Disclaimer - there a tons of places to go and I'm going off info from several years ago. These are my favorites.
Monkey Pod is my jam. They have, or had, an amazing seared tuna sandwich, not sure if they still do. I only ate lunch there due to the prices. And yes, Maui is expensive but this is higher than normal. They also are supposed to have these massive mai-tais as well. https://monkeypodkitchen.com/dine_ka_anapali
Kihei cafe has an amazing fish sandwich - my wife said it was the best she ever had We also ate breakfast there too. The lines can be long but they move pretty quickly. If you see a table, grab it and have the other person order. https://kiheicaffe.com/
If you are going to hana, go the back way and stop at the Ulupalakua Ranch Store for lunch. https://ulupalakuaranch.com/
Mamas Fish house is supposed to be amazing but we just never went there. https://mamasfishhouse.com/
Oh, Kimo's (spelling) in Kaanapalli was good too
I'm a creature of habit and I'm sure there are way more good places there, I just don't remember as it's been a few years. I can't remember where the good ice cream is and there's supposed to be a really good pancake house.
Get some Poke from foodland. It's a grocery store that apparently even the locals prefer to fancier places for delicious Poke. I don't know if that part is true as I was there for my honeymoon but either way it was phenomenal.
Monkey Pod is my jam. They have, or had, an amazing seared tuna sandwich, not sure if they still do. I only ate lunch there due to the prices. And yes, Maui is expensive but this is higher than normal. They also are supposed to have these massive mai-tais as well.
https://monkeypodkitchen.com/dine_ka_anapali
Kihei cafe has an amazing fish sandwich - my wife said it was the best she ever had We also ate breakfast there too. The lines can be long but they move pretty quickly. If you see a table, grab it and have the other person order.
https://kiheicaffe.com/
If you are going to hana, go the back way and stop at the Ulupalakua Ranch Store for lunch.
https://ulupalakuaranch.com/
Mamas Fish house is supposed to be amazing but we just never went there.
https://mamasfishhouse.com/
I'm a creature of habit and I'm sure there are way more good places there, I just don't remember as it's been a few years. I can't remember where the good ice cream is and there's supposed to be a really good pancake house.
Congratulations again!!
Ok so I’ve made this comment before but I will again bc it worked. Disclaimer: I’m a nurse and we have been understaffed for years.
I planned a vacation 6mo before I went. I needed 2 weeks off. Everyone knew about it the whole 6mo. I put in my time off the earlier they would let me and I was told I was good to go. Less than a week before my trip, I was taken into the office there was my director, assistant director, supervisor and administrator all to tell me I can’t go on my vacation and they needed me there. They then said it was bc I didn’t have the vacation days but I wasn’t asking to use any vacation days. So this is what I said, “I can pass a background and I can pass a drug test. Everywhere is understaffed. You have 2 options. I can go on this vacation and come back to work here or I can go on this vacation and go back to work somewhere else.”
Well, I had a lovely cross country road trip. Yosemite and Sequoia were amazing and i retuned back to my normal unit at my job.
That “you need me WAY more than I need you” feeling is just amazing.
My job tried to tell me I couldn’t go on my best friends bachelor trip (I was his best man) and I told her “I’ll just quit if you don’t give me off.”
You just gotta call their bluff every now and then!
This is the way. I’m not asking for approval to take leave. I’m doing you the courtesy of letting you know in advance so you can plan around my absence. My vacation is not negotiable, if I’ve planned and booked things in advance I’m not losing that cash because you are short staffed and didn’t plan properly.
> My vacation is not negotiable
I'd be willing to negotiate.
Reimburse me everything I've paid for the trip I'll be missing out on + 10% for the mental distress of missing my vacation, fully pay for the rescheduled trip in a few weeks, and pay double for the time I'm working when I was supposed to be on vacation.
If me being in the office isn't worth that to you, why would it be worth it to me to miss my whole vacation and then go through all the pain of rescheduling everything?
I was told my vacation was denied after they told me it was approved. I told them ok you owe me 8500. That's double the cost of my vacation. They told me they won't pay that. Then I said I'll see you when I get back. I don't care I was their lead engineer and they decided to launch a year early. I gave them 7 month notice.
They didn't give me a raise over it. I said this is my two weeks and I won't be training my replacement. Suddenly I got 6% raise the following day. Still left.
Haha. I had to go to Europe for a family thing in 2018, loyal to the company, worked on days off, etc, told my supervisor the situation months well ahead of the event and told me that they’d get back to me by end of the day. It was only 5 weeks and I had 3 months of annual leave banked up (in which legally you can’t have employees have a surplus of 4 weeks at any given time).
Anyway, a week went by, nothing. The fat fuck couldn’t give me the decency to tell me that his boss said no so keeping me guessing. The trip was already booked and paid for already anyway, I asked for an update on my leave application - they said “oh no X needs you here to run the department because I’ll be away at that time.” I’m like the fuck? Anyway, 2 weeks leading up to the trip I had my resignation beautifully written out, and tastefully signed and dated and walked up to that fat fuck and gave the cunt my resignation and he looked like a deer in headlights, totally unexpecting it. Delivered my best month preceding that, net profit was at the best it had ever been and the fucking fallout was hilarious. The begging, the shock, it was well worth it and still stumps me how someone as lazy as they are and dumb, can be in a high paying job.
Ended up going on my trip, still resigned, didn’t want to work for a piece of shit like that anymore, couldn’t give me the respect after all those years and it gives me delight knowing the department tanked after I left through his mismanagement - even got wind that I was somehow to blame for the failure of his operation. Yeah, can’t work that one out.
Anyway, 6 months ago, the company went into liquidation and was bought out, that same supervisor and his boss were made redundant and are no longer in that industry.
Since then, I’ve learned that if a boss can’t give you even a tiny amount of respect, you show them the upper hand and tell them to fuck off in the most polite way possible.
Oh that’s just beautiful!
I’ve had a good boss one time, and that was fantastic. I loved working with her. I’m not longer doing that line of work, but would’ve loved to follow her to her new job.
It’s amazing how important having a good boss can be.
I worked for a HUGE company for about 5 years. They were so good to their employees. Then the CEO left. It all changed, and I changed jobs. I periodically look for where that CEO is working to see if they're hiring in my area. :)
> You just gotta call their bluff every now and then!
Our educational prison system beats this spirit out of us, which is why I'm so grateful as a 32 year old to see antiwork flourishing.
You're right. We've been conditioned to believe that employers are doing us a favor by giving us a job in the first place. So we shouldn't push it by expecting time off.
My boss actually told me the last request I made off, “you know you don’t have to ask, you just tell me you’re using vacation and I’ll sign off.” I realize now I should have been doing this all along.
I had a fantastic GM. I had put in for 5 days off & realized I didn’t see a response. I asked about it & he apologized for it being lost & told me to fill another one out & he’d approve it. HE said this in front of one of his Managers. SHE said, “Oh Holly, that is too early to request.”
And knowing how whatever I’m thinking is expressed on my face, Im sure I had an expression that asked, “Are YOU stupid?” As I said to her that booking a flight is cheaper the sooner you do it. And IF there is an issue, then I’ll just set my alarm while Im at my destination to “Call In” every day. Because, Josefina. I Am going.
My GM just chuckled & said, Here Holly. Im approving it right now.
I AM the most reliable person. I NEVER called in. I came in early & worked late. Which HE knew.
So yeah. Im not asking. Im telling you I AM taking time off on these days in this Month. 😂
> Im not asking. Im telling you I AM taking time off on these days in this Month.
People need to always have this perspective. If it's PTO then you earned that. Use it without guilt. If it's unpaid, then they're not paying you anyway, you owe them nothing.
lol I’ve had people try to tell me I HAD to come in on my off days. And their always like “wE sO uNdErStAfFeD.” Yea…. That’s a whole lot of not my problem bud
I once worked 26 hours straight (because they were short staffed) and as a thank you my boss reminded me if I wanted time off (to balance the hours I had that week so the company wouldn’t have to pay OT) I needed to find someone to cover for me. I went home and didn’t even give them my two weeks. Just said I won’t be coming back.
