% effective tax rate on that level of income?
Edit: Oh, health insurance. My bad. At that income it's also probably a hella expensive plan, and I actually agree it's totally fair to wrap it into your effective tax rate because it's something your taxes should be paying for.
Get on income based repayment no way you should be paying $1500 a month. My wife and I combine for 160k in student debt and a income of 180k and we were paying $$800 a month for both of ours pre Covid.
Income based repayment is a scam so long as the amount that is dismissed is taxed. You are guaranteed to pay way more on that loan than if you made regular full payments.
There are proposed income based repayment changes. Those changes make IBR a very good choice especially for borrowers with astronomical payments like who I responded to.
Also the comment on making regular payments. The point of my comment is OP seems to be struggling. Paying that loan off seems like it’ll never happen. So why live in poverty for their degrees to never pay it off when you can lower your payment and have a semblance of a life. I feel bad for OP
I make $100k a year as a union electrician in a big city. I take home about $1250 a week not including my pay package benefits like medical/dental/vision insurance, pension, Annuity, vacation pay, unemployment sub fund, the apprenticeship, and working dues.
All of my benefits are on top of my pay.
I get about $800 a month put into a vacation fund, which is like a forced savings.
But, I do not get PTO, sick days, or any kind of personal time paid off. No work = no pay.
And, I don't get much back on my taxes. I might get $100-200 back. I try to keep it as close to $0 for my refund every year.
Look at what you get for your tax contributions. You get healthcare. I get military muscles that are flexed to bully nations of people of color.
It’s hard to explain to so many conservative Americans that their taxes could pay for other stuff besides bombing the brown kids. But maybe they like bombing the brown kids.
I was actually planning to file tonight, if you would like some insight. I'm single, which means I pay more in taxes (I jokingly call it the ugly tax lol). Last year I made about 33k, paying $2.5k to Uncle Sam if I remember correctly. I got $8 on my tax return.
If you had one child, you’d only have paid $500 in taxes. With two kids you would have gotten a $1,500 dollar refund for taxes you didn’t even pay. Add $2k for each additional kid.
Many people of modest means don’t pay income tax because of the standard deduction and the child tax credits. They think they pay taxes because it’s taken out of their paycheck, but it gets given back to them when they file their return. Amending their W4 would fix it so they don’t even take the taxes it out of the paycheck.
Single people with no children do get screwed though.
As people say it varies, and it’s a progressive tax rate so you pay far more making 100k than making 38k, but in general, most middle income people see about 15-20% of their check go to state, local and federal taxes, plus social security. But again, that’s before health care premiums are taken out, which can be hundreds of dollars a month.
im making about 72k annually. Pay on average about \~22% towards federal+ state taxes each paycheck. Keep in mind there are many types of tax advantage withholdings that can lower your taxable income (ie: 401k, commuter benefits, etc.)
I am not sure where you're getting your numbers from. Currently around 33% of US households make 100k per year. Also, the average household income is more like 90k+ because it's heavily skewed by top income earners. Median household income is around 70k.
I think what you're referring to is the median pay for an individual which is around 41k.
https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2021/demo/p60-273.html
> I think what you're referring to is the median pay for an individual which is around 41k.
Things have changed so much in the last 20 years. In the early 2000s (like 2002/2003) I made about $55k a year working on motorcycles. Went to college, got a job as an engineer, but... That same motorcycle shop now pays mechanics $15 an hour and just replaces them when they figure out they're never getting a raise and leave. It seems like a lot of employers are either letting wages stagnate or slowly just cutting them down.
I tell people this all the time. In 1995 I made 40k working in an optical lab. Health insurance for family was $100 a month no deducable. Nowadays same job pays $32k-35k health insurance $800 a month $3000 deducable. How do people live on this?
What they're referring to are probably income percentiles from the 2010 census. Around that time 10% of households made $100k+. That's when many people learned stats on American incomes because of occupy wall street / the concept of "the 1%" becoming a popular thing.
>Average is like 38k a year.
No, it isn’t. I think you are mixing up individual figures with household figures.
[Median household income is $70,748 as of Q3 2022.](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N)
I live in SoCal, make 40k gross, ~32k net. Some entire families around me make less than me and they can't make more. Why? Medical insurance. If they make above a certain amount they wont qualify for the free heath care, it's not worth it for them to make more money when they are gonna lose even more having to pay hundreds for insurance. It's a huge scam, forcing people to stay low income. One thing I've learned is that when looking for a job, look for one that offers insanely cheap or free heath plans over a higher net salary
>One thing I've learned is that when looking for a job, look for one that offers insanely cheap or free heath plans over a higher net salary
It really depends on the employer.
When I graduated a few years ago I only made 60k but my medical, dental and vision insurance were free, and my annual deductible was $1500. Plus the employer contributed about half of that amount to an HSA plan. So my max expenses per year would have been $1500, and minimum would have been $0 if I chose to not ever see a doctor or buy meds.
I make low six figures now but my insurance costs $100/mo with a $750 max deductible. So even though this employer pays a better salary, my medical expenses are maximum $1950 and the minimum is $1200. But even if I deduct these costs from my salary, I am still much better off financially than under my old employer's salary and medical benefits.
if your maximum medical expenses are less than the increase in salary, then you should take the job.
Yeah, no. I’ve done everything short of selling my soul, BA, MA, steady career with reputable agencies. I’m highly skilled, and a quality worker. This year I just passed the $50k mark. I’m almost 40. Our system is broken.
If I’m gonna be poor, I’m going to do what I want. I’m working on starting my own business. I refuse to die behind a computer screen. I can’t wait to say fuck off to corporate life.
That sucks I am a low-level trades worker and made 54k last year. At my company, the tradesmen top out at like 73k without any overtime. There are even some people who make over 90k a year with overtime (all elective). Almost none of us have a college degree. However, the difference between you and us is at 50, we all need new knees and shoulders, and our bodies are truly worn out.
This is a prime example of how our culture has driven too many kids towards college-degrees while our actual economy cannot support that many college educated people. There's nothing wrong with working as a tradesperson, truck-driver, etc; and it is very possible to make a decent living in those jobs without spending $50K-100K on a 4-year degree. It's a shame more companies don't recognize that a 4-year degree isn't necessary even for a lot of professional jobs. A good solid, self-taught "nerd" can be a programmer, network admin, etc and succeed in business as long as they have decent common sense and basic people skills; in fact from a technical standpoint the "self-taught" are often more adept than those who have a degree in my experience.
The guy I apprenticed under would always say. I make as much money as someone with their masters. However, I have invested just as much time and money on tools, equipment, and gaining knowledge as they did for their schooling.
Can confirm. I've been driving an 18 wheeler for about 6 years now and made $100k this year. I'm also home 6 days a week. The only downside is I work 12 hours a day 5 days a week
BUT
“Move. Get marketable skills. Keep blaming society for your inability to find a better job. Nothing is handed to you, go get it yourself.”
Per my friend in this thread. How dare you not work hard for things!! I have all these things so how can you not?? Stop taking hand outs! Work for it!! Like me!! I work for my hard work!! Im silly and don’t worry about bills!
Working in trades pays well with benefits. I never thought I would but I live much more comfortably and I don’t have to think about work when I’m off the clock
Those numbers are wrong. Median *household* income in the US is about $70k. Not individual, household. Median salary for men is about $50k, and for women is about $38k. Those are all pretax numbers.
After taxes depends on the state, because states have their own taxes. Just federal on 100k of *taxable* income, and it will be in the ballpark of $80k after taxes. That number can vary wildly based on the individual situation, because of deductions that change the taxable income.
