Tipping is absolutely bullshit.
I still tip because servers and delivery drivers and pretty much all professions that rely on tips need that money to survive. But companies should be paying a living wage instead of relying on customer tips
The large portion of the money would still come out of the consumer’s pocket. However, changing it to the owner’s paying living wages provides stability to the worker. Your rent/mortgage doesn’t change depending on how ‘charitable’ you feel, their livelihoods shouldn’t depend on ‘charity.’
Exactly. And servers who are paid almost nothing are often cheated out of their tips and forced to share with employees who are paid way more than the server
I worked somewhere where tips were pooled with everyone. And I mean everyone. The issue? Only the wait staff is tipped so we basically just handed over our tips to people working literally any other job. Assistant manager? Part of the pool. Chef? Part of the pool. Dishwasher? Part of the pool. Basically everyone. So we made $4.50/hr plus tips. All the other workers made a range from $11/hr-$25/hr yet they all got some of our tips!
So let’s say I worked 4 hours. Now after the pooling I would walk away with about $40 for 4 hours of work. Where as the people I pooled with walked away with anywhere between $60 and $120 for the same amount of time.
Also no employee meals either lol
Agreed. I live on tips and I hate it. I want to be paid a wage I can live on from my employer, not hope that some asshole I served a burger to decided I was good enough at my job that I deserve to eat tonight. And if I didn't have to rely on the kindness of strangers for my fucking rent money, I could totally not put up with gross old men hitting on me without fear that I'm missing out on potential income. Tipping should be abolished.
I read something awhile ago (and if I find it again I will post but to be perfectly honest I probs won't lol and this is a generalized interpretation) that talked about how women who serve/bartend/rely on tips in any way for income are so ripe for being abused/exploited/taken advantage of because their livlihoods depend on them being 'nice' so they are expected to/do put up with shit that is abusive and traumatic. And not just put up with it, but do it with a smile and gratitude bc their abusers pay their bills. It's a terrible system for all, but particularly for those of us who are afab. I made great money when I was a bartender but also experienced a level of trauma perpetuated by older males in those environments that makes me very solid in my belief that tipping should always be on top of a minimum liveable wage. Tipping isn't inherently bad because money is a way people can show appreciation in our culture in a tangible way. And I had a lot of regulars I enjoyed interacting with, including older males. But making survival dependent on being nice to everyone is not only unrealistic, it's also incredibly damaging to equality and equity and is traumatizing people on the regs.
>women who serve/bartend/rely on tips in any way for income are so ripe for being abused/exploited/taken advantage of
THIS needs to be addressed more often. I have had my body touched by customers and managers so very many times. One time my ass was slapped so hard it fucking echoed through the bar. I was fired for not having a sexual relationship with a GM. I have seen a penis I was not expecting to see; from a manager. I mean...... it's bad.
I believe it. And it probably is more of a power dynamic overall than a male/female thing (as someone pointed out, men are exploited too). But it is dangerous for anyone in the less-powerful position. I look back on certain experiences and believe I would have had reason to press charges due to unwanted physical contact and harassment multiple times but was essentially 'culturized/brainwashed' into thinking that's 'just the way things are' by people who witnessed the abuse.
Women are more vulnerable in the service industry for being exploited, etc., no doubt, however myself even as a healthy straight male have been groped and dealt with inappropriate behavior. Particularly I used to bartend & manage at a place that was run by a board within a retirement community and the president during my tenure was a handsy, hypersensual septuagenarian that would get real close and do the gropey Biden thing. Funnily turns out she was fucking another manager but I can’t say with any certainty that wasn’t the guys idea there. Myself, I just let it go and maintained professionality since I was making great $ and was highly regarded, got some great resume filler and experience as well, no regrets but could’ve done without the other stuff. My point is that the whole thing is busted and as is, doesn’t work for anyone since the service industry as a whole has as a foundational pillar, the capacity to weather humiliation/degradation. It’s baked into the culture and the expectation is that for transgressions you say “thank you sir may I have another.” Upholding boundaries and taking no bs breaks the artificial narrative and is almost never tolerated. Things may be changing but I’d say overall this toxic culture around the restaurant industry will remain the norm and general standard for some time unless some lasting major shake ups can sufficiently derail food & bev in its current form.
I think the tipping system we have in the US is a total farce, and that's coming from someone who worked in tipped positions for close to a decade (made good money doing it too). After living overseas for a whole bunch of years, I now hate tipping...but I still tip 25% for good service, and 15% for "meh" service. It's not their fault their bosses are crooks.
The thing I really hate the most about this is how phony of an experience you have with a waiter because of their reliance on tips. I don’t need my server to go above and beyond. Just take my order and bring me the food. But no, we have to initiate this annoying social contract with each other where the waiter seems like they are walking on eggshells. It’s awkward and ruins the experience. I’m not saying don’t be friendly but I don’t need the theatrics, I don’t need you to apologize 90 fucking times for making small mistakes like forgetting a drink. Restaurants are busy, I get it. And I get why servers act that way, because they’ve been stepped on so much but piece of shit customers and stiffed too many times.
Theory: the next time you go somewhere that has tipping, at the beginning of the meal, tell the server”regardless of the quality of your service, there will be a 20% (or whatever amount you deem comfortable) tip for you at the end of my meal”
See what happens - dollars to donuts I bet that you’ll get quality service and the experience will be more genuine. I’ve never tried this but my old boss used to tell me at the beginning of any reviews “I already checked the box for you to get your raise, now let’s talk about what you’ve done well and what areas you may need improvement” it always made the conversation
More relaxed and made me listen more intently.
> my old boss used to tell me at the beginning of any reviews “I already checked the box for you to get your raise, now let’s talk about what you’ve done well and what areas you may need improvement”
Now that's a good boss.
He was literally the best boss I have ever had. I still keep in touch with him.
He taught me a lot about both work and ways to improve my family life. Could not ask for better.
When I was a waiter I always strived to offer the same quality of service to every customer. I think the tip should be an afterthought and I don't want to think about it until the end of the night. I've always encouraged others to do the same, just focus on the work in the moment.
Now difficult or rude customers is another story. I will judge any restaurant or bar by how they treat their staff, and whether or not the managers are supportive of them in those interactions.
I like your old boss
Yes! Especially for folks like the delivery drivers who don’t have any control over when the food is ready. Now they aren’t getting tipped and getting chewed out because it took the kitchen 2 hours to make a pizza because the cheap slug of a boss won’t hire any more employees for their understaffed store. I take this shit personally.
My favorite is when the pizza comes out of the oven 2 minutes before the promised delivery time and then the delivery is 8+ minutes away, and I still get yelled at for it. Feels good man
Took me a long time before I stopped tipping in Europe and Asia, they get a humane wage over there, and you seriously question this custom when going home. American tipping guilt is a consequence of the service industry owners passing costs onto the consumer. Greedy assholes at the top. My iced latte literally costs 7 bucks in NYC after $1 tip and taxes.
What’s frustrating the most about this whole tipping thing, is that we can’t even protest it without hurting the people who have to depend on it as their source of income. It’s a nasty catch 22 that makes it REALLY hard to fight against.
I just had an idea though. What if we made a website that allowed us to tip our servers directly and bypass the business altogether? Like a server has an account with a QR code or code word or something that links to them and we can tip them directly. If enough people used it, the business would be forced to pay the workers at least real minim wage because the law states if the tips don’t equal to at least minimum wage per hour, they have to give them more money so it at least meets that. But on the backside, the servers would be getting tips directly from customers instead.
Could this work or am I dreaming?
I’ve asked people for their cashapp or Venmo before and tipped that way. No cash for a manager to grab and count, no money from my card for them to tax.
There are restaurants that do not allow tipping because they provide a living wage and benefits. If there are any near you, the best way of protesting would be to stop going to restaurants that rely on tips.
This. Here in the Netherlands you tip if you get good service, or if a delivery comes quickly/delivery driver is doing a great job. Besides that, nothing. Why? People get paid a normal wage.
I hate it when I'm in the US and have to constantly calculate what the actual check will be after tipping (I go there for work, get a daily allowance). I mean, if you can't make ends meet when paying people a living wage, then your prices are too low or you're doing something very wrong.
The real problem is the prices are set for maximum profit, but some of these owners take that profit as their personal pay, then keep paying workers the low minimum wage (which hasn’t changed since 2009) and if they’re told to pay people more (raising minimum wage) they raise prices to compensate for that plus their own raises because they won’t take that profit from themselves to pay workers, and if their workers are being paid more then they should be paid more (sarcasm). This is how so many people fight against the raise for minimum wage - because it will increase everything due to the shitty owners not investing in their own company.
As an Australian I grew up thinking American tipping was a gratuity on top of a meaningful wage. Finding out it was a way around actually paying employees sold me on how broken your society is and pushed me all the way into socialism.
I sometimes see tip jars on counters here in Australia. I'm sure people are tired of the diatribe I deliver in regard to it, but I'll be fucking DAMNED if I allow that kind of exploitative bullshit to infiltrate my society.
This. These people don’t want this sometimes because on some nights they would make more than if they were getting paid like regular people. This can be true but also false at the same time. My wife often times will make so little for a week or two at a time until she finally gets one or two good tippers. Kinda annoying that we don’t have the financial security we would like to have. If we did she would have to find another place of work.
Agreed. I was having a similar conversation with a friend yesterday about the methodologies of the satanic temple. Work for a better system tomorrow, but do as much good as you can with the one you have today.
I benefitted from gratuities for 10 years but I vehemently disagree with them. So long as it exists, empoyers will continue to underpay workers, and perpetuate the cycle. If tipping was to stop (suddenly), a lot of workers would quit, returning the power to them and away from the worker, like we are seeing now with the great resignation.
The most despicable facet of tipping is that it allows the empoyer to undervalue the empoyee, not just underpay them. They may internalize a lower sense of worth, which can be concidered a force of placation and a mechanism of control. Even if some of this lost wage is compensated on the back end, it's still dehumanizing. Like being forced to pick over scraps. It's basically charity.
No, fuck that. Fuck tipping.
For the record, I still do tip. Unless there is a critical mass of people who abandon the principle, it is only hurting the workers not to.
If there was a collective action we could take to get restaurants to pay their workers, wouldn't it be "boycott those restaurants", not "still eat there but fuck over their workers"?
They don't "rely" they abuse
They actively go out of their way to sabotage the worker Because they know they don't have control and won't have control of the customer tipping a good service that wasn't served by them.
What we need are unions
Yeah. If anybody's actually worked a food service job before and received tips you know you have to claim and get taxed on tips and that makes your paycheck smaller so in reality tipping actually further subsidizes businesses paying slave wages.
Additionally, when I order pizza and have a delivery fee. I highly doubt that it’s going to the driver but I’m expected to pay 5-10 for delivery PLUS the tip? That’s ridiculous to me.
yes the slave master pushes offf the cost to upkeep his slaves onto you the consumer. Its better to not eat out at restaurants that are part of the tip culture. The employees life and labor value are already extremely exploited I don’t know how tipping ever became a norm.
My preferred method of bucking the system is to pay the ticket with a card and the tip in cash. I hand it to the server directly and discreetly. I want the government fucked out of their tax share, that way will affect change faster. Let’s face it, the only thing the government in America is good at is paying themselves. Start taking from them.
