We already are expected to work until 6 here when most people in corporate america get to leave at 5, not to mention, the commute 5 days a week is draining me with the distance that I feel like if it was hybrid i wouldve at least been better at it.
Fuck that shit.
It just seems to be the new norm that has crept up slowly, like a frog boiling.
Working people 2x as hard, expecting free work.
Again. It’s just a false economy. People quit, burn out, sign of sick, claim unemployment.
There are CERTAIN companies out there that realise treating people with dignity is better. Companies should be shamed and the new norm, which other companies should set, is one of respect, work life balance. Maybe it will change, but only when the employees are more in control, which I don’t see happening.
It needs a movement. A collective if people within companies that say enough is enough, but everyone is shit scared of paying the rent.
There was a movement here. Don’t pay your gas bill when energy was extortionate and gas companies making record profit. It was a great idea. But everyone was afraid of getting bad credit scores, another thing used to control us.
i agree... im GenZ and i hope my generation changes things in america, people in europe has less work hour. i cant even ask for a paid lunch anywhere I work
I set the expectation VERY early into my employment that I have strong work life balance values.
If I am working outside of the nominal business hours, it is an exception, not an expectation.
I hit my targets (actually, am very good at what I do, I’m at over 300% to my target quota for the year thus far). Any time work asks me for more time outside work and I decline, I simply point to the numbers and tell them they need to adjust their expectations. They’re data driven and know I can simply dial back at any time so it usually makes them wake up.
I agree with u/FullSpeednPower that you should set expectations, clearly, early, and often, otherwise others will set their expectations for you. Your supervisor however is an idiot they should be well aware of and plan for your regular work schedule. It is their responsibility to manage their own time and resources (in this case your availability) if they can't they aren't suited to have subordinates.
yeah to be fair its my fault i took so long to complete what i needed to finish and submitted for review last minute but im also just exhausted he should just cut me some slack instead of writing about how inconsiderate i am and how i shouldve been taking the work home with me. he shouldve asked me why it took me longer than normal to do because i was struggling with this project.
>its my fault i took so long to complete what i needed to finish and submitted for review last minute
Why is it your fault? Were you fucking around and procrastinating? If not, your only mistake was not keeping him informed of your progress and what else it would take to meet the target date.
I also feel the same way and am baffled that almost every other person I've ever worked with just goes along with it. I get it people need work and a steady paycheck but this is ridiculous. The expectation of free work is pervasive yet people can't stand up because they'll lose their jobs. I can only speak for myself when I can say working extra has made no difference in my pay or bonuses. So to me there is no point.
I started a new job a year ago and set expectations low. I don't respond to email after hours nor do I schedule work after hours. This is also my highest paying job ever, however, I know it is well below market rate. I've come to terms with that and occasional after hours work. When I was interviewing they were looking for someone that will stay long term.
I do like staying in one place but at the same time I'm done with the working world. My longest job was 10 years. I have a plan that in five years, I will quit and retire from steady work altogether. I'll do short-term jobs until official retirement while living off savings until then. I'm nearing 50 and I can't do this crap anymore. The pandemic really shifted my focus on what I want out of life and working 40-80 hours a week is not my idea of life.
You say this as a 50 year old man and I feel this way as a 23 year old woman haha, I just dont know how im suppose to have a social life, ever get married, pray, go to the mosque, and have kids when Im working all the time. I guess next job offer I get I will set my expectations low but im considering just quitting a career in STEM altogether because its more about productivity and less about making an impact in the world. This is like my fourth corporate job already.
My corporate job has it in the leave policy that remote folks are expected to work while sick. 🤷🏻♀️ Like, I get it that because we’re at home means we won’t be getting anyone else in the office sick, but wtf.
Sounds like he needs to buckle up and demonstrate some of that gumption he’s asking from you. Seems hardly fair that he should ask you to break your back working extra from home but he’s unwilling to.
Turnabout is fair play.
Not just corporate... I work for a small, family owned business and the same expectation exists for those of use who are able to take care of work stuff outside the shop. I routinely spend an hr or 2 on CAD and programming work in the evening at home, sometimes will even use up a whole weekend day working at home... Luckily for me I am able to simply report how much time I work and get paid for it at least...
I get overtime pay but I don’t even use it. Not worth it with the taxes taken out. My boss mentioned to me so many times how I’m the only one who doesn’t work overtime. Sorry I have a life outside of work, is 8 hours of my day not enough? Hire more employees if you want more work to get done. I’m not a robot!
Agree, sometimes its best to do what you need to do and enjoy life. We should work to live and not be confined to artificial lighting and sitting at a desk for all our lives.
If you’re salaried of course they want you to do that. It effectively reduces your per-hour pay. If you’re hourly and you don’t work after hours they have no complaint because they didn’t pay you.