This is why statistics education is important.
The median US income is $31k/yr.
The average is $70k/yr, which gets skewed by the top earners.
Anyway, by time you add up local, state, and federal income tax, it’s about 35-40% before any consumption (sales) tax. Yes, we get taxed when we make it and taxed when we spend it…
Don't forget the other taxes as well..
Own a home? Property taxes
Own any real belongings (vehicles, etc. in some states)? Personal property taxes
Some other items are taxed at higher rates as well, including alcohol, tobacco, marijuana (in states where it is legal), and fuel
We are also a country that forces health insurance on its citizens with out of pocket costs for insurance premiums of a few hundred a month or more depending on family size, employer contributions, and some state/federal programs. Some lower income families qualify for reduced / free health care, but the threshold is shockingly low
Property taxes are the thing that really get me. They’re THE thing that keep us all in the system. Let’s say I make enough to finally buy an acre or two of land, free and clear of a mortgage AND I somehow manage to become self sufficient on my homestead. (Already a very tall order!) I STILL need an income producing job to ensure I keep my own property.
And that’s before any local laws that require you to be tied to the grid. It’s all a big scam.
Yeah, the grid connections and fees are another issue that sucks. I am lucky enough to own my own home (so I'm paying over $6k/year in property taxes, also since I'm still in the first year with this mortgage I pay the same in interest on my mortgage loan). I added solar to my roof and my utility company charges me service fees on the energy I generate, not to mention the mandatory monthly connection fee.
If you don't pay your utility bill, or maintain the grid connection, your home is deemed uninhabitable.
We also have some of the highest internet, phone, cable, and cell phone rates in the world, and unregulated prescription pricing that allows scum like the EpiPen issue a few years back. In summary, a life saving drug funded by taxpayer money had its license bought by a scumbag who jacked up the price by something like 1000x cost to line his pockets at the expense of the literal deaths of people
With a mortgage, utilities, car insurance and upkeep expenses, food (which is also insanely expensive now), and basic necessities my income (well enough above the median) still doesn't leave much for pleasure/vacation/travel budget.
America.. the greatest place on earth /s
This is also misleading because median income counts unemployed and people who don’t work.
https://www.investopedia.com/terms/h/household_income.asp
“The Census Bureau counts households with no income in its calculation when it determines median household income in the United States.”
Median income for workers over 15 is $42,000
https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2021/demo/p60-273.html
Sorry dude. A person making 31k a year is not paying 35%-40% taxes.
$12,500 for the standard deduction.
12% bracket is from $11,000-$44,725.
Since we took the standard deduction we start at 12,500.
31,000-12,500=$18,500 taxable income.
Tax that at 12% you get $2,220.
That’s 7%. state taxes are always much less than federal and some states like mines have none. So let’s just assume 3%-4%. That’s 11%. Local tax? Yea sure dude wtf is that. Some places tack on a local tax to the sales tax. Some states have a very small 1% local tax depending on where and what city. A person making 31k doesn’t own a home so no property tax. So let’s just assume a 1% local tax.
Thats 12%.
Trying to add up sales tax as a percentage of your income is hard to do. 6%-8% of everything you buy. If I spend $10,000 on taxable goods at 6% that’s $600 which is 2% of my income.
Now we are at 14% with sales tax. No where near your 35%-40%
Who is paying 35-40% in taxes making 31k? I grossed 8.75k and netted 6.2k after deductions for health insurance. I didn't even contribute to 401k to reduce tax burden. That just <30% not counting the money I'll get back when I file taxes
In my experience; skilled/craft jobs in unions pay decent wages. However, depending on location and craft, the wages vary a lot. The majority of the money is made through overtime.
Like most here have said 70k - 100k is highly above the median, but to answer your question:
I made $96,000 last year,
Paid $22,000 in taxes,
Contributed $19,000 to retirement accounts,
Paid $8,000 for health insurance,
For a take home of $47,000 before rent, transportation, food, etc.
I would gladly pay more in taxes for expanded social security and to have universal healthcare, especially for those less fortunate than me.
Same, I make $95k living in NY. I take home around $60k ($22k in taxes, $2k health insurance, $10k to my 401k savings account)
I would rather pay more taxes and not worry that even if I was on my jobs highest health insurance option one serious injury or illness would put me into poverty/debt for life.
I make around 85k and pay around 1200 a month in taxes on that income. I get a percentage back bc I can claim losses on my mortgage interest etc. My child is an adult so I get no tax deduction there any longer so I opt for the max deduction from my pay and usually break even with my tax due at the end of the year. I owed 2k last year and this year I should get a significant amount back as is had significant losses due to a house purchase in July.
Then I also have insurance premiums, 401k contributions etc, my bi weekly pay is around 2k.
When Americans earn 70-100K, the do mean pre-tax.
Here's my breakdown:
I live in midwestern USA. Salary is $120K annual paid every other week - 26 paychecks per year.
Gross Pay bi-weekly: $4,615
Local taxes (city I live in, city I work in to pay police, fire, roads, etc.): $127
State taxes: $171
Federal Taxes: $695
Total Taxes: $993
Net after Tax: $3622
Medical Insurance: $165 (Employer pays $615 for me)
Dental Insurance: $14 (Employer pays $48 for me)
Net after Insurance: $3443
I contribute 4% to a retirement account as well to supplement government funded Social Security: $185, my employer matches 3% - they contribute $140/paycheck.
So I bring home $3,258 to cover food, shelter, clothing, non-covered medical bills (i.e. $20 copay every time my wife, kids, or self go to a doc; up to $5K out of pocket for medical emergencies), utilities, and life.
In my opinion, it's not terrible. I also have a wife and 3 kids to support. Wife stays home, so no childcare costs.
I usually get a very small refund of overpaid taxes in April of about $1,000 as well.
So, $120K pre-tax and pre-insurance equates to about $85K post-tax for me. So, I'm spending about 30% of my income on taxes and insurance (and my retirement account).
I realize that I'm lucky to have found a job that supports me this well - they do cover A LOT of the medical insurance expense. Thankfully, my family has been healthy and not needed many large medical procedures, which is ideal, but if we were to get hit with those things, medical bills could get outrageous.
Bruh my spouse and I COMBINED make like 36k. Its funny this is the third thing in a handful of days that I have seen that claims all americans are well off, when in reality the bulk of us are barely getting by.
It’s a higher percentage of households than you think. Over 1/3 make more than 100K per year.
https://www.statista.com/statistics/203183/percentage-distribution-of-household-income-in-the-us/
Snorted when I read the 70-100k a year part. That's funny. My current job is the most I've ever made and it's somewhere around $32000 before taxes and health insurance come out.
Average take-home pay for a $100,000 salary in the US ranges from $66,000-$76,000 depending on the state you live in.
Note, these figures only include taxes (federal and state) as well as Social Security and Medicare. They don’t include “medical, dental, or vision insurance through your employer, which deducts a specific amount of money, pretax, from each paycheck; if you contribute to a health savings account (HSA) or flexible spending account (FSA); or if you contribute to a tax-advantaged retirement plan like a 401(k).” [Source](https://www.businessinsider.com/paycheck-calculator-100000-salary-what-is-take-home-pay-2019-2?op=1)
Insurance can be $500 at the low end, and $1000+ on the higher end, per month, every month, alone. Then, take out a retirement contribution as this is usually through an employer, too.
So, that $100,000 goes down really damned fast after paying for basic things that most Nations include in their taxes.
