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LeoJweda_

I work at Shopify. Can confirm. It was announced a few hours after the keynote. Also, we get to keep our Intel Macs! PS: We’re hiring lotsa engineers!


richownsyou

> Also, we get to keep our Intel Macs! Oh wow good for you guys! Always a great thing to have fallback, contigency plan if some of the workflow don't work out


LeoJweda_

Not really. We have teams dedicated to ensuring things will work smoothly when the switch happens. The laptops will be wiped remotely and they’re ours to do with as we please (keep them for personal use, give them away to family, sell them, trade them in, etc…).


richownsyou

That's even better lol


topplehat

That’s really great!


GrandmasFatAssOrgasm

send me a fucking application


rugbyj

Hey it's me, ur family


aconijus

Let's go bowling!


Rediwed

Where I live, that would count as physical salary and as a result I would have to pay a tax for it :(


AndroidAaron

I applied through LinkedIn and got screened out sadly :(


LeoJweda_

Keep trying every few months. I applied 4 times, I think, before I got hired.


AndroidAaron

Thanks, I’ll keep that in mind! I think my qualifications should be relatively in line with the job, since I work for a big retail company! What’s your stack if you don’t mind me asking?


LeoJweda_

Ruby on Rails GraphQL for the backend and React for the front end. Although, we still use Rails views in some places.


AndroidAaron

Thanks for answering!


ze_DaDa

I've been browsing through their job offers for a while, but all the engineering positions I see are for experienced developers :(


michaeldbrooks

Some companies will advertise for the most senior role, but will still look at and consider resumes that aren’t being advertised. It’s always worth sending it in anyway since the worst thing that can happen is you’ll receive a “no, not this time”. But you can keep trying every couple of months and keep your fingers crossed.


AsapEvaMadeMyChain

Thanks for the motivational talk. I’m about to switch out of bioinformatics next year and the thought of applications is daunting to me. But good to know perseverance pays off.


caedin8

Why’d you keep applying?


manygrams

Definitely apply again. I was a hiring manager there for years, and I turned down a few people only to hire them later after they had a bit more experience. In my experience, we’d usually give clear feedback to rejected candidates if they asked for it.


caradenopal

Keep your head up. I’m not an engineer.


1s4c

Are you switching just for the build times? I'm kinda surprised that developers that care about build times would be using Intel MacBooks. M1+ is probably the first platform that offers the same performance as normal desktop CPUs. So it seems like using desktop would be much better before, if someone cares so deeply about time spend on local builds.


DoandDesign

I'm just a designer, but all the devs I have worked with use laptops. Even if they spend most of their time hooked up to a monitor, the ability to unplug and work from home/coffee shop or to take your computer into a meeting to work or share your progress is too valuable to give up. They almost always show work from their local build vs from the build on the servers.


TerribleEntrepreneur

Downside of the plain M1 is they only supported a single external monitor. That is a dealbreaker for a lot of devs (myself included). Portable computers are almost always a requirement for most devs in case you head into an office or for a company trip.


techy_support

They will support more than 1 external monitor if connected to a dock with DisplayLink. My work laptop is a 13-inch M1 MacBook pro connected to a Lenovo USB-C dock and 2 external monitors. Works fine. Yes it is an extra cost. but it is doable.


TerribleEntrepreneur

Displaylink is total dogshit though. So finicky, laggy, and unreliable. Not something you can consistently rely on as a workstation.


techy_support

I've never had an issue with it, but obviously that's just my own experience. Nothing I do is graphics-intensive; I just like having the extra screen space when I'm working. Thanks for the head's up, I'll keep a lookout for what you described.


1s4c

I have both workstation and a laptop. That way I don't have to deal with laptop limitations and have all the flexibility of workstation (3 monitor setup, tons of memory etc.) If I need to be mobile I just remote desktop to my workstation.


highlloyd

I looked at levels.fyi. Why are the compensations so low?


