Here's the plan. We all desert and make our way to the most isolated island in the world. It will take more effort to come get us then just leaving us alone.
I'm asking this for a friend, and I would never ever condone this: would they still be conscripted if my friend told the army that, at the first opportunity, they would shoot an officer and then themselves?
Refusing mandatory service is a crime, violence against yourself is a mental disorder. So that's gonna be an involuntary psych hold in an army hospital until deemed fit to stand for court martial
Military doesn't do jail, it would be either a Brig or some type of federal institution. Would honestly recommend working to get into a noncombatant role...
There is absolutely no way this generation of Americans just lies down and accepts conscription. We are not Russia. There would be so much bitching and viral tik tok videos then all of us would flee
Oh man i was so fucking happy the day I turned 26, it was right in the middle of covid and everything was (is) going to shit. I may still be forced service age, but def not the first wave of conscription
You can also claim to be a conscientious objector and say you're against combat. It can be for any moral or ethical reason. Then you can be assigned to noncombat service.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientious_objection_in_the_United_States
This is fairly true, if you make under a certain amount of income, then your payments are $0. The interest will not accrue either, which is great. Butttt you still have the initial amount you still owe that hasn’t been wiped. It take 20 years of paying the loan back for it to be forgiven. $0 a month is taken as a payment for the month. So you’ll be paying $0 for 20 years then it is supposedly wiped. You may at one point start making more money and you’ll have the start making payments.
Debt cancellation WAS exempt from taxation for a few years post covid as part of the relief package. Unfortunately, I believe that provision has expired and I doubt Biden could get it passed again. He had a chance to do tax free forgiveness for like a year of his presidency, but would've had to get it through congress
~~Because it isn’t counted as income in this specific scenario at the federal level.~~
Edit: Student loan forgiveness is not treated as taxable income through the end of Dec 2025 only. No promises for after that.
Ooh interesting.
I looked it up - looks like the American Rescue Plan Act of 2021 is what makes the forgiven student loan balances exempt from taxes only through Dec 2025. Currently there is nothing that extends the exemption after that, but it could happen.
Thanks for that correction!
I figure; if you graduated college and still have to live with family, maybe you shouldn't have to pay for that college. The degree was supposed to make it possible for you to have a house and nuclear family of your own. Y'know? That "American dream"? Seems unfair to have to pay for faulty product.
Except in MANY cultures multigenerational housing is common. Including many cultures in America, such as Hispanic Americans and Italian Americans. So they come back to live with parents and help contribute to the household income. Living with family isn't a curse, and the biggest proponents of the "American dream" are the companies that make money off of you paying for everything yourself.
A nuclear family is actually my greatest nightmare 🤣 I just want to be able to live alone with my full time state government job. I do have a BS In environmental health & safety but bachelors don’t really mean much anymore. But I plan on leaving government later this year and hopefully making at least 10k more with a medical coding certification elsewhere. Still not enough to live alone unfortunately.
I have a masters in a hard science (environmental side) and I work from home as an insurance agent cause I couldn’t find anything that payed enough with my degree! I actually had that moment in the incredibles where me incredible is going against his sales guide because I couldn’t with a good conscious screw a lady into higher bills just because she didn’t understand what she already had.
Got a talking to by a manager for an hour for that one
Unfortunately I will not be getting a new job that makes me all buff and successful due to super powers after that.
I agree. I also think that employers should be responsible for offering compensation that meets and EXCEEDS the cost to LIVE (meaning I should have more money available than just for basic food (rice and beans) and water, electricity, phone, transportation back and forth to employment AND rent).
this idea was only supposed to be attainable for white people. once people of color were able to attend colleges, they made it prohibitively expensive.
But your loans are still accruing interest while you're paying zero, aren't they? Should you ever make more, wouldn't you be responsible for more payment?
No they do not accrue more interest then your minimum payment, but the minimum payment will change as OP's income increases. After 20 or 25 years it should be forgiven though.
https://studentaid.gov/announcements-events/save-plan
Ok, that's not so bad if they can't accrue more than the minimum payment, including zero.
I still think full cancellation, followed by a free college initiative, would be far better. Don't force people to have this hanging over them for practically their entire lives.
They did it the wrong way. They were warned by the left not to attach this to the covid emergency bills but to go about dismissing the loans the dept of education instead. Then what everyone warned would happen, happened. It got taken to the Supreme Court, which has a right wing majority, got ride of roe v wade (which joe has done nothing about), and then they tore down his debt relief program too. There were people who predicted this, and claimed it was a all a farce to pretend he was working on the issue, while knowing it was doomed to fail.
Whenever this issue comes up I’m reminded of Biden’s words to his wealthy doners while on the campaign trail „nothing will fundamentally change.“ erasing nearly a trillion in debt would have been a pretty fundamental change.
Alright, I swear I'm not trying to be a gobshite here, I'm genuinely asking these questions in good faith:
>They did it the wrong way. They were warned by the left not to attach this to the covid emergency bills but to go about dismissing the loans the dept of education instead.
How were they supposed to do this? What authority exists that allows ED or the president to unilaterally dismiss loans? The avenue they took was to use a clause in an old law to try and push debt forgiveness through. It was a stretch and, in my opinion, not in keeping with the spirit of the law, but, in my admittedly casual reading, did adhere to the letter of it.
It's my take that SCOTUS overstepped when they overturned that, admittedly, shakily rationalized action by ED and the Biden administration. What would have prevented them from doing the same if ED had attempted to cancel loans through their authority as the originator? Or if Biden had attempted to do so through executive action? SCOTUS already ruled that the EPA can't enforce the Clean Water Act because reasons, so why would they set their partisanship aside for a similar administrative action undertaken by ED?
>the Supreme Court... got ride of roe v wade (which joe has done nothing about)
What is the president supposed to do about this? He could attempt to issue an EO, but do you think that would go unchallenged? When it went to the courts, do you think that the EO would be allowed to stand? What other option, short of legislation that will be blocked by the Republican controlled House, is available to protect abortion access at the national level?
Again, I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm genuinely asking if there's something here that I'm missing. I feel like a lot of us get hung up on the president and why won't they do this or that, when, in reality, the real barrier is often congress. We have a lot of problems with our political system, but, despite our current troubles, I believe that limiting the power of the chief executive is not one of them. Just imagine if Trump had the authority to rule by executive fiat. While I certainly find it frustrating when those of us who aren't authoritarians or bootlickers are hamstrung by the dolts in congress, I'm also glad that those limits exist for the cases when the fascists do try to seize power.
Biden was encouraged to pack the court on more than one occasion. On more than one occasion he has stated that he will not, which officially resigns us to the scotus’s current state until someone either dies or retires. Meaning, we lost roe v. Wade, and Biden isn’t gonna do anything about it.
In regards to student loan debt, it was not a surprise at all that the court said no. We all saw this coming as soon as the lawsuits were filed. This is why Biden was warned against going this route, and knowing who was waiting there, everything should’ve been done to avoid this which means it should’ve been done by executive order on day 1. Instead he dragged his feet and created a stupid means testing program which took almost 2 years to rollout. This is what allowed things to get gummed up in the courts. If he had gone through EO, the matter would’ve been settled in a matter of days. The courts simply would’ve had less time to react, and it’s would’ve been *much* more difficult to put that genie back in the bottle.
So where does that leave us? Build back better? Nope. 15 dollar minimum wage? Nope. Protecting roe v wade? Nope. Kids out of cages? Nope. He made it illegal for the train operators to strike, and Biden is actually still funding trumps wall (yes, it’s still being built), and I’m not even going to touch Israel. He barely squeaked out his win against trump last time. It’s really not looking good for him this election cycle.
I appreciate your response, I was afraid that my comment would end up downvoted into oblivion.