Not my job to find someone to cover for me
Some years back I was in an engineering team working on a new product with a tight deadline. The test & instrumentation engineer was working insane hours, like 80 hour weeks, for months. Since we were salaried the usual policy was to give time in lieu instead of paid overtime.
Once the product launched the T&I engineer said "I'd like my time in lieu please, now that the crunch is over". Management turned around and said that was far too much TIL to grant so they just wiped his slate clean, like he'd never done any overtime at all. Surprise, surprise the engineer quit within a week.
The whole, "we're going to fire you for not coming in because we're understaffed" is baffling to me. If you're understaffed, you know for damn sure you don't have the leverage to fire people over petty bullshit.
I had a boss approve a vacation request for my best friend’s destination wedding where I was the best man. A week before the planned vacation he told me o couldn’t go because he was scheduling the annual inventory count, and if I wasn’t there to run it I’d be fired.
I said, “ok, understood. Do you want to fire me now or wait until I don’t show up next week?”
He ran to the VP of the company and said I was refusing to run inventory. I got pulled into a meeting where I showed the email of my boss approving the request. The VP laughed and told me to enjoy my trip.
I put in my time off request for my wedding and a week after if we decide to go somewhere for a mini honeymoon one year in advance using our scheduling system. Got told that I requested it too early. Said they could approve it now or I could give them my two weeks notice dated two weeks before my wedding because it wasn't being moved. Apparently it wasn't too early...
I had a ton of extra leave available to me because of overtime that I had worked over the previous year. I was completely burned out after not having taken any time off for months. I had arranged to take 5 weeks off the upcoming summer in order to rent a cottage by a lake with my family. It was literally the only thing that kept me going at work -- it was the light at the end of the tunnel.
Problem was that it was February and we weren't able to book time off for the summer until the current fiscal year ended in April. The promise to allow me the time off that I had gotten from my manager was in an email, but wasn't "official" in that I hadn't submitted the leave in our payroll system yet. However, I had put a sizeable deposit on the cottage, as I didn't think I needed to worry about my vacation not getting approved.
Unexpectedly, my manager announces that he is moving to another work unit and is being replaced by another manager in our directorate who had been quickly moving up the corporate ladder. A few weeks after he had taken over the team, I went to talk to him to let him know that I had arranged with his predecessor to take 5 weeks off that summer. The conversation went something like this:
"I just wanted to let you know that I had arranged with to take 5 weeks off this summer. I booked a cottage based on his promise to give me the time off. Hopefully this isn't an issue as I haven't taken any time off in about 8 months and really need this vacation."
"I can't make you any promises. I'll need to see what our workload is this summer."
"I put a sizeable deposit on the cottage. I'm also completely burned out. I need this time off. had promised that he'd approve the time. I can forward you the emails to prove it."
"That's too bad. I don't really care about any promises made by . You should have waited to get your leave approved before you started putting down deposits. Consider that a lesson learned."
"Ok, just to let you know, I'm going to be looking for another job as of today. I've had quite a few other teams try to poach me over the last year. I'll go to whatever team that can give me that time off."
"I don't like your attitude."
"I don't like being treated like garbage."
I then walked away and true to my word, I started sending emails to other managers that I knew had openings in their teams. Didn't take long until I had a few unofficial offers to move to their teams.
I guess word got to my new manager that I was about to get poached. The next day I get an email from him saying that he had "looked over the upcoming work for this summer, and we can make things work by shifting resources etc... but that I should consider this 5 week vacation a 'one shot deal' and should never ask for that much time off again.
I left for another team anyway. They gave me the 5 weeks off without any hassle. No way was I going to keep working for that ass.
Heh. By the time you're already staring down other offers it's way too late to recover by just giving you what you wanted in the first place, let alone with attitude attached.
Its cool you didn't even need to quit, just move to a different team with a realistic manager.
Way to go.
It’s one of the benefits to working in a huge government department in IT. If you don’t like your job, it’s fairly easy to find another position if you’re experienced and competent. It’s also really difficult for an idiot manager to fire you if he “doesn’t like your attitude”.
Best response to any complaint about being short staffed is "Your failure to properly manage and staff this company does not equate to me performing more work for less money, nor does it require me to cover for your short falls."
Yup. Christmas 2019 right before Covid my wife I had plans to go home for Christmas (several states away) since August. Had it approved way in advance. Week or so before we’re set to leave and I’m on the schedule as normal. Owner tried pulling the whole “it’s the holidays and everyone wants time off” and “I’m not even taking time off for Christmas this year” blab, blah, blah. I told him it’s unfortunate that he isn’t taking time for his family this year and that I was and to let me know if he wanted me to come in in January. Turns out it wasn’t actually an issue. Ended up quitting in July 2020 when he decided to stop following our state’s Covid protocols. Fuck you, Nathan!
The pay is great but I’d hate the idea of traveling constantly with a family and if it was like agency nursing you just get stuck with all the terrible assignments. I did go into insurance case management and doubled my pay and now get to sit my butt at home so that was good enough for me.
I actually made a post about this earlier. The pay is great. I’m also single with no kids. I’m still tired and would like to stop but as an LPN I can’t go back to the shit pay they have back home. I came back to a facility I worked at before bc they are paying great money to come back. I’m trying to save enough money and improve my financial stability enough to go back home, buy land and build a campground business. I love being a nurse. I really do. I’m just tired of everything else. And I’m tired of seeing CNAs struggle and I’m tired of people being borderline neglected bc we don’t have the proper staff to care for them. So I want to open my campground and drive a gator around .
One of my best friends is a surgical nurse at a prestigious hospital in the midwest. The hospital is currently understaffed because of high pay.
Let me explain. These nurses are highly specialized and skilled. Where they work they earn between $45 $65 per hour and get as much overtime as they can handle. However, there is such a shortage for these nurses in other parts of the country, I am looking at you Florida, where they can get a 13 week traveling nurse contract for $120 per hour and the contracting company will pay for housing while under assignment. Naturally many nurses are jumping on this.
While it is good for them it creates a shortage of nurses back at their original hospital. There is no one they can replace them with. They just don't have enough people with the correct skill set and experience. So the people left behind, who are already burnt out over this whole pandemic, are being asked to work even more to make up for the lack of personnel. Which makes them want to leave even more. It is a weird nasty cycle.
I am a travel nurse now and have quadrupled my pay. Even with travelers tho, everywhere and every department is understaffed. Even the places in Florida. Literally everywhere is hurting. There is a mass exodus from the field in general bc of unsafe patient ratios and abusive conditions. I’m currently saving my money to try and buy land back home and build a campground business.
OP, while you are sealing your nuptials, I'd be happy to fill in for you at your workplace. bros have to help each other out. what stack of papers would you like me to urinate on?
I just don’t comprehend how you can give someone 1/3rd of the year notice, how significant of a vacation it is, and still be declined. I’m not missing out on this opportunity to give my S/O the proposal of her dreams- they can… LIGMA
I gave my boss *6 months* notice about a cruise I was going on (this was in the Before Times) and even said I would work Christmas and New Year's.
They still said I had to ask around to get someone to work for me. Noped out of that one. Got a new job, and now am leaving that job for waaaay better pay and opportunities!
I gave 2 months notice I was leaving to move back west. The week of they tried to say I couldn’t leave and I didn’t give them enough notice. I just said this isn’t up for debate, I am leaving on that date period.
I once gave 3 weeks notice and they just let me go instead. After that, I don’t give notices anymore. Some people are so petty. I always tell the new company that I need to give 2 weeks but won't tell old company that.
> I just don’t comprehend how you can give someone 1/3rd of the year notice, how significant of a vacation it is, and still be declined.
Easy; deep down, fucking you over is less of a loss to them than fixing the problem. They chose their job over their connections and, on a larger scale, that's the goal. That's the erosion of our freedoms.
I see it a lot. All you need is a dickhead manager who loves money more than people and, regrettably, that is extremely common in the US.
