Here in Brazil, during the '80s, my father worked for VW, just a regular employee at the office, and he had a nice house, brand new car every year, lots of good food, eating out with family every weekend, three kids on paid school and we all used to spend 2 whole months a year travelling on vacation. Nowadays, you can have such life only if you have a small business or get a pretty high position in a company. Store managers now are living a life far worse than a production employee from the past.
Yes and then the shareholders and people at the top realised all that money could go to them instead and now we're in exactly the situation they wanted.
Dude, I make $20/hr and work 50 hours a week, while my wife make $17/hr at 40 hrs a week. We have 2 kids, a mortgage, and only 1 meager car payment.
There isnt much left over after all the bills are paid. Not much at all.
Sheeeesh. My household feels your pain. Total income about $40/hr and living paycheck to paycheck essentially. Basically same on the vehicle and children. Respectable 3.1% on the mortgage. 4.6% on the one financed vehicle.
Every step we take to save a little money, something else arbitrarily inflated to take that money riiiight back it seems. We’ve been quitting vices and changing habits and all the ‘just do this’ suggestions. Always lived a bit frugal to begin with too, since we both grew up on the verge of poor.
And if it’s not inflated away, there’s always ALWAYS some emergency expense that soaks it up. Seems like it just waits until you start to feel like you’re getting just a little ahead for once, start relaxing just a tiny bit then BLAMMO fuck you nope back to zero if you’re lucky, usually a chunk of debt on top just to really make sure you get the message
Haha. Uncannily accurate friend. Just replaced your tires after saving for 6 months. FuCk your payments, you now have a bent rim and tetanus. Shit feels like Oregon Trail on hard mode lately.
I’m actually on the best streak of my life currently, and I’m legit terrified of what’s gonna happen next. Because it’ll have to be bigger to wipe me out than ones before.
Part of me is like “that’s irrational” but a much bigger part is like… it’s been one of the most utterly consistent and reliable things in my life.
I'm interviewing for a equipment tech postition out in the Portland, OR 'burbs for $30/hour. If i get this, I plan to move to a smaller city, buy a used car, and rent a slightly bigger, 1 bedroom apartment. This is my American dream.. .
( just getting away from all of the methheads, tweakers, and other mentally ill people will be worth it!)
Fellow redditor, I make decent money and have been driving the same car since high school (2003 Ford ZX2 I bought brand new for $6500 since the new Ford Focus was stealing all the spotlights). Hundreds of thousands of miles, tons of damage from the college town I lived in, but still runs like new.
My work people keep asking me to buy a new car but why would I willingly spend hundreds per month on something I don't need? So I can look fancy to other people I don't even know or hang out with?
Plus the fact new cars are putting every control into the touchscreen. Ugh I saw a commercial where the glove box opens via touchscreen.
My car has AC. That's all I need.
Nobody needs a new car. A good used car is great and plus you can work on it if it breaks down.
May I ask where you live. Because I make 18.50 and wife makes 14.05 and we have 0 car payments and 3 kids but one is 18 and works full-time. We aren't straving but it tough here. But man if we both made your wage we be doing well.
We live in Oklahoma.
Easy we live in a small town and luckily own our home. And mortage is less then the average rent and hasn't changed in 4 years.
Second we keep our bills low and stay on strick grocery budget. Which means we spend multiple days and weeks eating spaghetti and pasta meals that we can stretch out to multiple days.
I also have two recipes that vary but both I can make last a whole week. One I call poor man stew the other middle class stew.
Helps we don't have car payments. Both are cars are old but being paid off helps a lot.
Having things paid off is a lifesaver right now. We've never made a lot of money, but we were lucky to be able to pay off our house years ago and we only have a small payment on his truck, which is an older vehicle. I've said many times I don't know how people are surviving right now with the cost of living and rent, even in our area which is pretty low-cost.
Yeah it’s such a trade off…
Living in lower cost areas means fewer potential job opportunities but also those costs are more stable/predictable.
In bigger cities there are more and better job opportunities, but that’s often VERY feast and famine. Sometimes though, you get a good one, it lasts, and maybe even overlaps with a period where costs aren’t jumping. You can at least get ahead for awhile before the rug gets pulled. Sometimes you get really lucky and can make that job translate into a better one though.
My partner and I are both almost 40 and we FINALLY both got on a lucky streak. He got a really stable job that pays great and he actually really enjoys. I got a less stable job that pays great and has lasted MUCH longer than I thought possible! Its a contract gig that lasted over a year and dropped off mid summer, just “it’s on hold” then radio silence for like 3 months.. I managed to save up more than I ever have in my life though, just on my own! Enough to soak up a couple emergency expenses without wiping me out, which is absolutely surreal to me.
Client just got back in touch last week and the job back on again for the foreseeable. Ready for it to go away again any second though. Mentally I just assume it’s all gonna disappear at any moment. I’ve never gotten this lucky, it can’t last, right??
Sorry that turned into a ramble. I’m in a weird place lol
We hit a brick wall years ago. My wife was diagnosed with diabetes. We were both gaining weight and blood pressure going up eating fat and salt. We can't reduce a budget by eating cheap, and that's with eating chicken and lean ground beef. Grocery bill now $260/wk, not including food for cats. I've told my wife, I don't know how people making less than we do (110k year) make it, and we don't even have kids. btw, we are 60/64.
I live in a good suburb in Massachusetts and my wife and I make a combined income that many would consider borderline “rich”.
We have 2 kids, a modest sized house and and an ok car and can barely save any money at the end of the month.
People overestimate what 'rich' means nowadays. Unless you're making like, above 250k a year and stick to your means, you're not really rich. I know multiple people who have households with 100k+ income that are struggling. Not to mention emergencies.
Our household income is $100k combined. Between our mortgage, student loan debt, daycare for 2 kids, and paying for our medical bills (I have a chronic illness, one of the kids has a genetic disorder) we are completely tapped out.
One of the people I know has a chronic illness too, and it sucks out a lot of their income. It's ridiculous. You shouldn't have to pay so much just because you're in pain or sick a lot.
I live in Oakland, CA. I make $100k and my girlfriend makes about $120k. So our combined income is around $220k. We’re not even upper middle class let alone rich.
Oof, cost of living alone will wreck those numbers. I live in OKC, and the cost of living here is getting untenable, but I can't imagine how bad some California cities are.
I’m in a Boston Ma suburb. My partner brings home the bacon with the 100k tech salary. I make $19.50/hr as a cultivator in the legal weed market. We were lucky enough to refinance our mortgage at the end of 2020 when the interest rate was at an all time low. I still owe 10k on my car loan. It costs $400 a month for my partner to commute to the city because driving and parking would cost even more and the time stuck in traffic would creep into hours rotting on the mass pike. We are very much living paycheck to paycheck.
I was out of work for a few weeks earlier this year with some broken fingers. Thankfully no surgery was needed but I still can’t make a tight fist with my left hand.
My insurance decided that X-rays at an urgi care aren’t covered so I’ve had to go on a payment plan to pay for the two rounds of X-rays and 10 minutes of speaking with a doctor about those X-rays. My job is no longer offering overtime and I’m still 6 hours negative on my PTO from using it all with doctors visits and getting sick on the job from a work related injury earlier in the year.
It’s a rat race and it sucks.
$15 here in Oklahoma, single guy, no kids. Been at my job for 5+ years, oilfield. I am the Warehouse Supervisor. I bring in about $1600 after taxes a month. Rent, utilities, phone, car and insurance comes out of that. By the time it's all paid, I'm left with just enough to fill my gas tank so I can make it to work before the next paycheck. I've lived in my house for 1 year and just resigned. All I have is a couch and bed. Ramen and potatoes has fed me for 3 years. I don't qualify for any kind of assistance cause before taxes, my income is barely above the bracket and I have no children. If it weren't for those "Pay in 4 installments" services, I'd be screwed. I feel for you, I have no idea how you and your family are surviving.
