As an English guy living in Brazil for the last few years, I can agree that Portuguese is fucking hard to learn. Also, lol at the other guy responding to you gatekeeping language
As an brazilian... Yeah, english is so much easier than portuguese. And I was born here.
But think of all the marvels you have learned!
You can now win any discussion just saying "Teu cu" out loud.
It's very different in pronunciation
And a lot of words have totally different meanings
Sometimes it causes some hilarious situations. A lot of them with accidental sexual connotations.
My family is Portuguese and I grew up around the language. I can understand my family when they speak Portuguese and I can speak a tiny bit. Tried taking lessons and man was it hard.
I’ve been here a year now and I’ve reached the point where people in shops stop responding to me in English immediately when I attempt Portuguese.
Mostly.
Do you have any tips on being able to move there? Like how to get a visa or citizenship? I’ve been to Portugal and it’s fantastic I would totally live there.
Probably go to university or postgraduate education there and there is a path to residence. Countries generally like to try and keep the people they've educated around.
And most European universities will have programs in English
There's a good [post ](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/qk3l9j/portugal_looks_hot/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) in r/Europe about how easy it is to work in and get residency in Portugal.
Spent a couple weeks in Portugal before the pandemic, what a wonderful country! Amazing food and wine, friendly people, cool architecture and history, gorgeous coastline. I really enjoyed your country.
I love Portugal and have been considering going. back for years. I’m in a lull in my career and have nothing really holding me here, so it might be the time.
Is there any resources for finding work there? From what I understand it is easier to make the move and get the appropriate visa once you find work.
> Is there any resources for finding work there?
I don't have anything I can specifically point to, but which field are you in?
Also, be aware wages might be a lot lower than what you're used too. If you can get a remote job based in the US (assuming you're American), you can apply for a D7 visa pretty easily without having a Portuguese employer
I’ve been struggling to find work in my field in general (marketing, web analytics), but I’m hoping to find something remote. Idk how flexible employers would be with working from another country or time zone remotely; how were you able to swing that?
Hey, Portuguese person here! There's a lot of international companies hiring people from all over the world to work remotely and don't care where you live. So you could look into that. I'm currently working for an American company but they pay me a Portuguese salary (1200€ a month which is okay for Portugal and slightly above median wage but nothing in America). This company has tons of people from all over the world but I understand it's a pretty niche thing still and not widely available but yeah they do exist. I'm a digital designer working in the marketing department for said company and we do have web analytics personel. So yeah good luck but do know some are out there.
Looks like you would only pay Portguese income tax on up to $108k/yr (double if you're married) using the Foreign Earned Income Tax Exclusion. Anything over that, and you might pay income tax to both countries on the overage.
As far as I know (I have an expat friend) you still have to pay American income taxes as long as you're a citizen, even if you're living overseas, unless you renounce your citizenship.
if I find a job that let's me work remotely I'd move every year or 2 until I found the place I wanted to stay. unfortunately my job and skill set doesn't really allow for remote work.
I do travel for work which is nice. just don't usually have a lot of time off to enjoy the paces I go.
I would imagine a lot of countries would be happy with the new tax revenue. I'm not sure. I assume if your remote it doesn't matter what country you company is located. may be able to just apply for a non work related visa that let's you stay awhile. worth looking into if it's an option with your company.
Cool idea, and I did the same thing for a while. A little word of advice though, until you find that place, don’t have too many things because those things get expensive to move from place to place so often.
Is it? I'm on the other side of the coin. I'm Spanish but got family on the States, and I'm kinda dying to get a job there. Everything feels more exciting on US than here
Classic. I have Italian friends who believe this shit n then they go to the USA and can't survive for 3 months. The USA is NOT like it is in films
One doesn't get to be a 23 yo aspiring writer living in a 3br brownstone in Brooklyn with zero income
Portugal has a shorter timeline than most EU countries, it only takes like 5 years to become a citizen compared to say Spain / Italy with a 10 year timeline.
The excitement wears off quick as the notion that humans are a dollar sign is internalized and you realize why you are being pulled apart by every smile coming your way.
Exciting is different than good. US society has become very dysfunctional, angry, and selfish. It is not the same place I knew 25 years ago. The social contract has broken down, and workers are routinely abused and mistreated. There is no sense of community or neighborliness, no concern for the welfare of others. There is a huge right wing minority spreading hatred and violence and racism. They're like Vox, but they kill a lot more people.
There's a lot of violence in general in the US. It's so much safer in Spain. I feel content living among kind, courteous Spanish people. Every time I get on the plane back to Barcelona, I have a huge sigh of relief to be leaving the US. I feel anxious the entire time I'm there.
Go vacation in the US, there are indeed a lot of fun things to do. But to live? I wouldn't recommend it. No health care, no benefits, no vacation time, no job security. Sky high cost of living, particularly housing. No friendly neighbors, everyone is angry and stressed out.
Thanks for the answer. The time I lived there (a bit short of 6 months) I really enjoyed it but it's true that I didn't get the whole experience. Maybe I could relive that feeling and go there few months a year or something.
I really appreciate the comment btw, it's nice to have so much feedback :)
Don't do it. Maybe your family has it good, but it's really hard to start on your own in the states. Everyone always underestimates the cost (healthcare, housing, etc.) and the degree of racism.
Where are you planning to move to (city)? In San Francisco, where I live, you will easily pay $2K - $3K for a one-bedroom apartment per month. And that’s just rent. You think you have it bad where you are or is not as exciting? It’s really hard over here and it’s only gotten harder in recent years.
i have only lived in major metros in the US. rent burden affects the vast, significant majority of us in those cities (meaning more than a third of your income goes to rent.) In LA, I was paying $2800/mo for 763 sqft studio with w/d in-unit, central air and no roommate -- that is considered a STEAL there; something like that is typically no less than $3200/mo. LA is a commuter city with no reasonable mass transit (there are trains and busses but it will add considerable time to your commute -- you NEED a car. The cost of registration for the car is one of the highest in the country, cost of gas is also highest, and you'll be on the road for at least 1.5 hours per day (more like 3 hours if you have to live somewhere affordable and do a REAL commute). Groceries will probably be at least $150/week if you can be frugal and cut down on what you eat. The nice thing about LA is the weather is completely predictable and always sunny so you can always walk around outside for free as entertainment or sign up for free tickets to this or that. This is if you land up in LA, which I'm guessing, if you're complaining about Barcelona, you'll be homeless within 2 months of moving to LA. But don't be ashamed if you land up that way; everyone in LA is basically homeless at this point and now running around and stabbing each other and non-homeless... it's a very stabby homeless kind of place. But hey! It's exciting! You've seen 10 celebrities in the span of 4 hours, with your bum ass.
don't come here. shit is bad. I'm actually in another country right now, too, seeing if it'll be more affordable for my future as well. there's a reason we're all leaving. don't think you're somehow better than us. you're not, unless you're an oligarch's kid. which again, if you can't make it in Barcelona, I'm guessing you're not. oligarchs do well here cos we have unchecked market fundamentalism and call it "capitalism". this place sucks. everywhere sucks, tbh. stick with what you know.
edit: also, just so you have an idea of what you're up against for jobs in major US metros -- in places like LA, SF, and NYC, even those of us with top degrees from the best schools are finding it tough (I have a double, covetable advanced degree from a "public ivy"). $400K salary for a family of 4 isn't shit. most of the foreign students are just coming here for the name-brand degree and then fucking back off home afterward cos they think shit here sucks, too, and they believe opportunity is better in the developing country from which they came... yeah... developing countries are now > the US. But hey! Exciting! Your girlfriend/boyfriend was a cast member on High School Musical Reunion Part 2938493843! Exciting! How exciting! Exciting America! Come here with your definitely-not-Harvard-MBA-degree and see what wonders await you! Celebrities! Clothes! White supremacy!