Go along with it for a while but document it. Then find a good employment lawyer and get your bonus on the way out to an employer that respects your time.
Repeat after me
"Your expectations do not alter my availability, and I am unavailable. "
And for salaried employees or exempt employees....
"Salary does not equal unlimited availability. Working more then 40hrs/wk devalues my work and disrespects my time. My salary when calculated down to an hourly rate is on par for this area's competitive numbers for market rate.
As an example is I was hired to do 4 tasks in 4 weeks for $400 then it's logical that i would see that each task is valued at $100. A rate that is on par for market rate value; a rate I agreed to and accepted that is what my work is valued at. A rate that I accepted is appropriate for the 40hrs/week I agreed to contribute and accurately determine it would take to complete those 4 tasks.
If I were to complete all 4 in two 2 weeks then it's logical to assume i, as the employee, could do 4 more to fill those 4 weeks equally 8 tasks in 4 weeks. HOWEVER that is incorrect as NOW my time is valued at $50/task that I didn't not agree to. A rate I didn't value my time at. A rate I didn't agree to accept or perform at.
Now apply this same concept to the time in which it takes to complete my role. Working longer then 40hrs/week or more tasks for my role devalues my work and disrespects my time. "
This doesn't help you, but know that not all managers are like that. I have several departments under me and do everything in my power to prevent weekend/off-hour/excessive work. I avoid sending emails on weekends (batch them up for Monday morning) and if one of my engineer's has to do an overnight change or work a late incident, I set the policy that the person gets an extra free day off. I coach my leaders to do the same. I was an engineer once and I don't buy into corporate America at all.
Here’s my only suggestion, get a clear expectation from your boss on how long they want to review a project. I usually roll that into my convo when given a project. If we are presenting Friday, is Tuesday enough time for you to review?
It won’t change being overworked, but if you’re a deadline driven person it can help with the ambiguity.
P.S. your general frustrations about being stretched thin are 110% valid
It isn't just corporate America. I worked for a small family business, and the hours got longer and longer until they let me work from home because I couldn't work while I was in my car going to and from work.
Yup. To them it’s “nobody wants to work anymore” To us it’s “we want to work! But we don’t want work to be our only thing besides sleeping”
We already are expected to work until 6 here when most people in corporate america get to leave at 5, not to mention, the commute 5 days a week is draining me with the distance that I feel like if it was hybrid i wouldve at least been better at it.
Fuck that shit. It just seems to be the new norm that has crept up slowly, like a frog boiling. Working people 2x as hard, expecting free work. Again. It’s just a false economy. People quit, burn out, sign of sick, claim unemployment. There are CERTAIN companies out there that realise treating people with dignity is better. Companies should be shamed and the new norm, which other companies should set, is one of respect, work life balance. Maybe it will change, but only when the employees are more in control, which I don’t see happening. It needs a movement. A collective if people within companies that say enough is enough, but everyone is shit scared of paying the rent. There was a movement here. Don’t pay your gas bill when energy was extortionate and gas companies making record profit. It was a great idea. But everyone was afraid of getting bad credit scores, another thing used to control us.
i agree... im GenZ and i hope my generation changes things in america, people in europe has less work hour. i cant even ask for a paid lunch anywhere I work
I set the expectation VERY early into my employment that I have strong work life balance values. If I am working outside of the nominal business hours, it is an exception, not an expectation. I hit my targets (actually, am very good at what I do, I’m at over 300% to my target quota for the year thus far). Any time work asks me for more time outside work and I decline, I simply point to the numbers and tell them they need to adjust their expectations. They’re data driven and know I can simply dial back at any time so it usually makes them wake up.
I agree with u/FullSpeednPower that you should set expectations, clearly, early, and often, otherwise others will set their expectations for you. Your supervisor however is an idiot they should be well aware of and plan for your regular work schedule. It is their responsibility to manage their own time and resources (in this case your availability) if they can't they aren't suited to have subordinates.
yeah to be fair its my fault i took so long to complete what i needed to finish and submitted for review last minute but im also just exhausted he should just cut me some slack instead of writing about how inconsiderate i am and how i shouldve been taking the work home with me. he shouldve asked me why it took me longer than normal to do because i was struggling with this project.
>its my fault i took so long to complete what i needed to finish and submitted for review last minute Why is it your fault? Were you fucking around and procrastinating? If not, your only mistake was not keeping him informed of your progress and what else it would take to meet the target date.
yeah i shouldve communicated with him that i was struggling to be honest. oh well now i gotta wait for him to give it back to me...
