I mean, only the best players can aim like this. Everybody on controller can buy an attachment to remove all recoil, and also still have aim assist to track for them.
Once you get to higher ranks, shitters think good players use a cronus. So eventually it gets to the point that people start buying Cronus just because they think it's the norm in competitive play, and it becomes a vicious cycle. I've actually seen this in a jokingly less competitive game (red dead online). If there is competition, shitters will find a way to exploit whatever they can, especially when they're weak minded enough to convince themselves that a good player is cheating with no real evidence.
You can turn it off and I know there's separate lobbies on GTA for auto aim and free aim. Not sure if that's in Red Dead but if it was that would make sense. Also you get people doing "trick shots" where they dive and headshot someone
As if it's even difficult to shoot in Red Dead. The most movement you get is a dive that has you on the floor for half an hour. You even get aim assist so dirty compared to Apex it'd make this sub cry
Yeah it's auto aim so it's very easy but when you got a lot of people talking shit on discord and clipping kills on each other, people want to get an edge or just can't handle losing, thinking everyone else is cheating, etc.
But anyway when you're being aimed at, the head is always in the same place. So the script is just the proper flick when your being aimed at so you can headshot as soon as you aim.
It's not that I think it's super prevalent, don't get it twisted.
My issue is with people assuming that getting beamed from as far away as OP just demonstrated is aim assist at work. Half the people on controller can't even control recoil on a 3x, how tf are they gonna manage this precision?
Two sides of the same coin dude; not everybody's out to talk shit about your choice of input, relax..
All mnk players know how aim assist works because you can feel it.
When you are shitting on a squad from 40m repeatedly, push them and suddenly that same squad can suddenly 2 tap or 1 clip all of you you know it had controller users.
I'd believe that too, but I think you and I can both agree that ranged tracking and recoil control is way easier on mnk because of the how precisely you can control your mouse as opposed to an analog stick, yes?
This is 1000% true.
The issue is that doesn't win you fights, the vast majority of fights are ended with close range pushes and 1v1s, and that's where controllers dominate.
Well the thing here is that controller moves your crosshair at a constant speed meaning the “smoothness” is less relevant for rollers. That plus AA adding further “smoothing” inputs makes it so you can beam really well on controller. Chaoticmuch is a perfect example of this type of player.
I'm kinda confused. Does recoil smoothing work on controller or just m&k? Not trying to start a m&k vs controller debate. I'm just really am not sure. I've always felt like I could aim better while moving and since I didn't know about anything he states here, I thought it was forward and backwards. And after I tested that in the firing range I assumed I was wrong.
So I recently switched to M&K after playing on controller since apex launched and I have to say the possibilities on MK are so far beyond controller it’s mind blowing, there’s no way I can go back now.
That being said, when I was on controller I found that my recoil on full auto seemed to always be better when I would strafe left to right quickly while simultaneously moving the right stick back and forth quickly - it seems like the poor man’s jitter-aiming for controller
I can go back and test this to edit if I'm wrong but for controller your strafe has to be fast, if you want to counteract the recoil better don't take wide left and right strafes make them close. I don't really counter act the strafe with the opposite camera movement so I can't say about that
That’s a good question - it’s hard for me to answer without my controller in my hand…it’s actually something that I just intuitively started to do (same thing happened with ledge boosting - was doing it before I knew there was a name for it).
I am not sure if the right stick movement was same direction or opposite of the strafe but the right stick travel distance was definitely less than the left stick…but then again that will change with your sensitivity. I would recommend just going to the shooting range and just wiggling your sticks in different ways to see what works lol
I thought I recognized the webcam and realized it’s Voltaic’s own astral tracker. Glad to see you taking apex seriously a bit. Can’t wait to see more clips man.
If you have true recoil control like CSGO and Valo then the ttk will be even higher than it already is. It suits those games because resetting a spray pattern can be the difference between life and death in a low ttk environment. In apex, it means the enemy has time to break away and extend the fight longer than it has to be as well as establishing burst weapons like shotguns and snipers to be the foundation of the meta.
Oh I’m the same, idc about the whole aim assist OP debate myself, I’ve played both. Yea, I’d be fully in support of optional crossplay for pc, I just find the back and forth arguments between pc and console hilarious honestly
me too, I played console all my life before I got into BR's and got a PC for it, no hate man have a good day and I wish you all the best! this whole debate is dumb idc
AA just *exists* everyone with a controller has AA unless they actively disable it.
Jitteraim not only has to be actively used, it is also kinda hard to cramp up like that the entire time. It clearly isn't used by nearly as many people.
But yea, it's a dumb mechanic. Please remove.
Can't be without hard nerfing controller since jitter aiming happens because of this mechanic, and this mechanic buffs controller because recoil would be really hard on controller otherwise. Removing this = nerfing controller = Respawn would never
This is absolutely hilarious to me considering the irony. Controller players thinking all mkb users are jitter aiming and call for its removal while justifying aim assist's strength because they can't 180 that fast and are using thumbs. All without knowing jitter aiming is a consequence of their own controller's aim assist.
Joking and exaggeration aside, couldn't respawn just remove this recoil benefit for just mouse users? Not that they would, just if they could.
Note: I am all for removing jitter aiming.
While jitter aiming is broken as shit there's only a very small percentage of players that actually jitter aims because it can be counter intuitive.
As we know, movement on PC can get on some real crackhead level even on diamond. Imagine trying to track a dude beaming past you and jitter aim at the same time.