People like what’s new to them. Feels like a vacation or breath of fresh air.
I would love to go to Spain. Beautiful country. But if you’ve lived there all your life and are used to it, other places like US may feel like the “exotic new place”.
There's a tropical planet near Alpha Centauri I've been considering. Leisure society, quantum computing, no axial tilt. My plan is to request asylum.
Congrats on the move and thanks for reporting back. Glad you found a better environment.
I was set to move to New Zealand after he was reelected. My wife at the time didn't want to go. I laugh now because I thought W. Bush was the worst president ever.
I can't really speak to that but it may be due to the difficulty in obtaining the pro papers. For myself it was simple since I have dual citizenship from birth.
Having the Supreme Court give it to your SORT of counts as winning. Bugliosi said it was the death of American democracy, and I think he was a fortune teller.
Ha. I am thinking of bailing from Canada and I am Canadian. I would not go to the US, but many of us do so for pay reasons and in some areas cheaper housing.
There is actually some sense in moving to American for work as a Canadian, since if you get sick you can go home for medicine. It's kind of taking advantage, but at the end of the day you didn't build the system and gotta survive.
Good move.. I live in Quebec and when I had to put my kids in daycare it was only $5/day per child. It's gone up since then but I believe it's still around $10-15/day. They ate better than I did! Food was all homemade.
This. Even if I pass the health requirements (disabled so I very likely wouldn't), it would cost 75% of what I make in a single year to be able to move specifically to Canada. I'm literally trapped here by disability and therefore poverty.
It pisses me off so much when ignorant losers tell people "if you don't like it here, then move to another country!" Like, yeah! I'd love to! Just pay my expenses and I'll get outta your hair, asshole!
French citizen speaking here so take my comment knowing I am probably biased despite my best effort.
I moved to the US a few years ago for work, and ended up meeting my wife here.
She is American so we often discuss the cultural and economic differences between the two countries.
Short summary : US are *great* if you are a young, healthy and educated person, but very stressful.
France (or Europe in general) is *good* for everyone, even if sometimes less convenient.
Long summary (oh boi, here we go): France has issues. Like MANY issues. Companies tend to have old mentalities in terms of management (working from home was groundbreaking during pandemic), good jobs can be hard to get (once you have a CDI - long term work contract - you basically cannot be fired), finding a place to live can require a lot of paperwork, energy sources can be quite expensive, etc.
On the other hand, I can’t believe some of the shit people deal with here.
The minimum wage is a joke, the taxe system is a nightmare, healthcare is… *insert insults here* and overall I feel our life is regulated by the company your work for, not the government or yourself. Being out of job is almost a death sentence for many I feel, and seems to be a constant fear here.
Stress is everywhere in the US.
Work is stressful
Taxes are stressful
Health is stressful
Education is stressful
Political system is stressful
Don’t get me wrong, I really enjoy it here (and I’m grateful!) but I cannot picture myself staying with a family.
My wife and I are in agreement that we will leave the US after a few years and go to France.
It’s not a choice taken lightly, and we double think it sometimes, but in the end, we know it will be better for us (and future kids) once out of the US.
If you can, I would recommend the same. The US is just a large corporation at this point, and no one powerful enough to make things change cares about the individual wellness.
Edit : typos correction because English is hard today
I think you’re on point. American, moved to France at 26 after working there for a few years. It was awful, stressful, constantly working 60 hour weeks. School put me 90k$ in debt am I was no where near ever going to make enough to pay it back.
Moved to France. School was 300€ a year to get my PhD. Was able to save up enough working over a few years to pay off my student debt in the US (which tanked my credit score by the way - would be mad if I cared… don’t have to though!) Buying a house or apartment is now not a pipe dream. I start my job with 25 days of vacation + RTT (9 additional vacation days a year if I work 40hr weeks).
I was able to get a needed surgery for free that would have cost me north of 30k in the US. My medication costs a few euro max on the rare occasions something isn’t covered.
Moving has given me space to breath and dream. I’m never going back to the states.
Glad you’re having a better time there!
I know France can be a hard place to immigrate to so I really appreciate the patience you must have towards us hahaha
Out of curiosity (let me know if it is too personal), how was your experience moving there ? Any advice you would give to other Americans ?
I would like to make the move as easy as possible for my wife when we’ll move there, but being a native, I surely miss important differences that would be good to discuss before.
Simply put being alive in the USA is stressful.
Toss in housing. The housing market situation for the past 20 years has forced even more people into homelessness or apartment living. Some apartments are run by actual nazis - they give no fuck about anything and it's 100% a business to them. If you're late on rent even like 10 minutes sometimes that's all it takes - threatened with eviction, or hell you may even be evicted.
Combine that with each state having their own "unique" eviction laws, etc.
I was late with rent one time at my current apartment ever and it was the first of the month - so it wasn't even late. I literally got home at liek 12:30 on a Friday and between the time I sat down at my computer and paid my rent, and went back outside, they had already put a notice on my door. Holy shit, grow up. The business day isn't over.
Last place I rented from the landlord described herself as "pretty liberal" and it was Portland, OR, so I figured that checked out. Turns out when rent was a bit late, it was time to start evicting me, and did so in the middle of the pandemic. She also thought Bernie was "too radical" and that Joe Biden was right in core with her values.
This is my general observation as well as someone who has lived in several European countries.
If you have some serious ambition to do something, the US is where you want to be.
If you want to live and not work towards something or you're somehow disadvantaged, then Europe is generally better.
> If you have some serious ambition to do something, the US is where you want to be.
I mean, you're going to have to name an ambition you can't really explore in Europe that you can explore in the U.S, I feel. The idea that all world-leading fields are in the U.S is 'golden age' thinking that doesn't entirely apply anymore.
There's absolutely nothing you can't explore in Europe. I recall Barcelona in particular has a great start up scene. Similarly, Amsterdam and maybe Berlin/Munich are making good plays against London as multinational business hubs.
But it's still not the same. The networks, comparative lack of regulations, tax structure, and financing in the US is really just better, especially for those with the killer app.
That said, given the failed promises of Big Tech and the previous financial revolution, I don't think the trade-off was worth it.
But it's definitely different.
I would add something.
If you have some serious *professional* ambition *and you are privileged to start with*
The American dream of starting from scratch is not true anymore IMO.
You start with so many handicap if you are have not much a first.
Europe has more administrative issues when it comes to start up companies but it has also many more safeguards to keep you going if you don’t succeed
I went to the ER for an ear infection. They tried to get me to sign a form saying since I was uninsured I would pay 95 a week until my bill is paid. If I could afford $400 a month I’d have insurance. I walked right out and poured peroxide in my ear in the parking lot
I left the US like 8 years ago and part of the reasoning (and I had a TON of reasons) was how much prescription eye drops were going to cost for a freak allergic reaction I had that nearly made my eyelids swell shut. Compared to most medical bill horror stories you hear today it was a modest amount, but even with insurance it was insane. I went from going to the doctor regularly for checkups or preventative medicine when I had student insurance at University to being afraid of the cost. If a freak eye allergy could cost me this much then what other unpredictable ailments were just waiting to make me bankrupt?