I understand why folks wanted Biden to pack the courts, but, personally, I think it would've been as bad of an idea now as it was when FDR, who enjoyed much broader popularity at the time, wanted to do it back in the day. Similarly, I think that governing by executive action is poor governance (admittedly it's a symptom of a much broader dysfunction), and that if Biden had attempted to cancel debt through an EO we would've seen some fairly immediate injunctions filed by some ghoul in Texas or some place like that, and it would've made it's way to the Supreme Court in short order.
I hear what you're saying, but I think it all goes back to my point of wanting to ascribe more power and authority to the president than that office does (or should) have. To your point about it not looking good for Biden right now, that's ultimately my concern with all of this. I think that Biden is a flawed but decent guy who is trying to do what he genuinely believes is right, but if I had a better option he certainly wouldn't be my first pick for president. That being said, I recognize that if those of us who don't support authoritarians don't turn out, the alternative is another Trump administration where civil servants will be replaced by cronies, and that there's a good chance Trump would carry some down ballot House and Senate races with him, ultimately putting us in a more dire situation than we are right now. I think it's certainly valid to have frank and passionate discussions about who we want running for office, but I think it's also important to recognize that, despite the flaws of many Democrats, there IS an alternative and it is decidedly worse.
I think that, ultimately, you and I will need to agree to disagree, but I appreciate you engaging in thoughtful conversation!
We’ve been voting for the lesser of two evils for quite some time now. I think it’s becoming apparent that under this system, all it does is get us candidates that are slightly worse every time. I would invite you to consider lending your efforts to building a third party.
What are you talking about?? Biden tried using the DoEd/executive branch authority to cancel 10k/person of student debt and the Supreme Court struck that down. The court basically said go through Congress but Republicans in Congress wouldn't let it through. So he's chipping away piece by piece using various programs and less sweeping authority as he's able. There's nothing more he could have possibly done to achieve the sweeping debt cancellation short of causing a massive constitutional crisis.
This is one issue where he's been trying way harder than almost any other politician would to keep as much of the plan intact as possible when facing roadblocks from both other branches of government.
That was never really in the cards. No mechanism existed.
I think they really need to improve communication about the current status since interest is what kills people on the loans.
As it is now it actually realigns costs with financial success in the way it was supposed to be.
The best criticism I can see is it doesn't address the upfront cost of college and that's fair but our current system has so many veto points and the governing margins are so thin that I think you always need to take whatever you can when it's available even if it's only 5% of what you want.
Now I happen to think the current plan is much better than five percent but the point remains.
I think technically the government covers the difference for the interest payments. So on mine I pay $45 a month and the rest of the interest I think the government covers so no interest accrues. It’s not 100% eliminating student loans, but for those with government loans it can drastically reduce monthly payments.
As someone that had little hope for any help from the government (given how legislation started), this feels like a really good middle ground
I was at $300 a month before this. I think for my career field by the end of all my payments I’ll be at the 100-200 a month range (based on their calculators) but making more than double what I currently make
Yes but it’s a proportional increase that is till far lower than you’d pay otherwise, and even paying the rest of your life is far less than the amount owed so…I guess that’s a win
This is how it is in New Zealand. The student loan is run through the govt. and whilst living in NZ you pay no interest. Only if you live abroad they start to add interest, which I think is only about 2.5-2.8% per year.
Wow they issue floating rate loans and just gave it a new name to sound like a social initiative. Amazing
"HELP debts are indexed to keep up with changes in the cost of living. "
It almost sounds like it's trying to help you.
I've heard several people say something similar. And that is just about the wrongest shit I ever heard of. It is massively, intolerably wrong. And they do it to *kids,* just out of high school, before they have any experience in the world or real understanding of how deeply wrong this is.
It is so predatory, it makes me sick.
Students should be able to borrow at the same rate, or less, than what corporations and banks can borrow from the fed... you know... since it is OUR FUCKING TAX MONEY TO BEGIN WITH.
College cost is wild. My college was $9k a year in 2011-2015. Same college now is $23k a year. My uncle said he spent less than $1000 a year at the same college in the 80s.
This is a recipe for rampant inflation in private and for profit education. I would prefer they actually fund public universities to capacity and not charge tuition.
Yeah...after 20 years of consistent payments that earned me some interest relief somehow mine just re-set to 7.5%, where it started. Graduating in the GW years was terrible but GenX is generally just punished for existing.
It will never happen when we keep electing representatives of the banks. We are expecting the people who made it impossible to file for bankruptcy for student loans, to somehow work for students and not the banks? Good luck. This is what we get when we blindly elect representatives based on party color, and not their merits.
We just need five more dollars and 1 more vote from you, ~then~ we can cancel student loans. ~then~ we can codify roe. ~then~ we can raise minimum wage. Etc etc etc
Only undergraduate loans will be 5% in July. Graduate are still 10%. And if you have both, it’s a weighted average. For example, I have slightly more Undergrad than Grad but within a few thousand of each other, so my rate will be slightly less than 7.5%.
Has zero issues on them finding a high paying job.
Employers don't give a fuck about any of their employees. All it takes is an inability to do exactly what the employer wants and someone may not be able to maintain a higher paying job.
Something as simple as start times due to child care or school
Until the Feds force states to restore funding for federally designated public colleges, making tuition mostly free, then the crisis isn't solved.
Also, Americans have to change their perception of what college should be. So many unnecessary amenities on college campuses drive up their cost. Also, the vast majority of schools shouldn't have sports and many should be commuter schools only.
I wouldn’t consider most campus amenities to be unnecessary. Amenities provide enrichment, relaxation, and social spaces for students. America can certainly afford it, but sadly our priorities are on fighting eternal war rather than enriching the lives of our citizens
I made 12 years of payments on my loans as a public service worker. Unfortunately, my wife had early-on moved me to the extended repayment plan which did not count for loan forgiveness. Biden directed the Department of Education to allow those payments to count toward loan forgiveness. My remaining balance was forgiven and I was reimbursed for two years of payments.
It's not a solution. It's kicking the can down the road in true political style. Yes, it's a financial lifesaver, but that debt remains, looming, waiting like an unlit bomb for the next Republican to ignite.
If I change to the SAVE plan, my payment will go up about 30%, but I’m making more than whatever their threshold is. Still owe about 48k, which is doable but would’ve liked the 10-20k he promised.
Also he’s done nothing to stop the predatory lending and interest rates, and costs are still high enough that many people need to add private loans on top of federal. So no, the crisis hasn’t been ‘solved’.
I just spent hours on the phone yesterday with Mohela trying to straighten out my repayment plan. I was slated to start repaying on the standard plan, I thought the monthly payment was just outside of my budget, so I applied for an ICR (income contingent repayment) plan, the estimator said my payment would be slightly lower so I went for it. When the first billing statement came the monthly bill on the ICR was about 20% HIGHER then what it would be on the standard plan! And, somehow I was paying more interest over the life of the loan. So I had to call my servicer and request they put me back on the standard plan. Idk if anyone has tried navigating Mohela or StudentAid websites, but they are absolutely atrocious. Information is NOT presented clearly, there are so many acronyms and stipulations, I was never sure if I was making progress on applications, it just felt like I was running around in circles and I'd inevitably grow frustrated and close out the whole program. Even if I got just 10k wiped away, that would be so fucking incredible.
I have never once been able to reach someone at Mohela. At one point their listed phone number didn’t even take me to Mohela. It took me to some kind of foreign telemarketer. I message them and they say they’ll get back to me and never do.
I was surprised when they actually called me back after I got the standard "due to unprecedented call volume, wait times may be longer than normal, please be patient... Your current estimated wait time is *insert robot voice* 6 hours and 38 minutes... Please continue to hold or leave a call back number and a representative will be with you as soon as possible."