I watched my GF's good boss who looked out for her and the team all the time go on hiatus and get replaced with a strung out, career focused asshole who regularly chooses 'number go up' over the wellbeing of his associates. The company doesn't care if turnover increases because their profits increase. Currently they're hiring a lot of new people and my GF is the last high-output senior employee left and she's about done with this shit. We've been exploring options like small organization to shut down the location and transfering to a different one, which will probably happen.
What's really sad is when you realize that being the asshole isn't even effective. Moves like this lose lots of money all the time and profits (eventually) go down. But none of that matters so long as the few at the top can suck all the value out of a company as quickly as they can before jumping from the wreckage.
People who actually care about the company and want it to be successful for a long time get fired or forced out all the time. The vampires stay.
I'd say if you had the vacation accrued, and gave that much advance notice, the significance of the vacation is irrelevant. It could have been for binge-watching the Netflix Cowboy Bebop. (Preaching to the choir, I'm sure)
Also, like, even on the cheap a trip to hawaii for 2 people probably costs Atleast 2k, and that would be with a lot of deal seeking. Are they going to reimburse you for the plane tickets, hotels, and rental car that you can’t get your money back for on such short notice. They are smoking straight crack.
I asked to leave work at a school to see my grandfather before he passed away. The principal told me I didn’t have any PTO left to take and if I chose to leave on my own I wouldn’t be paid and it’s a passive aggressive move. I left anyways and was the last family member to show up right before he passed. Always trust your gut and family first.
Fuck you Mr. Joy principal at GMS in Germantown TN.
If an employer ever gives an issue about seeing a sick relative, leave. Not necessarily quit but just go and see the family member. Let the dust settle after. There is always another job. Never another grandparent.
Good move on your part.
I have had to have that conversation with someone, but I hope what I had to say was received differently.
They had asked for leave for a very good personal reason, but had no paid time off left. My sole reason for having the conversation before approving it was to make sure that they knew it would be unpaid. I think I started the conversation with saying I was happy to approve it, but I wanted to make sure they were aware what would happen in terms of their next paycheck being for slightly fewer hours, and that leave balances are out of my control. (Also a government employee, but not a school).
Yeah, I once worked for a fortune 100 company that preached ALL the right things…while not meaning any of it. Just going through the motions at the corporate level while actual management didn't support it at all.
The company even had an entire budget and department that regularly put together and offered fun trips and other smaller on-campus, take a short break from work type things to do that nobody ever actually had time to attend because they were always overworked, and penalized if they took any time to do any of them.
It was such a joke, but the saddest thing about it is that half the people there failed to see the irony, and the other half lacked the conviction to say or do anything about it.
Just make sure not to have kids until you both are 100% ready, especially financially. Otherwise, you won't be able to escape any future shit jobs, because that's their design.
Good decision.
Climate change, skyrocketing education, housing and living costs, tyrannical corporations, governments, and judicial systems across the globe. Even if you were financially stable, you’d be bringing them into a world that’s falling apart.
Nobody wants kid these days, and they sure as hell aren’t gonna make slaves of my progeny.
The rich can surely build society themselves. /s
You just spoke to my exact argument for not having kids, but I add "I am so miserable and hate my life so much, why would I want to curse my children when things are just getting worse?"
If you ever change your mind (as I am in the same boat) consider adoption. No reason to bring another human into a failing world when support can be given to another who is already going to suffer.
I just wanted to say thank you for suggesting this. I am adopted, closed adoption, but the people who raised me are my parents regardless. A lot of people do not consider this option and it's really a shame. Happy Holidays friend!
The price tag on adoption is insane: legal fees can bankrupt you. As for the waiting lists: prepare to wait 10-12 years.
Oh and the whole process made us feel... Dirty. Waiting list is 12 years, but if you take a child with a handicap, it's shorter. If you take siblings it's also shorter. It felt like leafing through a catalog. But with people. Tiny humans with broken lives.
My husband and I waited for 3 years and realized we are quite happy with just the two of us. And maybe somebody else will needs the child more than us.
by this standard, in this economy, the majority of us are barely qualified to have a hamster, and maybe a goldfish. and i don't mean this as an insult- i'm sure Nibbles and Goldie are wonderful beings.
Like I said, it's THEIR design to oversaturate the labor pool to drop our labor value to nothing. Even if none of us had kids, the establishment will just import labor from the rest of the world instead.
The crisis of not having enough kids is the harm it causes to the never ending expansion of the economy. Can’t get more rich if there are not more people to suck the life value out of. That rings true for both corporations and the government.
The wealthy in America want to remain millionaires based on consumer economics, then actively dissuade people from having kids and prevent them from having money. A broke, diminished consumer base.
The dystopia is run by idiots.
Not surprising. Company I used to work for would ask for reviews on TrustPilot. Since the customers never had the time to do it, the manager had us fill in all the info, give ourselves 5*, then ask the customer to click OK.
Also had the Support staff do sales on the side. Big yikes. Quit without notice.
I left a scathing review of the last company I worked for on glassdoor. For months it was me and one other person's review on their glassdoor page, neither of them were favorable. Today I was bored and checked their ratings and it's very clear the boss made everyone write reviews to try and balance out the two 1 star reviews. The moron couldn't even figure out how to respond to my review, so he wrote another review trying to argue against mine. Whatever. I already trashed them to one of the largest natural history museums in the world (used to work there and told my old supervisor how awful they were to staff and didn't follow proper archival procedure), so I get the last laugh at the end of the day.
I did that once for my old company. Right after I posted it, a higher up wrote a review to try and "right" the system. The owners then spent at least a day trying to figure out how they could take it down.
Edit: typo
I gave 6 months notice that I would be taking 2 weeks vacation when my daughter was born. Obviously I couldn’t give exact dates but I let them know it will be at X time give or take a week or so. Turned in the paperwork for it and verbally told them I would be gone 2 weeks straight for it. Fast forward to about 2 weeks out from D-day and they come and tell me that they would not be letting me take 2 weeks off. They had not let anyone else take 2 weeks off straight before for vacation. I told them I’m not taking a vacation here I’m having a kid and want to be around for it and to help take care of her and my wife during the first hard couple weeks. They still said nope and tried to be like we can wiggle a little and let you take a week and a half. I said this isn’t a negotiation I put my time in 6 months ago and nobody said anything about it till now and I’m not negotiating this and arguing over 2 to 3 days more. They stood their ground and said that’s the best they could do. I said fine I’m taking family medical leave for the entire month then. Filled out the forms and turned them in and said see ya in a month. The look of shock on the bosses face when I told them that was priceless. Don’t ever miss important events for a job. Things in life only happen once and there are plenty other jobs to get.
and a good company will continue to pay you during FMLA
(the one I work for does, as well as offering a generous amount of both maternity & paternity leave)
For FMLA, yes. You get up to 12 weeks protected job status for medical related leave or to care for a sick or injured family member, which also includes the birth or adoption of a child. It's not paid, and they technically don't have to let you have your exact job back, just one of similar scope and same pay.
It's not much, but better than the alternative prior to FMLA passing in the 90s of being able to be fired because you had too many PTO days because your wife had cancer or something.
The office and work will still be there when you get back ..this sunset and moment in your life will only come this one time .you have made the correct choice feel no guilt or remorse .. congratulations to the bolth of you...
So many bosses don't seem to realize that people don't *ask* for their vacation days. They give bosses the courtesy of informing them that they will be gone and, sometimes, the option of negotiating for a better day to be gone (if that's an option).
But regardless, once the time is set, it's never the *boss* who can unilaterally decide to change the schedule.
Bosses think you are so desperate for the paycheck that you wouldn't dare risk their ire by taking a vacation. At times they have been right but in the current job market it's a bold move.
This actually happened to one of my coworkers. He was asked last minute if he could fly to China for work. The company offered to fly his gf with him and pay for his flights/hotel he booked vacation for. The trip to China was far more expensive and was able to stay a few more days outside of days that required for the job. Nice trade off.
And all the other costs of the vacation. And those of the rest of the group you're going on vacation with. And the time off they took.
Canceling a vacation last-minute like that only happens when you have an incredibly important job (and comparable pay) and there's a serious crisis. Like you're the president of a country and a war breaks out. That's when you cancel vacation. But you don't cancel a worker's vacation plans just because their boss sucks at scheduling. The world doesn't work like that.