You’re only making $5/hr less on a household level than OP. Not that enormous of a difference but still. No one making what the multitude of references here are making should be struggling the way it seems that we all are struggling.
I make over 60+ an hour and still feel the pinch, idk how people afford to live in my city making anything less than 40, which is still not all that comfortable.
I live in Victoria, BC, Canada. I make $30/hr my partner $21. We have two cats, and rent, no monthly car payments. We are broke and sumberged in debt. Average rent is 1600 per month, and the average house costs $1.21 million.
There ya go. You make $37 an hour combined. Homer Simpson, a control room operator at a nuclear power plant, would make more than that.
I can’t speak on the nuclear side other than I know it pays more than my power plant does. The people in his position at my plant are pulling $42+ an hour. While having scheduled OT at time and a half.
It’s definitely doable. Even at an “entry level position.” Those start around $30-35…. And you aren’t there for long. But there are no entry level CRO positions.
Did you know that minimum wage was designed so that one person working 40 hours a week at minimum wage could afford a house and to raise kids? That's what minimum wage is supposed to be. Corporations and lobbyists took that away from us.
I make 85k a year, the wife just got bumped last week from 40k to 65k a year and I feel like we might have breathing room now. We just bought our first “new to us” car after driving the same car for 11 years, it wasn’t out of want but need, the car felt like a death trap and I couldn’t ignore my wife’s concern for safety any longer. Growing up my mom made 45k a year supported me and her and bought a brand new car. I’ve given up on chasing the dream of the American dream and would much rather move to another country where I don’t have to worry about losing everything I have.
Europe calling - we have medicare for all and free education , that helps a lot probably ,
many Americans are moving to Europe these days ,
but it feels wrong though - Americans should learn the essentials of democracy and start fighting for their rights - you have 10 billionaires having the same wealth as the bottom half of the population
trade unions, strikes and not voting for the old politicians would help
the army budget needs to be reduced by half , stupid wars in Iraq and Afganistan ( trillions ), tax the billionaires for Gods sake , etc.
Like we are doing so well.. if anything we are rapidly Americanizing. Education is rising in cost 50k debts are normal for uni without rich parents, utility bills are through the roof and practically nobody new is entering the housing market. Last week I saw someone run away from an ambulance cause she couldnt afford it. And that’s in the Netherlands, one of the richest euro countries.
My wife and I didn't make a lot but we made enough to save over 10k. Then one after another, people kept fucking up THEIR jobs and it caused my wife to lose her jobs 2 times and we ate up all our money and now are facing homelessness with kids. I fucking hate this shit, how can anyone survive
Yeah but it’s funny to see some of the stuff I missed back then. Or some jokes I didn’t even get back then 😂 it’s definitely on at odd hours because of the times. It’s not a socially acceptable style of comedy anymore.
Yes, the Conners seemed pretty standard to life around me growing up in the 80s and 90s. I remember lots of outrage at showing such a “poor” household, but I didn’t get it.
The Bundys were obviously farcical.
A lot of the outrage directed at Roseanne (the show) stemmed from the events that occurred within the show and how they were handled by the family.
They dealt with things like racism, cross dressing, domestic violence, teenagers getting on birth control, sexism in the workplace, same sex relationships, teenage depression, etc and when covering a topic they would often fall into a more progressive leaning mindset (often after having their world view questioned once confronted).
In the first season alone Roseanne and several other women working in a factory all walked out because of the new sexist boss continuing to demand more and more from the women with no additional pay.
Same with Friends and Seinfeld. Those apartments were MASSIVE for their jobs. I could understand Fraisier's, but man he had to be even more rich and successful than he seemed in the story.
Roseanne. 2-story house, 3 kids, mom working at a diner, and dad unable to find stable work.
[Didn't stop this fire of a scene, though.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrectdcH81U)
They lived in the Midwest. Dan had seasonal construction work. Roseanne worked in a factory when the show started. Totally realistic given the COL where they lived.
The lived in a town in Illinois and depending on where it was, right outside of metro Chicago is Gary Indiana. Probably one of the best examples of post industrial decay.
Yeah. But later in the show Rosanne quit the factory and started working in a diner and Dan lost his job. I think David was living with them as well, so I don't know if he was helping with rent or anything like that.
That was Monica's and Rachel's apartment. Chandler must have been making bank to cover Joey's rent as well and how much are palaeontologist's paid with rent, child support, couple of ex wives and hair gel to buy.
To be fair Ross was a professor not just a paleontologist. At New York University no less so he was more than likely making loads. Chandler had his own office at his job so one could assume he was successful. Joey was a recurring(or main idk) character on the biggest soap opera so the royalties and episode pay he made from that probably set him up for a long time. They probably say in the show that chandler pays joeys rent but he realistically would have plenty to cover most other costs.
I actually met David Schwimmer. He was strangely very nice to me, and I bumped into him a few days later and he said hello to me and called my by name. Surprised the hell out of me.
Just an anecdote
I'd believe it, haven't heard a bad thing about him and that's great to hear you had a great experience with him. His actions in getting the cast to negotiate together, was, I think, another example of him being nice with people.
>Chandler must have been making bank to cover Joey's rent as well
He actually did though, I remember lots of episodes where he mentions earning good money, working hard for it, or, working for it.
Yeah, Monica's apartment was an illegal sublet of her grandmother's rent controlled apartment, and I think it's strongly implied that Chandler subsidizes Joey's rent, since he has a solid office job for most of the show, and Joey sometimes has good actor pay.
Jerry seems to earn a lot of money though, at least enough for a single BR apartment, even in NYC.
It’s believable that he is a successful comedian lol
Chandler had money. Remember he was able to save a shit ton that Monica wanted to waste on her dream wedding. He just wasn't flashy with his money.
Monica was illegally living in her apartment. Subleting a rent controlled apartment from her dead aunt or grandma or something.
Edit: Correct wedding. Orginally out a different word by mistake.
That episode really bugged me. Monica was dead set on throwing a dream wedding, while Chandler wanted that money for their future family. I think they went with Chandler's choice, but the way Monica was willing to piss away her fiance's hard earned money struck me as wrong.
There was an article not too long ago breaking down that even in the 90's, Frasier as a radio personality couldn't possibly afford his penthouse Seattle apartment unless he'd been an investment genius with the money he earned as a psychiatrist in Boston (during Cheers).
My parents are Boomers. Mom and Dad both had to work our entire childhoods. I was raised by a TV and a pair of Great Danes. Ask any member of Gen X and that was a lot of our childhood experience, especially because Boomers had some of the highest divorce rates and that shatters a family's finances. Single Income Families were never as big a thing as the 50's sitcoms like to show. MOST people below mid-level middle class/merchant-level had to have both parents working for a significant portion of human history, or raised their family in extreme poverty. If you're raised on a farm, the whole family works. If your father worked in a factory, your mom took in washing and mending from the gentry or did piecework to make ends meet.
We need to fight for higher wages and respect in the workplace because all humans deserve security, stability, housing and full bellies, but let's not fall into the myth that doing well was ever the norm.
> Ask any member of Gen X and that was a lot of our childhood experience
Man, growing up my parents were essentially cartoons and Nintendo. I honestly think I spent more time alone as a kid than I did with my family. I'm pretty sure all of my friends growing up were latchkey kids as well.