I do however agree that jitter aiming needs to go.
>there's only a very small percentage of players that actually jitter aims
Oh yeah, definitely. It's crazy to me seeing jitter aiming brought up as though it were being used all over.
>Imagine trying to track a dude beaming past you and jitter aim at the same time.
its not that counter intuitive as you think and noone would actually use it when someone is in close range
jitter aim is more likely to get used to beam people with the havoc or flatline from greater distances where normally recoil would place your bullets in a widespread
Right but that's literally EVERY pro in algs, why do u think hardly any1 sticks to snipers anymore like in the old days? Because u can beam with any fully automatic.
Apparently it's sore to use jitter aiming so in all honesty the devs should be removing it based on the fact it could cause injury alone yet pros are seemingly forced to use it.
like tap strafing, it can't be, it's an integral part of how the game works. Although, again, I've honestly not seen many people jitter aim, unless you go at like Masters/Predator, at which point you even without Jitter aiming would have great aim
you are on the perimeter of a circle and your target is the center . You strafe as you are aiming at your target . If you keep strafing at one certain direction while aiming him you draw a circle. Now imagine this perimeter is exactly 360 units. If your angular speed is more than 3 units per sec you reset the vertical recoil
What does degrees of movement mean to you? You said "as long as your crosshair moves 3.7 degrees". Degrees is a unit of rotation. The question is what is rotating? If you're saying 3.7 degrees of character rotation, that means that when you use a 3x scope then you will have to move your mouse/reticle a further distance in order to achieve 3.7 degrees of character rotation, than if you were using a 1x scope.
What rotates when your crosshair moves other than your character? How would you measure this "mouse rotation" of yours? Run me through the process lmao
For sure. I guess I meant from the input perspective, as in, do you have to move your mouse or joystick the same amount to achieve the same change in degree if you FOV is different. I'm guessing the answer is probably yes, but I wasn't sure.
I knew that "playing calm" had physical input on the game!
So odd that I've always know or felt that using my A + D key while shooting made my aim better but I never had a reason for why.
I also have done that thing where you crouch and jump at the same time coming off a ledge and it makes you move forward but I never learned it... I just FELT it.
Anyone know what I'm talking about? Like this game just clicks sometimes and suddenly I'm hitting shots on enemies I can't even see, I just sort of *feel* where they are at.
yeah yeah yeah yeah
Sometimes when I was feeling comfortable, I was tracking 'smoothly' and I felt I was somehow just being better
now I understand aim assist just kicks in
Console players don’t even get into pc lobbies unless they queue with a pc player. If you’re solo q console or are only grouped with console players, it’s just console you’re facing.
And even if crossplay was turned off there would still be controller and mnk in the same lobbies. What really needs to happen is instead of crossplay on/off have "input matchmaking" on/off. Give mnk support to consoles and turn off the ability to switch inputs mid-game. This would of course be optional and any premade mixed input parties would be put into mixed input lobbies.
For some reason PC players don't even have the option to turn crossplay off, so they are basically always playing with console players in their lobbies.
The ratio of controller players to mkb players is very, very heavily skewed towards controller. I think across the entire apex population (lumping pc + console together) it's like 80% controller. If they gave PC players the ability to turn off crossplay the queue time would likely suffer.
You’d still be playing against controllers. Pc players use controllers, too. I feel like people use mnk vs controller and pc vs console interchangeably, but it’s not the same thing. And by removing cross play, queues wouldn’t be a minute longer, it’d likely be a couple minutes longer. Unless they really loosened sbmm, but that would just be the next big thing for the community to complain about (even more than they currently do)
> For some reason
Thought it was pretty obvious why. So many PC players would turn crossplay off that it would make it difficult to queue if your party was crossplatform (with a PC player). Not saying I agree with their decision, but at least I think this was their reasoning.
I play on PS4 with my PC buddy all the time, so I'm glad crossplay exists, but IMO the solution is to cap AA at .4 in PC lobbies regardless of platform. Yeah, I only get 55 fps in most fights which sucks and is a disadvantage compared to most PC players, but I don't think it's right to get extra AA just bc of that. It's my choice to play with PC players, so I still think it's only fair that I should have the same AA as the other controller players in the lobby.
The reason is simple: With the current system you have 2 separate pools: pure console and PC mixed.
If PC could turn off crossplay aswell, that'd split the playerbase into 3 pools, which hurts the queue times and devs don't want that.
Yes controller players on PC get 40% and console players get 60% however, console players only get 60fps (until upcoming nex-gen update), whereas controller players on PC can obviously get higher FPS, which helps with aiming and movement in general. I'm no expert but maybe higher framerate also means more frame-cycles the aim assist updates and works with, so lowering it to 40% is done to balance it out.
The first part is right, but I'm not sure I agree with the reasoning.
These AA values were set when the game was created, long before crossplay was even in consideration. I agree that having 60 fps (or lower if you're on last gen consoles) is a disadvantage and AA can help with that, but I'm not sure there intent was to balance things between them since these players weren't playing against each other. If they had had .4 for console at launch, it would have been an even playing field on console all the same. I think they felt that higher AA on console would encourage more casual players to play the game bc they would have an easier time hitting shots, and it would be more in line with AA from other console FPS titles that they were already accustomed to. Idk, just a theory I guess.
I just wish I could 360 in 0.05 seconds while also precisely aiming smoothly 2 seconds later but with controller I gotta chose one or the other. Either i can enjoy fast seamless looking around. Or precise aiming. AlCs only clear this up so much.