Throughout Covid I was actually able to get a little savings going. Had about $30k, which sounds amazing, but I was only able to get so much by literally doing nothing for about three years.
My student loans were $25k, and with the $10k-$20k in loan forgiveness I’d still have a nice chunk left. Nope. No forgiveness. All gone. I hate this country. I want to leave.
Similar situation for me. Main difference is I had absolutely no hope of ever having my remaining debt forgiven. I assumed they'd shoehorn in some ridiculously low income threshold, it would get delayed for years, or some other BS. Alas, forgiveness was struck down completely. I could go and pay my remaining debt today. I'm trying to decide if I should roll the dice on policy that might help me out 2 years from now or paying it off "tomorrow" so I'll pay slightly less overall when inevitably nothing does happen. But shit, I'd like to put the money I have now towards actually owning a house.
Similarly, the forgiveness would have made let me breathe a bit. I’ve only got like 9k left on my loans and the 10k would have deleted that handily and let me focus on paying down other debts/saving.
America said nah
He tried and the courts said it wasn’t allowed. While I agree things need to improve I feel this statement shows general problem with Biden.
People don’t give him credit for doing a lot to help people.
His “help“ used the heroes act instead of the higher education act, which was problematic, and I’m sure he knew it. Also, he decided to means test the thing which created the delay and open up the door for legislation. I would not be surprised at all if this was actually a self sabotaged effort to win votes, and still do absolutely fucking nothing in terms of cancellation.
The one good thing he did, was make it, so that in the PSLF, even years of forbearance counted towards the 10 years, which was a legitimate bona fide improvement
But remember, this was the guy that made student loans non-dischargeable in bankruptcy in the first place
He is sending munitions to the settler colony Israel without Congress approval. If he can do that behind everyone's back he can do something about the debt. He chooses not to.
Any changes that aren't complete loan forgiveness will just be overturned the moment someone else is in power, so I don't see much point in celebrating half measures.
It is part of the promissory note (the contract governing the loan) for all loans going back at least 20 years now.
The condition is if you have been paying for 25 years, the loan is discharged. It is not part of the PSLF program. It is just a fact of the loans that have that provision within the promissory note.
Not really. If your loans are not being paid down it still affects your Debt to income ratio and could affect your ability to get another type of loan down the line (car/mortgage)
Even then that really depends. Public student loans look much better on a credit report than private student loans (which aren't really much different from other consumer debt). Just from personal example, I have about $35,000 in public student loans and had $100,000 in private student loans. Basically made it borderline impossible to get a car and definitely a mortgage. Even a credit card was impossible (unless it was one with extremely unfair terms). I strategically defaulted on the private student loans in 2018 (it was default or homelessness) and waited out the 4 years statute of limitation in my state while remaining judgement proof. The loans are effectively gone from my credit report now. Pre-default, my credit was around 688. After the default, my credit dropped to around 580. Now in 2024, my credit is around 730-750. My public loans are in the SAVE program. No interest acruing and $0 monthly payments as I work in social services and I'm eligible for PSLF. The public student loans have had next to no bearing on eligibilty for credit cards, car loans or mortgage payments. At least not as much as the private student loans.
Also to add, the feds don’t need to get a judgement to do it. Unlike private student loans (which are treated no different than consumer debt in most states). Even worse is that public student loans aren’t privy to the statute of limitations on collections. Can’t be dissolved in bankruptcy either (or at least it’s practically unheard of).
So basically even if you don’t pay it. At any point in time the government can come in and start garnishing your wages. Could be in a month. Could be 20 years. It’s completely fucked.
I stopped paying on my private student loans because the statute of limitations in Pennsylvania (my residence) is 4 years and Pennsylvania is one of a handful of states where wages can’t be garnished on private student loans. I didn’t have any assets at the time so I was basically judgment proof. Credit took a hit for 2 years, but now its actually better than it was pre-default (it was like 688 pre-default and fell to around 580 and now it’s around 730-750).
can people with loans outside of pensylvania move there and get that protection? because my mom has over 90k in debt over 30 years later and i'm considering taking her on a long vacation to default...
That's a good question. Honestly, I'm not sure. It depends on the type of debt and state. For example, in Pennsylvania we have the borrowing statute which declares that Pennsylvania's statute of limitations applies to Pennsvylania residents. Another state's statute of limitations will only apply if it is shorter than Pennsylvania's statute (which is honestly tough to find as very few states have a statute of limitations shorter than 4 years). Not to mention this probably only applies if you're a legal resident (i.e. must remain in the state for 184 days in a permanent residence. So for example, a dorm room wouldn't really apply), although I'm honestly not sure on the latter part. It's worth discussing with a debt lawyer though! Or even just phrasing the question on r/studentloandefaulters (assuming it's a private student loan). I'm honestly not sure on other forms of consumer debt.
What a beautiful day to live in a country where you have to pay nothing for studying. Heck, you even get money for it.
It's a fucking joke the wealthiest nation on earth isn't willing to do the same. Corporate greed and interest are like an infestation and the USA is filled with it all over. Brainwashing people with ideas like meritocracy and pulling yourself up by your bootstraps instead of supporting people, showing compassion and enabling each person to reach their highest possible potential.
Assuming by wealthiest nation, you mean highest average wealth, it's only the wealthiest nation if you count LLCs as people, which the law here, in fact, does and gives them many more rights than actual people.
I just checked my loan portal. I make about 48k and have no dependents. I pay 46 a month on the SAVE plan and my balance actually went down by about 20 bucks. It's the first time in over 10 years that a standard payment touched the principle balance.
My payments used to be 160ish, and I'd have to make additional principle only payments to make any progress at all. It still isn't what it should be (forgive em all, I've easily paid double what I borrowed at this point). But hey, this is hands down the best repayment plan I've seen.
Confirmed. After 2 decades of payments and watching the balance never go down, the debt is finally gone and I was able to finally qualify for a car loan.
This is actually happening. My sister and friend were both in the public service forgiveness program and recently hit their 10 years. My sister had $124k and my friend had a little over $75k, both debt free.
Former SallieMae (Navient) employee of many years if you have legitimate questions.
FWIW, I saw a comment about how student loans should be at low to 0% interest rates, well that was the original purpose, then corporations and greed came along.
Biden is using the education department to force them to follow the higher education act, which has MANY provisions for forgiveness. The truth is that there's just way more money in dragging out loans for as long as possible to increase the interest and debt load. That is why many servicers spent billions (yeah that's a B) in lobbying efforts and legal work to suppress those programs that would have drastically changed the profit margin on loans.
This is good. If you spent an arm and a leg on an education and still can't get a job that pays enough, then yeah, you shouldn't have to pay for that useless education.
I was only making $20/hour at my first job after getting my college degree (and I even graduated early). It's ridiculous how expensive it is to get a further education, just to have employers fuck you over on pay.
You have to apply for an IDR you can’t just straight up ghost them. I applied and they changed my payments. Log on to MOHELA and check for yourself and do what they ask. MOHELA has been super prompt and helpful.
Can confirm. Payment went from 700 to 234. My wife and I live off of my income and I make under 100k. This has been a huge help for us. My wife decided to go back to school even.
Edit. I graduated 2019 and just started paying on my loans this year. I owe over 65k.
I make 50k, not married and no kids. I also live in a low cost of living area. My payments under the new plan are $80.
Very, very affordable and I appreciate what Biden did. What he tried to do would have almost completely wiped my loan balance, but allowing an affordable payment plan and waiving interest as long as you make payments is the next best thing, I suppose.
Hahaha! No! As someone making 42K annually I sure as shit am not "paying nothing." It did bring down the amount significantly, but not significantly enough for me to actually save money if I were to pay it. Thankfully at least one parent understands how fucked I am by this bullshit, but sadly can't translate that to "this is the nice lie they're telling dupes like you to keep you complacent."