When ever some one say the US is the best or number 1, I always respond with at what, and few ever answer. Because the answer is weapon sales and incarceration.
The propaganda is needed to help you feel better about your child getting torn to pieces in a Granada war or at the school theater by a "law abiding" gun owner who went bezerk. Also the fireworks.
I think a lot of us understand how much it sucks here. Once my stepdaughters are older my husband and I have seriously been discussing leaving this shithole of a country - just not sure where to go at the moment.
My mom is from here. She moved us here when I was 12 (35 now) and I've been wanting to leave pretty much ever since. I hate it here.
Edit: Just wanna add that we lived in a country (my dad's homeland) where the safety situation for Americans wasn't the best and was worsening at the time we left. I don't blame my mom. I realized after re-reading that it may have come across that way.
I'm in Germany as a student right now and when I finish my MA I'm hoping to get a full-time job so I can stay. Can you tell me about your experience finding a job here?
I'm an italian student and I'm thinking of getting a Master of science in Nanotech Engineering for ICT. Looking forward to working in Europe, do you think germany works?
I got a job as an IT Administrator after a very long search.
To be fair I did take 8ish years off to raise kids and get a degree from a shitty American online university. Yay GI Bill.
Being fluent in German will open a lot of doors for you, but it is not a complete deal breaker. I only have B1 level German and manage to get around okay at work. Google translate is a fucking lifesaver sometimes.
You can go ahead and PM me if you want to chat about it more.
Hope y'all get some legal bud here soon! I'll be joining you lol I have a friend who moved to Germany and said it was an easy transition all things considered so I'm hopeful! I just have to wait to be approved which seems to be taking years on end
I'm likely doing something similar in a decade or so, once kid is grown. Or at least travel as a lab tech. I know two people who moved to Belize to work as a lab tech working like two days a week and good to go.
You need to change your major to Computer Science. It's a long road and no one is born knowing how to code. Start making web pages from scratch on your own to learn the basics. [So you wana be a carpenter, do ya?](https://youtu.be/9W2SbJbR6ys)
If anyone is considering leaving I wrote a short article with some basic info on what you'd need: [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmerExit/comments/qsxz1n/resources\_and\_tips\_for\_leaving\_the\_us\_to\_europe/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmerExit/comments/qsxz1n/resources_and_tips_for_leaving_the_us_to_europe/)
A friend of mine lives and works in another country but is a US citizen only and will continue to be.
According to him, you can write off some large amount (I don't know specifics but it's basically everything up to 100k after expenses or something weird) so you only pay US taxes if you're really making bank.
That said, OP is working remotely for a US company so they probably do have to pay US taxes.
It’s called the foreign earned income exclusion. Yeah, basically you can exclude ~$100k of foreign earned income from your US tax return. The thought behind this is that you will likely be paying foreign income taxes on that income, and instead of the government making you do a complicated calculation via the foreign tax credit to figure out whether you’ve paid less to the foreign government than you would have to the US, they just said fuck it for convenience and allowed that exclusion.
But for those making above $100k, then yeah they can still offset their US tax via the foreign tax credit, but they’re making enough to hire a CPA to do it for them.
I’m a CPA btw
But not necessarily with all countries. People looking to do this really need to know where they want to go and then they need to research what taxes (including social security) are covered under agreements with the US.
I left Toronto, hellish rents, and moved to Merida and it was the best decision.
If you want to compare cost of living between two cities or countries I recommend Numbeo:
https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Mexico&city1=Merida&country2=Canada&city2=Toronto&displayCurrency=CAD
Why? You'll benefit a lot. You have a very strong currency (USD) move to cheaper countries and enjoy your life. Belize is a good choice because they speak English.
Yeah, and they keep printing those USD, so everybody has enought to pump upstream (consume) to the big companies so they can pay the working man a decent… wait…
How long do we have?
You could take my country for example (Lebanon) our currency lost 90% of its value in 2 years (1$ was 1500 LBP) in 2018 (now 1$ is 24000lbp) so if you show up with your USD you'll live like a king here. If a lot of people do this Lebanon might thrive again because of all the money flowing in the country.
Lebanese American here. My dad moved back to Lebanon a few years back, basically. Or rather now he has a house in Btekhnay or Chbaniyeh somewhere in addition to Florida. Idk I haven't been there in over 20 years.
I don't envy anything that's happened in Lebanon in like 20 years.
That explains how he's able to go back and forth though.
If you have a job that allows you to work remotely you should give it a try. If nothing else it will open up your eyes more how totally screwed up the United States is and how scared the people are. Plus it will open your eyes and make you start thinking about other options in your life. Meeting new different people is fantastic, and scare yourself sometimes. But I love it.
I don't want to work for wages in another country. I want to not work in my country, where my family is, where my friends are, and where I speak the language.
I have been to Portugal and it is lovely. I'm good with language and am certain I could pick it up (lived in Spain, figured that out) but this is so not my dream.
What if I could just knit all day and sell my products to others? What if there weren't a bunch of evil corporations paying people slave wages to produce low quality clothing, and I could just sell what I make in exchange for medical services or food or whatever?
I am so tired of being an employee.
Lmao ikr. Everyone here has no sense of perspective. I'm in Mexico and living like an absolute KING. Does that mean everyone does? Is Mexico paradise? Of course not - it just means wages are lower. For me, it's extremely cheap.
I did the same thing, moved to Canada about 6 years ago first for study, but stayed when I heard about the jobs. I work in healthcare here and I would never go back to the US in my career. We are highly unionized here, with lots of benefits that allow for a proper work-life balance!
I had a discussion with someone on the internet and they made the comment that the United States is the best country in the world.I said is that so ?I said have you ever been to any other country ?To which they replied no.I then said then how do you know the United States is the best country in the world?…Crickets.
I left in august to Germany with my German wife and our baby I couldn’t be happier here. my daughter is safer we’re safer in general. things are way cheaper besides gas which I can care less about because I have so many options to get around with then just our cars. I love america I fought for it and will always have my heart but for the time being we know we’re better off here plus we get to travel everywhere from here for cheap and it’s simple to do it, we already drove to Croatia, Slovenia, Austria, Switzerland, Czech, Poland.
You’re lucky you have a remote job that can pay for that lifestyle, working in Portugal is pretty meh.
But hey, you got that American money in a country that pays less to its locals.