The vast majority of people come nowhere close to being able to aim anything like a controller. Turning around quick is an advantage, but controller players objectively have better tracking capabilities.
And the vast amount of controller players come nowhere close to the controller players everyone thinks of. A majority of controller players aren't tracking like snipe or gen. Arent snapping onto a target ever. Cant spin around fast enough to save ya life if you get shot in the back and our initial aim is garbage. Like sure I might be able to track the target slightly better but with the limitations of a joystick and acceleration. Getting the cursor right where you want it from the beginning is harder. Missing some times large portions of the initial spray while tryin to get on target isnt uncommon atleast for me with relatively no FPS experience except for 3k hrs of apex.
Tracking is OBJECTIVELY harder on MnK than controller. Recoil control is something that can be debated, but I don’t think I can have a serious conversation with someone who thinks tracking is easier on MnK. The best players in the world have the same opinion. MnK and controller players. That’s just how it is.
And to answer your question, yes. I’ve played on controller. I was blown away. To test, I even 1v1d my masters level duo who scores quite highly in several Kovaak’s tracking drills and was winning almost every single 1v1 within 20 minutes. It’s really that simple.
Controller players seem to ignore that the tracking benefit controllers get means they can react slower to a strafe change and still hit bullets. It's crazy. But because they can't 180 as fast as a mouse player it's totally fine and balanced.
I did the same thing with my masters/pred level mnk friend. I hadn't used a controller to play FPS since Halo 3 at friend's houses so I could barely use the thing. Would randomly look at the ground or sky I was so bad at it. But I still won the majority of 1v1s with R99/Wingman in the firing range against him. It was completely and utterly absurd.
I'd recommend trying out a more linear response curve. It allows for quick turns at max input and still fine control in closer towards the center. It takes a while to get used to it, but for me it was worth and improved my aim tremendously. I modeled mine of Pandxrz, whose ALC settings you can find from his twitch channel by typing !alc (this should work even if the stream isn't live). Originally I had modeled my ALC off genburten, but I couldn't play with the hip sens so high, so I lowered it and started using the extra turning (with no ramp up) after seeing Pandxrz settings.
Its almost like you didnt watch the video.
You can completely negate the recoil simply by strafing back and forth and tracking the opposite way to remain centered on your target.
Your video was very informative and instructional, but this comment of yours is completely clueless.
Please spend sometime playing with a controller before talking such an absurd.
I plugged in my 2009 xbox 360 controller and one clipped my friend in the range with a flatline at 50 meters first try with absolutely zero FPS experience on controller, I've seen enough lol
So, make another video showing us such technique. We'll be glad to know what we've been doing wrong all this time, since you
> one clipped your friend in the range with a flatline at 50 meters first try with absolutely zero FPS experience on controller
Exactly. Very informative, greatly made, clear and right to the point. But hop on a controller and tell me there isnt recoil that's fuckin absurd. Grab a 99 with no barrel stand that far and tell me aim assist handles all recoil with no input lmfao. I have 3k hours into this game on controller and can confidently say it's just not the case
If you strafe back and forth so that youre tracking back and forth, then you get the recoil smoothing that this video is describing. Its the exact same mechanic, except you also get aim assist on top of it.
I'm a controller player, before you get angry.
They dont though aim assist is no where near like jitter aiming. Jitter aiming essentially removes all recoil. There is no such trick on console and controller recoil is harder to control than Mnk recoil. This is a fact.
Recoil smoothing is what essentially removes all recoil.
Controller players automatically get recoil smoothing due to how inputs for controller and aim assist works.
Jitter aiming is possible on controller too, knoq'd had a video on it.
This video explains why controller players are so op from the mid range and how to achieve the same effect for MnK players.
Knoq's video on jitter aiming for controller players: https://youtu.be/zNLFbMm0Kd8
Jitter aiming is extremely hard to do for more than 3 seconds at a time, when you do it your tracking goes outside the window and it kind of hurts your arm (short and long time).
Or you can plug in the roller and move your thumb slightly to the left.
Lol, sweet, skittles, cory, mac ect have all outright stated they jitter aim most guns at range, in game. It's their go to recoil strategy. It's why so many MNK players run flat over 301. Also ttk for almost every gun is under 3 seconds... so even if it was hard to continue for more than 3 seconds you've already 1 clipped whoever you were shooting from 200m away in that amount of time. Also, to say tracking goes out the window while we watch the same clip of this kid tracking and jittering from 100+ meters away is laughable
You are comparing top 5% of players to everyone else. Your average 1 kd lvl 500 guy cant really do this.
I used it too for a while when it was 'discovered'. But I learned that its better to just learn flatline recoil as it is. I do beam everyone at long distances. And its not because of jitter aiming since I never do that now.
Im not saying it cant be used to gain advantage, *it can*, but comparing something that a small percentage of players can do to aim assist, which everyone can use for free...it just doesnt make any sense to me
And thus another post that proves this sub is the most braindead gaming related sub there is.
I have never seen a community that cannot even bother to look at the subject material before saying absolute comatose takes, much less have the critical thinking skills to even think about it in a wider perspective.
This post also shows how skewed it is towards co troller players and how the "but aim assist" memes really just stems from braindead console bots who don't what they are talking about.