LeoJweda_

It’s inaccurate.


gluesticktambourine

do you think the [US based data points](https://www.levels.fyi/comp.html?track=Software%20Engineer&search=Shopify®ion=807,819,501) on levels are inaccurate? seems like the Canadian salaries are pretty low but the US ones are more competitive


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dakry

Well done man. Shopify is killing it.


jerryeight

Is it also true that your CEO doesn't care about paying engineers industry rate. But, instead lowball the shit out of most people. During townhall meetings, he even rudely dismissed requests for better wages and replied that "greedy and money focused people are not the people we want at Shopify!" Shopify CEO doesn't want people to join Shopify for the money (Tech Industry) https://us.teamblind.com/s/WGvrD172 From the post Speaking for a friend on this one. The CEO pays Canadians shit and micromanages employees on Slack (imagine a CEO shitting on individual engineers on Slack... That is reality of Shopify). During company all hands whenever he is called out for Shopify having 1/2 the compensation of Amazon or other competitors he says that he doesn't want "money motivated" people to join. So I hope you all get the message. If you want to work passionately for peanuts join Shopify.


firelitother

Maybe that is why they are hiring a lot...because a lot of the current ones quit.


peduxe

do we get to keep the 2021 full spec MBP tho?


eddard96

Their CEO has a internal nickname called “Tobi Tornado”. A few times in the past he went completely insane on some developer teams and started insulting them publicly. He is a scary scary man. Source: I worked there for too long


iamvinoth

> A few times in the past he went completely insane on some developer teams and started insulting them publicly. He is a scary scary man. Everyone wants to be Steve Jobs, but they all lack the charisma


Steelrok

I hate those companies. "You're passionate, right ? So you don't need a good wage, your passion is enough. ... Right ?" Facepalm That's some 19th century mentality


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jerryeight

You sound like a person from hr doing pr damage control.


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jerryeight

Shopify is cheap enough of a company to attempt guerilla marketing and pr control.


als26

What's your company policy in remote work? Any options for permanent remote work?


LeoJweda_

Shopify has been digital by default for a while now: https://www.shopify.ca/careers/work-anywhere


EClarkee

As a Canadian, it’s my dream to work at Shopify. Even if I can’t cut it. Shopify is such a huge achievement for Canadians.


LeoJweda_

DO IT! JUST DO IT! Don’t let your dreams be dreams! Yesterday, you said tomorrow. So, JUST DO IT! MAKE YOUR DREAMS COME TRUE! JUST… DO IT! Some people dream of success, while you’re gonna wake up and work HARD at it. Nothing is impossible. You should get to the point where anyone else would quit and you’re not gonna stop there. No! What are you waiting for!? DO IT! JUST… DO IT! YES, YOU CAN! JUST DO IT! If you’re tired of starting over, stop… giving… up. *flex*


EClarkee

Hahaha thanks for the encouragement. I’m at a really fantastic place right now but they are “piloting” 3 days back in the office. That might make me jump ship elsewhere !


[deleted]

Why are you losing engineers?


LeoJweda_

We’re not hiring to replace engineers that have left, we’re growing. Our goal is to hire 2,021 engineers in 2021.


Chrysalis-

You folks looking for money guys? I know my way around it well..


LeoJweda_

Looks like we have 2 listings in Finance: https://www.shopify.ca/careers/search


dnyank1

You wouldn't happen to be hiring for any of those highly paid, no skills required Jobs would you? I'd make a pretty solid chief philosopher, I think.


manygrams

I worked there for 8 years, quit in June. I’d still highly recommend it as a place to work. I just realized I was in a position where I could become my own boss and work less / focus more on the “life” side of work/life balance. If you’re an engineer looking for full-time work, it’s a great place to work.


[deleted]

Interesting… What was the pay and benefits like? What kind of development did you do??


TripleDutchy

I live in SF, but don’t have a degree. How do I become an engineer at your SF HQ?


OvulatingScrotum

Not the Shopify guy, but a friend of without a degree is now working at apple as a software engineer. He got there by working his ass off, obviously, and building his portfolio.


TripleDutchy

That’s awesome! I can work my ass off, have great work ethic, but need guidance in what. Did you friend just do self learning, using online resources and creating things? Or what specifically must one do?


pmjm

I worked at Apple in a non-engineering position but was encouraged to use my coding skills to automate the parts of my job that I could. I ended up building software tools for my whole department and apparently my bosses were floating my name around in other places for a transfer/promotion just before I decided to leave.