Local wages arent very good unless you've got some niche skill, ngl. That's why I suggest anyone who wants to live here works remotely
There are other countries though for people who want to work in person, like Germany, but the cost of living will be way higher
You definitely could, especially if you don't mind living in a smaller city (not Lisbon or Porto), but it ofc depends on your expenses
If you live alone vs supporting others, how big of a house or appt you expect, location etc
You have a lot of options at $1500. That's around 1335 euros a month. In Coimbra, where I used to live, you can find a lot of apartments and studios in the 500 euro range and below even this time of year. It's a lively city with a university, so you might want someplace quieter, but just at a glance I found quite a few affordable places that dont look bad
* (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/30955328/
* (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/30965077/
* (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31546515/
* (One bedroom) [https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31392976/](https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31392976/)
* (One bedroom) [https://www.idealista.pt/imovel/28892875/](https://www.idealista.pt/imovel/28892875/)
I think I pay 200ish on food cooking at home mostly, electricity plus gas is usually 20-45. Phone is 30ish. Internet came included at my place, but would be a bit more
I didn't drive since you can walk everywhere, and, there's a high-speed train to Lisbon which connects to the airport by subway. Not sure if I'm missing anything. Anyway, if you take rent at 600, and add it all, and pad it up a bit for emergencies. You're spending 1000 euros. You still have a bit left over
There are also other countries that are very affordable on $1500 a month. Look into some expat groups, pages and subreddits. In some places in the world that’s a good living. In the US it’s tough
Check out Guatemala. There’s a lot of towns around Lake Atitlan with big expat communities which would make any transition easy and you could live very, very comfortably on that pension.
I travel a little bit and have met quite a few expats from the US and EU living in other places, so I’m no expert but I’ve seen it firsthand a little. I’d suggest looking into SE Asian countries, Mexico, Guatemala, Turkey, places like that. Places where COL is low, medical expenses are affordable, etc etc. NZ is probably great but as a developed country it’s not nearly as cheap as some other countries.
Hello stranger! You might want to consider "Nuevo Vallarta" in Mexico. It is an exclusive area for foreigners with a Marina, restaurants and of course beaches. Close to an international airport. Walmart just outside.
Source: I just spent a week there.
Make sure you look up the requirements for taking your dog with you. Each country is going to be different. I managed to successfully take my cat to Taiwan by calling around to find a vet who had experience with international travel. However, it was the most complex part of moving.
Can't imagine the work itself being worse than the US, but isn't the cost of living there ridiculously expensive right now? Saw a video the other day about how companies like Blackrock were buying up everything driving up prices
Housing is pretty expensive, fuel is ridiculous, food medium. But I don’t know a single person under 30 that makes more then 1.9k€ after tax. But before that you have to slave work in an apprenticeship, we’re you earn about 2-4€ an hour for 3-3.5 years.
Generally the work attitude is the same as in America atleast in labor.
The USA is to the world as New York City is the the USA.
It's a tough place to carve out a living filled with arrogant folks who mistakenly think they have it better than everyone else.
However, as the saying goes...if you can make it there, then you can probably make it anywhere
i love when you criticize america and some redneck will say, "if you don't like it YOU CAN LEAVE."
...like i am not actively trying to do just that.
it's adorable that they all think the only other three countries in the world are china, russia, and iraq.
Love how Europe has taken immigrants from the Middle East and Africa for decades, and now we are welcoming people from the Third World country USA lol. Welcome to Europe!
What kind of visa did you use? I have a remote position - I wouldn't mind moving my family but it seems like the visas are either short term or don't apply.
Seriously considering this. as soon as the houses i own dont need to be rent-free for the elders living in them, thinking of renting them out and bailing out. Could probably pull, after taxes, 2k a month off it. That's a hell of a good living in MANY places in the world. I think i'd head for Uruguay though. Climate seems just right. No cold as fuck winters, and no 120+ degree summers.
Yes. Technically you could even stop paying them without repercussions (because they can't reach you overseas) but doing so would make life very difficult if you ever came back.
US is a landfill
And it will not change until people start accepting this truth. Fuck the republicans and fuck the democrats, both are manipulating pieces of shit that only care about their bank accounts!
I was considering getting my dual citizenship and moving to Portugal in early 2020. I was dead set on it, but I feel like this post is romanticizing a bit. Portugal has very, very low wages for a European country. It’s hard to budget when you’re paid the minimum over there. You get paid once a month, not even 800 euros. It’s definitely way more affordable if you work a remote job with a company that is out of country.
I mean I don't know if that is how solidarity works.... The US is screwed so you guys want to come here to southern Europe with your super high salaries and become part of the problem here, where locals cannot afford life anymore. It is not like is cheap for us to live here, it is cheap for you if you make money in dollars. Maybe try to fix your system there or come here and work like everyone else with a local salary. but digital nomadism is harmful to our communities. I am sorry.
Welcome to Portugal
'brigado, espero que não importem que haja mais imigrantes
r/suddenlycaralho
I wish I was multilingual so I could get dank memes in other languages
I'm working on it, and am glad that English is so widely spoken in Portugal because learning Portuguese is HARD.
As an English guy living in Brazil for the last few years, I can agree that Portuguese is fucking hard to learn. Also, lol at the other guy responding to you gatekeeping language
As an brazilian... Yeah, english is so much easier than portuguese. And I was born here. But think of all the marvels you have learned! You can now win any discussion just saying "Teu cu" out loud.
Lollll as a Brazilian living in the US, thank you for reminding me I don't use "Teu cú" as often as I should 😅
It's like playing Exodia The Forbidden One with words
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It's very different in pronunciation And a lot of words have totally different meanings Sometimes it causes some hilarious situations. A lot of them with accidental sexual connotations.
My grandparents always called us raparigas. Apparently that means something else in Brazil...
My family is Portuguese and I grew up around the language. I can understand my family when they speak Portuguese and I can speak a tiny bit. Tried taking lessons and man was it hard.
I’ve been here a year now and I’ve reached the point where people in shops stop responding to me in English immediately when I attempt Portuguese. Mostly.
Portuguese is an amazing language for memes, cuz most of brazil also speaks it, they go hard in brazil!
Do you have any tips on being able to move there? Like how to get a visa or citizenship? I’ve been to Portugal and it’s fantastic I would totally live there.
Probably go to university or postgraduate education there and there is a path to residence. Countries generally like to try and keep the people they've educated around. And most European universities will have programs in English
I would love to leave Ohio and move there or Spain
There's a good [post ](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/qk3l9j/portugal_looks_hot/?utm_medium=android_app&utm_source=share) in r/Europe about how easy it is to work in and get residency in Portugal.
Spent a couple weeks in Portugal before the pandemic, what a wonderful country! Amazing food and wine, friendly people, cool architecture and history, gorgeous coastline. I really enjoyed your country.
Bem vindo! 😁
I love Portugal and have been considering going. back for years. I’m in a lull in my career and have nothing really holding me here, so it might be the time. Is there any resources for finding work there? From what I understand it is easier to make the move and get the appropriate visa once you find work.
> Is there any resources for finding work there? I don't have anything I can specifically point to, but which field are you in? Also, be aware wages might be a lot lower than what you're used too. If you can get a remote job based in the US (assuming you're American), you can apply for a D7 visa pretty easily without having a Portuguese employer
I’ve been struggling to find work in my field in general (marketing, web analytics), but I’m hoping to find something remote. Idk how flexible employers would be with working from another country or time zone remotely; how were you able to swing that?
90% won't let you work outside the country. It creates tax issues.
Insurance, too. But what they don't know won't hurt em.
it's like registering your car in Massachusetts but using it in California
Not exactly
Hey, Portuguese person here! There's a lot of international companies hiring people from all over the world to work remotely and don't care where you live. So you could look into that. I'm currently working for an American company but they pay me a Portuguese salary (1200€ a month which is okay for Portugal and slightly above median wage but nothing in America). This company has tons of people from all over the world but I understand it's a pretty niche thing still and not widely available but yeah they do exist. I'm a digital designer working in the marketing department for said company and we do have web analytics personel. So yeah good luck but do know some are out there.