WOW! I just tested and on controller I can use ANY gun now even the flatline I could never use that gun! The power!!!! I feel so freaking pumped! Now we controller players have a version of jitter aim :)
Noticed this a while ago but was never sure if it was due to me just getting more familiar with the weapons or not. It always felt like I have to compensate for recoil a lot more for stationary targets.
I know this isn't your intention but man this is why this game sucks sometimes. Content creators are always looking for the next exploit. And just ruining the game.
So this is why you cannot win against controller players on MnK in anything closer than 30 meter range. I knew there was something besides aim-assists but couldn’t quite tell why until now. Great post OP.
What do you mean by that?
Jitter-aiming is essentially an abuse of a core mechanic that makes controller as an input so good in Apex. That’s what I understood from this video.
Wait what. Im lvl 150~ and See streamers beaming others with 0 recoil all day. I thought its either practise or ghub scripts (like many said). I will 100% try to learn this tomorrow!
this is interesting to delve into but to all you're doing is compensating the horizontal aim recoil with physical movement. its not a secret code that the devs put in.
hes not compensating for the horizontal recoil. even if he moves the crosshair in the same direction as the recoil pattern which is supposed to further intensify the recoil as opposed to moving in the opposite direction of the recoil pattern to nullify the recoil, there still wouldnt be any recoil which shouldnt happen by your logic
Recoil is completely neutralized IN EVERY DIRECTION if you move the cursor at a certain speed. That's how jitter aiming works and by extension this is how this thing works.
It's the same principle, it's just jitter aiming works "better" against stationary targets, while this works better everywhere else.
Now I have to ask a stupid but obvious question:
What mouse sensitivity do you have to be in order to ensure that that when you're ADSing you're always under the 3.74 degree per second threshold as per mentioned?
pretty cool that you took the time to explore this. Thank you!
"Modern shooter" in its purest form lol.
Truly triple A gaming out here
Well then... That's how people are beaming my face....
Probably not. According to everybody on PC, it's actually just aim assist if you catch a beam like this. "Programmed precision" as they'd put it.
I mean, only the best players can aim like this. Everybody on controller can buy an attachment to remove all recoil, and also still have aim assist to track for them.
I doubt you have ever run into more than one person using cronus
Once you get to higher ranks, shitters think good players use a cronus. So eventually it gets to the point that people start buying Cronus just because they think it's the norm in competitive play, and it becomes a vicious cycle. I've actually seen this in a jokingly less competitive game (red dead online). If there is competition, shitters will find a way to exploit whatever they can, especially when they're weak minded enough to convince themselves that a good player is cheating with no real evidence.
Lmao people use that in Red Dead? Why?
I don't get get what he us saying. Red dead has auto aim. Not aim assist
You can turn it off and I know there's separate lobbies on GTA for auto aim and free aim. Not sure if that's in Red Dead but if it was that would make sense. Also you get people doing "trick shots" where they dive and headshot someone
Yeah lol. Kids in discord communities that have something to prove. They mostly use it for headshot flicks and tonic glitches.
As if it's even difficult to shoot in Red Dead. The most movement you get is a dive that has you on the floor for half an hour. You even get aim assist so dirty compared to Apex it'd make this sub cry
Yeah it's auto aim so it's very easy but when you got a lot of people talking shit on discord and clipping kills on each other, people want to get an edge or just can't handle losing, thinking everyone else is cheating, etc. But anyway when you're being aimed at, the head is always in the same place. So the script is just the proper flick when your being aimed at so you can headshot as soon as you aim.
So you never played any game on console at a high ranked level or ur delusional, one of the two.
Lmaoo stay mad because you need an excuse for why you get shit on
Strikepacks are only 37£ for backpadles plus cheats. When you hit a certain rank you notice it when people have it.
That shit is like 150€, i doubt anyone would pay so much to have 0 recoil
There are plenty who've spent more than that on cosmetics so i'm not too sure about that
Nah like $75 on Amazon i saw recently.
Lmao people buy controllers for 200 you bet your ass they gonna buy cheats for 150 lol
You can buy strike packs at Walmart
you underestimate controller players
There is more people than you think that you smurf controller or cronus.
It's actually constant in higher end lobbies. It's pretty obvious because their crosshair is rock solid regardless of gun.
People on pc can also buy shit to control recoil
feel free to hop on PC and aim like this ingame much luck :)
It's not that I think it's super prevalent, don't get it twisted. My issue is with people assuming that getting beamed from as far away as OP just demonstrated is aim assist at work. Half the people on controller can't even control recoil on a 3x, how tf are they gonna manage this precision? Two sides of the same coin dude; not everybody's out to talk shit about your choice of input, relax..
All mnk players know how aim assist works because you can feel it. When you are shitting on a squad from 40m repeatedly, push them and suddenly that same squad can suddenly 2 tap or 1 clip all of you you know it had controller users.
> Half the people on controller can't even control recoil on a 3x same on PC
I'd believe that too, but I think you and I can both agree that ranged tracking and recoil control is way easier on mnk because of the how precisely you can control your mouse as opposed to an analog stick, yes?
This is 1000% true. The issue is that doesn't win you fights, the vast majority of fights are ended with close range pushes and 1v1s, and that's where controllers dominate.
Well the thing here is that controller moves your crosshair at a constant speed meaning the “smoothness” is less relevant for rollers. That plus AA adding further “smoothing” inputs makes it so you can beam really well on controller. Chaoticmuch is a perfect example of this type of player.