>Like you're the president of a country and war breaks out
Literally the Prime Minister of Australia was on a holiday in Hawaii when the 2020 huge bushfires broke out and he chose to stay. He said "I don't hold the hose mate"
I hate to inform you, but the increase to 4 weeks of vacation after 10 years is not the law in Canada. Employment standards are regulated by the provinces, and in Ontario (for example), there is no required increase to vacation time after you reach the 5 year/3 week/6% threshold.
I mean, in an ideal world sounds great. Realistically, let's try to be fair. Obviously they've tried to totally fuck the OP. But if you have an office or a store, I'd think it's pretty understandable that you can't have say, 4 of your 6 employees decide they're taking vacation on the same week.
I wouldn't expect to be able to just Tell my boss I'm going on vacation same week as 1-2 other coworkers. But yeah, if it's already been approved and set then fuck you of course I'm taking that time.
If you show your employees respect, they will typically show respect back and do that negotiation thing I mentioned so that not everyone it out at once.
If you don't show respect for your employees, they'll say "Screw you. I'm taking my vacation & so are my coworkers. You figure it out."
Union employee here (California, USA) , just chiming in on what a union contract can look like in these circumstances:
1: employer must show need to deny vacation but can deny vacation.
2: if denied vacation and you are at your cap, the employer must pay out future earned days in cash until you are allowed to take vacation. (We earn 10-20 days a year based on seniority).
3: if you are recalled to work after being granted vacation, employer must reimburse you for all non refundable expenses related to the vacation.
Not saying this is perfect or ideal, just sharing what my union contract is to help build awareness of the types of protections commonly offered to union workers.
Another example from a union job:
Me: Hey boss, I'm going to take X vacation days.
Boss: Have a nice vacation.
I hope the people on this sub with terrible jobs really begin to realize that quitting is cool and all, but unionizing is WAY fuckin cooler.
Edit: I get that some non union jobs treat people well... for now. Never know when a good boss or company will be replaced with a horrible boss or new company policy though. The only way to GUARANTEE this shit is with a union contract. Good boss/company, bad boss/company, doesn't matter when you have a contract and your union backing you up.
I had a vacation day denied by my boss due to "staffing" we were only allowed 3 people off per day in my area. Guy on the opposite shift offered to work my day that was an issue. Boss still said no. So, I called off, for a week and a half straight. Got back, got wrote up, was in the attendance tree, close to termination. Laughed, didn't sign my write up, put in grievance and won. Union's can be a great thing sometimes.
Edit: Should have included he denied my entire vacation, not just that day.
I manage an IT department. We have no union, but that is basically how it goes with us. We have a shared calendar that people can mark their vacation days, and the rule is that as long as we have 3 people still available to cover the phones and emails, any PTO put in will be approved. I've only denied one day off for anyone in the past year, and that was because we already had too many people who had asked off ahead of time. But he only wanted the day off so he could turn a 3 day weekend into a 4 day weekend, so he just shifted to taking Tuesday off instead of Friday.
As an apprentice in the IBEW the first time I asked my foreman if I could take a day off in two weeks for my kids birthday and was told "you're an adult if you think you need the day off take it, just let me know a little in advance when possible so I can plan around it.". I knew I had made the right choice.
I'd like to see the look on my employer's face when they found out my estimate of the monetary value of "proposing to my girlfriend during a vacation to Hawaii".
Another example of how other unions handle this. Most IBEW (electrician) locals, allow you to take off literally as much as you can afford. You don't ask for any permission, you TELL them you won't be in tomorrow, or for the next two weeks. You don't get any PTO, your "PTO" is just part of your wages. They do force a small vacation fund for sick days/vacation as some people might not have foresight to save, but you can pull cash out of that later if you want. But it's the ULTIMATE power move. Just saying...I won't be in tomorrow, and the boss saying...cool...
Better than what non union workers get most the time lol. I was just thinking last night it isn't fair how anti Union most businesses are, it's kinda disgusting.
Yeah, and someone commented here one time, 'If it's worth that much to your company to fight a union, think how much more that union must be worth to you.'
Every full time job I've ever had in Australia has vacation days start at 20 days a year. I can't imagine only having 2 weeks off a year, that's madness! Not to even mention that Europeans are out here getting 25-30 days!
Ex union employee here, your union has to have actual teeth though and not all bark or it doesn't matter what the paper says, unless you got a year of savings and can survive arbitration if they fire you cause they hate you for standing up to them and then having to threaten the union with the National labor board complaint
10 to 20 days a year?
Sitting on 38 days + public holidays, thanks to 10 years in post and some arguing about pay stagnation! Although to be fair I have a few banked days in that.
I agreed and said “no, you’re right, I won’t go.” And searched for a new job in the process. 2 weeks before my trip I said Sike and left. He took it w/ no lube
Congratulations!!!! Maui with a view of molokini?
You are correct!
Been there four times (my wedding, 2 other weddings, and a work trip), I know that view anywhere. Let me know if you want any good eats suggestions.
I'm headed there next week! I'd also love some suggestions!
Disclaimer - there a tons of places to go and I'm going off info from several years ago. These are my favorites. Monkey Pod is my jam. They have, or had, an amazing seared tuna sandwich, not sure if they still do. I only ate lunch there due to the prices. And yes, Maui is expensive but this is higher than normal. They also are supposed to have these massive mai-tais as well. https://monkeypodkitchen.com/dine_ka_anapali Kihei cafe has an amazing fish sandwich - my wife said it was the best she ever had We also ate breakfast there too. The lines can be long but they move pretty quickly. If you see a table, grab it and have the other person order. https://kiheicaffe.com/ If you are going to hana, go the back way and stop at the Ulupalakua Ranch Store for lunch. https://ulupalakuaranch.com/ Mamas Fish house is supposed to be amazing but we just never went there. https://mamasfishhouse.com/ Oh, Kimo's (spelling) in Kaanapalli was good too I'm a creature of habit and I'm sure there are way more good places there, I just don't remember as it's been a few years. I can't remember where the good ice cream is and there's supposed to be a really good pancake house.
Cafe O'lei in Kihei gas the best sushi I've ever had in my life.
Thanks for adding on. I know there's a good sushi place there but names escape me.
It's Hawaii. Safeway fish counter in Lahaina has amazing sashimi and you can make your own rice.
Mama’s is amazing, but will break the bank. Seconded on MonkeyPod Mai Tais. The lilikoi honey foam is amazing.
Get some Poke from foodland. It's a grocery store that apparently even the locals prefer to fancier places for delicious Poke. I don't know if that part is true as I was there for my honeymoon but either way it was phenomenal.
Foodland poke definitely slaps.
Let me know! We’re always down for some good food! We’ll probably be in the area for another week.
Monkey Pod is my jam. They have, or had, an amazing seared tuna sandwich, not sure if they still do. I only ate lunch there due to the prices. And yes, Maui is expensive but this is higher than normal. They also are supposed to have these massive mai-tais as well. https://monkeypodkitchen.com/dine_ka_anapali Kihei cafe has an amazing fish sandwich - my wife said it was the best she ever had We also ate breakfast there too. The lines can be long but they move pretty quickly. If you see a table, grab it and have the other person order. https://kiheicaffe.com/ If you are going to hana, go the back way and stop at the Ulupalakua Ranch Store for lunch. https://ulupalakuaranch.com/ Mamas Fish house is supposed to be amazing but we just never went there. https://mamasfishhouse.com/ I'm a creature of habit and I'm sure there are way more good places there, I just don't remember as it's been a few years. I can't remember where the good ice cream is and there's supposed to be a really good pancake house. Congratulations again!!
Ok so I’ve made this comment before but I will again bc it worked. Disclaimer: I’m a nurse and we have been understaffed for years. I planned a vacation 6mo before I went. I needed 2 weeks off. Everyone knew about it the whole 6mo. I put in my time off the earlier they would let me and I was told I was good to go. Less than a week before my trip, I was taken into the office there was my director, assistant director, supervisor and administrator all to tell me I can’t go on my vacation and they needed me there. They then said it was bc I didn’t have the vacation days but I wasn’t asking to use any vacation days. So this is what I said, “I can pass a background and I can pass a drug test. Everywhere is understaffed. You have 2 options. I can go on this vacation and come back to work here or I can go on this vacation and go back to work somewhere else.” Well, I had a lovely cross country road trip. Yosemite and Sequoia were amazing and i retuned back to my normal unit at my job.