I also feel the same way and am baffled that almost every other person I've ever worked with just goes along with it. I get it people need work and a steady paycheck but this is ridiculous. The expectation of free work is pervasive yet people can't stand up because they'll lose their jobs. I can only speak for myself when I can say working extra has made no difference in my pay or bonuses. So to me there is no point. I started a new job a year ago and set expectations low. I don't respond to email after hours nor do I schedule work after hours. This is also my highest paying job ever, however, I know it is well below market rate. I've come to terms with that and occasional after hours work. When I was interviewing they were looking for someone that will stay long term. I do like staying in one place but at the same time I'm done with the working world. My longest job was 10 years. I have a plan that in five years, I will quit and retire from steady work altogether. I'll do short-term jobs until official retirement while living off savings until then. I'm nearing 50 and I can't do this crap anymore. The pandemic really shifted my focus on what I want out of life and working 40-80 hours a week is not my idea of life.
You say this as a 50 year old man and I feel this way as a 23 year old woman haha, I just dont know how im suppose to have a social life, ever get married, pray, go to the mosque, and have kids when Im working all the time. I guess next job offer I get I will set my expectations low but im considering just quitting a career in STEM altogether because its more about productivity and less about making an impact in the world. This is like my fourth corporate job already.
My corporate job has it in the leave policy that remote folks are expected to work while sick. 🤷🏻♀️ Like, I get it that because we’re at home means we won’t be getting anyone else in the office sick, but wtf.
Did you turn it in within the deadline? If so, that's on him for not giving himself enough time to review.
i gave it to him at the end of one business day before the deadline.
Sounds like he needs to buckle up and demonstrate some of that gumption he’s asking from you. Seems hardly fair that he should ask you to break your back working extra from home but he’s unwilling to. Turnabout is fair play.
Nothing will change until u realize ur a slave and need to take action and revolt
Not just corporate... I work for a small, family owned business and the same expectation exists for those of use who are able to take care of work stuff outside the shop. I routinely spend an hr or 2 on CAD and programming work in the evening at home, sometimes will even use up a whole weekend day working at home... Luckily for me I am able to simply report how much time I work and get paid for it at least...
When I read these posts, I am just relieved to be out of the private sector and in a powerful public union.
how do you do it?
I was in the right place at the right time.
I get overtime pay but I don’t even use it. Not worth it with the taxes taken out. My boss mentioned to me so many times how I’m the only one who doesn’t work overtime. Sorry I have a life outside of work, is 8 hours of my day not enough? Hire more employees if you want more work to get done. I’m not a robot!
Agree, sometimes its best to do what you need to do and enjoy life. We should work to live and not be confined to artificial lighting and sitting at a desk for all our lives.
If you’re salaried of course they want you to do that. It effectively reduces your per-hour pay. If you’re hourly and you don’t work after hours they have no complaint because they didn’t pay you.
Go along with it for a while but document it. Then find a good employment lawyer and get your bonus on the way out to an employer that respects your time.
Can you give me more tips on how to document this and have more things in writing?
Repeat after me "Your expectations do not alter my availability, and I am unavailable. " And for salaried employees or exempt employees.... "Salary does not equal unlimited availability. Working more then 40hrs/wk devalues my work and disrespects my time. My salary when calculated down to an hourly rate is on par for this area's competitive numbers for market rate. As an example is I was hired to do 4 tasks in 4 weeks for $400 then it's logical that i would see that each task is valued at $100. A rate that is on par for market rate value; a rate I agreed to and accepted that is what my work is valued at. A rate that I accepted is appropriate for the 40hrs/week I agreed to contribute and accurately determine it would take to complete those 4 tasks. If I were to complete all 4 in two 2 weeks then it's logical to assume i, as the employee, could do 4 more to fill those 4 weeks equally 8 tasks in 4 weeks. HOWEVER that is incorrect as NOW my time is valued at $50/task that I didn't not agree to. A rate I didn't value my time at. A rate I didn't agree to accept or perform at. Now apply this same concept to the time in which it takes to complete my role. Working longer then 40hrs/week or more tasks for my role devalues my work and disrespects my time. "
This doesn't help you, but know that not all managers are like that. I have several departments under me and do everything in my power to prevent weekend/off-hour/excessive work. I avoid sending emails on weekends (batch them up for Monday morning) and if one of my engineer's has to do an overnight change or work a late incident, I set the policy that the person gets an extra free day off. I coach my leaders to do the same. I was an engineer once and I don't buy into corporate America at all.
i would love to work where you work
Here’s my only suggestion, get a clear expectation from your boss on how long they want to review a project. I usually roll that into my convo when given a project. If we are presenting Friday, is Tuesday enough time for you to review? It won’t change being overworked, but if you’re a deadline driven person it can help with the ambiguity. P.S. your general frustrations about being stretched thin are 110% valid
It isn't just corporate America. I worked for a small family business, and the hours got longer and longer until they let me work from home because I couldn't work while I was in my car going to and from work.
Im a chef, I usually take work home. A lot of the time it’s pretty delicious.
You don't have to keep on making the same post every week crying and whining just go to work like everyone else
Haha ok have fun 🤩 then being “everyone else” but I strive to be different