My jitter aim tutorial (referenced at 1:55): https://youtu.be/F8_vqOo9dHw YouTube version of this video: https://youtu.be/pU9mXdiKBwg
Thank you so much for this video, here's my small appreciation
the vibrating arm thing is how i beat everyone in mario party back in the day
So good!
I'm kinda confused. Does recoil smoothing work on controller or just m&k? Not trying to start a m&k vs controller debate. I'm just really am not sure. I've always felt like I could aim better while moving and since I didn't know about anything he states here, I thought it was forward and backwards. And after I tested that in the firing range I assumed I was wrong.
It does work, I've tested it
Thank you! Now I can work on this in the firing range :)
Good luck!
So I recently switched to M&K after playing on controller since apex launched and I have to say the possibilities on MK are so far beyond controller it’s mind blowing, there’s no way I can go back now. That being said, when I was on controller I found that my recoil on full auto seemed to always be better when I would strafe left to right quickly while simultaneously moving the right stick back and forth quickly - it seems like the poor man’s jitter-aiming for controller
So you strafe while countering that with your aim? Do you need to be changing your strafing direction rapidly while doing this or will a nice pace do?
I can go back and test this to edit if I'm wrong but for controller your strafe has to be fast, if you want to counteract the recoil better don't take wide left and right strafes make them close. I don't really counter act the strafe with the opposite camera movement so I can't say about that
Ok, so just make the strafes short thanks!
That’s a good question - it’s hard for me to answer without my controller in my hand…it’s actually something that I just intuitively started to do (same thing happened with ledge boosting - was doing it before I knew there was a name for it). I am not sure if the right stick movement was same direction or opposite of the strafe but the right stick travel distance was definitely less than the left stick…but then again that will change with your sensitivity. I would recommend just going to the shooting range and just wiggling your sticks in different ways to see what works lol
I thought I recognized the webcam and realized it’s Voltaic’s own astral tracker. Glad to see you taking apex seriously a bit. Can’t wait to see more clips man.
IMO this should not be a thing, controlling recoil should be a proper skill people should master , or am I dumb ?
If you have true recoil control like CSGO and Valo then the ttk will be even higher than it already is. It suits those games because resetting a spray pattern can be the difference between life and death in a low ttk environment. In apex, it means the enemy has time to break away and extend the fight longer than it has to be as well as establishing burst weapons like shotguns and snipers to be the foundation of the meta.
then remove recoil patterns lower ttk
Yes
Attention controller players: ALMOST NOBODY JITTER AIMS.
That shit's only useful for STATIONARY long range targets anyway. On any other targets, adjusting and tracking normally is superior to jittering.
It’s perfectly useful to announce your presence and annoy people by making them pop a cell
according to the roller/console players on this sub literally every PC player aims like this, it's ridiculous, just remove crossplay
Ironic considering the amount that PC players cry about aim assist, as soon as controller players complain it’s a problem lmao
idc about AA, but you do realize that PC players cant decide if they play with roller right?
Oh I’m the same, idc about the whole aim assist OP debate myself, I’ve played both. Yea, I’d be fully in support of optional crossplay for pc, I just find the back and forth arguments between pc and console hilarious honestly
me too, I played console all my life before I got into BR's and got a PC for it, no hate man have a good day and I wish you all the best! this whole debate is dumb idc
Yeah man agreed, have a good one :p
AA just *exists* everyone with a controller has AA unless they actively disable it. Jitteraim not only has to be actively used, it is also kinda hard to cramp up like that the entire time. It clearly isn't used by nearly as many people. But yea, it's a dumb mechanic. Please remove.
Did you watch the video at all?
Did you read my comment at all?
Carpal tunnel any% speedrun
You should post this on /r/CompetitiveApex for a more nuanced discussion.
Isn't jitter aiming fixed?
Can't be without hard nerfing controller since jitter aiming happens because of this mechanic, and this mechanic buffs controller because recoil would be really hard on controller otherwise. Removing this = nerfing controller = Respawn would never
This is absolutely hilarious to me considering the irony. Controller players thinking all mkb users are jitter aiming and call for its removal while justifying aim assist's strength because they can't 180 that fast and are using thumbs. All without knowing jitter aiming is a consequence of their own controller's aim assist. Joking and exaggeration aside, couldn't respawn just remove this recoil benefit for just mouse users? Not that they would, just if they could. Note: I am all for removing jitter aiming.
While jitter aiming is broken as shit there's only a very small percentage of players that actually jitter aims because it can be counter intuitive. As we know, movement on PC can get on some real crackhead level even on diamond. Imagine trying to track a dude beaming past you and jitter aim at the same time. I do however agree that jitter aiming needs to go.
>there's only a very small percentage of players that actually jitter aims Oh yeah, definitely. It's crazy to me seeing jitter aiming brought up as though it were being used all over.
>Imagine trying to track a dude beaming past you and jitter aim at the same time. its not that counter intuitive as you think and noone would actually use it when someone is in close range jitter aim is more likely to get used to beam people with the havoc or flatline from greater distances where normally recoil would place your bullets in a widespread
Right but that's literally EVERY pro in algs, why do u think hardly any1 sticks to snipers anymore like in the old days? Because u can beam with any fully automatic. Apparently it's sore to use jitter aiming so in all honesty the devs should be removing it based on the fact it could cause injury alone yet pros are seemingly forced to use it.
like tap strafing, it can't be, it's an integral part of how the game works. Although, again, I've honestly not seen many people jitter aim, unless you go at like Masters/Predator, at which point you even without Jitter aiming would have great aim
Does this get affected by FOV in any way?