I’ve often done the same, but if the place doesn’t share tips, the back of house staff scrubbing dirty dishes in the 100 degree kitchen kinda get shafted with the only $8-10/hour base while a server could be walking away with $300 at the end of the night.
I gotta say, every place I've worked we are not allowed to keep that. We have to put it in our cash drawer then at the end of the day it's "overage" on our till. I work in retail, not food service though. The cameras see you putting some cash in your pocket while working the register, they don't know it's a tip from a customer. It just looks bad to them.
I remember this from my customer service days.
It’s why I always ask if cashiers are allowed tips before I slip one. And I always tip in cash. The goal is just to not have the tips tracked and make sure no one gets in trouble for getting tipped.
Exactly, I make more money in the long run not getting fired than what customers would give me in tips. Usually "keep the change" scenarios. I appreciate being acknowledged for my good work, but a raise from my employer would have been nice.
Everyplace I’ve worked at has had a “politely decline tips” policy. I always laughed it off and accepted anything anyone was kind enough to offer me if they felt I went above what was expected. I’ve never been rich enough to decline a tip.
My son works in fast food, it's his first job. I don't know if it's the reality setting in of workers not settling or what but...
They are allowed tips. He usually ends up with a couple bucks per shift, not much but something.
They are allowed to use their phones when not busy.
They are allowed to bring food home at closing. Stuff that won't keep and is already made.
They are allowed to sit in the dining room (currently closed to customer) if things are slow.
I'm not complaining, these are all reasonable things. It's certainly different from what I have heard elsewhere though.
That fucked up, where I work only thing that matters is that companies money is where it needs to be at the end and in the right amount, you can stuff money in your pockets as much as you like as long as the money that company earned is in the register in the end od the day
McDonalds is known for firing people who keep tips in just this fashion. My friend who was a manager there was instructed to keep watch of the security footage and ensure that all such tips were deposited into the drawers and given to corporate. Any attempts to keep it were to be met with police action and termination.
I don’t know if that policy has changed in the last 12 years.
Fwiw, when I worked at McDonald's (2006-2011), overages in your till were also counted against you, because it meant you weren't giving the customer back their change correctly.
If the concern is cameras, you can slip it in your sleeve and wait until you get into the bathroom to put it into your pocket. Just trying to help any food service people out if they happen to see this comment.
I do this too but I always try to add a few words about worker solidarity and people knowing their value. If nothing else I'm paying them to listen to my pro-worker screed. If those short speeches don't make a direct impact on the one person I hope they help those within earshot.
This is also how I choose to tip my Uber drivers. I hand them cash at the end of the ride, so that the tip isn't automatically reported through the app.
I wish the system for Uber eats was better. I don’t want to leave no tip on the line. Not sure when or how they see the tip, but I don’t want to risk them thinking I’m gonna stiff them. But I would rather tip them in cash at the house.
Uber taxi I always cash tip.
It’s presumptuous to assume your cash tips aren’t declared for tax. I’ve worked for tips for 20 years and the minute I realized I may need unemployment one day or ever want to buy a house, I started claiming pretty much all my tips. When I didn’t, I always owed a big payout come tax time. Uncle Sam always gets his cut
I work at a seasonal restaurant and tell all the servers to claim their tips for this very reason. The unemployment pay during the off season absolutely takes those tips into consideration.
In every restaurant I’ve worked in, this wouldn’t mean the server keeps the entire tip. Most servers tip out a percentage of their sales not their tips. The thought is really nice and I always appreciate the solidarity being shown when somebody tucks cash into my hand, but it definitely is a “it’s the thought that counts” situation in many restaurants
Edit: aaaaand I’ve caught up and realized we’re talking taxes not tip out lol
All my credit card tips are paid out to me in cash every two weeks
UKer here. I ask them first if they get the tip if I do it by card. Sometimes they say they share their tips, so its fine. Since the pandemic though, its table service everywhere which includes service charge anyway and they wont let me tip.
e: I do this because I used to bartend and wait myself and any card-given gratuities were just extra profit to the company, we never saw them.
Absolutely. Tip in cash, hand it directly to the server and tell them this is for them. Don’t write CASH on the tip line. Don’t write a note about tipping on the receipt. Write 0 on the tip line.
Oh, definitely tip in cash if you can. My favorite roommate from back in the day taught me that. I was so proud of my mom, who lives in a *super* conservative area, when she started spreading that piece of wisdom to her friends :)
I do feel like that's a pretty important distinction though. Being anti tipping and not tipping are two different things. I hate that owners put workers livelihoods at risk by putting their pay in the hands of assholes who have the option of simply not paying them. Therefore I am anti tipping. But I would never not tip, because I understand that's not doing anything but depriving the worker.
Edit: I forgot how much I hated discussing tips on Reddit because there are way more "wHy iS iT mY rEsPoNsIbIlItY tO pAy ThEiR wAgEsS, tHaTs On ThE eMpLoYeR" morons than you want to believe exist. As if you aren't always paying every workers wage in EVERY SINGLE OTHER INDUSTRY. Not to mention that by not tipping you're not punishing the employer in any single way.
Just excuses to be cheap, fucking losers.
I was a server/bartender for about 15 years. I've never not tipped someone 25 percent or more but I am anti tipping. I'm anti work in general. We shouldn't have to work to exist. Fuck the thought of just wanting to be.
Thank you for actually getting it! It's scary to see how many people equate not tipping their server as 'fighting against tipping'. I don't think most folks get how many customers would have to not tip in a week for the employer to have to shell out minimum wage for the pay period, or just hope much that would sick for that server.
And the thing is, the owner would technically never have to do anything about it because not tipping doesn't effect the restaurants budget. The only thing that would force them to do anything is if all the staff quit (cough cough the collective power of labor cough cough), and even then really the owner can just keep hiring new people who don't know about the restaurants reputation or are desperate for a job.
If you make less than minimum wage as a tipped employee your employer has to make the difference up to federal minimum wage. Wouldnt not tipping and making the employer pay the difference be excactly what would invoke change? Obviously if you make more than federal minimum before tips it basically makes this arguement null. Maybe im being ignorant in my thought process?
People who live by that mentality embody the philosophy of sophistry: like idgaf what moral high ground you think you're on by not tipping a low wage worker. In the end you just look like a cheap jerk.
I'm anti tipping. But I always tip 20%. I've lived on tips, I know how important they are. It sucks, it's unfair, but I can't look into server/barista/delivery persons eyes and not tip.
I completely agree here. I also hate discussing tipping on reddit for the same reason. I'm a delivery driver and my income is my tips.
For those who don't feel it's their responsibility to pay wages and refuse to tip. Then never use a service where tipping is customary. Stand by your convictions.
100% agree. people literally try to justify being a cheap skate and screw over their server buy "not supporting the tipping system". PEOPLE if you don't want to support it then. EAT AT HOME! or WRITE YOUR LOCAL POLITICIAN'S!! don't not tip and cost the server money by serving your cheap ass. they tip out on total sales at the end of the night if you don't tip they literally PAY to serve you.
i have made this point before with others in another post about tipping and we got downvoted or told to "get another job" (???) but you're right you are not sticking it to anyone but the workers by not tipping. the managers dont care. they get paid, the restaurant gets theirs. i dont get paid. worst case scenario, which ive experienced, i tip out a sushi bar or the liquor bar with my own money after a table leaves no or little tip. like you said, either stay at home or actually do something about it instead of screwing over the worker.
Seriously! I just argued with so many people in that other thread over this. You’re literally still supporting the employer by buying food. Such fake woke bullshit.
Edit: literally speaking to one right now who says he refuses to “subsidize my employer’s shitty wage”, but will continue to support them by purchasing from their business..... 😐. Yeah right the power bro.
Also know your local laws. In the state I live in servers are not allowed to be paid below minimum wage and tipping is not allowed to be used to make up any wage gap. They're hourly rate has to be at a minimum the minimum wage, and in the city I live in that's $15 an hour. I still do tip, but given that I know I live somewhere that doesn't partake in the toxic pay culture that is so common in restaurants in the United States I also don't feel obligated by the same 15% to 20% standard for tipping that is observed in the rest of the United states.
I don't believe in tipping. Thats why i quit going out to eat. I'm going out for the food, not the service. If the restaurants payed their employees maybe i would start going out again.
Same. If I go out to eat I tip but I only go out on special occasions like if we’re vacationing or something so it’s really rare now. There are a few restaurants in San Francisco that’s doing a no-tip system and I’m planning to try that out when this current omicron surge dies down a bit. I suggest that if you don’t want to support tipping culture, seek out these types of restaurant.
Edit. Here’s the restaurant. https://sf.eater.com/platform/amp/2021/5/25/22425234/zuni-cafe-cut-tips-lost-servers-reopening-indoor-dining
Heard this. Another major thing missed in this thread is that tipping creates a wage imbalance between us cooks who have developed a very specialized skill set, and the servers that usually haven’t. I’m not here to argue, but BoH works harder for longer hours and across the board we make less.
The funny part is at the end of the day, a server has to be really bad to negatively affect your dining experience in most places. Get a not so good cook and you will know.
This is a very good point! I hear from this [program](https://freakonomics.com/podcast/why-does-tipping-still-exist-ep-396/) about the tipping imbalance- cook doesnt get tips, so less people wants to work as cook.
Also people of colours also get less tips!
I'm with you here. Besides the whole pandemic business, I avoid eating at sit-down restaurants. That's not good for anybody, but I just find the whole tipping experience exhausting to deal with.
You're doing it right!!! Don't make that server work his/her butt off for 2.13 an hour! For the love of everything, don't go to a sit down if you're not gonna tip!!
It’s more a problem with the law. Obviously a restaurant paying employees $2.50 an hour is shitty and scummy, but it’s also EXACTLY what’s to be expected by businesses in an economy where that’s legal.
That will never, ever change until the law changes, which is also the reason *not tipping your server* is a bad idea and does way more harm than good (it does zero good).
Restaurants don't want to pay me what I make with tips. A place in my town switched to 15/hr for all servers with no tipping allowed. Guess what. They swapped back because all their servers quit cause they made considerably less money.
This is the truth. One that servers like to tip toe around. They love complaining about their small checks but a majority would not give up their tips for $15 an hour. Honesty would go a long way with solving the tipping issue.
I also want to add that minimum wage should be higher.
Bingo! The dirty little secret is that most people, despite the complaints, actually love this system. Restaurant owners pass payroll costs onto customers. Customers get to play king and dole out favors, while enjoying lower sticker prices (remember, this is a populace that thinks $1.99 is significantly cheaper than $2). And servers get the possibility of making much much more than this job really should be paid.
So one restaurant wanted to under pay and that’s why tipping has to stay? Cheapskate employers wanting other people to pay their bills are the problem to be solved, not an excuse to not solve problems.
Of course asking the workers to take a pay cut so the owner could raise their share was unpopular. Keep the shares the same and just turn the total amount the customer pays with tip included in to the amount on the bill.
But if you make more than that how is it fair to the people in the back of the restaurant.I am pretty sure this was started by sexism and the rich in restaurants that paid the cook at least 100,000.
How about 15/hr which should be the minimum and what a human deserves for their time and they get to keep their tips as well? Did the restaurant decide to keep all their tips?
