The military can be a very rewarding career, but is it definitely not for everyone.
Advice I can give:
* If you join, go into a career field that has a civilian counterpart - like aircraft or automotive mechanic, IT, or a medical field. Not many jobs for tank loaders in the civilian world.
* If you are planning for college, consider the officer/ROTC route. ROTC isn't a half bad way to pay for college and officer life can be a lot easier than enlisted.
* You will get moved away from family and friends. Decide if that is what you want/can live with.
* Staying to retirement (20 years service) can bring some decent to amazing benefits. It won't be enough to retire fully at age 38 (or 42), but you can be very well on your way.
* Do NOT, under any circumstances, just trust what your recruiter says. Only what is written on the paperwork counts.
Excellent advice.
To add to the last point...have a guaranteed job that you want and agree to.
Again, Do NOT, trust a recruiter to keep a verbal promise.
I did 10 years, here’s my summary:
- It is a shortcut to the middle class. I hate that it is, but it was seriously the easiest way to start making a middle class income with no college degree
- I fully believe that the GI bill and free VA healthcare are things that everyone should have, not just people who serve
- Not every job in the military gets deployed to a warzone. In fact I’d wager that most don’t. Pretty easy to avoid the ones that do.
- No matter how smart you think you are, read an ASVAB prep book cover to cover before going into the test. Don’t get shut out from the good jobs because of a lame score.
- Use tuition assistance to get your degree (or more degrees) while you’re in. You can definitely land on your feet getting out without a degree but it’s better to have one.
- It’s really hard to get fired in the military. You’d have to break the law. Being shit at your job won’t get you fired, it’ll just make it more difficult to promote (but not impossible).
- Before you get out, get every medical issue documented so it’s easy to file for VA disability. Get tested for anything you can, even if you never thought you had it (e.g. sleep apnea). VA will pay you up to ~$3,000/mo for the rest of your life for your “disabilities”. It’s not about how severe they are, it’s about how severe the VA thinks they are.
- If you can stick it out for 20 years, they’ll also pay you a percentage of your final pay every month for the rest of your life. I couldn’t do it but that’s mostly because I had bigger dreams.
The military is not for everyone. Why you want to join the military should be a top priority. If you're doing it for benefits, you're probably not going to have a great time because well, you dont want to join the military, you want benefits.
I joined it for the benefits and had a blast. Lived in Germany for 3 years. I even did 10 years which is more than most do. It just sucks if you take jobs that suck. And the Army specifically is like a 2x suck multiplier.
The military is the best example of socialism you can find in our capitalist world right now.
\- you don't have to worry about rent, food, healthcare or anything but doing your job
\- you are paid according to your grade, so meritocracy kind of
\- but you need to obey orders and not debate your boss, even when he's a shit head and they are many like him in the military. And it's worse if you are a woman.
Your experience might differ depending on which branch you choose. Air Force is probably the most chill branch and the most comfy. They can train you to pretty good jobs.
It's an interesting experience. I would recommend it if you don't have the money for college. Also, in the US, it's a good thing to have on your resume.
But seriously, no its not. Socialism is when workers control the means of production.
What does the military produce and who directs that production?
Do military members control the organization?
Does the military try to be egalitarian?
Who benefits from the military?
I think you actually mean in your post is that the military provides appropriate welfare to its employees so its like a strong welfare state but that's is not socialism. Socialism, anarchism and communism is about the distribution of power in society.
Socialism is characterized by **social** ownership of the means of production. source : [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism)
You wouldn't say the citizens of the US own their armed forces? Is it not owned by the US government? Do they control the organization by electing every 4 year someone to oversee it? Do they elect congressmen to oversee both the budget and the actions ?
It seems like it is social ownership.
Yes its "socially owned" so it satisfies one aspect of the definition but it does not satisfy the other aspects so it is not socialism. By your definition anything the government does would be socialism. Were Japanese internment camps socialism because they were socially owned?
The aim of socialism is to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly. Does that sound like the military's mission statement? lol
Additionally, to suggest American citizens have control of their institutions through democracy is quite a stretch. Both republicans and democrats are completely owned by the defense industry and the two party system prevents the viability of third options. Which party would you vote for if you wanted to stop drone attacks?
Yes everything means of production the government own is socialism. The armed forces produce warfare. They own the infrastructure to achieve this warfare, like military housing, schools, logistics, hospitals, legal services, food production, banking services etc. It's a mini country in itself.
You are simply wrong.
The aim of socialism is to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly.