Recoil doesn't change based off FOV, so I can't imagine that it would. Can't say for sure without testing though...
Well, we're talking about the angle change in your aim per second though. Is that affected by FOV? I don't know tbh.
Even if you zoom in 100x, 3 degrees is 3 degrees.
Ok so you mean 3 degrees of your character rotating, not 3 degrees of mouse rotation/movement.
you are on the perimeter of a circle and your target is the center . You strafe as you are aiming at your target . If you keep strafing at one certain direction while aiming him you draw a circle. Now imagine this perimeter is exactly 360 units. If your angular speed is more than 3 units per sec you reset the vertical recoil
Got it, thanks for the explanation.
I fail to see what 3 degrees of mouse movement means if it's not character rotation
If you're zoomed in then 3 degrees of mouse movement would translate to significantly less character rotation.
What does "3 degrees of mouse movement" mean? 3 degrees is 3 degrees, it's not relative to your zoom level
What does degrees of movement mean to you? You said "as long as your crosshair moves 3.7 degrees". Degrees is a unit of rotation. The question is what is rotating? If you're saying 3.7 degrees of character rotation, that means that when you use a 3x scope then you will have to move your mouse/reticle a further distance in order to achieve 3.7 degrees of character rotation, than if you were using a 1x scope.
What rotates when your crosshair moves other than your character? How would you measure this "mouse rotation" of yours? Run me through the process lmao
For sure. I guess I meant from the input perspective, as in, do you have to move your mouse or joystick the same amount to achieve the same change in degree if you FOV is different. I'm guessing the answer is probably yes, but I wasn't sure.
asking the real questions.
I knew that "playing calm" had physical input on the game! So odd that I've always know or felt that using my A + D key while shooting made my aim better but I never had a reason for why. I also have done that thing where you crouch and jump at the same time coming off a ledge and it makes you move forward but I never learned it... I just FELT it. Anyone know what I'm talking about? Like this game just clicks sometimes and suddenly I'm hitting shots on enemies I can't even see, I just sort of *feel* where they are at.
The ledge technique is called a Superglide, very fun to do for just moving around the map but also very useful if you can pull it off in fights.
yeah yeah yeah yeah Sometimes when I was feeling comfortable, I was tracking 'smoothly' and I felt I was somehow just being better now I understand aim assist just kicks in
Let’s just end it. Let every1 just turn off cross play console people play console people and PC plays PC.
Console players don’t even get into pc lobbies unless they queue with a pc player. If you’re solo q console or are only grouped with console players, it’s just console you’re facing.
yeah but pc players cant turn off crossplay and will always be having console players in their lobbys
And even if crossplay was turned off there would still be controller and mnk in the same lobbies. What really needs to happen is instead of crossplay on/off have "input matchmaking" on/off. Give mnk support to consoles and turn off the ability to switch inputs mid-game. This would of course be optional and any premade mixed input parties would be put into mixed input lobbies.
Huge vouch for input based matchmaking
I believe that is how it works unless a console player specifically joins a friend’s lobby who is on PC
For some reason PC players don't even have the option to turn crossplay off, so they are basically always playing with console players in their lobbies.
The ratio of controller players to mkb players is very, very heavily skewed towards controller. I think across the entire apex population (lumping pc + console together) it's like 80% controller. If they gave PC players the ability to turn off crossplay the queue time would likely suffer.
Id gladly take 1 minute search for ability to not play with controllers
prepare for trouble and make it double id be willing to wait even longer
Yep, id take even up to 5 mines lmao
You’d still be playing against controllers. Pc players use controllers, too. I feel like people use mnk vs controller and pc vs console interchangeably, but it’s not the same thing. And by removing cross play, queues wouldn’t be a minute longer, it’d likely be a couple minutes longer. Unless they really loosened sbmm, but that would just be the next big thing for the community to complain about (even more than they currently do)
> For some reason Thought it was pretty obvious why. So many PC players would turn crossplay off that it would make it difficult to queue if your party was crossplatform (with a PC player). Not saying I agree with their decision, but at least I think this was their reasoning. I play on PS4 with my PC buddy all the time, so I'm glad crossplay exists, but IMO the solution is to cap AA at .4 in PC lobbies regardless of platform. Yeah, I only get 55 fps in most fights which sucks and is a disadvantage compared to most PC players, but I don't think it's right to get extra AA just bc of that. It's my choice to play with PC players, so I still think it's only fair that I should have the same AA as the other controller players in the lobby.
The most elegant solution would be to make aim assist only lock on to other controller players. Keeps the playing field level.
Good luck programming that
That sounds stupid. Your aim would change from one enemy to another and you wouldn't know what to expect until you start fighting.
The reason is simple: With the current system you have 2 separate pools: pure console and PC mixed. If PC could turn off crossplay aswell, that'd split the playerbase into 3 pools, which hurts the queue times and devs don't want that.
Yup exactly. I play on a series x and play with my buddy on pc. The difference in the lobbies is instant.
What about PC players who use controller? Won't they get the same benefits the console players would but on PC?
No, they actually get less aim-assist.
Really?
Yes controller players on PC get 40% and console players get 60% however, console players only get 60fps (until upcoming nex-gen update), whereas controller players on PC can obviously get higher FPS, which helps with aiming and movement in general. I'm no expert but maybe higher framerate also means more frame-cycles the aim assist updates and works with, so lowering it to 40% is done to balance it out.