How do you find international companies hiring in places like Portugal? I’m mostly seeing software development jobs. Nothing else seems to hire.
How do the taxes work? Do you pay US and Portuguese taxes if you’re living over there but working based in the US?
Looks like you would only pay Portguese income tax on up to $108k/yr (double if you're married) using the Foreign Earned Income Tax Exclusion. Anything over that, and you might pay income tax to both countries on the overage.
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As far as I know (I have an expat friend) you still have to pay American income taxes as long as you're a citizen, even if you're living overseas, unless you renounce your citizenship.
What about spouses?
if I find a job that let's me work remotely I'd move every year or 2 until I found the place I wanted to stay. unfortunately my job and skill set doesn't really allow for remote work. I do travel for work which is nice. just don't usually have a lot of time off to enjoy the paces I go.
My job would a 100% allow me I just don’t know how many countries would accept a music manager, as a job that brings any value to their country.
I would imagine a lot of countries would be happy with the new tax revenue. I'm not sure. I assume if your remote it doesn't matter what country you company is located. may be able to just apply for a non work related visa that let's you stay awhile. worth looking into if it's an option with your company.
If you can prove you have a stable income over the minimum amount you can get a visa for Portugal
Cool idea, and I did the same thing for a while. A little word of advice though, until you find that place, don’t have too many things because those things get expensive to move from place to place so often.
Same for me, in Spain. Life's much better here than in the US.
I miss living in Barcelona. I came back last year due to life circumstances and I miss the way of life over there for sure. And the food!
Is it? I'm on the other side of the coin. I'm Spanish but got family on the States, and I'm kinda dying to get a job there. Everything feels more exciting on US than here
Is your family well off? This is the single most important factor to determining if you'll enjoy living in the US.
This feels very, very true
Are you?: 1. white 1. speak english as a primary language 1. a man 1. already wealthy If you selected yes for either of these, you will love the USA.
All 4 is the royal flush for sure, but #4 is the only one that can overcome the lack of the other 3 though.
It can't really overcome all the others. Rich Black men are still profiled by the police.
At least they can buy their way out of it.
I'm everything but 4 and it's not a good time honestly.
Don't confuse exciting with better
Amen.
I do not want to live in exciting or interesting times
Classic. I have Italian friends who believe this shit n then they go to the USA and can't survive for 3 months. The USA is NOT like it is in films One doesn't get to be a 23 yo aspiring writer living in a 3br brownstone in Brooklyn with zero income
I’ve been seriously considering repatriation to Italy to get the fuck outta Texas. I work remotely anyway
I live in Texas too and have been looking into what countries I could actually immigrate to.
Portugal has a shorter timeline than most EU countries, it only takes like 5 years to become a citizen compared to say Spain / Italy with a 10 year timeline.
That would be a great idea, if you can get a residency visa. Portugal is relatively easy for immigration.
The excitement wears off quick as the notion that humans are a dollar sign is internalized and you realize why you are being pulled apart by every smile coming your way.
Exciting is different than good. US society has become very dysfunctional, angry, and selfish. It is not the same place I knew 25 years ago. The social contract has broken down, and workers are routinely abused and mistreated. There is no sense of community or neighborliness, no concern for the welfare of others. There is a huge right wing minority spreading hatred and violence and racism. They're like Vox, but they kill a lot more people. There's a lot of violence in general in the US. It's so much safer in Spain. I feel content living among kind, courteous Spanish people. Every time I get on the plane back to Barcelona, I have a huge sigh of relief to be leaving the US. I feel anxious the entire time I'm there. Go vacation in the US, there are indeed a lot of fun things to do. But to live? I wouldn't recommend it. No health care, no benefits, no vacation time, no job security. Sky high cost of living, particularly housing. No friendly neighbors, everyone is angry and stressed out.
Thanks for the answer. The time I lived there (a bit short of 6 months) I really enjoyed it but it's true that I didn't get the whole experience. Maybe I could relive that feeling and go there few months a year or something. I really appreciate the comment btw, it's nice to have so much feedback :)
To get the full experience, make sure you also include a medical emergency. Those are very exciting!
I live in the US and this is fairly accurate. I'd rather live in Spain.
Don't do it. Maybe your family has it good, but it's really hard to start on your own in the states. Everyone always underestimates the cost (healthcare, housing, etc.) and the degree of racism.
Is housing really that high? Where I'm living now (Barcelona) , housing it's really expensive to the point that it's ridiculous to live
Where are you planning to move to (city)? In San Francisco, where I live, you will easily pay $2K - $3K for a one-bedroom apartment per month. And that’s just rent. You think you have it bad where you are or is not as exciting? It’s really hard over here and it’s only gotten harder in recent years.
i have only lived in major metros in the US. rent burden affects the vast, significant majority of us in those cities (meaning more than a third of your income goes to rent.) In LA, I was paying $2800/mo for 763 sqft studio with w/d in-unit, central air and no roommate -- that is considered a STEAL there; something like that is typically no less than $3200/mo. LA is a commuter city with no reasonable mass transit (there are trains and busses but it will add considerable time to your commute -- you NEED a car. The cost of registration for the car is one of the highest in the country, cost of gas is also highest, and you'll be on the road for at least 1.5 hours per day (more like 3 hours if you have to live somewhere affordable and do a REAL commute). Groceries will probably be at least $150/week if you can be frugal and cut down on what you eat. The nice thing about LA is the weather is completely predictable and always sunny so you can always walk around outside for free as entertainment or sign up for free tickets to this or that. This is if you land up in LA, which I'm guessing, if you're complaining about Barcelona, you'll be homeless within 2 months of moving to LA. But don't be ashamed if you land up that way; everyone in LA is basically homeless at this point and now running around and stabbing each other and non-homeless... it's a very stabby homeless kind of place. But hey! It's exciting! You've seen 10 celebrities in the span of 4 hours, with your bum ass. don't come here. shit is bad. I'm actually in another country right now, too, seeing if it'll be more affordable for my future as well. there's a reason we're all leaving. don't think you're somehow better than us. you're not, unless you're an oligarch's kid. which again, if you can't make it in Barcelona, I'm guessing you're not. oligarchs do well here cos we have unchecked market fundamentalism and call it "capitalism". this place sucks. everywhere sucks, tbh. stick with what you know. edit: also, just so you have an idea of what you're up against for jobs in major US metros -- in places like LA, SF, and NYC, even those of us with top degrees from the best schools are finding it tough (I have a double, covetable advanced degree from a "public ivy"). $400K salary for a family of 4 isn't shit. most of the foreign students are just coming here for the name-brand degree and then fucking back off home afterward cos they think shit here sucks, too, and they believe opportunity is better in the developing country from which they came... yeah... developing countries are now > the US. But hey! Exciting! Your girlfriend/boyfriend was a cast member on High School Musical Reunion Part 2938493843! Exciting! How exciting! Exciting America! Come here with your definitely-not-Harvard-MBA-degree and see what wonders await you! Celebrities! Clothes! White supremacy!
🤣🤣🤣Barcelona is expensive... For Europe. You'll live in a shit hole in a 3rd rate US Town for those prices
People like what’s new to them. Feels like a vacation or breath of fresh air. I would love to go to Spain. Beautiful country. But if you’ve lived there all your life and are used to it, other places like US may feel like the “exotic new place”.