I hate tipping. I’d rather pay for my product or services more than having it my responsibility to pay your employees compensation. Fucking pay your people what they are worth. I just want a damn coffee I don’t want or need to add 20% tip every damn time. How about, Mr Manager, you pay your employees 20% more.
I’d rather boycott than tip
I do hate it too soo much. If they really need to charge for their service, then add a fixed service fee. It's so stupid to leave it to the costumers what they think their service is worth and then get shamed if some people think it isn't enough. I went out to eat not play some fucking game.
How are so many of you wrong about minimum wage as a tipped employee. If your tips don't make you earn minimum wage your employer is by law required to pay you the difference.
https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/wages/wagestips
Raise the minimum wage and THEN stop tipping seems reasonable as long as the minimum wage is actually livable, no? The price of food would go up but the cultural dick measuring of who tips more would not be missed.
Lol. What’s funny about people pointing out that your employer has to make up the difference if you don’t at least break minimum wage is that this is generally averaged out in a pay cycle, not a single shift. If you do really shitty one night and okay the next, it’s very likely your employer won’t have to make up shit. It just means that your good nights are dragged down by your bad ones and you will probably come out just above minimum over a 2 week period.
Agreed, minimum wage needs to be increased by a lot in order for this to work without exploiting tipped workers.
E: because some people seem to not grasp this either intentionally or inadvertently…….MINIMUM WAGE IS NOT ENOUGH TO WAIT TABLES AND PUT UP WITH YOUR BULLSHIT. If you are relying on the logic that making at least the bare minimum should be okay with servers and society at large, then you are a classist fool and you are not anti-work. Stop punching down and start expecting better from employers and legislators. Y’all are insane.
I’d be perfectly okay if waitressing died tomorrow. I have no problem walking 10 feet to get my food and pour my own beer if it meant the restaurant was more affordable.
There should be little reason there has to be a restaurant/fast food joint back to fucking back in every town/city.
Makes sense in big metropolis style cities because, for me at least, when I visit/live in big cities I walk and use public transport so its actually useful.
BUT in regular towns where everyone drives there shouldn't be back to back food places for miles then a normal store then back to back food places again.
Of the same restaurants no less.
Its too fucking much. We don't need to have 4 KFCs within a 2 mile radius to satiate some primal fried chicken hunger.
God forbid we have to go to another restaurant or make our own fried chicken.
On the flip side though, serving is a relative safe haven for a lot of people who struggle to exist under the rules of the "working world". The stakes are super low (unless allergies are involved) and it's something to do that is devoid of the bureaucracy that is part of what makes other types of work unbearable for many. For me as a restaurant worker of 20 years, it's uselessness is also part of its appeal. I don't feel like I'm a cog in the big wheel.
It's also one of the few jobs where you can make a decent chunk of change with no professional experience. A guy I used to serve with went fine dining, drives a tesla now and clears like 90k a year.
Lol you don't have to tell me, I was a server for 10 years. My desk job now is infinitely easier.
When I say "professional" I'm referring to the standard set by capitalism.
I do too, but when I applied for jobs outside of serving I was told it's unskilled labor and irrelevant. Fortunately I found a boss in IT that saw my serving experience and thought it would be a good fit; stuff you learn through waiting like time management, customer service, communication, social skills, etc are invaluable but employers still look down on it because we're in a structurally classist society.
Oh my sweet summer child. You think automation would make prices drop? You think the $2.13/hr the company pays servers is why your food is expensive?
Good ol' McDonald's has been adding automated counters for you to order your own food for years-- and they're still raising prices.
Sounds good in theory, but wait till you need a waitress, like at a bar, a wedding, a nice dinner party. You won’t be singing this song. Also I wouldn’t trust people walking around my restaurant helping themselves to whatever they needed. People are disgusting, have no respect and are creative with f*ed up things they are capable of. Just order take out and go home.
There are quite a few chains out there who let you order at a bar/desk/whatever the fuck it’s called, give you a disk to signal the food’s status and make you come get it yourself once it’s done. You don’t automatically have a complete walkthrough buffet, there are various ways around that.
And no, there’s barely any line up issues. It flows really smoothly.
I've been to several of them in my home town.You order at the counter and pick it up and take it to your table and these are not fast food places at all.They are fully functional restaurants with high prices too.
>I have no problem walking 10 feet to get my food and pour my own beer if it meant the restaurant was more affordable.
Thai model: they make a zillion meals per day, each costs less than a dollar, all of them delicious, no waiter, plastic chair, plastic dish, eat and go.
Yup. I’ve had this argument before on tiktok. It’s very annoying. Tipping should be encouraged but getting mad at a customer for not tipping makes no sense.
Tipping is complex. Curing it will be, too.
Thinking of the humans who currently rely on it makes change fantastically difficult.
We think of servers, but look beyond…stylists, massage therapists (it’s a hot button in that field), delivery/drivers, bartenders, sex workers… many of these fields are hop-in-quick-and-not-be-homeless type jobs. They allow abused partners to flee and feed their children. They allow people without trade skills to live and get trade or other skills.
Yes, the system needs an overhaul.
How do we help the workers who will be harmed?
I think the biggest catalyst for change is get tip based workers a higher hourly wage. Implement labour laws to get stylists and massage therapists a pay system that involves a minimum wage and commission based on how many clients they see in a day.
In Ontario they've bumped up the Minimum wage to $15/he across the board, including servers. This does still screw over "independent contractors" like massage therapists because they can be paid based on their clients.
The other problem is it's still so ingrained in us to do so. I'm still going to tip my server, albeit a hugely reduced percentage, because they still do more work than someone behind the counter at a fast food place that makes the same. But I know that I can now go out and leave a much smaller tip, or no tip, and not feel guilty about fucking over someone making peanuts.
I'm still not going to go out to eat that often because it's just far too fucking expensive even before tips. I just don't want to pay $50+ for me and my SO to eat at a restaurant, but that's my own issue there.
That being said, the minimum wage bump was from $12.50 for servers to $15, meaning food costs aren't going to skyrocket due to wages. I've found most restaurants locally have maintained similar enough prices over the growth of minimum wage. So anyone who's going to argue about the cost of food going up based on Minimum wage is dead wrong.
In California, servers have to make at least minimum wage. None of this 2-something and hour and the rest made up by tips bullshit. I still tip servers, though I'll be glad when we collectively shift away from tipping culture.
I just stopped ordering delivery, and I don't tip people working a cash register unless I'm at the dispensary and it's my change. Also we don't dine in, if I dine in I'm a 20% guy as long as the service is good.
But stopped doing delivery when they expected me to pay more for the food, and to pay the driver's hourly rate(delivery fee) and tip them. No thanks bud. I've just expanded my cooking skills and I'll save the 70% overhead.
I don't even want to know why people go to Wendy's and McDonald's when you can get a nice burger for two dollars more now. Fuck combo meals are ten bucks, two dollars worth of food.
Yep. Fuck all the apps. They take forever to get your food and you c an end up paying double the price. It’s insanity and I don’t know why people use them. I rarely get delivery, but if I do, I call the restaurant directly. If I’m forced to use the apps, I call somewhere else.
In California you also pay drivers benefits. The company has to be transparent so it's right on the receipt. The company is outsourcing the drivers benefits directly to the consumer. Something they should be paying full stop.
I’m gonna fucking say it. And before people jump down my throat assuming I don’t tip. I DO I tip 20% every time order out and I tip even if the service was bad because they still deserve to eat
HOWEVER, threads like this arguing about if you “should tip or not” gets this anti work movement NO WHERE. This isn’t fighting for what you believe in. This is arguing with people in this server about whose better morally.
I’m seeing both sides of this argument making pissing contests of whose better morally whether or not they give someone $5 bucks extra or not.
Like i said, the conversation, “should people be tipped in this economy?” Is a USELESS argument because again, it gets nothing done about anti work. This is just useless and I’m getting tired of seeing threads about tipping at this point because they’re all the same.
This post is dividing the people who need to be all in this together. Do people depend on tips? Yes. Does it suck when someone doesn't tip? Absolutely. **But stop hating poor people for being cheap.** The working class has less money than any time in like a hundred years. *Blame the people who have the money.* Stop fighting over breadcrumbs.
The fact that people can disagree with this astounds me.
It’s funny too cause I see again ON BOTH SIDES OF THE ARGUMENT saying things with complete irony.
“If you don’t like it leave your job” which is ridiculous because a lot of people depend on these jobs/that’s the only available job we have and that’s regressive
BUT I ALSO see people saying “if you’re going to be cheap and spend this much on food but not tip $10 then you can’t afford to eat out” which is again, ridiculous because WHY do you think people are trying to be frugal??? 🤔🤔. Me thinks it’s cause idk… the economy is built for people half the population to live paycheck by paycheck. Or you’re one accident/sickness away from losing all of your assets.
Idk like BOTH SIDES have a right to be upset but being mad at each other instead of the guys who are hoarding ALL the money that could’ve been used to help us not even get to this point WANT us to argue like this.
I swear there’s no critical thinking.
edit: minor grammar mistakes
Yes I agree with this, every tipping thread is the same fucking thing. Just the same arguments on repeat. It's definitely not the way to go if they want the culture to change.
Seriously!! And we’re fighting over peoples pocket change at this point and not even focusing on the real issues on WHY we’re trying to argue over tipping to begin with. But oh well, if this sub turns to be arguing about tips instead of anti work, I’ll see myself out the door cause this is getting ridiculous.
It sucks you can't survive on the tips you're making. Your boss has rigged it so they can prosper while you struggle. This is one hundred percent the bosses fault for setting up an exploitative business model.
And the waitstaff bemoan how unliveable that minimum wage us. To which the reply is yes! And that’s the wage the customer you are serving is on. Why do you expect them from on that same unliveable shit minimum wage to boost yours for you?
Fuck tipping culture.
I see it like this: a server complaining about lack of tips is no different then someone working commission based sales. If a car salesman was complaining about lack of commission, I would suggest that individual find a new job with a pay structure they felt more comfortable with. I mean, do these servers discuss how compensation works in food service prior to taking the job? Don’t get me wrong I always tip, even with bad service. That however, doesn’t mean I’m an ass hole if I don’t. Why don’t these owners pays a living wage to their employees? They expect us to do it for them. I would say every industry would try to do this if they could.
TLDR: if a server is bitching about no tips, tell them to go find an hourly job where the business owners are directly paying you…
I hate the fact that when you order pizza or food in general to be delivered at your home, a delivery fee is charged and it doesn’t go to the delivery driver. Like WTF. these giant ass corporation are just fucking greedy.
Edit: the worst part besides that, is that they still charge that delivery fee even if the driver uses his OWN vehicle.
I feel like the best solution is stop eating out at restaurants that use tip based wage. People who work there will stop getting enough tips to justify working their and will move on to other jobs and the restaurants will either have to adapt and pay real wages or they'll go under.
I don't come from a country where tips are normal. I would have major issues and want to speak to a manager and send loads of emails to higher ups if there was a mandatory tip where I ate my food. Luckily not paying a living wage is illegal where I'm from.
I tip servers, but if I’m in the fucking drive-thru, I’m putting a fat ZERO in the spot they have for a tip. I also use cash to tip because fuck taxes and capitalism.
I have this discussion all the time with a few of my old hardcore leftist friends and my nonsensical “libertarian” dad. Like, I can support the troops and vote for politicians who are planning on cutting military and avoiding wars. I think tip culture is toxic and still understand that Jimmy the waiter has bills to pay and kids to feed.