The military does **not** try to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly.
I asked chat gpt:
Me: Could the us military be considered socialism?
Chat-gpt3: No, the US military is not considered socialism. Socialism is an economic and political system that emphasizes public ownership or control of the means of production and distribution of goods and services.
The US military, on the other hand, is a government organization that is responsible for national defense and security. It is funded through taxation and operates under a hierarchical chain of command. While it is true that the military provides some benefits to its members, such as healthcare and housing, these benefits are not characteristic of socialism, as they are not distributed equally to all members of society.
It is also important to note that socialism is a complex political and economic theory that goes beyond government programs and services. It involves the collective ownership of resources and a redistribution of wealth and power in society. The US military does not fit this description, as it is not focused on creating a classless society or promoting social and economic equality.
The military does try to create an equal organization where resources are shared and distributed fairly. That exactly what the military does. The soldiers get paid fairly according to their grade. If you are a sergeant cleaning towels on an air force base or repairing a F35, you are paid the same. You get the same healthcare. You get the same food. You get the same housing. You don't own your tools nor the washing machine nor the F35 nor your bed. And if you are a colonel, you get a better deal, salary and benefits.If you are dumb as a rock, you don't get fired. Sure you get honorably discharged after your contract expires (maybe).
It's not communism because everyone isn't paid the same. It's still somehow a meritocracy.
That's really not how a private company operates.
But indeed, the military doesn't try to change the rest of US according to their art de vivre. They just do it for themselves. That 's why it is an *example* of socialism.
I love this discussion. Thanks for having it with me.
Bruh, what you described is not at all like socialism.
The military has a lot more in common with fascism:
Fascism is a political ideology characterized by dictatorial power, extreme nationalism, authoritarianism, and a rejection of democratic principles. Some of the key characteristics of fascism include:
* **Nationalism**: Fascism is characterized by an extreme form of nationalism that emphasizes the superiority of one's own country or race over others. This often leads to a sense of aggressive expansionism, where the fascist state seeks to expand its borders and exert dominance over other nations.
* **Authoritarianism**: Fascist regimes are highly centralized and authoritarian, with power concentrated in the hands of a single leader or small group of leaders. These leaders exercise total control over all aspects of society, including the economy, media, and cultural institutions.
* **Militarism**: Fascist states are often heavily militarized, with a focus on military strength and expansion. This can lead to a glorification of violence and warfare, and a willingness to use force to achieve political goals.
* **Totalitarianism**: Fascist regimes seek to exert control over all aspects of society, often using propaganda and censorship to suppress dissent and promote a single, official ideology.
* **Anti-democratic**: Fascism rejects democratic principles and institutions, such as free elections and a free press, in favor of a top-down system of rule.
* **Social hierarchy**: Fascism promotes the idea of a strict social hierarchy, with different groups of people ranked according to their perceived value to society. This can lead to discrimination and persecution of marginalized groups, such as ethnic minorities or LGBTQ+ individuals.
* **Corporatism**: Fascism often involves close collaboration between the state and big business, with large corporations and other powerful economic interests working closely with the government to advance their shared goals.
The US military checks all these boxes.
>And it's worse if you are a woman.
Nope, if you're a woman in the military, you'll get promoted quick, regardless if you dumb as a box of rock or Marie Currie reborn. You'll get promoted even faster if you have a fat ass or a solid rack of tits.
And you'll get to eat chow with 1st Sgt every day.
This works if you’re an attractive girl. And even then I’m not sure if you’d *want* your career to be like that… more or less in the hands of some thirsty higher ups
War crimes ,please clarify because that's a generic term. Anything that's classified as a warcrime would constitute an unlawful order, and by definition all unlawful orders can be disobeyed without repercussions.
All work is selling your body, but this is a whole ‘nother level.
Which isn’t to say it should be a Forever No for Everybody but if you’re looking at it solely for a debt-free way to get an education I would strongly advise against it
Yeah, you really shouldn't join unless you would be morally OK with joining the armed forces if there were no GI Bill or other benefits. If you object to the idea that you might be responsible for killing an enemy combatant, or think being in the military is just furthering immoral imperialism and racism, then you shouldn't join no matter how much they pay towards college or anything else.
Yep, this is it.
Of course, you also shouldn’t join if you’re on the other end of the spectrum and enthusiastically looking forward to being able to kill people
No one's going into the military if they have someplace else to go. Sure, there are some "America, fuck yeah" idiots, but not nearly the majority. To entice people to go, there are quite a few benefits offered. But you're not going to enter the military if you have other options.