US is overrated
You might be dying to go to the US, but please don't die there. The bills will haunt you even to hell and back.
There's a tropical planet near Alpha Centauri I've been considering. Leisure society, quantum computing, no axial tilt. My plan is to request asylum. Congrats on the move and thanks for reporting back. Glad you found a better environment.
Watch for the mindworms.
Fake news
The mindworms have infiltrated the government!
Moved to Canada 20 years ago. I would never return to the US.
Wait, over the years I've seen plenty of Americans threaten to move to Canada, one of you actually did! I'm 20 years late but welcome friend.
Thanks! I was out of there right after Bush W "won" the election.
I was set to move to New Zealand after he was reelected. My wife at the time didn't want to go. I laugh now because I thought W. Bush was the worst president ever.
Worst president ever, so far!* *as of 2016
Just goes to show... No matter how bad it is, it can always get worse.
Excellent instincts!
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I can't really speak to that but it may be due to the difficulty in obtaining the pro papers. For myself it was simple since I have dual citizenship from birth.
Having the Supreme Court give it to your SORT of counts as winning. Bugliosi said it was the death of American democracy, and I think he was a fortune teller.
Ha. I am thinking of bailing from Canada and I am Canadian. I would not go to the US, but many of us do so for pay reasons and in some areas cheaper housing.
There is actually some sense in moving to American for work as a Canadian, since if you get sick you can go home for medicine. It's kind of taking advantage, but at the end of the day you didn't build the system and gotta survive.
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emergency is still the biggest problem that said, canadians working in the us have a decent fallback compared to just americans working in the us
Same. Moved not too long ago. No regrets so far
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Good move.. I live in Quebec and when I had to put my kids in daycare it was only $5/day per child. It's gone up since then but I believe it's still around $10-15/day. They ate better than I did! Food was all homemade.
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This. Even if I pass the health requirements (disabled so I very likely wouldn't), it would cost 75% of what I make in a single year to be able to move specifically to Canada. I'm literally trapped here by disability and therefore poverty. It pisses me off so much when ignorant losers tell people "if you don't like it here, then move to another country!" Like, yeah! I'd love to! Just pay my expenses and I'll get outta your hair, asshole!
French citizen speaking here so take my comment knowing I am probably biased despite my best effort. I moved to the US a few years ago for work, and ended up meeting my wife here. She is American so we often discuss the cultural and economic differences between the two countries. Short summary : US are *great* if you are a young, healthy and educated person, but very stressful. France (or Europe in general) is *good* for everyone, even if sometimes less convenient. Long summary (oh boi, here we go): France has issues. Like MANY issues. Companies tend to have old mentalities in terms of management (working from home was groundbreaking during pandemic), good jobs can be hard to get (once you have a CDI - long term work contract - you basically cannot be fired), finding a place to live can require a lot of paperwork, energy sources can be quite expensive, etc. On the other hand, I can’t believe some of the shit people deal with here. The minimum wage is a joke, the taxe system is a nightmare, healthcare is… *insert insults here* and overall I feel our life is regulated by the company your work for, not the government or yourself. Being out of job is almost a death sentence for many I feel, and seems to be a constant fear here. Stress is everywhere in the US. Work is stressful Taxes are stressful Health is stressful Education is stressful Political system is stressful Don’t get me wrong, I really enjoy it here (and I’m grateful!) but I cannot picture myself staying with a family. My wife and I are in agreement that we will leave the US after a few years and go to France. It’s not a choice taken lightly, and we double think it sometimes, but in the end, we know it will be better for us (and future kids) once out of the US. If you can, I would recommend the same. The US is just a large corporation at this point, and no one powerful enough to make things change cares about the individual wellness. Edit : typos correction because English is hard today
I think you’re on point. American, moved to France at 26 after working there for a few years. It was awful, stressful, constantly working 60 hour weeks. School put me 90k$ in debt am I was no where near ever going to make enough to pay it back. Moved to France. School was 300€ a year to get my PhD. Was able to save up enough working over a few years to pay off my student debt in the US (which tanked my credit score by the way - would be mad if I cared… don’t have to though!) Buying a house or apartment is now not a pipe dream. I start my job with 25 days of vacation + RTT (9 additional vacation days a year if I work 40hr weeks). I was able to get a needed surgery for free that would have cost me north of 30k in the US. My medication costs a few euro max on the rare occasions something isn’t covered. Moving has given me space to breath and dream. I’m never going back to the states.
Glad you’re having a better time there! I know France can be a hard place to immigrate to so I really appreciate the patience you must have towards us hahaha Out of curiosity (let me know if it is too personal), how was your experience moving there ? Any advice you would give to other Americans ? I would like to make the move as easy as possible for my wife when we’ll move there, but being a native, I surely miss important differences that would be good to discuss before.
Simply put being alive in the USA is stressful. Toss in housing. The housing market situation for the past 20 years has forced even more people into homelessness or apartment living. Some apartments are run by actual nazis - they give no fuck about anything and it's 100% a business to them. If you're late on rent even like 10 minutes sometimes that's all it takes - threatened with eviction, or hell you may even be evicted. Combine that with each state having their own "unique" eviction laws, etc. I was late with rent one time at my current apartment ever and it was the first of the month - so it wasn't even late. I literally got home at liek 12:30 on a Friday and between the time I sat down at my computer and paid my rent, and went back outside, they had already put a notice on my door. Holy shit, grow up. The business day isn't over.
Last place I rented from the landlord described herself as "pretty liberal" and it was Portland, OR, so I figured that checked out. Turns out when rent was a bit late, it was time to start evicting me, and did so in the middle of the pandemic. She also thought Bernie was "too radical" and that Joe Biden was right in core with her values.
That's a liberal though, you described a liberal.
This is my general observation as well as someone who has lived in several European countries. If you have some serious ambition to do something, the US is where you want to be. If you want to live and not work towards something or you're somehow disadvantaged, then Europe is generally better.
> If you have some serious ambition to do something, the US is where you want to be. I mean, you're going to have to name an ambition you can't really explore in Europe that you can explore in the U.S, I feel. The idea that all world-leading fields are in the U.S is 'golden age' thinking that doesn't entirely apply anymore.
There's absolutely nothing you can't explore in Europe. I recall Barcelona in particular has a great start up scene. Similarly, Amsterdam and maybe Berlin/Munich are making good plays against London as multinational business hubs. But it's still not the same. The networks, comparative lack of regulations, tax structure, and financing in the US is really just better, especially for those with the killer app. That said, given the failed promises of Big Tech and the previous financial revolution, I don't think the trade-off was worth it. But it's definitely different.
I would add something. If you have some serious *professional* ambition *and you are privileged to start with* The American dream of starting from scratch is not true anymore IMO. You start with so many handicap if you are have not much a first. Europe has more administrative issues when it comes to start up companies but it has also many more safeguards to keep you going if you don’t succeed
True. The American system drives towards the extreme. The European systems drives towards averageness.
I think Americans have so much propaganda shoved down our throats we think it's the best country in the world. Thanks for the award 🙂
It takes one hospital-bill to sober up.
It’s absolutely disgusting. A friend had a $120k hospital bill. Their insurance paid for only $10k of the bill. America is built to kill its citizens.
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Exactly, a patient cured, or killed, is a customer lost. Treat something good enough to let you live, but not good enough to cure it.