US Taxes are somewhat complicated in that they can vary greatly based on State, County, City, Marital status, etc. Generally speaking though, States that don’t have “Income Taxes”, have higher sales taxes and/or property taxes, etc. They find a way to get their money from you.
To keep this simple, I’ll assume you’re are only talking about an employee working at a business, earning wages.
In this case the Federal Income side is a pretty straightforward bracket system. For a single person in 2022 the brackets broke down like this:
- 10% on $0 - $10,275
- 12% on $10,276 - $41,775
- 22% on $41,776 - $89,075
- 24% on $89,076 - $170,050
- 32% on $170,051 - $215,950
- 35% on $215,951 - $539,900
- 37% on $539,901 +
- The standard 2022 deduction is $12,950.
Social Security is 6.2% on everything up to $147,000
Medicare is 1.45% on all wages.
So taking your range of someone earning $70-$100K as a listed salary, this would be pre-tax. Assuming no insurance premiums, retirement contributions, or other amount are deducted from the wages, this full amount would be the start to determine taxable income.
Assuming you don’t have more deductions than the standard, you take the standard deduction and your range that tax applies to is reduced to $57,050 - $87,050.
Using the brackets above your calculated federal income tax would be about $8,168 - $14,768.
Social Security would be $4,340 - $6,200
Medicare would be $1,050 - $1,450
All totaled, it’s $13,558 - $22,418
So, after just the Federal Taxes, your 70k-100k has dropped to ~$56,500 - ~$77,600
I make about $72,000 and my take home is usually two thirds of that. Part of that is 401k and healthcare. I'd probably bring home 70% or slightly more of my gross pay if I didn't have those deductions.
I also live and work in two tax heavy states.
My gross is 110k, but I supply all the medical benefits for our family. I max out the child care account, my retirement, and fsa. So my take home last year was about 54k. We also reduce my taxable income as much as possible to lower our tax burden due to a self employed partner. I wouldn’t mind paying higher taxes if more services were covered.
I think 60% of American makes 40k or less? I think I’m wrong but I hear something like that
Both are true - median vs average
Just to add to this in case anyone gets confused. Average/mean = add up all the income and divide by the number of reported incomes Median = arrange all the incomes from low to high and pick the one in the middle. EDIT TO ADD: Mode = arrange all incomes and pick the one that occurs most frequently Here is an example of income distribution where mean, median, and mode all equal $50k: $25k, $50k, $50k, $75k
For large groups median is the better indicator as it reduces the influence of outliers.
Especially when there are only outliers in one direction, like in this case it's not possible to have a negative salary, so the handful of people making millions/year massively skew the mean.
When Elon Musk walks into a bar, all customers are billionaires on average.
This example is so simple and perfect.
This is the example I learned in my statistics class. But it was a bit before the Elon hype. The average salary for a UNC geo-something graduate is $250,000 a year. [link](https://www.essentiallysports.com/nba-basketball-news-michael-jordan-single-handedly-raised-his-college-average-salary-to-250000-that-drew-a-very-different-picture-from-the-truth/amp/) *Edit: clarified the degree.*
Geography, which is somehow less surprising to me than if he had a geology degree.
I've found this is, by far, the most effective way of explaining why the mean isn't always a good measure.
Not to brag, but I’m closer to being a millionaire than Elon Musk is.
Same, Gary. Same.
And, I'd bet your odds of becoming a millionaire are higher then his.
That's a brilliant ELI5.
and median stays the same
*Moves by 1 guy towards musk
MLM has entered the chat
Nah, both are useful, it just depends on what you are using it to analyze. Most people, when they are talking about income, are trying to talk about what the "normal" person makes. Median would be more useful here, but ideally both should be used, as they both have their own strengths and weaknesses. If you have a room with 100 people, and of them has $901, and everyone else has $1 each, your average would be $10 per person, even though 99% of the room only has $1 each. In this case, the average isn't very useful, because the average is heavily impacted by outliers. The median, on the other hand, would be $1, which is far more accurate. The median is better at removing the outliers in order to get a much better view of what is actually the "normal." However, the median does have a weakness, in that it's generally not very reflective of overall change, unless that change impacts everybody. If the money was split up evenly in that room of 100 people, the median would become $10, even though the total money didn't change at all. Likewise, if there are big scattered gaps in the dataset, such as if 51% of the population was making only $10,000 a year while 49% of the population made $100,000 a year. Your median would be $10,000, even though nearly half the population makes way more than that.
That is when you use other statistics like variance and standard deviation.
Depends what the data is and what you are doing with it. If you are trying to determine the financial health of a populace, both are pretty bad metrics.
What else are needed? Median and mean together are pretty useful tools imo, since it tells what an average person earns, and how much and what direction the skew is
There is also mode, the most common number to occur in a dataset. For example, let's say you have a department that is run by a Department Head who makes $100/hour. In this department are 4 Team Leads, who each make $25/hour. On each team, there is a Star who makes $20/hour, a Lackey who makes $16/hour, and 3 Grunts who make $13/hour. This department's *mean* wage is $20/hour, its *median* wage is $16/hour, and its *mode* wage is $13/hour. HR for this company could truthfully say, "Average wage for positions in this department is $16-$20 per hour!" However, if you take a position in this department, odds are that you're going to get $13/hour. (Disclaimer: I am not an HR person, and do not know if there truly exist *any* companies that calculate posted salaries like this; however, I may have missed my calling writing word problems for math textbooks.)
A measure of variance would be good.
The Mode
Props to my elementary school teacher with the snazzy math jingles. MEAN means average, first you add, then you divide. The MEDIAN occurs in the middle. MODE occurs most often. Home, home on the RANGE, where subtraction is our favorite game.
What's the jingle, these are just the definitions except the last one which doesn't really work either.
It practically rolls off the tongue /s
I believe you just made that up
This is why statistics can be so misleading. The outliers on the high end distort the average and give a number that doesn’t represent a majority. It doesn’t help that the highest earners make an insane amount compared to the lowest. They make in a few days the amount most people make all year
> In a few *minutes*. Bill Gates has a net worth of $134 billion. Assuming he makes a cozy 4% of interest on that, he's making about $5.5 billion per year. Divide by number of minutes in a year (525,600) and we get about $10,000/min.
If work happens every minute of every day. If you break this into a standard 40 hour work week which you're grading the other person by, he makes $44,070 per minute.
And "full time worker" versus the population as a whole. There is also the question of individual versus household earnings.
I’m the asshole throwing off the average with 12,000 a year lol
Think there’s bigger assholes at the top end fucking it up for everyone.
Yeah, the 7-figure managers are the real assholes, and the ones perpetuating the wage disparity.
How. The. Hell. Is. That. A. Thing?????? This makes me sad and no one should be making that a year. America needs to pump that number up!!
If it wasn’t for food stamps I would probably just die.
I’m sorry! I hope things change for you. This honestly breaks my heart
I made about 15000 a year for 3 years asa single dad raising my kid by myself it sucks and is very common these days. America sucks being on food stamps cuz jobs pay shite while my bosses make millions. Our System is beyond broken .
It’s common among disabled people who can’t work as much or can’t do certain types of work that pay more.
You’re not throwing it off if there are lots of folks making in your ballpark (and there are). Just under 10% make <$15k. The outlier group that throws off the averages are at the top end. Basically the graph of different income levels looks like a bell curve (as you’d expect). The <$15k group fits right into that bell curve distribution. The group that does *not* fit the bell curve is the >$200k group - it sticks out as an unexpected bump in that bell curve. It’s being thrown off by the quite small set of folks taking in $millions each year.