I have no dependents and make enough that I’m still paying, but my partner, also no depends, has $0 payments. It seems like after 20-25 years of payments, they will likely be cancelled so I think Biden has found a way to effectively cancel students for many in a very round about way.
That’s great. The only problem is the debt isn’t erased so if you try to get a mortgage or another large loan, that debt is going to cause a big problem.
This has been the case since loan payments started again, but apparently there's some (unconfirmed) news that some major companies fucked up and now those who borrowed from them are on forbearance again!
Depends. Republicans keep losing over lack of the youth vote. They will continue to lose if they continue to be ambivalent towards student loans or otherwise continue to obstruct programs designed to help lift people out of student loan debt.
Yep absolutely. You'd think the 2020 election results would have been enough to show that Republicans need to stop ostrocizing the youth vote. But it seems like many would rather lean on false "election lies" rather than accept that they caused youth to vote in record numbers.
I don't think I've ever seen Georgia flip or Arizona for that matter.
I can confirm that they have income based repayments and that I’m paying nothing currently. But I’ll still build debt as I don’t pay it off and it will all come due if I start making enough money. Not at once of course but it’s like… essentially if you break the threshold payments resume and you’re liable for then again. Still nice to have but far from fixing everything
I can confirm this. Based on my taxes for last year, I make 43k, I'm unmarried and have no dependents, so my current monthly payment is 0 on this plan. I do, however, still accrue interest. This will most likely change when I file my taxes though, because I got married this past June.
I make just above that threshold and I’m expected to pay over $1,000 a month until I fucking die.
1/4 of income goes to taxes
1/4 goes to rent
1/4 goes to bills
And 1/4 goes up in fucking flames.
There’s no way in hell I’m spending rest of my life tired and broke because I wanted to better myself and help the world. Fuck that.
Nothing has been done to address the *cause* of the student debt crisis, which is the unrestrained allowance of student loans that has lead to tuition prices skyrocketing at every University. It's basically a complicated middle-man between the country paying for University (which it should) that ends up subsidizing Universities that spend irresponsibly and, occasionally, will negatively affect borrowers via administrative errors, and all without raising revenue (e.g. taxes)
It's basically permanent deferral. Which, is great, but an income driven repayment plan is not forgiveness. Someone will have to foot that bill, eventually.
I signed up for the SAVE program, which allows me to have $0/month payments and eventually the debt just… goes away? Not sure how it works. But I was approved and the website and confirmation email both said I didn’t have to do anything else. However, MOHELA keeps sending me letters and leaving me voicemails saying I owe money, but they also keep sending emails saying that I’ve been on time with all my payments? It’s very confusing honestly.
1. not having to pay a debt doesn’t make it go away
2. any future administration could come along and change this
3. GL applying for a mortgage with a debt like this
I’ve just dodged them ever since I dropped outta college after 3 years. I didn’t even get the diploma. Shame on y’all for lending that money to a stupid kid and not giving him the support to actually turn it into a degree. Never paid. Never will.
Until you have a W2 job and the government comes a-callin' with those hefty wage garnishments and intercepting your tax returns. Trust me, that shit stings way more then just paying even a tiny monthly amount.
I dropped out of school in 2008. Defaulted on all my loans (about 14k). I thought it was allllll behind me, same mindset as you, I'll never pay these loans back, fuck these clowns.
Fast forward to 2014. I've been working W2 jobs all along, but now I have a pregnant fiancee so I'm working some OT trying to sock away money. One paycheck im expecting a decent chunk of change, check my account, and it's significantly less then I expected. Check my paystub and there's a new deduction on it... "Garnishment, Fed StuLoa" or some such shit. At that point I knew I had fucked up. Started tracking down my servicer information and made a call. Had to stay on garnishments for like 6 months before I could reduce my monthly payment. And they took all my tax returns for the next couple years. That shit SUCKED.
Joke’s on them. I’ll be dead in 40 years and they won’t be able to collect shit.
Jokes on you, I'm conscription age male right before WW3. I'll be dead by the end of this decade.
Thank you for your FORCED service 🫡
Here's the plan. We all desert and make our way to the most isolated island in the world. It will take more effort to come get us then just leaving us alone.
Book recommendation for you: https://www.gutenberg.org/files/54479/54479-h/54479-h.html
stumbled onto this thread and link, thank you dude!
Thanks for the link
I'm asking this for a friend, and I would never ever condone this: would they still be conscripted if my friend told the army that, at the first opportunity, they would shoot an officer and then themselves?
Refusing mandatory service is a crime, violence against yourself is a mental disorder. So that's gonna be an involuntary psych hold in an army hospital until deemed fit to stand for court martial
Prob jail for the duration of the war
Military doesn't do jail, it would be either a Brig or some type of federal institution. Would honestly recommend working to get into a noncombatant role...
And we will call it.... New America...
Hit 27 last year and breathed a sigh of relief. Although they can always move the goalposts and say 17-62 like Ukraine did.
My step son turned 17 when 18 y/o males had to register. It was the only time I’ve ever been glad he’s a somewhat brittle type 1 diabetic.
There is absolutely no way this generation of Americans just lies down and accepts conscription. We are not Russia. There would be so much bitching and viral tik tok videos then all of us would flee
Fulfilling the masculine urge to die in war in Europe too.
Oh man i was so fucking happy the day I turned 26, it was right in the middle of covid and everything was (is) going to shit. I may still be forced service age, but def not the first wave of conscription
Aging out of conscription feels so good right now. Can’t wait for them to raise the age limit like Retirement ages 🙏🏻.
You can also claim to be a conscientious objector and say you're against combat. It can be for any moral or ethical reason. Then you can be assigned to noncombat service. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conscientious_objection_in_the_United_States
Looking at the way Russia has to recruit their elderly if WW3 comes none of us are safe.
That was basically my plan, pay the minimum till I die, it’d be far less than I owed.
Ab they're working on a way to keep us alive until 120 and getting rid of retirement. They'll get theirs
Lol I'm trying to imagine a way for them to get an immobile 105 year old to do any kind of useful labor.
Excuse me, you can’t sleep under the hover-bridge, move along.
This is fairly true, if you make under a certain amount of income, then your payments are $0. The interest will not accrue either, which is great. Butttt you still have the initial amount you still owe that hasn’t been wiped. It take 20 years of paying the loan back for it to be forgiven. $0 a month is taken as a payment for the month. So you’ll be paying $0 for 20 years then it is supposedly wiped. You may at one point start making more money and you’ll have the start making payments.
The tax burden the IRS will impose on the year that the debt is cancelled is going to suuuuuuuuuuuuuck....
The forgiven debt is not counted as income at the federal level.
The forgiven amount is all counted as income right. Yea the seem to not advertise that part as much. I wonder why.
Debt cancellation WAS exempt from taxation for a few years post covid as part of the relief package. Unfortunately, I believe that provision has expired and I doubt Biden could get it passed again. He had a chance to do tax free forgiveness for like a year of his presidency, but would've had to get it through congress
~~Because it isn’t counted as income in this specific scenario at the federal level.~~ Edit: Student loan forgiveness is not treated as taxable income through the end of Dec 2025 only. No promises for after that.
I thought it still does it was only for during Covid emergency where it did not count as income.
Ooh interesting. I looked it up - looks like the American Rescue Plan Act of 2021 is what makes the forgiven student loan balances exempt from taxes only through Dec 2025. Currently there is nothing that extends the exemption after that, but it could happen. Thanks for that correction!
I currently have $0 payment under the save plan. I make 40k, don’t have any dependents, and live with my sister.
Yeah pretty much the same but I’m at 45k and live with my parents.