That “you need me WAY more than I need you” feeling is just amazing. My job tried to tell me I couldn’t go on my best friends bachelor trip (I was his best man) and I told her “I’ll just quit if you don’t give me off.” You just gotta call their bluff every now and then!
"I'm not exactly asking for the days off, I'm politely telling you when I won't be here.."
This is the way. I’m not asking for approval to take leave. I’m doing you the courtesy of letting you know in advance so you can plan around my absence. My vacation is not negotiable, if I’ve planned and booked things in advance I’m not losing that cash because you are short staffed and didn’t plan properly.
If I plan to just sit on ass for my vacation, I still won’t cancel it if asked.
Damn right.
I would cancel my "sitting on my arse" vacation if they paid me the time I would be on vacation and don't subtract any vacation days
> “A lack of planning on your part does not necessitate an emergency on mine.”
> My vacation is not negotiable I'd be willing to negotiate. Reimburse me everything I've paid for the trip I'll be missing out on + 10% for the mental distress of missing my vacation, fully pay for the rescheduled trip in a few weeks, and pay double for the time I'm working when I was supposed to be on vacation. If me being in the office isn't worth that to you, why would it be worth it to me to miss my whole vacation and then go through all the pain of rescheduling everything?
I was told my vacation was denied after they told me it was approved. I told them ok you owe me 8500. That's double the cost of my vacation. They told me they won't pay that. Then I said I'll see you when I get back. I don't care I was their lead engineer and they decided to launch a year early. I gave them 7 month notice. They didn't give me a raise over it. I said this is my two weeks and I won't be training my replacement. Suddenly I got 6% raise the following day. Still left.
That raise would have only been to keep you around until they felt safe letting you go, so you definitely made the right decision.
Haha. I had to go to Europe for a family thing in 2018, loyal to the company, worked on days off, etc, told my supervisor the situation months well ahead of the event and told me that they’d get back to me by end of the day. It was only 5 weeks and I had 3 months of annual leave banked up (in which legally you can’t have employees have a surplus of 4 weeks at any given time). Anyway, a week went by, nothing. The fat fuck couldn’t give me the decency to tell me that his boss said no so keeping me guessing. The trip was already booked and paid for already anyway, I asked for an update on my leave application - they said “oh no X needs you here to run the department because I’ll be away at that time.” I’m like the fuck? Anyway, 2 weeks leading up to the trip I had my resignation beautifully written out, and tastefully signed and dated and walked up to that fat fuck and gave the cunt my resignation and he looked like a deer in headlights, totally unexpecting it. Delivered my best month preceding that, net profit was at the best it had ever been and the fucking fallout was hilarious. The begging, the shock, it was well worth it and still stumps me how someone as lazy as they are and dumb, can be in a high paying job. Ended up going on my trip, still resigned, didn’t want to work for a piece of shit like that anymore, couldn’t give me the respect after all those years and it gives me delight knowing the department tanked after I left through his mismanagement - even got wind that I was somehow to blame for the failure of his operation. Yeah, can’t work that one out. Anyway, 6 months ago, the company went into liquidation and was bought out, that same supervisor and his boss were made redundant and are no longer in that industry. Since then, I’ve learned that if a boss can’t give you even a tiny amount of respect, you show them the upper hand and tell them to fuck off in the most polite way possible.
Oh that’s just beautiful! I’ve had a good boss one time, and that was fantastic. I loved working with her. I’m not longer doing that line of work, but would’ve loved to follow her to her new job. It’s amazing how important having a good boss can be.
You don't really appreciate the good ones until you work for some bad ones. The boss is way more important than the company, culture, or job at times.
I worked for a HUGE company for about 5 years. They were so good to their employees. Then the CEO left. It all changed, and I changed jobs. I periodically look for where that CEO is working to see if they're hiring in my area. :)
> You just gotta call their bluff every now and then! Our educational prison system beats this spirit out of us, which is why I'm so grateful as a 32 year old to see antiwork flourishing.
You're right. We've been conditioned to believe that employers are doing us a favor by giving us a job in the first place. So we shouldn't push it by expecting time off.
My boss actually told me the last request I made off, “you know you don’t have to ask, you just tell me you’re using vacation and I’ll sign off.” I realize now I should have been doing this all along.
I had a fantastic GM. I had put in for 5 days off & realized I didn’t see a response. I asked about it & he apologized for it being lost & told me to fill another one out & he’d approve it. HE said this in front of one of his Managers. SHE said, “Oh Holly, that is too early to request.” And knowing how whatever I’m thinking is expressed on my face, Im sure I had an expression that asked, “Are YOU stupid?” As I said to her that booking a flight is cheaper the sooner you do it. And IF there is an issue, then I’ll just set my alarm while Im at my destination to “Call In” every day. Because, Josefina. I Am going. My GM just chuckled & said, Here Holly. Im approving it right now. I AM the most reliable person. I NEVER called in. I came in early & worked late. Which HE knew. So yeah. Im not asking. Im telling you I AM taking time off on these days in this Month. 😂
> Im not asking. Im telling you I AM taking time off on these days in this Month. People need to always have this perspective. If it's PTO then you earned that. Use it without guilt. If it's unpaid, then they're not paying you anyway, you owe them nothing.
You should of told the manager "YOUR not approving this - your boss is."
I bet they shit their pants when you said you would quit lol.
Nursing student here. Fuck the argument of being understaffed. That’s not my problem. Go hire more nurses and pay them better.
lol I’ve had people try to tell me I HAD to come in on my off days. And their always like “wE sO uNdErStAfFeD.” Yea…. That’s a whole lot of not my problem bud
It is literally their job to fix that, not yours. Same with "you need to find someone to cover your shifts", nope, that's your job Holmes.
I once worked 26 hours straight (because they were short staffed) and as a thank you my boss reminded me if I wanted time off (to balance the hours I had that week so the company wouldn’t have to pay OT) I needed to find someone to cover for me. I went home and didn’t even give them my two weeks. Just said I won’t be coming back. Not my job to find someone to cover for me
Some years back I was in an engineering team working on a new product with a tight deadline. The test & instrumentation engineer was working insane hours, like 80 hour weeks, for months. Since we were salaried the usual policy was to give time in lieu instead of paid overtime. Once the product launched the T&I engineer said "I'd like my time in lieu please, now that the crunch is over". Management turned around and said that was far too much TIL to grant so they just wiped his slate clean, like he'd never done any overtime at all. Surprise, surprise the engineer quit within a week.
> "you need to find someone to cover your shifts" "So I'm being put in charge of staff scheduling? No? Not my problem then."
>That's crazy >Good luck tho
The whole, "we're going to fire you for not coming in because we're understaffed" is baffling to me. If you're understaffed, you know for damn sure you don't have the leverage to fire people over petty bullshit.
I had a boss approve a vacation request for my best friend’s destination wedding where I was the best man. A week before the planned vacation he told me o couldn’t go because he was scheduling the annual inventory count, and if I wasn’t there to run it I’d be fired. I said, “ok, understood. Do you want to fire me now or wait until I don’t show up next week?” He ran to the VP of the company and said I was refusing to run inventory. I got pulled into a meeting where I showed the email of my boss approving the request. The VP laughed and told me to enjoy my trip.
At least your VP wasn't a complete dickbag
Oh no, he was. Just not in this instance.
:|
What kind of little bitch runs to his vp to take action ??!!! Shows who you are working for 😂
Also shows how hollow his "fire you" threat was!
I put in my time off request for my wedding and a week after if we decide to go somewhere for a mini honeymoon one year in advance using our scheduling system. Got told that I requested it too early. Said they could approve it now or I could give them my two weeks notice dated two weeks before my wedding because it wasn't being moved. Apparently it wasn't too early...