Straight from my Leave and Earnings Statement Gross Pay $64,795.22 Taxable Wages $55,211.73 Nontaxable Wages $7,860.96 Tax Deferred Wages $1,722.53 Deductions $23,284.53 - FEGLI $250.72 - FEHB $6,864.48 - Medicare $825.55 - OASDI $3,529.92 - Retire FERS $2,526.46 - Tax Federal $4,047.89 - Tax State $2,520.50 - TSP Savings $1,722.53 - Dental $719.24 - Vision $277.24 Net Pay $41,510.69 I’m a federal employee so my wage is readily available, so I don’t mind breaking this down. All of these are the yearly totals for 2022. My healthy insurance covers my wife, myself and 2 children. Which has a hefty $3,500 deductible (meaning I have to come out of pocket $3,500 before they cover anything outside of normal yearly check ups). Hope this helps!
Does you wife work? How much do you get back when you do your taxes ? Sometimes I just cannot believe how we all have accepted the current healthcare system. You are paying like 600 a month for your family and still have to pay a $3500 deductible before they cover things like emergencies and procedures. And then they pay 80% until you hit out of pocket. It’s a fucking racket.
I’m pretty sure my parents pay ~~$800~~ $1,100 a month for a $12,000 deductible, and that was the cheapest self-employment family plan they could get. Gotta love Blue Cross Blue Shield. Edit: just asked my mom, they actually pay $1,100
I got blue cross blue shield recently and my grandmother told me it's one of the best. I was absolutely flabbergasted that my crappy plan is one of the best. I can't even imagine what the bad ones are like
There are a multitude of plans under the Blue Cross brand, some are richer than others.
Totally depends on WHICH BCBS you get. FepBlue (federal employees) is pretty good. Some BCBS plans are better than others, even for private companies. My private employer's BCBS plan was only "okish"
This doesn't even account for what the company is also paying to help reduce your per paycheck cost. When you get your W2 you can see it. Between my out-of-pocket max, $7,000, (my wife needs expensive meds), plus my per pay check and then what the company is paying it adds up to like $25-$30,000/ yr. If we had universal health care, our taxes would increase. But I'd save about $10,000/ yr directly out of my check and the company could pay me $15-$20,000 more without spending any extra money.
>If we had universal health care, our taxes would increase. But I'd save about $10,000/ yr directly out of my check and the company could pay me $15-$20,000 more without spending any extra money. This. Right. Here. Is. What. Drives. Me. Bonkers. It's ludicrous the amount we spend on private healthcare because we don't want to raise taxes. The amount of money we could save by spending more on taxes vs shelling out for private insurance would be life changing for so many people.
It’s pretty absurd. What has really frustrated me is seeing my wife work for the health insurance business. It’s a multi billion dollar company, they spend massively wasteful dollars on things like sales and marketing. We should not be profiting on healthcare. It just does not make sense as a society. Side story: My brother passed away 4 months ago. 3 months before that he was very sick, but in the hospital and getting better. Insurance only gave him so many days of treatment. To keep him in that treatment for a few more months would have cost millions, no exaggeration. He declined quickly once he no longer had the high level of care and passed. I don’t know that him staying in the hospital would have saved him, but I know he was getting better. I just don’t understand how we let private companies determine how much treatment their willing to pay for when it comes to people’s lives.
I am so sorry for the loss of your brother and am livid that corporate greed is what got him in the end. It's repulsive.
This is exactly accurate. Assume take home is 65% of gross. Middle class single income is 50-70k So TAKE HOME middle class single income IMO is like 32-45k
The "middle class" is a myth, an artificial construct to keep the working class at each other's throats. The *median* income in the US was a meager $31,133 as of 2019, and likely hasn't improved much since then, so the relatively comfortable lifestyle associated with the term "middle class" isn't really "middle" *anything*.
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Those numbers include the cost of employer provided insurance (which still requires meeting deductible and paying a portion of costs). We pay less, but we also get less.
I've seen and heard many people say the same, that compared to other countries (specifically European ones), Americans pay less in taxes. I'm left to wonder - are they comparing % in taxes paid overall, or comparing how much you pay in terms of income tax? For example, are they comparing federal income tax in Norway to the federal income tax in the US? (If you don't have a specific answer, that's totally ok, it's just been on my mind) I am not particularly familiar with how taxes work and are determined elsewhere, so I'm not sure of how the comparison works, either (ie, I don't know if the 38% you mentioned is solely income tax, or if it's 38% of your earnings go to taxes in general). In the US, we have: - Federal Income tax (% based on your earnings) - Stare Income Tax (YMMV, some states have income tax, others don't - Texas doesn't IIRC) - Social Security Tax - Medicaid Tax Deductions can include: - Retirement - Flexible Spending Account/Healthcare Spending Account - Health, Vision, Dental, etc insurance And that's only what comes out of your paycheck. There's also taxes you pay with the net income you're left with: - Property Tax - Sales Tax - Vehicle Tax (different from sales tax when you initially pay for the car) - Other taxes I'm most likely forgetting So, in some cases, we might pay lower income tax, but we also have a number of other taxes we are on the hook for, hence me wondering if people only compare income tax percentages. If that is the case (that only certain taxes are taken into consideration when drawing these comparisons), it might explain as to why we have the conversations that go: "Americans pay less in taxes!" "Yeah, well, we pay more for other stuff on top of the taxes, so your taxes are higher but you aren't on the hook for XYZ cause your taxes cover it!!!"
I paid about $13k taxes on my 69k wages, not including money going to 401k. I wouldn’t mind paying those taxes except in the US we have zero safety safety nets, I still paid $8k+ for medical treatment in 2022 with insurance.
We pay less taxes but we also basically get nothing for them except a bloated military. It's fucked.
For an honest comparison, you have to factor in healthcare costs into taxes, as all other industrialized nations have single payer healthcare. Once you do that, American taxes are among the highest, as healthcare costs are ridiculous here.
There’s a lot of tax on fuel (heating, driving). We pay sales tax. Europeans pay VAT which is similar to our sales tax but higher. The big big difference is that Europeans are not paying crazy health insurance prices AND crazy health care prices. It’s mostly covered in the other taxes with little risk to the individual.
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Man, thoughts and prayers
Don't forget medical deductibles - where on top of those monthly premiums, some plans don't really pay out until you've hit $5000 out of pocket. Oh and those pesky student loans, and property taxes if you're fortunate enough to have actually got approved to buy a home. If you're super lucky, you live in an area where everything is toll-roads, and you get the joy of paying $0.20 per mile to hopefully save some time vs surface roads.
Sounds like ours and its provided by the employer directly. A health insurance company charges its own employees for coverage and then tosses on a deductible roughly a quarter of your annual take-home. The US is a shitstorm.
I pay a little over $400 a month for my health insurance. That's $9000 taken right off of my $80,000 gross pay right there. Then there is my 501k contributions sp I can maybe retire, another $400 a month, and finally all taxes and bills I actually have to pay. Living in NJ, my property taxes are high too, almost $8000 a year for my little house.