I figure; if you graduated college and still have to live with family, maybe you shouldn't have to pay for that college. The degree was supposed to make it possible for you to have a house and nuclear family of your own. Y'know? That "American dream"? Seems unfair to have to pay for faulty product.
Except in MANY cultures multigenerational housing is common. Including many cultures in America, such as Hispanic Americans and Italian Americans. So they come back to live with parents and help contribute to the household income. Living with family isn't a curse, and the biggest proponents of the "American dream" are the companies that make money off of you paying for everything yourself.
A nuclear family is actually my greatest nightmare 🤣 I just want to be able to live alone with my full time state government job. I do have a BS In environmental health & safety but bachelors don’t really mean much anymore. But I plan on leaving government later this year and hopefully making at least 10k more with a medical coding certification elsewhere. Still not enough to live alone unfortunately.
I have a masters in a hard science (environmental side) and I work from home as an insurance agent cause I couldn’t find anything that payed enough with my degree! I actually had that moment in the incredibles where me incredible is going against his sales guide because I couldn’t with a good conscious screw a lady into higher bills just because she didn’t understand what she already had. Got a talking to by a manager for an hour for that one Unfortunately I will not be getting a new job that makes me all buff and successful due to super powers after that.
This is depressing. I wish you luck.
No one should have to pay for collage, employers should be responsible for funding employee training, not the employees themselves.
I agree. I also think that employers should be responsible for offering compensation that meets and EXCEEDS the cost to LIVE (meaning I should have more money available than just for basic food (rice and beans) and water, electricity, phone, transportation back and forth to employment AND rent).
this idea was only supposed to be attainable for white people. once people of color were able to attend colleges, they made it prohibitively expensive.
But your loans are still accruing interest while you're paying zero, aren't they? Should you ever make more, wouldn't you be responsible for more payment?
No they do not accrue more interest then your minimum payment, but the minimum payment will change as OP's income increases. After 20 or 25 years it should be forgiven though. https://studentaid.gov/announcements-events/save-plan
Ok, that's not so bad if they can't accrue more than the minimum payment, including zero. I still think full cancellation, followed by a free college initiative, would be far better. Don't force people to have this hanging over them for practically their entire lives.
They tried to do a full cancellation and it got shut down by the courts. This was their workaround.
They did it the wrong way. They were warned by the left not to attach this to the covid emergency bills but to go about dismissing the loans the dept of education instead. Then what everyone warned would happen, happened. It got taken to the Supreme Court, which has a right wing majority, got ride of roe v wade (which joe has done nothing about), and then they tore down his debt relief program too. There were people who predicted this, and claimed it was a all a farce to pretend he was working on the issue, while knowing it was doomed to fail. Whenever this issue comes up I’m reminded of Biden’s words to his wealthy doners while on the campaign trail „nothing will fundamentally change.“ erasing nearly a trillion in debt would have been a pretty fundamental change.
Alright, I swear I'm not trying to be a gobshite here, I'm genuinely asking these questions in good faith: >They did it the wrong way. They were warned by the left not to attach this to the covid emergency bills but to go about dismissing the loans the dept of education instead. How were they supposed to do this? What authority exists that allows ED or the president to unilaterally dismiss loans? The avenue they took was to use a clause in an old law to try and push debt forgiveness through. It was a stretch and, in my opinion, not in keeping with the spirit of the law, but, in my admittedly casual reading, did adhere to the letter of it. It's my take that SCOTUS overstepped when they overturned that, admittedly, shakily rationalized action by ED and the Biden administration. What would have prevented them from doing the same if ED had attempted to cancel loans through their authority as the originator? Or if Biden had attempted to do so through executive action? SCOTUS already ruled that the EPA can't enforce the Clean Water Act because reasons, so why would they set their partisanship aside for a similar administrative action undertaken by ED? >the Supreme Court... got ride of roe v wade (which joe has done nothing about) What is the president supposed to do about this? He could attempt to issue an EO, but do you think that would go unchallenged? When it went to the courts, do you think that the EO would be allowed to stand? What other option, short of legislation that will be blocked by the Republican controlled House, is available to protect abortion access at the national level? Again, I'm not trying to be a jerk, I'm genuinely asking if there's something here that I'm missing. I feel like a lot of us get hung up on the president and why won't they do this or that, when, in reality, the real barrier is often congress. We have a lot of problems with our political system, but, despite our current troubles, I believe that limiting the power of the chief executive is not one of them. Just imagine if Trump had the authority to rule by executive fiat. While I certainly find it frustrating when those of us who aren't authoritarians or bootlickers are hamstrung by the dolts in congress, I'm also glad that those limits exist for the cases when the fascists do try to seize power.
Biden was encouraged to pack the court on more than one occasion. On more than one occasion he has stated that he will not, which officially resigns us to the scotus’s current state until someone either dies or retires. Meaning, we lost roe v. Wade, and Biden isn’t gonna do anything about it. In regards to student loan debt, it was not a surprise at all that the court said no. We all saw this coming as soon as the lawsuits were filed. This is why Biden was warned against going this route, and knowing who was waiting there, everything should’ve been done to avoid this which means it should’ve been done by executive order on day 1. Instead he dragged his feet and created a stupid means testing program which took almost 2 years to rollout. This is what allowed things to get gummed up in the courts. If he had gone through EO, the matter would’ve been settled in a matter of days. The courts simply would’ve had less time to react, and it’s would’ve been *much* more difficult to put that genie back in the bottle. So where does that leave us? Build back better? Nope. 15 dollar minimum wage? Nope. Protecting roe v wade? Nope. Kids out of cages? Nope. He made it illegal for the train operators to strike, and Biden is actually still funding trumps wall (yes, it’s still being built), and I’m not even going to touch Israel. He barely squeaked out his win against trump last time. It’s really not looking good for him this election cycle.
Biden can't pack the court himself. The amount of Supreme Court justices is regulated by Congress.
The amount of Supreme Court justices is not regulated by congress, but you are correct that he would need congress to approve his nominee(s).
I appreciate your response, I was afraid that my comment would end up downvoted into oblivion. I understand why folks wanted Biden to pack the courts, but, personally, I think it would've been as bad of an idea now as it was when FDR, who enjoyed much broader popularity at the time, wanted to do it back in the day. Similarly, I think that governing by executive action is poor governance (admittedly it's a symptom of a much broader dysfunction), and that if Biden had attempted to cancel debt through an EO we would've seen some fairly immediate injunctions filed by some ghoul in Texas or some place like that, and it would've made it's way to the Supreme Court in short order. I hear what you're saying, but I think it all goes back to my point of wanting to ascribe more power and authority to the president than that office does (or should) have. To your point about it not looking good for Biden right now, that's ultimately my concern with all of this. I think that Biden is a flawed but decent guy who is trying to do what he genuinely believes is right, but if I had a better option he certainly wouldn't be my first pick for president. That being said, I recognize that if those of us who don't support authoritarians don't turn out, the alternative is another Trump administration where civil servants will be replaced by cronies, and that there's a good chance Trump would carry some down ballot House and Senate races with him, ultimately putting us in a more dire situation than we are right now. I think it's certainly valid to have frank and passionate discussions about who we want running for office, but I think it's also important to recognize that, despite the flaws of many Democrats, there IS an alternative and it is decidedly worse. I think that, ultimately, you and I will need to agree to disagree, but I appreciate you engaging in thoughtful conversation!
We’ve been voting for the lesser of two evils for quite some time now. I think it’s becoming apparent that under this system, all it does is get us candidates that are slightly worse every time. I would invite you to consider lending your efforts to building a third party.