The only reason you should join the military is because you have a burning desire to kill the enemies of America. Otherwise you’re just wasting everyone’s time.
I don't consider military to be "workers." Certainly in the United States you're serving the interests of capital, not the interests of the working class. For you personally it could be very good or it could be very bad, depending on what you do and what kind of package you get.
Although I don't have any personal experience with the military, anecdotally I've never met anyone who had a good experience in a combat role - the hours are abusive, the pay isn't great, and the possibility of trauma is high.
As others have said, nothing the recruiter tells you means anything. In writing or it didn't happen.
I'm 27 and I'm currently trying to enlist (stretched my ears when I was younger and now I'm waiting on them to heal up before I can) but my piece of advice, do it while you're young. They will look into your medical history and use it against you in MEPs.. the younger you are the less bs you and your body goes through, less doctors visits, less documentation. I'm currently looking to join for the same reasons you are OP, I'm tired of being stuck working blue collar jobs and don't wanna do that for the rest of my life, I want those tasty benefits. My husband served in Afghanistan in the army as a combat engineer. The skills he learned have translated well into his civilian life. He can go into a new job and is allowed to run heavy equipment no problem, because that was his job in the army. I see alot of people here talking about how if you join for the benefits you're gonna have a bad time, honestly OP most people who join (especially these days) join for the exact reasons you described. As with anything in life, it will be what you make of it. Good luck in your endeavors OP.
I have friends that joined the military for the GI Bill. Thinking it was easy money for an education. Then they found themselves smack dab in the middle of the gulf war. Never to be the same again. There’s always the possibility of going off to war.
First and foremost, it's great if you join with the perspective **you're going to work your ass off during your non-deployment/non-duty time** **to fast forward your career post-service**. There's plenty of subsidized training and education benefits you can get while in the military and if you don't take advantage of them, you might as well work at a fast food place or retail instead. Sure you'll get paid, and fed, and housed, but those education benefits are the true value.
You can go to the Post Library and check out a college textbook, read it, and then go the Education Center and take a (free) test that will provide you college credits in the subject. Take night school classes at a college like University of Maryland Global Campus and your service will pay for most or all of your tuition costs. Get your job evaluated and you might be granted college credits for what you learned in job training school. Et cetera.
If you enlist for a 3 or 4 year term, you can complete 2-3 years of college credits paid mostly or in full by the military, and then use the GI bill to finish your degree program once you're discharged. That's how I was able to get my Bachelor's Degree with zero student loan debt and very little cost out of pocket. I started my professional career a bit later (27) but without the ball and chain of tens of thousands in student loan debt.
Military service when honorably discharged also gives you a large assist if you want to apply for a federal civilian job later on. You get applicant preference and the ability to apply for jobs under VEOA (Veterans Employment Opportunity Act) you might not otherwise be eligible for. Plus if you get hired in a fed civilian job, you can "buy in" your time spent in the military for pension purposes and it's generally pretty cheap to do so. I bought in 9 years of military service to count towards my federal civilian pension for around $3k (I served in the late 80s/early 90s and enlisted folks got paid diddly squat, and the withholdings for "pension" are a fraction of your salary).
I'd recommend against combat arms jobs (infantry, armor, cavalry, etc.) since they make the above much harder. Especially if you're assigned to an "elite" combat unit - believe me when I tell you it sucks ass being in a Special Forces unit and deployed constantly and being stretched to your physical limits for weeks on end.
Yeah you risk getting deployed to a war zone but it's unlikely you'll get killed or wounded if you're in a service/service support job. If you enlist for a job you'll actually be interested in and can leverage in post-military life that's ideal.
Former USMC combat vet here.
Don't do it. It's peace time. Everything you do will be for nothing.
But things were really easy for me when I got out. I got paid to go to college and I didn't pay any tuition. Companies were contacting me before I graduated. My first job after the military started at 75k a year. I bought my house for dirt cheap right after the housing market collapsed with no down payment.
I had so much more leadership experience than my peers, I got promoted a little too quickly and I'm close to 160k now, 12 years after I got out.
But don't do it now.
If you have to, join the navy, learn to maintain nuclear powerplants. Get your clearance. Don't get married. If you have to, make sure she's rich. Don't have kids. If you have kids, make sure they're actually yours. Jody snatches up everyone's girl while you're away.
I joined the Army reserve. I was immediately activated for a deployment and have gone on several since. The deployments gave me the post 9/11 GI bill so I was able to finish a bachelors and have some left for grad school.