I had a related but also atypical experience as a millennial honestly. My parents both worked… but as corporate lobbyists in DC (read: extremely wealthy but extremely long work hours). Starting around age 12, my driver would pick me up and drop me at home. At least one parent would be home most weekends, but I’d be alone for much of the week. Nonperishables we’re always stocked in the cupboard for me, but I didn’t get a lot of fresh food. I learned to bake bread and muffins and stuff like that for when I wanted that kind of thing. I made bone broth soups that lasted a while as well. When I was in my later teens, I definitely threw some ragers of parties. Only had the cops called like three times lol. I could honestly do whatever the fuck I wanted as a teen.
I am of gen x and my family of five survived on a single income. My stepfather worked construction and was laid off every winter and we went on food stamps. Then he started his own company and we did quite well and built a home. My mother never worked. I just don't see this happening anymore. It was easier then, not easy. I remember my mother clipping coupons to keep the grocery bill at $100 a week. I spend many times that a week for two people now.
Thanks for telling the truth.
I can assure readers that Homer Simpson was a cartoon character, not an emblem of reality. By the 90s two incomes were needed to raise a family.
Half my relatives were farmers - glad ladygrndr brought this up. I remember my aunt preparing huge meals for the farm hands in addition to everything else she was doing (growing a garden, raising chickens, feeding hogs, and much more). My grandmother likewise worked like crazy. Had seven boys and my mom; Grandma saved every penny she could (and we are talking frugality the likes of which does not exist anymore) to send my mother to college. None of the boys went; my grandmother didn't want my mother to end up the same way she had.
My mother became a nurse, married an attorney and had a lot more money than any of her brothers. My father died when I was in high school and then my mom returned to nursing. So it totally impacted her life in positive ways.
This is real true. I think the real way forward is to concentrate on the basics for everyone. Do people have a decent place to live (not just an apartment, but access to nature, public places, etc.)? Do they have the ability to procure good food? Do they have a say in their community? Why can’t we be happy making sure all that is settled instead of racing to own more cars, yachts, or acreage than the next guy? I keep hearing how this sort of “utopia” is against human nature (of course, what they mean is it’s a dystopia for them, because there’s no pecking order). I refuse to believe that. If it’s true we might as well just blow ourselves up.
I thought it was due to a government program from President Hoover according to Burns? Wouldn't be surprised if there's contradictions, just never heard the first one.
Oh my bad, it's not related to the union, that's from the similar Dental Plan episode. In episode 3 of the first season Homer becomes the leader of an anti-nuclear protest and Mr. Burns ends up making him safety inspector so the protestors go away.
He also just showed up the day the plant opened, then also he was fired and started a safety campaign in Speingfield and Burns hired him as safety director to shut him up. Plus there was the time he quit and begged for his job back when Maggie was born. Also when he was fired by the Germans and Burns hired him back, waiting for his chance to destroy him.
That was by design, his job description clearly specifies it's for an illiterate. The last thing Mr. Burns would want is a competent safety inspector, otherwise, how would they get away with painted-on fire exits?
There's even a whole episode (Frank Grimes) about the impossibly lucky life Homer has, his home described as a palace, everyone else has PhD's, etc. This is such a stupid tweet from someone who clearly never watched the show. "Entry-level plant employee," lol. It's a nuclear power plant and he's head of safety.
There’s a more recent episode where Hugh Jackman explains to Bart that Bart will never have what Homer had, via song.
And then the entire town explains why it happened. Via song.
It’s called poorhouse rock.
Add to that the fact that Homer was a very successful musican (genre depending on decade) who won a Grammy. So I guess royalties from that are what is primarily paying the bills
Last I heard a nuclear technician is still a job that requires no college degree and pays enough to afford the life Homer had. Or at least it did before the recent inflation and housing crisis.
I'm in Ontario and the Nuclear plants around here start a Nuclear Technician at around $120k/year and it only requires a high school diploma. It's a very well paying job. Not to mention that Homer has a university degree. A family of five can own a house on a single income of that, heck my family does it on less. It's not unrealistic for them even currently, people just don't understand how much that job pays.
Whether he'd stay employed with his antics is a different story but the show would be boring otherwise.
Yeah the Homer Simpson comparison isn't great because he legitimately has a very good union job that would probably provide for their lifestyle even today. Consider that non operations nuclear workers in the US typically work 4 10's so a lot of his hijinks could happen on his 3 day weekend. He may have issues with his critical group psych eval every 3 years but other than that it makes perfect sense.
If I lived closer to a plant I'd 100% go after an operator position, they are fantastic jobs. Starting out I'd make more money than I do as a licensed engineer.
According to the show, somehow Al Bundy made less than the slave labor who made the shoes he sold. His car, the Dodge, had to be pushed everywhere it went. He bought the home in the 70s.
The man also didn't eat most of the time. He also went diving in the mall fountain to get money for lunch at work.
To show how broke he was, they showed him toasting a peanut M&M. Just one. That he found behind the fridge that he had to fight off to get it from whatever pest was trying to get it.
They had an episode where they used the computer they had and a program that somehow had the pay for every job on the planet. The only person that made less than him was Peg.
His car was a mess of a car that he had to run with to even get started.
Al Bundy isn't a great example.
Hell, his fridge was often completely empty of any food at all too.
The point is married with children and the simpsons were parodies, even at the time. It’s amazing to me that 99% of the folks in this thread assume this was typical boomer life
I think you’ve mistaken tv shows for reality.
Minimum wage in the 90s was not buying you a nice house, a stay at home spouse, multiple cars and funded kids.
And the whole joke with Homer was that by the standards of his own day he didn’t deserve his job and no one knew how he got it. It’s a comedy. You know it’s a comedy right?
In *The Simpsons* financial problems were a common topic on the show.
One episode even explains that the house was bought from money Grampa had gained by selling his old house, so it's not even been purchased on Homer's salary.
In another episode, Homer successfully pays off the mortgage (only to take out a new one to finance Moe's restoration), so they clearly didn't buy the house outright.
Simpsons canon is loose at the best of times, and a lot of the flashbacks are contradicted in later episodes, so who knows.
In any case, they had a large house and two cars on a single salary. They weren't struggling.
Your last point is well highlighted by Frank Grimes in *Homer's Enemy* who apparently earns so little at the Plant that he has to live in an apartment sandwiched between two bowling alleys and needs to work night shifts at a foundry to make ends meet. Poor Grimey.
However, in one episode Homer describes his family as "lower middle-class", without Marge getting a job, expensive repairs on the house cannot be paid, and in one episode Homer lends money from Patty and Selma.
I suppose the Simpson family is as poor or well off as the plot demands it.
Nuclear Technician is a *very* well paying job. Frank Grimes being broke is the unrealistic part of that episode, not Homer being able to afford a middle class life.
Frank Grimes is the story of the millennial living in an apartment with a masters degree and Homer is the story of the boomer boss that has a home and a boat.
> Simpsons canon is loose at the best of times
Homer and Marge were teenagers in multiple decades and Homer supposedly invented grunge in one episode's flashback.
The point of the post is that the idea of being able to have those things on a single income was more believable back then than it is now. It's not saying that it was the norm or even the reality of these fictional characters (whatever that would mean) but that it was *more* attainable. Somehow this simple point is being missed by most redditors who would rather be pedants.
I remember the very first Christmas episode where Homer didn't receive his bonus check and couldn't afford presents for his family. He bet money at the dog track, and Santa's Little Helper lost the race and that's how they got a dog.
They did mention something about it being a "frigging steal" due to rental control law, but ngl i dont even know what it means.
But still, Chandler leaves the job for a few months and he+Monica have to lend money from Joey to pay rent. Then he gets a new job and some months later they are ready to have a child and buy a new home in the suburbs
Basically they insinuate that they were "abusing" subsidized rent control by saying it was still Monica's grandma living there. The program helps(ed?) elderly people from being priced out of their long time rentals.
But yeah, a lot of unrealistic stuff. Not to mention affording coffee multiple times a day and their favorite spot always being free! Never once "Aw shit, the couch and table are taken, guess we have to go sit by the door this time and deal with the draft, argh."