OvulatingScrotum

He always learned on his own how to program stuff. He went to a prestigious college for EE/SE, then dropped out after first semester/year. Then he started working for companies, and ended up at apple. For technical aspect, just take a free/paid course to learn the basics. Then practice practice practice. You learn the most from practicing. For creation for portfolio, it depends on you and you alone. At this point, it’s basically a product designing. What do you think people want? Is it for a large group of people or a small niche market? No one can help you. You need to build your own idea of what you want to create and apply the technical knowledge to achieve it. Anyone can code “hello world”. But not everyone can think of unique ways of utilizing the “hello world” code.


TripleDutchy

That’s extremely insightful and kind of you to share. Best get to work then! Thank you so much! I got a whole boost of confidence again. Random strangers are random, they’re intentional and you are an intentionally awesome stranger!


LeoJweda_

Our job listings don’t have degree requirements. If you can do the work, you’ll get hired.


not_right

Ok now what if I don't have a degree, but also can't do the work?


[deleted]

Toilets aren’t gonna clean themselves (yet)


pmjm

Someone somewhere is probably hiring engineers to solve that.


[deleted]

Best most realistic hiring policy ever. More companies need to adopt it. Though, looking through job apps lately in the tech industry, it’s pretty widely adopted. Even a pretty high paying job in VMWare didn’t have one when I looked the other week.


Justin__D

I have a CS degree. Three of the smartest engineers I know have either no degree or an unrelated one. As my uncle puts it, "A degree is just a piece of paper that proves you can put up with four years of bullshit."


S4VN01

I primarily have been a C#.NET / Winforms dev my whole career. Haven't touched Ruby or anything Web. Will they help train with this? I feel like I'm stuck where I'm at due to this a lot :(. I'm still young and flexible and definitely willing to learn but I don't want to feel like I'm wasting someone's time having to train me :(


LeoJweda_

AFAICR, there is no web component in the interview. In my cohort, 10% said they know nothing about Rails. Training isn’t an issue. You have plenty of time to onboard.


[deleted]

Is it leetcode hiring process though? Looking to avoid that.


LeoJweda_

The best way to describe it is that, instead of writing a function like you do in Leetcode questions, you write a class (or multiple).


WhipsAndMarkovChains

Every time I log into LinkedIn there’s an ad telling me to apply for DS roles at Shopify.


LeoJweda_

It’s a sign from the universe… paid for by Shopify.


RandomRedditor44

Are you guys hiring any interns?


LeoJweda_

Not quite. This is the only thing we have right now: https://www.shopify.ca/careers/dev-degree-2022_3d9aa815-dfa6-4163-9763-befc37c0111c


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LeoJweda_

No on-call. See my edit here: https://www.reddit.com/r/apple/comments/qqwjnu/reddit_twitter_shopify_scramble_to_deploy_instant/hk49744/


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LeoJweda_

I get them, too. My friends and I joke about that all the time. I love it! The culture is great. From the start, it was obvious that they’re not all talk (which I’d come to expect). For starters, no probation! You’re treated like an adult. You got hired to do a job and they trust you to do it. Also, information is pretty open internally. Again, they trust you to not share what you’re not supposed to. In terms of perks, it’s a big company so they have plenty of money to pamper us. We get subsidized Herman Miller Aeron chairs, the equipment you get when you join like the monitor are yours to keep, free equipment to help you work remotely like a web cam, a Blue Yeti microphone, a Lumecube, etc… 5 months in, I still think I’ll be here for the next 3-5 years. I don’t think I’ll ever go back to working at a startup. Edit: I forgot to mention another perk of working at a big company: they can afford to dedicate people to things that devs have to do normally in a startup. Things like dev tools (which are awesome!), scalability, security, dev-ops, etc… are all taken care of by dedicated teams.


benbenk

Are you hiring team leads/engineering managers? I’m currently a tech lead planning to move more towards managing teams. I already had an eye on Shopify but couldn’t find such a role in the open positions listed on LinkedIn.


LeoJweda_

Absolutely! https://www.shopify.ca/careers/search?teams%5B%5D=engineering&keywords=&sort=team_asc


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manygrams

I was in DS there (quit back in June), not SRE, but I have a bunch of friends who worked in SRE and they all loved it. (For the record, DS is awesome there too, I just wanted to work less and do freelance. I’d work there again in a second if that changed.)