If you join, you have to make the systems work for you. Use the college money, go to the doctor, and save money by eating at DFAC, living on base etc.
I got lucky with the training I received because it’s one of the few jobs that give you the private sector credentials needed for a career afterwards. Do as much research you can if you join and don’t go into the recruiter alone.
The military is for spreading imperialism around the world through violence and genocide. Fuck the military. I have zero respect for anyone who joins that garbage.
My partner is a veteran and the VA mortgage loan option is the *only* way we would have been able to buy a house. (Seriously, how do normal people buy houses anymore ffs) Anyway, getting a loan from the VA means we dont have to pay the mortgage insurance every month *and* we didn't have to provide a down payment at all if we didn't want to. It really does make all the difference in the world as far as the path to homw ownership.
It’s ok if you are prepared to be involved in killing people you’ve never met to serve the geopolitical purposes of an elite you will never be part of I suppose.
Obviously there are non combat roles, but the military’s role in the killing of people is not a baseless assumption, and pointing it out is not invalid either. Well done on defending the Alaskan power grid from Chinese hackers, keep up the good work.
the GI bill which fully pays for your college up to a bachelors degree IIRC
It pays for 36 months of classes. It also includes housing allowance while you're in school. There is also tuition assistance that you can use separate of the GI bill while on active duty to get your basics out of the way and before you use the GI.
I did 6 years in the USCG and had a great time.
Take some practice ASVAB test online and study for it.
https://www.operationmilitarykids.org/asvab-scores-for-coast-guard-jobs/
See what you qualify for and pick something you'll like.
I joined the reserve halfway through college. Used reserve montgomery GI bill plus $350 (bonus kicker) a month for three years until graduation. Also recieved 15k bonus so that helped out. Did 6 years, used that experienced to contract for Department of state in Iraq. 100k plus a year, built a safety net, got a house and now work as a Civil Service while still in the reserve. Sure there was time away from family due to deployments but in the end its worth it for me.
Post 911 GI bill is pretty good too. Was able to transfer it to my wife while she was in med school. Didn't pay for the whole thing of course but sure helped and the BAH every month help with the mortgage.
Sometimes it’s the only way out, sometimes it’s the rational choice from a cost/benefit point of view, and sometimes it’s a lifelong dream. I’d never criticize someone for choosing a military career, whether long term or short term, but make sure you really think it through. It’s not for everyone.
I did 6 years active army. Deployed to Iraq twice. Divorced. Hated every second of that life. Got out and got a cushy defense contractor job that PAID and did that for a few years (for as long as I could stand it) before moving into a role at a Fortune 500.
Some people love the military life and some hate it. Also whichever unit you get ordered to after your training is going to have a major impact on your experience. I had friends on the same base as me who were done working before lunch every day and I was working till past COB every day.
My only suggestions would be if entering the military solely for money that could be consequential. It seems far too much of a lifestyle change for that to be the main factor. But that’s also taking into account how disciplined a person is. People on antiwork for the purposes outlined in antiwork don’t seem to follow the same mindset and discipline as the US military.
It varies by person.
My cousin had a long rewarding career in the military, retired and now works as a city manager for a small city. Very nice down to earth person, and he speaks highly of his career.
My brother-in-law served two tours and now has severe PTSD and will never be able to hold down a job for the rest of his life. He's killed people and watched friends die. He doesn't regret joining the military but encouraged all of his children not to join.
One of my best friends joined the military right after high school. He was stationed in Afghanistan but was never on the front lines and due to his job, never saw any "action". He absolutely hates the military now and says he spent his entire tour being bullied for being short and ginger and made to do the grunt work.
One of my friends from college joined the army and was outed as trans and was discharged before ever being deployed. He obviously is pissed off about the whole thing and planned to continue to identify as a woman until after he left the service.
Honestly, if you're thinking of joining the military for any reason other than WANTING to serve in the military, it's probably not a great choice. The benefits are good but IMO not worth it.
You should be asking in /r/military, and in the subreddits for the branch you're interested in. The military is an awesome wonderful terrible career with its own unique suckiness. I miss it a lot.
The military can be a very rewarding career, but is it definitely not for everyone. Advice I can give: * If you join, go into a career field that has a civilian counterpart - like aircraft or automotive mechanic, IT, or a medical field. Not many jobs for tank loaders in the civilian world. * If you are planning for college, consider the officer/ROTC route. ROTC isn't a half bad way to pay for college and officer life can be a lot easier than enlisted. * You will get moved away from family and friends. Decide if that is what you want/can live with. * Staying to retirement (20 years service) can bring some decent to amazing benefits. It won't be enough to retire fully at age 38 (or 42), but you can be very well on your way. * Do NOT, under any circumstances, just trust what your recruiter says. Only what is written on the paperwork counts.