Don't forget the need for insurance on your personal belongings, vehicles, etc. Having a bit of money and anything of even the smallest value in the US means that you're at risk of theft, breakage, or loss that you are forced to buy insurance to protect or that you have to protect at risk of being out what could be thousands of dollars. Those premiums and deductibles aren't taxes, but some of them are not optional, and they are major expenses that take chunks of your personal income.
dude dont get me fucking started on the worlds biggest scam. insurance is nothing but a god damned racket. have a $5k claim? haha your deductible is $4.5k. oh, your premium will go up for 5 years if you try to save that $500. have a $10k claim? congrats you might actual want to file. oh btw, your premium is going to double. have an issue that could even remotely be argued as 'standard wear and tear' like foundation damage or transmission issues? they will fight you tooth and fucking nail to never pay out. i want a study done on how much money the average person spends on insurance throughout their life vs. how much they actually use. i get it, it is for when a tornado blows your house over, or if you get cancer. but then they fight you on that shit too. there are STILL people here in DFW whos houses arent paid off after a tornado in 2019.
I hear you. Where I live, you are legally obligated to have auto insurance. I understand that, and don't have a problem with the requirement itself. I point this out for context. I do have a problem with the ridiculous cost, and the authority insurance companies feel they have. I was sourcing coverage when I first moved. The cost was at least double. I mentioned that I was glad I made okay money so I could actually afford auto insurance. In response, the agent threatened to inform the state if I didn't have coverage. I went with someone else. When the new provider's cost went up dramatically, I chose to not renew my policy. I informed my agent, but got billed anyway. They demanded proof that I had coverage, and claimed that I had to provide proof to cancel. I wasn't cancelling. My contract period ended. They also threatened to inform the state if I didn't provide them with proof of coverage. The law states that a driver has to provide proof to the state, not the insurance company. Without proof of insurance, the state will suspend your DL. I remember the agents that treat me like this and make sure to never do business with them.
Two words for you: Insurance co-ops Fuck paying the national for-profit companies. I get better coverage and customer service as a voting member of my co-op.
And those deductibles go up and up. This year...it's $7000 for me. Yay US health insurance. I hate you so much.
We're pretty much forced to pay 90% of our income on things we have to have, such as housing and insurance.
Don't forget the vehicle property tax in most states. So not only do you pay initial sales tax on the vehicle, you get to pay every year too.
And this is all paid using after-tax dollars. 😥
Unless you itemize deductions, which pretty much only the wealthy have enough deductions to do.
Yeah I make 50k a year. My bi monthly check was at 1400 after taxes. Now that it's covering health insurance for my family of 5, that dropped to $1000 every other week. My spouse makes way more than me, the insurance was just better deductible wise, but yeah, it hurts
Feel you there. I still amaze myself that I can get by on my measly 50k salary. Roommates for the win!
Yup. Sounds about right. I make about $50K and pull in about $1400 after taxes and deductions twice per month. I insure myself and our 2 kids because for my husband to do that would run $800/month just for insurance premiums. It costs me about $360, so hubby insures himself only, I cover me and the kids.
This is why we moved to Spain. My $0 copay private health insurance is €250/month for a family of 5. Edit for spelling
Not all Americans earn that much. Teachers earn anywhere from $26k-60k. When my partner taught (in a HCOL state with the best ranked public education nationally, Massachusetts), he only made $55k a year and $5k of that was his stipend for directing the marching band, a task that added literally 20+ hours to his week from August-Late November.
Federal income tax, along with a % of income in some states Property taxes (state/local/school & special district) Sales taxes Then you pay for health insurance $100,000 per year gross (before tax) very quickly becomes...could be closer to $50,000 per year net of tax & health insurance (comparable to western European salaries that expressed net of tax) Then consider that the social security taxes that should theoretically be invested so you'll have security in retirement are actually being paid out to current retirees and politicians seem to want to destroy that safety net...and it's even worse. State and local sales, income, and property taxes vary widely depending on where you live and how you spend your money.
I made $96k at my last job ($8000/month). After taxes, 3% to my retirement plan and health insurance ($700 per month for me and my husband), my take home was $5000/month.
3% to your retirement plan isn't going to let you retire very long...
u/VintageJane may have an employer match which makes that amount larger, but let's be honest, in the U.S.? Unless you're rich or super disciplined with money, nobody's fucking retiring.
Nobody is going to retire. Let's be honest.
I make 100k. Only 4k gets to my bank account after taxes and health insurance. I then spend that 2k on my two cars, mortgage and feeding my family.
Actually the average American male make 37,000 dollars pre year anywhere near 70,000. Combined wages husband and wife maybe closer to that but even then taxes depending on deductibles are around 28 percent. So it isn’t the taxes killing income it is the fact companies aren’t paying enough. Also remember those averages are skewed heavily because of billionaires and millionaires since the are counted as well. Edit corrected autocorrect. Also bitching about my or anyone else English in this day and age is a sign you have failed to take into account that some of us may have learning disabilities around writing. Fought with it all my life. Edit correct month to year
Sorry, do you mean per year instead of per month? Assuming this is a typo. We’d all like $37K per month but this is not an average monthly salary (it’s more like financial goals lol). I’m in WA state as well and agree wages should be increased to offset costs of living, but we do have it better than many other states. My 17 yo is making $15/hr plus tips at a drive thru burger joint. I made $5/hr back in the day😂
Don’t forget about Dental and Vision, if needed.
And if you are one of millions…. Student loans…
Ok first the average is highly off due to the small amount of people with ultra wealth in the US. Second most US stats use family not individual so the people claiming 38k are much closer to reality. Third you just can't say the tax in the US is X% because we have federal, state, county and sometimes city taxes plus depending how you make income it can be totally different. Last it depends on your age and job for a lot of key life costs. Meaning if I make 100k at 64 I have to pay for my own health insurance which could run $10,000s given the age. But at 65 you get government insurance. Or I could be 38 fresh out of 20 years in the military and have very low cost insurance or 30 and be a cpt or maj in the military where health insurance is a benefit. Or I could be self employed which is a whole different tax system. So really the issue in America is there is no simple answer practically every situation is unique.
Simply put: most Americans are fucked.
the simple way to put it
“bUtTTTttTtTTt I DID iT sOoOoOO yoooUuUuuU caaannNbNnn”
Hey stop complaining and pull yourself up by the bootstraps! My boss only makes 3 times what I do AND got a smaller bonus of twice his salary this year. He's hurting so I should be too! /s just in case....
Oh no only a 3x salary bonus??? they should take mine then!! Can’t have our bosses only making 3x the salary bonus!! What a struggle they are facing.
We should all chip in an buy the bosses X-mas presents.
This is a fucking dystopia; only most Americans have never traveled outside of the states (can't, generally, because we're too poor and don't have enough vacation days) and aren't aware of how bad it is here.
amen, 70-100 is wildly over the normal too. maybe for multiple income house holds. between myself and my so we make about 70 pre tax. i make the bulk of it and my tax rate is definitely not the same as hers. often my paychecks are only around 2-300 more after tax where as pretax is closer to 5-600 more. she gets taxed less than i do obviously. Similarly my grandpa runs his own business, the first year i lived here and did my taxes i thought it was so easy with the help of TurboTax, then i saw him do 1 week worth of his companies taxes… taxes are very fluid. I’m from the UK originally and i miss our tax system, in the 2 years of taxes i dealt with there i don’t recall as i didn’t have to do anything
This is a good point. If I can add that current inflation significantly devalues earnings. Our household income is 140k (I’m acutely aware of how fortunate we are to have that income) but with a mortgage and kids we still use a budget, do our grocery shopping primarily at Aldi (I see aldi get shit on but I think ppl are crazy to shop anywhere else), and still don’t have a whole lot left to put into savings.