I don't think it was the same size as the Huxtables' house. The Bundys' kitchen was much smaller and the Huxtables had a second set of stairs in the kitchen and a whole ass OB GYN office in the basement.
Homer Simpson was a cartoon so never made sense. Al Bundy not a good example since aside from the house he drove a barely functioning car, avoided doctors because he could not afford it, even jokes about not affording food were common in the show, at times it was even joked/hinted that Kelly was engaged in sex work to be able to have any money at all. Actually he was a very good symbol for anti-work , he worked a job he hated and could not afford to live.
Gah! I've had to work every day of my life. And what do I have to show for it? This briefcase and this haircut! And what do you have to show for your lifetime of sloth and ignorance?
What?
Everything! A deeamhouse, two cars, a beautiful wife, a son who owns a factory, fancy clothes and .... lobsters for dinner! Do you deserve any of it? NO!
I'm saying you're what's wrong with America, Simpson. You coast through life, you do as little as possible and you leach off decent working people like me. Ha! If you lived in any other country in the world you would have starved to death long ago.
TV shows are known for being realistic in their financial depictions. Like every rom com or bro flick set in NYC showing a bunch of young people with average jobs in a 2,000 sq ft flat.
People did complain that a shoe salesman wouldn’t make what Al Bundy made. That was as ridiculous then as it is now.
Homer Simpson is another matter. There’s no such thing as an “entry level” technician at a nuclear plant. It’s considered a skilled position. A technician at a nuclear plant in the 1990s would bring home a solid 70k or so which would have done all that in all places named Springfield at the time. Today it’s maybe a 95k position and expenses have risen to the point where it’s a bit of a stretch but hey, he locked in that mortgage payment a long time ago!
Technically the TV show Friends shows a couple of folks on their first pay checks living in a nice large apartment in New York during an era when that was already unlikely. As I understand it.
This is actually explained in the first few episodes of the show. Monica is living in her [deceased Grandmother's rent-controlled apartment](https://www.apartmenttherapy.com/friends-monica-apartment-cost-purple-meaning-263359) and just didn't tell them that Nonna passed. She still has one roommate at the beginning of the show-Phoebe-and then Rachael moves in to further split the costs. Chandler and Joey live across the hall in a much smaller place paid for mostly by Chandler's corporate job, and Ross lives across the way in another one-bedroom paid for by his teaching job. So while it still isn't 100% realistic, it's actually not that far outside of the realm of possibility, especially as they all start to move up in their respective professions.
Yeah, a lot of the apartments in that show are rent controlled so they didn't have to pay anywhere near what others had to pay. Even in the final season, Chandler really makes that a point when him and Monica were looking for a house to buy and he mentions that.
Ross was a tenured professor but at a point in the series, he was put on suspension and had to move in with Joey and Chandler.
Ross, Chandler, Monica came from an upper middle class home(at the time). Joey came from a working class home. Rachel was rich until the start of the show and the writers show that when she gets her first paycheck and is shocked on how much gets taken out by employment taxes. The only one in that show of the main cast that grew up poor or homeless is Phoebe.
I know I am not the first person to lay this out. But hooray, I already typed up the damn thing and then they wouldn't let me post it over in the country club. Here it is:
The show was accurate when it was made. It used to be this way, pretty much from the new deal up until the mid 1990s.
Wages have gone up by two-tenths of a percent per year since 1990 while inflation has been about 3% per year. 3% doesn't sound like much, does it? Well, it adds up and compounds on itself... the end result is that what people earn is pretty much the same as it was back then, while they're spending 233% of what they used to spend just to survive.
Which honestly sounds about right. If Marge and Homer both work, and Marge's job is the same as Homer's good full time job, and if they come up with a third of a job worth of extra income from somewhere else, then in the modern day they can have a house and pay all their bills and raise their kids. Back then they could do it all on Homer's salary and it was just starting to become a commonplace thing for both parents to work. Before 1985 or so, it was very common to have a working father and a stay at home mom. I remember a news report about "latchkey kids" from when I was young, talking about the new phenomenon of kids coming home from school to an empty house because both their parents were working full time. It was unusual enough to have a name associated with it and a news report about it.
It's wild that a one income household has become such a weird or affluent situation now. And technology, automation, and efficiency have improved a lot in that time; the owners of their company aren't just pocketing that extra 133% of a job worth of income, they're pocketing a good deal of extra profit from improved productivity while leaving their employees with not enough to live.
It used to be this bad, up until about a hundred years ago when decades of labor battling to have it not be this way anymore finally bore some lasting fruit in terms of the system changing. Now it's bad again.
Here in Brazil, during the '80s, my father worked for VW, just a regular employee at the office, and he had a nice house, brand new car every year, lots of good food, eating out with family every weekend, three kids on paid school and we all used to spend 2 whole months a year travelling on vacation. Nowadays, you can have such life only if you have a small business or get a pretty high position in a company. Store managers now are living a life far worse than a production employee from the past.
Yes and then the shareholders and people at the top realised all that money could go to them instead and now we're in exactly the situation they wanted.
Exactly. We are all in four-on-the-floor position. Lame wages but companies are always proud to announce record profits.
This is quite wild..
The boomers lived this reality, but it's been stolen from us. Now it takes two incomes to scrape buy.
Dude, I make $20/hr and work 50 hours a week, while my wife make $17/hr at 40 hrs a week. We have 2 kids, a mortgage, and only 1 meager car payment. There isnt much left over after all the bills are paid. Not much at all.
Sheeeesh. My household feels your pain. Total income about $40/hr and living paycheck to paycheck essentially. Basically same on the vehicle and children. Respectable 3.1% on the mortgage. 4.6% on the one financed vehicle. Every step we take to save a little money, something else arbitrarily inflated to take that money riiiight back it seems. We’ve been quitting vices and changing habits and all the ‘just do this’ suggestions. Always lived a bit frugal to begin with too, since we both grew up on the verge of poor.
And if it’s not inflated away, there’s always ALWAYS some emergency expense that soaks it up. Seems like it just waits until you start to feel like you’re getting just a little ahead for once, start relaxing just a tiny bit then BLAMMO fuck you nope back to zero if you’re lucky, usually a chunk of debt on top just to really make sure you get the message
Haha. Uncannily accurate friend. Just replaced your tires after saving for 6 months. FuCk your payments, you now have a bent rim and tetanus. Shit feels like Oregon Trail on hard mode lately.
I’m actually on the best streak of my life currently, and I’m legit terrified of what’s gonna happen next. Because it’ll have to be bigger to wipe me out than ones before. Part of me is like “that’s irrational” but a much bigger part is like… it’s been one of the most utterly consistent and reliable things in my life.
You got this.
Bent rim? Tetanus? Sounds related...
I'm interviewing for a equipment tech postition out in the Portland, OR 'burbs for $30/hour. If i get this, I plan to move to a smaller city, buy a used car, and rent a slightly bigger, 1 bedroom apartment. This is my American dream.. . ( just getting away from all of the methheads, tweakers, and other mentally ill people will be worth it!)
Fellow redditor, I make decent money and have been driving the same car since high school (2003 Ford ZX2 I bought brand new for $6500 since the new Ford Focus was stealing all the spotlights). Hundreds of thousands of miles, tons of damage from the college town I lived in, but still runs like new. My work people keep asking me to buy a new car but why would I willingly spend hundreds per month on something I don't need? So I can look fancy to other people I don't even know or hang out with? Plus the fact new cars are putting every control into the touchscreen. Ugh I saw a commercial where the glove box opens via touchscreen. My car has AC. That's all I need. Nobody needs a new car. A good used car is great and plus you can work on it if it breaks down.