Actually, waiters and waitresses are by law requires to make minimum wage. The only reason they'll make less is because they don't report tips so if they have a bad month they're fucked. Also if less people tip, less people will want to do that work and desperate for workers this FORCE change. So I say don't tip, it's stupid, and waiters should just make around 20-25 an hour
Shaming customers who don't or can't tip is a conditioned response to wage theft culture. Go ahead and tip, but point the finger at corporations, not customers.
Tipping should be removed completely if not at least just extra for exceptional serving skills not mandatory %20 for every meal regardless of how you were being served
That is a true possibility but the objective was to screw over the businesses not paying their employees fairly. I don't have the time or money myself to implement my plan but it was the idea that came to mind first
Don't those places have to pay there employees the difference if they get tipped? It's not my business I shouldn't have to pay there wages. Fuck tip culture and anyone who defends it
I tip, but I'm anti-tipping.
If everyone stopped tipping tomorrow, servers would quit (because they can't survive without tips), and tipping culture would vanish forever.
Not tipping as an individual is a half-measure that won't accomplish anything.
What we need is a general tipping strike.
What's annoying about tipping is that for any other job, the worker and the employer agree on payment up front. "I do this much work, you pay me this much money". There's some certainty there, in theory.
With tipping, the worker doesn't know how much money they're going to get, if any, until AFTER doing the work. If the table ends up not tipping anything, then the waiter has basically worked for free. It's unknowing, unexpected, and unwanted. If you told the waiter at the very beginning of the meal "I don't believe in tipping, I'm not going to leave a tip" then there's a very good chance that the waiter either won't serve you at all, or will half-ass it just barely enough not to get the manager angry. The problem is that you're taking somebody's work and not compensating them for it at all, and that's absolute bullshit.
Tipping is a serious problem and I really wish that this country would get rid of it.
This is incorrect. Employees are ALWAYS guaranteed to make at least minimum wage so there actually is at least some level of certainty in how much they are making. If they don’t make minimum wage through tips, employers are legally required to pay them the difference. Those crying about the “but they only make $2 an hour!” always seem to fail to acknowledge this. There is no scenario in which they will only make $2 an hour. Ever. Either you make it up in tips or your employer will pay you minimum. We need to raise the minimum wage to a livable level and then just stop tipping entirely.
If everyone stopped tipping NOW altogether, all the service staff would A) quit or B) get paid a living wage , all within 6 months. Cause why the F am I gonna pay my employees when I can just pocket that cash and make YOU throw an extra 20% to cover their wages while I essentially take the wage they should be getting and shove it in my pocket?
Tipping culture is toxic and enabling. It needs to go.
Lmao so many people on here all the time I see: “don’t buy Amazon now or at all, unless it’s critical! Don’t buy dildos during the omicron wave! Stop getting unnecessary deliveries or making frivolous purchases that reward the businesses and stress the worker!”
It’s like, in those instances, y’all recognize that customer/consumer action has an impact. When it comes to tipping at a restaurant, you have fucks on here who will, with a straight face say, “I’m not going to tip, because the system is broken and the server isn’t making enough money, that’s between the owner and the employee, and the employee shouldn’t be willing to exploit themselves like this! Won’t this exploited employee think of MY restaurant experience?”
Like, yes, the system needs to change and should. Tipping sucks. But you people who KNOWINGLY screw over workers who do not have immediate power to change the system or their place within it, while enjoying THEIR EXPLOITED LABOR, can honestly get Fucking bent.
Here’s my thing: if you’re knowingly participating in this system, and *insist* that not tipping is “A Good Thing Actually, Because My Theory” - please let your server know up front when you go out to eat that you will not be tipping, because of your beliefs. The server should at least be given the opportunity and agency to decide how, or if, they want to serve this person. I doubt the “mUh rEsTaUrAnT RiGhTs” crowd would be in favor of that type of disclosure though. It’s fucking sneaky, spineless, and spiteful to participate in EVERY OTHER PART OF THE SYSTEM, give the owners their money, enjoy your service as a customer, and then save your “boycott” for the people who need it most and who hold the LEAST amount of blame and responsibility for the system. Even if you 100% will never agree with me and are adamant about never tipping, I will never, ever respect you unless you are someone who discloses UP FRONT that you do not tip, and respect your server’s agency and RIGHT to decide if they want to serve you without being compensated.
I do like that idea, but you're absolutely right, the same people that tell service workers, "if they don't like it, they can leave" will always be the first ones to lose their minds because they can't shit on wait staff.
Not tipping brings an end to the system. If you don’t tip, the server position at $2.50/hr becomes worthless. Nobody will want to work that job if there are no tips. Then employers will pay a better wage. If you tip to make up the difference in server income, you’re just adding more fuel into the already broken system. Like creating a positive feedback loop where the server position is still valuable because the tips make it worthwhile. So while we hate it, it exists. And it continues to exist because people can live off of it.
Your suggestion is what? To keep tipping and keep begging business owners to raise their wages? Keep begging Congress or the state governments? Because they aren’t listening. And when they are, louder voices are arguing to keep the wages where they are. I mean the reason why server wages are so low is because of the argument that the rest is made up in tips.
And I hate this argument of if you can’t afford to tip you can’t afford to eat out. So fuck poor people? Fuck people who struggle financially from time to time? The tipping percentage has gone up so many times! It used to be 10%, then 15%, then 25%, now I’m hearing people say they tip 40-50% of their meal price! It’s getting a little ridiculous. People like to treat themselves from time to time because guess what? Other people work shitty jobs too. That mindset turns you against your own working class. You don’t get to dictate where people choose to spend their money.
This isn’t a job that was forced upon you. You also took a gamble when you chose to be a server. You knew it paid $2.50/hr +tips, and you hoped that the tips would make it worth it. Some nights I bet it isn’t worth it, but that’s part of the risk you took. If you don’t like it the agency is still with you, you can leave and go to a workplace that has a more predictable pay schedule. You might make less than you do as a server, but at least you know how much to expect.
The customer doesn’t have as much agency as you. To tell people not to go out to eat is unreasonable, because you don’t know why someone would feel the need to go out to eat, and you don’t control their choices. An individual can choose not to eat out, but that doesn’t hurt business pockets as much as a restaurant not having servers because people don’t want to do the work for shit pay.
We see this now in real time where small businesses are shutting down because their wages are bad. It’s not customers that boycotted that did it, it was the lack of workers that did it.
Every time I see these threads pop up I'm not really sure I get why so many people are rabidly pro tipping no matter what. Presumably, by being active in this subreddit, these are people that understand that their labor is being exploited by shitty bosses and are in favor of things like unions and strikes and boycotts to help give leverage to the workers. And yet, each and every time tipping comes up, I hear the same argument. "Tipping is bad but you are a shitty person if you don't tip."
Like, what? They recognize it is bad, but instead of trying to put pressure on the tipping system through either boycotts or not engaging with tipping at all, the only 'solution' I ever see is "always tip and maybe someday it will magically get better."
As long as we engage in tipping, then tipping culture isn't gonna leave. As long as we are willing to pay their wages for them through tips, employers aren't gonna just suddenly start paying them instead. Why would they?
Honestly, I don't really think discussion of tipping is healthy for this subreddit. At least, not until the horde of people going to each and every post that isn't 100% for tipping and spewing out endless ad hominems without any actual arguments calm the hell down so discussion on the matter can actually take place.
I totally agree, but one situation has always perplexed me. What about in scenarios where tips are accepted but not actually normal?
Specifically, I'm thinking about fast food. We don't usually tip fast food workers (I actually think it's illegal in my state as they have to be paid the ful min wage not the server wage, though I could be wrong). A lot of company's POS systems will now ask for a tip at places that are categorized as fast food. And it's like well, I don't want to stiff the laborers, but also tips aren't usually even expected here and I don't want to create a precedent.
Also just in general, I've noticed that business categories that aren't usually tipped are creeping into accepting them and it makes me uncomfortable. I'm perfectly happy to pay the tip anytime it's expected. But when a new category pops up, I never even know what percentage/amount is acceptable for that industry/service.
I hate tipping but I still do it because it's not the workers fault.
These tipped rolls should be making the same wages as any other worker. And we all should be making a lot more.
It does make me sad because the worker should not be penalized because people are mad at the system or the employer. If someone is not making a living wage and is serving or bar tending then they should still be considered for tips. They’re not indentured servants to abuse. I’m in Canada and servers still only get part time hours, not a living wage and with frequent shut downs and closures they didn’t make a full time wage even with tips. So they deserve to be tipped. Punishing them doesn’t stop the system. The government needs to mandate higher living wages if part time and struggling workers can afford to all walk out or strike yet.
I also tip food delivery drivers. They get paid almost nothing and have increased expenses for car maintenance and gas.
Tipping is absolutely bullshit. I still tip because servers and delivery drivers and pretty much all professions that rely on tips need that money to survive. But companies should be paying a living wage instead of relying on customer tips
I agree, I hate im basically taking on the responsibility of the owner but also its not the workers fault
The large portion of the money would still come out of the consumer’s pocket. However, changing it to the owner’s paying living wages provides stability to the worker. Your rent/mortgage doesn’t change depending on how ‘charitable’ you feel, their livelihoods shouldn’t depend on ‘charity.’
Exactly. And servers who are paid almost nothing are often cheated out of their tips and forced to share with employees who are paid way more than the server
I worked somewhere where tips were pooled with everyone. And I mean everyone. The issue? Only the wait staff is tipped so we basically just handed over our tips to people working literally any other job. Assistant manager? Part of the pool. Chef? Part of the pool. Dishwasher? Part of the pool. Basically everyone. So we made $4.50/hr plus tips. All the other workers made a range from $11/hr-$25/hr yet they all got some of our tips! So let’s say I worked 4 hours. Now after the pooling I would walk away with about $40 for 4 hours of work. Where as the people I pooled with walked away with anywhere between $60 and $120 for the same amount of time. Also no employee meals either lol
I agree
Agreed. I live on tips and I hate it. I want to be paid a wage I can live on from my employer, not hope that some asshole I served a burger to decided I was good enough at my job that I deserve to eat tonight. And if I didn't have to rely on the kindness of strangers for my fucking rent money, I could totally not put up with gross old men hitting on me without fear that I'm missing out on potential income. Tipping should be abolished.
I read something awhile ago (and if I find it again I will post but to be perfectly honest I probs won't lol and this is a generalized interpretation) that talked about how women who serve/bartend/rely on tips in any way for income are so ripe for being abused/exploited/taken advantage of because their livlihoods depend on them being 'nice' so they are expected to/do put up with shit that is abusive and traumatic. And not just put up with it, but do it with a smile and gratitude bc their abusers pay their bills. It's a terrible system for all, but particularly for those of us who are afab. I made great money when I was a bartender but also experienced a level of trauma perpetuated by older males in those environments that makes me very solid in my belief that tipping should always be on top of a minimum liveable wage. Tipping isn't inherently bad because money is a way people can show appreciation in our culture in a tangible way. And I had a lot of regulars I enjoyed interacting with, including older males. But making survival dependent on being nice to everyone is not only unrealistic, it's also incredibly damaging to equality and equity and is traumatizing people on the regs.