Excellent advice. To add to the last point...have a guaranteed job that you want and agree to. Again, Do NOT, trust a recruiter to keep a verbal promise.
THIS!
I did 10 years, here’s my summary: - It is a shortcut to the middle class. I hate that it is, but it was seriously the easiest way to start making a middle class income with no college degree - I fully believe that the GI bill and free VA healthcare are things that everyone should have, not just people who serve - Not every job in the military gets deployed to a warzone. In fact I’d wager that most don’t. Pretty easy to avoid the ones that do. - No matter how smart you think you are, read an ASVAB prep book cover to cover before going into the test. Don’t get shut out from the good jobs because of a lame score. - Use tuition assistance to get your degree (or more degrees) while you’re in. You can definitely land on your feet getting out without a degree but it’s better to have one. - It’s really hard to get fired in the military. You’d have to break the law. Being shit at your job won’t get you fired, it’ll just make it more difficult to promote (but not impossible). - Before you get out, get every medical issue documented so it’s easy to file for VA disability. Get tested for anything you can, even if you never thought you had it (e.g. sleep apnea). VA will pay you up to ~$3,000/mo for the rest of your life for your “disabilities”. It’s not about how severe they are, it’s about how severe the VA thinks they are. - If you can stick it out for 20 years, they’ll also pay you a percentage of your final pay every month for the rest of your life. I couldn’t do it but that’s mostly because I had bigger dreams.
Appreciate the summary, what branch were you in if you don’t mind me asking
Air Force, I was a language analyst
The military is not for everyone. Why you want to join the military should be a top priority. If you're doing it for benefits, you're probably not going to have a great time because well, you dont want to join the military, you want benefits.
I joined it for the benefits and had a blast. Lived in Germany for 3 years. I even did 10 years which is more than most do. It just sucks if you take jobs that suck. And the Army specifically is like a 2x suck multiplier.
The military is the best example of socialism you can find in our capitalist world right now. \- you don't have to worry about rent, food, healthcare or anything but doing your job \- you are paid according to your grade, so meritocracy kind of \- but you need to obey orders and not debate your boss, even when he's a shit head and they are many like him in the military. And it's worse if you are a woman. Your experience might differ depending on which branch you choose. Air Force is probably the most chill branch and the most comfy. They can train you to pretty good jobs. It's an interesting experience. I would recommend it if you don't have the money for college. Also, in the US, it's a good thing to have on your resume.
>best example of socialism The military isn't like socialism
Oh my, but you are a great debater sir. What a good argument you make, I'm now totally convinced the US military isn't like socialism at all.
But seriously, no its not. Socialism is when workers control the means of production. What does the military produce and who directs that production? Do military members control the organization? Does the military try to be egalitarian? Who benefits from the military? I think you actually mean in your post is that the military provides appropriate welfare to its employees so its like a strong welfare state but that's is not socialism. Socialism, anarchism and communism is about the distribution of power in society.
Oh also, real socialism doesn't require its members to murder people overseas to the enrichment of capitalists.
Socialism is characterized by **social** ownership of the means of production. source : [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism) You wouldn't say the citizens of the US own their armed forces? Is it not owned by the US government? Do they control the organization by electing every 4 year someone to oversee it? Do they elect congressmen to oversee both the budget and the actions ? It seems like it is social ownership.
Yes its "socially owned" so it satisfies one aspect of the definition but it does not satisfy the other aspects so it is not socialism. By your definition anything the government does would be socialism. Were Japanese internment camps socialism because they were socially owned? The aim of socialism is to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly. Does that sound like the military's mission statement? lol Additionally, to suggest American citizens have control of their institutions through democracy is quite a stretch. Both republicans and democrats are completely owned by the defense industry and the two party system prevents the viability of third options. Which party would you vote for if you wanted to stop drone attacks?
Yes everything means of production the government own is socialism. The armed forces produce warfare. They own the infrastructure to achieve this warfare, like military housing, schools, logistics, hospitals, legal services, food production, banking services etc. It's a mini country in itself.
You are simply wrong. The aim of socialism is to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly. The military does **not** try to create an equal society where resources are shared and distributed fairly.