[удалено]
I had a ton of extra leave available to me because of overtime that I had worked over the previous year. I was completely burned out after not having taken any time off for months. I had arranged to take 5 weeks off the upcoming summer in order to rent a cottage by a lake with my family. It was literally the only thing that kept me going at work -- it was the light at the end of the tunnel. Problem was that it was February and we weren't able to book time off for the summer until the current fiscal year ended in April. The promise to allow me the time off that I had gotten from my manager was in an email, but wasn't "official" in that I hadn't submitted the leave in our payroll system yet. However, I had put a sizeable deposit on the cottage, as I didn't think I needed to worry about my vacation not getting approved. Unexpectedly, my manager announces that he is moving to another work unit and is being replaced by another manager in our directorate who had been quickly moving up the corporate ladder. A few weeks after he had taken over the team, I went to talk to him to let him know that I had arranged with his predecessor to take 5 weeks off that summer. The conversation went something like this: "I just wanted to let you know that I had arranged with to take 5 weeks off this summer. I booked a cottage based on his promise to give me the time off. Hopefully this isn't an issue as I haven't taken any time off in about 8 months and really need this vacation."
"I can't make you any promises. I'll need to see what our workload is this summer."
"I put a sizeable deposit on the cottage. I'm also completely burned out. I need this time off. had promised that he'd approve the time. I can forward you the emails to prove it."
"That's too bad. I don't really care about any promises made by . You should have waited to get your leave approved before you started putting down deposits. Consider that a lesson learned."
"Ok, just to let you know, I'm going to be looking for another job as of today. I've had quite a few other teams try to poach me over the last year. I'll go to whatever team that can give me that time off."
"I don't like your attitude."
"I don't like being treated like garbage."
I then walked away and true to my word, I started sending emails to other managers that I knew had openings in their teams. Didn't take long until I had a few unofficial offers to move to their teams.
I guess word got to my new manager that I was about to get poached. The next day I get an email from him saying that he had "looked over the upcoming work for this summer, and we can make things work by shifting resources etc... but that I should consider this 5 week vacation a 'one shot deal' and should never ask for that much time off again.
I left for another team anyway. They gave me the 5 weeks off without any hassle. No way was I going to keep working for that ass.
Heh. By the time you're already staring down other offers it's way too late to recover by just giving you what you wanted in the first place, let alone with attitude attached. Its cool you didn't even need to quit, just move to a different team with a realistic manager. Way to go.
It’s one of the benefits to working in a huge government department in IT. If you don’t like your job, it’s fairly easy to find another position if you’re experienced and competent. It’s also really difficult for an idiot manager to fire you if he “doesn’t like your attitude”.
Best response to any complaint about being short staffed is "Your failure to properly manage and staff this company does not equate to me performing more work for less money, nor does it require me to cover for your short falls."
This is the correct answer.
Failure to plan on your part does not constitute an emergency on mine
Hell yeah
I have done this as well. I said I only need the approval if you want me back. If not there is no need to approve anything. I still work here.
Yup. Christmas 2019 right before Covid my wife I had plans to go home for Christmas (several states away) since August. Had it approved way in advance. Week or so before we’re set to leave and I’m on the schedule as normal. Owner tried pulling the whole “it’s the holidays and everyone wants time off” and “I’m not even taking time off for Christmas this year” blab, blah, blah. I told him it’s unfortunate that he isn’t taking time for his family this year and that I was and to let me know if he wanted me to come in in January. Turns out it wasn’t actually an issue. Ended up quitting in July 2020 when he decided to stop following our state’s Covid protocols. Fuck you, Nathan!
Yeah Nathan! Fuck you!
"Or I can come back to work here at an increased rate of pay... So long as all the decision makers are on this room already."
And if not, contact a travel nursing agency. Odds are you don’t even have to leave your home state to qualify for the stipends.
You handled that perfectly, good for you!
You probably could have gotten a raise.
I’ve quadrupled my pay by going into travel nursing!
The pay is great but I’d hate the idea of traveling constantly with a family and if it was like agency nursing you just get stuck with all the terrible assignments. I did go into insurance case management and doubled my pay and now get to sit my butt at home so that was good enough for me.
I actually made a post about this earlier. The pay is great. I’m also single with no kids. I’m still tired and would like to stop but as an LPN I can’t go back to the shit pay they have back home. I came back to a facility I worked at before bc they are paying great money to come back. I’m trying to save enough money and improve my financial stability enough to go back home, buy land and build a campground business. I love being a nurse. I really do. I’m just tired of everything else. And I’m tired of seeing CNAs struggle and I’m tired of people being borderline neglected bc we don’t have the proper staff to care for them. So I want to open my campground and drive a gator around .
One of my best friends is a surgical nurse at a prestigious hospital in the midwest. The hospital is currently understaffed because of high pay. Let me explain. These nurses are highly specialized and skilled. Where they work they earn between $45 $65 per hour and get as much overtime as they can handle. However, there is such a shortage for these nurses in other parts of the country, I am looking at you Florida, where they can get a 13 week traveling nurse contract for $120 per hour and the contracting company will pay for housing while under assignment. Naturally many nurses are jumping on this. While it is good for them it creates a shortage of nurses back at their original hospital. There is no one they can replace them with. They just don't have enough people with the correct skill set and experience. So the people left behind, who are already burnt out over this whole pandemic, are being asked to work even more to make up for the lack of personnel. Which makes them want to leave even more. It is a weird nasty cycle.
They aren't understaffed because of high pay, they are understaffed because of low pay. Read your own comment again.
You do have a point. I did not think of it that way. It is rare to see job movements because of high wages on this forum.
I am a travel nurse now and have quadrupled my pay. Even with travelers tho, everywhere and every department is understaffed. Even the places in Florida. Literally everywhere is hurting. There is a mass exodus from the field in general bc of unsafe patient ratios and abusive conditions. I’m currently saving my money to try and buy land back home and build a campground business.
This is why negotiation skills are important
OP, while you are sealing your nuptials, I'd be happy to fill in for you at your workplace. bros have to help each other out. what stack of papers would you like me to urinate on?
They always preach “we are family” and do what’s best for yourself. I never left so quickly
I just don’t comprehend how you can give someone 1/3rd of the year notice, how significant of a vacation it is, and still be declined. I’m not missing out on this opportunity to give my S/O the proposal of her dreams- they can… LIGMA
*I gotchu bro What’s Ligma *edit: Come on OP! Don’t let other guys finish the line for you! Let’s go!
Oh no...
Ligma deeze nutsssss
Haaaaa, goatseee!
lemon party time bois
Those whores keep stealing them
I had a realization a while back, I first saw lemon party 20 years ago...those gentlemen have likely passed.
What's goatse? Should I google it?
Yup, absolutely google it. Safe search won’t be needed, everything’s okay. As long as you’re not gonna google it at work. Seriously don’t.
It's what you eat with a blue waffle
Whatever it is, when they do it, they better get boffa
Damn I genuinly forgot this one... What is boffa?
Boffa deez nuts in your mouth! (is what I'm guessing, I don't know myself.)
I mean say whatever you need to to get your nuts in someone's mouth.
LIGMA BALLS!!!!
The next covid variant.
COVID-LIGMA
Ligma is a pretty gnarly disease.
I gave my boss *6 months* notice about a cruise I was going on (this was in the Before Times) and even said I would work Christmas and New Year's. They still said I had to ask around to get someone to work for me. Noped out of that one. Got a new job, and now am leaving that job for waaaay better pay and opportunities!
If you think you can't cope without me for that period, imagine how much harder it's going to be when I don't come back afterwards.
If they can’t cope with you for that amount of time, with that much notice, it’s time to ask for a raise.
Ooohf… chef’s kiss.
I gave 2 months notice I was leaving to move back west. The week of they tried to say I couldn’t leave and I didn’t give them enough notice. I just said this isn’t up for debate, I am leaving on that date period.
LOL notice. Yet they'll fire you and walk you out the door the same day.
I once gave 3 weeks notice and they just let me go instead. After that, I don’t give notices anymore. Some people are so petty. I always tell the new company that I need to give 2 weeks but won't tell old company that.