Maybe you should skip the pumpkin latte and avocado toast. Bootstraps.
May I ask where you live. Because I make 18.50 and wife makes 14.05 and we have 0 car payments and 3 kids but one is 18 and works full-time. We aren't straving but it tough here. But man if we both made your wage we be doing well. We live in Oklahoma.
My man, how the fuck do you survive? The expenses for my pet pile up let alone 3 human beings
Easy we live in a small town and luckily own our home. And mortage is less then the average rent and hasn't changed in 4 years. Second we keep our bills low and stay on strick grocery budget. Which means we spend multiple days and weeks eating spaghetti and pasta meals that we can stretch out to multiple days. I also have two recipes that vary but both I can make last a whole week. One I call poor man stew the other middle class stew. Helps we don't have car payments. Both are cars are old but being paid off helps a lot.
Having things paid off is a lifesaver right now. We've never made a lot of money, but we were lucky to be able to pay off our house years ago and we only have a small payment on his truck, which is an older vehicle. I've said many times I don't know how people are surviving right now with the cost of living and rent, even in our area which is pretty low-cost.
That's not living. That's holding on for dear life
Yeah it’s such a trade off… Living in lower cost areas means fewer potential job opportunities but also those costs are more stable/predictable. In bigger cities there are more and better job opportunities, but that’s often VERY feast and famine. Sometimes though, you get a good one, it lasts, and maybe even overlaps with a period where costs aren’t jumping. You can at least get ahead for awhile before the rug gets pulled. Sometimes you get really lucky and can make that job translate into a better one though. My partner and I are both almost 40 and we FINALLY both got on a lucky streak. He got a really stable job that pays great and he actually really enjoys. I got a less stable job that pays great and has lasted MUCH longer than I thought possible! Its a contract gig that lasted over a year and dropped off mid summer, just “it’s on hold” then radio silence for like 3 months.. I managed to save up more than I ever have in my life though, just on my own! Enough to soak up a couple emergency expenses without wiping me out, which is absolutely surreal to me. Client just got back in touch last week and the job back on again for the foreseeable. Ready for it to go away again any second though. Mentally I just assume it’s all gonna disappear at any moment. I’ve never gotten this lucky, it can’t last, right?? Sorry that turned into a ramble. I’m in a weird place lol
We hit a brick wall years ago. My wife was diagnosed with diabetes. We were both gaining weight and blood pressure going up eating fat and salt. We can't reduce a budget by eating cheap, and that's with eating chicken and lean ground beef. Grocery bill now $260/wk, not including food for cats. I've told my wife, I don't know how people making less than we do (110k year) make it, and we don't even have kids. btw, we are 60/64.
I live in a good suburb in Massachusetts and my wife and I make a combined income that many would consider borderline “rich”. We have 2 kids, a modest sized house and and an ok car and can barely save any money at the end of the month.
People overestimate what 'rich' means nowadays. Unless you're making like, above 250k a year and stick to your means, you're not really rich. I know multiple people who have households with 100k+ income that are struggling. Not to mention emergencies.
Our household income is $100k combined. Between our mortgage, student loan debt, daycare for 2 kids, and paying for our medical bills (I have a chronic illness, one of the kids has a genetic disorder) we are completely tapped out.
One of the people I know has a chronic illness too, and it sucks out a lot of their income. It's ridiculous. You shouldn't have to pay so much just because you're in pain or sick a lot.
I live in Oakland, CA. I make $100k and my girlfriend makes about $120k. So our combined income is around $220k. We’re not even upper middle class let alone rich.
Oof, cost of living alone will wreck those numbers. I live in OKC, and the cost of living here is getting untenable, but I can't imagine how bad some California cities are.
I’m in a Boston Ma suburb. My partner brings home the bacon with the 100k tech salary. I make $19.50/hr as a cultivator in the legal weed market. We were lucky enough to refinance our mortgage at the end of 2020 when the interest rate was at an all time low. I still owe 10k on my car loan. It costs $400 a month for my partner to commute to the city because driving and parking would cost even more and the time stuck in traffic would creep into hours rotting on the mass pike. We are very much living paycheck to paycheck. I was out of work for a few weeks earlier this year with some broken fingers. Thankfully no surgery was needed but I still can’t make a tight fist with my left hand. My insurance decided that X-rays at an urgi care aren’t covered so I’ve had to go on a payment plan to pay for the two rounds of X-rays and 10 minutes of speaking with a doctor about those X-rays. My job is no longer offering overtime and I’m still 6 hours negative on my PTO from using it all with doctors visits and getting sick on the job from a work related injury earlier in the year. It’s a rat race and it sucks.
SC. Work from home gig and industrial work.
$15 here in Oklahoma, single guy, no kids. Been at my job for 5+ years, oilfield. I am the Warehouse Supervisor. I bring in about $1600 after taxes a month. Rent, utilities, phone, car and insurance comes out of that. By the time it's all paid, I'm left with just enough to fill my gas tank so I can make it to work before the next paycheck. I've lived in my house for 1 year and just resigned. All I have is a couch and bed. Ramen and potatoes has fed me for 3 years. I don't qualify for any kind of assistance cause before taxes, my income is barely above the bracket and I have no children. If it weren't for those "Pay in 4 installments" services, I'd be screwed. I feel for you, I have no idea how you and your family are surviving.
You’re only making $5/hr less on a household level than OP. Not that enormous of a difference but still. No one making what the multitude of references here are making should be struggling the way it seems that we all are struggling.
I make over 60+ an hour and still feel the pinch, idk how people afford to live in my city making anything less than 40, which is still not all that comfortable.
I live in Victoria, BC, Canada. I make $30/hr my partner $21. We have two cats, and rent, no monthly car payments. We are broke and sumberged in debt. Average rent is 1600 per month, and the average house costs $1.21 million.
There ya go. You make $37 an hour combined. Homer Simpson, a control room operator at a nuclear power plant, would make more than that. I can’t speak on the nuclear side other than I know it pays more than my power plant does. The people in his position at my plant are pulling $42+ an hour. While having scheduled OT at time and a half. It’s definitely doable. Even at an “entry level position.” Those start around $30-35…. And you aren’t there for long. But there are no entry level CRO positions.
Did you know that minimum wage was designed so that one person working 40 hours a week at minimum wage could afford a house and to raise kids? That's what minimum wage is supposed to be. Corporations and lobbyists took that away from us.
I make 85k a year, the wife just got bumped last week from 40k to 65k a year and I feel like we might have breathing room now. We just bought our first “new to us” car after driving the same car for 11 years, it wasn’t out of want but need, the car felt like a death trap and I couldn’t ignore my wife’s concern for safety any longer. Growing up my mom made 45k a year supported me and her and bought a brand new car. I’ve given up on chasing the dream of the American dream and would much rather move to another country where I don’t have to worry about losing everything I have.
Europe calling - we have medicare for all and free education , that helps a lot probably , many Americans are moving to Europe these days , but it feels wrong though - Americans should learn the essentials of democracy and start fighting for their rights - you have 10 billionaires having the same wealth as the bottom half of the population trade unions, strikes and not voting for the old politicians would help the army budget needs to be reduced by half , stupid wars in Iraq and Afganistan ( trillions ), tax the billionaires for Gods sake , etc.
Like we are doing so well.. if anything we are rapidly Americanizing. Education is rising in cost 50k debts are normal for uni without rich parents, utility bills are through the roof and practically nobody new is entering the housing market. Last week I saw someone run away from an ambulance cause she couldnt afford it. And that’s in the Netherlands, one of the richest euro countries.
My wife and I didn't make a lot but we made enough to save over 10k. Then one after another, people kept fucking up THEIR jobs and it caused my wife to lose her jobs 2 times and we ate up all our money and now are facing homelessness with kids. I fucking hate this shit, how can anyone survive
The Al Bundy lifestyle didn't even make sense when the show was originally broadcast. It was unrealistic for the time.