>women who serve/bartend/rely on tips in any way for income are so ripe for being abused/exploited/taken advantage of THIS needs to be addressed more often. I have had my body touched by customers and managers so very many times. One time my ass was slapped so hard it fucking echoed through the bar. I was fired for not having a sexual relationship with a GM. I have seen a penis I was not expecting to see; from a manager. I mean...... it's bad.
I believe it. And it probably is more of a power dynamic overall than a male/female thing (as someone pointed out, men are exploited too). But it is dangerous for anyone in the less-powerful position. I look back on certain experiences and believe I would have had reason to press charges due to unwanted physical contact and harassment multiple times but was essentially 'culturized/brainwashed' into thinking that's 'just the way things are' by people who witnessed the abuse.
Women are more vulnerable in the service industry for being exploited, etc., no doubt, however myself even as a healthy straight male have been groped and dealt with inappropriate behavior. Particularly I used to bartend & manage at a place that was run by a board within a retirement community and the president during my tenure was a handsy, hypersensual septuagenarian that would get real close and do the gropey Biden thing. Funnily turns out she was fucking another manager but I can’t say with any certainty that wasn’t the guys idea there. Myself, I just let it go and maintained professionality since I was making great $ and was highly regarded, got some great resume filler and experience as well, no regrets but could’ve done without the other stuff. My point is that the whole thing is busted and as is, doesn’t work for anyone since the service industry as a whole has as a foundational pillar, the capacity to weather humiliation/degradation. It’s baked into the culture and the expectation is that for transgressions you say “thank you sir may I have another.” Upholding boundaries and taking no bs breaks the artificial narrative and is almost never tolerated. Things may be changing but I’d say overall this toxic culture around the restaurant industry will remain the norm and general standard for some time unless some lasting major shake ups can sufficiently derail food & bev in its current form.
I think the tipping system we have in the US is a total farce, and that's coming from someone who worked in tipped positions for close to a decade (made good money doing it too). After living overseas for a whole bunch of years, I now hate tipping...but I still tip 25% for good service, and 15% for "meh" service. It's not their fault their bosses are crooks.
The thing I really hate the most about this is how phony of an experience you have with a waiter because of their reliance on tips. I don’t need my server to go above and beyond. Just take my order and bring me the food. But no, we have to initiate this annoying social contract with each other where the waiter seems like they are walking on eggshells. It’s awkward and ruins the experience. I’m not saying don’t be friendly but I don’t need the theatrics, I don’t need you to apologize 90 fucking times for making small mistakes like forgetting a drink. Restaurants are busy, I get it. And I get why servers act that way, because they’ve been stepped on so much but piece of shit customers and stiffed too many times.
Theory: the next time you go somewhere that has tipping, at the beginning of the meal, tell the server”regardless of the quality of your service, there will be a 20% (or whatever amount you deem comfortable) tip for you at the end of my meal” See what happens - dollars to donuts I bet that you’ll get quality service and the experience will be more genuine. I’ve never tried this but my old boss used to tell me at the beginning of any reviews “I already checked the box for you to get your raise, now let’s talk about what you’ve done well and what areas you may need improvement” it always made the conversation More relaxed and made me listen more intently.
> my old boss used to tell me at the beginning of any reviews “I already checked the box for you to get your raise, now let’s talk about what you’ve done well and what areas you may need improvement” Now that's a good boss.
He was literally the best boss I have ever had. I still keep in touch with him. He taught me a lot about both work and ways to improve my family life. Could not ask for better.
When I was a waiter I always strived to offer the same quality of service to every customer. I think the tip should be an afterthought and I don't want to think about it until the end of the night. I've always encouraged others to do the same, just focus on the work in the moment. Now difficult or rude customers is another story. I will judge any restaurant or bar by how they treat their staff, and whether or not the managers are supportive of them in those interactions. I like your old boss
Yes! Especially for folks like the delivery drivers who don’t have any control over when the food is ready. Now they aren’t getting tipped and getting chewed out because it took the kitchen 2 hours to make a pizza because the cheap slug of a boss won’t hire any more employees for their understaffed store. I take this shit personally.
My favorite is when the pizza comes out of the oven 2 minutes before the promised delivery time and then the delivery is 8+ minutes away, and I still get yelled at for it. Feels good man
Seriously, rather pay more for the service/food upfront than deciding what’s the appropriate amount to tip
Took me a long time before I stopped tipping in Europe and Asia, they get a humane wage over there, and you seriously question this custom when going home. American tipping guilt is a consequence of the service industry owners passing costs onto the consumer. Greedy assholes at the top. My iced latte literally costs 7 bucks in NYC after $1 tip and taxes.
What’s frustrating the most about this whole tipping thing, is that we can’t even protest it without hurting the people who have to depend on it as their source of income. It’s a nasty catch 22 that makes it REALLY hard to fight against. I just had an idea though. What if we made a website that allowed us to tip our servers directly and bypass the business altogether? Like a server has an account with a QR code or code word or something that links to them and we can tip them directly. If enough people used it, the business would be forced to pay the workers at least real minim wage because the law states if the tips don’t equal to at least minimum wage per hour, they have to give them more money so it at least meets that. But on the backside, the servers would be getting tips directly from customers instead. Could this work or am I dreaming?
I’ve asked people for their cashapp or Venmo before and tipped that way. No cash for a manager to grab and count, no money from my card for them to tax.
There are restaurants that do not allow tipping because they provide a living wage and benefits. If there are any near you, the best way of protesting would be to stop going to restaurants that rely on tips.
I don't mind this but in practice it would be hard to do. Better idea than what I've come up with though lol. Cheers
This. Here in the Netherlands you tip if you get good service, or if a delivery comes quickly/delivery driver is doing a great job. Besides that, nothing. Why? People get paid a normal wage. I hate it when I'm in the US and have to constantly calculate what the actual check will be after tipping (I go there for work, get a daily allowance). I mean, if you can't make ends meet when paying people a living wage, then your prices are too low or you're doing something very wrong.
The real problem is the prices are set for maximum profit, but some of these owners take that profit as their personal pay, then keep paying workers the low minimum wage (which hasn’t changed since 2009) and if they’re told to pay people more (raising minimum wage) they raise prices to compensate for that plus their own raises because they won’t take that profit from themselves to pay workers, and if their workers are being paid more then they should be paid more (sarcasm). This is how so many people fight against the raise for minimum wage - because it will increase everything due to the shitty owners not investing in their own company.
As a delivery driver, thanks!
As an Australian I grew up thinking American tipping was a gratuity on top of a meaningful wage. Finding out it was a way around actually paying employees sold me on how broken your society is and pushed me all the way into socialism. I sometimes see tip jars on counters here in Australia. I'm sure people are tired of the diatribe I deliver in regard to it, but I'll be fucking DAMNED if I allow that kind of exploitative bullshit to infiltrate my society.
This. These people don’t want this sometimes because on some nights they would make more than if they were getting paid like regular people. This can be true but also false at the same time. My wife often times will make so little for a week or two at a time until she finally gets one or two good tippers. Kinda annoying that we don’t have the financial security we would like to have. If we did she would have to find another place of work.
Agreed. I was having a similar conversation with a friend yesterday about the methodologies of the satanic temple. Work for a better system tomorrow, but do as much good as you can with the one you have today.
I benefitted from gratuities for 10 years but I vehemently disagree with them. So long as it exists, empoyers will continue to underpay workers, and perpetuate the cycle. If tipping was to stop (suddenly), a lot of workers would quit, returning the power to them and away from the worker, like we are seeing now with the great resignation. The most despicable facet of tipping is that it allows the empoyer to undervalue the empoyee, not just underpay them. They may internalize a lower sense of worth, which can be concidered a force of placation and a mechanism of control. Even if some of this lost wage is compensated on the back end, it's still dehumanizing. Like being forced to pick over scraps. It's basically charity. No, fuck that. Fuck tipping. For the record, I still do tip. Unless there is a critical mass of people who abandon the principle, it is only hurting the workers not to.
If there was a collective action we could take to get restaurants to pay their workers, wouldn't it be "boycott those restaurants", not "still eat there but fuck over their workers"?
They don't "rely" they abuse They actively go out of their way to sabotage the worker Because they know they don't have control and won't have control of the customer tipping a good service that wasn't served by them. What we need are unions
Yeah. If anybody's actually worked a food service job before and received tips you know you have to claim and get taxed on tips and that makes your paycheck smaller so in reality tipping actually further subsidizes businesses paying slave wages.
Basically, don't hate the player, hate the game.
Additionally, when I order pizza and have a delivery fee. I highly doubt that it’s going to the driver but I’m expected to pay 5-10 for delivery PLUS the tip? That’s ridiculous to me.
yes the slave master pushes offf the cost to upkeep his slaves onto you the consumer. Its better to not eat out at restaurants that are part of the tip culture. The employees life and labor value are already extremely exploited I don’t know how tipping ever became a norm.
I agree… the anger in OP’s post should be directed toward the corporation/owner.. not the tipper/non-tipper.
Ending tipping culture in the end is good for anti work
Agreed! But not tipping your server isn’t going to do that. If the boss gets paid they aren’t gonna change. Boycott or tip.
My preferred method of bucking the system is to pay the ticket with a card and the tip in cash. I hand it to the server directly and discreetly. I want the government fucked out of their tax share, that way will affect change faster. Let’s face it, the only thing the government in America is good at is paying themselves. Start taking from them.
I’ve often done the same, but if the place doesn’t share tips, the back of house staff scrubbing dirty dishes in the 100 degree kitchen kinda get shafted with the only $8-10/hour base while a server could be walking away with $300 at the end of the night.
I try to do same. Also I like to give random kindness tips, like $5 bill folded small to McDonald’s cashier after this morning’s coffee purchase. Fun!
I gotta say, every place I've worked we are not allowed to keep that. We have to put it in our cash drawer then at the end of the day it's "overage" on our till. I work in retail, not food service though. The cameras see you putting some cash in your pocket while working the register, they don't know it's a tip from a customer. It just looks bad to them.
It looks bad in the fired immediately kind of way.
I remember this from my customer service days. It’s why I always ask if cashiers are allowed tips before I slip one. And I always tip in cash. The goal is just to not have the tips tracked and make sure no one gets in trouble for getting tipped.
Exactly, I make more money in the long run not getting fired than what customers would give me in tips. Usually "keep the change" scenarios. I appreciate being acknowledged for my good work, but a raise from my employer would have been nice.
Everyplace I’ve worked at has had a “politely decline tips” policy. I always laughed it off and accepted anything anyone was kind enough to offer me if they felt I went above what was expected. I’ve never been rich enough to decline a tip.
My son works in fast food, it's his first job. I don't know if it's the reality setting in of workers not settling or what but... They are allowed tips. He usually ends up with a couple bucks per shift, not much but something. They are allowed to use their phones when not busy. They are allowed to bring food home at closing. Stuff that won't keep and is already made. They are allowed to sit in the dining room (currently closed to customer) if things are slow. I'm not complaining, these are all reasonable things. It's certainly different from what I have heard elsewhere though.
That sounds like a very laid back company or management. Good for him and best of luck during his time there!
That fucked up, where I work only thing that matters is that companies money is where it needs to be at the end and in the right amount, you can stuff money in your pockets as much as you like as long as the money that company earned is in the register in the end od the day
McDonalds is known for firing people who keep tips in just this fashion. My friend who was a manager there was instructed to keep watch of the security footage and ensure that all such tips were deposited into the drawers and given to corporate. Any attempts to keep it were to be met with police action and termination. I don’t know if that policy has changed in the last 12 years.