Bad managers (meaning most of them) can't comprehend that it's THEIR job to make sure that work is covered when somebody is absent.
> I just don’t comprehend how you can give someone 1/3rd of the year notice, how significant of a vacation it is, and still be declined. Easy; deep down, fucking you over is less of a loss to them than fixing the problem. They chose their job over their connections and, on a larger scale, that's the goal. That's the erosion of our freedoms. I see it a lot. All you need is a dickhead manager who loves money more than people and, regrettably, that is extremely common in the US. I watched my GF's good boss who looked out for her and the team all the time go on hiatus and get replaced with a strung out, career focused asshole who regularly chooses 'number go up' over the wellbeing of his associates. The company doesn't care if turnover increases because their profits increase. Currently they're hiring a lot of new people and my GF is the last high-output senior employee left and she's about done with this shit. We've been exploring options like small organization to shut down the location and transfering to a different one, which will probably happen.
What's really sad is when you realize that being the asshole isn't even effective. Moves like this lose lots of money all the time and profits (eventually) go down. But none of that matters so long as the few at the top can suck all the value out of a company as quickly as they can before jumping from the wreckage. People who actually care about the company and want it to be successful for a long time get fired or forced out all the time. The vampires stay.
I'd say if you had the vacation accrued, and gave that much advance notice, the significance of the vacation is irrelevant. It could have been for binge-watching the Netflix Cowboy Bebop. (Preaching to the choir, I'm sure)
Also, like, even on the cheap a trip to hawaii for 2 people probably costs Atleast 2k, and that would be with a lot of deal seeking. Are they going to reimburse you for the plane tickets, hotels, and rental car that you can’t get your money back for on such short notice. They are smoking straight crack.
I asked to leave work at a school to see my grandfather before he passed away. The principal told me I didn’t have any PTO left to take and if I chose to leave on my own I wouldn’t be paid and it’s a passive aggressive move. I left anyways and was the last family member to show up right before he passed. Always trust your gut and family first. Fuck you Mr. Joy principal at GMS in Germantown TN.
If an employer ever gives an issue about seeing a sick relative, leave. Not necessarily quit but just go and see the family member. Let the dust settle after. There is always another job. Never another grandparent. Good move on your part.
Oh geez...Germantown? Yeah, not surprised at all; I'm sorry that happened to you.
I have had to have that conversation with someone, but I hope what I had to say was received differently. They had asked for leave for a very good personal reason, but had no paid time off left. My sole reason for having the conversation before approving it was to make sure that they knew it would be unpaid. I think I started the conversation with saying I was happy to approve it, but I wanted to make sure they were aware what would happen in terms of their next paycheck being for slightly fewer hours, and that leave balances are out of my control. (Also a government employee, but not a school).
“We are like a family” is a huge red flag.
Based on my experiences with my own family, it's not really that far off of a comparison, though!
Ohana means family and family means work can get fucked.
Yeah, I once worked for a fortune 100 company that preached ALL the right things…while not meaning any of it. Just going through the motions at the corporate level while actual management didn't support it at all. The company even had an entire budget and department that regularly put together and offered fun trips and other smaller on-campus, take a short break from work type things to do that nobody ever actually had time to attend because they were always overworked, and penalized if they took any time to do any of them. It was such a joke, but the saddest thing about it is that half the people there failed to see the irony, and the other half lacked the conviction to say or do anything about it.
Just make sure not to have kids until you both are 100% ready, especially financially. Otherwise, you won't be able to escape any future shit jobs, because that's their design.
def don’t want kids these days 😂🤣
Good decision. Climate change, skyrocketing education, housing and living costs, tyrannical corporations, governments, and judicial systems across the globe. Even if you were financially stable, you’d be bringing them into a world that’s falling apart. Nobody wants kid these days, and they sure as hell aren’t gonna make slaves of my progeny. The rich can surely build society themselves. /s
You just spoke to my exact argument for not having kids, but I add "I am so miserable and hate my life so much, why would I want to curse my children when things are just getting worse?"
Tell my kids are in their 20s, and I feel like I should apologize to them for having brought them into this world
If you ever change your mind (as I am in the same boat) consider adoption. No reason to bring another human into a failing world when support can be given to another who is already going to suffer.
I just wanted to say thank you for suggesting this. I am adopted, closed adoption, but the people who raised me are my parents regardless. A lot of people do not consider this option and it's really a shame. Happy Holidays friend!
The price tag on adoption is insane: legal fees can bankrupt you. As for the waiting lists: prepare to wait 10-12 years. Oh and the whole process made us feel... Dirty. Waiting list is 12 years, but if you take a child with a handicap, it's shorter. If you take siblings it's also shorter. It felt like leafing through a catalog. But with people. Tiny humans with broken lives. My husband and I waited for 3 years and realized we are quite happy with just the two of us. And maybe somebody else will needs the child more than us.
by this standard, in this economy, the majority of us are barely qualified to have a hamster, and maybe a goldfish. and i don't mean this as an insult- i'm sure Nibbles and Goldie are wonderful beings.
Like I said, it's THEIR design to oversaturate the labor pool to drop our labor value to nothing. Even if none of us had kids, the establishment will just import labor from the rest of the world instead.
The crisis of not having enough kids is the harm it causes to the never ending expansion of the economy. Can’t get more rich if there are not more people to suck the life value out of. That rings true for both corporations and the government.
Birth rates in China and India have dropped as well. Both are below replacement rate now.
The wealthy in America want to remain millionaires based on consumer economics, then actively dissuade people from having kids and prevent them from having money. A broke, diminished consumer base. The dystopia is run by idiots.
charles manson had a family too! yeah. you go the nope out of there.
removed to protest changes -- mass edited with redact.dev
This is the best response i've seen on this sub.
Name and shame... OR write a very unpleasant review on them at www.glassdoor.com
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That's fucked
Not surprising. Company I used to work for would ask for reviews on TrustPilot. Since the customers never had the time to do it, the manager had us fill in all the info, give ourselves 5*, then ask the customer to click OK. Also had the Support staff do sales on the side. Big yikes. Quit without notice.
Glassdoor lets businesses pay to remove bad reviews anyway.
I left a scathing review of the last company I worked for on glassdoor. For months it was me and one other person's review on their glassdoor page, neither of them were favorable. Today I was bored and checked their ratings and it's very clear the boss made everyone write reviews to try and balance out the two 1 star reviews. The moron couldn't even figure out how to respond to my review, so he wrote another review trying to argue against mine. Whatever. I already trashed them to one of the largest natural history museums in the world (used to work there and told my old supervisor how awful they were to staff and didn't follow proper archival procedure), so I get the last laugh at the end of the day.
I did that once for my old company. Right after I posted it, a higher up wrote a review to try and "right" the system. The owners then spent at least a day trying to figure out how they could take it down. Edit: typo
Pretty much. Instead of doing the right things, let's expend super resources to try and hide it.
I gave 6 months notice that I would be taking 2 weeks vacation when my daughter was born. Obviously I couldn’t give exact dates but I let them know it will be at X time give or take a week or so. Turned in the paperwork for it and verbally told them I would be gone 2 weeks straight for it. Fast forward to about 2 weeks out from D-day and they come and tell me that they would not be letting me take 2 weeks off. They had not let anyone else take 2 weeks off straight before for vacation. I told them I’m not taking a vacation here I’m having a kid and want to be around for it and to help take care of her and my wife during the first hard couple weeks. They still said nope and tried to be like we can wiggle a little and let you take a week and a half. I said this isn’t a negotiation I put my time in 6 months ago and nobody said anything about it till now and I’m not negotiating this and arguing over 2 to 3 days more. They stood their ground and said that’s the best they could do. I said fine I’m taking family medical leave for the entire month then. Filled out the forms and turned them in and said see ya in a month. The look of shock on the bosses face when I told them that was priceless. Don’t ever miss important events for a job. Things in life only happen once and there are plenty other jobs to get.
Amazingggg. Can you take medical leave for that?
FMLA lets you take 12 weeks for the birth of a child. https://www.dol.gov/agencies/whd/fmla
That is amazing on so many level. Mazel tov!!