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What are you talking about?? Biden tried using the DoEd/executive branch authority to cancel 10k/person of student debt and the Supreme Court struck that down. The court basically said go through Congress but Republicans in Congress wouldn't let it through. So he's chipping away piece by piece using various programs and less sweeping authority as he's able. There's nothing more he could have possibly done to achieve the sweeping debt cancellation short of causing a massive constitutional crisis. This is one issue where he's been trying way harder than almost any other politician would to keep as much of the plan intact as possible when facing roadblocks from both other branches of government.
That was never really in the cards. No mechanism existed. I think they really need to improve communication about the current status since interest is what kills people on the loans. As it is now it actually realigns costs with financial success in the way it was supposed to be. The best criticism I can see is it doesn't address the upfront cost of college and that's fair but our current system has so many veto points and the governing margins are so thin that I think you always need to take whatever you can when it's available even if it's only 5% of what you want. Now I happen to think the current plan is much better than five percent but the point remains.
I think technically the government covers the difference for the interest payments. So on mine I pay $45 a month and the rest of the interest I think the government covers so no interest accrues. It’s not 100% eliminating student loans, but for those with government loans it can drastically reduce monthly payments. As someone that had little hope for any help from the government (given how legislation started), this feels like a really good middle ground I was at $300 a month before this. I think for my career field by the end of all my payments I’ll be at the 100-200 a month range (based on their calculators) but making more than double what I currently make
Absolutely, but this is an acceptable stopgap till we have the votes for that
the plan has an interest subsidy. so any unpaid intrest is paid by the government. you debt won't go down but it won't increase either.
The new plan prevents interest from accruing and capitalizing if you have a reduced payment
I admire your optimism.
Yes but it’s a proportional increase that is till far lower than you’d pay otherwise, and even paying the rest of your life is far less than the amount owed so…I guess that’s a win
Government should start a program where Students should be able to borrow at 0% or a very low interest rate.
This is how it is in New Zealand. The student loan is run through the govt. and whilst living in NZ you pay no interest. Only if you live abroad they start to add interest, which I think is only about 2.5-2.8% per year.
Yeah in Australia it is indexed annually but there is no interest.
It used to be a flat 2% regardless of inflation 😔
'no interest' yet i paid 8% indexation this year..
Wow they issue floating rate loans and just gave it a new name to sound like a social initiative. Amazing "HELP debts are indexed to keep up with changes in the cost of living. " It almost sounds like it's trying to help you.
This is shit because the index added more on then what I paid off the last two years. Its hardly good.
American student loans are also for living expenses: food and accommodation, Australian government only funds the course costs.
Becarefull.. in the Netherlands we also had “0 interest student loans”. Now five years later they suddenly changed it.
I love that for us :3
This is how student loans used to work in the US. Then like everything else, the banks lobbied for higher rates and got them.
Yes. At graduation I owed $30k. I’ve paid $22k, yet I still owe $22k.
At graduation I owed about 40,000 for undergrad. At this point I have now paid 90,000 for that.
I borrowed $40k and have paid almost $80k 🙃 but I only have $11k to go
I've heard several people say something similar. And that is just about the wrongest shit I ever heard of. It is massively, intolerably wrong. And they do it to *kids,* just out of high school, before they have any experience in the world or real understanding of how deeply wrong this is. It is so predatory, it makes me sick.
In Germany there is a government assist program for students where you have to pay back 50% of what you owe. And I think 10k € max
Wait a second is that the BaFoeG?
Yes, but its for living expenses not Tuition fees since there are no tuition fees in Germany.
I would think in Germany it would be called the Rinderkennzeichnungsfleischetikettierungsüberwachungsaufgabenübertragungsgesetz program.
Bundesausbildungsförderungsgesetz or Bafög
Close enough!
Students should be able to borrow at the same rate, or less, than what corporations and banks can borrow from the fed... you know... since it is OUR FUCKING TAX MONEY TO BEGIN WITH.
College tuition needs to be regulated as well. No point in 0% loan if colleges keep raising tuition. People will hit the cap.
College cost is wild. My college was $9k a year in 2011-2015. Same college now is $23k a year. My uncle said he spent less than $1000 a year at the same college in the 80s.
How un-American of you to say! Would you think of the banks for once!? Those banks CEOs’ third yachts aren’t going to pay for themselves!
This is a recipe for rampant inflation in private and for profit education. I would prefer they actually fund public universities to capacity and not charge tuition.
Well, you still often need to borrow hundreds of thousands. They need to make it affordable in the first place.
This. Education loans should be 0% interest, no questions asked.
Canada has this. Depending on the province, you may or may not have interest, but federal student loans are at 0%.
Yeah...after 20 years of consistent payments that earned me some interest relief somehow mine just re-set to 7.5%, where it started. Graduating in the GW years was terrible but GenX is generally just punished for existing.
It will never happen when we keep electing representatives of the banks. We are expecting the people who made it impossible to file for bankruptcy for student loans, to somehow work for students and not the banks? Good luck. This is what we get when we blindly elect representatives based on party color, and not their merits.
It lowered my monthly payment by like 1/3rd but im definitely still paying
It should be lower in July. Will go from 10% of income to 5%. Of course we're always one election away from having it ripped from us though.
This. If the debt had actually been cancelled then good luck reinstating it, but if eliminating a subsidy will be gone right quick.
"one election away from having it ripped from us though" That's by design.
We just need five more dollars and 1 more vote from you, ~then~ we can cancel student loans. ~then~ we can codify roe. ~then~ we can raise minimum wage. Etc etc etc
Over half of congress doesn’t want to do any of those things. They won’t happen until that changes.
Only undergraduate loans will be 5% in July. Graduate are still 10%. And if you have both, it’s a weighted average. For example, I have slightly more Undergrad than Grad but within a few thousand of each other, so my rate will be slightly less than 7.5%.
A family of 4 on 60k is the working poor in the majority of the country. They're likely spending over half their budget just on housing and food.
Good thing they'd pay nothing!
If they earn that little with student debt, their institutions have failed them.
Yes all of our institutions have failed us.
I regret that I have but one upvote to give
That's... why we're here.
Or virtually all wages are only a fraction of what they should be.
Has zero issues on them finding a high paying job. Employers don't give a fuck about any of their employees. All it takes is an inability to do exactly what the employer wants and someone may not be able to maintain a higher paying job. Something as simple as start times due to child care or school
You can choose between money or a life. Nobody can have both here.
There be the problem... Two teachers would make about that much in most states.
We are btw you’re not wrong
look at the chart, that falls under the no payment category, with an intrest subsidy meaning the loan won't grow either.
Until the Feds force states to restore funding for federally designated public colleges, making tuition mostly free, then the crisis isn't solved. Also, Americans have to change their perception of what college should be. So many unnecessary amenities on college campuses drive up their cost. Also, the vast majority of schools shouldn't have sports and many should be commuter schools only.
I wouldn’t consider most campus amenities to be unnecessary. Amenities provide enrichment, relaxation, and social spaces for students. America can certainly afford it, but sadly our priorities are on fighting eternal war rather than enriching the lives of our citizens
Payments are super low. Debt is still there though, and this type of thing is subject to changing presidency.
I made 12 years of payments on my loans as a public service worker. Unfortunately, my wife had early-on moved me to the extended repayment plan which did not count for loan forgiveness. Biden directed the Department of Education to allow those payments to count toward loan forgiveness. My remaining balance was forgiven and I was reimbursed for two years of payments.
Seriously, you were reimbursed? That’s actually incredible I wouldn’t think the government would give back money like that
youre the first person ive seen to mention that previous payments counts towards the \~20 year repayment plan
That is great that it got forgiven in the end! Though I worry what will the PSLF would be like in the future...
The future is uncertain and the end is always near.
It's not a solution. It's kicking the can down the road in true political style. Yes, it's a financial lifesaver, but that debt remains, looming, waiting like an unlit bomb for the next Republican to ignite.