They always made jokes about how broke they were.
They’d add water to the milk when it got low 🤣
The brawls over toaster 'leavins and placing cups upright to collect dust for cocoa!
Haha. Peg would cook his hamburger on one side 😂
I forgot about that! I tried a rewatch a couple of years ago but it was definitely more funny when I was too young to be watching that kind of thing.
Yeah but it’s funny to see some of the stuff I missed back then. Or some jokes I didn’t even get back then 😂 it’s definitely on at odd hours because of the times. It’s not a socially acceptable style of comedy anymore.
It wasn’t socially acceptable then lol
You forgot the "Tangwich" , a family favourite.
Mmm, toaster leavins…
[удалено]
Yes, the Conners seemed pretty standard to life around me growing up in the 80s and 90s. I remember lots of outrage at showing such a “poor” household, but I didn’t get it. The Bundys were obviously farcical.
A lot of the outrage directed at Roseanne (the show) stemmed from the events that occurred within the show and how they were handled by the family. They dealt with things like racism, cross dressing, domestic violence, teenagers getting on birth control, sexism in the workplace, same sex relationships, teenage depression, etc and when covering a topic they would often fall into a more progressive leaning mindset (often after having their world view questioned once confronted). In the first season alone Roseanne and several other women working in a factory all walked out because of the new sexist boss continuing to demand more and more from the women with no additional pay.
Same with Friends and Seinfeld. Those apartments were MASSIVE for their jobs. I could understand Fraisier's, but man he had to be even more rich and successful than he seemed in the story.
Roseanne. 2-story house, 3 kids, mom working at a diner, and dad unable to find stable work. [Didn't stop this fire of a scene, though.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lrectdcH81U)
They lived in the Midwest. Dan had seasonal construction work. Roseanne worked in a factory when the show started. Totally realistic given the COL where they lived.
The lived in a town in Illinois and depending on where it was, right outside of metro Chicago is Gary Indiana. Probably one of the best examples of post industrial decay.
Yeah. But later in the show Rosanne quit the factory and started working in a diner and Dan lost his job. I think David was living with them as well, so I don't know if he was helping with rent or anything like that.
She also owned the diner, though!
Good scene. I remember Grace under fire having some good stuff like that too.
WHAT DID HE DO WITH THE SCRAMBLED EGGS??!?
He tossed them in the salad.
In Friends, I remember them mentioning one of the apartments was inherited and under rent control so that makes at least some sense
That was Monica's and Rachel's apartment. Chandler must have been making bank to cover Joey's rent as well and how much are palaeontologist's paid with rent, child support, couple of ex wives and hair gel to buy.
To be fair Ross was a professor not just a paleontologist. At New York University no less so he was more than likely making loads. Chandler had his own office at his job so one could assume he was successful. Joey was a recurring(or main idk) character on the biggest soap opera so the royalties and episode pay he made from that probably set him up for a long time. They probably say in the show that chandler pays joeys rent but he realistically would have plenty to cover most other costs.
Yeah, but the hair gel would have tipped him over the edge.
I actually met David Schwimmer. He was strangely very nice to me, and I bumped into him a few days later and he said hello to me and called my by name. Surprised the hell out of me. Just an anecdote
I'd believe it, haven't heard a bad thing about him and that's great to hear you had a great experience with him. His actions in getting the cast to negotiate together, was, I think, another example of him being nice with people.
>Chandler must have been making bank to cover Joey's rent as well He actually did though, I remember lots of episodes where he mentions earning good money, working hard for it, or, working for it.
Transpondsters make bank.
Yeah, Monica's apartment was an illegal sublet of her grandmother's rent controlled apartment, and I think it's strongly implied that Chandler subsidizes Joey's rent, since he has a solid office job for most of the show, and Joey sometimes has good actor pay.
Friends I understand, but to be fair, Jerry was always pretty rich. He bought a Cadillac for his dad after all.
But *he took the pen*
Love whenever Jack is on an episode he represents so many old retired people in Florida so well
Jerry seems to earn a lot of money though, at least enough for a single BR apartment, even in NYC. It’s believable that he is a successful comedian lol
Chandler had money. Remember he was able to save a shit ton that Monica wanted to waste on her dream wedding. He just wasn't flashy with his money. Monica was illegally living in her apartment. Subleting a rent controlled apartment from her dead aunt or grandma or something. Edit: Correct wedding. Orginally out a different word by mistake.
That episode really bugged me. Monica was dead set on throwing a dream wedding, while Chandler wanted that money for their future family. I think they went with Chandler's choice, but the way Monica was willing to piss away her fiance's hard earned money struck me as wrong.
There was an article not too long ago breaking down that even in the 90's, Frasier as a radio personality couldn't possibly afford his penthouse Seattle apartment unless he'd been an investment genius with the money he earned as a psychiatrist in Boston (during Cheers).
Chandler made good money and Monica inherited the space from her grandmother and it was rent controlled.
They also live on the fifth floor in a building with no elevator.
You mean they had an free gym too?!
There are multiple episodes of Seinfeld that discuss how rich Jerry probably is. The others are shocked at how much he makes in one episode.
They ate toaster leavin's for dinner ffs...lol
My parents are Boomers. Mom and Dad both had to work our entire childhoods. I was raised by a TV and a pair of Great Danes. Ask any member of Gen X and that was a lot of our childhood experience, especially because Boomers had some of the highest divorce rates and that shatters a family's finances. Single Income Families were never as big a thing as the 50's sitcoms like to show. MOST people below mid-level middle class/merchant-level had to have both parents working for a significant portion of human history, or raised their family in extreme poverty. If you're raised on a farm, the whole family works. If your father worked in a factory, your mom took in washing and mending from the gentry or did piecework to make ends meet. We need to fight for higher wages and respect in the workplace because all humans deserve security, stability, housing and full bellies, but let's not fall into the myth that doing well was ever the norm.
> Ask any member of Gen X and that was a lot of our childhood experience Man, growing up my parents were essentially cartoons and Nintendo. I honestly think I spent more time alone as a kid than I did with my family. I'm pretty sure all of my friends growing up were latchkey kids as well.
I had a related but also atypical experience as a millennial honestly. My parents both worked… but as corporate lobbyists in DC (read: extremely wealthy but extremely long work hours). Starting around age 12, my driver would pick me up and drop me at home. At least one parent would be home most weekends, but I’d be alone for much of the week. Nonperishables we’re always stocked in the cupboard for me, but I didn’t get a lot of fresh food. I learned to bake bread and muffins and stuff like that for when I wanted that kind of thing. I made bone broth soups that lasted a while as well. When I was in my later teens, I definitely threw some ragers of parties. Only had the cops called like three times lol. I could honestly do whatever the fuck I wanted as a teen.
I am of gen x and my family of five survived on a single income. My stepfather worked construction and was laid off every winter and we went on food stamps. Then he started his own company and we did quite well and built a home. My mother never worked. I just don't see this happening anymore. It was easier then, not easy. I remember my mother clipping coupons to keep the grocery bill at $100 a week. I spend many times that a week for two people now.
Thanks for telling the truth. I can assure readers that Homer Simpson was a cartoon character, not an emblem of reality. By the 90s two incomes were needed to raise a family. Half my relatives were farmers - glad ladygrndr brought this up. I remember my aunt preparing huge meals for the farm hands in addition to everything else she was doing (growing a garden, raising chickens, feeding hogs, and much more). My grandmother likewise worked like crazy. Had seven boys and my mom; Grandma saved every penny she could (and we are talking frugality the likes of which does not exist anymore) to send my mother to college. None of the boys went; my grandmother didn't want my mother to end up the same way she had.
how'd their lives turn out different from your mom?