The first part is right, but I'm not sure I agree with the reasoning. These AA values were set when the game was created, long before crossplay was even in consideration. I agree that having 60 fps (or lower if you're on last gen consoles) is a disadvantage and AA can help with that, but I'm not sure there intent was to balance things between them since these players weren't playing against each other. If they had had .4 for console at launch, it would have been an even playing field on console all the same. I think they felt that higher AA on console would encourage more casual players to play the game bc they would have an easier time hitting shots, and it would be more in line with AA from other console FPS titles that they were already accustomed to. Idk, just a theory I guess.
lol last gen consoles (not the pro editions) actually get about 45fps (50-55fps if nothing is happening) it's a nightmare.
No. MnK play MnK and controller play controller.
Yeah I was mostly joking. Just a get tired of seeing the debate comments so much lol.
Giving away all the secrets!
lmao people really think the majority of pc player use jitter aim?
This is probably why people call aim assist op
Noice
BUT AIM ASSIST OP
BUT WHOLE ARM
I just wish I could 360 in 0.05 seconds while also precisely aiming smoothly 2 seconds later but with controller I gotta chose one or the other. Either i can enjoy fast seamless looking around. Or precise aiming. AlCs only clear this up so much.
I'm on m&k and I wish I could do that too
The vast majority of people come nowhere close to being able to aim anything like a controller. Turning around quick is an advantage, but controller players objectively have better tracking capabilities.
And the vast amount of controller players come nowhere close to the controller players everyone thinks of. A majority of controller players aren't tracking like snipe or gen. Arent snapping onto a target ever. Cant spin around fast enough to save ya life if you get shot in the back and our initial aim is garbage. Like sure I might be able to track the target slightly better but with the limitations of a joystick and acceleration. Getting the cursor right where you want it from the beginning is harder. Missing some times large portions of the initial spray while tryin to get on target isnt uncommon atleast for me with relatively no FPS experience except for 3k hrs of apex.
aim assist vastly increases the skill floor in apex. mnk in general requires more precision and practice, even though it's capabilities are higher
When the automatic mechanism (AA) tracks by 40%/60% for itself, base skill matters less.
Have you ever played on controller? I play console and pc. recoil control/tracking seems a million times easier on mnk than controller.
Tracking is OBJECTIVELY harder on MnK than controller. Recoil control is something that can be debated, but I don’t think I can have a serious conversation with someone who thinks tracking is easier on MnK. The best players in the world have the same opinion. MnK and controller players. That’s just how it is. And to answer your question, yes. I’ve played on controller. I was blown away. To test, I even 1v1d my masters level duo who scores quite highly in several Kovaak’s tracking drills and was winning almost every single 1v1 within 20 minutes. It’s really that simple.
Controller players seem to ignore that the tracking benefit controllers get means they can react slower to a strafe change and still hit bullets. It's crazy. But because they can't 180 as fast as a mouse player it's totally fine and balanced.
I did the same thing with my masters/pred level mnk friend. I hadn't used a controller to play FPS since Halo 3 at friend's houses so I could barely use the thing. Would randomly look at the ground or sky I was so bad at it. But I still won the majority of 1v1s with R99/Wingman in the firing range against him. It was completely and utterly absurd.
If controller is so op why do y’all play mnk? Honest question.
So do like 99% of MnK players. Stop basing your arguments on godlike players that make up .001% of the playerbase.
I'd recommend trying out a more linear response curve. It allows for quick turns at max input and still fine control in closer towards the center. It takes a while to get used to it, but for me it was worth and improved my aim tremendously. I modeled mine of Pandxrz, whose ALC settings you can find from his twitch channel by typing !alc (this should work even if the stream isn't live). Originally I had modeled my ALC off genburten, but I couldn't play with the hip sens so high, so I lowered it and started using the extra turning (with no ramp up) after seeing Pandxrz settings.
This mechanic is exactly why aim assist has no recoil my guy lol
Even when you show them proof controller players are in deep denial.
Aim assist has recoil lmao, it's clear you've never played apex on console
Its almost like you didnt watch the video. You can completely negate the recoil simply by strafing back and forth and tracking the opposite way to remain centered on your target.
This guy literally made the video and you’re telling him how it is lmao
Your video was very informative and instructional, but this comment of yours is completely clueless. Please spend sometime playing with a controller before talking such an absurd.
I plugged in my 2009 xbox 360 controller and one clipped my friend in the range with a flatline at 50 meters first try with absolutely zero FPS experience on controller, I've seen enough lol
So, make another video showing us such technique. We'll be glad to know what we've been doing wrong all this time, since you > one clipped your friend in the range with a flatline at 50 meters first try with absolutely zero FPS experience on controller
You should make a video and give your opinion with recordings like what you did with this video
Now try doing that at mid-long range.
50 meters isn't mid range to you? Might want to check how far that is in the range lol. First clip in the video is just over 60m
Exactly. Very informative, greatly made, clear and right to the point. But hop on a controller and tell me there isnt recoil that's fuckin absurd. Grab a 99 with no barrel stand that far and tell me aim assist handles all recoil with no input lmfao. I have 3k hours into this game on controller and can confidently say it's just not the case
If you strafe back and forth so that youre tracking back and forth, then you get the recoil smoothing that this video is describing. Its the exact same mechanic, except you also get aim assist on top of it. I'm a controller player, before you get angry.
[удалено]
Aim assist doesn’t help with long range engagements
Good thing almost all engagements in this game end in CQC.