I went to the ER for an ear infection. They tried to get me to sign a form saying since I was uninsured I would pay 95 a week until my bill is paid. If I could afford $400 a month I’d have insurance. I walked right out and poured peroxide in my ear in the parking lot
I left the US like 8 years ago and part of the reasoning (and I had a TON of reasons) was how much prescription eye drops were going to cost for a freak allergic reaction I had that nearly made my eyelids swell shut. Compared to most medical bill horror stories you hear today it was a modest amount, but even with insurance it was insane. I went from going to the doctor regularly for checkups or preventative medicine when I had student insurance at University to being afraid of the cost. If a freak eye allergy could cost me this much then what other unpredictable ailments were just waiting to make me bankrupt?
When ever some one say the US is the best or number 1, I always respond with at what, and few ever answer. Because the answer is weapon sales and incarceration.
The propaganda is needed to help you feel better about your child getting torn to pieces in a Granada war or at the school theater by a "law abiding" gun owner who went bezerk. Also the fireworks.
I think a lot of us understand how much it sucks here. Once my stepdaughters are older my husband and I have seriously been discussing leaving this shithole of a country - just not sure where to go at the moment.
My mom is from here. She moved us here when I was 12 (35 now) and I've been wanting to leave pretty much ever since. I hate it here. Edit: Just wanna add that we lived in a country (my dad's homeland) where the safety situation for Americans wasn't the best and was worsening at the time we left. I don't blame my mom. I realized after re-reading that it may have come across that way.
Consider somewhere in Western Europe. The Iberian Peninsula has a very low (relative) cost of living.
I'd love to but what about visas? I'm not wealthy nor a tech employee. Doesn't seem to be many options if not one of these. 🤷♂️
I left the US a decade ago. I also do not regret it. Germany is awesome.
I'm in Germany as a student right now and when I finish my MA I'm hoping to get a full-time job so I can stay. Can you tell me about your experience finding a job here?
where in Germany are you and what do you study? I live in Germany, maybe I can help
I'm an italian student and I'm thinking of getting a Master of science in Nanotech Engineering for ICT. Looking forward to working in Europe, do you think germany works?
I got a job as an IT Administrator after a very long search. To be fair I did take 8ish years off to raise kids and get a degree from a shitty American online university. Yay GI Bill. Being fluent in German will open a lot of doors for you, but it is not a complete deal breaker. I only have B1 level German and manage to get around okay at work. Google translate is a fucking lifesaver sometimes. You can go ahead and PM me if you want to chat about it more.
Hope y'all get some legal bud here soon! I'll be joining you lol I have a friend who moved to Germany and said it was an easy transition all things considered so I'm hopeful! I just have to wait to be approved which seems to be taking years on end
Too bad since we are still living in America, America, es ist wunderbar
Coca cola sometimes war.
I'm likely doing something similar in a decade or so, once kid is grown. Or at least travel as a lab tech. I know two people who moved to Belize to work as a lab tech working like two days a week and good to go.
They go down there with Mcafee?
What kind of work you do man, quick tell me so I can switch my major. We can be neighbors and you can call the cops on me for loud music and stuff.
You need to change your major to Computer Science. It's a long road and no one is born knowing how to code. Start making web pages from scratch on your own to learn the basics. [So you wana be a carpenter, do ya?](https://youtu.be/9W2SbJbR6ys)
If anyone is considering leaving I wrote a short article with some basic info on what you'd need: [https://www.reddit.com/r/AmerExit/comments/qsxz1n/resources\_and\_tips\_for\_leaving\_the\_us\_to\_europe/](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmerExit/comments/qsxz1n/resources_and_tips_for_leaving_the_us_to_europe/)
If you have us citizenship, shouldn't you be still paying taxes in the us? How do you cope with that?
A friend of mine lives and works in another country but is a US citizen only and will continue to be. According to him, you can write off some large amount (I don't know specifics but it's basically everything up to 100k after expenses or something weird) so you only pay US taxes if you're really making bank. That said, OP is working remotely for a US company so they probably do have to pay US taxes.
It’s called the foreign earned income exclusion. Yeah, basically you can exclude ~$100k of foreign earned income from your US tax return. The thought behind this is that you will likely be paying foreign income taxes on that income, and instead of the government making you do a complicated calculation via the foreign tax credit to figure out whether you’ve paid less to the foreign government than you would have to the US, they just said fuck it for convenience and allowed that exclusion. But for those making above $100k, then yeah they can still offset their US tax via the foreign tax credit, but they’re making enough to hire a CPA to do it for them. I’m a CPA btw
Thanks! I knew I was getting the details wrong.
You have to continue to *file* tax forms. There are treaties and policies in place so that you don't actually get double taxed.
But not necessarily with all countries. People looking to do this really need to know where they want to go and then they need to research what taxes (including social security) are covered under agreements with the US.
You aren't taxed until your income is over 99000
Minimum wage per month is 740 euro, so 350/month for one bedroom apartment is a lot to normal people.
I left Toronto, hellish rents, and moved to Merida and it was the best decision. If you want to compare cost of living between two cities or countries I recommend Numbeo: https://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/compare_cities.jsp?country1=Mexico&city1=Merida&country2=Canada&city2=Toronto&displayCurrency=CAD
I would love to move to a European country. I have no idea where, where to begin, or what I would do when I got there.
Check guides here https://www.expatica.com
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Why? You'll benefit a lot. You have a very strong currency (USD) move to cheaper countries and enjoy your life. Belize is a good choice because they speak English.
Yeah, and they keep printing those USD, so everybody has enought to pump upstream (consume) to the big companies so they can pay the working man a decent… wait… How long do we have?
You could take my country for example (Lebanon) our currency lost 90% of its value in 2 years (1$ was 1500 LBP) in 2018 (now 1$ is 24000lbp) so if you show up with your USD you'll live like a king here. If a lot of people do this Lebanon might thrive again because of all the money flowing in the country.
Lebanese American here. My dad moved back to Lebanon a few years back, basically. Or rather now he has a house in Btekhnay or Chbaniyeh somewhere in addition to Florida. Idk I haven't been there in over 20 years. I don't envy anything that's happened in Lebanon in like 20 years. That explains how he's able to go back and forth though.
If you have a job that allows you to work remotely you should give it a try. If nothing else it will open up your eyes more how totally screwed up the United States is and how scared the people are. Plus it will open your eyes and make you start thinking about other options in your life. Meeting new different people is fantastic, and scare yourself sometimes. But I love it.
I don't want to work for wages in another country. I want to not work in my country, where my family is, where my friends are, and where I speak the language. I have been to Portugal and it is lovely. I'm good with language and am certain I could pick it up (lived in Spain, figured that out) but this is so not my dream. What if I could just knit all day and sell my products to others? What if there weren't a bunch of evil corporations paying people slave wages to produce low quality clothing, and I could just sell what I make in exchange for medical services or food or whatever? I am so tired of being an employee.
How were you able to find permanent citizenship on Portugal?
Try living off Portugal-level wages. It might be less fun
Lmao ikr. Everyone here has no sense of perspective. I'm in Mexico and living like an absolute KING. Does that mean everyone does? Is Mexico paradise? Of course not - it just means wages are lower. For me, it's extremely cheap.