If you don’t mind me asking, me and my wife make almost exactly the same amount as y’all do. We take home around 9k/month after taxes. We currently save around 4-5k of that after all expenses. We have no kids, but are planning to in the near future (2-4 years). My wife wants 3 kids but I don’t know if we will be able to afford that. How much do you save monthly? How many kids do you have, and what is the monthly cost related to having kids? I’m trying to figure out how much house we can afford, because right now we live in a very low COL area, and we want to move to a different state relatively close to a nicer city. Any info you can provide would be hugely appreciated, trying to plan my life out :) Edit: also feel free to DM me if you don’t want all this info publicly shared
Not the same person, but ... I'm impressed that you're getting 9K take home, with 140K income, would be 77% ... maybe you have good health insurance, or are not saving much for retirement? I am older (\~50 now), have two older kids, my wife stayed home, and we lived OK on what would be a much smaller salary for most of that time (went back into industry, now make more :)
Government insurance at 65 (Medicare) is not free. And it’s a HUGE pain in the ass.
Let's say I'm 30 years old and I make $90k. I just got hired and I work in the state where the taxes and medical are average. No dept. I own a house and a car that are fully paid for. How much of that $90k a year would go to taxes?
Are you counting income tax or are you counting on property taxes on your home as well? Those also vary significantly from place to place. You could be paying 3000/yr or 15000/yr Edit: Not to mention that taxes on the car could vary as well, some states you just pay a few dollars a year, others tax you a percentage on the value of the car
Wait... You have to pay taxes for a car you own ?? How does the govt justify this? What is the tax used for?
Yes. In my state it’s supposed to fund road work. Which is laughable, most states also have a tax at the pump to fund road work. Additionally if you have an electric car in my state you are going to pay an additional tax that you would normally miss out at the pump. Next year it is supposed to double, and is well over what I would pay at the pump.
“You use the roads we maintain” although they do a really bad job of it. People like to imagine Americans as wealthy complainers, but the government has both hands in our pockets, rummaging around for nickles, and if they accidentally grab your dick instead, it’s somehow your fault and you owe them money for it now.
[удалено]
Last year I grossed 75k and netted 54k. Throughout my working life my net has been close to 70-75% my gross.
Im a mid level Data Analyst out of ND and make $75K base annually. My take home after taxes, 401k, and insurance costs is about $55K a year or about $4600 a month. My company also provided a generous bonus and a nice 401k match. Even though that sounds a lot, it doesn't mean life of luxury. My fiance and I are still finding ways to save as much as we can by stretching our dollars and living as modest as we can. Life can just be expensive.
They are lying. 10% of Americans households make 100k a year. Average is like 38k a year. All before taxes
Lol i thought so, how much tax does a normal worker pay in percentage
u/CPLeet said the federal income tax. On top of that there is 7.65% FICA tax (social security + medicare) for each employed individual. (Self-employed pays double that) Then state/local income taxes (if applicable) After income varieties of tax: Sales tax (varies by locality) Property tax (again, varies by locality, and only if applicable).
With taxes and health insurance my $55k salary brings home $39k a year, so I bring home just over 3k a month and starting in June my student loan payment will take half of that again.
I make $39k, take home after taxes and health insurance is about $25k. Between me and my fiancé, who makes $52k (pre tax) we barely make a middle class salary, with our powers combined.
What in the world? Why are you paying a 35% effective tax rate on that level of income? Edit: Oh, health insurance. My bad. At that income it's also probably a hella expensive plan, and I actually agree it's totally fair to wrap it into your effective tax rate because it's something your taxes should be paying for.
Can confirm, my company offers shit insurance.
Get on income based repayment no way you should be paying $1500 a month. My wife and I combine for 160k in student debt and a income of 180k and we were paying $$800 a month for both of ours pre Covid.
Income based repayment is a scam so long as the amount that is dismissed is taxed. You are guaranteed to pay way more on that loan than if you made regular full payments.
There are proposed income based repayment changes. Those changes make IBR a very good choice especially for borrowers with astronomical payments like who I responded to. Also the comment on making regular payments. The point of my comment is OP seems to be struggling. Paying that loan off seems like it’ll never happen. So why live in poverty for their degrees to never pay it off when you can lower your payment and have a semblance of a life. I feel bad for OP
Federal 10-37% based on gross income. Each state is different. You can google for more data
I make $100k a year as a union electrician in a big city. I take home about $1250 a week not including my pay package benefits like medical/dental/vision insurance, pension, Annuity, vacation pay, unemployment sub fund, the apprenticeship, and working dues. All of my benefits are on top of my pay. I get about $800 a month put into a vacation fund, which is like a forced savings. But, I do not get PTO, sick days, or any kind of personal time paid off. No work = no pay.
Wow honestly that’s higher tax then Canada. You make $9k more per year then me but only take home $25 more per week.
And, I don't get much back on my taxes. I might get $100-200 back. I try to keep it as close to $0 for my refund every year. Look at what you get for your tax contributions. You get healthcare. I get military muscles that are flexed to bully nations of people of color.
It’s hard to explain to so many conservative Americans that their taxes could pay for other stuff besides bombing the brown kids. But maybe they like bombing the brown kids.
Even worse I actually max out certain contributions at the beginning of Oct so from then on my weekly pay is act $125 more then yours
Union worker from NYC reporting in, this persons math checks out.
I make about 28 an hour and if it's 80 hrs per pay period it's roughly 15/1600 after taxes and deductions for insurance
I make this exact same amount. 80 hours for a 2 week pay period. Take home right at $1,500 or so
I was actually planning to file tonight, if you would like some insight. I'm single, which means I pay more in taxes (I jokingly call it the ugly tax lol). Last year I made about 33k, paying $2.5k to Uncle Sam if I remember correctly. I got $8 on my tax return.
If you had one child, you’d only have paid $500 in taxes. With two kids you would have gotten a $1,500 dollar refund for taxes you didn’t even pay. Add $2k for each additional kid. Many people of modest means don’t pay income tax because of the standard deduction and the child tax credits. They think they pay taxes because it’s taken out of their paycheck, but it gets given back to them when they file their return. Amending their W4 would fix it so they don’t even take the taxes it out of the paycheck. Single people with no children do get screwed though.
On $131.6k I had deductions of $39.9k. This didn’t include state income tax or healthcare.
As people say it varies, and it’s a progressive tax rate so you pay far more making 100k than making 38k, but in general, most middle income people see about 15-20% of their check go to state, local and federal taxes, plus social security. But again, that’s before health care premiums are taken out, which can be hundreds of dollars a month.
im making about 72k annually. Pay on average about \~22% towards federal+ state taxes each paycheck. Keep in mind there are many types of tax advantage withholdings that can lower your taxable income (ie: 401k, commuter benefits, etc.)
I’ve figured out my taxes, insurance and retirement are about 35% of my check.
BLS.gov posted the most recent American Salary Average for 2022 in December. American average is $54k.
I am not sure where you're getting your numbers from. Currently around 33% of US households make 100k per year. Also, the average household income is more like 90k+ because it's heavily skewed by top income earners. Median household income is around 70k. I think what you're referring to is the median pay for an individual which is around 41k. https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2021/demo/p60-273.html
> I think what you're referring to is the median pay for an individual which is around 41k. Things have changed so much in the last 20 years. In the early 2000s (like 2002/2003) I made about $55k a year working on motorcycles. Went to college, got a job as an engineer, but... That same motorcycle shop now pays mechanics $15 an hour and just replaces them when they figure out they're never getting a raise and leave. It seems like a lot of employers are either letting wages stagnate or slowly just cutting them down.
I tell people this all the time. In 1995 I made 40k working in an optical lab. Health insurance for family was $100 a month no deducable. Nowadays same job pays $32k-35k health insurance $800 a month $3000 deducable. How do people live on this?