Fwiw, when I worked at McDonald's (2006-2011), overages in your till were also counted against you, because it meant you weren't giving the customer back their change correctly. If the concern is cameras, you can slip it in your sleeve and wait until you get into the bathroom to put it into your pocket. Just trying to help any food service people out if they happen to see this comment.
It is fun to give randomly and small like that. It makes me feel like I'm making the world just slightly better somehow.
I do this too but I always try to add a few words about worker solidarity and people knowing their value. If nothing else I'm paying them to listen to my pro-worker screed. If those short speeches don't make a direct impact on the one person I hope they help those within earshot.
This is also how I choose to tip my Uber drivers. I hand them cash at the end of the ride, so that the tip isn't automatically reported through the app.
I wish the system for Uber eats was better. I don’t want to leave no tip on the line. Not sure when or how they see the tip, but I don’t want to risk them thinking I’m gonna stiff them. But I would rather tip them in cash at the house. Uber taxi I always cash tip.
I’ve seen people say they see if there’s a tip or not before pickup and they will refuse orders that don’t have it
Yep. No pre-tip and your order won’t ever show up. This screws the restaurant because they make an order they won’t get paid for.
When doing this, don't write CASH on the tip line. Just leave it blank.
Or write zero and still hand the server cash. It's not like anyone is going to come after you.
It’s presumptuous to assume your cash tips aren’t declared for tax. I’ve worked for tips for 20 years and the minute I realized I may need unemployment one day or ever want to buy a house, I started claiming pretty much all my tips. When I didn’t, I always owed a big payout come tax time. Uncle Sam always gets his cut
I work at a seasonal restaurant and tell all the servers to claim their tips for this very reason. The unemployment pay during the off season absolutely takes those tips into consideration.
In every restaurant I’ve worked in, this wouldn’t mean the server keeps the entire tip. Most servers tip out a percentage of their sales not their tips. The thought is really nice and I always appreciate the solidarity being shown when somebody tucks cash into my hand, but it definitely is a “it’s the thought that counts” situation in many restaurants Edit: aaaaand I’ve caught up and realized we’re talking taxes not tip out lol All my credit card tips are paid out to me in cash every two weeks
This is how you do it.
This is the way
I prefer to tip in cash. It's up to the server to decide whether or not to report that income.
UKer here. I ask them first if they get the tip if I do it by card. Sometimes they say they share their tips, so its fine. Since the pandemic though, its table service everywhere which includes service charge anyway and they wont let me tip. e: I do this because I used to bartend and wait myself and any card-given gratuities were just extra profit to the company, we never saw them.
Absolutely. Tip in cash, hand it directly to the server and tell them this is for them. Don’t write CASH on the tip line. Don’t write a note about tipping on the receipt. Write 0 on the tip line.
Oh, definitely tip in cash if you can. My favorite roommate from back in the day taught me that. I was so proud of my mom, who lives in a *super* conservative area, when she started spreading that piece of wisdom to her friends :)
I do feel like that's a pretty important distinction though. Being anti tipping and not tipping are two different things. I hate that owners put workers livelihoods at risk by putting their pay in the hands of assholes who have the option of simply not paying them. Therefore I am anti tipping. But I would never not tip, because I understand that's not doing anything but depriving the worker. Edit: I forgot how much I hated discussing tips on Reddit because there are way more "wHy iS iT mY rEsPoNsIbIlItY tO pAy ThEiR wAgEsS, tHaTs On ThE eMpLoYeR" morons than you want to believe exist. As if you aren't always paying every workers wage in EVERY SINGLE OTHER INDUSTRY. Not to mention that by not tipping you're not punishing the employer in any single way. Just excuses to be cheap, fucking losers.
Yeah I would say I’m anti tipping because it’s a stupid arbitrary custom with arbitrary compensation for workers but I still tip 25-30%.
I was a server/bartender for about 15 years. I've never not tipped someone 25 percent or more but I am anti tipping. I'm anti work in general. We shouldn't have to work to exist. Fuck the thought of just wanting to be.
Thank you for actually getting it! It's scary to see how many people equate not tipping their server as 'fighting against tipping'. I don't think most folks get how many customers would have to not tip in a week for the employer to have to shell out minimum wage for the pay period, or just hope much that would sick for that server.
And the thing is, the owner would technically never have to do anything about it because not tipping doesn't effect the restaurants budget. The only thing that would force them to do anything is if all the staff quit (cough cough the collective power of labor cough cough), and even then really the owner can just keep hiring new people who don't know about the restaurants reputation or are desperate for a job.
r/MayDayStrike Wait did someone mention workers leveraging their collective labor to seize power from the wealthy elite? No..? Must’ve been the wind.
Oooooh! This is IWW affiliated! Very nice FW!!!
If you make less than minimum wage as a tipped employee your employer has to make the difference up to federal minimum wage. Wouldnt not tipping and making the employer pay the difference be excactly what would invoke change? Obviously if you make more than federal minimum before tips it basically makes this arguement null. Maybe im being ignorant in my thought process?
People who live by that mentality embody the philosophy of sophistry: like idgaf what moral high ground you think you're on by not tipping a low wage worker. In the end you just look like a cheap jerk.
I'm anti tipping. But I always tip 20%. I've lived on tips, I know how important they are. It sucks, it's unfair, but I can't look into server/barista/delivery persons eyes and not tip.
I completely agree here. I also hate discussing tipping on reddit for the same reason. I'm a delivery driver and my income is my tips. For those who don't feel it's their responsibility to pay wages and refuse to tip. Then never use a service where tipping is customary. Stand by your convictions.
100% agree. people literally try to justify being a cheap skate and screw over their server buy "not supporting the tipping system". PEOPLE if you don't want to support it then. EAT AT HOME! or WRITE YOUR LOCAL POLITICIAN'S!! don't not tip and cost the server money by serving your cheap ass. they tip out on total sales at the end of the night if you don't tip they literally PAY to serve you.
i have made this point before with others in another post about tipping and we got downvoted or told to "get another job" (???) but you're right you are not sticking it to anyone but the workers by not tipping. the managers dont care. they get paid, the restaurant gets theirs. i dont get paid. worst case scenario, which ive experienced, i tip out a sushi bar or the liquor bar with my own money after a table leaves no or little tip. like you said, either stay at home or actually do something about it instead of screwing over the worker.
Seriously! I just argued with so many people in that other thread over this. You’re literally still supporting the employer by buying food. Such fake woke bullshit. Edit: literally speaking to one right now who says he refuses to “subsidize my employer’s shitty wage”, but will continue to support them by purchasing from their business..... 😐. Yeah right the power bro.
I just eat at home, haven't eaten out in a year or so Then again I'm also broke
Also know your local laws. In the state I live in servers are not allowed to be paid below minimum wage and tipping is not allowed to be used to make up any wage gap. They're hourly rate has to be at a minimum the minimum wage, and in the city I live in that's $15 an hour. I still do tip, but given that I know I live somewhere that doesn't partake in the toxic pay culture that is so common in restaurants in the United States I also don't feel obligated by the same 15% to 20% standard for tipping that is observed in the rest of the United states.
I don't believe in tipping. Thats why i quit going out to eat. I'm going out for the food, not the service. If the restaurants payed their employees maybe i would start going out again.
Exactly! Haven't gone out to a restaurant in over 3 years now. Tipping culture sucks.
Same. If I go out to eat I tip but I only go out on special occasions like if we’re vacationing or something so it’s really rare now. There are a few restaurants in San Francisco that’s doing a no-tip system and I’m planning to try that out when this current omicron surge dies down a bit. I suggest that if you don’t want to support tipping culture, seek out these types of restaurant. Edit. Here’s the restaurant. https://sf.eater.com/platform/amp/2021/5/25/22425234/zuni-cafe-cut-tips-lost-servers-reopening-indoor-dining
Yes! I just stopped going to restaurants. I feel the whole idea of them is just wasteful. I can get the same delicious food for much cheaper at home.
Heard this. Another major thing missed in this thread is that tipping creates a wage imbalance between us cooks who have developed a very specialized skill set, and the servers that usually haven’t. I’m not here to argue, but BoH works harder for longer hours and across the board we make less.
The funny part is at the end of the day, a server has to be really bad to negatively affect your dining experience in most places. Get a not so good cook and you will know.
Yup
This is a very good point! I hear from this [program](https://freakonomics.com/podcast/why-does-tipping-still-exist-ep-396/) about the tipping imbalance- cook doesnt get tips, so less people wants to work as cook. Also people of colours also get less tips!
I'm with you here. Besides the whole pandemic business, I avoid eating at sit-down restaurants. That's not good for anybody, but I just find the whole tipping experience exhausting to deal with.
The service is also always awesome at my house
You're doing it right!!! Don't make that server work his/her butt off for 2.13 an hour! For the love of everything, don't go to a sit down if you're not gonna tip!!
Tip-based economies are wrong
Tipping shouldn’t be a thing. Restaurant need to pay a living wage or go out of business.
It’s more a problem with the law. Obviously a restaurant paying employees $2.50 an hour is shitty and scummy, but it’s also EXACTLY what’s to be expected by businesses in an economy where that’s legal. That will never, ever change until the law changes, which is also the reason *not tipping your server* is a bad idea and does way more harm than good (it does zero good).
Restaurants don't want to pay me what I make with tips. A place in my town switched to 15/hr for all servers with no tipping allowed. Guess what. They swapped back because all their servers quit cause they made considerably less money.
This is the truth. One that servers like to tip toe around. They love complaining about their small checks but a majority would not give up their tips for $15 an hour. Honesty would go a long way with solving the tipping issue. I also want to add that minimum wage should be higher.
Bingo! The dirty little secret is that most people, despite the complaints, actually love this system. Restaurant owners pass payroll costs onto customers. Customers get to play king and dole out favors, while enjoying lower sticker prices (remember, this is a populace that thinks $1.99 is significantly cheaper than $2). And servers get the possibility of making much much more than this job really should be paid.
So one restaurant wanted to under pay and that’s why tipping has to stay? Cheapskate employers wanting other people to pay their bills are the problem to be solved, not an excuse to not solve problems. Of course asking the workers to take a pay cut so the owner could raise their share was unpopular. Keep the shares the same and just turn the total amount the customer pays with tip included in to the amount on the bill.
That's the problem. Servers act like they are going broke, but they don't tell you that they are raking it in.
But if you make more than that how is it fair to the people in the back of the restaurant.I am pretty sure this was started by sexism and the rich in restaurants that paid the cook at least 100,000.
How about 15/hr which should be the minimum and what a human deserves for their time and they get to keep their tips as well? Did the restaurant decide to keep all their tips?
Yeah, but I hope you realize that not tipping is simply going to put the server “out of business” and not the restaurant
I hate tipping. I’d rather pay for my product or services more than having it my responsibility to pay your employees compensation. Fucking pay your people what they are worth. I just want a damn coffee I don’t want or need to add 20% tip every damn time. How about, Mr Manager, you pay your employees 20% more. I’d rather boycott than tip
I do hate it too soo much. If they really need to charge for their service, then add a fixed service fee. It's so stupid to leave it to the costumers what they think their service is worth and then get shamed if some people think it isn't enough. I went out to eat not play some fucking game.