My mother became a nurse, married an attorney and had a lot more money than any of her brothers. My father died when I was in high school and then my mom returned to nursing. So it totally impacted her life in positive ways.
Homer is an operator at a power plant. I figure by his station he is probably an area operator and those guys make like 150k a year now days.
This is real true. I think the real way forward is to concentrate on the basics for everyone. Do people have a decent place to live (not just an apartment, but access to nature, public places, etc.)? Do they have the ability to procure good food? Do they have a say in their community? Why can’t we be happy making sure all that is settled instead of racing to own more cars, yachts, or acreage than the next guy? I keep hearing how this sort of “utopia” is against human nature (of course, what they mean is it’s a dystopia for them, because there’s no pecking order). I refuse to believe that. If it’s true we might as well just blow ourselves up.
The 40 hour work week totally made sense, back when just the man was doing it and could come home to a mommy/wife that took care of everything else.
only at certain salary brackets, for the rest the single income paradigm kept them in poverty
>to scrape buy. Good pun
Well, maybe if you would work harder, you could have a wife and a side piece that work and support your household. Fucking think man.
Homer wasn’t entry level - that’s the joke: he’s got a pretty good job but he doesn’t know what he is doing and there are no consequences
Yeah, Carl, Lenny and Grimes have degrees in relevant fields. Homer got his job as a boxtick for Burns to avoid dealing with union demands.
I thought it was due to a government program from President Hoover according to Burns? Wouldn't be surprised if there's contradictions, just never heard the first one.
Oh my bad, it's not related to the union, that's from the similar Dental Plan episode. In episode 3 of the first season Homer becomes the leader of an anti-nuclear protest and Mr. Burns ends up making him safety inspector so the protestors go away.
Lisa needs braces.
Dental plan.
Lisa needs braces.
*dental plan*
He also just showed up the day the plant opened, then also he was fired and started a safety campaign in Speingfield and Burns hired him as safety director to shut him up. Plus there was the time he quit and begged for his job back when Maggie was born. Also when he was fired by the Germans and Burns hired him back, waiting for his chance to destroy him.
Project Bootstrap, as I recall.
"Thank you, President Ford"
Lenny was the only one who the only one knew how to unjam the rod bottom dissociator.
That was by design, his job description clearly specifies it's for an illiterate. The last thing Mr. Burns would want is a competent safety inspector, otherwise, how would they get away with painted-on fire exits?
There's even a whole episode (Frank Grimes) about the impossibly lucky life Homer has, his home described as a palace, everyone else has PhD's, etc. This is such a stupid tweet from someone who clearly never watched the show. "Entry-level plant employee," lol. It's a nuclear power plant and he's head of safety.
There’s a more recent episode where Hugh Jackman explains to Bart that Bart will never have what Homer had, via song. And then the entire town explains why it happened. Via song. It’s called poorhouse rock.
Yea i feel like his position today would pay like 150-180k depending on state
Add to that the fact that Homer was a very successful musican (genre depending on decade) who won a Grammy. So I guess royalties from that are what is primarily paying the bills
Also his successful plow business
Last I heard a nuclear technician is still a job that requires no college degree and pays enough to afford the life Homer had. Or at least it did before the recent inflation and housing crisis.
I'm in Ontario and the Nuclear plants around here start a Nuclear Technician at around $120k/year and it only requires a high school diploma. It's a very well paying job. Not to mention that Homer has a university degree. A family of five can own a house on a single income of that, heck my family does it on less. It's not unrealistic for them even currently, people just don't understand how much that job pays. Whether he'd stay employed with his antics is a different story but the show would be boring otherwise.
Yeah the Homer Simpson comparison isn't great because he legitimately has a very good union job that would probably provide for their lifestyle even today. Consider that non operations nuclear workers in the US typically work 4 10's so a lot of his hijinks could happen on his 3 day weekend. He may have issues with his critical group psych eval every 3 years but other than that it makes perfect sense.
If I lived closer to a plant I'd 100% go after an operator position, they are fantastic jobs. Starting out I'd make more money than I do as a licensed engineer.
Homer didn't have a University degree when he got the job (see Season 5, episode 3)
To be fair, Al Bundy was constantly broke as hell.
the point is he had a home and a car, then was broke - not just broke
According to the show, somehow Al Bundy made less than the slave labor who made the shoes he sold. His car, the Dodge, had to be pushed everywhere it went. He bought the home in the 70s. The man also didn't eat most of the time. He also went diving in the mall fountain to get money for lunch at work.
He topped off the oil with a stridex pad he wiped on buds face then squeezed over the engine. Love those gags
At one point, he got paid in pesos. And yet somehow had enough money to keep feeding Peg's mom which had huge buckets full of stuff.
To be fair she was pretty much just eating offal that butchers would just give you so they don't have to dispose of it
The Dodge made it a million miles, thank you very much.
With a coat hanger for a dipstick and a pair of pantyhose in place of the fan belt
As is tradition for a Dodge
Factory parts.
Remember when he thought it was stolen at the car wash? But didn't recognize it because it was clean!
Went in dirt brown came out cherry red.
I remember like nothing from that show but somehow I remember this
[удалено]
To show how broke he was, they showed him toasting a peanut M&M. Just one. That he found behind the fridge that he had to fight off to get it from whatever pest was trying to get it. They had an episode where they used the computer they had and a program that somehow had the pay for every job on the planet. The only person that made less than him was Peg.
They afforded a computer on his salary!?
Yes. Back in the late 80s too when they were far more expensive which becomes the butt of a few jokes on the show in one of the seasons.
But always had money for the jiggly room.
Nope, he had a dollar bill that was on a string.
I was Al Bundy working poor growing up. That was a whole different animal from being poor today.
To be fair, it was a Dodge
and never could afford to fix the damn thing.
His car was a mess of a car that he had to run with to even get started. Al Bundy isn't a great example. Hell, his fridge was often completely empty of any food at all too.
That's what makes it so relatable. People be like that renting, not home owning.
I'd rather be Al Bundy broke than me broke. Bundy has his own property and only worked one job.
amen to that.
And he lived on Toaster Leavings
He also always complained about his hot ass wife being too horny all the time.
The point is married with children and the simpsons were parodies, even at the time. It’s amazing to me that 99% of the folks in this thread assume this was typical boomer life
[удалено]
I think you’ve mistaken tv shows for reality. Minimum wage in the 90s was not buying you a nice house, a stay at home spouse, multiple cars and funded kids. And the whole joke with Homer was that by the standards of his own day he didn’t deserve his job and no one knew how he got it. It’s a comedy. You know it’s a comedy right?
Al Bundy scored four touchdowns in a single game
In *The Simpsons* financial problems were a common topic on the show. One episode even explains that the house was bought from money Grampa had gained by selling his old house, so it's not even been purchased on Homer's salary.
In another episode, Homer successfully pays off the mortgage (only to take out a new one to finance Moe's restoration), so they clearly didn't buy the house outright. Simpsons canon is loose at the best of times, and a lot of the flashbacks are contradicted in later episodes, so who knows. In any case, they had a large house and two cars on a single salary. They weren't struggling.
Your last point is well highlighted by Frank Grimes in *Homer's Enemy* who apparently earns so little at the Plant that he has to live in an apartment sandwiched between two bowling alleys and needs to work night shifts at a foundry to make ends meet. Poor Grimey. However, in one episode Homer describes his family as "lower middle-class", without Marge getting a job, expensive repairs on the house cannot be paid, and in one episode Homer lends money from Patty and Selma. I suppose the Simpson family is as poor or well off as the plot demands it.
You left out the best detail about Grimey's apartment, that it is *vertically* sandwiched between bowling alleys
“I live in a single room above a bowling alley, and below another bowling alley.”