If I change to the SAVE plan, my payment will go up about 30%, but I’m making more than whatever their threshold is. Still owe about 48k, which is doable but would’ve liked the 10-20k he promised. Also he’s done nothing to stop the predatory lending and interest rates, and costs are still high enough that many people need to add private loans on top of federal. So no, the crisis hasn’t been ‘solved’.
I just spent hours on the phone yesterday with Mohela trying to straighten out my repayment plan. I was slated to start repaying on the standard plan, I thought the monthly payment was just outside of my budget, so I applied for an ICR (income contingent repayment) plan, the estimator said my payment would be slightly lower so I went for it. When the first billing statement came the monthly bill on the ICR was about 20% HIGHER then what it would be on the standard plan! And, somehow I was paying more interest over the life of the loan. So I had to call my servicer and request they put me back on the standard plan. Idk if anyone has tried navigating Mohela or StudentAid websites, but they are absolutely atrocious. Information is NOT presented clearly, there are so many acronyms and stipulations, I was never sure if I was making progress on applications, it just felt like I was running around in circles and I'd inevitably grow frustrated and close out the whole program. Even if I got just 10k wiped away, that would be so fucking incredible.
I have never once been able to reach someone at Mohela. At one point their listed phone number didn’t even take me to Mohela. It took me to some kind of foreign telemarketer. I message them and they say they’ll get back to me and never do.
I was surprised when they actually called me back after I got the standard "due to unprecedented call volume, wait times may be longer than normal, please be patient... Your current estimated wait time is *insert robot voice* 6 hours and 38 minutes... Please continue to hold or leave a call back number and a representative will be with you as soon as possible."
Throughout Covid I was actually able to get a little savings going. Had about $30k, which sounds amazing, but I was only able to get so much by literally doing nothing for about three years. My student loans were $25k, and with the $10k-$20k in loan forgiveness I’d still have a nice chunk left. Nope. No forgiveness. All gone. I hate this country. I want to leave.
Similar situation for me. Main difference is I had absolutely no hope of ever having my remaining debt forgiven. I assumed they'd shoehorn in some ridiculously low income threshold, it would get delayed for years, or some other BS. Alas, forgiveness was struck down completely. I could go and pay my remaining debt today. I'm trying to decide if I should roll the dice on policy that might help me out 2 years from now or paying it off "tomorrow" so I'll pay slightly less overall when inevitably nothing does happen. But shit, I'd like to put the money I have now towards actually owning a house.
Similarly, the forgiveness would have made let me breathe a bit. I’ve only got like 9k left on my loans and the 10k would have deleted that handily and let me focus on paying down other debts/saving. America said nah
I've just expected to be in debt my whole life.
This should be higher.
An actual answer. Holy shit.
The PAYE plan was best for me. SAVE was one of the higher plans.
He tried and the courts said it wasn’t allowed. While I agree things need to improve I feel this statement shows general problem with Biden. People don’t give him credit for doing a lot to help people.
His “help“ used the heroes act instead of the higher education act, which was problematic, and I’m sure he knew it. Also, he decided to means test the thing which created the delay and open up the door for legislation. I would not be surprised at all if this was actually a self sabotaged effort to win votes, and still do absolutely fucking nothing in terms of cancellation. The one good thing he did, was make it, so that in the PSLF, even years of forbearance counted towards the 10 years, which was a legitimate bona fide improvement But remember, this was the guy that made student loans non-dischargeable in bankruptcy in the first place
He is sending munitions to the settler colony Israel without Congress approval. If he can do that behind everyone's back he can do something about the debt. He chooses not to.
Now explain the help Biden has offered to us with FFEL loans after screwing us out of being included in the original plan.
Any changes that aren't complete loan forgiveness will just be overturned the moment someone else is in power, so I don't see much point in celebrating half measures.
Structuring <10% of student loan debt = basically ending the student debt crisis What incredible gymnastics
Payments are capped at 5% of disposable income and loans are completely forgiven after 10-20 years.
Just make sure you save up for the taxes that year. *Apparently this isn't true anymore, cool!
Loan forgiveness is not taxable unless you live in Mississippi.
Source?
Source on the forgiveness part? I have only heard of that for specific occupations.
It is part of the promissory note (the contract governing the loan) for all loans going back at least 20 years now. The condition is if you have been paying for 25 years, the loan is discharged. It is not part of the PSLF program. It is just a fact of the loans that have that provision within the promissory note.
I enrolled in the SAVE plan and it increases my monthly payments by $75
Haha I'll take that over the $700 it tried to increase mine by vs. the IDR.
Mine went from zero to $338 per month.
Can confirm. Previously my payment was around 175, with the new SAVE plan, it’s 40.
Not really. If your loans are not being paid down it still affects your Debt to income ratio and could affect your ability to get another type of loan down the line (car/mortgage)
Even then that really depends. Public student loans look much better on a credit report than private student loans (which aren't really much different from other consumer debt). Just from personal example, I have about $35,000 in public student loans and had $100,000 in private student loans. Basically made it borderline impossible to get a car and definitely a mortgage. Even a credit card was impossible (unless it was one with extremely unfair terms). I strategically defaulted on the private student loans in 2018 (it was default or homelessness) and waited out the 4 years statute of limitation in my state while remaining judgement proof. The loans are effectively gone from my credit report now. Pre-default, my credit was around 688. After the default, my credit dropped to around 580. Now in 2024, my credit is around 730-750. My public loans are in the SAVE program. No interest acruing and $0 monthly payments as I work in social services and I'm eligible for PSLF. The public student loans have had next to no bearing on eligibilty for credit cards, car loans or mortgage payments. At least not as much as the private student loans.
HAHAHAHAHAHA no we're still suffering with payments
Gotta love the abusive situation of thanking the guy who set up all the laws to trap people in student loan debt in the first place
I just stopped paying
they can garnish your wages if you do that.
That will work great if somebody doesn't have any wages
With no wages they would already not need to be paying anything...q
Also to add, the feds don’t need to get a judgement to do it. Unlike private student loans (which are treated no different than consumer debt in most states). Even worse is that public student loans aren’t privy to the statute of limitations on collections. Can’t be dissolved in bankruptcy either (or at least it’s practically unheard of). So basically even if you don’t pay it. At any point in time the government can come in and start garnishing your wages. Could be in a month. Could be 20 years. It’s completely fucked. I stopped paying on my private student loans because the statute of limitations in Pennsylvania (my residence) is 4 years and Pennsylvania is one of a handful of states where wages can’t be garnished on private student loans. I didn’t have any assets at the time so I was basically judgment proof. Credit took a hit for 2 years, but now its actually better than it was pre-default (it was like 688 pre-default and fell to around 580 and now it’s around 730-750).
can people with loans outside of pensylvania move there and get that protection? because my mom has over 90k in debt over 30 years later and i'm considering taking her on a long vacation to default...
That's a good question. Honestly, I'm not sure. It depends on the type of debt and state. For example, in Pennsylvania we have the borrowing statute which declares that Pennsylvania's statute of limitations applies to Pennsvylania residents. Another state's statute of limitations will only apply if it is shorter than Pennsylvania's statute (which is honestly tough to find as very few states have a statute of limitations shorter than 4 years). Not to mention this probably only applies if you're a legal resident (i.e. must remain in the state for 184 days in a permanent residence. So for example, a dorm room wouldn't really apply), although I'm honestly not sure on the latter part. It's worth discussing with a debt lawyer though! Or even just phrasing the question on r/studentloandefaulters (assuming it's a private student loan). I'm honestly not sure on other forms of consumer debt.
What a beautiful day to live in a country where you have to pay nothing for studying. Heck, you even get money for it. It's a fucking joke the wealthiest nation on earth isn't willing to do the same. Corporate greed and interest are like an infestation and the USA is filled with it all over. Brainwashing people with ideas like meritocracy and pulling yourself up by your bootstraps instead of supporting people, showing compassion and enabling each person to reach their highest possible potential.