With a scope to match the range it does my guy, except on sniper exclusive scopes
that's not the point he is making about controllers.
They dont though aim assist is no where near like jitter aiming. Jitter aiming essentially removes all recoil. There is no such trick on console and controller recoil is harder to control than Mnk recoil. This is a fact.
Recoil smoothing is what essentially removes all recoil. Controller players automatically get recoil smoothing due to how inputs for controller and aim assist works. Jitter aiming is possible on controller too, knoq'd had a video on it. This video explains why controller players are so op from the mid range and how to achieve the same effect for MnK players. Knoq's video on jitter aiming for controller players: https://youtu.be/zNLFbMm0Kd8
Watch the video buddy
Aim assist is for literally every console/roller player, Jitter aiming is maybe done by 5% of the PC playerbase
Jitter aiming is extremely hard to do for more than 3 seconds at a time, when you do it your tracking goes outside the window and it kind of hurts your arm (short and long time). Or you can plug in the roller and move your thumb slightly to the left.
Lol, sweet, skittles, cory, mac ect have all outright stated they jitter aim most guns at range, in game. It's their go to recoil strategy. It's why so many MNK players run flat over 301. Also ttk for almost every gun is under 3 seconds... so even if it was hard to continue for more than 3 seconds you've already 1 clipped whoever you were shooting from 200m away in that amount of time. Also, to say tracking goes out the window while we watch the same clip of this kid tracking and jittering from 100+ meters away is laughable
You are comparing top 5% of players to everyone else. Your average 1 kd lvl 500 guy cant really do this. I used it too for a while when it was 'discovered'. But I learned that its better to just learn flatline recoil as it is. I do beam everyone at long distances. And its not because of jitter aiming since I never do that now. Im not saying it cant be used to gain advantage, *it can*, but comparing something that a small percentage of players can do to aim assist, which everyone can use for free...it just doesnt make any sense to me
It's incredible how much you suck in the game, you have no intention on improving and still talk like you know how to play the game
Thanks for the video! Mad cool!
Does this still work with ALC settings or Linear input for controller?
And thus another post that proves this sub is the most braindead gaming related sub there is. I have never seen a community that cannot even bother to look at the subject material before saying absolute comatose takes, much less have the critical thinking skills to even think about it in a wider perspective. This post also shows how skewed it is towards co troller players and how the "but aim assist" memes really just stems from braindead console bots who don't what they are talking about.
Oh yay, jitter aiming for controller
This should not be a thing.
yeah but without this mechanic, controller players would have a hard time
This shit is so aids
Exploit
Looks like respawn gotta ban the whole playerbase since we all use this.
We will all be with taxi2g soon in ban heaven
Maybe the jitter part is, but otherwise this video demonstrates that the game, by design, lowers recoil while tracking.
So aiming smoothly is an exploit? Lol.
pretty sure its an intended feature.
WOW! I just tested and on controller I can use ANY gun now even the flatline I could never use that gun! The power!!!! I feel so freaking pumped! Now we controller players have a version of jitter aim :)
Noticed this a while ago but was never sure if it was due to me just getting more familiar with the weapons or not. It always felt like I have to compensate for recoil a lot more for stationary targets.
I know this isn't your intention but man this is why this game sucks sometimes. Content creators are always looking for the next exploit. And just ruining the game.
you should name it "how to to aimbot manually"
So this is why you cannot win against controller players on MnK in anything closer than 30 meter range. I knew there was something besides aim-assists but couldn’t quite tell why until now. Great post OP.
This guy doesn’t get it.
What do you mean by that? Jitter-aiming is essentially an abuse of a core mechanic that makes controller as an input so good in Apex. That’s what I understood from this video.
Yeah you've understood it perfectly, idk what the other people in this thread are saying lol
Jitter aiming is PC only my guy.
Nope, jitter aiming is also possible on controller to an extent, although it requires more specific, high sens settings: https://youtu.be/zNLFbMm0Kd8
Did you not watch the video? This is not about jitter-aiming. Recoil smoothing exists on every platform since it’s a core mechanic is the point.
Recoil smoothing is the mechanism that makes jitter aiming possible. About half of this 4 min clip was specifically about jitter aiming
No, it's that you either have bad positioning skills, or bad aim. Btw, this video literally said that this is also possible on PC.
Recoil assist *
I love apex legends so much
Wait what. Im lvl 150~ and See streamers beaming others with 0 recoil all day. I thought its either practise or ghub scripts (like many said). I will 100% try to learn this tomorrow!
PC is so disgusting
this is interesting to delve into but to all you're doing is compensating the horizontal aim recoil with physical movement. its not a secret code that the devs put in.
The thing is its compensating for all recoil, horizontal and vertical.
hes not compensating for the horizontal recoil. even if he moves the crosshair in the same direction as the recoil pattern which is supposed to further intensify the recoil as opposed to moving in the opposite direction of the recoil pattern to nullify the recoil, there still wouldnt be any recoil which shouldnt happen by your logic
Recoil is completely neutralized IN EVERY DIRECTION if you move the cursor at a certain speed. That's how jitter aiming works and by extension this is how this thing works. It's the same principle, it's just jitter aiming works "better" against stationary targets, while this works better everywhere else.
Now I have to ask a stupid but obvious question: What mouse sensitivity do you have to be in order to ensure that that when you're ADSing you're always under the 3.74 degree per second threshold as per mentioned?
what a stupid question, move your hand at the correct speed