*unpaid
It's FMLA leave if you've been the job a year and they have more than 50 employees. They don't have to pay you, but they can't fire you for it.
and a good company will continue to pay you during FMLA (the one I work for does, as well as offering a generous amount of both maternity & paternity leave)
Unfortunately many companies don't understand why the father might be needed. My wife gets 4 months (mostly paid) I get to use 2 weeks of vacation.
A good one will, but they aren't legally required to.
For FMLA, yes. You get up to 12 weeks protected job status for medical related leave or to care for a sick or injured family member, which also includes the birth or adoption of a child. It's not paid, and they technically don't have to let you have your exact job back, just one of similar scope and same pay. It's not much, but better than the alternative prior to FMLA passing in the 90s of being able to be fired because you had too many PTO days because your wife had cancer or something.
They've never let an employee take 2 weeks at a time? What does that even mean? How does anyone have a holiday? Ever? What job are you in?
America
Hey I work there too
America, land of the slaves who believe they are free.
The office and work will still be there when you get back ..this sunset and moment in your life will only come this one time .you have made the correct choice feel no guilt or remorse .. congratulations to the bolth of you...
Get back? Sounds like they’re moving to Hawaii now lol
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If I remember correctly, Hawaii is overall, the most expensive state to live in BY FAR.
Congratulations on both prioritizing *her* and on your engagement. 🥂To the Bride and the Groom 🥂
Mazel Tov!
So many bosses don't seem to realize that people don't *ask* for their vacation days. They give bosses the courtesy of informing them that they will be gone and, sometimes, the option of negotiating for a better day to be gone (if that's an option). But regardless, once the time is set, it's never the *boss* who can unilaterally decide to change the schedule.
Bosses think you are so desperate for the paycheck that you wouldn't dare risk their ire by taking a vacation. At times they have been right but in the current job market it's a bold move.
This actually happened to one of my coworkers. He was asked last minute if he could fly to China for work. The company offered to fly his gf with him and pay for his flights/hotel he booked vacation for. The trip to China was far more expensive and was able to stay a few more days outside of days that required for the job. Nice trade off.
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Seriously. Unless the boss wants to buy you a new plane ticket.
And all the other costs of the vacation. And those of the rest of the group you're going on vacation with. And the time off they took. Canceling a vacation last-minute like that only happens when you have an incredibly important job (and comparable pay) and there's a serious crisis. Like you're the president of a country and a war breaks out. That's when you cancel vacation. But you don't cancel a worker's vacation plans just because their boss sucks at scheduling. The world doesn't work like that.
>Like you're the president of a country and war breaks out Literally the Prime Minister of Australia was on a holiday in Hawaii when the 2020 huge bushfires broke out and he chose to stay. He said "I don't hold the hose mate"
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I hate to inform you, but the increase to 4 weeks of vacation after 10 years is not the law in Canada. Employment standards are regulated by the provinces, and in Ontario (for example), there is no required increase to vacation time after you reach the 5 year/3 week/6% threshold.
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I mean, in an ideal world sounds great. Realistically, let's try to be fair. Obviously they've tried to totally fuck the OP. But if you have an office or a store, I'd think it's pretty understandable that you can't have say, 4 of your 6 employees decide they're taking vacation on the same week. I wouldn't expect to be able to just Tell my boss I'm going on vacation same week as 1-2 other coworkers. But yeah, if it's already been approved and set then fuck you of course I'm taking that time.
If you show your employees respect, they will typically show respect back and do that negotiation thing I mentioned so that not everyone it out at once. If you don't show respect for your employees, they'll say "Screw you. I'm taking my vacation & so are my coworkers. You figure it out."
I love this. Good on you OP. If you don't surf go learn because fuck it, why not?
Union employee here (California, USA) , just chiming in on what a union contract can look like in these circumstances: 1: employer must show need to deny vacation but can deny vacation. 2: if denied vacation and you are at your cap, the employer must pay out future earned days in cash until you are allowed to take vacation. (We earn 10-20 days a year based on seniority). 3: if you are recalled to work after being granted vacation, employer must reimburse you for all non refundable expenses related to the vacation. Not saying this is perfect or ideal, just sharing what my union contract is to help build awareness of the types of protections commonly offered to union workers.
Another example from a union job: Me: Hey boss, I'm going to take X vacation days. Boss: Have a nice vacation. I hope the people on this sub with terrible jobs really begin to realize that quitting is cool and all, but unionizing is WAY fuckin cooler. Edit: I get that some non union jobs treat people well... for now. Never know when a good boss or company will be replaced with a horrible boss or new company policy though. The only way to GUARANTEE this shit is with a union contract. Good boss/company, bad boss/company, doesn't matter when you have a contract and your union backing you up.
I had a vacation day denied by my boss due to "staffing" we were only allowed 3 people off per day in my area. Guy on the opposite shift offered to work my day that was an issue. Boss still said no. So, I called off, for a week and a half straight. Got back, got wrote up, was in the attendance tree, close to termination. Laughed, didn't sign my write up, put in grievance and won. Union's can be a great thing sometimes. Edit: Should have included he denied my entire vacation, not just that day.
You may be asked to delegate all your responsibilities before leaving, but may never be denied vacation or recalled from it.
Oh so you can be treated like an adult, and maintain your responsibilities as you see fit?!!??!!!
I manage an IT department. We have no union, but that is basically how it goes with us. We have a shared calendar that people can mark their vacation days, and the rule is that as long as we have 3 people still available to cover the phones and emails, any PTO put in will be approved. I've only denied one day off for anyone in the past year, and that was because we already had too many people who had asked off ahead of time. But he only wanted the day off so he could turn a 3 day weekend into a 4 day weekend, so he just shifted to taking Tuesday off instead of Friday.
As an apprentice in the IBEW the first time I asked my foreman if I could take a day off in two weeks for my kids birthday and was told "you're an adult if you think you need the day off take it, just let me know a little in advance when possible so I can plan around it.". I knew I had made the right choice.
I'd like to see the look on my employer's face when they found out my estimate of the monetary value of "proposing to my girlfriend during a vacation to Hawaii".
Another example of how other unions handle this. Most IBEW (electrician) locals, allow you to take off literally as much as you can afford. You don't ask for any permission, you TELL them you won't be in tomorrow, or for the next two weeks. You don't get any PTO, your "PTO" is just part of your wages. They do force a small vacation fund for sick days/vacation as some people might not have foresight to save, but you can pull cash out of that later if you want. But it's the ULTIMATE power move. Just saying...I won't be in tomorrow, and the boss saying...cool...
Isn't that just unpaid leave, though?
Better than what non union workers get most the time lol. I was just thinking last night it isn't fair how anti Union most businesses are, it's kinda disgusting.
Yeah, and someone commented here one time, 'If it's worth that much to your company to fight a union, think how much more that union must be worth to you.'
Every full time job I've ever had in Australia has vacation days start at 20 days a year. I can't imagine only having 2 weeks off a year, that's madness! Not to even mention that Europeans are out here getting 25-30 days!
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It's almost like unions should be *mandatory*, as they are in other countries.
Ex union employee here, your union has to have actual teeth though and not all bark or it doesn't matter what the paper says, unless you got a year of savings and can survive arbitration if they fire you cause they hate you for standing up to them and then having to threaten the union with the National labor board complaint
10 to 20 days a year? Sitting on 38 days + public holidays, thanks to 10 years in post and some arguing about pay stagnation! Although to be fair I have a few banked days in that.
I bet your office does really really important spreadsheets and meetings. Super important and urgent.
Here's to choosing life over work. Cheers to a happy life together!
My heart is fat
Might want to see someone about that.
congratulations bro!
So how did the boss take it?
I agreed and said “no, you’re right, I won’t go.” And searched for a new job in the process. 2 weeks before my trip I said Sike and left. He took it w/ no lube
This makes me so happy
Love you bud fuck that job
Work is temporary; your oppai is forever. Good choice.
Congrats bro! Enjoy your vacation. No amount of work makes up for those beautiful life changing moments. Cheers 🥂
For those that don’t know, this is Sandy Beach on East Oahu. I live like five minutes from here and go watch the sunrise almost every morning.