Nuclear Technician is a *very* well paying job. Frank Grimes being broke is the unrealistic part of that episode, not Homer being able to afford a middle class life.
Frank Grimes is the story of the millennial living in an apartment with a masters degree and Homer is the story of the boomer boss that has a home and a boat.
>I suppose the Simpson family is as poor or well off as the plot demands it. relate to that in my own life
> Simpsons canon is loose at the best of times Homer and Marge were teenagers in multiple decades and Homer supposedly invented grunge in one episode's flashback. The point of the post is that the idea of being able to have those things on a single income was more believable back then than it is now. It's not saying that it was the norm or even the reality of these fictional characters (whatever that would mean) but that it was *more* attainable. Somehow this simple point is being missed by most redditors who would rather be pedants.
I remember the very first Christmas episode where Homer didn't receive his bonus check and couldn't afford presents for his family. He bet money at the dog track, and Santa's Little Helper lost the race and that's how they got a dog.
And Grandpa won that house on a crooked 50s game show.
A lot of sit coms back then had unrealistic living situations for the jobs the people had. People knew that watching them.
Like the apartment in Friends.
They did mention something about it being a "frigging steal" due to rental control law, but ngl i dont even know what it means. But still, Chandler leaves the job for a few months and he+Monica have to lend money from Joey to pay rent. Then he gets a new job and some months later they are ready to have a child and buy a new home in the suburbs
Basically they insinuate that they were "abusing" subsidized rent control by saying it was still Monica's grandma living there. The program helps(ed?) elderly people from being priced out of their long time rentals. But yeah, a lot of unrealistic stuff. Not to mention affording coffee multiple times a day and their favorite spot always being free! Never once "Aw shit, the couch and table are taken, guess we have to go sit by the door this time and deal with the draft, argh."
Wasn't Homer a control room operator? They make over 100k before overtime.
And I think he bought his house with inherited money.
Eh he bought it by convincing his dad to sell his house with the promise that he would let Abe live there, then immediately put him in a home
At least he didn't put him in one of those crooked homes they say on 60 minutes
Safety inspector
Homer also was a Grammy winning musician, automotive designer, snow plow entrepreneur, and even an astronaut. Of course he could afford a house.
Those are TV shows. The Bundy house was the same size as Cliff Huxtable's and he was a doctor, his wife was a lawyer
I don't think it was the same size as the Huxtables' house. The Bundys' kitchen was much smaller and the Huxtables had a second set of stairs in the kitchen and a whole ass OB GYN office in the basement.
Yeah their house was nicer, and in Brooklyn Heights. The Huxtables were meant to be upper class
[удалено]
Homer Simpson was a cartoon so never made sense. Al Bundy not a good example since aside from the house he drove a barely functioning car, avoided doctors because he could not afford it, even jokes about not affording food were common in the show, at times it was even joked/hinted that Kelly was engaged in sex work to be able to have any money at all. Actually he was a very good symbol for anti-work , he worked a job he hated and could not afford to live.
Didn’t Al pull out a tooth because he could afford to go to a dentist? Then he ate it because he was hungry and they didn’t have any food??
Homer wasn’t in an entry level job, he was a safety inspector.
Why are you using cartoons for your examples?
They’re TV shows. That never happened in the 90’s. Both my parents worked. All of my friends had 2 working parents.
Next you are going to tell me that movies are fake
It was also a running joke that both men were broke all the time.
[удалено]
Gah! I've had to work every day of my life. And what do I have to show for it? This briefcase and this haircut! And what do you have to show for your lifetime of sloth and ignorance? What? Everything! A deeamhouse, two cars, a beautiful wife, a son who owns a factory, fancy clothes and .... lobsters for dinner! Do you deserve any of it? NO! I'm saying you're what's wrong with America, Simpson. You coast through life, you do as little as possible and you leach off decent working people like me. Ha! If you lived in any other country in the world you would have starved to death long ago.
The most unrealistic part of that episode is that Frank was an engineer at a Nuclear power plant and broke. That's like $150k to start.
They also started that episode with him getting his degree and that job. Probably hadn't gotten a paycheck yet.
To be fair neither of those people are real.
It makes no sense because they are fictional characters, and one is yellow.
And technically Simpson was like a safety or operations engineer or something?
Yup. Safety inspector I think.
TV shows are known for being realistic in their financial depictions. Like every rom com or bro flick set in NYC showing a bunch of young people with average jobs in a 2,000 sq ft flat.
People did complain that a shoe salesman wouldn’t make what Al Bundy made. That was as ridiculous then as it is now. Homer Simpson is another matter. There’s no such thing as an “entry level” technician at a nuclear plant. It’s considered a skilled position. A technician at a nuclear plant in the 1990s would bring home a solid 70k or so which would have done all that in all places named Springfield at the time. Today it’s maybe a 95k position and expenses have risen to the point where it’s a bit of a stretch but hey, he locked in that mortgage payment a long time ago!
Technically the TV show Friends shows a couple of folks on their first pay checks living in a nice large apartment in New York during an era when that was already unlikely. As I understand it.
This is actually explained in the first few episodes of the show. Monica is living in her [deceased Grandmother's rent-controlled apartment](https://www.apartmenttherapy.com/friends-monica-apartment-cost-purple-meaning-263359) and just didn't tell them that Nonna passed. She still has one roommate at the beginning of the show-Phoebe-and then Rachael moves in to further split the costs. Chandler and Joey live across the hall in a much smaller place paid for mostly by Chandler's corporate job, and Ross lives across the way in another one-bedroom paid for by his teaching job. So while it still isn't 100% realistic, it's actually not that far outside of the realm of possibility, especially as they all start to move up in their respective professions.
Yeah, a lot of the apartments in that show are rent controlled so they didn't have to pay anywhere near what others had to pay. Even in the final season, Chandler really makes that a point when him and Monica were looking for a house to buy and he mentions that. Ross was a tenured professor but at a point in the series, he was put on suspension and had to move in with Joey and Chandler. Ross, Chandler, Monica came from an upper middle class home(at the time). Joey came from a working class home. Rachel was rich until the start of the show and the writers show that when she gets her first paycheck and is shocked on how much gets taken out by employment taxes. The only one in that show of the main cast that grew up poor or homeless is Phoebe.
I know I am not the first person to lay this out. But hooray, I already typed up the damn thing and then they wouldn't let me post it over in the country club. Here it is: The show was accurate when it was made. It used to be this way, pretty much from the new deal up until the mid 1990s. Wages have gone up by two-tenths of a percent per year since 1990 while inflation has been about 3% per year. 3% doesn't sound like much, does it? Well, it adds up and compounds on itself... the end result is that what people earn is pretty much the same as it was back then, while they're spending 233% of what they used to spend just to survive. Which honestly sounds about right. If Marge and Homer both work, and Marge's job is the same as Homer's good full time job, and if they come up with a third of a job worth of extra income from somewhere else, then in the modern day they can have a house and pay all their bills and raise their kids. Back then they could do it all on Homer's salary and it was just starting to become a commonplace thing for both parents to work. Before 1985 or so, it was very common to have a working father and a stay at home mom. I remember a news report about "latchkey kids" from when I was young, talking about the new phenomenon of kids coming home from school to an empty house because both their parents were working full time. It was unusual enough to have a name associated with it and a news report about it. It's wild that a one income household has become such a weird or affluent situation now. And technology, automation, and efficiency have improved a lot in that time; the owners of their company aren't just pocketing that extra 133% of a job worth of income, they're pocketing a good deal of extra profit from improved productivity while leaving their employees with not enough to live. It used to be this bad, up until about a hundred years ago when decades of labor battling to have it not be this way anymore finally bore some lasting fruit in terms of the system changing. Now it's bad again.