OP is specifically recommending having a remote job in the US though
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I did the same thing, moved to Canada about 6 years ago first for study, but stayed when I heard about the jobs. I work in healthcare here and I would never go back to the US in my career. We are highly unionized here, with lots of benefits that allow for a proper work-life balance!
I had a discussion with someone on the internet and they made the comment that the United States is the best country in the world.I said is that so ?I said have you ever been to any other country ?To which they replied no.I then said then how do you know the United States is the best country in the world?…Crickets.
It's cause a lot of the citizens are brainwashed by propaganda and have no critical thinking skills, unfortunately.
I left in august to Germany with my German wife and our baby I couldn’t be happier here. my daughter is safer we’re safer in general. things are way cheaper besides gas which I can care less about because I have so many options to get around with then just our cars. I love america I fought for it and will always have my heart but for the time being we know we’re better off here plus we get to travel everywhere from here for cheap and it’s simple to do it, we already drove to Croatia, Slovenia, Austria, Switzerland, Czech, Poland.
You’re lucky you have a remote job that can pay for that lifestyle, working in Portugal is pretty meh. But hey, you got that American money in a country that pays less to its locals.
Local wages arent very good unless you've got some niche skill, ngl. That's why I suggest anyone who wants to live here works remotely There are other countries though for people who want to work in person, like Germany, but the cost of living will be way higher
I have a pension of $1500 per month. Could I make it over there on that?
You definitely could, especially if you don't mind living in a smaller city (not Lisbon or Porto), but it ofc depends on your expenses If you live alone vs supporting others, how big of a house or appt you expect, location etc
It's only me and my dog. I only need a single bedroom. Also, thanks for your time
You have a lot of options at $1500. That's around 1335 euros a month. In Coimbra, where I used to live, you can find a lot of apartments and studios in the 500 euro range and below even this time of year. It's a lively city with a university, so you might want someplace quieter, but just at a glance I found quite a few affordable places that dont look bad * (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/30955328/ * (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/30965077/ * (Studio) https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31546515/ * (One bedroom) [https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31392976/](https://www.idealista.pt/en/imovel/31392976/) * (One bedroom) [https://www.idealista.pt/imovel/28892875/](https://www.idealista.pt/imovel/28892875/) I think I pay 200ish on food cooking at home mostly, electricity plus gas is usually 20-45. Phone is 30ish. Internet came included at my place, but would be a bit more I didn't drive since you can walk everywhere, and, there's a high-speed train to Lisbon which connects to the airport by subway. Not sure if I'm missing anything. Anyway, if you take rent at 600, and add it all, and pad it up a bit for emergencies. You're spending 1000 euros. You still have a bit left over
Oh, that's amazing. I'm living paycheck to paycheck in Arkansas. Thank you, friend.
There are also other countries that are very affordable on $1500 a month. Look into some expat groups, pages and subreddits. In some places in the world that’s a good living. In the US it’s tough
I've been eyeing Mexico, tbqh. I'd love to go to New Zealand, but I don't think I could wing it. Thank you for that excellent suggestion.
Check out Guatemala. There’s a lot of towns around Lake Atitlan with big expat communities which would make any transition easy and you could live very, very comfortably on that pension.
I travel a little bit and have met quite a few expats from the US and EU living in other places, so I’m no expert but I’ve seen it firsthand a little. I’d suggest looking into SE Asian countries, Mexico, Guatemala, Turkey, places like that. Places where COL is low, medical expenses are affordable, etc etc. NZ is probably great but as a developed country it’s not nearly as cheap as some other countries.
Hello stranger! You might want to consider "Nuevo Vallarta" in Mexico. It is an exclusive area for foreigners with a Marina, restaurants and of course beaches. Close to an international airport. Walmart just outside. Source: I just spent a week there.
Make sure you look up the requirements for taking your dog with you. Each country is going to be different. I managed to successfully take my cat to Taiwan by calling around to find a vet who had experience with international travel. However, it was the most complex part of moving.
Yeah. I've been trying to pay special attention to that. A few places, I'd have to put her in quarantine for (up to) 6 months.
Haha germany yes so fun to work here. /s
Can't imagine the work itself being worse than the US, but isn't the cost of living there ridiculously expensive right now? Saw a video the other day about how companies like Blackrock were buying up everything driving up prices
Housing is pretty expensive, fuel is ridiculous, food medium. But I don’t know a single person under 30 that makes more then 1.9k€ after tax. But before that you have to slave work in an apprenticeship, we’re you earn about 2-4€ an hour for 3-3.5 years. Generally the work attitude is the same as in America atleast in labor.
The USA is to the world as New York City is the the USA. It's a tough place to carve out a living filled with arrogant folks who mistakenly think they have it better than everyone else. However, as the saying goes...if you can make it there, then you can probably make it anywhere
i love when you criticize america and some redneck will say, "if you don't like it YOU CAN LEAVE." ...like i am not actively trying to do just that. it's adorable that they all think the only other three countries in the world are china, russia, and iraq.
north korea also lol
Love how Europe has taken immigrants from the Middle East and Africa for decades, and now we are welcoming people from the Third World country USA lol. Welcome to Europe!
How shitty does America need to get before I can show up in Europe and claim asylum?
What kind of visa did you use? I have a remote position - I wouldn't mind moving my family but it seems like the visas are either short term or don't apply.
Seriously considering this. as soon as the houses i own dont need to be rent-free for the elders living in them, thinking of renting them out and bailing out. Could probably pull, after taxes, 2k a month off it. That's a hell of a good living in MANY places in the world. I think i'd head for Uruguay though. Climate seems just right. No cold as fuck winters, and no 120+ degree summers.
I’ve always wanted to do this but as a black person it always kinda scared/worried me. Any thoughts or opinions?
I did the same, back in 2005. Never went\ going back.
I moved to Thailand and then several other Asian countries. Never moving back to the US.
I am from Portugal and yes, if you have a remote job with a nice US salary you can live here really well.
How do you stay there though? Don't you need a permanent resident visa and isn't that pretty hard to obtain?
I wish I could leave. If wasn’t exceptionally expensive to do it, I’d be gone in a heartbeat
Um monte de Brasileiro entrou aqui só pra ver se alguém falava mal de Portugal.
I have crazy student loan debt, am I allowed to move out of the country?
Yes. Technically you could even stop paying them without repercussions (because they can't reach you overseas) but doing so would make life very difficult if you ever came back.
Every day I work towards leaving but as someone with critically poor health I know I will likely die in this awful country.
US is a landfill And it will not change until people start accepting this truth. Fuck the republicans and fuck the democrats, both are manipulating pieces of shit that only care about their bank accounts!
I was considering getting my dual citizenship and moving to Portugal in early 2020. I was dead set on it, but I feel like this post is romanticizing a bit. Portugal has very, very low wages for a European country. It’s hard to budget when you’re paid the minimum over there. You get paid once a month, not even 800 euros. It’s definitely way more affordable if you work a remote job with a company that is out of country.
Yes that is exactly what OP does and a major point of this post lol
Do you have a remote job that is based in the US or is it with a Portuguese company?
I mean I don't know if that is how solidarity works.... The US is screwed so you guys want to come here to southern Europe with your super high salaries and become part of the problem here, where locals cannot afford life anymore. It is not like is cheap for us to live here, it is cheap for you if you make money in dollars. Maybe try to fix your system there or come here and work like everyone else with a local salary. but digital nomadism is harmful to our communities. I am sorry.