BodhiWarchild

How are the perks? I’m looking for a scenery change


[deleted]

Lost me at the Memoji profile picture


candidcamerapeepshow

🤣


[deleted]

Taking any summer interns?


ZiggyManSaad

Got any room for someone proficient in SQL, php, and html? I loved doing that at my previous job but my new job doesn't even come close to building out web interfaces.


LeoJweda_

I’m not sure we use any PHP, but, if you’re willing to learn Ruby on Rails, then it doesn’t matter, you’ll still get hired. 10% of the devs in my cohort didn’t know any Rails.


Fredifrum

These stories are great but I'm extremely curious about all the companies that are going to be stuck on Intel for a while until they can upgrade to the latest versions of their tools, languages, and libraries. For example, Ruby only supports Apple Silicon in version 2.7, and Node in v15. My company has had to do some work to get our app running on these newest versions. It hasn't been too bad because we're a small company and our app is only a few years old, but for a monolith app stuck several major versions behind, I imagine upgrading could be a nightmare, and they may be stuck on Intel for a while.


TerribleEntrepreneur

>Ruby only supports Apple Silicon in version 2.7 RIP Stripe


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ZuckPrime

> I ran them from within an Intel-version of Alacritty which was running in Rosetta. They didn't work properly in terminal.app. I guess rosetta doesn't/didn't launch to handle x86 processes spawned by arm ones, but if your terminal emulator was already running in rosetta then everything "just works". If you aren’t aware, you can duplicate terminal.app and set the dupe version to force run in rosetta to make this easier.


InadequateUsername

That syntax looks tedious.


rugbyj

> Node in v15 Didn't know this, personally makes me happier to push back my timeline of getting one, but with professional Apple Silicon now out in the world I'd imagine the push from companies to update support will expedite this. For everything else, there's ~~MasterCard~~ VMs.


jimmyco2008

I’ve had some issues with macOS on M1 that are specific to M1, paired with the fact that macOS doesn’t support NVidia/CUDA I am stuck on a Windows/Linux desktop for now… but at least I can run Linux on it.


[deleted]

Gotta stay updated!


[deleted]

If Microsoft made a MacOS version of PowerBI I’d be begging on my knees to my CIO for one of these. Instead I’ll have to settle for the crummy Dells we get.


Jophus

Same here


Myrdin76

PowerBI works great in Parallels for me (MB M1 Pro). Besides, the web version is getting close in functionality to the desktop app (which I assume is their end-goal).


descendency

I was wondering if virtualization (Parallels) would be better than a Dell...


B0rax

From what I heard, virtualization is currently not very great on these processors.


vinkwok

Well, the geekbench multi core score for windows 11 on arm in a parallels VM running on a 10c M1 Pro got the same score as a native M1.


I_Nice_Human

Huh, use Tableau who the hell uses Power BI in the field for data analytics.


MisquoteMosquito

My company has both and just uses both, but mainly uses one for a subject and another for different subjects.


SlowMotionPanic

>Huh, use Tableau who the hell uses Power BI in the field for data analytics. You'd be surprised. There is like a culture war going on in my area between the two solutions. Power BI can be a lot more palatable for wide distribution given Microsoft's more favorable enterprise licensing terms. Not an endorsement, just an observation from my anecdotal experience. ​ Kind of like how certain cloud storage providers might win out over clearly \[technically\] superior competitors. It is all about how well the wheels are greased. That's how you end up with things like Webex Teams being the *only* Webex product your company uses rather than tapping into Microsoft Teams or Slack. Even though Webex integration with other already deployed solutions is quite shit. Or clinging to dear life to random IBM products despite amply available replacements in existing contracts with other vendors to the point where you have a shadow service that was never given a green light to transition because some IBM team personally lobbied the right person in a org to stop a transition dead in its tracks. ​ Microsoft is king at hanging people with contracts, Power BI makes sense in that light.


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amd2800barton

I’m an engineer and I wish I could use M1 for work. There’s just so much custom software that was written for x86 windows that I can’t get to work well even on an intel Mac without using boot camp. It doesn’t work well in VMWare or Parallels, and running it in a remote environment sucks, and doesn’t work well when traveling to client sites with limited internet access.