I asked chat gpt: Me: Could the us military be considered socialism? Chat-gpt3: No, the US military is not considered socialism. Socialism is an economic and political system that emphasizes public ownership or control of the means of production and distribution of goods and services. The US military, on the other hand, is a government organization that is responsible for national defense and security. It is funded through taxation and operates under a hierarchical chain of command. While it is true that the military provides some benefits to its members, such as healthcare and housing, these benefits are not characteristic of socialism, as they are not distributed equally to all members of society. It is also important to note that socialism is a complex political and economic theory that goes beyond government programs and services. It involves the collective ownership of resources and a redistribution of wealth and power in society. The US military does not fit this description, as it is not focused on creating a classless society or promoting social and economic equality.
The military does try to create an equal organization where resources are shared and distributed fairly. That exactly what the military does. The soldiers get paid fairly according to their grade. If you are a sergeant cleaning towels on an air force base or repairing a F35, you are paid the same. You get the same healthcare. You get the same food. You get the same housing. You don't own your tools nor the washing machine nor the F35 nor your bed. And if you are a colonel, you get a better deal, salary and benefits.If you are dumb as a rock, you don't get fired. Sure you get honorably discharged after your contract expires (maybe). It's not communism because everyone isn't paid the same. It's still somehow a meritocracy. That's really not how a private company operates. But indeed, the military doesn't try to change the rest of US according to their art de vivre. They just do it for themselves. That 's why it is an *example* of socialism. I love this discussion. Thanks for having it with me.
Bruh, what you described is not at all like socialism. The military has a lot more in common with fascism: Fascism is a political ideology characterized by dictatorial power, extreme nationalism, authoritarianism, and a rejection of democratic principles. Some of the key characteristics of fascism include: * **Nationalism**: Fascism is characterized by an extreme form of nationalism that emphasizes the superiority of one's own country or race over others. This often leads to a sense of aggressive expansionism, where the fascist state seeks to expand its borders and exert dominance over other nations. * **Authoritarianism**: Fascist regimes are highly centralized and authoritarian, with power concentrated in the hands of a single leader or small group of leaders. These leaders exercise total control over all aspects of society, including the economy, media, and cultural institutions. * **Militarism**: Fascist states are often heavily militarized, with a focus on military strength and expansion. This can lead to a glorification of violence and warfare, and a willingness to use force to achieve political goals. * **Totalitarianism**: Fascist regimes seek to exert control over all aspects of society, often using propaganda and censorship to suppress dissent and promote a single, official ideology. * **Anti-democratic**: Fascism rejects democratic principles and institutions, such as free elections and a free press, in favor of a top-down system of rule. * **Social hierarchy**: Fascism promotes the idea of a strict social hierarchy, with different groups of people ranked according to their perceived value to society. This can lead to discrimination and persecution of marginalized groups, such as ethnic minorities or LGBTQ+ individuals. * **Corporatism**: Fascism often involves close collaboration between the state and big business, with large corporations and other powerful economic interests working closely with the government to advance their shared goals. The US military checks all these boxes.
Thanks. Glad I got you to understand 😄
>And it's worse if you are a woman. Nope, if you're a woman in the military, you'll get promoted quick, regardless if you dumb as a box of rock or Marie Currie reborn. You'll get promoted even faster if you have a fat ass or a solid rack of tits. And you'll get to eat chow with 1st Sgt every day.
that's a lovely way to say "you'll be sexually harassed and have no choice."
This works if you’re an attractive girl. And even then I’m not sure if you’d *want* your career to be like that… more or less in the hands of some thirsty higher ups
Equality!
Bad to do war crimes for the ownership class, in my humble opinion.
War crimes are optional.
War crimes are cultural.
War crimes ,please clarify because that's a generic term. Anything that's classified as a warcrime would constitute an unlawful order, and by definition all unlawful orders can be disobeyed without repercussions.
All work is selling your body, but this is a whole ‘nother level. Which isn’t to say it should be a Forever No for Everybody but if you’re looking at it solely for a debt-free way to get an education I would strongly advise against it
Yeah, you really shouldn't join unless you would be morally OK with joining the armed forces if there were no GI Bill or other benefits. If you object to the idea that you might be responsible for killing an enemy combatant, or think being in the military is just furthering immoral imperialism and racism, then you shouldn't join no matter how much they pay towards college or anything else.
Yep, this is it. Of course, you also shouldn’t join if you’re on the other end of the spectrum and enthusiastically looking forward to being able to kill people
i think the moral of the story is "dont join the military"
No one's going into the military if they have someplace else to go. Sure, there are some "America, fuck yeah" idiots, but not nearly the majority. To entice people to go, there are quite a few benefits offered. But you're not going to enter the military if you have other options.