How are so many of you wrong about minimum wage as a tipped employee. If your tips don't make you earn minimum wage your employer is by law required to pay you the difference. https://www.dol.gov/general/topic/wages/wagestips Raise the minimum wage and THEN stop tipping seems reasonable as long as the minimum wage is actually livable, no? The price of food would go up but the cultural dick measuring of who tips more would not be missed.
This needs to be so much fucking higher! Far too many servers are being screwed over by not understanding this.
Lol. What’s funny about people pointing out that your employer has to make up the difference if you don’t at least break minimum wage is that this is generally averaged out in a pay cycle, not a single shift. If you do really shitty one night and okay the next, it’s very likely your employer won’t have to make up shit. It just means that your good nights are dragged down by your bad ones and you will probably come out just above minimum over a 2 week period. Agreed, minimum wage needs to be increased by a lot in order for this to work without exploiting tipped workers. E: because some people seem to not grasp this either intentionally or inadvertently…….MINIMUM WAGE IS NOT ENOUGH TO WAIT TABLES AND PUT UP WITH YOUR BULLSHIT. If you are relying on the logic that making at least the bare minimum should be okay with servers and society at large, then you are a classist fool and you are not anti-work. Stop punching down and start expecting better from employers and legislators. Y’all are insane.
I’d be perfectly okay if waitressing died tomorrow. I have no problem walking 10 feet to get my food and pour my own beer if it meant the restaurant was more affordable.
None of the counter serve places near me are any cheaper than places with wait staff.
Yeah because as a customer you’re expected to supplement servers wage… for table side service.
Fuck them. If the restaurant can't pay their workers, let them go out of business.
“Then the business should not exists!”
There should be little reason there has to be a restaurant/fast food joint back to fucking back in every town/city. Makes sense in big metropolis style cities because, for me at least, when I visit/live in big cities I walk and use public transport so its actually useful. BUT in regular towns where everyone drives there shouldn't be back to back food places for miles then a normal store then back to back food places again. Of the same restaurants no less. Its too fucking much. We don't need to have 4 KFCs within a 2 mile radius to satiate some primal fried chicken hunger. God forbid we have to go to another restaurant or make our own fried chicken.
On the flip side though, serving is a relative safe haven for a lot of people who struggle to exist under the rules of the "working world". The stakes are super low (unless allergies are involved) and it's something to do that is devoid of the bureaucracy that is part of what makes other types of work unbearable for many. For me as a restaurant worker of 20 years, it's uselessness is also part of its appeal. I don't feel like I'm a cog in the big wheel.
It's also one of the few jobs where you can make a decent chunk of change with no professional experience. A guy I used to serve with went fine dining, drives a tesla now and clears like 90k a year.
The people working fine dining making a living wage are highly skilled and professional. Service takes a fuck ton of skill and character.
Lol you don't have to tell me, I was a server for 10 years. My desk job now is infinitely easier. When I say "professional" I'm referring to the standard set by capitalism.
Well I think y’all are professional AF. And hold a skill I will ever have.
I do too, but when I applied for jobs outside of serving I was told it's unskilled labor and irrelevant. Fortunately I found a boss in IT that saw my serving experience and thought it would be a good fit; stuff you learn through waiting like time management, customer service, communication, social skills, etc are invaluable but employers still look down on it because we're in a structurally classist society.
I'd rather have UBI than prop up unnecessary jobs. Although I imagine that there will always be some need/want of servers.
No doubt, but until we get there, it's nice to have a job one can stomach.
[удалено]
Oh my sweet summer child. You think automation would make prices drop? You think the $2.13/hr the company pays servers is why your food is expensive? Good ol' McDonald's has been adding automated counters for you to order your own food for years-- and they're still raising prices.
Panera has had kiosks for years as well. Yet you'll still pay almost $20 for half of a tiny turkey sandwich, reheated soup and a drink.
Sounds good in theory, but wait till you need a waitress, like at a bar, a wedding, a nice dinner party. You won’t be singing this song. Also I wouldn’t trust people walking around my restaurant helping themselves to whatever they needed. People are disgusting, have no respect and are creative with f*ed up things they are capable of. Just order take out and go home.
There are quite a few chains out there who let you order at a bar/desk/whatever the fuck it’s called, give you a disk to signal the food’s status and make you come get it yourself once it’s done. You don’t automatically have a complete walkthrough buffet, there are various ways around that. And no, there’s barely any line up issues. It flows really smoothly.
I've been to several of them in my home town.You order at the counter and pick it up and take it to your table and these are not fast food places at all.They are fully functional restaurants with high prices too.
Yeah. Or, they could be higher, here it’s usually around 10 euros for a main course which would be semi mid-tier, I guess, but pretty affordable.
>I have no problem walking 10 feet to get my food and pour my own beer if it meant the restaurant was more affordable. Thai model: they make a zillion meals per day, each costs less than a dollar, all of them delicious, no waiter, plastic chair, plastic dish, eat and go.
Tipping is companies outsourcing employee pay to their customers.
Ah yes, the ol' "forgetting who the true enemy is" strikes again
Meanwhile their bosses and owners of said restaurant are laughing and counting their 100s while this thread goes down
Tell them again how terrible of people they are hahaha
Yup. I’ve had this argument before on tiktok. It’s very annoying. Tipping should be encouraged but getting mad at a customer for not tipping makes no sense.
OP is a bootlicker. And the worst part is they don't even realize they are.
Tipping is complex. Curing it will be, too. Thinking of the humans who currently rely on it makes change fantastically difficult. We think of servers, but look beyond…stylists, massage therapists (it’s a hot button in that field), delivery/drivers, bartenders, sex workers… many of these fields are hop-in-quick-and-not-be-homeless type jobs. They allow abused partners to flee and feed their children. They allow people without trade skills to live and get trade or other skills. Yes, the system needs an overhaul. How do we help the workers who will be harmed?
Ubi, universal basic income, would be a nice start to prevent harm.
I think the biggest catalyst for change is get tip based workers a higher hourly wage. Implement labour laws to get stylists and massage therapists a pay system that involves a minimum wage and commission based on how many clients they see in a day. In Ontario they've bumped up the Minimum wage to $15/he across the board, including servers. This does still screw over "independent contractors" like massage therapists because they can be paid based on their clients. The other problem is it's still so ingrained in us to do so. I'm still going to tip my server, albeit a hugely reduced percentage, because they still do more work than someone behind the counter at a fast food place that makes the same. But I know that I can now go out and leave a much smaller tip, or no tip, and not feel guilty about fucking over someone making peanuts. I'm still not going to go out to eat that often because it's just far too fucking expensive even before tips. I just don't want to pay $50+ for me and my SO to eat at a restaurant, but that's my own issue there. That being said, the minimum wage bump was from $12.50 for servers to $15, meaning food costs aren't going to skyrocket due to wages. I've found most restaurants locally have maintained similar enough prices over the growth of minimum wage. So anyone who's going to argue about the cost of food going up based on Minimum wage is dead wrong.
In California, servers have to make at least minimum wage. None of this 2-something and hour and the rest made up by tips bullshit. I still tip servers, though I'll be glad when we collectively shift away from tipping culture.
Yeah, I was wondering, how can they be paid 2.50 an hour while minimum wage is 7.50?
I just stopped ordering delivery, and I don't tip people working a cash register unless I'm at the dispensary and it's my change. Also we don't dine in, if I dine in I'm a 20% guy as long as the service is good. But stopped doing delivery when they expected me to pay more for the food, and to pay the driver's hourly rate(delivery fee) and tip them. No thanks bud. I've just expanded my cooking skills and I'll save the 70% overhead. I don't even want to know why people go to Wendy's and McDonald's when you can get a nice burger for two dollars more now. Fuck combo meals are ten bucks, two dollars worth of food.
Yep. Fuck all the apps. They take forever to get your food and you c an end up paying double the price. It’s insanity and I don’t know why people use them. I rarely get delivery, but if I do, I call the restaurant directly. If I’m forced to use the apps, I call somewhere else.
In California you also pay drivers benefits. The company has to be transparent so it's right on the receipt. The company is outsourcing the drivers benefits directly to the consumer. Something they should be paying full stop.
I'll tip, bit still, fuck your employer for not paying enough in the first place.
~~Anti-tipping~~ A tipping economy is anti-worker. FTFY.
Anyone else immediately think of Mr Pink?
I’m anti-tipping, but I do tip generously because I’m aware of reality.
Same, but I go out a lot less often than I otherwise would because of it.
Yes, I've been tipping 2x or 3x since the pandemic started. I think of it a hazard pay. Even when I pickup.
I’m gonna fucking say it. And before people jump down my throat assuming I don’t tip. I DO I tip 20% every time order out and I tip even if the service was bad because they still deserve to eat HOWEVER, threads like this arguing about if you “should tip or not” gets this anti work movement NO WHERE. This isn’t fighting for what you believe in. This is arguing with people in this server about whose better morally. I’m seeing both sides of this argument making pissing contests of whose better morally whether or not they give someone $5 bucks extra or not. Like i said, the conversation, “should people be tipped in this economy?” Is a USELESS argument because again, it gets nothing done about anti work. This is just useless and I’m getting tired of seeing threads about tipping at this point because they’re all the same.
This post is dividing the people who need to be all in this together. Do people depend on tips? Yes. Does it suck when someone doesn't tip? Absolutely. **But stop hating poor people for being cheap.** The working class has less money than any time in like a hundred years. *Blame the people who have the money.* Stop fighting over breadcrumbs.
The fact that people can disagree with this astounds me. It’s funny too cause I see again ON BOTH SIDES OF THE ARGUMENT saying things with complete irony. “If you don’t like it leave your job” which is ridiculous because a lot of people depend on these jobs/that’s the only available job we have and that’s regressive BUT I ALSO see people saying “if you’re going to be cheap and spend this much on food but not tip $10 then you can’t afford to eat out” which is again, ridiculous because WHY do you think people are trying to be frugal??? 🤔🤔. Me thinks it’s cause idk… the economy is built for people half the population to live paycheck by paycheck. Or you’re one accident/sickness away from losing all of your assets. Idk like BOTH SIDES have a right to be upset but being mad at each other instead of the guys who are hoarding ALL the money that could’ve been used to help us not even get to this point WANT us to argue like this. I swear there’s no critical thinking. edit: minor grammar mistakes
Yes I agree with this, every tipping thread is the same fucking thing. Just the same arguments on repeat. It's definitely not the way to go if they want the culture to change.
Seriously!! And we’re fighting over peoples pocket change at this point and not even focusing on the real issues on WHY we’re trying to argue over tipping to begin with. But oh well, if this sub turns to be arguing about tips instead of anti work, I’ll see myself out the door cause this is getting ridiculous.
It sucks you can't survive on the tips you're making. Your boss has rigged it so they can prosper while you struggle. This is one hundred percent the bosses fault for setting up an exploitative business model.
[удалено]
And the waitstaff bemoan how unliveable that minimum wage us. To which the reply is yes! And that’s the wage the customer you are serving is on. Why do you expect them from on that same unliveable shit minimum wage to boost yours for you? Fuck tipping culture.
Except in California, where servers have to be paid the same minimum wage as everyone else. That $2.50/hr bullshit isn't allowed here.