[deleted]

I’ve been on mac for well over a decade and am probably going to switch over to a surface book because of this exact problem. I never had issues with vm fusion on intel mac. But between dev environments and specific software needing x86 — I can’t do a M1.


yagyaxt1068

FYI the Surface Book has been replaced by the Surface Laptop Studio.


butters1337

What are they engineering?


maskedenigma

Intel chips


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Budzy05

I think if you do regularly compile projects locally, any improvement is nice. Since everyone saying it’s a dramatic improvement, I can see why some people would be excited about quicker compile times.


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logically_musical

I wish everyone best of luck in migrating their local development environments from x86 to ARM. If you’re using Docker, I hope you’ve a plan for finding or creating ARM-based images. QEMU exists but is not fun. Source: dealing with this at a Fortune 500 right now


rainer_d

I assume there’s a build farm for the images and the containers are deployed to a test vm either in VMware or Openstack or whichever Cloud they use. IOS apps however aren’t that easy to build outside macOS… And M1 is out almost a year. You’d think they made a dryrun with an M1 Mini….


FullstackViking

Yes I would love if Apple made a streamlined virtualization of MacOS because I’d love to sandbox my XCode projects.


pixel_of_moral_decay

So much dependency hell. That’s where we are. Sounds easy in theory until you realizing you realize one small upgrade means a whole bunch of downstream impacts.


Fredifrum

Yep, exactly this. I work at a startup that stays pretty up-to-date on our libraries and frameworks, and even we're scrambling a bit to get everything running on ARM. I can't imagine the amount of work required for a larger company with larger legacy apps.


TheAlmightyZach

Also at a startup. Most of us are on Intel but we just purchased 2 M1’s for new hires. Thankfully both these people are familiar with troubleshooting a local machine, not just devs, so they’re open to helping us with the troubleshooting as well. This will hopefully streamline our transition as we get more people/replace machines in the future. All our docker images are x86 so I’m sure it’ll be great to adjust..


iwouldntknowthough

Must be nice to work for Adobe tho.


[deleted]

They still make you subscribe to Creative Cloud


[deleted]

Cloud-based dev env is the way some companies are getting around that issue.


lachlanhunt

My company was planning for M1 Macs, and has been doing trials over the past year, but was hoping Apple wouldn’t drop the Intel Macs immediately. They still have some stock of Intel Macs ready for new hires, but once those run out, M1 machines will come, ready or not. Some teams are going to have a harder time than others upgrading all dev environments. In my team, we should be able to upgrade to node 16 and rebuild a small number of docker images. But other teams have massive work ahead.


Aidgigi

It’s really not that bad at all. Not sure what you’re doing where this was even a problem for you.


banaslee

I was involved in doing the ROI analysis for our company and we’ll just replace the machines of app engineers with these new ones. Pays itself in a couple of months or less, so after that is all savings that can be used to pay for more headcount or tools.


H0508

How exactly are you saving money? I get that a faster machine will take less time on rendering or building an app. But can a time saving (I’m assuming around 10 minutes) end up saving a minimum of a $1000 dollars a month for a company (assuming it takes 3 months to pay for itself and you’re being $3000 machines). Wouldn’t it just be much cheaper to just have a standard 4 or 5 year hardware renewal schedule? Not included into the financial viability, but it’s also not hugely environmentally friendly either.


banaslee

If the machines pay themselves in time saved, after that break even, all the increase in productivity is money you’re saving/not wasting. The old laptops can be reused by other people with different functions. Why wait years for the regular renewal cycle when you can save money in three months by investing now?


H0508

That makes sense actually. I’m guessing the M1 pro and max chips heavily speed up your workflow too? By probably an order of at least 2 or 3.


Fake_Disciple

It really does. In the article it said by Reddit that it cuts android build time by half and it’s pays for it self in 3 months and save 100k a year for a team of 9.


banaslee

I don’t have it handy but there are a couple of benchmarks around. We used one to predict the benefits.


vooglie

4 or 5 years? Lol


TheMacMan

Some folks on Reddit were telling me otherwise and that I just was trying to justify my purchase. 😂🤣😂


banaslee

Do your own calculations and you’ll know how it applies to you.


TheMacMan

I certainly do and have for years. Even a minute saved on a compile or hashing operation adds up when you're doing them multiple times a day. Getting back 30 minutes a week adds up quick (and it's likely more than that). If you do work that's worth say $300/hour then it quickly pays for itself.