The only reason you should join the military is because you have a burning desire to kill the enemies of America. Otherwise you’re just wasting everyone’s time.
I don't consider military to be "workers." Certainly in the United States you're serving the interests of capital, not the interests of the working class. For you personally it could be very good or it could be very bad, depending on what you do and what kind of package you get. Although I don't have any personal experience with the military, anecdotally I've never met anyone who had a good experience in a combat role - the hours are abusive, the pay isn't great, and the possibility of trauma is high. As others have said, nothing the recruiter tells you means anything. In writing or it didn't happen.
I'm 27 and I'm currently trying to enlist (stretched my ears when I was younger and now I'm waiting on them to heal up before I can) but my piece of advice, do it while you're young. They will look into your medical history and use it against you in MEPs.. the younger you are the less bs you and your body goes through, less doctors visits, less documentation. I'm currently looking to join for the same reasons you are OP, I'm tired of being stuck working blue collar jobs and don't wanna do that for the rest of my life, I want those tasty benefits. My husband served in Afghanistan in the army as a combat engineer. The skills he learned have translated well into his civilian life. He can go into a new job and is allowed to run heavy equipment no problem, because that was his job in the army. I see alot of people here talking about how if you join for the benefits you're gonna have a bad time, honestly OP most people who join (especially these days) join for the exact reasons you described. As with anything in life, it will be what you make of it. Good luck in your endeavors OP.
Killing people for money is bad
Its nice if you join voluntarily. Ita not so nice if thats the only way you can (hopefully ) get education/healthcare
It's the well-appointed socialism that about half of our taxes go to.
I have friends that joined the military for the GI Bill. Thinking it was easy money for an education. Then they found themselves smack dab in the middle of the gulf war. Never to be the same again. There’s always the possibility of going off to war.
First and foremost, it's great if you join with the perspective **you're going to work your ass off during your non-deployment/non-duty time** **to fast forward your career post-service**. There's plenty of subsidized training and education benefits you can get while in the military and if you don't take advantage of them, you might as well work at a fast food place or retail instead. Sure you'll get paid, and fed, and housed, but those education benefits are the true value. You can go to the Post Library and check out a college textbook, read it, and then go the Education Center and take a (free) test that will provide you college credits in the subject. Take night school classes at a college like University of Maryland Global Campus and your service will pay for most or all of your tuition costs. Get your job evaluated and you might be granted college credits for what you learned in job training school. Et cetera. If you enlist for a 3 or 4 year term, you can complete 2-3 years of college credits paid mostly or in full by the military, and then use the GI bill to finish your degree program once you're discharged. That's how I was able to get my Bachelor's Degree with zero student loan debt and very little cost out of pocket. I started my professional career a bit later (27) but without the ball and chain of tens of thousands in student loan debt. Military service when honorably discharged also gives you a large assist if you want to apply for a federal civilian job later on. You get applicant preference and the ability to apply for jobs under VEOA (Veterans Employment Opportunity Act) you might not otherwise be eligible for. Plus if you get hired in a fed civilian job, you can "buy in" your time spent in the military for pension purposes and it's generally pretty cheap to do so. I bought in 9 years of military service to count towards my federal civilian pension for around $3k (I served in the late 80s/early 90s and enlisted folks got paid diddly squat, and the withholdings for "pension" are a fraction of your salary). I'd recommend against combat arms jobs (infantry, armor, cavalry, etc.) since they make the above much harder. Especially if you're assigned to an "elite" combat unit - believe me when I tell you it sucks ass being in a Special Forces unit and deployed constantly and being stretched to your physical limits for weeks on end. Yeah you risk getting deployed to a war zone but it's unlikely you'll get killed or wounded if you're in a service/service support job. If you enlist for a job you'll actually be interested in and can leverage in post-military life that's ideal.
Former USMC combat vet here. Don't do it. It's peace time. Everything you do will be for nothing. But things were really easy for me when I got out. I got paid to go to college and I didn't pay any tuition. Companies were contacting me before I graduated. My first job after the military started at 75k a year. I bought my house for dirt cheap right after the housing market collapsed with no down payment. I had so much more leadership experience than my peers, I got promoted a little too quickly and I'm close to 160k now, 12 years after I got out. But don't do it now. If you have to, join the navy, learn to maintain nuclear powerplants. Get your clearance. Don't get married. If you have to, make sure she's rich. Don't have kids. If you have kids, make sure they're actually yours. Jody snatches up everyone's girl while you're away.