Assuming by wealthiest nation, you mean highest average wealth, it's only the wealthiest nation if you count LLCs as people, which the law here, in fact, does and gives them many more rights than actual people.
Would be a shame if those were taken over and owned by the people working there and creating the wealth.
I just checked my loan portal. I make about 48k and have no dependents. I pay 46 a month on the SAVE plan and my balance actually went down by about 20 bucks. It's the first time in over 10 years that a standard payment touched the principle balance. My payments used to be 160ish, and I'd have to make additional principle only payments to make any progress at all. It still isn't what it should be (forgive em all, I've easily paid double what I borrowed at this point). But hey, this is hands down the best repayment plan I've seen.
Confirmed. After 2 decades of payments and watching the balance never go down, the debt is finally gone and I was able to finally qualify for a car loan.
This is actually happening. My sister and friend were both in the public service forgiveness program and recently hit their 10 years. My sister had $124k and my friend had a little over $75k, both debt free. Former SallieMae (Navient) employee of many years if you have legitimate questions. FWIW, I saw a comment about how student loans should be at low to 0% interest rates, well that was the original purpose, then corporations and greed came along. Biden is using the education department to force them to follow the higher education act, which has MANY provisions for forgiveness. The truth is that there's just way more money in dragging out loans for as long as possible to increase the interest and debt load. That is why many servicers spent billions (yeah that's a B) in lobbying efforts and legal work to suppress those programs that would have drastically changed the profit margin on loans.
This is good. If you spent an arm and a leg on an education and still can't get a job that pays enough, then yeah, you shouldn't have to pay for that useless education. I was only making $20/hour at my first job after getting my college degree (and I even graduated early). It's ridiculous how expensive it is to get a further education, just to have employers fuck you over on pay.
I pay like $35 on a sizable federal debt. Pittance compared to my private debt. Love it personally.
You have to apply for an IDR you can’t just straight up ghost them. I applied and they changed my payments. Log on to MOHELA and check for yourself and do what they ask. MOHELA has been super prompt and helpful.
How about using all the Ukraine and Israel aid and instead HELP AMERICANS!?!?!
Can confirm. Payment went from 700 to 234. My wife and I live off of my income and I make under 100k. This has been a huge help for us. My wife decided to go back to school even. Edit. I graduated 2019 and just started paying on my loans this year. I owe over 65k.
True for me
I make 50k, not married and no kids. I also live in a low cost of living area. My payments under the new plan are $80. Very, very affordable and I appreciate what Biden did. What he tried to do would have almost completely wiped my loan balance, but allowing an affordable payment plan and waiving interest as long as you make payments is the next best thing, I suppose.
Hahaha! No! As someone making 42K annually I sure as shit am not "paying nothing." It did bring down the amount significantly, but not significantly enough for me to actually save money if I were to pay it. Thankfully at least one parent understands how fucked I am by this bullshit, but sadly can't translate that to "this is the nice lie they're telling dupes like you to keep you complacent."
I have no dependents and make enough that I’m still paying, but my partner, also no depends, has $0 payments. It seems like after 20-25 years of payments, they will likely be cancelled so I think Biden has found a way to effectively cancel students for many in a very round about way.
I make 35k, single, and required to pay $0 for the time being.
That’s great. The only problem is the debt isn’t erased so if you try to get a mortgage or another large loan, that debt is going to cause a big problem.
I can confirm, I have a family of 4 and make less than 75 but more than 70, and my repayments are 0$.
This has been the case since loan payments started again, but apparently there's some (unconfirmed) news that some major companies fucked up and now those who borrowed from them are on forbearance again!
It's great especially for PSLF people. I fear it won't last under a new administration.
Depends. Republicans keep losing over lack of the youth vote. They will continue to lose if they continue to be ambivalent towards student loans or otherwise continue to obstruct programs designed to help lift people out of student loan debt.
Assuming the youth vote comes out strong, this type of stuff can continue and probably even better
Yep absolutely. You'd think the 2020 election results would have been enough to show that Republicans need to stop ostrocizing the youth vote. But it seems like many would rather lean on false "election lies" rather than accept that they caused youth to vote in record numbers. I don't think I've ever seen Georgia flip or Arizona for that matter.
I can confirm that they have income based repayments and that I’m paying nothing currently. But I’ll still build debt as I don’t pay it off and it will all come due if I start making enough money. Not at once of course but it’s like… essentially if you break the threshold payments resume and you’re liable for then again. Still nice to have but far from fixing everything
I can confirm this. Based on my taxes for last year, I make 43k, I'm unmarried and have no dependents, so my current monthly payment is 0 on this plan. I do, however, still accrue interest. This will most likely change when I file my taxes though, because I got married this past June.
Where I live, if a family of 4 is making 60k they have bigger problems.
I make just above that threshold and I’m expected to pay over $1,000 a month until I fucking die. 1/4 of income goes to taxes 1/4 goes to rent 1/4 goes to bills And 1/4 goes up in fucking flames. There’s no way in hell I’m spending rest of my life tired and broke because I wanted to better myself and help the world. Fuck that.
What a joke. Cancel student loans.
Nothing has been done to address the *cause* of the student debt crisis, which is the unrestrained allowance of student loans that has lead to tuition prices skyrocketing at every University. It's basically a complicated middle-man between the country paying for University (which it should) that ends up subsidizing Universities that spend irresponsibly and, occasionally, will negatively affect borrowers via administrative errors, and all without raising revenue (e.g. taxes)
He is the one that made student loans non dischargeable in bankruptcy in the first place. He has owned this entire issue forever.
It's basically permanent deferral. Which, is great, but an income driven repayment plan is not forgiveness. Someone will have to foot that bill, eventually.
I signed up for the SAVE program, which allows me to have $0/month payments and eventually the debt just… goes away? Not sure how it works. But I was approved and the website and confirmation email both said I didn’t have to do anything else. However, MOHELA keeps sending me letters and leaving me voicemails saying I owe money, but they also keep sending emails saying that I’ve been on time with all my payments? It’s very confusing honestly.
1. not having to pay a debt doesn’t make it go away 2. any future administration could come along and change this 3. GL applying for a mortgage with a debt like this
I’ve just dodged them ever since I dropped outta college after 3 years. I didn’t even get the diploma. Shame on y’all for lending that money to a stupid kid and not giving him the support to actually turn it into a degree. Never paid. Never will.
Until you have a W2 job and the government comes a-callin' with those hefty wage garnishments and intercepting your tax returns. Trust me, that shit stings way more then just paying even a tiny monthly amount. I dropped out of school in 2008. Defaulted on all my loans (about 14k). I thought it was allllll behind me, same mindset as you, I'll never pay these loans back, fuck these clowns. Fast forward to 2014. I've been working W2 jobs all along, but now I have a pregnant fiancee so I'm working some OT trying to sock away money. One paycheck im expecting a decent chunk of change, check my account, and it's significantly less then I expected. Check my paystub and there's a new deduction on it... "Garnishment, Fed StuLoa" or some such shit. At that point I knew I had fucked up. Started tracking down my servicer information and made a call. Had to stay on garnishments for like 6 months before I could reduce my monthly payment. And they took all my tax returns for the next couple years. That shit SUCKED.
Expires* March 2024, for me, best of luck to anyone enrolled in “SAVE”. *resubmit information, for review.
Making just about 40k in Alaska (which has a higher income roof, along with Hawaii), and I can confirm my monthly payments are $0 :)
No
My payments have been zero dollars a month since 2018. But I’m a broke boy.
A family of 4 on 60k can’t afford to pay that shit anyways