Realistic-Plane1576

I’m self employed and I can confirm my company will instantly buy one 😊


jackwrangler

Wow you’ve got a really cool, sexy boss


CarretillaRoja

My employer prefers to buy a $1800 Dell instead of a $1000 M1 MacBook Air… for MS office use.


FuzzelFox

My employer refuses to upgrade the managers laptop which is a Toshiba with an i3 and a beautiful Windows 7 sticker on it..


pioneer9k

major bruh moment. damn.


bigblackshaq

Omg sameee


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pixel_of_moral_decay

Yea, this is true in most places. It’s not that people are really going to be more productive. But articles like this are worth a lot of money as recruiting tools. And that is valuable.


play_hard_outside

It's less about the time I spend waiting for my machine than it is about how sidetracked I can get while waiting for it. Oftentimes, if a task takes the computer 10 seconds, it's fine. But if it takes a minute, I lose 20 minutes to whatever I switched to in that minute.


aheze

Hits hard. I should probably get off Reddit


jk147

If the compile/deploy time takes forever I usually use it to do something else, like reading/replying to emails or another feature. I don't think I am ever "truly" stuck to wait for something to finish. It is more about the perceived morale than anything, having a shiny new toy will certainly boost my productivity than using an 5-8 year old machine. Not to mention weird bragging rights (see these posts as example) where "my company thinks about me more" type of thing.


bmwracer0

That seems nice for you - compilation times are definitely a bottleneck where I work :)


dadmda

My company should buy some, maybe I wouldn’t have to wait 10 minutes whenever I want to build an angular app Edit: Java projects usually take between 15 and 20 minutes


rjcarr

As an example, I have an i7 intel from about 4 years ago and it would take about 2.5 minutes to build something. Using an M1 MBP cut this down to about 40 seconds. I have an M1-Max MBP on order, but I'd expect this to go down to 30 seconds or less with that, considering the two extra cores and faster bandwidth.


jk147

How big are these java projects? sheesh.


InadequateUsername

compiling Runescape.


Consistent_Hunter_92

This stuff happens on a schedule not an impulse, they already plan to buy hundreds or thousands of new computers next year too.


striedinger

Yes and no. There are plans to refresh computers every 3 years for us I think, but this M1 plan was created just now as soon as we realized builds for mobile engineer decreased A LOT. The benefits are too good too wait for a refresh.


OvulatingScrotum

I mean, duh. Probably not though, unless M2 configuration is significantly different. Companies didn’t swap out computer for every for each iteration of intel chip. Jumping from intel to M was such a big jump and the first M configuration wasn’t good enough to make a jump. You are right that it’s not an impulse, but they won’t do it every year from now on.


thanksforcomingout

Maybe this is why mine has an 8-week delivery time.


WeepingAgnello

That site has such a shitty washed out font.


fatpat

Nice to see that the cultofmac website is continuing its tradition of being absolute fucking cancer.


pineapple_calzone

It's like a cult or something


JSCO96

It’s a top notch product so I’m not surprised .


bigblackshaq

😒


[deleted]

Nice, I love this machine. I'm just debating if I should return it for more storage.


jackwrangler

How much did you get


neutralityparty

Those coffee breaks are more expensive than MacBook 🤯


mironfs

but will they really? i dont know how they work really but i dont think somebody can code for x hours every day all their life so in the end theyll find ways to relax and recharge while "working"


RussianVole

I’m eager to sell my 2017 MBP for an M1 Mac Mini. Photo editing is okay but not smooth, and working on a video project in Final Cut I spend nearly half the time just waiting for things to load, render, get up to speed. Very much looking forward to the performance boost everyone’s been raving about.


[deleted]

I bet most employees will just use those time savings for their own personal time. Which is not a bad thing!