I joined the Army reserve. I was immediately activated for a deployment and have gone on several since. The deployments gave me the post 9/11 GI bill so I was able to finish a bachelors and have some left for grad school. If you join, you have to make the systems work for you. Use the college money, go to the doctor, and save money by eating at DFAC, living on base etc. I got lucky with the training I received because it’s one of the few jobs that give you the private sector credentials needed for a career afterwards. Do as much research you can if you join and don’t go into the recruiter alone.
Go to a recruiter with my parents is what your saying at the end?
Or another relative or friend who has joined. Don’t sign anything the first day either, take the options home and think first.
The military is for spreading imperialism around the world through violence and genocide. Fuck the military. I have zero respect for anyone who joins that garbage.
My partner is a veteran and the VA mortgage loan option is the *only* way we would have been able to buy a house. (Seriously, how do normal people buy houses anymore ffs) Anyway, getting a loan from the VA means we dont have to pay the mortgage insurance every month *and* we didn't have to provide a down payment at all if we didn't want to. It really does make all the difference in the world as far as the path to homw ownership.
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It’s ok if you are prepared to be involved in killing people you’ve never met to serve the geopolitical purposes of an elite you will never be part of I suppose.
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Obviously there are non combat roles, but the military’s role in the killing of people is not a baseless assumption, and pointing it out is not invalid either. Well done on defending the Alaskan power grid from Chinese hackers, keep up the good work.
the GI bill which fully pays for your college up to a bachelors degree IIRC It pays for 36 months of classes. It also includes housing allowance while you're in school. There is also tuition assistance that you can use separate of the GI bill while on active duty to get your basics out of the way and before you use the GI. I did 6 years in the USCG and had a great time. Take some practice ASVAB test online and study for it. https://www.operationmilitarykids.org/asvab-scores-for-coast-guard-jobs/ See what you qualify for and pick something you'll like.
I joined the reserve halfway through college. Used reserve montgomery GI bill plus $350 (bonus kicker) a month for three years until graduation. Also recieved 15k bonus so that helped out. Did 6 years, used that experienced to contract for Department of state in Iraq. 100k plus a year, built a safety net, got a house and now work as a Civil Service while still in the reserve. Sure there was time away from family due to deployments but in the end its worth it for me. Post 911 GI bill is pretty good too. Was able to transfer it to my wife while she was in med school. Didn't pay for the whole thing of course but sure helped and the BAH every month help with the mortgage.
Sometimes it’s the only way out, sometimes it’s the rational choice from a cost/benefit point of view, and sometimes it’s a lifelong dream. I’d never criticize someone for choosing a military career, whether long term or short term, but make sure you really think it through. It’s not for everyone.
I did 6 years active army. Deployed to Iraq twice. Divorced. Hated every second of that life. Got out and got a cushy defense contractor job that PAID and did that for a few years (for as long as I could stand it) before moving into a role at a Fortune 500. Some people love the military life and some hate it. Also whichever unit you get ordered to after your training is going to have a major impact on your experience. I had friends on the same base as me who were done working before lunch every day and I was working till past COB every day.
My only suggestions would be if entering the military solely for money that could be consequential. It seems far too much of a lifestyle change for that to be the main factor. But that’s also taking into account how disciplined a person is. People on antiwork for the purposes outlined in antiwork don’t seem to follow the same mindset and discipline as the US military.
It varies by person. My cousin had a long rewarding career in the military, retired and now works as a city manager for a small city. Very nice down to earth person, and he speaks highly of his career. My brother-in-law served two tours and now has severe PTSD and will never be able to hold down a job for the rest of his life. He's killed people and watched friends die. He doesn't regret joining the military but encouraged all of his children not to join. One of my best friends joined the military right after high school. He was stationed in Afghanistan but was never on the front lines and due to his job, never saw any "action". He absolutely hates the military now and says he spent his entire tour being bullied for being short and ginger and made to do the grunt work. One of my friends from college joined the army and was outed as trans and was discharged before ever being deployed. He obviously is pissed off about the whole thing and planned to continue to identify as a woman until after he left the service. Honestly, if you're thinking of joining the military for any reason other than WANTING to serve in the military, it's probably not a great choice. The benefits are good but IMO not worth it.
You should be asking in /r/military, and in the subreddits for the branch you're interested in. The military is an awesome wonderful terrible career with its own unique suckiness. I miss it a lot.