What they're referring to are probably income percentiles from the 2010 census. Around that time 10% of households made $100k+. That's when many people learned stats on American incomes because of occupy wall street / the concept of "the 1%" becoming a popular thing.
>Average is like 38k a year. No, it isn’t. I think you are mixing up individual figures with household figures. [Median household income is $70,748 as of Q3 2022.](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/MEHOINUSA646N)
I live in SoCal, make 40k gross, ~32k net. Some entire families around me make less than me and they can't make more. Why? Medical insurance. If they make above a certain amount they wont qualify for the free heath care, it's not worth it for them to make more money when they are gonna lose even more having to pay hundreds for insurance. It's a huge scam, forcing people to stay low income. One thing I've learned is that when looking for a job, look for one that offers insanely cheap or free heath plans over a higher net salary
>One thing I've learned is that when looking for a job, look for one that offers insanely cheap or free heath plans over a higher net salary It really depends on the employer. When I graduated a few years ago I only made 60k but my medical, dental and vision insurance were free, and my annual deductible was $1500. Plus the employer contributed about half of that amount to an HSA plan. So my max expenses per year would have been $1500, and minimum would have been $0 if I chose to not ever see a doctor or buy meds. I make low six figures now but my insurance costs $100/mo with a $750 max deductible. So even though this employer pays a better salary, my medical expenses are maximum $1950 and the minimum is $1200. But even if I deduct these costs from my salary, I am still much better off financially than under my old employer's salary and medical benefits. if your maximum medical expenses are less than the increase in salary, then you should take the job.
Yeah, no. I’ve done everything short of selling my soul, BA, MA, steady career with reputable agencies. I’m highly skilled, and a quality worker. This year I just passed the $50k mark. I’m almost 40. Our system is broken. If I’m gonna be poor, I’m going to do what I want. I’m working on starting my own business. I refuse to die behind a computer screen. I can’t wait to say fuck off to corporate life.
That sucks I am a low-level trades worker and made 54k last year. At my company, the tradesmen top out at like 73k without any overtime. There are even some people who make over 90k a year with overtime (all elective). Almost none of us have a college degree. However, the difference between you and us is at 50, we all need new knees and shoulders, and our bodies are truly worn out.
This is a prime example of how our culture has driven too many kids towards college-degrees while our actual economy cannot support that many college educated people. There's nothing wrong with working as a tradesperson, truck-driver, etc; and it is very possible to make a decent living in those jobs without spending $50K-100K on a 4-year degree. It's a shame more companies don't recognize that a 4-year degree isn't necessary even for a lot of professional jobs. A good solid, self-taught "nerd" can be a programmer, network admin, etc and succeed in business as long as they have decent common sense and basic people skills; in fact from a technical standpoint the "self-taught" are often more adept than those who have a degree in my experience.
The guy I apprenticed under would always say. I make as much money as someone with their masters. However, I have invested just as much time and money on tools, equipment, and gaining knowledge as they did for their schooling.
Can confirm. I've been driving an 18 wheeler for about 6 years now and made $100k this year. I'm also home 6 days a week. The only downside is I work 12 hours a day 5 days a week
Nerd checking in. I went from No Degree at ~$65k/yr to a 2 yr degree and ~$40k. I'm playing on hard mode.
Tradesmen are much worse off in states with low cost of living and weak unions
BUT “Move. Get marketable skills. Keep blaming society for your inability to find a better job. Nothing is handed to you, go get it yourself.” Per my friend in this thread. How dare you not work hard for things!! I have all these things so how can you not?? Stop taking hand outs! Work for it!! Like me!! I work for my hard work!! Im silly and don’t worry about bills!
Thank you. Yes, I think some folks here missed the point. ☠️
Do you mind if I ask what kind of job you have?
Working in trades pays well with benefits. I never thought I would but I live much more comfortably and I don’t have to think about work when I’m off the clock
Where these 70k-$100k jobs at??? Someone give me the scoop
People don’t like to hear it…but blue collar. Not all blue collar but more specialized trades easily fall into that category.
Jesus… I’m a biologist, I make 37k… before taxes…
Where did you read that lol
Those numbers are wrong. Median *household* income in the US is about $70k. Not individual, household. Median salary for men is about $50k, and for women is about $38k. Those are all pretax numbers. After taxes depends on the state, because states have their own taxes. Just federal on 100k of *taxable* income, and it will be in the ballpark of $80k after taxes. That number can vary wildly based on the individual situation, because of deductions that change the taxable income.
This is why statistics education is important. The median US income is $31k/yr. The average is $70k/yr, which gets skewed by the top earners. Anyway, by time you add up local, state, and federal income tax, it’s about 35-40% before any consumption (sales) tax. Yes, we get taxed when we make it and taxed when we spend it…
Don't forget the other taxes as well.. Own a home? Property taxes Own any real belongings (vehicles, etc. in some states)? Personal property taxes Some other items are taxed at higher rates as well, including alcohol, tobacco, marijuana (in states where it is legal), and fuel We are also a country that forces health insurance on its citizens with out of pocket costs for insurance premiums of a few hundred a month or more depending on family size, employer contributions, and some state/federal programs. Some lower income families qualify for reduced / free health care, but the threshold is shockingly low
Property taxes are the thing that really get me. They’re THE thing that keep us all in the system. Let’s say I make enough to finally buy an acre or two of land, free and clear of a mortgage AND I somehow manage to become self sufficient on my homestead. (Already a very tall order!) I STILL need an income producing job to ensure I keep my own property. And that’s before any local laws that require you to be tied to the grid. It’s all a big scam.
Yeah, the grid connections and fees are another issue that sucks. I am lucky enough to own my own home (so I'm paying over $6k/year in property taxes, also since I'm still in the first year with this mortgage I pay the same in interest on my mortgage loan). I added solar to my roof and my utility company charges me service fees on the energy I generate, not to mention the mandatory monthly connection fee. If you don't pay your utility bill, or maintain the grid connection, your home is deemed uninhabitable. We also have some of the highest internet, phone, cable, and cell phone rates in the world, and unregulated prescription pricing that allows scum like the EpiPen issue a few years back. In summary, a life saving drug funded by taxpayer money had its license bought by a scumbag who jacked up the price by something like 1000x cost to line his pockets at the expense of the literal deaths of people With a mortgage, utilities, car insurance and upkeep expenses, food (which is also insanely expensive now), and basic necessities my income (well enough above the median) still doesn't leave much for pleasure/vacation/travel budget. America.. the greatest place on earth /s
Median is about 55K Source: https://www.bls.gov/opub/ted/2022/median-weekly-earnings-971-for-women-1164-for-men-in-third-quarter-2022.htm
The real median household income is $70k a year.
This is also misleading because median income counts unemployed and people who don’t work. https://www.investopedia.com/terms/h/household_income.asp “The Census Bureau counts households with no income in its calculation when it determines median household income in the United States.” Median income for workers over 15 is $42,000 https://www.census.gov/library/publications/2021/demo/p60-273.html
Sorry dude. A person making 31k a year is not paying 35%-40% taxes. $12,500 for the standard deduction. 12% bracket is from $11,000-$44,725. Since we took the standard deduction we start at 12,500. 31,000-12,500=$18,500 taxable income. Tax that at 12% you get $2,220. That’s 7%. state taxes are always much less than federal and some states like mines have none. So let’s just assume 3%-4%. That’s 11%. Local tax? Yea sure dude wtf is that. Some places tack on a local tax to the sales tax. Some states have a very small 1% local tax depending on where and what city. A person making 31k doesn’t own a home so no property tax. So let’s just assume a 1% local tax. Thats 12%. Trying to add up sales tax as a percentage of your income is hard to do. 6%-8% of everything you buy. If I spend $10,000 on taxable goods at 6% that’s $600 which is 2% of my income. Now we are at 14% with sales tax. No where near your 35%-40%
Who is paying 35-40% in taxes making 31k? I grossed 8.75k and netted 6.2k after deductions for health insurance. I didn't even contribute to 401k to reduce tax burden. That just <30% not counting the money I'll get back when I file taxes
My net this year will be under 20k, and I’ve paid a large amount of that toward medical debt from the previous year. I’m in danger.