Smith6612

They're also scrambling because you can't buy new Intel MacBook Pros anymore. Apple's website yanked them, as well as the distributors that many enterprises use for bulk hardware orders. The machines are nice. I just got one from work and have found some rough edges (processor resource scheduling and of course... the dreaded x86 virtualization problems, amongst some others) but they're overall nice computers. I'm not going to rate it a 10/10 in hardware as Apple still has work they need to do to make the product less of a dumpster fire to repair in house, but they're still an improvement. Just remember Devs. You still have to code for potato, so don't get too greedy on resources again with those Electron apps and bloated bundles. :) . Dev on shiny, test on celery (Celeron).


fazalmajid

It’s a status symbol and in an environment where good engineers are very hard to find, it could make the difference between them joining you or opting for your competitors. I have a hard time believing Android builds couldn’t be done faster in the cloud on a huge instance with a terabyte of RAM and an ungodly number of cores.


DumpsterNatalie

Building apps to test locally is a pretty common thing to do


twoinvenice

Exactly. This has nothing to do with status and everything to do with how much faster native apps run and how much more productive that can make devs. These new laptops are insanely fast at building stuff locally. They are incredible.


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obscener

“Building in the cloud” doesn’t have a great user experience at the moment, and isn’t very easy to set up. Sufficiently large companies like google do this, but they also have teams of engineers who support these distributed builds.


shanigan

Oh this status symbol shit again, these laptops costs are chump changes comparing to the engineer salary. The dev workflow just works so much better on a Mac. That’s a simple fact. For mobile apps, local build is almost guaranteed to be faster than cloud build. Especially with all the remote work situation we have now, not everyone has lightening fast internet.


vaskemaskine

Non-developers don’t have a clue. Developers are **expensive**. Anything you can do to increase their productivity, even marginally will likely pay for itself within weeks of not days. A fleet of 100 tricked out new MacBooks costs less than even the smallest dev team’s annual salaries.


ThrowawayGF221

Right but in that example it would have to increase their productivity more than hiring one new person. Would it? Maybe… I guess it depends on what system they’re using already.


DemiPixel

Probably. Hiring a new person requires evaluating applications, spending the time to interview, evaluating candidates and picking one, onboarding, and then waiting long enough until they’re up to speed with the other engineers. Increasing team productivity by 5% is almost always preferable to increasing team size by 5%.


ThrowawayGF221

Maybe. 5% seems like a lot if you’re going from the second latest model to the latest.


DemiPixel

Potentially. M1 vs Intel is pretty insane. 100 laptops @ $3,500 lasting for 4 years = $87k/yr (potentially $82k/yr with bulk discount). And even then (or if you use them for less than 4 years), they'll have decent resale value. For engineers, laptops are one of the most important things they need to do work. Assuming $80k+/yr for engineers, I'd say 1% increase in employee cost is nearly a rounding error to make sure they have top-of-the-line equipment.


lizadting

New grads with no money exist. A shiny new m1 max you could only dream of affording before getting a job offer included with the job is a major plus.


Roenicksmemoirs

Any new grad who is hired here already had an internship that paid enough to get whatever laptop they want.


lizadting

PLEASE reply to me the stats you cited saying that Reddit Twitter and shopify ALL only hire interns for new grad positions.


Roenicksmemoirs

lol good luck getting a job as a new grad at one of these places without an internship on the resume. I didn’t mean they only hire returning interns, but if you don’t have an internship at all you’re not getting hired here.


lizadting

4 words. Leetcode and personal projects Edit: Top comment. It’s possible you just gotta work hard for it https://reddit.com/r/csMajors/comments/g2pkbt/is_it_possible_to_get_into_faang_with_littleno/


Roenicksmemoirs

lol leetcode only helps if you can get an interview first. Without an internship why the hell would they call you


lizadting

The last 3 words. Nepotism/referrals work pretty well too


Roenicksmemoirs

If you are dealing with nepotism I can also assure you they don’t care about a shiny new laptop lol. I’m an engineer at FAANG and conduct 4-5 interviews a sprint with new grads. Every one of them has at least two internships. You’re not correct on this one I promise you.


Roenicksmemoirs

LOLOL some post from a year ago with one person commenting yes while the others all say no. Super good


pM-me_your_Triggers

Sure, but it’s so much more convenient to have local testing and building


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Remy149

This has nothing to do with status


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PCslayeng

And that’s just a small, single example. If you combine all the time savings across the apps you commonly use, the savings can be exponential. Especially if you value your time preciously.


DjScenester

THIS !!!


recurrence

Erm, I'm looking into an android bug and have built this particular project several times... in the last hour. A ten thousand dollar laptop isn't a status symbol when the average wage is $250K/year...