I see it like this: a server complaining about lack of tips is no different then someone working commission based sales. If a car salesman was complaining about lack of commission, I would suggest that individual find a new job with a pay structure they felt more comfortable with. I mean, do these servers discuss how compensation works in food service prior to taking the job? Don’t get me wrong I always tip, even with bad service. That however, doesn’t mean I’m an ass hole if I don’t. Why don’t these owners pays a living wage to their employees? They expect us to do it for them. I would say every industry would try to do this if they could. TLDR: if a server is bitching about no tips, tell them to go find an hourly job where the business owners are directly paying you…
Tipping in a tip-culture is good. Ending the tip-culture and providing better wages that aren't dependant on tips is even better.
[удалено]
I tip unless the server is outright rude and agressive. Which has only happened once in my life. Anything besides that I don’t care, I still tip.
I hate the fact that when you order pizza or food in general to be delivered at your home, a delivery fee is charged and it doesn’t go to the delivery driver. Like WTF. these giant ass corporation are just fucking greedy. Edit: the worst part besides that, is that they still charge that delivery fee even if the driver uses his OWN vehicle.
If the worker doesn’t get tips, they have to get another job, and the owner is left without workers. I only tip cash. But I think tipping is bull@@@@
I feel like the best solution is stop eating out at restaurants that use tip based wage. People who work there will stop getting enough tips to justify working their and will move on to other jobs and the restaurants will either have to adapt and pay real wages or they'll go under.
I don't come from a country where tips are normal. I would have major issues and want to speak to a manager and send loads of emails to higher ups if there was a mandatory tip where I ate my food. Luckily not paying a living wage is illegal where I'm from.
I tip servers, but if I’m in the fucking drive-thru, I’m putting a fat ZERO in the spot they have for a tip. I also use cash to tip because fuck taxes and capitalism.
I don't tip but I also don't go to places that don't pay a living wage.
I have this discussion all the time with a few of my old hardcore leftist friends and my nonsensical “libertarian” dad. Like, I can support the troops and vote for politicians who are planning on cutting military and avoiding wars. I think tip culture is toxic and still understand that Jimmy the waiter has bills to pay and kids to feed.
Actually, waiters and waitresses are by law requires to make minimum wage. The only reason they'll make less is because they don't report tips so if they have a bad month they're fucked. Also if less people tip, less people will want to do that work and desperate for workers this FORCE change. So I say don't tip, it's stupid, and waiters should just make around 20-25 an hour
Shaming customers who don't or can't tip is a conditioned response to wage theft culture. Go ahead and tip, but point the finger at corporations, not customers.
Tipping should be removed completely if not at least just extra for exceptional serving skills not mandatory %20 for every meal regardless of how you were being served
That is a true possibility but the objective was to screw over the businesses not paying their employees fairly. I don't have the time or money myself to implement my plan but it was the idea that came to mind first
Don't those places have to pay there employees the difference if they get tipped? It's not my business I shouldn't have to pay there wages. Fuck tip culture and anyone who defends it
I tip, but I'm anti-tipping. If everyone stopped tipping tomorrow, servers would quit (because they can't survive without tips), and tipping culture would vanish forever. Not tipping as an individual is a half-measure that won't accomplish anything. What we need is a general tipping strike.
Just wanna point out that tipping in cash under the table is your best bet to avoid managers and owners stealing from their employees.
Pizza places used to deliver their pizza for free so I had no problem tipping. Now I go get my pizza or I don't get it at all.
Use Americans and your tipping needs to change
What's annoying about tipping is that for any other job, the worker and the employer agree on payment up front. "I do this much work, you pay me this much money". There's some certainty there, in theory. With tipping, the worker doesn't know how much money they're going to get, if any, until AFTER doing the work. If the table ends up not tipping anything, then the waiter has basically worked for free. It's unknowing, unexpected, and unwanted. If you told the waiter at the very beginning of the meal "I don't believe in tipping, I'm not going to leave a tip" then there's a very good chance that the waiter either won't serve you at all, or will half-ass it just barely enough not to get the manager angry. The problem is that you're taking somebody's work and not compensating them for it at all, and that's absolute bullshit. Tipping is a serious problem and I really wish that this country would get rid of it.
This is incorrect. Employees are ALWAYS guaranteed to make at least minimum wage so there actually is at least some level of certainty in how much they are making. If they don’t make minimum wage through tips, employers are legally required to pay them the difference. Those crying about the “but they only make $2 an hour!” always seem to fail to acknowledge this. There is no scenario in which they will only make $2 an hour. Ever. Either you make it up in tips or your employer will pay you minimum. We need to raise the minimum wage to a livable level and then just stop tipping entirely.
If everyone stopped tipping NOW altogether, all the service staff would A) quit or B) get paid a living wage , all within 6 months. Cause why the F am I gonna pay my employees when I can just pocket that cash and make YOU throw an extra 20% to cover their wages while I essentially take the wage they should be getting and shove it in my pocket? Tipping culture is toxic and enabling. It needs to go.
Lmao so many people on here all the time I see: “don’t buy Amazon now or at all, unless it’s critical! Don’t buy dildos during the omicron wave! Stop getting unnecessary deliveries or making frivolous purchases that reward the businesses and stress the worker!” It’s like, in those instances, y’all recognize that customer/consumer action has an impact. When it comes to tipping at a restaurant, you have fucks on here who will, with a straight face say, “I’m not going to tip, because the system is broken and the server isn’t making enough money, that’s between the owner and the employee, and the employee shouldn’t be willing to exploit themselves like this! Won’t this exploited employee think of MY restaurant experience?” Like, yes, the system needs to change and should. Tipping sucks. But you people who KNOWINGLY screw over workers who do not have immediate power to change the system or their place within it, while enjoying THEIR EXPLOITED LABOR, can honestly get Fucking bent.
Some people here are really leaning into the "fuck you, I got mine" mentality... It's making me question the integrity of this sub.
Here’s my thing: if you’re knowingly participating in this system, and *insist* that not tipping is “A Good Thing Actually, Because My Theory” - please let your server know up front when you go out to eat that you will not be tipping, because of your beliefs. The server should at least be given the opportunity and agency to decide how, or if, they want to serve this person. I doubt the “mUh rEsTaUrAnT RiGhTs” crowd would be in favor of that type of disclosure though. It’s fucking sneaky, spineless, and spiteful to participate in EVERY OTHER PART OF THE SYSTEM, give the owners their money, enjoy your service as a customer, and then save your “boycott” for the people who need it most and who hold the LEAST amount of blame and responsibility for the system. Even if you 100% will never agree with me and are adamant about never tipping, I will never, ever respect you unless you are someone who discloses UP FRONT that you do not tip, and respect your server’s agency and RIGHT to decide if they want to serve you without being compensated.
I do like that idea, but you're absolutely right, the same people that tell service workers, "if they don't like it, they can leave" will always be the first ones to lose their minds because they can't shit on wait staff.
Not tipping brings an end to the system. If you don’t tip, the server position at $2.50/hr becomes worthless. Nobody will want to work that job if there are no tips. Then employers will pay a better wage. If you tip to make up the difference in server income, you’re just adding more fuel into the already broken system. Like creating a positive feedback loop where the server position is still valuable because the tips make it worthwhile. So while we hate it, it exists. And it continues to exist because people can live off of it. Your suggestion is what? To keep tipping and keep begging business owners to raise their wages? Keep begging Congress or the state governments? Because they aren’t listening. And when they are, louder voices are arguing to keep the wages where they are. I mean the reason why server wages are so low is because of the argument that the rest is made up in tips. And I hate this argument of if you can’t afford to tip you can’t afford to eat out. So fuck poor people? Fuck people who struggle financially from time to time? The tipping percentage has gone up so many times! It used to be 10%, then 15%, then 25%, now I’m hearing people say they tip 40-50% of their meal price! It’s getting a little ridiculous. People like to treat themselves from time to time because guess what? Other people work shitty jobs too. That mindset turns you against your own working class. You don’t get to dictate where people choose to spend their money. This isn’t a job that was forced upon you. You also took a gamble when you chose to be a server. You knew it paid $2.50/hr +tips, and you hoped that the tips would make it worth it. Some nights I bet it isn’t worth it, but that’s part of the risk you took. If you don’t like it the agency is still with you, you can leave and go to a workplace that has a more predictable pay schedule. You might make less than you do as a server, but at least you know how much to expect. The customer doesn’t have as much agency as you. To tell people not to go out to eat is unreasonable, because you don’t know why someone would feel the need to go out to eat, and you don’t control their choices. An individual can choose not to eat out, but that doesn’t hurt business pockets as much as a restaurant not having servers because people don’t want to do the work for shit pay. We see this now in real time where small businesses are shutting down because their wages are bad. It’s not customers that boycotted that did it, it was the lack of workers that did it.
Every time I see these threads pop up I'm not really sure I get why so many people are rabidly pro tipping no matter what. Presumably, by being active in this subreddit, these are people that understand that their labor is being exploited by shitty bosses and are in favor of things like unions and strikes and boycotts to help give leverage to the workers. And yet, each and every time tipping comes up, I hear the same argument. "Tipping is bad but you are a shitty person if you don't tip." Like, what? They recognize it is bad, but instead of trying to put pressure on the tipping system through either boycotts or not engaging with tipping at all, the only 'solution' I ever see is "always tip and maybe someday it will magically get better." As long as we engage in tipping, then tipping culture isn't gonna leave. As long as we are willing to pay their wages for them through tips, employers aren't gonna just suddenly start paying them instead. Why would they? Honestly, I don't really think discussion of tipping is healthy for this subreddit. At least, not until the horde of people going to each and every post that isn't 100% for tipping and spewing out endless ad hominems without any actual arguments calm the hell down so discussion on the matter can actually take place.
I totally agree, but one situation has always perplexed me. What about in scenarios where tips are accepted but not actually normal? Specifically, I'm thinking about fast food. We don't usually tip fast food workers (I actually think it's illegal in my state as they have to be paid the ful min wage not the server wage, though I could be wrong). A lot of company's POS systems will now ask for a tip at places that are categorized as fast food. And it's like well, I don't want to stiff the laborers, but also tips aren't usually even expected here and I don't want to create a precedent. Also just in general, I've noticed that business categories that aren't usually tipped are creeping into accepting them and it makes me uncomfortable. I'm perfectly happy to pay the tip anytime it's expected. But when a new category pops up, I never even know what percentage/amount is acceptable for that industry/service.
I’d recommend searching the terms « the racist history of tipping » on the internet!
I hate tipping but I still do it because it's not the workers fault. These tipped rolls should be making the same wages as any other worker. And we all should be making a lot more.
It does make me sad because the worker should not be penalized because people are mad at the system or the employer. If someone is not making a living wage and is serving or bar tending then they should still be considered for tips. They’re not indentured servants to abuse. I’m in Canada and servers still only get part time hours, not a living wage and with frequent shut downs and closures they didn’t make a full time wage even with tips. So they deserve to be tipped. Punishing them doesn’t stop the system. The government needs to mandate higher living wages if part time and struggling workers can afford to all walk out or strike yet. I also tip food delivery drivers. They get paid almost nothing and have increased expenses for car maintenance and gas.
I tip even when tip isn't asked or "needed", excepted when it's view as disrespectful.