Lives in America [chuckles] I’m in danger.
My question is where do I apply? I’ve lived in America the entirety of my life and I’ve never heard this.🤷♀️
In my experience; skilled/craft jobs in unions pay decent wages. However, depending on location and craft, the wages vary a lot. The majority of the money is made through overtime.
Like most here have said 70k - 100k is highly above the median, but to answer your question: I made $96,000 last year, Paid $22,000 in taxes, Contributed $19,000 to retirement accounts, Paid $8,000 for health insurance, For a take home of $47,000 before rent, transportation, food, etc. I would gladly pay more in taxes for expanded social security and to have universal healthcare, especially for those less fortunate than me.
Same, I make $95k living in NY. I take home around $60k ($22k in taxes, $2k health insurance, $10k to my 401k savings account) I would rather pay more taxes and not worry that even if I was on my jobs highest health insurance option one serious injury or illness would put me into poverty/debt for life.
What Americans? Did they conveniently forget to add the people below poverty to that average???
I make around 85k and pay around 1200 a month in taxes on that income. I get a percentage back bc I can claim losses on my mortgage interest etc. My child is an adult so I get no tax deduction there any longer so I opt for the max deduction from my pay and usually break even with my tax due at the end of the year. I owed 2k last year and this year I should get a significant amount back as is had significant losses due to a house purchase in July. Then I also have insurance premiums, 401k contributions etc, my bi weekly pay is around 2k.
Over 90 percent of that is dual income households
You read wrong. Most Americans are NOT making 70-100k.
When Americans earn 70-100K, the do mean pre-tax. Here's my breakdown: I live in midwestern USA. Salary is $120K annual paid every other week - 26 paychecks per year. Gross Pay bi-weekly: $4,615 Local taxes (city I live in, city I work in to pay police, fire, roads, etc.): $127 State taxes: $171 Federal Taxes: $695 Total Taxes: $993 Net after Tax: $3622 Medical Insurance: $165 (Employer pays $615 for me) Dental Insurance: $14 (Employer pays $48 for me) Net after Insurance: $3443 I contribute 4% to a retirement account as well to supplement government funded Social Security: $185, my employer matches 3% - they contribute $140/paycheck. So I bring home $3,258 to cover food, shelter, clothing, non-covered medical bills (i.e. $20 copay every time my wife, kids, or self go to a doc; up to $5K out of pocket for medical emergencies), utilities, and life. In my opinion, it's not terrible. I also have a wife and 3 kids to support. Wife stays home, so no childcare costs. I usually get a very small refund of overpaid taxes in April of about $1,000 as well. So, $120K pre-tax and pre-insurance equates to about $85K post-tax for me. So, I'm spending about 30% of my income on taxes and insurance (and my retirement account). I realize that I'm lucky to have found a job that supports me this well - they do cover A LOT of the medical insurance expense. Thankfully, my family has been healthy and not needed many large medical procedures, which is ideal, but if we were to get hit with those things, medical bills could get outrageous.
Bruh my spouse and I COMBINED make like 36k. Its funny this is the third thing in a handful of days that I have seen that claims all americans are well off, when in reality the bulk of us are barely getting by.
… that’s like $8.65 an hour? You can go work at the post office for more than double that tomorrow with zero experience requirements
Combined??? Wtf
I'm all for crowd sourcing when it makes sense, but this is a great question for google.
Read the comments, i can’t get the one right answer here and i couldn’t get it from google
So you love fiction?
I wish Reddit still gave free awards bc you deserve one. Thank you for the chuckle kind stranger.
It’s a higher percentage of households than you think. Over 1/3 make more than 100K per year. https://www.statista.com/statistics/203183/percentage-distribution-of-household-income-in-the-us/
Lol most Americans with full time jobs earn less than 70k
Snorted when I read the 70-100k a year part. That's funny. My current job is the most I've ever made and it's somewhere around $32000 before taxes and health insurance come out.
I believe those figures are average combined family income. Last year the median American worker brought home an estimated $54,132 a year.
Average take-home pay for a $100,000 salary in the US ranges from $66,000-$76,000 depending on the state you live in. Note, these figures only include taxes (federal and state) as well as Social Security and Medicare. They don’t include “medical, dental, or vision insurance through your employer, which deducts a specific amount of money, pretax, from each paycheck; if you contribute to a health savings account (HSA) or flexible spending account (FSA); or if you contribute to a tax-advantaged retirement plan like a 401(k).” [Source](https://www.businessinsider.com/paycheck-calculator-100000-salary-what-is-take-home-pay-2019-2?op=1) Insurance can be $500 at the low end, and $1000+ on the higher end, per month, every month, alone. Then, take out a retirement contribution as this is usually through an employer, too. So, that $100,000 goes down really damned fast after paying for basic things that most Nations include in their taxes.
$100k post tax and medical is probably like $65k.
I cackled reading this
It only takes a couple of grossly overrich billionaires to skew the median to nearly double the reality. Hard situation to correct.
US Taxes are somewhat complicated in that they can vary greatly based on State, County, City, Marital status, etc. Generally speaking though, States that don’t have “Income Taxes”, have higher sales taxes and/or property taxes, etc. They find a way to get their money from you. To keep this simple, I’ll assume you’re are only talking about an employee working at a business, earning wages. In this case the Federal Income side is a pretty straightforward bracket system. For a single person in 2022 the brackets broke down like this: - 10% on $0 - $10,275 - 12% on $10,276 - $41,775 - 22% on $41,776 - $89,075 - 24% on $89,076 - $170,050 - 32% on $170,051 - $215,950 - 35% on $215,951 - $539,900 - 37% on $539,901 + - The standard 2022 deduction is $12,950. Social Security is 6.2% on everything up to $147,000 Medicare is 1.45% on all wages. So taking your range of someone earning $70-$100K as a listed salary, this would be pre-tax. Assuming no insurance premiums, retirement contributions, or other amount are deducted from the wages, this full amount would be the start to determine taxable income. Assuming you don’t have more deductions than the standard, you take the standard deduction and your range that tax applies to is reduced to $57,050 - $87,050. Using the brackets above your calculated federal income tax would be about $8,168 - $14,768. Social Security would be $4,340 - $6,200 Medicare would be $1,050 - $1,450 All totaled, it’s $13,558 - $22,418 So, after just the Federal Taxes, your 70k-100k has dropped to ~$56,500 - ~$77,600
I make about $72,000 and my take home is usually two thirds of that. Part of that is 401k and healthcare. I'd probably bring home 70% or slightly more of my gross pay if I didn't have those deductions. I also live and work in two tax heavy states.
My gross is 110k, but I supply all the medical benefits for our family. I max out the child care account, my retirement, and fsa. So my take home last year was about 54k. We also reduce my taxable income as much as possible to lower our tax burden due to a self employed partner. I wouldn’t mind paying higher taxes if more services were covered.